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deleted50478
The problem is that you probably disagree for irrational reasons.
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Will Trump win again???
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deleted126335
Perhaps you should get out and about more. Less than picturesque areas are not on most of the recommended sites on tripadvisor.
That said, California is magnificent. Too bad Californians have f#cked it up.
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deleted87051
I was all over....SoMa, Hayes Street, Union Square, and Forest Hill in addition to Marin. I’ve lived in California since 1993. I don’t “need to get out more.” I know what it’s like here. It’s wonderful.
When people have an agenda they use the tools at their disposal to manipulate others. This definitely includes "religion" by taking things out of context.
Just because leaders of all types (religious and secular) have used and abused the teachings of the Lord doesn't mean hate is part of God's agenda. The founders knew all men were equal before God and our nation was founded on that principle. That is why slavery was so hard to put into the U.S. Constitution as it clearly was contradictory to the philosophy of the founders and the understanding of scripture.
Agree. A deep breath is needed.
We must remember that we are often talking with very young people and people with very young minds.
That said, please moderator Arch G, do not stop this thread. If there are threats towards posters, that is one thing. If there are threats towards ideas or ideologies, please let this thread remain free...it's the Anesthesiology forum, where much extra-circ is tolerated and appreciated.
HH
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deleted50478
you are just wrong. The bible was the strongest defense of slavery since it is instructed by the god of the bible. Slavery isn’t in the constitution because the founders had a higher moral code than the authors of the bible.
Aside from the slavery issue, the god of the bible was wildly immoral. If you think the god of the bible is a good guy, you are being very selective in your reading. At church they don’t tend to chose the readings about god doing horrible things, but they are there.
you don’t consider someone a good guy who is great 90% of the time but commits horrible atrocities sometimes. you’d consider that person a psychopath.
Leviticus 25:44-46
Exodus 21:2-4
Exodus 21:20-21
Ephesians 6:5
1 Timothy 6:1-2
The non-slavery-related immoral bible verses are far too numerous to quote.
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deleted171991
Organized religion is just another way to control (and profit from) the masses. The holy books contain whatever their authors wanted to include. It's not like the gods dictated them, whether they exist or not (and whether they give a crap about the pale blue dot, or probably not). The books reflect the morals of the authors and human society at their time.
There is a lot of wisdom in there, as expected, but also a lot of stupidity, as expected. Let's not forget that the Christian book was behind all those atrocities during the Dark Middle Ages. Before the Nazis, there was the Inquisition. And before that, emperors and kings and popes and khans and sultans who profited from whatever their holy texts allowed them to do, such as killing the infidels, cutting body parts, enslaving and torturing people.
I totally understand how an intelligent person could be spiritual, even dedicate her life to enlightenment. I absolutely can't how they can believe all those bedtime stories, without any judgment, and argue based on some holy text (hence the Dark Middle Ages). But, hey, if you can believe Earth was made only a few thousand years ago, then you can also believe that the CVP is an indicator of volume status. 😉
There is a lot of wisdom in there, as expected, but also a lot of stupidity, as expected. Let's not forget that the Christian book was behind all those atrocities during the Dark Middle Ages. Before the Nazis, there was the Inquisition. And before that, emperors and kings and popes and khans and sultans who profited from whatever their holy texts allowed them to do, such as killing the infidels, cutting body parts, enslaving and torturing people.
I totally understand how an intelligent person could be spiritual, even dedicate her life to enlightenment. I absolutely can't how they can believe all those bedtime stories, without any judgment, and argue based on some holy text (hence the Dark Middle Ages). But, hey, if you can believe Earth was made only a few thousand years ago, then you can also believe that the CVP is an indicator of volume status. 😉
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deleted171991
That could only be their gods, if they showed up and said: hey, don't believe all that BS. Kind of like Jesus pointed out the good parts. (And that's why I love that man/prophet/god/whatever. I also like The Buddha and his teachings, but that's a different story.) If only Christians were like Jesus supposedly was...
I used to believe humanity would be a better place without organized religion. But, then, I looked at the less-religious younger generations, and their hatefulness, and I realized that, if you remove one kind of brain shampoo, dumb people will just replace it with an even worse one. Hence, I now support "positive" religious movements, those that spread love and peace, and oppose those that say that their way is the only way. Religion is just a way to control the mob, hence it matters a lot who leads them and where.
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Article 1, Section 2, Clause 3: Representatives and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons, including those bound to Service for a Term of Years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons.
