US anesthesiology residency - transition to UK

zaphod7

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Hi,

I am currently in a US anesthesiology residency with possible plans for fellowship afterwards. While my hope is to work in the US after training, I have personal reasons that make me want to keep the option open of moving to the UK (where I am allowed to live and work) in the future. From what I have read, the British GMC considers the US Anesthesiology Boards a valid exam in terms of demonstrating specialty-specific training, which makes things easier. However, I also know that US and UK training is vastly different, and that UK anesthetists, for example, during their longer training, also have significantly more training in Critical Care than their US counterparts do. My questions are:

1) Has anyone had any experience going to work in anesthesia in the UK following completion of US training, and if so, at what level (consultant, SAS, registrar, etc), and what hurdles did they face?

2) Specifically with regard to Critical Care, is anyone aware of any UK-mandated minimum training requirements in that area? As I am still in residency, I may have some flexibility to request additional ICU rotations before graduating, and would consider doing so if it allowed me to better transition to the UK without completing a Critical Care fellowship.

Thank you all for your help!
 

cockblockandrun

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The UK GMC allows US board certified anesthesiologists and pediatricians a fast track to apply for a license to practice. For other specialities, there are more hoops for them to jump through. They say that US trained anesthesiologists are not "equivalent" but the training and the examination process is just as vigorous as UK trained anesthetists hence the fast track.
But if you want to be on the specialist list, it is almost impossible for a US trained anesthesiologist to get on the list because the paperwork you need actually doesn't exist. You need something called a 360 assessments and that includes letters written by patients and nurses about you. I "LOL'd" when the GMC told me that because none of us are running around in the US getting letters from hospital staff about our performance. Plus you need every single presentation, morning report, grand rounds, papers, etc. to submit to the GMC.

So my advice is just to get a full license to practice and you can apply for jobs in the UK. You won't be officially a "consultant" but they will treat and pay you as one. Many hospitals you will be a "Specialist Doctor" but they will treat you as a consultant. I had one consultant try to act as a hot shot with me but when he realized I was a US board certified anesthesiologist, he backed off.
Once paperwork is in, you will have to go to London and bring all your original certificates- med school, residency and board certificate and they take your picture for their system. Whole thing take about 30 minutes and then you get your GMC registration number.

I did some locums there for a few weeks just because I was bored but I missed baseball, American milk and large toilets at home so I came back. Plus this was around Brexit so the pound was garbage compared to the dollar so was worth it come back financially.
 
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vector2

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I did some locums there for a few weeks just because I was bored but I missed baseball, American milk and large toilets at home so I came back. Plus this was around Brexit so the pound was garbage compared to the dollar so was worth it come back financially.

What are locums rates like there? I can’t imagine locums would be worth it under any exchange rate if it pays as poorly as most salaried consultant jobs...
 
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cockblockandrun

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What are locums rates like there? I can’t imagine locums would be worth it under any exchange rate if it pays as poorly as most salaried consultant jobs...

So UK locums don't pay for housing or transport and you have to have your own medmal too.
When you do the conversion, it comes out to less than the US. I did some locums there for a few weeks just to check it out and have all the cute nurses loving my American accent- you cannot monetize that kind of attention :giggle::love:
 
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RadsWFA1900

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So UK locums don't pay for housing or transport and you have to have your own medmal too.
When you do the conversion, it comes out to less than the US. I did some locums there for a few weeks just to check it out and have all the cute nurses loving my American accent- you cannot monetize that kind of attention :giggle::love:

Unless you have some strong ties to the area, I really don’t see how it’s worth jumping through these hoops to practice there.
 
D

deleted171991

So UK locums don't pay for housing or transport and you have to have your own medmal too.
When you do the conversion, it comes out to less than the US. I did some locums there for a few weeks just to check it out and have all the cute nurses loving my American accent- you cannot monetize that kind of attention :giggle::love:
Reminds me of this:

 
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chocomorsel

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True. I have my entire family in the UK. But end of the day more than finances, I love Murica more!
Why is this? I have always wondered why Europeans and UK people move to Murica if it isn't just to make more money. They have an equal quality of life, besides the big restrooms, big fridges, big houses that is lol. Moving from first world to another first world, I have always wondered.
 
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RadsWFA1900

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Why is this? I have always wondered why Europeans and UK people move to Murica if it isn't just to make more money. They have an equal quality of life, besides the big restrooms, big fridges, big houses that is lol. Moving from first world to another first world, I have always wondered.

Not all first worlds are created equal.

I lived with my cousins in Rome for 6 months. Apart from the nice scenery, I found the day to day QOL to be poorer than back home. The only thing people really revel in is not working hard but beyond that really disappointing. Even the cuisine never really lived up to the hype.

But despite all this, familial ties are more powerful so some people may be willing to overlook it.
 
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cockblockandrun

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Why is this? I have always wondered why Europeans and UK people move to Murica if it isn't just to make more money. They have an equal quality of life, besides the big restrooms, big fridges, big houses that is lol. Moving from first world to another first world, I have always wondered.

