I am very lucky in that my lab has a large (ongoing) study that I have free range over. But I've been with the project for ~5 years now and have played my part in the collection, coding and management of the data. I completely feel your pain about awaiting the decision on a paper - and worse is waiting 5-6 months only to get rejected. The range of my pubs is pretty large. First-authored ones range from 1.8 - 7.7 (avg. ~3.2). Some strategies (beyond luck) that I have used are: (1) publishing things as brief reports rather than full length articles (which expedites the writing, review, and revision process); (2) delegating writing of various sections to colleagues on the paper (and sometimes recruiting colleagues with expertise); (3) turning projects from classes (e.g., final papers etc.) into review papers (and likewise with pieces of my dissertation which may comprise portions of the intro or general discussion); and (4) working part time as a research analyst at local hospitals/mental health centres, which usually results in shared authorship (and similarly by getting involved in research at practica). Other than that, I just try to always have the next idea ready to go before a decision on the first is made. The caveat of course is the trade-off in clinical hours, which could be better by shifting the balance.
2015-2016 APPIC Internship Cycle Thread
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I am very lucky in that my lab has a large (ongoing) study that I have free range over. But I've been with the project for ~5 years now and have played my part in the collection, coding and management of the data. I completely feel your pain about awaiting the decision on a paper - and worse is waiting 5-6 months only to get rejected. The range of my pubs is pretty large. First-authored ones range from 1.8 - 7.7 (avg. ~3.2). Some strategies (beyond luck) that I have used are: (1) publishing things as brief reports rather than full length articles (which expedites the writing, review, and revision process); (2) delegating writing of various sections to colleagues on the paper (and sometimes recruiting colleagues with expertise); (3) turning projects from classes (e.g., final papers etc.) into review papers (and likewise with pieces of my dissertation which may comprise portions of the intro or general discussion); and (4) working part time as a research analyst at local hospitals/mental health centres, which usually results in shared authorship (and similarly by getting involved in research at practica). Other than that, I just try to always have the next idea ready to go before a decision on the first is made. The caveat of course is the trade-off in clinical hours, which could be better by shifting the balance.
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My program doesn't have an active research line under any faculty so I'm left to design, implement, and do everything myself. It definitely would be a lot easier with an open database of information. Conjunctively, although others are interested in research, it is a much lessen level of interest. Between writing external grants to fund the projects and doing recruitment, it makes me feel like I'm running as fast as I can to hit the 1-2 in press per year. I've seen the same trade off in hours as well.
I would say that makes your accomplishment of 1-2 papers each year particularly impressive!
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Glad someone started this thread!
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Hi everyone! I have a question that no faculty in my program seem to be able to answer. I'm a 6th year applying this year and moved back to my home state because of financial issues. Unfortunately I do not have a practicum experience right now. I know that the internship app asks about current practicum placements and anticipated number of hours. I have about 830 direct hours right now, but will it look bad if I don't have a placement by the time I submit my apps? Your thoughts and previous experience/knowledge with this is much appreciated!
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There are definitely folks who are not in practicum placements during the year they apply. That area of the AAPI is just to give people who are still accruing hours post application to get some credit for some of their future work. If you're able to, do something else psych-related like taking a psychometrist position or volunteering at a relevant agency so you at least have something "hands on" to speak to in your application/interviews. I don't think you need to anticipate sites looking at your app vs another's and discard yours because that person had a current placement and you didn't. It would be a different story if you only had like 400 direct hours, but you have a decent amount.
My advice to all applicants: Every single one of you will think of at least one reason or another to fear your application will look "bad" compared to others. Nine times out of ten this is caused by anxiety and folks who have been through the process will tell you how that particular issue is not critical or deal-breaking to sites (and they will be right!). If you had that serious of an issue that could restrict you from being selected by a site, your school probably would not have given you the green light to apply. Yes, there will be other applications that look better than yours, but there will also be many that don't look nearly as good as yours. To increase your chances of getting interviews, (this is the same old story but it's CRITICAL) apply to sites that make sense for you, your previous training, and your future training interests. If a site wants "X" and you're not "X," then, yeah, your application will look inferior. Picking the right sites to apply to will increase your confidence, as well as remembering that even though there may be Johnny Rockstars out there, you are most definitely a Johnny Rockstar compared to others and especially if you are smart about where you're applying. Don't get caught up in the small stuff even if it seems really really big (because it probably isn't).
