Midwestern (CCOM) vs. Rosalind Franklin (CMS)

[NontradCA]

Dunno, this year's class will be the 2nd class to graduate under probation. I doubt it'll have any effect. Back when we got placed on probation in 2003/2004, we were still sending 10+ kids into rads when rads was hotter than Derm.


The difference being that you have to be a superstar to match at those places as a DO whereas you just need to be above average as an MD. And depending on the specialty, those matches may not even be all that impressive (eg PM&R at Mayo is not nearly as competitive as IM at Mayo). And are those the main, university programs or affliated community programs. Johns Hopkins Bayview is not in the same league as Osler but they both carry the JH name.



Ya, I was studying for boards when the decision came down. Stressed me out for an hour or so but then only one or two schools have lost accreditation so I wasn't worried. And the probation was because of locker space at rotation sites. Not because of anything related to the curriculum.

Impressive to whom? Here's the crux of the problem here. I'd say that if you're looking for prestige, medicine isn't for you. It's all fun and games until you're 40 on and none of that **** matters. The names of places matter to tools IN medicine. Once you leave the hospital, you're still a tool.

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[AlteredScale]

Impressive to whom? Here's the crux of the problem here. I'd say that if you're looking for prestige, medicine isn't for you. It's all fun and games until you're 40 on and none of that **** matters. The names of places matter to tools IN medicine. Once you leave the hospital, you're still a tool.

HAHAHAHAHA wow that killed me.

 

[user3]

Impressive to whom? Here's the crux of the problem here. I'd say that if you're looking for prestige, medicine isn't for you. It's all fun and games until you're 40 on and none of that **** matters. The names of places matter to tools IN medicine. Once you leave the hospital, you're still a tool.

I don't think that was his point though.

 

[NontradCA]

I don't think that was his point though.

What is his point then? He's acting like DO students are over here thinking about Harvard IM residency on a daily basis.

 

[Stagg737]

The difference being that you have to be a superstar to match at those places as a DO whereas you just need to be above average as an MD. And depending on the specialty, those matches may not even be all that impressive (eg PM&R at Mayo is not nearly as competitive as IM at Mayo). And are those the main, university programs or affliated community programs. Johns Hopkins Bayview is not in the same league as Osler but they both carry the JH name.

Ya, I was studying for boards when the decision came down. Stressed me out for an hour or so but then only one or two schools have lost accreditation so I wasn't worried. And the probation was because of locker space at rotation sites. Not because of anything related to the curriculum.

They are the main programs. I'd say you need to be a little better than "above average" to match into surgery at Rush U medical center, and we had 2 people do it. UChicago medical center was internal med. Mayo clinic was gen surgery at THE mayo clinic. The year before we had people match into OB-GYN and Derm at the mayo clinic (not an affiliate). I don't care if you're MD or DO, you've gotta be a stud to match derm at mayo either way. Not saying it isn't easier to get into those specialties as an MD, because it typically is. Just saying that unless you're a damn good student, you're not getting into those specialties no matter what the letters behind your name are. The people that are only 'above average' and apply for the competitive specialties are usually the ones that end up scrambling after everyone else has matched somewhere.

That sucks about the probation though. I heard that Emory got put on probation a few years ago for not having enough study space for students and supposedly the students felt like there was plenty of room. I honestly don't understand why schools are penalized for stuff like that. Unless they're doing something ridiculous like not teaching anatomy or not getting their students rotation sites probation just seems ridiculous.

Edit: Another thing to keep in mind is that the merger will be coming into effect very soon. No, it's not going to completely balance things out between DO vs. MD, but if it works the way it supposedly will, then we may be seeing more DOs getting spots in those specialties over international MD applicants...

 

[chizledfrmstone]

It's still probation though...and how were the placements in the years following the probation? Not trying to knock RF, I'm genuinely curious if there were any effects.

Also, our school (DO, not CCOM) placed people at Mayo, UChicago, Rush surgical, along with a few other notables recently. 60% of the non-milmed class placed into an ACGME residency. Last year we placed 4 people into Rad, 5 into ortho, 6 into path, uro, along with a bunch of surgery and internal meds that plan to specialize. I hate hearing the "Going DO will close this door" argument, because it's just not true.

That being said, certain specialties are more difficult to get into, but that's true for everyone. So unless you're top of your class and dominate the boards, you're not going to get into them regardless of the letters behind your name. Period. Would you have to work harder to land those specialties as a DO, if you want to go to an ACGME residency, yes. Ultimately, med school will be what you make of it. If you go to an MD school just because it's MD instead of going to a DO school where you will be better prepared, then you're making the wrong decision. There are plenty of legitimate reasons to chose RF over CCOM and vice versa, but the letters at the end of your name should not be one of them.