Slaves were counted as 3/5 of a person by the Constitution.
Dang, you guys just kept on posting all during Thanksgiving and shop day huh? I would say I’m impressed, but that’s not necessarily the right word...
Anyway, sounds like the majority of people here are sane and understand the vileness of sharia law and fundamentalist Muslims. So hopefully you get the point AMEHigh and realize that nothing I said was hateful or bigoted, as you like to say, but a simple summary of that belief system as is largely practiced in the Middle East, but is also creeping ever more so into Europe. So I don’t think I’ll rehash that any more. Other than to say that there is lots more data out there summarizing beliefs by Muslims by country if you wanna look for it and you still don’t believe that a LARGE portion of Muslims in this world believe in honor killings, subjugating women, killing or jailing gays, etc etc.
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Anyway, sounds like the majority of people here are sane and understand the vileness of sharia law and fundamentalist Muslims. So hopefully you get the point AMEHigh and realize that nothing I said was hateful or bigoted, as you like to say, but a simple summary of that belief system as is largely practiced in the Middle East, but is also creeping ever more so into Europe. So I don’t think I’ll rehash that any more. Other than to say that there is lots more data out there summarizing beliefs by Muslims by country if you wanna look for it and you still don’t believe that a LARGE portion of Muslims in this world believe in honor killings, subjugating women, killing or jailing gays, etc etc.
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Sorry bud, YOU are just wrong. And I don’t intend to change your mind about God or religion, but I will say, I’m guessing you haven’t read the Bible (just picking and choosing things out of context). I’m guessing you don’t understand the original Hebrew meanings of word that have been translated into “slave” in some translations of the Bible. And I know you are ignoring the historical context of slavery as it was at the time, as it was often entered into voluntarily for the purpose of debt repayment. There was forced slavery as well via kidnapping etc and that was condemned in the Bible. So to try and conflate the slavery of the Bible with the slavery of the Deep South is either disingenuous or just misinformed. Additionally, there are many other parts of the Bible where God talks about submitting to an authority of the time (I.e. give to Caesar what is Ceasar’s) but that doesn’t necessarily mean the authority is of Gods intention.
Some food for thought...if the God of the Bible was wildly immoral and the Bible was a staunch proponent of slavery, dont you think that immorality and slavery would be at least somewhat pushed by some factions of Christianity???
Kinda like some good chunk of Muslims practice the awful things the Quran promotes?
It takes some strong cognitive dissonant leaps to claim what you claim and mesh that up with the reality of Christianity today.
Anyways, that’s pretty much what I’ll have to say to you on this as there’s no point in arguing. We aren’t gonna move each other’s needle at all on this. But just had to say my piece.
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deleted50478
It’s not a question of context. You can read the Bible in its entirety and it still condones slavery.
It’s not a question of translation. Some slavery was like indentured servitude, but not all. Read the verses. If you can be bought and sold, raped, and babies can be born into it for life, it’s slavery not indentured servitude. Even if I granted you that it’s different than the African slave trade (which I don’t), you have to admit biblical slavery is also immoral and encouraged by the authors of the Bible.
Christians today are largely good, moral people in spite of the Bible not because of it.
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You've read the entire Bible, and your conclusion is that it condones slavery?
Are you sure you haven't been reading the Quran?
"Religion is opium for the people." - Lenin, via Marx
"Organized religion is just another way to control (and profit from) the masses." - @FFP
Interestingly, your "zinger" point you were trying to make (which is the same as Lenin's) is different from Marx's. Marx wasn't speaking poorly of religion, but that it helped the pain of life, and "soul of soulless conditions".
Don't make the mistake of thinking all those subjugated under theocratic/autocratic governments don't also yearn to breathe free. It would be as wrong as saying all Americans are big fans of current ***** in the WH. Do you remember what happened in 2012? Do you know what's happening right now in Iraq, Sudan, Algeria, Lebanon?
Certainly agree with both your points. However, that is not what the most ardent Trumpists have been doing. They essentially demean all Muslims and try to paint them all as Sharia zealots, all in a furtherance of shutting down all immigration to the US, especially if the immigrant is brown. In regard to number 2, they would much rather create a blanket ban than go through the work of judging an individual by his merits and doing individual vetting of immigrants before granting visas.
