[2016-2017] Emergency Medicine Rank Order List Thread

[deleted547339]

Fellas, rank lists only.

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[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: ~230, Step 2: ~ 230, ~575/625
EM rotations: H/H(?) not 100% on second SLOE
Medical school region: Northeast
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Non trad applicant; my work experience was brought up on most interviews and looked upon favorably. I was told one of my SLOE had a glowing review. Both SLOE from ACGME. Mostly H during 3rd year. No research. DO.

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
Geography #1. From CA and was looking to go back home.
3>4
8/10 > 12 hour shifts
Keep spouse happy.
Warm and fuzzies, did residents seem happy.
I felt everywhere I interviewed would give me outstanding training. It's up to the resident to stay motivated, put in the work, and ensure you receive the best training possible. Work/life balance important and geography big factor in keeping spouse happy.

1) Kaweah Delta - Visalia CA
Very busy ED, catches everything in the area, great acuity. Rotated here, outstanding faculty, enjoyed the residents, was impressed with the seniors. You'll be giving away procedures after 1st year. Run by CEP with good networking that will help with job opportunities in CA. Interpreters in the ED. Will see tons of peds and able to rotate at local pediatric hospital. Newer program, they have graduated only 1 class. Interactive didactics with great guest lecturers. They are working on setting up fellowships.

2) Maricopa - Phoenix AZ
I had a difficult time with the top 3. I had Maricopa at the top multiple times. Looking into possibility of education as fellowship, and the PD is education guru. I loved the fact you received 3 electives to help tailor your training to suit your goals. Have family in Phoenix, I like the desert, and has Costco (as emphasized during interview). Burn rotation sounded like awesome experience. Sounded like busy ED and got to see everything with high acuity. Strong emphasis on work/life balance.

3) UCSF - Fresno
4 year program. =( CA isn't the be all end all as you'll see below. Their 4th year isn't just doing more shifts, but a mix of electives, tox, and 3 rotations in "area of concentration". Tons of fellowship opportunities and the 4th year will help me build a resume if I decide to go fellowship route. Got along with residents despite the fact I don't ski. Well established program, great reputation, and huge ED that is incredibly busy. Kaiser rotation to get your feet wet with their system and see if you like it for job opportunities.

4) UB - Buffalo NY
Rotate at a couple sites with minimal driving distance for good mix of places. I liked their Scholarly Tracks where you can emphasize in an area of focus for possible resume building/fellowship. Busy mix of county and community. They do love their stroke care there. Huge catchment area, nothing else nearby. EM program seemed strong. I really liked the city of Buffalo, we already have friends in the city. Spouse travels for work and airport has less connections, so spouse bumped it up. New facilities, building peds hospital and will rotate in their ED. 12 hour shifts negative. Con for me was no outside moonlighting. All had to be in-house. PD thought you shouldn't work on your own until finished training.

5) Albany NY
I really liked this program. Had is #4, but spouse gets say in matter too; liked city of Buffalo better. Hospital has great catchment area, and gets exposure to everything. All residents were extremely friendly and happy, and they sold me on the program. Sounds like the EM program is very strong in hospital.

6) Western MI - Kalamazoo MI
Rotated here. Two hospital system. That wasn't a big selling point for me as EMR is an EMR... However, I liked the fact you would be exposed to a huge number of different faculty. Great APD here with ton networking opportunities. Big catchment area and will have great exposure to pathology. Large class and great spouse group thats very active together. Holy sim center! Tons of resources and great EMS experience. College town, so little bit of culture and great micro brews. Low cost of living.

7) Desert Regional - Palm Springs CA
DO program. Thought I would include for any DO next year if they still have to decide between matches (or hopefully will be combined). I had this program and ARMC on my list. I liked my interview here and thought it would be a great place to train. They are new and are still working on setting up facilities. ED is cramped and sounds like it will be a bit before expansion is built. Still working on getting sim center up and dedicated classroom area . Smaller peds population. My advisor said I am a good applicant and should match so I felt the risk was worth it to match at 1-6. Withdrew from DO match.

8) Mercy St Vincent - Toledo OH
The next three are still awesome places, but the location was big negative. Amazing moonlighting experience. Got the impression more of the trauma came here when compared to Univ of Toledo. All residents were friendly and I got along well with them. APD went out of way to talk about some issues with me and answer questions. Overall very solid, but Toledo...

9) Hamot - Erie PA
Great training. No problem with pathology, all trauma goes to this hospital. Unopposed with no shortage of procedures. 12 hr shifts, =( . To quote Apollyon, "location is A1 ****"

10) Central MI - Saginaw MI
Really loved the program here. Had great interview with PD, all the residents were super nice and very happy with the program. Large catchment area and will get to see everything. Unopposed, EM runs the hospital. New, awesome facilities. Spouse spent some time looking into Saginaw and I got "the look". Even PD during interview said they have trouble getting people there due to location.

11) Drexel - Philadelphia PA
Walked away from interview with funny feeling. They did not bring up recent probation during presentation. When I brought it up with PD, he was very vague with details and implementation changes. When I asked one of the interviewers about their trauma exposure, they said you won't be properly trained here and the residents don't see enough. Then, didn't have any follow up with any fixes/plans to fix.

12) Lehigh Valley - Allentown PA
Couple residents were not happy with place/program. 4 years. Did not have good interview experience, all 4 interviews literally asked me same question and didn't seem interested at all. Middle on nowhere. Told me we don't match DO's on ACGME side and you need to rank us in the DO match.

13) Albert Einstein - Philadelphia PA
4 years. More than one resident said I wouldn't see my spouse for 4 years here. They looked like they had the soul beaten out of them. I would like to stick to Whitecoat Investor's advice of one spouse, one house. Training looked solid though...

Rest of list:
Arrowhead Regional Medical Center - Colton CA interviewed and didn't like it here. Too hands off. 4th year only spent doing EM shifts, no specialty track or emphasis . Sad because was best fit geography wise.

Conemaugh - couldn't make interview because of schedule. Sorry gamerEMdoc. Truly wanted to make it.

Went to few other DO interviews early. System is stupid and thankfully changing for unified match. Applied to a ton of programs.

 

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

The Match is unpredictable. An individual is entitled to apply to and interview at as many programs as they wish, even if their motivation is to pad their list, go on vacation, etc. Their portfolio of attributes earned them that right.

Programs colluding to limit applicants' number of interviews in a given geography is nothing short of oligarchy.

The EM match doesn't appear to be suffering from this phenomenon. According to the NRMP, there was 1 unfilled position in the 2016 Match.

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 246, Step 2: 269
EM rotations: H/H/H
Medical school region: Everywhere. The IMG struggle is real
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Step Scores, Personality, LOR's & my CV.

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
Fit at the program. Opportunists to teach and pursue an EMS fellowship.

1) Washington University
Loved the program & PD. I expected St. Louis to be a small cow town but I really enjoyed the city. Amazing EMS opportunity & a fellowship in house.

2) Sinai Grace- Wayne State
This program is in the hood which make is very appealing for trauma & high acuity patients they see. The residents seemed exhausted but well prepared for anything.

3) Sparrow-Michigan State University
Beautiful hospital, chill residents, great structured program & scribes in your 3rd year. But it's in east lancing.

4) SUNY Upstate
Great program its just in Syracuse

5) Wright State
Opportunity to get involved in disaster medicine & tactical medicine. Its in the middle of nowhere & the residents seemed kinda odd

6) Lehigh Valley Hospital
Its a beautiful hospital, Close to my friends in both Philly & NYC. Not sure how I feel about Allentown.

7) St. Vincent Mercy
I loved the program. I rotated here. However the Interns at the Resident dinner were incredibly open about being racist.

8) Allegiance (Henry ford affiliate in Jackson)
The program is new to MD's, and its in the middle of nowhere but the hospital is nice.