This is such good advice. There is no magic formula. There are many variables in this process and you will survive it best if you look for what feels like a good "fit" for you. Don't work to fit yourself into sites that are what other folks tout or your advisor's favorite. Figure out who you are and where you are now and describe that with some authenticity and humor and try to avoid obsessing on all the advice, options, etc. out there. This is an important year but it is only a year and it will not determine the entire future course of your life.
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I do think having a high number of publications can hurt you some places, ironically, because it makes people look for the "smoke and mirrors" behind it, even there are none. I'm applying for faculty jobs at R1s, which are probably some of the most research-y jobs you can apply for, and even then, some of the feedback I've been getting from my faculty mentors have been to downplay my publication productivity and not mention it in cover letters, instead focusing on one or two specific articles that really highlight my research agenda well. If your research ties into your clinical foci or involves clinical research, that may help.
I really, really doubt this will hurt you. Your hours look pretty strong to me. It's really a matter of quality, as well as other aspects of your CV at this point.
This was my thinking too. Aside from academy sites, my feeling is that being typecast as a researcher may deter sites that are more interested in training future clinicians rather than scientists or clinician-scientists. Of course, this won't be true for all sites. My hours are modest (~350 intervention; 250 assessment), but with training at top national hospitals. So we will see what happens. I'm surprised that in your case it has been recommended to de-emphasize your research - isn't this what R1 jobs are all about? Thank you for sharing though, this will be good advice to file away for future job searches!
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600 F2F hours should be fine with most sites with a moderate or higher research emphasis (AMCs, VAs, big hospitals, etc), and I imagine you'll do well.
FWIW, I've heard that hours past the minimums are largely a diminishing returns situation at many sites. I'm a bit an outlier when it comes to publications (35+, ~40% first-author--not the best ratio, certainly, but not *awful*), and it's been a surprisingly mixed bag in terms of faculty reactions. Like I said, it seems to invite people to try to poke holes in it (saying they must be all "gift authorships," for example), which can be frustrating. I've worked a lot on how to present it so it doesn't come across as arrogant--and I'm certainly acutely aware of the weak points in my publication record and CV to the degree that I don't feel that I'd even have justification to be arrogant--but the number itself seems to throw people at times. The "sell yourself but don't sell yourself too hard" thing is tricky, especially when research is my best selling point.
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That's really good advice. Thanks.
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Does anyone know when sites typically post their new brochures? I feel like none of the sites I'm applying to have released their most recent brochures and it worries me a bit!
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Some won't post new brochures, but will update their APPIC directory page. Some sites literally wait until late September/early October to upload new information, and it's very annoying if you're someone who likes to get started early. I recommend to everyone to keep checking back before submitting applications, as last year I had 2 sites decide at the last minute they wanted sample reports and I didn't see it before sending out my materials. Also some sites change their application deadline last minute and you can miss out on applying (that happened to me, too). If there are sites where you are dying for updated brochures (or brochures in general if they haven't linked them to their directory page), you can email the training directors and request information or ask if they have made changes since the last brochure was printed. Everyone I interacted with was very friendly and accommodating.
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Usually sometime in September.
I just wanted to say good luck to everyone and if anyone wants to connect about applying to internship as a parent-let me know! I was very anxious going through the process with a 1 year old last year, but it can and will work out!!
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Hi everyone-
Good luck to all!
Just a quick question for anyone who may be able to help. There are a number of places I am applying with 2, 3 or even 4+ tracks. If the program specifies that you can apply to more than one because they are different match numbers, do you write separate cover letters? Is there even a place to upload a second or third cover letter?
Some of the brochures are more better at highlighting how to go about this. I am asking for those places that are less clear about how to do this.
thanks!
Good luck to all!
Just a quick question for anyone who may be able to help. There are a number of places I am applying with 2, 3 or even 4+ tracks. If the program specifies that you can apply to more than one because they are different match numbers, do you write separate cover letters? Is there even a place to upload a second or third cover letter?
Some of the brochures are more better at highlighting how to go about this. I am asking for those places that are less clear about how to do this.
thanks!
