why D.O. over M.D.?

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This thread is going to get nasty. It is impossible to debate this issue on SDN without that happening. So, I have no comment on your question. Sorry!🙂
 
This thread is going to get nasty. It is impossible to debate this issue on SDN without that happening. So, I have no comment on your question. Sorry!🙂
Yup.

*loads ammo*
 
This has been discussed before and it can get ugly. Please use search function.
 
I'll give it a shot. I believe DOs offer another aspect of medicine not used or trained within the allopathic schools: manipulative medicine and its techniques. This aspect of medicine provides an alternative form of treating and diagnosing patient conditions/diseases in a non-invasive manner that is natural, and actually stimulates natural self-healing due to increases in circulation of the blood due to the manipulations. Thus, there is no side-effect(s) as are seen in prescription medications or over the counter meds ... this is not to say that a DO wont ever prescribe drugs, because they do, but they also have this ability to treat and diagnose without using the drugs if it is deemed not necessary to use the drugs.

However, both are fully trained/licensed doctors and both are equal. patients dont care who they are, as long as they know what they are doing.

goodluck in your decisions.
 
Personally, I can't think of a scenario where I would choose DO over MD (it would take basically the offer of a full ride scholarship to an osteopathic program), but then again that's just me.
 
I'll give it a shot. I believe DOs offer another aspect of medicine not used or trained within the allopathic schools: manipulative medicine and its techniques. This aspect of medicine provides an alternative form of treating and diagnosing patient conditions/diseases in a non-invasive manner that is natural, and actually stimulates natural self-healing due to increases in circulation of the blood due to the manipulations. Thus, there is no side-effect(s) as are seen in prescription medications or over the counter meds ... this is not to say that a DO wont ever prescribe drugs, because they do, but they also have this ability to treat and diagnose without using the drugs if it is deemed not necessary to use the drugs.

However, both are fully trained/licensed doctors and both are equal. patients dont care who they are, as long as they know what they are doing.

goodluck in your decisions.

Are you saying DO's are better than MD's? :meanie:
 
Oh Jesus H. Christ....... :laugh:

nah, theyre not better ... just provide a more generalist aspect of medicine while allos tend to be more specialists ...


*is bitin his tongue before he lashes out at the idiotic pre-osteos tryin to start a md vs do fight*
 
nah, theyre not better ... just provide a more generalist aspect of medicine while allos tend to be more specialists ...


*is bitin his tongue before he lashes out at the idiotic pre-osteos tryin to start a md vs do fight*

LMAO AGAIN!!! :laugh: Come on boys, behave. It is all fun and games until someone loses an eye...:meanie: 😀
 
the idiotic pre-osteos

Correction: idiotic pre-osteo. Singular. I'm not trying to start anything (and I'm a premed since I'm not decided on which to attend yet).

It is all fun and games until someone loses an eye...

Then it just becomes funny.....
 
nah, theyre not better ... just provide a more generalist aspect of medicine while allos tend to be more specialists ...


*is bitin his tongue before he lashes out at the idiotic pre-osteos tryin to start a md vs do fight*

Well, thanks for calling me an idiot and a pre osteo, since neither term is really accurate given that I got in. I was just making fun of the people who start the flame wars on this, and trying to beat them to the punch before they do it in a more serious manner. Just wait 'till Northerner catches the scent of this thread. 🙄
 
Correction: idiotic pre-osteo. Singular. I'm not trying to start anything (and I'm a premed since I'm not decided on which to attend yet).