9) NYMC Metro
I would love to stay in NYC but the sacrifices are not worth it. Small ER (15 real beds) No Resus room, paper charts, CT scanner is on the 2nd floor. It felt more like a slightly higher acuity urgent care than anything else.

10) Wyckoff Heights (New EM program in Brooklyn)
The hospital is pretty run down, They are still unsure on the schedule and a lot of other details about the residency program. I think it has great potential but there are too many unknowns to put it higher on my list.

11) Memorial Hospital
New program to MD's unopposed residency. Very small town.

Other:
I applied to 150 programs as an IMG I got rejected from most of them.

Waitlisted at Baylor, U Maryland, U Mississippi, Rejected everywhere else.

I really hope I end up at my top 4.

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: low 220s, Step 2: high 230s
EM rotations: HP/H/H
Medical school region: Midwest
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Below average numbers-wise. Strong SLOEs. Exquisitely vanilla personal statement. B-heavy 3rd year grades. Very handsome (according to mom and sig other).

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
1. Warmer weather; was targeting southwest, but got absolutely no love west of Texas (AZ, NM, NV, CA, UT) except for UC Riverside. I want to blame it on regional bias, but also have meh scores that could explain it. Pretty sure I get SAD every winter in the Midwest and am sick of running on treadmills or chapping my everything by running in the cold.
2. Vibes - Did I like the residents and faculty? Wanted a mix of family types and singles. Have a serious sig other that will come with and could see myself having a kiddo in residency, but didn't want to be surrounded by kids at all social events.
3. Perceived happiness and perceived quality of training. Were the residents happy? Do they like each other? Did they seem so beaten down they didn't want to be at the socials? As far as training, I was looking for strong ultrasound since I have no interest in doing a US fellowship, but want to come out really good at it. Some places the residents said they had "TONS" of scans and when prompted for a number said like 175 while other places quoted 400-600 and beyond. And of course job opportunities.
4. My and Sig other's opinions of cities, mainly a distaste for Miami and Chicago.
5. Only 3 years. No need for 4. Every program I went to said everyone at their program got a fellowship that wanted one, which I probably will not want anyways.

Sorry if I offend anyone.

1) UTSW
Pros: Crazy busy ED. Really clicked with the residents. Journal clubs and didactics pretty strong. They have a soccer team. Tons of Spanish. Dallas has everything. Weather is good. DFW and DAL for international and domestic flights. Graduates seemed well prepared. Good moonlighting opportunities. New Zealand rotation. Big class, which was something I wanted. I know some would put that in the cons.

Cons: Seemed so busy that time for teaching took a hit sometimes and residents needed to consult out more. Dallas isn't particularly bike friendly.

2) JPS
Pros: Warm weather. Residents were down to earth and seemed like there was a good number of distance athletes here to run/ride with. Spanish. Strong benefits. PD and faculty seemed pretty motivated and receptive. Pretty much the same Dallas perks of being a hub.

Hands down the best interview dinner food of the whole season.

Cons: Peds all the way in Dallas. Fort Worth might not be as fun as Dallas, but I honestly don't know that for sure.

3) Scott and White, Temple
Pros: Strong training. Great moonlighting opportunities. COL probably unmatched. PD tied for nicest PD on the interview trail (with Hackensack).

Cons: Not as much diversity as I'd like. Temple seems a touch small. Residents seemed a touch overly family oriented.

4) Hennepin, Minneapolis, MN
Pros: Reputation. Great Faculty. Strong ultrasound. Great didactics. Twin Cities are the place to be if you are a young professional and love crap weather. Close to home and both sig other and I have plenty of friends in the cities. The 3rd years are absolute bosses. Pretty decent Spanish exposure. Hands down the most bike friendly city I have ever been to. Very active city in general.

Cons: Residents seemed physically AND emotionally worked. I expect to be physically beaten down in residency, but not that bad. Graduated responsibility seemed to be taken to an extreme here. MN is cold and dark.

I spent a week debating #3 and #4 with the trade-off of do I want to be happy and well trained, or very well trained, but miserable for 3 years to have Hennepin's name on my CV. No idea how different the quality of training would be, but it did not seem worth it.

5) WVU, Morgantown, WV
Pros: Unmatched ultrasound. Extremely nice PD, APDs, and residents. True family feel. Great community exposure. Great COL. Good outdoors stuff.

Cons: Minimal diversity. No spanish. Morgantown has no Trader Joe's (too small). Residents are not particularly diverse in gender or race.

6) SLU, St. Louis, MO
Pros: PD seemed awesome. St. Louis feels like a dirty Minneapolis (backhanded compliment?). Kinda got to the point in the interview season where I stopped caring and don't have a ton of notes, but I know I left feeling pretty good about the program.

Cons: 7 residents seemed a little too small for me.

7) Allegheny
Pros: I like Pittsburgh. Decent COL. Strong EMS, but thats not really my scene. Pretty good vibes from residents.

Cons: Geriatric AF. 9 hour interview day. Far from home without the benefit of warmer weather.

8) Western Michigan, Kalamazoo, MI
Pros: I liked the faculty, students and leadership. Training sounded decent. Dat Stryker Sim lab. Good COL.

Cons: Weather. Kalamazoo too small. Michigan is not where I'd choose to live if I stayed in the Midwest.

9) MSU Sparrow, Lansing MI
Pros: Great oral boards training. Really nice PD and faculty. Perfect location to be involved in advocacy.

Cons: Same as #8, but further north.

10) Hackensack, NJ
Pros: Liked the people, especially the faculty. Seemed like in the sweet spot for program age, where they are new enough to have grads, but young enough to be very receptive to resident feedback. PD tied for second nicest with Scott and White.

Cons: COL and east coast life.

11) UW Madison (Wisconsin)
Pros: Sounds like leadership is making big strides with the program. Close to home.

Cons: Madison has zero young people other than grad students and Epic employees. Garbage weather. Some of the faculty seem overly academic. I know, I know, it is academic.

12) Presence Resurrection, Chicago
Pros: Close to home, good benefits.

Cons: IMHO Chicago is an overcrowded, more expensive, less fun version of Minneapolis. I am always underwhelmed with Chicago and infuriated with the traffic. Not really sure why I applied, I think I just wanted to give Chicago another chance because I was curious about being close to home and it seemed far enough out of the city to be away from traffic, but it wasn't. Res seemed a touch too geriatric (not that allegheny didn't, but at least allegheny isn't in chicago). ED seemed kinda small. 2/4 interviews were fun. Interview dinner turnout from residents was underwhelming. Talked to a student that rotated there that wasn't particularly impressed (minor factor).

13) Jackson/Miami
Pros: Weather. Spanish. Probably will be a powerhouse in a decade. It's Jackson, enough said.

Cons: Too new. No idea if teaching will come from senior residents or faculty. PD came off as arrogant telling us what we should want in a residency. Resident dinner did not happen and communication was weak. Only enjoyed one of my 4 or 5 interviews. Got grilled on clinical scenarios by one doc for the entirety of the interview, which is the only time it happened all season. Got stuck in traffic for 30 minutes trying to drive 1.5 miles to get dinner the night after the interview, which was the icing on the cake. COL insane. Came down to Miami stoked for this program and left knowing it was going to be bottom 3. Also, sig other dislikes Miami more than I dislike Chicago. Even the weather couldn't save this one from the bottom.

Other:
Applied to ~20 in my wheelhouse, 20 safety, and 20 reaches. Declined two interviews. Miami being so new and underwhelming spoiled my curiosity for new programs like UC Riverside. Kinda wish I would have gone to it, but also had spent too much money and was burnt out.

Withdrew all my safety school apps once I had 11 interviews on the books. Got rejected by too many schools to recount.