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I saw this play out this year. One of our higher up psychologists was almost outright against interviewing applicants with more than 10, stating, "theyre usually devoid interpersonally," or "characterologically narcissistic." Bit of a false dichotomy I thought and not very critical but it was what it was. overall it was very enlightening (frightening) witnessing how arbitrary the ranking process was down the line. (I.e., "did you see the shoes she was wearing?!" "She chose to wear that dress?!?" "He looked at me weird,". "that tie was atrocious" "she played with her food at lunch," "she seemed abrasive when asking where the bathroom was," and on and on. It also became clear that perceived likeability was what really differentiated the top from middle tier in the rankings. Gender was huge as well (in fact, there was inherent/covert gender stuff/sexism playing out through the entire selection process, as you could tell from my comment examples). If you were a dude it seemed to be a whole lot harder to incur critical comments that would affect rank order.
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Usually they say in their brochure or descriptive materials but from what I've seen, you just write one cover letter and mention all the tracks that you are interested in explicitly. Also watch because sometimes they have a limit on the number of tracks you can apply to. I think the match number is relevant when you actually match on match day and you are placed with that specific number but check on this part. Hope this helps!
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I wrote one cover letter unless directed otherwise. I indicated which tracks I was applying to in the first paragraph, in bold. After interviews, some sites made it clear which tracks I was being considered for at that point, which I appreciated.
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Hi everyone,
I have been eliciting letters of recommendation, and I wanted to see if anyone has any insights about the new standardized reference form. One of my references specifically asked me to draft responses for each section, which I am finding to be quite daunting. I have drafted my own free-form letter for this reference in the past, but the specifics on the new form seem fairly irrelevant. On the other hand, the form directs writers to fill in every question if possible. Lastly, I don't know what to put in for the question about areas for growth, especially because this is a supervisor who has not seen my work for a few years. Does anyone have any advice?
Thanks!
I have been eliciting letters of recommendation, and I wanted to see if anyone has any insights about the new standardized reference form. One of my references specifically asked me to draft responses for each section, which I am finding to be quite daunting. I have drafted my own free-form letter for this reference in the past, but the specifics on the new form seem fairly irrelevant. On the other hand, the form directs writers to fill in every question if possible. Lastly, I don't know what to put in for the question about areas for growth, especially because this is a supervisor who has not seen my work for a few years. Does anyone have any advice?
Thanks!
For sites that start internship in September they may not get focused on the next year's process until their current year cohort is oriented--which is not really a bad sign. They are taking care of their interns and will get updates in place in September or October. In most cases there will not be big changes... Just plan to go back and review as you get further along in the application process.
Unless they say otherwise, it is fine to send a single cover letter and explain why multiple tracks are of interest. They probably would like you to indicate preferences if you have them, but it is not necessary.
I'm also finding it to be a daunting task and have several letter writers that want me to also draft out the sections. I've been told by my DCT that, with the new standardized form, if there is a section one supervisor cannot directly talk about, they can either write about what they've heard or you've told them, or they can write a joint letter with another supervisor. My DCT also said to avoid leaving blank sections. I've been fortunate that my letter writers seem to be open to putting down whatever I want them to (i.e., speaking about indirect knowledge of my competencies) so long as it's realistic and they agree. So far, I am NOT a fan of this format especially trying to draft 2 myself and making sure they don't sound the same! It feels like this new format forces writers to be specific and concrete which is also adding to the difficulty. I've found it somewhat helpful to pull statements made in previous letters and try to fit it under a section so I don't have to totally reinvent the wheel. Still hard though...
As far as areas of growth, my DCT stated you should identify or discuss these beforehand with your letter writers and try to identify areas you need more training in (ex: family therapy) and NOT weaknesses. Interested to hear what others suggest.
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I'm not super familiar with the new form, but I don't like when people ask someone to write their own LOR. It isn't easy and, well, it shouldn't be, because you're not supposed to be the one writing it.
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ITA. It's so hard to walk the line between a great LOR and feeling like an arrogant braggart when writing one's own. Ugh.
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Agreed. Apparently (according to my DCT and others applying) it's not at all uncommon. My DCT stated that perhaps it was a good thing, because it meant that the letter-writer was busy but didn't want to just give a generic recommendation. I'm a bit skeptical, though.