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deleted126335
Don't make the mistake of thinking all those subjugated under theocratic/autocratic governments don't also yearn to breathe free. It would be as wrong as saying all Americans are big fans of current ***** in the WH. Do you remember what happened in 2012? Do you know what's happening right now in Iraq, Sudan, Algeria, Lebanon?
People pay for the choices of their governments. 2016 US presidential election- America First means America alone. Damage is being done that we will all pay for. Even those who didn't vote for Trump.
Imperial Japan led to millions of their citizens dead. American military occupation of Japanese home islands. Soviet Seizure and sovereignty over some Northern islands. Nazi Germany left millions of Germans dead and their nation divided for half a century. Not All Germans were Nazis or Japanese supported the militarists. All their citizens suffered the consequences of the choices of their governments.
The Arab Spring fizzled. The recent uprisings in the middle east and Africa are unlikely to go anywhere IMO. There is more than a small chance that similar horrors of WW2 will be visited upon some of the world in the future. Where do you think the most likely location for this would be? Who will bear the consequences? Who will likely get the blame should these things occur?
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This is awesome. A forum for essentially "highly educated" physicians has spiraled into one of the most ignorant, bigoted, and racist things I've seen in awhile.
Getting back to the title of the thread- Yes, Trump will again if many people hold these types of views. People need to get out of their comfort zone meet people that are not like them and then form their opinions. Instead of regurgitating whatever Islamophobic talking points they hear.
Also, its extremely myopic to sit here and criticize Arab/Muslim countries without looking at our own role in destabilizing many of these countries by supporting dictators and proxy wars.
I hope the mods DO NOT take this thread down. Other physicians need to see that their colleagues could hold these views.
Getting back to the title of the thread- Yes, Trump will again if many people hold these types of views. People need to get out of their comfort zone meet people that are not like them and then form their opinions. Instead of regurgitating whatever Islamophobic talking points they hear.
Also, its extremely myopic to sit here and criticize Arab/Muslim countries without looking at our own role in destabilizing many of these countries by supporting dictators and proxy wars.
I hope the mods DO NOT take this thread down. Other physicians need to see that their colleagues could hold these views.
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You sure love to boldly proclaim the exact opposite of what is actually stated. Outside of a group of small true racists/white supremacists, and yeah, it’s an INCREDIBLY SMALL group, no one is trying to say ALL Muslims, or ALL Mexicans, or ALL immigrants. Yet that’s what you and the left stream media shout from the roof tops all the live long day. That conservatives, Republicans, Trump supporters hate all Muslims, hate all immigrants, hate all blacks, all women, and on and on and on and on the hateful accusations go. It’s how you try and control the narrative and ignore the real issues.
And I truly hope you aren’t so disingenuous that you were including me in your “ardent Trumpists” because I most intentionally and most certainly made clear to anyone with a few brain cells, that there is a big distinction between most American and European Muslims and most sharia supporting middle eastern Muslims.
It’s such a vial form of twisted hatred that you project on others by claiming (incorrectly) that they vilify an entire people group, when the truth of the matter is that they have a specific issues with a specific action, or specific culture norms, or specific whatever that happens to fall in a large group of a certain race.
We think single motherhood is a big problem - “Oh you hate black women!”
We think immigration is out of control and brings in criminals with a bunch of perfectly fine non-criminals - “You hate all immigrants!”
We don’t think people should be compelled to do things against their religious beliefs - “You hate all gays!”
It’s typical. It’s tired. It’s a horribly disingenuous argument. It should stop.
But it won’t.
Thanks Saul.
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Dude, the whole point I'm making is that you're being nonsensical by saying that "People pay for the choices of their governments" when most of these Arab countries in turmoil never really got to pick their leaders in the first place. We elected Donald Trump. By 1933 the election results for the Nazi party matched Trump's %, and in later years the vast majority of Germans rallied strongly around Adolph Hitler and the ideas he propagated about blame for post-WWI economic suffering. The Japanese people as a whole in that era developed one of the strongest monolithic forms of nationalism the world has ever seen. You're missing the point again when you say that the Arab Spring fizzled- these people want to be free- just because they can't compete with an entire autocratic military doesn't diminish their desire.
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Ilhan Omar's opponent banned from Twitter after suggesting congresswoman should be hanged
Danielle Stella, a candidate hoping to challenge Omar for her Minnesota seat in the 2020 election, tweeted earlier this week, "If it is proven @IlhanMN passed sensitive info to Iran, she should be tried for #treason and hanged."