 

[KinesiologyNerd]

Mercy St Vincent - Toledo OH... Got the impression more of the trauma came here when compared to Univ of Toledo

Penetrating trauma it's not even close. Toledo Hospital (new affiliate of/future home of UT residency) probably gets more blunt trauma with an uptick in penetrating trauma.

 

[WalkingCorpse]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 246, Step 2: 269
EM rotations: H/H/H
Medical school region: Everywhere. The IMG struggle is real
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Step Scores, Personality, LOR's & my CV.

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
Fit at the program. Opportunists to teach and pursue an EMS fellowship.

1) Washington University
Loved the program & PD. I expected St. Louis to be a small cow town but I really enjoyed the city. Amazing EMS opportunity & a fellowship in house.

2) Sinai Grace- Wayne State
This program is in the hood which make is very appealing for trauma & high acuity patients they see. The residents seemed exhausted but well prepared for anything.

3) Sparrow-Michigan State University
Beautiful hospital, chill residents, great structured program & scribes in your 3rd year. But it's in east lancing.

4) SUNY Upstate
Great program its just in Syracuse

5) Wright State
Opportunity to get involved in disaster medicine & tactical medicine. Its in the middle of nowhere & the residents seemed kinda odd

6) Lehigh Valley Hospital
Its a beautiful hospital, Close to my friends in both Philly & NYC. Not sure how I feel about Allentown.

7) St. Vincent Mercy
I loved the program. I rotated here. However the Interns at the Resident dinner were incredibly open about being racist.

8) Allegiance (Henry ford affiliate in Jackson)
The program is new to MD's, and its in the middle of nowhere but the hospital is nice.

9) NYMC Metro
I would love to stay in NYC but the sacrifices are not worth it. Small ER (15 real beds) No Resus room, paper charts, CT scanner is on the 2nd floor. It felt more like a slightly higher acuity urgent care than anything else.

10) Wyckoff Heights (New EM program in Brooklyn)
The hospital is pretty run down, They are still unsure on the schedule and a lot of other details about the residency program. I think it has great potential but there are too many unknowns to put it higher on my list.

11) Memorial Hospital
New program to MD's unopposed residency. Very small town.

Other:
I applied to 150 programs as an IMG I got rejected from most of them.

Waitlisted at Baylor, U Maryland, U Mississippi, Rejected everywhere else.

I really hope I end up at my top 4.

If the original poster would want to send me a private message about the residents being "openly racist" at Mercy St. Vincent, I would really like to talk further about that. That is an issue that has never even been brought up in my time here. We have a relatively diverse program, and it upsets me that that even played a part in your ranking. I'm sorry you had that experience.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[gamerEMdoc]

Conemaugh - couldn't make interview because of schedule. Sorry gamerEMdoc. Truly wanted to make it.

No offense taken. Cant be high on everyones list and interview season is so crammed together. Best of luck!

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 220s, Step 2: 210s, Step 2 CS: Pass
EM rotations: H/H/H
Medical school region: NE
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Lots of EM research

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
Fit, Research, Work with the underserved, from NJ

1) Jacobi:
A bunch of EM faculty I have met during my years of EM research are Jacobi EM grads. Good trauma setup. County style I'm looking for

2) Lincoln:
Relatively new (renovated) ED, residents were really chill, really gelled with each other well - I would say they were the resident group I was most into on the trail. County style I'm looking for

3) Rutgers - New Jersey Medical School (NJMS):
County style I'm looking for, very much up and coming program...EM has been a department there since ~2010 and never had a chair until now (last summer) - Lewis Nelson - who has for over a decade ran the tox fellowship at NY poison control (major international name in toxicology, and is definitely actively supporting the residency) along with a new PD (two years ago) who is hoping to start tox and other fellowships

4) Miami:
County style I'm looking for, exciting tox and research opportunities, as others have said they're trying to make the most of the resources they have at Jackson. 3 years

5) UF Gainesville:
Well established, high acuity residency, academic with research and teaching opportunities. 3 years

Couldn't decide between 6, 7, 8

6) Einstein Philadelphia:
County-ish with level 1 trauma and the underserved mission that I'm looking for. EM stands well in the hospital. good research support and opportunities. Con: concerned about how hard residents are worked.

7) Rutgers - Robert Wood Johnson Medical School:
Diverse population, close to home, + tox/research opportunities. 3 years

8) Northwell Staten Island:
Great didactics, sim lab, has US fellowship and good US rotation for residents. Small program. Staten Island.

9) Newark Beth Israel Medical Center:
Good underserved, sick community. Do 3 trauma months at NJMS. Residents happy, friendly. Have worked with a couple of the faculty who I would love to work with again. ED stands well in the hospital.

10) Morristown:
Happiest residents. Old EM residency with lots of connections and resources - e.g. past president of ACEP on faculty. Nurturing residency.

11) Crozer:
High acuity/social mission I'm looking for, 15 minutes (ish?) from Philly, loved the faculty, nice benefits (health center, for instance). taking their second class

12) Penn State Hershey:
Academic center, large cachement area. Presumably opportunities to teach with the medical center there.

13) Hackensack:
3 years. taking fourth class.

14) St John's Riverside:
PD was NJMS PD for a number of years. Have a unique arrangement allowing for the odd shift in a single coverage ER to get that feel during residency. Taking first class.

15) Florida Atlantic University:
PD is a Tox God and it would be great to have him as a mentor. He ran Morristown for ~12 years. Taking first class.

Other:
Applied to like 105 programs due to board scores. Of note, applied to ~80 off the bat and then added midwest, ohio, michigan schools only a few weeks later (after ACEP), and got zero interviews out of the 25 added programs.

 

[doggydog]

Everyone needs a hug.

 

[fresh101889]

.

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: ~240, Step 2: ~240
EM rotations: H/HP/H
Medical school region: Midwest
Anything else that made you more competitive:
SLOEs, A's in 3rd year clerkships, volunteer and extracurricular activities to talk about during interviews

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
Midwest preferred but applied midwest and east, 3y>4y, community/academic > county, good international health opportunities, interest in public health

1) Christ
Pros: great fit, residents and faculty are supportive and tight knit, all rotations at one site, good peds exposure, close to family and friends

Cons: commute in and out of the city

2) University of Wisconsin-Madison
Pros: great feeling on interview day, PD and chair are great, residents and faculty down to earth, could sense the motivation they have to consistently improve the program, optional med-flight, a lot of flexibility in 3rd year

Cons: patient population might not be too diverse

3) University of Michigan
Pros: perfect split between academic and community with the University site and St. Joe's, get some county exposure at Hurley, faculty very supportive, great for critical care with EC3 concept in ED, funding for global health, focus on becoming a leader

Cons: Ann Arbor isn't for everyone, commute to Hurley, 4 years instead of 3 years

4) UIC
Pros: 4 unique sites gives you exposure to different settings and patient populations, core faculty at all sites, PD and APD are great and you work with them frequently at the University site

Cons: I would prefer not to have to travel to 4 different sites in Chicago traffic but it's doable

5) University of Chicago
Pros: Has some of the best faculty I saw on the interview trail, PD is awesome, focus on hitting the ground running as an intern with no graduated responsibility, focuses on becoming a leader, strong alumni network, new trauma center and ED opening in summer 2017.