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I second this. When going on interviews, you have to remember that this will be a job. Your potential future coworkers and bosses are going to hire somebody they like to work with vs. someone with tons of experience but who is rude and doesn't smile. I have also heard some people say, "I want to hire someone I would refer a family member to for counseling." This means they're looking for someone who is relational, compassionate, calm, and professional.
I have also been reading several books by entrepreneurs, such as Michael Port who wrote Book Yourself Solid, and all of them stress being likeable and relational as being the key to make sales, secure jobs, and attract clients.
100% agree students shouldn't have to write their letters. I believe some suggest it b/c you do upfront work to remind them about all of your work and accomplishments with them and so you can identify your own areas of growth? I'm fine with writing the objective stuff, just not the subjective portions.
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Why wouldn't an internship site be "self-serving?" They invest money and time into the intern, and need to do their best to obtain interns (who are "employees", in most cases) who will contribute most to the setting. You are not advocating for sites to give a higher rank to somebody who they think will be less likely to benefit the internship than another applicant? When I was on an internship faculty, we were definitely biased towards applicants from specific training programs, as well as towards students of specific mentors. This was based on previous positive experiences- their training, abilities, and experience seemed to be more predictable and in line with the work we needed them to do. We wanted interns that would stay for post-doc, and then stick around and work for us.
That all said, there are many biases that creep in because of the over-reliance on interviews.
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Question from one of the students in my internship cohort: how closely should we adhere to the 500-word limit for essays? Several of us think that 5-6 words over or under is okay but more than that may be risky. Opinions?
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We dont have time to count for goodness sake, lol. So dont make us. Make sense?
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why take the chance? if you can do 506, you can do 500. Omit needless words.
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Do you guys think it's strange or unwise to devote your autobiographical essay to the specialty population you're interested in and closely related training goals? That's sort of how my first draft reads, but I'm wondering about the utility of this since only about half of your internship experiences at most are dedicated to this area, even at specialized sites.
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I am applying to BOP sites; however, I have no personal contact with anyone who has recently been through this process with them. I would love any feedback/guidance specific to applying to these sites. Also, how does the usajobs.gov portion work (i.e., will I be directed to this by sites interested in me or is this something I can have completed prior to the submission deadline). I have looked on the website a couple times but have been unable to find positions specific to internship. Thank you in advance!
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USAJOBS is a non issue/not involved. at least it wasn't 5 years ago.
The interview has the typical clinical interviews, then an interview that asks about security issues and background investigation questions. No cell phones are allowed inside the facilities. Dont wear alot of mental.
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I applied to BOP sites last year, and basically you either get a rejection or an "invitation to move forward" and fill out the usajobs thing. From what I remember, the TD sent specific and thorough instructions on how to access what you need on usajobs and you're given a 7-day window to complete the paperwork. I believe you needed transcripts and possibly a CV to upload (I have blocked out a lot of this in my brain, so forgive me! haha). People at usajobs review your application to determine if you are qualified for the position. My understanding is that last year was the first year they did this, and TDs were afraid that the non-internship-related folks at usajobs would accidentally weed people out and there was a ton of paranoia about it. Luckily it all seemed to work out. Once you're cleared by that end, then you'll hear from the TD to schedule an interview.
To work at a BOP, you have to pass a test that basically determines whether or not you're too naive to work in a prison. The test can be taken at any BOP, but you must pass it or else they won't even proceed with the interview. The good news is that if you interview at say 4 BOP sites, you only have to take the test once and you'll be covered. I forget what score you needed to pass (possibly an 80?) and most people I know just barely passed. The advice I was given was to think like a corrections officer and NOT like a psychologist when you take the test, and that really helped me passed. There was an HR interview that consisted of random prison-related questions as well as some psych questions, and you have to watch a video and practice writing incident reports. And all that is before you even do the internship interview. Applying to a BOP is certainly a marathon.
I also want to note that I heard a lot of rumors beforehand that we'd have to take a polygraph or be grilled about our background during the interview day, and that was not that case. The only background-related thing we did was fill out a basic little packet with the same questions you get in the electronic version (arrest history, drug history, traffic violations, etc etc). I didn't really have anything to hide but I was super worried my interview anxiety would read on a polygraph and I'd look sketchy. Thankfully that was not the case.