The post that followed included a crude drawing of a body hanging from gallows with a link to a right-wing website on her belief that Omar should be hanged if a conspiracy that Omar provided sensitive intelligence to Qatar and Iran were true.
NBC News has found no evidence that support this claim, but Stella is also a known purveyor of the far-right fringe QAnon conspiracy theory.
www.nbcnews.com
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Sure, go ahead and pretend this would happen to a non-Somali-American Muslim candidate.
Ilhan Omar's opponent banned from Twitter after suggesting congresswoman should be hanged
Danielle Stella, a candidate hoping to challenge Omar for her Minnesota seat in the 2020 election, tweeted earlier this week, "If it is proven @IlhanMN passed sensitive info to Iran, she should be tried for #treason and hanged."
The post that followed included a crude drawing of a body hanging from gallows with a link to a right-wing website on her belief that Omar should be hanged if a conspiracy that Omar provided sensitive intelligence to Qatar and Iran were true.
NBC News has found no evidence that support this claim, but Stella is also a known purveyor of the far-right fringe QAnon conspiracy theory.
Ilhan Omar's opponent banned from Twitter after suggesting congresswoman should be hanged
"Violent rhetoric inevitably leads to violent threats, and ultimately, violent acts," Omar said in response to the threatening tweets from Republican candidate Danielle Stella.
www.nbcnews.com
Sure, go ahead and pretend this would happen to a non-Somali-American Muslim candidate.
Your problem is that you've been educated in a very narrow-minded, intolerant system, that expects people to hold one view. I can understand why you're having a hard time hearing different opinions, and why you're lashing out and calling everyone else islamaphobes and racists, it's not your fault you were educated to be a closed minded person. I would encourage you to steer away from your fascist tendencies, it just doesn't reflect very well and doesn't help the discussion at all.
Tl;Dr: Calling people you disagree with "racist" is stupid.
Almost 60% of Republicans agree that there is a "great deal" of extremism amongst US Muslims. Y'all need to give it a rest with this BS about "Oh, I'm only talking about non-US and non-European Muslims." There are a large number of people in this country who see all the Muslims the same way, and it surely isn't favorable.
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I think you've totally lost your train of thought. First you say that it's the people's fault in theocratic/autocratic countries for having to live with the downsides of a fundamentalist Islamic society because they chose their leaders. I tell you it's not their fault because they never actually did choose their leaders, and in fact there are uprisings in many of these countries where people are fighting to be able to choose their leaders. Then you say it's their fault anyway because of some stretched analogy about bad parents. Gimme a break.
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deleted126335
You give me a break. I said people get the blame and suffer the consequences of their leaders' choices. Whether or not they support said leaders. It's a hard truth that you just can't accept.
Let's a take a quick trip back to the past since you want to shift the goalposts now. "If you want an Islamic society, don’t complain when you get an Islamic education system and Islamic economy and social discord because of those choices. "
Your statement presupposes that a billion some people are currently choosing to live under some some militaristic/religious autocrat. I'm trying to get it through your thick skull that many Muslims would prefer to live in democracies and in fact are fighting for the right to do so. Ergo, all this talk about how backward and ignorant all non-US/non-European Muslims are and how much they desire 100% Sharia law is mostly stereotype.
Polls conducted by Gallup and PEW in Muslim-majority countries indicate that most Muslims see no contradiction between democratic values and religious principles, desiring neither a theocracy, nor a secular democracy, but rather a political model where democratic institutions and values can coexist with the values and principles of sharia. /
That sounds scary at first, right? Consider for a moment that 46% of Americans think the bible should be a source for US legislation. No, majority-Muslim countries are not as secular as we are (as pgg and I discussed). Mocking them and their religion, or shaming them about their "choices," however, will bring them no closer to the secular light.
Trigger warning:
Fact: The punishment for Treason is death by hanging or firing squad.
Fact: X wrote on Twitter "If it is proven that Y...then..."
Fact: If it is proven that Y committed Treason, the punishment would be death.
Side note, (only because it is brought up here frequently): I've always personally thought that Trump's comment about being able to shoot somebody and not lose voters was a coded reference to a firing squad for Treason, which IMO will likely happen in the years to come. Better get accustomed to discussions about the gallows and firing squads, because I feel this won't be the last time somebody publicly brings it up.
