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Often times I read "unless you live in a lucky state, do this". Are lucky states only because schools highly prefer IS or because there are a lot of medical schools in that state or both? Also if this is the case what are the "lucky states"?
 

gyngyn

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Womb Raider

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Texas
 

Womb Raider

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Texas distinguishes itself by it's very small percentage of exports, only 5% leave.
Only Louisiana (3.9%) and Puerto Rico (1.9%) have a smaller percentage of matriculants leave the state.
Yes, and it has made me wonder whether out of state schools (from a Texan's perspective) hold that against the Texas applicant when offering IIs?
 
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solitarius

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Lots of states take their own residents, but none of them have schools as good as Texas nor tuition as low.

I had the great fortune of interviewing at some UT's, and they will generously extend their low in-state tuition for any OOSer who can get in.
 

gyngyn

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Yes, and it has made me wonder whether out of state schools (from a Texan's perspective) hold that against the Texas applicant when offering IIs?
I think you can guess.
Unless you plan to offer a recruitment scholarship what are the odds that one of the 193 that left TX last year would care to attend?
 

Caffein3

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I live in FL. Plenty of schools here (7 MD + 2 DO? Check me on the DO schools). That's a lot of chances to get in for instate. Only 23% matriculate in state but we also have a large number of applicants.
 
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I live in FL. Plenty of schools here (7 MD + 2 DO? Check me on the DO schools). That's a lot of chances to get in for instate. Only 23% matriculate in state but we also have a large number of applicants.
I also live in Florida. Which is why I was skeptical about what lucky states are. Turns out FL isn't necessarily one of them, but there are a lot of schools here.
 

UNMedGa

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Lucky comes from both having lots of medical schools, and from those states favoring IS. Texas comes to mind. California doesn't because despite the fact that they have a lot of schools, they don't heavily favor in state at a lot of them as much as other states and it's very competitive to get into any CA school anyway
 
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gyngyn

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Lucky comes from both having lots of medical schools, and from those states favoring IS. Texas comes to mind. California doesn't because despite the fact that they have a lot of schools, they don't heavily favor in state at a lot of them as much as other states and it's very competitive to get into any CA school anyway
Only UCR and UCD profess any preference for IS.
 
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UNMedGa

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Only UCR and UCD profess any preference for IS.
Gotcha, thanks. I wasn't 100% sure, but I'd heard that most CA schools don't prefer IS.
 
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Cyberdyne 101

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Gotcha, thanks. I wasn't 100% sure, but I'd heard that most CA schools don't prefer IS.
They have the advantages that come with pedigree, a desirable location, and an abundance of high quality IS applicants. As a result, they can still keep their IS matriculant numbers high without deterring top OOS applicants from applying.
 
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WingedOx

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Off the top of my head.

Texas, NC (for tuition), Michigan and Ohio (for number of schools), Perhaps Florida as well.
 

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And ND, SD, NM, SC, KS, OK, IA, AR, NE, TN
 

md-2020

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Can't believe this hasn't been mentioned yet.


West Virginia!
 

GiveMeThatMD

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Currently live in Utah. 1 medical school - University of Utah. Great school, just INSANELY competitive. So if one state were not lucky.... it's this one.
 
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sazerac

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Just look at the last column in that PDF file. West Virginia is by far the luckiest state to be from. Alabama, North Dakota, and Montana are close behind.

Montana is an interesting case. While they have no medical school themselves, they have reciprocal agreements with states all across the west and it is rare for a Montana resident to pay out of state tuition anywhere.

Wyoming has a similar setup, but they still have lousy acceptance rates. I guess they just aren't as smart ;-)
 

md-2020

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Currently live in Utah. 1 medical school - University of Utah. Great school, just INSANELY competitive. So if one state were not lucky.... it's this one.
Look at the stats for Maryland bruh. We're in it together.
 
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I've always thought Michigan was a good place to be. Several schools, MD and DO, a few with IS preference, and one (Central MI) with very high IS preference + low stats requirement. But we all just want to go to U of M anyway :)

Of course, applying MD/PhD means I lose that advantage :(
 

allantois

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I also live in Florida. Which is why I was skeptical about what lucky states are. Turns out FL isn't necessarily one of them, but there are a lot of schools here.
We will also be getting another allopathic school (NSU) in the foreseeable future.
 

GrapesofRath

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There a couple ways to define "lucky state". One factor is simply getting in if you are a marginal candidate. Another is cost and tuition issues.

One way is to look at the table @gyngyn provided. Note take note of ratios ie for a state the percent of IS applicants who matriculated IS compared to % of IS applicants who matriculated OOS.

Another thing is to look at MSAR and see which state schools have a high percentage of % of IS applicants who were offered an interview. If you are a borderline candidate this is useful. Also useful is to see how many schools that state has.

Note these figures are not up to date but I have in the past done this and looked at states that interview a high % of IS applicants. Of course the thing to consider which isn't really accounted for here is how competitive these schools are. Ohio State shows some IS bias but when you have median stats at 3.8/35 that doesn't necessarily mean your borderline 3.6/30 candidate is really at much of an advantage there.