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I am applying to mostly BOP sites, so my anxieties rest in the "if I get interviews, what if I fail the test and am no longer eligible at any of them." Thank you for responding to my question!! This is incredibly helpful!
If the sites you are applying to all include this population or training relevant to work with them, then I think you can benefit from being specific. It shows you have reflected on specific career goals and your identity as an early career psychologist, as well as your actual (not just aspirational) knowledge of the population. It makes for a more detailed picture of you as a person and coming across clearly is an advantage I think.
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Hi all! First, I want to say a big good luck to all of you applying for internship this year! It's a crazy, daunting, insecurity-invoking process. Remember to evaluate how you fit a site's needs and how they fit yours, then show that to them in the cover letter. Some of the sites you anticipate being a good fit at will fall to the bottom of your list following interviews, and vice versa! Good things CAN come from this process...it doesn't seem like it now, but it really does help you hone your interests in the end.
Second, I know that it can be really annoying when sites don't post their updated brochures early enough in the process. The TD at the VA St. Louis Health Care System wanted me to post on here that a technical glitch prevented their new brochure from being available as early as they had hoped. The new brochure has been up for a while, but she wanted to make sure people were aware of it. So, for anyone interested in the St. Louis VA as a site, or anyone who knows anyone interested, here is the link for the correct brochure:
http://www.stlouis.va.gov/careers/STL_VA_Health_Care_System_Psychology_Training_Programs.asp
Best of luck!!!
Second, I know that it can be really annoying when sites don't post their updated brochures early enough in the process. The TD at the VA St. Louis Health Care System wanted me to post on here that a technical glitch prevented their new brochure from being available as early as they had hoped. The new brochure has been up for a while, but she wanted to make sure people were aware of it. So, for anyone interested in the St. Louis VA as a site, or anyone who knows anyone interested, here is the link for the correct brochure:
http://www.stlouis.va.gov/careers/STL_VA_Health_Care_System_Psychology_Training_Programs.asp
Best of luck!!!
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There was an IT problem in the VA where they moved the training webpages to a different area, but never took the old ones offline, and when people would search for specific training programs, they'd get the old brochure. At this point, if the thing you are getting looks outdated, it's ok to e-mail someone and ask if that is the most recent information. Most likely not the program's fault, rather the terrible IT infrastructure in the VA.
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I want to piggyback on the two previous posts and remind people that new brochures/new info are still very likely to come, even though it feels pretty late in the game. My site is still planning to release an updated brochure during this cycle, and I'm sure this is especially true for sites with later application deadlines like mid-November to early December. Before submitting materials, do a last minute double check of the site's brochure or website and keep an eye on the program update emails from the APPIC listserv. I got tripped up last year with three sites that changed requirements/deadlines within the last week or two before the due date without me checking and it was pretty embarrassing. So, my advice is - don't be me. 
Feeling unbelievably burned out on this applying process. (If I re-read my essays/cover letters one more time...)
I'm actually more worried about getting 0-1 interviews than not matching at this point. Is this normal?
I'm actually more worried about getting 0-1 interviews than not matching at this point. Is this normal?
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yeah, I'm feeling really burned out on applications at this point. I think it may have to do with other stuff including the fact that it's also a really busy time for my diss data collection but it worries me that I'm not even done with final drafts of my essays or early drafts of my cover letters. Not so worried about getting interviews, just surprised by my feeling like I just want to submit what I have now just so I can get it over with.
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Question: My transcripts had to be resubmitted to APPIC, and now they might not be up by the 11/1 deadlines . . . does anyone know if sites will actually refuse to review my application because of this?
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Not sure this is normal, whatever that means anyway, but it sure does capture the way I'm feeling pretty well. I'm not feeling particularly confident about any of my written stuff and the cover letters are just really annoying at this point ... so yeah, totally worried about not getting any interviews at all. But hey, if that happens to us, at least we won't be alone.
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So who's going to start the 2015-2016 APPIC internship interview thread? I've thought of doing it but I'm not sure I can spare the time. If no one comes forward by mid-November, I may take it on though.
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I don't know for sure, maybe some of the psychologists who are at sites where they review applications can answer you. But my guess is that some will and some won't, that it will depend on several factors. Maybe that's not a helpful answer but no one else replied so it's an answer at least.