Cons: changes in sites based on new trauma center opening?, didn't click as well with the residents

6) Hennepin County
Pros: great faculty, the ED basically runs that hospital at every level, county setting WITH A TON of resources, amazing ultrasound, great EMS

Cons: freezing cold, graduated responsibility with 3rd years running the STAB room, probably wont get most procedures until PGY2 or PGY3

7) BIDMC
Pros: strong program, EMR made in house, I liked the faculty more than I thought I would, I was torn between ranking this or Denver next but I preferred 3y>4y at this point

Cons: Boston COL

8) Denver
Pros: excellent program with amazing training, didn't feel malignant at a lll

Cons: would be higher but the schedule seems very demanding, far from home

9) Resurrection
Pros: stronger program than it gets credit for, trauma at cook and sinai, shifts split between Res and St. Francis in Evanston (level 1), clicked with the residents and the faculty a lot here

Cons: patient population might not be too diverse

10) Detroit Receiving
Loved the people here, wasn't sold on detroit, lack of funding

11) William Beaumont
12) UNC
13) Peoria
14) Georgetown
15) Hofstra/LIJ/Northshore
16) NYP

Other:
Declined Interviews: SUNY Downstate, NY Methodist, Metrohealth, St John, Western MI, Sinai Grace, JPS, Baylor, Yale, Brown, UCSF Fresno, U of Az Tucson, LSU NOLA, Iowa, Mayo, Duke, Wake Forest

Waitlisted: Regions, Henry Ford, BMC

Rejections: Emory, Cincy, Northwestern, Cook, Carolinas, Harbor, Vandy, GW, all Pennsylvania programs

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 230, Step 2: 240, CS: ? Didn't take until mid-January (Gasp!)
EM rotations: HP (home)/?/H
Medical school region: Midwest
Anything else that made you more competitive:

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
During interviews I began to realize how similar many of the programs were. I ended up focusing on a few important things. Fit, Ultrasound, rotations through multiple hospitals including rural areas. Nearby outdoor activities including hunting/fishing/hiking. Also took SO into account for many of these rankings. I primarily used her as an initial screening tool when choosing where to apply so I only interviewed at places which are "livable".

1) West Virginia University
Pros: Extremely laid back close knit feeling especially enjoyed talking with PD and APD, Best US program I saw. Had a corner of the ED with 6 machines sitting there, compared to other EDs I was at which only had 2 total machines. Also have increased interaction with medical students and US education. Numerous rural rotations at varying distances from hospital. Furthest is rural enough to be giving thrombolytics for MIs.
Area is really beautiful, rolling hills and forests. Lots to do outdoors including skiing nearby.

Cons: Morgantown is small city ~30,000. Had to drive down after flying into Pitt. Limited career opportunities for SO. Wouldn't expect much of a gun and knife club, although they said they get a fair number of gunshots.

Extra points for most fun at social and best interview swag (nice t-shirt)

2) Nebraska
Pros: Busy ED with expected increase in pt volume over next year as Creighton is relocating. Enjoyed time spent with residents, all seemed great. Increased rural rotations at varying distances from Omaha. Left the program feeling really good about it. Seems like it could be a fun town to live in. One of the biggest pluses for me is the great hunting in the area, especially waterfowl and pheasant. 4wks vacation and highest pay for any of the programs I was at (although you may parking and gym).

Cons: Would rather leave the midwest and try a new locale. No fellowship trained Ultrasound faculty. Have flight but residents do not fly, unless they do a ride along.

Trivia: Home of Ruben Sandwich

3) UConn
Pros: Rotate at 4 different hospitals all within 10 minutes of each other. Academic and community exposure. Great sim center, live animal models. Nice gym. Huge nice ED, broken into PODS. 3 day weekend each month. Can request off easily. longitudinal PEDS. Great US program including multiple US fellowship trained docs, continual image review and immediate cloud upload. Residents seem to get along well, HUGE turn out for dinner (due to big classes?)

Cons: Hartford. Metro health sees only adults as childrens is next door, rest of hospitals see peds mixed in. I'm still undecided if large classes ~20 are a downside. Could be nice if trying to hang out with people on off days. Interns are not on trauma teams and do not intubate.

4) University of South Florida, Tampa
Pros: Really liked ED layout with pod system, new PD is great and very enthusiastic. Residents all seemed great, fun social the night before. Great ultrasound program, similar to UConn. Rotation at state tox center (across the street). Able to make any elective you want. Fun location with good weather. Great cafeteria FWIW with fresh sushi and brick pizza oven.

Cons: Currently work a lot of 12 without corresponding shift reduction. Residents seem to frequently stay pretty late after shifts. Mcdonalds in hospital? Also participates in SOCOM military training. I got the impression they might take some procedures although this could be nice if busy. Expensive COL

5) LSU - NOLA
This program is a bit of an outlier on my list as it is the most academic and only 4 year program.

Pros: Really nice new hospital and sim lab (after Katrina). Fun enthusiastic PD and APDs. Fantastic emergency preparedness and hyperbaric medicine. Actually receive all dive injuries from oil workers in the gulf. 2nd years are running entire pod with interns and medical students below them. Work 10s with 2hrs of overlap between shifts. 4 year has a ton of elective time, with unlimited opportunities (ski patrol in CO). Longitudinal Peds experience. primarily at 1 hospital, but do rotate at others a few times. 4 wks vacation, need to take 2 weeks blocks. 2-2 day weekends each month. Fun city with great food and music.

Cons: City safety, traffic. I ignored the fact that this program is 4 years when making this list, although I question the benefits. Created a ton of elective time which could be great if you have a specific area of interest. Residents all felt the 4th year is a benefit. Don't recall how US works.

6) UW Madison
Pros: Enthusiastic PD and chair. Faculty all seemed great. Very up and coming program. Rotate at Tac where resident is 1:1 with attending. Limited community rotations. Nice ED and attached children's hospital. Fun town, lots to do nearby including lakes.

Cons: patient population does not seem very sick. Does not many OB patients as they go to other area hospital. Lots of US faculty but was less impressed by it than other programs.

Note: Gave tshirt AND coffee mug.

7) U Illinois - Peoria, St. Francis
Pros: PD was great. Moonlighting in house year 2, outside year 3. Extensive flight, starts year 1, fly solo with flight nurse, can moonlight on heli 35/hr, 2 full weekends off per month. no Medicine rotation, large EMS/tactical med program. Really nice large sim center. Gym membership at local YMCA, Free food and covered parking. Very low cost of living. No anesthesia or ortho residency, do all reduction, have fluro in ED.

Cons: a lot of ICU, sounds like you do a lot of rounds. Use ultrasound, cannot upload or bill for, only academic fellowship. most of faculty are graduates of program.

8) University of MO, Kansas City, Truman Medical Center
Pros: Not sure why but really didn't feel very excited about this program. Nothing really stood out to me as superior. pod system ED, nice children's hospital,

Cons: increased amount of on the floor rotations with rounding and caring for patients (pager), no current US fellowship, maybe in futre X2 US boarded

Note: Great social the night before at jack stack. Have been to KC before and it is a really fun town.

9) University of MO, Columbia
I don't have as many notes about this program, but like the prior it wasn't a super exciting program for me. The biggest downside was my interaction with the residents during the social. Really left opinion of the program for me.

10) U Tennessee, Memphis
Pros: No other EM residency in city. large emphasis on Emergency preparedness and tactical medicine, fancy new ED with "2 sided rooms" not sure how well they have utilized this layout to effect flow.

Cons: 3rd class in program, trauma done at major center in city, Minimal trauma seen during regular shifts, No current attendings fellowship trained in US

11) Michigan State, Sparrow
Can't find my notes for this program. Was previously 50/50 MD/DO. Making switch to only accepting 6MDs to integrate into 2nd year DOs this year. Seemed like a strong program and very established. PD seemed like a good guy. The area really isn't one that I am very excited about.

12) East Carolina, Vidant
High volume ED serving very sick rural population. Feel that residents see high volume at the cost of teaching/education. Loots of procedural sedation done in ED. PD is somewhat abrasive, which may be received better by others. Greenville is less than exciting although it is 1.5hr from outer banks.

Note: I don't like East Carolina BBQ. Sorry not sorry.