I chose a DO school over an MD school because it was a better fit for me, and I have no regrets about it (bring on the criticism).

I wonder what @cliquesh and @sylvanthus would think about this.

 

[dav86]

CCOM Graduate.

This discussion is silly. I have seen three rank lists from my own program and have talked to plenty of people both DO and MD. CCOM and CMS aren't even comparable. If you want anything remotely competitive, both specialty or location, go MD. No questions. Sure CCOM has some decent match lists but you have to have an incredible resume especially in this day and age. While if you are an MD with a decent resume you'll get way more interviews and way more impressive interviews. That is a fact, can't be argued. It isn't only the fact they have an MD after their name, it is prep for USMLE, it is advising, it is the whole package. You will have a better chance if you go MD. DO is great for family medicine, pediatrics, psychiatry. Otherwise, great residencies, competitive specialties, or both are an uphill battle coming from a DO school.

In EM, we had five great matches in my class (CCOM). Talking to my fellow classmates from my residency: Cincy, CMC, Pitt, LAC, Cook, UTSW, UMich, Christ are commonplace, the expectations for MDs. As a DO you will be lucky with maybe one or two of those, and some of those will NOT interview a DO no matter how good you are.

So again, not even worth wasting more time on this. Going MD makes your life way, way, way, way easier to match into a competitive specialty or competitive region.

 

[bitternsweetxo2]

CCOM Graduate.

This discussion is silly. I have seen three rank lists from my own program and have talked to plenty of people both DO and MD. CCOM and CMS aren't even comparable. If you want anything remotely competitive, both specialty or location, go MD. No questions. Sure CCOM has some decent match lists but you have to have an incredible resume especially in this day and age. While if you are an MD with a decent resume you'll get way more interviews and way more impressive interviews. That is a fact, can't be argued. It isn't only the fact they have an MD after their name, it is prep for USMLE, it is advising, it is the whole package. You will have a better chance if you go MD. DO is great for family medicine, pediatrics, psychiatry. Otherwise, great residencies, competitive specialties, or both are an uphill battle coming from a DO school.

In EM, we had five great matches in my class (CCOM). Talking to my fellow classmates from my residency: Cincy, CMC, Pitt, LAC, Cook, UTSW, UMich, Christ are commonplace, the expectations for MDs. As a DO you will be lucky with maybe one or two of those, and some of those will NOT interview a DO no matter how good you are.

So again, not even worth wasting more time on this. Going MD makes your life way, way, way, way easier to match into a competitive specialty or competitive region.

Thank you! I appreciate everyone's input. I submitted my deposit to CMS

 

[user3]

CCOM Graduate.

This discussion is silly. I have seen three rank lists from my own program and have talked to plenty of people both DO and MD. CCOM and CMS aren't even comparable. If you want anything remotely competitive, both specialty or location, go MD. No questions. Sure CCOM has some decent match lists but you have to have an incredible resume especially in this day and age. While if you are an MD with a decent resume you'll get way more interviews and way more impressive interviews. That is a fact, can't be argued. It isn't only the fact they have an MD after their name, it is prep for USMLE, it is advising, it is the whole package. You will have a better chance if you go MD. DO is great for family medicine, pediatrics, psychiatry. Otherwise, great residencies, competitive specialties, or both are an uphill battle coming from a DO school.

In EM, we had five great matches in my class (CCOM). Talking to my fellow classmates from my residency: Cincy, CMC, Pitt, LAC, Cook, UTSW, UMich, Christ are commonplace, the expectations for MDs. As a DO you will be lucky with maybe one or two of those, and some of those will NOT interview a DO no matter how good you are.

So again, not even worth wasting more time on this. Going MD makes your life way, way, way, way easier to match into a competitive specialty or competitive region.

I kind of hope AOA/COCA read posts like yours.

 

[meliora27]

I kind of hope AOA/COCA read posts like yours.

I'm not sure the AOA/COCA has any desire to do anything other than design schools to pump out family practitioners. I'm not sure they'd even care...

 

[reapplicanthelpme2014]

I'd send my kids to CCOM.

Why? What's wrong with CMS? Genuinely asking!

 

[Goro]

CMS has had some rocky times. But really, they're both good schools, and I recommend CMS all the time to applicants.

Why? What's wrong with CMS? Genuinely asking!