Then it just becomes funny.....

no, its plurality because i was referring to the 2 who were trying to instigate somethin :meanie:

if y'all arent pre-DOs, then fine, pre-meds. happy.😎
 
jkhamlin said:
Well, thanks for calling me an idiot and a pre osteo, since neither term is really accurate

And you're certainly not an idiot. I may disagree with you on a lot of things but your intelligence is something I do not question anymore. 👍
 
no, its plurality because i was referring to the 2 who were trying to instigate somethin :meanie:

if y'all arent pre-DOs, then fine, pre-meds. happy.😎

I'm a med student waiting for classes to begin, thank you very much. 😛

DKM and I were not trying to instigate something, we were just joking around because we have both been involved in several of these flame wars (usually on opposite sides), and I am starting to think he is an ok guy. Wrong, but ok. :meanie: Besides, I am beginning to think he is starting to come around. 😀 😛
 
LOL! I just clicked back into this thread before turning my computer off and going to bed. DropKickMurphy and Dr. Inviz, I hope you all are behaving!!! LOL!:laugh: Night!😴
 
.....am starting to think he is an ok guy. Wrong, but ok. Besides, I am beginning to think he is starting to come around

Thank you for saying nice things about me, but I'm sorry, I'll never completely cross over to the Dark Side. :laugh: 😉
 
Yup.

*loads ammo*

me too...

revolver1.gif
 
But you don't realize the power of the Dark Side. We can do things that the Jedi can't do, like OMM. :laugh:
"Use the Force Luke.....no.....wait....use myofascial release!" :laugh:

Somewhere in Missouri, A.T. Still is rolling over in his grave.
 
Its like this: Many students apply to DO programs because of the differing philosophy of medicine the schools teach their students (the way to approach patient care, etc), many go DO because of OMT (it is a valuable tool if you plan to use it, however, many will probably end up not using it throughout their careers) or students go DO because to them, a DO is no different than an MD, bottom line. There are plenty of people who are going to contest that issue, even 40 years down the road, more than likely. People go DO for some or all of these reasons (I am sure some have their own reasons of course).

Here is my opinion, if one is deciding to go DO, dont go DO if you are worried about what others think of you. You will deal with the MD vs DO thing for most of your career (I am sure that situations will all be different in various parts of the country), explaining your training to patients and colleagues. If you are going to go DO, know as much about the profession as you possibly can learn.........I personally know of one DO, a 1st year intern now, who completely regreted going DO because of how some people treated him throughout his rotations. Now, mind you, this person is entirely concerned about what each and every person around him thinks.....he didnt really know anything about going DO, other than he would just be a doctor. Going DO is not for everyone!!!

When students start flame wars, it usually revolves around DOs wanting respect and equality and that MDs think that allopathic is superior (not all feel this way, obviously. There are many, many incredible MD docs that give the upmost respect and proper credence to their DO counterparts and colleagues).

Bottom line: if you feel comfortable being the minority in medicine and want to learn OMT (which will be very cool) and the possibility of having to explain your credentials and training to those who are in the dark about DOs, then go for it! It is pointless to fight and bicker about the DO v MD thing; it ends up going nowhere and the thread usually gets locked up by dear old Nate.....

Good luck to you dude.
 
You know what, the more and more I talk to actual physicians (not the pre-meds and the like) the more and more that people really need to see that there is absolutely no difference. Its all up to you over what you can do. Many DO's don't even USE OMM after their required rotations during med school or residency. Many of them don't care where they go to school they just want to be a physician.

DO schools tend to be forgiving on grades and look at the whole applicant. MD schools (most of them) have formulas you have to pass in order to get an interview (yes its a generalization but for the most part its true). DO schools claim a holistic approach to medicine, well more and more allopathic schools do this as well, so that really isn't the key anymore.

If you want to sacrafice more biochem, pharm, path for OMM then DO school would be a great fit 😉 j/k

Everyone has their own reasons of why DO. But only you as your own individual can find out which school is right for you, whether DO or MD. Once pre-meds realize that there isn't that big of a deal between most DO schools and MD schools other than osteopathic schools often focus on general practice and family practice (but don't exclude specialities), they might start to be a little more informed.
 
Lets all hug?....besides most yall are going to go in residencies where there a mix (md/do) and a senior resident md/do will save you butt or pimp you hard for your own good, but by the end of the day you will tka ehim/her out for hotwings and a fermented beverage.
 
If you want to sacrafice more biochem, pharm, path for OMM then DO school would be a great fit 😉 j/k

I know you're just joking, but you need to add "anatomy" and "clinical skills" to the subjects a DO program emphasizes over MD.
 