13) Southern Illinois, Springfield
Awesome simulation lab used weekly, with dedicated staff. Care is spit between 2 different hospitals one is more county hospital. Generally 1:1 resident attending. I didn't have great interactions with residents. The biggest downside for this program is location, and I'm sure they realize that. When asked what the residents liked to do with free time they said that St. Louis is only a couple hours away. . .

Trivia: Home of Honest Abe (cool home tour). Home of horseshoe sandwich? Look it up

Hope this list helps someone. Good luck in the match everyone!

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 233, Step 2: 263
EM rotations: HP/H
Medical school region: US-IMG; from tri-state area
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Good comments on SLOEs, 2 publications in EM during med school, strong extracurriculars, PS brought up in interviews

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
fit, 3>4, job opportunities for SO, location

1) Hofstra-Northwell:
Did an away here. 3+1 curriculum. Residents have say in how they want their residency to be. Great in-house fellowships. Subsidized housing. Near family and friends. LIJ has pretty diverse patient population. SO doesn't have to quit her job. Not a fan of 12hr shifts, merger of two programs may lead to issues.

2) Indiana U:
AMAZING program, loved everything about this place. Really chill down to Earth residents. Residents are actually a family which is the vibe I want. Really a fan of the track system, great opportunities in EMS and Global Health. 8hr shifts. Rotate thru the only 3 level trauma centers in the state, greats peds experience at Riley. Eskenazi was NICEEEE. Indy not my ideal location, but still a nice city.

3) Stony Brook:
Top notch faculty: Scott Weingart, Billy Mallon. PD is a really cool dude. residents seemed like they were prepared for anything. Hospital has lots of money, really cool tools to play with. RACCU shifts ++. Large catchment area, diverse pt population, high acuity. Residency is well respected in hospital. Not NYC but LI isn't too bad.

4) Wash U:
Really gelled with residents and faculty here. PD is amazing, program is on its way to being a powerhouse with Wagner at the helm. Huge hospital, huge catchment area, very diverse pt population, decent amount of penetrating and blunt trauma. St. Louis is a cool city, hipster vibe, good COL. Bumped down on list by SO.

5) Rutgers NJMS:
New chair is really invested in strengthening the program. PD is on board as well, Residents leave Newark as badasses. Serving underserved population is a plus. Seemed a bit overworked though and didactics didn't seem as strong. Newark is one of those places that is close, yet so far, so not thrilled about having to move to the burbs of Jersey (doesn't seem plausible to live in Hoboken or Jersey City on a residents salary)

6) Hackensack:
Newer program. PD is really invested. Solely sponsored residency in the hospital so EM is very well respected there. Nice, bright ED, good flow. Faculty invested in teaching residents. Close proximity to NYC. Trauma exp. is lacking, residents will start going to Lincoln in Bx for trauma.

7) Newark Beth Israel:
Surprise of the trail. Really enjoyed my interviews. Residents love their program and seem really happy. Residents raved about having a good quality of life. Placed ppl into some really impressive fellowships. Good benefits and meals paid for. NEWARK....

Rest of list:
Brookdale, SUNY Upstate, NYMC-met, Brooklyn Hospital, DMC-Sinai Grace

Waitlisted: St. Lukes-Roosevelt, Jacobi/Monte, VCU, UConn. Applied to 100 programs, then added 20 more later in the season for a total of 120(waste of money b/c no interviews came of it).

 

[EM17ThrowAway]

Brookdale last? Makes me want to cry. You guys on this website are too much. I hope all of you take what's posted by each other with a grain of salt. It's a lazy Friday and I thought I'd peruse the ROL thread.

Your original post was unfathomably petty and unprofessional. For those interested: he took offense to being last on a rank list and attempted to shame the student by posting personal emails.

I'm glad I didn't apply to your program, and would strongly advise future applicants to think long and hard about it.

 

[Epinephreus]

.

 

[BangBang22]

I have always read this website but never took it too seriously. That PD's comment literally made me create an account to call out this bs. You kidding me man? The original list didn't even say anything bad about your program.

I am so happy I didn't apply to your program and not have our emails potentially leaked to cyber space. I bet you really have your residents' backs if your willing to publish personal info of potential applicants.

Next time, if there is one- "What didn't you like about our program?...."

 

[EM17ThrowAway]

If I were you, I would be begging the moderator to delete this thread so that future applicants don't see this.

Deleting the thread accomplishes nothing and would be a disservice to future applicants. Besides, nothing is truly deleted from the Internet.

 

[New EM Program PD]

Your original post was unfathomably petty and unprofessional. For those interested: he took offense to being last on a rank list and attempted to shame the student by posting personal emails.

I'm glad I didn't apply to your program, and would strongly advise future applicants to think long and hard about it.

If my intention was to shame the applicant I would not have removed any identifying information and I would not have specifically stated her extremely competitive position on our rank list. If the post did result in such a feeling than I am very very sorry and I am not anonymous on this website. That was not the intention and it is of course difficult at times to interpret what is meant via text as opposed to verbal communication. I do not take offense to our program being last on anyone's rank list. I am grateful we actually made the list. It is better to have finished the race last than to have never even competed. My intention was to provide perspective and to suggest that everyone be careful with what they write as this not as anonymous as everyone might think. Also, nothing negative was written about our program or about me personally. She actually had some very nice things to say via e-mail and sharing these with future potential applicants might be more helpful than their simply seeing us last. I was once in many on this site's same shoes. I know how difficult this process is and my post included some feedback as to how future posts could prove to be more helpful for all those involved. I also try to offer honest feedback and information as it relates to this Match process. I have mentored many students through this ordeal and if there's one thing most have expressed being very grateful for, it's someone being honest and transparent. I am grateful to have been given the opportunity to participate in such a way and those that know and have met me personally even if just on the interview trail or who have taken the time to read other posts that actually have been written about me personally know I am someone who actually cares. Once again, best of luck to everyone in the Match!!!

 

[EM17ThrowAway]

If my intention was to shame the applicant...

Let's review the tape here...

...I would not have removed any identifying information

You mean like their gender, real step scores, what their significant other is applying to, interview date at Brookdale, and the incredibly specific location of their medical school? Because you didn't remember to remove any of that. For the sake of the applicant I will not repost that.

...I would not have specifically stated her extremely competitive position on our rank list.

"Keep in mind, these two e-mails are from someone who ranked our program last (we ranked her #5...ha ha ha...hope she matches with us!)"

 

[deleted109597]

Ok everyone. While only one of us is able to determine the intent of this PD except he himself, there's a lot of conjecture going on. All identifying information from that post was removed within 15 minutes of posting.
Mistakes were made. From all outward and PM communication, it appears as an honest mistake. I can't change people's opinions, but I can ask that we stop beating the horse for the time being.

 

[New EM Program PD]

Ok everyone. While only one of us is able to determine the intent of this PD except he himself, there's a lot of conjecture going on. All identifying information from that post was removed within 15 minutes of posting.
Mistakes were made. From all outward and PM communication, it appears as an honest mistake. I can't change people's opinions, but I can ask that we stop beating the horse for the time being.

You are all correct. I screwed up. I own it. I was trying to make a point and that point was not made due to my failure in execution. I was not offended by our position on the ROL. I have been doing this long enough to know that one never truly knows how great a program is unless they experience it as a resident themselves and one never truly knows how great an applicant is until they show up on their doorstep and at the bedside and a great program may not be great for everyone and a great resident may not be as great in every program. That's why we always stress "fit" when it comes to this process. Greatness is not determined by a name or a board score or a position on one's personal or program's list. I should not have included the e-mail and even having done so I could've deleted more information to make it even more anonymous. The purpose of stating her position on our rank list was to make the point of just how crazy this process is especially when one considers the stark contrast in the two positions. I am a staunch medical student and resident advocate and have clearly compromised my position. I should've known better. All I can ask for is the benefit of the doubt that my intention was the antithesis of that which many/most/all appreciated.