Anyway here are what I would consider some lucky states. Note the 15 or so truly luckiest states only account for say 15% of all US applicants.

Alabama: U of Alabama interviews about half of their IS applicants. So does South Alabama. Theoretically someone who is an AL resident has a 75% of nabbing a II from there(of course all kinds of qualifications and reasons why that is misleading).

Arkansas: Interviews a very high % of IS applicants. I believe 2/3 or so.

Georgia: I think Mercer and MCG both interview about 40% of IS applicants.

Iowa: I believe U of Iowa interviews close to 80% of IS applicants.

Indiana and Kansas: Both have state schools that interview around 70% of IS applicants from the info I have(could be wrong)

Louisiana: Both the LSU schools interview roughly half of IS applicants.

Michigan: Central Michigan and Wayne State interview about 30% of IS applicants. Michigan State and Oakland also have some bias in terms of it being easier to get a II IS.

Mississippi: Interviews about 2/3 of IS applicants.

Nebraska: U of Nebraska interviews over half of their IS applicants if I'm not mistaken. Even Creighton interviews around 20% I believe.

North Dakota and South Dakota: Both interview well over half of IS applicants.

Nevada: Also a school that interviews over half of IS applicants I believe.

South Carolina: One of the really lucky states in the country. Greenville, U of SC and MU SC all interview close to half of their IS applicants I believe.

Tennessee: U of T interviews a high number of applicants and I believe ETSU interviews around 1/3.

Utah: Yes it is competitive but a high number of IS applicants get an interview.

West Virginia: WVU interviews over half of their IS applicants and their median MCAT is under 30. Marshall also interviews a high number and has a median GPA under 3.6 I believe. Gem of a state for medical school applicants.

PA: This is a very competitive state with tons of great applicants but TCMC interviews close to 40% of IS applicants and I believe Drexel and Temple interview around 25% of IS applicants. Penn State has about 20% of IS applicants interviewed to throw in there also. Also people from the western part of the state are in regional proximity for WVU which can make it a worthwhile app and I believe WVU interviews around 20-25% of their OOS applicants.

Arizona: Both their state schools interview a fair number of IS applicants(somewhere around 40% if I'm not mistaken).

North Carolina: Brody interviews about half their applicants and if your stats are on par with UNC(median 3.75/34 I believe) they interview a fairly strong number of IS applicants. Wake Forest also shows some IS bias in that around 20% or so of IS applicants get an interview .

Missouri: Columbia I believe interviews half of their IS applicants.

Ohio: Toledo and Wright State show IS bias( I believe 25-30% of IS applicants get an interview). Northeast Ohio is 98% IS'ers but they get lots of apps for few spots .If your stats are up to par Cincinnati and Ohio State I think both interview around 25% of IS applicants.

So there you have it a rough summary. I probably missed out some states but the key thing here is there are ALOT of lucky states. More than people tend to think and that's part of why CA people and the like have it rough.

If you want the luckiest of this bunch you'd have to start with West Virginia, South Carolina, Arkansas, Dakota's, Mississippi, Iowa, Arkansas, Nebraska, Nevada and Tennesseee.
 
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GrapesofRath

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I also live in Florida. Which is why I was skeptical about what lucky states are. Turns out FL isn't necessarily one of them, but there are a lot of schools here.
Florida has tons of schools with IS bias but the problem is they get lots of applicants from Fl residents for relatively few spots. I don't think there is a single Fl school that interviews even 20% of IS applicants.
 
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dextertrip

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Arizona: Both their state schools interview a fair number of IS applicants(somewhere around 40% if I'm not mistaken).
I understand that your list is meant for a marginal candidates getting to the interview phase and past the numbers portion of the application, but Arizona has the WORST matriculation in the country. They only require that 50% are IS. Where the "lucky" comes in with Arizona schools is when you have low stats. Having a having a 28/3.5 isn't much worse than having a 35/3.9.

I feel for California applications, but it seems like one well defined solution for CA applications is to have stellar stats. The frustrating thing for Arizona applicants is that becoming the "competitive" applicant is such a nebulous endeavor.
 

Dr. Death

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Utah: Yes it is competitive but a high number of IS applicants get an interview.


[/QUOTE]
These are courtesy interviews. They let in 100 matriculants for over 550 in state applicants. Tons of med students going out of state here
 

dextertrip

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Utah: Yes it is competitive but a high number of IS applicants get an interview.
These are courtesy interviews. They let in 100 matriculants for over 550 in state applicants. Tons of med students going out of state here[/QUOTE]

I think that the list was meant for students wanting to get through the stats barrier. Surely they aren't just courtesy interviews, it seems like Utah has the same problem as Arizona, maybe worse because with so many competitive applications the median MCAT of Utah still sits around 30.
 