I find it quite funny that the article states that NBC News has found no evidence that IO passed along sensitive materials to Qatar/Iran. I mean, laugh out loud funny. This is the same NBC News that claimed it didn't know that Matt Lauer had a rape button installed on his desk, that hired Morning Joe even after his young intern died mysteriously of a head injury in his office, that covered up for the serial sexual abuser Harvey Weinstein by spiking that story? The same NBC News that has pushed the Kavanaugh hoax, the Russia hoax, the Ukraine hoax? I'm supposed to believe that they know anything about any news? Hahahahahaha! Quite funny, indeed.
I haven't personally read X's Twitter posts, but if this article accurately quoted her, why the Twitter ban? She stated a fact that a punishment for Treason is hanging, and by using the wording "If it is proven that..." she is not making an accusation. I mean, isn't this exactly what the MSM news has been doing for 3 years in regards to everything regarding Trump, Trump policies, Republican policies, etc. The MSM has changed their entire business model. Instead of reporting facts, they wax poetic about "If this is true...blah, blah, blah..." Yet they remain on air 24/7. Hypocrisy at it's finest.
Fact: The punishment for Treason is death by hanging or firing squad.
Fact: X wrote on Twitter "If it is proven that Y...then..."
Fact: If it is proven that Y committed Treason, the punishment would be death.
Side note, (only because it is brought up here frequently): I've always personally thought that Trump's comment about being able to shoot somebody and not lose voters was a coded reference to a firing squad for Treason, which IMO will likely happen in the years to come. Better get accustomed to discussions about the gallows and firing squads, because I feel this won't be the last time somebody publicly brings it up.
I find it quite funny that the article states that NBC News has found no evidence that IO passed along sensitive materials to Qatar/Iran. I mean, laugh out loud funny. This is the same NBC News that claimed it didn't know that Matt Lauer had a rape button installed on his desk, that hired Morning Joe even after his young intern died mysteriously of a head injury in his office, that covered up for the serial sexual abuser Harvey Weinstein by spiking that story? The same NBC News that has pushed the Kavanaugh hoax, the Russia hoax, the Ukraine hoax? I'm supposed to believe that they know anything about any news? Hahahahahaha! Quite funny, indeed.
I haven't personally read X's Twitter posts, but if this article accurately quoted her, why the Twitter ban? She stated a fact that a punishment for Treason is hanging, and by using the wording "If it is proven that..." she is not making an accusation. I mean, isn't this exactly what the MSM news has been doing for 3 years in regards to everything regarding Trump, Trump policies, Republican policies, etc. The MSM has changed their entire business model. Instead of reporting facts, they wax poetic about "If this is true...blah, blah, blah..." Yet they remain on air 24/7. Hypocrisy at it's finest.
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Whistleblower in New Orleans hotel collapse is deported to Honduras
Delmer Joel Ramirez Palma reported safety lapses to supervisors before the Hard Rock hotel disaster that killed three
A Honduran construction worker injured during the Hard Rock hotel collapse in New Orleans was deported by US immigration authorities on Friday, his lawyers confirmed.
Delmer Joel Ramirez Palma had reported potentially dangerous lapses in construction safety to his supervisors before the collapse, according to lawyers working on his immigration case and a civil complaint filed by Ramirez Palma and several other workers against hotel developers.
The collapse on 12 October killed three people and injured dozens. The bodies of two victims are still inside the half-crumbled remains of the 18-storey structure in downtown New Orleans. Developers are working with city officials to finalise plans to demolish the rest of the building.
Immediately after the accident, Ramirez Palma was interviewed by the local Spanish-language media outlet Jambalaya News. Two days later he was arrested by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (Ice), while fishing with his family in a national wildlife refuge, because he lacked identification documents.
The timing and circumstances of his October arrest raised suspicions among his lawyers and advocates that his detainment was connected to the hotel collapse and his previous safety complaints. The arrest and planned deportation drew widespread criticism from immigration advocates and some state officials in Louisiana.
King Company, Ramirez Palma’s supervising company at the Hard Rock site, did not respond to interview requests from the Guardian.
Mary Yanick, a senior lawyer at the New Orleans Worker Center for Racial Justice, an advocacy group, said Ramirez Palma had been interviewed by the whistleblower division of the US government’s Occupational Safety and Health Administration (Osha) on Monday. Osha and the New Orleans police department are investigating the hotel collapse.
Osha did not respond to a request for comment on Ramirez Palma’s role in the investigation.