 

[Apollyon]

You are all correct. I screwed up. I own it. I was trying to make a point and that point was not made due to my failure in execution. I was not offended by our position on the ROL. I have been doing this long enough to know that one never truly knows how great a program is unless they experience it as a resident themselves and one never truly knows how great an applicant is until they show up on their doorstep and at the bedside and a great program may not be great for everyone and a great resident may not be as great in every program. That's why we always stress "fit" when it comes to this process. Greatness is not determined by a name or a board score or a position on one's personal or program's list. I should not have included the e-mail and even having done so I could've deleted more information to make it even more anonymous. The purpose of stating her position on our rank list was to make the point of just how crazy this process is especially when one considers the stark contrast in the two positions. I am a staunch medical student and resident advocate and have clearly compromised my position. I should've known better. All I can ask for is the benefit of the doubt that my intention was the antithesis of that which many/most/all appreciated.

Don't EVEN be surprised if none of your residents feel comfortable telling you if they are depressed or gay or having marital troubles.

In the "real world", I found out at my job who I could trust (and that list is short), and I, who is notably chatty, am able to stay silent.

 

[6yearmedstud]

You are all correct. I screwed up. I own it. I was trying to make a point and that point was not made due to my failure in execution. I was not offended by our position on the ROL. I have been doing this long enough to know that one never truly knows how great a program is unless they experience it as a resident themselves and one never truly knows how great an applicant is until they show up on their doorstep and at the bedside and a great program may not be great for everyone and a great resident may not be as great in every program. That's why we always stress "fit" when it comes to this process. Greatness is not determined by a name or a board score or a position on one's personal or program's list. I should not have included the e-mail and even having done so I could've deleted more information to make it even more anonymous. The purpose of stating her position on our rank list was to make the point of just how crazy this process is especially when one considers the stark contrast in the two positions. I am a staunch medical student and resident advocate and have clearly compromised my position. I should've known better. All I can ask for is the benefit of the doubt that my intention was the antithesis of that which many/most/all appreciated.

When your tenure up tho??

 

[New EM Program PD]

When your tenure up tho??

No that's a sense of humor that's a perfect "fit" for our program. Unfortunately I suppose not soon enough for everyone.

 

[alexalex]

How did the PD know who the student was?!
And how do I go about asking for deletion of my previously submitted rol to this thread?

 

[doggydog]

How did the PD know who the student was?!
And how do I go about asking for deletion of my previously submitted rol to this thread?

PM me if you are serious with the post number.

I know this issue has a lot of people worried but I really do think this thread is so beneficial to applicants in the future. Being able to look at applicants from previous years, see how competitive you are compared to them, and see true pros and cons of various programs is tremendously valuable. I know I was looking for more information last year and way overapplied because of it.

I really appreciate everyone that has contributed to this thread and hope people will keep their rank lists posted. I do understand though if this causes anxiety for those that have posted and will make any deletions or edits that are requested of me.

Two weeks, everyone. We are almost there.

 

[New EM Program PD]

How did the PD know who the student was?!
And how do I go about asking for deletion of my previously submitted rol to this thread?

I don't know how many PDs are on the site. This will sound kinda corny but many students are in fact very memorable. They leave an impression. We interviewed 120 candidates this year for our 8 positions. We received 850+ applications. Standing out from the crowd is a must in this process because the competition is fierce. Of course the way one stands out is important. For example, I did not make myself stand out very well on this thread...not good. I remember a lot of our interviewed candidates because I spent a lot of time reviewing their applications and did so multiple times (initial receipt, interview preparation, ROL generation). I think its natural if a PD takes the time to review these lists to look back at their candidates to see if any are on there and where exactly they're ranked. I would suggest not including so much specific information in the candidates summary. I realize it might be helpful for other students to get an idea as to where they think they may comparatively stand but ultimately its a bit of a crap shoot. If PDs are willing to look beyond name brand medical schools, not care so much if someone is a USMG or an IMG, not place too much importance on board scores (yes all these things matter and some more than others) and take the time to really consider letters written on the student's behalf and not just SLOEs because not everyone can get one or get as many as others through no fault of their own and read personal statements, someone might not feel so competitive when they compare themselves to others on the site but they just might be so because of who they appear to be based on their total application and how well they performed on interview day which at least for our program carries the greatest weight of all.

 

[odoreater]

I don't know how many PDs are on the site. This will sound kinda corny but many students are in fact very memorable. They leave an impression. We interviewed 120 candidates this year for our 8 positions. We received 850+ applications. Standing out from the crowd is a must in this process because the competition is fierce. Of course the way one stands out is important. For example, I did not make myself stand out very well on this thread...not good. I remember a lot of our interviewed candidates because I spent a lot of time reviewing their applications and did so multiple times (initial receipt, interview preparation, ROL generation). I think its natural if a PD takes the time to review these lists to look back at their candidates to see if any are on there and where exactly they're ranked. I would suggest not including so much specific information in the candidates summary. I realize it might be helpful for other students to get an idea as to where they think they may comparatively stand but ultimately its a bit of a crap shoot. If PDs are willing to look beyond name brand medical schools, not care so much if someone is a USMG or an IMG, not place too much importance on board scores (yes all these things matter and some more than others) and take the time to really consider letters written on the student's behalf and not just SLOEs because not everyone can get one or get as many as others through no fault of their own and read personal statements, someone might not feel so competitive when they compare themselves to others on the site but they just might be so because of who they appear to be based on their total application and how well they performed on interview day which at least for our program carries the greatest weight of all.

Just stop---it does you a disservice to continue posting.

 

[Lexdiamondz]

How did the PD know who the student was?!
And how do I go about asking for deletion of my previously submitted rol to this thread?

ROLs are already submitted...it really doesn't matter at this point.

 

[EazyE1907]

 

[Onscene]

How did the PD know who the student was?!
And how do I go about asking for deletion of my previously submitted rol to this thread?

Honestly even with only the ROL, all they have to do is cross reference your home institution and aways. Including board score or personal info just makes it easier.

 

[Istaretoomuch]

All the programs I ranked I would be happy to get a job at- the match doesn't let us say "naw I'm good" after the fact. So say a program that I rank 10th likes me and ranks me to match... then reads on here that I "only" ranked them at 10. I guess I don't see a benefit for the program to drop me off there list as repercussion for not ranking them higher. That is basically an admission that they would rather have someone they liked less initially. If I fell down my ROL they should be happy they got a candidate they rated highly and I'd be pumped to get to learn how to be an EM doc there.

 

[EMhopeful2017]

I don't know how many PDs are on the site. This will sound kinda corny but many students are in fact very memorable. They leave an impression. We interviewed 120 candidates this year for our 8 positions. We received 850+ applications. Standing out from the crowd is a must in this process because the competition is fierce. Of course the way one stands out is important. For example, I did not make myself stand out very well on this thread...not good. I remember a lot of our interviewed candidates because I spent a lot of time reviewing their applications and did so multiple times (initial receipt, interview preparation, ROL generation). I think its natural if a PD takes the time to review these lists to look back at their candidates to see if any are on there and where exactly they're ranked. I would suggest not including so much specific information in the candidates summary. I realize it might be helpful for other students to get an idea as to where they think they may comparatively stand but ultimately its a bit of a crap shoot. If PDs are willing to look beyond name brand medical schools, not care so much if someone is a USMG or an IMG, not place too much importance on board scores (yes all these things matter and some more than others) and take the time to really consider letters written on the student's behalf and not just SLOEs because not everyone can get one or get as many as others through no fault of their own and read personal statements, someone might not feel so competitive when they compare themselves to others on the site but they just might be so because of who they appear to be based on their total application and how well they performed on interview day which at least for our program carries the greatest weight of all.