GrapesofRath

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Utah: Yes it is competitive but a high number of IS applicants get an interview.
Ehhh the part about lots of medical students going OOS for Utah is fair but there's more to it than U of Utah simply being very competitive. You have to realize 65% of Utah applicants don't get into a US MD school; that's one of the lowest rates in the country.

As for Utah itself last year they got 550 IS applicants. 100 matriculants with 80 being in-state. Schools don't usually openly state their yield rate but there are many that accept twice as many as they matriculate or more(even state schools---hell Southern Illinois accepts twice as much as they matriculate and they don't even consider OOS). So unless there is some specific insight you have about the school giving interviews only as a formality I don't see Utah as any different from alot of states.

I never said it was the luckiest state in the US and there is only one medical school in Utah, but from the data I looked up Utah interviewed around 300-350 in state applicants and around 500 applicants overall. For a school that has a class of a 100 that doesn't sound out of the norm at all. If you are to assume Utah maybe accepts 120-160 Utah residents for those 80 spots accepting 120-160 of the Utah residents out of the 3oo-35o interviewed it isn't particularly unusual or suggestive of just giving interviews that are simply "courtesy" interviews in a way that other schools don't do.
 

GrapesofRath

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I understand that your list is meant for a marginal candidates getting to the interview phase and past the numbers portion of the application, but Arizona has the WORST matriculation in the country. They only require that 50% are IS. Where the "lucky" comes in with Arizona schools is when you have low stats. Having a having a 28/3.5 isn't much worse than having a 35/3.9.

I feel for California applications, but it seems like one well defined solution for CA applications is to have stellar stats. The frustrating thing for Arizona applicants is that becoming the "competitive" applicant is such a nebulous endeavor.
This is the key point. Like I said there are many ways to define "lucky". Being a borderline applicant was what I was getting at the most with that list. Arizona has the same problem Utah does: 70% of applicants don't get into an MD school. That's a big part of the reason why that number is 14%. Arizona isn't what I would call the "luckiest" of the lucky states by any means but they have two state schools that interview a fairly high proportion of IS applicants. Many states wish they had that.
 

Lucca

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Yes, and it has made me wonder whether out of state schools (from a Texan's perspective) hold that against the Texas applicant when offering IIs?
Gyngyn already replied with the logical answer but anecdotally I have met very few people (3) in my time here that were both accepted out of state and left Texas. However, most Texas applicants I feel do not choose to apply anywhere but Texas.

The curse of Texas: Everyone wants to leave but there are so many good reasons to stay. If only we could replace the weather and make West Texas like New Louisiana or something then everything would be ok.
 

Dr. Death

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Goro forgot Kentucky on his list of lucky states. Louisville and UK are heavy in state biased and their average matriculants have lower stats than ~80% of MD schools. And if you can't figure a way into either of those they have a DO school with lower stats for average matriculants than ~80% of DO schools
 
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GrapesofRath

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Goro forgot Kentucky on his list of lucky states. Louisville and UK are heavy in state biased and their average matriculants have lower stats than ~80% of MD schools. And if you can't figure a way into either of those they have a DO school with lower stats for average matriculants than ~80% of DO schools
Yeah I somehow forgot to list that in that long excessive post here I went on yesterday. Kentucky is definitely one of the luckier ones even of the lucky states I listed.
 

UNMedGa

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They have the advantages that come with pedigree, a desirable location, and an abundance of high quality IS applicants. As a result, they can still keep their IS matriculant numbers high without deterring top OOS applicants from applying.
That actually makes perfect sense, thanks for the explanation. CA does have a ton of premeds to choose from so I suppose they don't have any issues getting as many IS as they think they need.
 
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sazerac

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And you keep forgetting Montana.

When is out of state medical not out of state medical school? When you get interview consideration as an instate applicant at 20 medical schools, and when your state pays you cash money to go to a medical school in another state.
 

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New Jersey is decent - when I apply next cycle it will have 3 state MD schools, 2 state DO schools, and a private MD school that will be partially funded by the state. Plus I think most people can easily write about connections to NYC, Philly, or both.
 

DokterMom

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Texas is lucky for a number of reasons --
  • There's a full range of schools from lower-stat to top-tier, so at least two schools that are a good fit (stats-wise) for every qualified applicant.
  • Because of insanely high in-state preferences, fewer OOS applicants flood the application pool, so qualified IS applicants are more likely to get their applications read and to get interview invitations. (Less reader fatigue)
  • Some of the lowest tuition and cost of attendance figures in the nation.
  • There is a large enough number of schools with a high enough likelihood of extending an interview that the majority of well-qualified IS applicants do not even really need to apply OOS.
    • Candidates with marginal stats can apply IS and DO and know their bases are covered.
    • Candidates with high stats can apply IS and Dream School and know their bases are covered. (Dream schools do still interview Texans.)
  • Being able to apply to fewer schools means fewer secondaries, so a cheaper, easier application cycle.
  • The Match. A blessing and a curse, but at least you know.
That said, getting into a TX medical school is statistically no more likely than average.
 
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