This week Ava Dejoie, secretary of the Louisiana Workforce Commission (LWC), also advocated for Ramirez Palma’s release, citing his role in the Hard Rock investigation and, more generally, the need to protect whistleblowers from retribution. The LWC is responsible for enforcing labor laws in the state.
In a 27 November letter addressed to William P Joyce, the New Orleans field office director of Ice, Dejoie implored the agency to release Ramirez Palma, stay his deportation and “commit to neutrality in ongoing labor investigations for all witnesses and victims”. The letter was seen by the Guardian.
“In the aftermath of a disaster of this scale, the public needs all available information to understand what happened at the worksite, including information from Mr Ramirez Palma and workers like him who witnessed safety violations before the collapse,” Dejoie wrote. “If he is deported, the public may never know what key information is being deported with him. The investigations will undoubtedly suffer.”
As of Friday afternoon she had not received a response to the letter. Ice representatives did not respond to multiple requests for comment on Ramirez Palma’s case.
Ramirez Palma’s lawyers previously believed he would be deported earlier in the week but that was delayed until today for unknown reasons. In 2016 a judge ordered he be deported. He had been regularly checking in with Ice since then and filed for a stay of deportation during 2019, Yanick said.
A citizen of Honduras, Ramirez Palma had lived with his wife and three children in New Orleans for 18 years. His lawyers and wife said he was seriously injured in the Hard Rock collapse and was briefly hospitalised for head trauma, internal inflammation and an acute eye injury that still requires surgery.
www.theguardian.com
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Hard Rock I'm sure will get off scot-free, or maybe a trivial fine at worst. This guy has been here for 18 years with his wife and kids, pays taxes, and gets deported even though he still needs surgery for a work-related injury. Justice served, right?
Whistleblower in New Orleans hotel collapse is deported to Honduras
Delmer Joel Ramirez Palma reported safety lapses to supervisors before the Hard Rock hotel disaster that killed three
A Honduran construction worker injured during the Hard Rock hotel collapse in New Orleans was deported by US immigration authorities on Friday, his lawyers confirmed.
Delmer Joel Ramirez Palma had reported potentially dangerous lapses in construction safety to his supervisors before the collapse, according to lawyers working on his immigration case and a civil complaint filed by Ramirez Palma and several other workers against hotel developers.
The collapse on 12 October killed three people and injured dozens. The bodies of two victims are still inside the half-crumbled remains of the 18-storey structure in downtown New Orleans. Developers are working with city officials to finalise plans to demolish the rest of the building.
Immediately after the accident, Ramirez Palma was interviewed by the local Spanish-language media outlet Jambalaya News. Two days later he was arrested by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (Ice), while fishing with his family in a national wildlife refuge, because he lacked identification documents.
The timing and circumstances of his October arrest raised suspicions among his lawyers and advocates that his detainment was connected to the hotel collapse and his previous safety complaints. The arrest and planned deportation drew widespread criticism from immigration advocates and some state officials in Louisiana.
King Company, Ramirez Palma’s supervising company at the Hard Rock site, did not respond to interview requests from the Guardian.
Mary Yanick, a senior lawyer at the New Orleans Worker Center for Racial Justice, an advocacy group, said Ramirez Palma had been interviewed by the whistleblower division of the US government’s Occupational Safety and Health Administration (Osha) on Monday. Osha and the New Orleans police department are investigating the hotel collapse.
Osha did not respond to a request for comment on Ramirez Palma’s role in the investigation.
This week Ava Dejoie, secretary of the Louisiana Workforce Commission (LWC), also advocated for Ramirez Palma’s release, citing his role in the Hard Rock investigation and, more generally, the need to protect whistleblowers from retribution. The LWC is responsible for enforcing labor laws in the state.
In a 27 November letter addressed to William P Joyce, the New Orleans field office director of Ice, Dejoie implored the agency to release Ramirez Palma, stay his deportation and “commit to neutrality in ongoing labor investigations for all witnesses and victims”. The letter was seen by the Guardian.
“In the aftermath of a disaster of this scale, the public needs all available information to understand what happened at the worksite, including information from Mr Ramirez Palma and workers like him who witnessed safety violations before the collapse,” Dejoie wrote. “If he is deported, the public may never know what key information is being deported with him. The investigations will undoubtedly suffer.”
As of Friday afternoon she had not received a response to the letter. Ice representatives did not respond to multiple requests for comment on Ramirez Palma’s case.