Why would it infuriate a PD if an applicant ranked their program at the bottom of their ROL? Don't PD's also have applicants at the bottom of their ROL?

Why cant we as applicants give valid perceived cons about programs without them flipping out?

And people with lower board scores, non-US medical grads, those without SLOES are all less competitive. They just are. I don't know why you think they shouldn't feel less competitive.

 

[SamtheWise]

Why would it infuriate a PD if an applicant ranked their program at the bottom of their ROL? Don't PD's also have applicants at the bottom of their ROL?

Why cant we as applicants give valid perceived cons about programs without them flipping out?

And people with lower board scores, non-US medical grads, those without SLOES are all less competitive. They just are. I don't know why you think they shouldn't feel less competitive.

For better or worse, I would imagine that it matters a lot for some PDs for their program to not go down super far on the rank list. Much like you would be happy matching at your #14, but your pride would feel a little stung. Not excusing the PD for coming on here and oversharing, but I can see how it would be frustrating to have an applicant you got good vibes from and really liked rank you lowly. I would certainly be frustrated if a program went out of their way to say how much they liked me, then I rank it #1 and don't match there.

 

[Apollyon]

For better or worse, I would imagine that it matters a lot for some PDs for their program to not go down super far on the rank list.

That is TOTALLY true, but, also, as someone who lives in the "real world", it is totally juvenile and petty. Seriously, who gives even one **** about how far down the list one goes? Next year, it's a TOTALLY forgotten thing. Do PDS even discuss this at meetings? Or, alternately, are they that much of losers, that, when they say, "we only went to number 9, for our 8 positions", does that get them laid, or a free drink (that is alcoholic, not a soda)? In other words, trivial.

 

[New EM Program PD]

Just stop---it does you a disservice to continue posting.

Yes because one post represents all of me. Thanks for the advice.

Why would it infuriate a PD if an applicant ranked their program at the bottom of their ROL? Don't PD's also have applicants at the bottom of their ROL?

Why cant we as applicants give valid perceived cons about programs without them flipping out?

And people with lower board scores, non-US medical grads, those without SLOES are all less competitive. They just are. I don't know why you think they shouldn't feel less competitive.

I suspect odoreater is correct and that I am doing myself a disservice by continuing to post but I have no one to blame but myself so be that as it may I will continue to do so should anyone else also reply to one of my posts asking for clarification or questioning me as you have done. I don't think it would infuriate a PD to see their program at the bottom of an ROL. It sucks for sure but not infuriating. We know we're not a perfect fit and in some instances any fit for everyone. The same is true on your side. We do have applicants at the bottom of our list but interestingly enough our philosophy is very much or should be just like that expressed by Istaretoomuch and that is we do not/should not rank anyone we don't think would be a good fit for our program. I would be more than thrilled to match any of our ranked candidates much like an EM applicant should be more than thrilled to match at any EM program as opposed to no EM program and as every PD knows one's highest matched applicant doesn't always turn out to be their "best" resident.

You definitely should feel free to give valid perceived cons about programs and if these are just that no one should flip out. We all know a con for one may be a pro for another. One point I was trying to make with my poorly executed initial post was that I think it would be of great benefit to those applying to actually state these. Our program was ranked last but no cons were stated. I think it would've been more helpful to actually state them and especially so when many other local so called "competing" programs are nearby.

I was one of those less competitive applicants. I was well aware of it. I just don't think it's helpful to those who are to have it thrown in their face. Of course they don't have to log on, read and post themselves so I suppose it simply just is what it is.

 

[odoreater]

One point I was trying to make with my poorly executed initial post was that I think it would be of great benefit to those applying to actually state these. Our program was ranked last but no cons were stated. I think it would've been more helpful to actually state them and especially so when many other local so called "competing" programs are nearby.

I was one of those less competitive applicants. I was well aware of it. I just don't think it's helpful to those who are to have it thrown in their face. Of course they don't have to log on, read and post themselves so I suppose it simply just is what it is.

I wrote a much longer snarky response to this and your previous violation of the spirt of the NRMP code of conduct but it really all came down to:

 

[OnlyOneZlatan]

 

[SamtheWise]

Yes because one post represents all of me. Thanks for the advice.

I suspect odoreater is correct and that I am doing myself a disservice by continuing to post but I have no one to blame but myself so be that as it may I will continue to do so should anyone else also reply to one of my posts asking for clarification or questioning me as you have done. I don't think it would infuriate a PD to see their program at the bottom of an ROL. It sucks for sure but not infuriating. We know we're not a perfect fit and in some instances any fit for everyone. The same is true on your side. We do have applicants at the bottom of our list but interestingly enough our philosophy is very much or should be just like that expressed by Istaretoomuch and that is we do not/should not rank anyone we don't think would be a good fit for our program. I would be more than thrilled to match any of our ranked candidates much like an EM applicant should be more than thrilled to match at any EM program as opposed to no EM program and as every PD knows one's highest matched applicant doesn't always turn out to be their "best" resident.

You definitely should feel free to give valid perceived cons about programs and if these are just that no one should flip out. We all know a con for one may be a pro for another. One point I was trying to make with my poorly executed initial post was that I think it would be of great benefit to those applying to actually state these. Our program was ranked last but no cons were stated. I think it would've been more helpful to actually state them and especially so when many other local so called "competing" programs are nearby.

I was one of those less competitive applicants. I was well aware of it. I just don't think it's helpful to those who are to have it thrown in their face. Of course they don't have to log on, read and post themselves so I suppose it simply just is what it is.

Being called out personally is a nightmare situation for anyone who posts their rank list on here. For the most part, people are on here posting their rank lists as well as pros/cons in the spirit of helping future applicants understand some of the (subjective) pros and cons about these programs as well as what kind of stats are competitive for what kind of programs. Your behavior certainly makes me nervous about the rank list I submitted, and I'm sure it makes other people nervous.

Yeah it sucks to not be ranked highly, I get that. It sucks to feel excited about a candidate and have them bump you down their list. But at the end of the day, you're just making yourself look petty, and your behavior is 100% contrary to the spirit of the match. We are going into EM, part of the reason we chose this field is because of the laid back, pleasant personalities it attracts as compared to the malignant personalities in many other fields of medicine.

 

[smokn]

Remember that time we had a rank order list thread? Yeah that was cool...

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 240s, Step 2: 260s
EM rotations: H/H/H
Medical school region: Midwest
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Engaged in EM from the start, several EM/Trauma focused research projects, strong community engagement, got the big "H" on all core clinical rotations, strong SLOEs, diverse aways

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
Urban location, county program, high acuity, trauma experience, family feel/gut feeling, 4>3 year program, self-sufficient department, opportunities for SO, overall reputation

1) Highland
Pros: A historic program with an amazing national reputation, jived with the residents and faculty, loved the close nit family feel, overall strong gut feeling, shadowed for a shift around my interview and the ED although small sees an impressive number of very sick medical and trauma patients, very self sufficient smart residents, graduates can go wherever, rotate at community and academic shops, was my dream program and it met my expectations, 1 month of vacation (2 as a intern ), amazing location, as a resident you are actually needed to keep the hospital functioning and not just there to learn. Active member in the ICUs.

Cons: COL, Oakland is still rough, IM as a 3rd year resident, possibly weaker off service rotations.

2) UCLA-Harbor
Pros: Amazing weather, loved the residents, county with strong academics to back it up, great faculty support, all of my interviews made me feel like home and wanted in the program, ability to engage in projects, great trauma and acuity, National reputation, can work anywhere after graduation. Strong off service rotations

Cons: COL, LA traffic, fewer off site rotations, would have been #1 but I liked Highlands grunge factor.