You know what, the more and more I talk to actual physicians (not the pre-meds and the like) the more and more that people really need to see that there is absolutely no difference. Its all up to you over what you can do. Many DO's don't even USE OMM after their required rotations during med school or residency. Many of them don't care where they go to school they just want to be a physician.

DO schools tend to be forgiving on grades and look at the whole applicant. MD schools (most of them) have formulas you have to pass in order to get an interview (yes its a generalization but for the most part its true). DO schools claim a holistic approach to medicine, well more and more allopathic schools do this as well, so that really isn't the key anymore.

If you want to sacrafice more biochem, pharm, path for OMM then DO school would be a great fit 😉 j/k

Everyone has their own reasons of why DO. But only you as your own individual can find out which school is right for you, whether DO or MD. Once pre-meds realize that there isn't that big of a deal between most DO schools and MD schools other than osteopathic schools often focus on general practice and family practice (but don't exclude specialities), they might start to be a little more informed.


Completely agree. Yet, why if I choose DO, will I have to defend myself to their adcoms as being sold on the unique philosophies and so forth that they're offering...when I am only seeking a path to being a doctor. Its this fundamental conceit that makes me hesitant to plan for osteopathic education, because I cannot be untruthful and convincing nor would I want to. Professionally there is little actual difference beyond the grey shades of generalizations propagated by premeds (and I might add the faithful disciples of AT still that get added to cult each year) , but nontheless, I've heard again and again that osteopathic admission-seeking individuals have to prove their allegiance to the cause. I see osteopathic education as a great opportunity for me that is blocked by its initiation rites that I just can feign enthusiasm for.
Comments appreciated....
 
Its like this: Many students apply to DO programs because of the differing philosophy of medicine the schools teach their students (the way to approach patient care, etc), many go DO because of OMT (it is a valuable tool if you plan to use it, however, many will probably end up not using it throughout their careers) or students go DO because to them, a DO is no different than an MD, bottom line. There are plenty of people who are going to contest that issue, even 40 years down the road, more than likely. People go DO for some or all of these reasons (I am sure some have their own reasons of course).

Here is my opinion, if one is deciding to go DO, dont go DO if you are worried about what others think of you. You will deal with the MD vs DO thing for most of your career (I am sure that situations will all be different in various parts of the country), explaining your training to patients and colleagues. If you are going to go DO, know as much about the profession as you possibly can learn.........I personally know of one DO, a 1st year intern now, who completely regreted going DO because of how some people treated him throughout his rotations. Now, mind you, this person is entirely concerned about what each and every person around him thinks.....he didnt really know anything about going DO, other than he would just be a doctor. Going DO is not for everyone!!!

When students start flame wars, it usually revolves around DOs wanting respect and equality and that MDs think that allopathic is superior (not all feel this way, obviously. There are many, many incredible MD docs that give the upmost respect and proper credence to their DO counterparts and colleagues).

Bottom line: if you feel comfortable being the minority in medicine and want to learn OMT (which will be very cool) and the possibility of having to explain your credentials and training to those who are in the dark about DOs, then go for it! It is pointless to fight and bicker about the DO v MD thing; it ends up going nowhere and the thread usually gets locked up by dear old Nate.....

Good luck to you dude.

I agree with this as well. Its not what you mention that bothers me, its the prospect of being asked by a DO interviewer why DO? And me saying...I want to practice medicine this is a medical school right...? Frowning...No why specifically DO?....Because maybe you'll give me a chance to be a physician and this city is a good prospective place to live for my wife and I and OMM looks interesting. That's all I've got. Is this enough to justify the thousands on applying or am I just not fitting the profile?
 
Its like this: Many students apply to DO programs because of the differing philosophy of medicine the schools teach their students (the way to approach patient care, etc), many go DO because of OMT (it is a valuable tool if you plan to use it, however, many will probably end up not using it throughout their careers) or students go DO because to them, a DO is no different than an MD, bottom line. There are plenty of people who are going to contest that issue, even 40 years down the road, more than likely. People go DO for some or all of these reasons (I am sure some have their own reasons of course).