I know my European friends will disagree but being both British and American, I think the United States is the greatest nation ever in the history of mankind. Sure there are problems like everyone country but you can do things in this country you can't do anywhere else. The American dream and ingenuity is what has propelled mankind over the last several decades- and that is not to say there haven't been contributions from other countries or that they are inferior to the US. Just that this country is truly the land of opportunities and ability to live your dreams out.
 
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chocomorsel

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I know my European friends will disagree but being both British and American, I think the United States is the greatest nation ever in the history of mankind. Sure there are problems like everyone country but you can do things in this country you can't do anywhere else. The American dream and ingenuity is what has propelled mankind over the last several decades- and that is not to say there haven't been contributions from other countries or that they are inferior to the US. Just that this country is truly the land of opportunities and ability to live your dreams out.
Give examples please. Like what can you do here that you can’t do in the UK?
 
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chocomorsel

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Not all first worlds are created equal.

I lived with my cousins in Rome for 6 months. Apart from the nice scenery, I found the day to day QOL to be poorer than back home. The only thing people really revel in is not working hard but beyond that really disappointing. Even the cuisine never really lived up to the hype.

But despite all this, familial ties are more powerful so some people may be willing to overlook it.
Could you provide comparisons? What was poor about the QOL?
 

Mman

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Give examples please. Like what can you do here that you can’t do in the UK?

big houses
big yards
big cars
live sporting events that are not soccer (sorry, football for the brits)
more varieties of great food. I mean if you want Indian food, by all means head to London, but others are probably done better here.
better weather and beaches
mountains
just far more outdoor activities overall
 
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chocomorsel

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big houses
big yards
big cars
live sporting events that are not soccer (sorry, football for the brits)
more varieties of great food. I mean if you want Indian food, by all means head to London, but others are probably done better here.
better weather and beaches
mountains
just far more outdoor activities overall
I am sure you can buy or build a big house if you wanted with a big yard. Whatever the case, all those big things are overrated IMO. Especially the big cars. And I hate sports.
The weather, mountains, outdoors, maybe.
I am thinking more in the lines of freedoms. I mean stuff is a given. Americans like their stuff and money.
 
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Could you provide comparisons? What was poor about the QOL?

Western Europe has better cities and more history, that's about it. Even the cities are now kind of deteriorating to the level of the American norm though. There are parts of London and Paris that are just as dangerous as the worst Chicago and LA hoods and this is common in smaller European cities as well. Still, if you're young and want to experience the city life or if you appreciate living in the midst of history then Europe is superior.

Every other aspect though USA is better. Where I'm at now I can pack my car full of guns, hop on the highway and drive less than hour before reaching a completely isolated stretch of wilderness where I can basically reenact WWII without anyone so much as catching the faintest note of it. In Europe not only can I not own the guns, but I doubt such an isolated bit of country exists on the entire continent. You can't drive 20 minutes out of the city you're currently in in any direction without running smack into the next city over. There is something exhilarating and liberating about knowing that you can escape civilization whenever you want and leave those annoying human insects behind that is absolutely priceless and completely unavailable in Europe.

Then of course there is the better money, lower taxes, cheap gas, bigger houses and yards, etc etc. But the low population density is what's best, for however long it lasts.
 
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zaphod7

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The UK GMC allows US board certified anesthesiologists and pediatricians a fast track to apply for a license to practice. For other specialities, there are more hoops for them to jump through. They say that US trained anesthesiologists are not "equivalent" but the training and the examination process is just as vigorous as UK trained anesthetists hence the fast track.
But if you want to be on the specialist list, it is almost impossible for a US trained anesthesiologist to get on the list because the paperwork you need actually doesn't exist. You need something called a 360 assessments and that includes letters written by patients and nurses about you. I "LOL'd" when the GMC told me that because none of us are running around in the US getting letters from hospital staff about our performance. Plus you need every single presentation, morning report, grand rounds, papers, etc. to submit to the GMC.

So my advice is just to get a full license to practice and you can apply for jobs in the UK. You won't be officially a "consultant" but they will treat and pay you as one. Many hospitals you will be a "Specialist Doctor" but they will treat you as a consultant. I had one consultant try to act as a hot shot with me but when he realized I was a US board certified anesthesiologist, he backed off.
Once paperwork is in, you will have to go to London and bring all your original certificates- med school, residency and board certificate and they take your picture for their system. Whole thing take about 30 minutes and then you get your GMC registration number.

I did some locums there for a few weeks just because I was bored but I missed baseball, American milk and large toilets at home so I came back. Plus this was around Brexit so the pound was garbage compared to the dollar so was worth it come back financially.

Hi cockblockandrun,

I really appreciate your detailed and incredibly helpful answer! I'm glad to hear it's feasible, and I don't mind working as a Specialist grade initially. Also good to be forewarned about the paperwork involved!

Thank you truly for your help! Very encouraging!

And thank you the rest of you for the fun US vs Europe debate! :)
 
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