Ramirez Palma’s lawyers previously believed he would be deported earlier in the week but that was delayed until today for unknown reasons. In 2016 a judge ordered he be deported. He had been regularly checking in with Ice since then and filed for a stay of deportation during 2019, Yanick said.
A citizen of Honduras, Ramirez Palma had lived with his wife and three children in New Orleans for 18 years. His lawyers and wife said he was seriously injured in the Hard Rock collapse and was briefly hospitalised for head trauma, internal inflammation and an acute eye injury that still requires surgery.
Whistleblower in New Orleans hotel collapse is deported to Honduras
Delmer Joel Ramirez Palma reported safety lapses to supervisors before the Hard Rock hotel disaster that killed three
Hard Rock I'm sure will get off scot-free, or maybe a trivial fine at worst. This guy has been here for 18 years with his wife and kids, pays taxes, and gets deported even though he still needs surgery for a work-related injury. Justice served, right?
Almost 60% of Republicans agree that there is a "great deal" of extremism amongst US Muslims. Y'all need to give it a rest with this BS about "Oh, I'm only talking about non-US and non-European Muslims." There are a large number of people in this country who see all the Muslims the same way, and it surely isn't favorable.
Goodness, you are disingenuous...
First off, your poll says 56% of republicans feel among US Muslims there is a “great deal/fair amount” but you conveniently left out the fair amount part. You also left out that nearly a quarter of democrats feel the same way. What is the definition of extremism in this poll? What’s actually being asked? Finally, are you equating this to hatred as you previously have stated? If so, you believe 1 out of 4 democrats hates all Muslims?
Ugh
[emoji15]
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You can't really use the 1933 election as that was after a wave of violence by the SA and new laws that made membership in several other political parties against the law. There was just massive voter suppression.
The election you want to use is November 1932 when Hitler got right at 1/3rd of the votes.
Yes, dumb dumb, I do think a large number of dems also have despicable views about Muslims. Luckily, the party has managed to push these people to the fringes instead of making Islamophobia part of their platform and pushing people like Peter King, Steve King, Duncan Hunter, Stephen Miller, Bannon and Trump front and center.
At the end of the day, I understand that I have partisan leanings, but my views on politics and ethics don't live and die with the democratic party. Your problem is that you will never understand that you're entirely a partisan hack, despite your weak, tepid, unsupported claim that you don't agree with Trump on everything. That's why you were all up in vapors when @FFP dared to insult your god-emperor. FFP and I agree on some things and vehemently disagree on some things, and that's OK because I know he is a moderate and I'm on the left. And I remember that you couldn't stop cheerleading him on when we were disagreeing, but the very second he stated (quite correctly) that Trump was a corrupt criminal who deserved to be impeached, the best insult you could come up with is that he had switched sides on you and he was now starting to sound like me (lol). That let him, me, and everyone else know that you are not (as I stated at the very onset of this thread) interested in any reasonable discussion.
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The one where they still had a plurality and had 50% more Reichstag seats than the next most represented party...
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American attorney and author Mike Godwinin the Voice of America headquarters, 2017
Godwin's law (or Godwin's rule of Hitler analogies)[1][2] is an Internet adage asserting that "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1";[2][3] that is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Adolf Hitler or his deeds, the point at which effectively the discussion or thread often ends. Promulgated by the American attorney and author Mike Godwin in 1990,[2] Godwin's law originally referred specifically to Usenet newsgroup discussions.[4] It is now applied to any threaded online discussion, such as Internet forums, chat rooms, and comment threads, as well as to speeches, articles, and other rhetoric[5][6] where reductio ad Hitlerum occurs.
Godwin has stated that he introduced Godwin's law in 1990 as an experiment in memetics.[2]
In 2012, "Godwin's law" became an entry in the third edition of the Oxford English Dictionary.[7]
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Multiple complaints have been received about this thread. Temporarily locking thread until tomorrow.
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deleted171991
No, my point was NOT the same, by far, though some people do depend on their religion as if it were a drug. My point was that organized religion has been used as a tool of oppression and mass manipulation for millennia, regardless of religion. We have had a lot of wars and suffering because of religious organizations.
And that was just a small part of my post, which I am sure you have read so carefully before comparing me to Marx and Lenin.
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It was the first thing you said, and, as that, that is what most people get from your post. Your words were sought carefully - you know what you meant. And, even if not your intent, you certainly (from my viewpoint, in the weeds) were impugning anyone of faith.