Here is my opinion, if one is deciding to go DO, dont go DO if you are worried about what others think of you. You will deal with the MD vs DO thing for most of your career (I am sure that situations will all be different in various parts of the country), explaining your training to patients and colleagues. If you are going to go DO, know as much about the profession as you possibly can learn.........I personally know of one DO, a 1st year intern now, who completely regreted going DO because of how some people treated him throughout his rotations. Now, mind you, this person is entirely concerned about what each and every person around him thinks.....he didnt really know anything about going DO, other than he would just be a doctor. Going DO is not for everyone!!!

When students start flame wars, it usually revolves around DOs wanting respect and equality and that MDs think that allopathic is superior (not all feel this way, obviously. There are many, many incredible MD docs that give the upmost respect and proper credence to their DO counterparts and colleagues).

Bottom line: if you feel comfortable being the minority in medicine and want to learn OMT (which will be very cool) and the possibility of having to explain your credentials and training to those who are in the dark about DOs, then go for it! It is pointless to fight and bicker about the DO v MD thing; it ends up going nowhere and the thread usually gets locked up by dear old Nate.....

Good luck to you dude.

AF i think this was one of the best statements on this topic i have read.
i totally agree with you...👍
 
I agree with this as well. Its not what you mention that bothers me, its the prospect of being asked by a DO interviewer why DO? And me saying...I want to practice medicine this is a medical school right...? Frowning...No why specifically DO?....Because maybe you'll give me a chance to be a physician and this city is a good prospective place to live for my wife and I and OMM looks interesting. That's all I've got. Is this enough to justify the thousands on applying or am I just not fitting the profile?

Seriously, I think mainly the reason they ask for this is not to see if you are a cheerleader for Osteopathic medicine or not, but to make sure that you are serious enough about your application to their school that you aren't just using them as a backup plan. They want to know whether you will approach the different philosophy with an open mind, not just say "yeah, whatever, just give me that medical license." They don't want to accept someone who really doesn't want to be a DO, and I don't blame them. It really wouldn't be a winning situation for either party.
 
I honestly believe that DO's and MD's are equal. It seems to me that DO's are actually better because they learn everything an MD learns plus osteopathic manipulations. Most practicing physicians I talk to agree. I think it's primarily the pretentious med students, residents and interns that make it difficult for DO's. But honestly, who cares about them.
 
Completely agree. Yet, why if I choose DO, will I have to defend myself to their adcoms as being sold on the unique philosophies and so forth that they're offering...when I am only seeking a path to being a doctor. Its this fundamental conceit that makes me hesitant to plan for osteopathic education, because I cannot be untruthful and convincing nor would I want to. Professionally there is little actual difference beyond the grey shades of generalizations propagated by premeds (and I might add the faithful disciples of AT still that get added to cult each year) , but nontheless, I've heard again and again that osteopathic admission-seeking individuals have to prove their allegiance to the cause. I see osteopathic education as a great opportunity for me that is blocked by its initiation rites that I just can feign enthusiasm for.
Comments appreciated....
I agree about all the philosophy mumbo-jumbo....but if you have any desire to learn the "non-dogmatic" OMM (ie purely musculoskeletal stuff that in ways resembles physical therapy and chiro) or like the generalist 1st/specialist 2nd approach....then you wouldn't be lying at all. If those don't really apply...then....sorry. At least you can say you'll get the training you need to be a competant physician.
 
How about them Gators beating those Buckeyes! Crazy.

Yeah we beat Tennessee, though! OSU got their asses kicked... made the Big Ten look bad... so did UMich.

Our strength of schedule is going to suffer. If Morelli plays as well as he did during the Outback Bowl next year, we're gonna be in the top 20.

I'm onto the Eagles now!
 
I honestly believe that DO's and MD's are equal. It seems to me that DO's are actually better because they learn everything an MD learns plus osteopathic manipulations. Most practicing physicians I talk to agree. I think it's primarily the pretentious med students, residents and interns that make it difficult for DO's. But honestly, who cares about them.

Uh oh...