And, I give you props - you gave me the first negative reaction I've ever gotten on SDN!
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deleted171991
I don't disagree with that Lenin quote (for some/many people). I don't respect blind belief in anything that one cannot at least somewhat verify, not even in science. That's why I ended with the parallel about CVP, because people who believe blindly in one thing tend to believe blindly in others.
I don't consider myself a religious person, although I am agnostic, hence occasionally spiritual. I do respect other people's beliefs (especially if thoughtful), and I have come to appreciate the positive part of organized religion for some people, who would turn bad otherwise ("humans are beasts deep inside" - to very imperfectly quote Jordan Peterson). But, historically, religious fundamentalism (which was what we had been talking mostly about for the last day), has brought a lot of wars and suffering.
Every time I look at a great medieval cathedral I wonder how many people have suffered to pay all those taxes and suffered through that backbreaking work to build those buildings for some megalomaniac priest or aristocrat. They are the wasteful palaces of organized religion, made so big not only for the glory of the deity, but mostly to make the believers feel small and insignificant, hence obedient.
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Oh, so you mean I supported FFP when I agreed with his positions and then I didn’t support him when he started to talk nonsense? Yeah, that sounds like my approach to Trump and everyone pretty much. Thanks for laying out how I function based on how truthful I think ones comments are.
I was looking through some poll numbers and was a bit surprised to find such high support for sharia among US Muslims
I wasn’t aware that it was that high. Perhaps this large chunk of Muslims are not very vocal about their support for sharia law, which is great. And hopefully they stay that way. But it is concerning that there is such high numbers of support here in America. Perhaps that info correlates to the numbers you posted. Sharia is extreme and does not jive with America. Period.
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deleted87051
And some American Christians believe the Bible should influence legislation. That is also concerning. Nothing scarier than a legislator with a mandate from god.
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deleted87051
The thread has certainly drained the swamp.
Can you please elaborate on this opinion? Perhaps provide a few specific examples of this? Thanks.
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deleted87051
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Please, describe to me how Christian values are anywhere equivalent to Sharia law. Obviously there's the abortion issue (which isn't necessarily a Christian issue per se - see the chart below), but what other evil Christian legislation are you concerned about?
False equivalencies with Sharia law are just that, false.
I don't think 100% Sharia jives with America either. I do think Muslims who are capable of participating in democracy, following the law, and respecting the Establishment clause and Free Exercise clause have as much a right to immigrate as anyone else.
But again, before anyone uses that graph as a spooky, scary warning against Muslims, consider for a moment that we have never had an American president who has not proclaimed himself a Christian. 85% of the members of Congress are Christian. One-third of Americans say that religion (i.e. presumably Christianity) is essential for national identity. The last two SCOTUS justices confirmed + another 2-3 already on the court are going to use evangelical principles to guide their decisions on Roe v. Wade challenges. Banning gay marriage was the law of the land until very recently (because the bible said marriage is between a man and a woman). We in many ways are already a religious nation- it just happens to be a religion which doesn't frighten you as much.
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deleted87051
Pew polling is usually pretty good but where in the world do you find a group of Evangelicals of which 33% of them say abortion should be legal in all/most cases?
I'm trying to reconcile the tone in your post with the stern admonitions I've heard from Democrats for the last three years that "nobody is above the law."
You're having trouble reconciling because people who see the world in black and white frequently don't understand that "the law" is not always synonymous with justice being served. But honestly, if you're defending Trump at this point then it's pretty clear you don't give a sht about either.
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deleted643396
These anti-abortion laws that are being proposed scare me more than any Medicare for all bill that will have us working for $15 an hour. It has the potential to criminalize a doctor-patient relationship and put the government in direct oversight of medical decision-making. Not good.
You have a real obsession with Sharia law. Is that your new buzzword? Any law that is guided by religion or some sort of deity is wrong and a law that I will always vehemently oppose. I get annoyed when I see “In God We Trust” on the dollar bill. The separation of “church” and state is a integral part of our nation. The same way you don’t want to here about transsexuals switching teams is how I feel about religion...keep it to yourself. Don’t bother me with your prayers and ideas about a magic man in the sky. Christian fundamentalism is much more likely to gain ground here and favor in our government than any kind of Sharia law. I wouldn’t worry too much about having to read the Koran anytime soon.
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deleted171991
"Translation" of Sharia into Christian (Catholic): Inquisition. 😉
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