*Runs for cover.*
 
I agree with this as well. Its not what you mention that bothers me, its the prospect of being asked by a DO interviewer why DO? And me saying...I want to practice medicine this is a medical school right...? Frowning...No why specifically DO?....Because maybe you'll give me a chance to be a physician and this city is a good prospective place to live for my wife and I and OMM looks interesting. That's all I've got. Is this enough to justify the thousands on applying or am I just not fitting the profile?
See....that's my attitude too. Reasons to go DO: I want to be a physician; the schools aren't in bad locations (except for that new one in Harlem); OMM is interesting even if only at some sort of academic level. I also want to practice in a rural area. Can I attend an osteopathic school now? Oh! and I'm willing to claim to want to do primary care if that helps my application..... :meanie:
 
i bet Nate is sitting infron of the computer making bets how many more posts before intervention will be needed.:laugh: 😉
 
See....that's my attitude too. Reasons to go DO: I want to be a physician; the schools aren't in bad locations (except for that new one in Harlem); OMM is interesting even if only at some sort of academic level. I also want to practice in a rural area. Can I attend an osteopathic school now? Oh! and I'm willing to claim to want to do primary care if that helps my application..... :meanie:
I wouldn't be opposed to that....its the ones who will sit and bitch to anyone around them about how much they don't wanna be there and how they wish they were an MD....I've got 1 of those in my class...as long as you wouldn't be "that guy" I think you'll be alright given that your grades are adaquate
 
Back to the OP.....

It's very simple.

Apply to all MD programs you can
Apply to all DO programs you can

Interview, do well, etc,

Hopefully get offers, then accept the best one.
It's that simple.
If the best one is MD good,
If the best one is DO good also.

better that sitting out year after waiting for a particular program
 
I agree about all the philosophy mumbo-jumbo....but if you have any desire to learn the "non-dogmatic" OMM (ie purely musculoskeletal stuff that in ways resembles physical therapy and chiro) or like the generalist 1st/specialist 2nd approach....then you wouldn't be lying at all. If those don't really apply...then....sorry. At least you can say you'll get the training you need to be a competant physician.

Ok. That's promising for my osteopathic application prospects. It's just that it gets confusing when alot of the material on this forum comes from the minority party plea for its own justification. I feel the proof is in the pudding. I also feel that trying to make the osteopathic profession superior to its allopathic counterpart is a major theme on this board and one that actually weakens its position.
If you're a good anything you don't have to justify it. It's just a matter of oh this area is giving you pain I see....let me try something...(OMM treatment or diagnosis).....Are you feeling better?....if enough patients receive benefits from the treatments they will speak for you.
The requests for your services will allow your allopathic counterparts to witness you prowess as a clinician--that's the pudding, as is the bleeding of osteopaths into successful and indistinguishable specialists--not the rhetoric of we practice "hollistic medicine with focus on the whole patient and so forth and therefore we give better care" that is also very prominent on this forum.
I guess internet forums have their drawbacks because when I talk to osteopaths, especially my buddy, then It makes alot of sense for me to pursue it. But the defensive rhetoric here is discouraging. Anyway thanks for the input!
 
Ok. That's promising for my osteopathic application prospects. It's just that it gets confusing when alot of the material on this forum comes from the minority party plea for its own justification. I feel the proof is in the pudding. I also feel that trying to make the osteopathic profession superior to its allopathic counterpart is a major theme on this board and one that actually weakens its position.
If you're a good anything you don't have to justify it. It's just a matter of oh this area is giving you pain I see....let me try something...(OMM treatment or diagnosis).....Are you feeling better?....if enough patients receive benefits from the treatments they will speak for you.
The requests for your services will allow your allopathic counterparts to witness you prowess as a clinician--that's the pudding, as is the bleeding of osteopaths into successful and indistinguishable specialists--not the rhetoric of we practice "hollistic medicine with focus on the whole patient and so forth and therefore we give better care" that is also very prominent on this forum.
I guess internet forums have their drawbacks because when I talk to osteopaths, especially my buddy, then It makes alot of sense for me to pursue it. But the defensive rhetoric here is discouraging. Anyway thanks for the input!
that could have something to do w/ listening to advice and opinions on here w/o knowing who is a pre-med and who is actually walking the walk..... always take the experience of your sources on here into account


oh...and to save the next few posters the time I'll respond to my own post:

How dare you say my opinion is any less valid just b/c I haven't started DO school yet....I've spoken or worked w/ several of them and they've all said...blah...

you get my point...
 
that could have something to do w/ listening to advice and opinions on here w/o knowing who is a pre-med and who is actually walking the walk....

True dat!!!!👍
 
What I think does a disservice to the DO are students who claim to attend osteopathic school as "backup". It is aggravating to meet students who apply to both MD and DO not because they see medicine as the ultimate goal, where the end justify the means, or because they see both as equally valid ways of practicing medicine, but because one serves as a safety school to another. Even if the interviews serve the purpose to weed out such students, the practice in itself by self-proclaimed pre-allos, with such an intent, is unfortunate for all. Personally, one thing I do not look forward to, is condescension towards fellow medical practitioners by MDs, I don't understand the chip such individuals carry on their shoulders when everyone is doing the same thing for what is supposed to be a physicians' primary concern of serving the public.
 
I agree with this as well. Its not what you mention that bothers me, its the prospect of being asked by a DO interviewer why DO? And me saying...I want to practice medicine this is a medical school right...? Frowning...No why specifically DO?....Because maybe you'll give me a chance to be a physician and this city is a good prospective place to live for my wife and I and OMM looks interesting. That's all I've got. Is this enough to justify the thousands on applying or am I just not fitting the profile?


Nasrudin, this is obviously bothering you, so let me give you a little advice...FWIW

Have you shadowed an osteopathic physician? Do you know the history of osteopathy and A.T. Still? If so, do you feel comfortable graduating with the D.O. degree and learning osteopathic medicine? Those are the questions you need to ask yourself and feel comfortable with the answers.

Personally, I shadowed an osteopathic physician and read up a LOT on the history of osteopathy. Therefore, when I was asked "why osteopathic medicine?", I could answer "because the osteopathic physician that I shadowed was a great doctor because X,Y, and Z, and he really encouraged me to apply to osteopathic medical schools, blah, blah, blah"....For Example. Also, if you have read up on osteopathic medicine, you can say that you know quite a bit about it, citing the books read, and that will also impress the interviewers.

You don't have to demonstrate that you have wanted to be a D.O. since you were a toddler, but you need to know the differences between a D.O. and M.D. education, the D.O. "philosophy", and the primary care emphasis. The D.O. interviewers will be very interested in the same things the adcoms at allo schools will be interested in, like your EC's, volunteer experiences, clinical experiences, research, etc. You really need to be yourself in these interviews, and be able to carry on a healthy conversation for an hour.

Last, but not least... Do Not infer to the interviewer that the osteo school is a Back-Up to a allo school. That is an immediate rejection.

If you have any more questions, Ask.

:luck:
 

OK I can think of 2 reasons, off the top of my head:

1. DO is over MD because it is in alphabetical order. To be explicit, "D" comes before "M" in the English alphabet, hence "DO" is always over "MD".

2. Little known fact is that OMM is not merely a treatment modality; it is also a martial art. DO's all get secret training in "high velocity" techniques that will seriously injure or even kill an allopathic opponent foolish enough to take them on. A DO will always wind up on top of an MD in a tussle.
 
What I think does a disservice to the DO are students who claim to attend osteopathic school as "backup". It is aggravating to meet students who apply to both MD and DO not because they see medicine as the ultimate goal, where the end justify the means, or because they see both as equally valid ways of practicing medicine, but because one serves as a safety school to another. Even if the interviews serve the purpose to weed out such students, the practice in itself by self-proclaimed pre-allos, with such an intent, is unfortunate for all. Personally, one thing I do not look forward to, is condescension towards fellow medical practitioners by MDs, I don't understand the chip such individuals carry on their shoulders when everyone is doing the same thing for what is supposed to be a physicians' primary concern of serving the public.


👍

Well said.


I went to PCOM because I wanted to learn OMT. Mission accomplished. On to another thread...
 
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