3) Cook County
Pros: National reputation, tied for best resident social event of the interview season, rotated here most of medical school and during EM so I know the place inside and out and can see myself being happy there, love the PD, get exposure beyond county and academic and community sites. As a resident you are actually needed to keep the hospital functioning and not just there to learn.

Cons: 2 months of IM, because of ACA acuity has dropped, strict graduated responsibility, weak peds, to many learners on the trauma team, nursing sucks, limited ICU exposure, want to leave Chicago

4) SUNY Downstate/Kings County
Pros: combination of county and academic sites, great group of residents, great trauma exposure, sick patient popultation love brooklyn, can work anywhere after graduation, friends and family support in the area, as a resident you are actually needed to keep the hospital functioning and not just there to learn.

Cons: PD is cold, didn't love the leadership, terrible nursing staff, COL, felt outdated, lots of ED boarding

5) UCSD
Pros: Almost canceled this interview but glad I didn't, great gut feeling from the start, PD and APD made me feel welcomed and a true guest of the program, immensely diverse training sites, San Diego is amazing, access to almost all fellowships, great flight exposure, would be in my top 3 if it had a better trauma experience and if there were more opportunities for my SO

Cons: bizarre trauma setup, over the top academic, lots of driving to other sites, not county, my interview with two of the residents was overly intense, wish there was more diversity among the residents program.

6) Advocate Christ
Pros: Amazing group of residents, probably the most down-to-earth group I met. High acuity mixed population of sick private and county style patients, top notch trauma experience, strong peds exposure, engaged faculty, great PD and soon to be PD.

Cons: would have been ranked higher but I want to leave Chicago and dont like that it is a single site program

7) NYU/Bellevue
Pros: historic program, amazing faculty (Goldfrank, Swami), diverse sites between county, private and hopefully community (Lutheran), Rotated here and fit in well with the residents and faculty, top notch conferences/morning report, loved NYC.

Cons: COL, lots of leadership changes, PD was "forced" out of his role, abused on off service rotations, Bellevue is more of a drunk tank and I personally believe its heyday is in the history books. Very weak trauma experience. Tisch consults a lot. Bellevue side appears to be focusing on homelessness and EtOH abuse which isn't my particular passion within EM.

8) WashU
Pros: Loved the PD and the program, seemed like a great balance between academics and county, its WashU so amazing off service rotations and teaching, great trauma exposure, very social group of residents and PD (they had two social events per interview day), got the warm fuzzes

Cons: Did not like St. Louis, limited opportunities for my SO

9) Denver
Pro: national reputation for producing leaders in emergency medicine, county and academics, the original knife and gun club, can go anywhere after residency

Cons: Did not like Denver as a city, PD and the rest of faculty were cold, residents openly admitted to treating rotating students poorly, malignant reputation that the residents confirmed, "if there isnt at least two M&M cases per shift you aren't seeing enough patients"

Rest of list:
In no particular order BIDMC, Wisconsin, MCW, Johns Hopkins, UMich, Duke, Resurrection, Rush.

Declined: Henry Ford, Siani Grace, LSU, UMaryland, UIC, Mount Siani, St. Lukes, UC Davis

Places I wish I had the opportunity to interview: USC, BMC, Temple, UWashington

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 240s, Step 2: 240s
EM rotations: H/H
Medical school region: South
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Slightly non traditional student, with some really unique life experiences. I know my SLOEs were very very good and from two well respected schools in EM. Received many comments about personal statement...I have a cool writing style. (Excuse the poor typing for this post, I am trying to do all this in like 10 min, and its 1am, hopefully not too many mistakes)

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
Strength of training, COL, significant other preferences for places to live, favor academics, interested in EMS and Crit. I also really cared a lot about what graduates of the residency did and where they went. I feel like that is a good picture of the vibe of the program. I had a hard time making my list, and confession, if I could, I would go back and change my top three around....I know right. My gut was telling me to do it too but oh well. I was too nervous to change my list with only 5 min left on the clock. I didn't really take notes on the interview trail and just took away general impressions. But I would honestly be happy at any of my top 10 programs.

1) Cincinnati -
Pros: Kind of just got the vibe this place is the Godfather of EM, and they have the program to back that reputation up. Program is well structured, while I favor 3 year programs in general, the 4th year here seems alright. I want to fly in a helicopter.

Cons: homogenous residency for sure. Cincinnati my least favorite city of my top three. I actually didn't jive that well with the PD where I feel like most people do, but he is not the PD next year anyway. If I could change my list this would actually be #3 now.

2) Vanderbilt -
Pros: Love Nashville, really a fun place to be at. I think you will get the best teaching at this program. Slovis and Wrenn are phenomenal. The new PD was one of the best I met the whole interview trail, her and I got along really well.

Cons: again, lack of diversity in the program. Only two electives, and a part of me wonders if there will be too much learning by listening, and not enough by doing, which the next program on my list is all about. This program would stay at #2 still if I could change my list.

3) Indiana -
Pros: Man! Should have went with my gut and put Indiana #1. I hesitated because my SO has never been to Indianapolis, but after speaking with friends who live there etc etc, she thought she would actually be really happy there. Program is awesome. Two hospital system so you get good variety. See a ton of patients but still are actually on the lower end shifts wise, which is awesome. Means you see a lot of patients while on shift. You learn by doing. I actually really like Indianapolis. Almost as much as Nashville.

Cons: again, not super diverse as far as attendings and residents. Maybe too much learning by doing and not enough just good organized instruction...opposite of Vandy. Flying is a no go here. They consider it not safe. I feel like they weren't as high on moonlighting (not as moonlighting friendly) as some other programs I went too. That was my impression, could be wrong. But still, were I to have another shot, I would put them #1...kind of weird to hope I actually fall to my #2 or even #3 in my actual list eh? Give me some love EM gods. Let me drop a bit.

4) UNC -
Pros: North Carolina was my favorite location I went to, and if that is the only thing that matter they would be #1. I am from Mountain West originally and love outdoors, North Carolina scratched that itch. Even if I don't go here I think I am going to shoot to move here to settle when I am all done with residency. I consider this interview day to be my peak, I was on fire in my interviews and jived with everyone there (it was right in the middle of interview season). PD is stellar, dare I say my favorite PD of the whole interview season. Wake Med seems like some awesome training, UNC seemed fine.

Con: man that driving is a b**** eh? I love audible and podcasts, they have turned me into a happy driver when I used to be road rage galore. But I just feel like three years of 40 min commutes on a regular basis will have a grind.

5) Wake Forest -
Pros: Much of the same reasons as UNC, love the area. Less commute than UNC, but also more secluded. I like that, my SO didn't. Didn't jive with PD, but I here a lot of people don't on interview day. Not as much to do in Winston-Salem as other places. But enough for me.

Cons: Remember me saying a factor is where graduates end up. Got the feeling most here stayed around Wake Forest or NC. Not a bad thing if everyone really just loves it and wants to stay because it is so awesome, but it is hard to gauge if that is the only reason.

6) Advocate Christ -
Pros: For me this is all about the residents. They were tied for the coolest residents I hung out with. I also liked getting to interview with a bunch of them. PD was cool, and new PD also very cool. New PD an award winner for teaching I believe.

Con: Oak Lawn, sort of? You are close to Chicago, Oak Lawn definitely isn't all that exciting. Maybe too community based for my tastes. And with UofChicago getting a level 1 trauma, maybe lose some of their trauma which they are so well known for. PD said they wouldn't be effected for the three years we are there, but maybe it will. My wife wasn't as excited about this program, otherwise is would be 4 or 5. She is into big fancy names to be honest.

7) Maricopa -
Pros: The other residency tied for best residents. Now look, I am a really sarcastic person, so that is why I loved it here. Copa classy is my language. Really liked everything about this program, and I like Phoenix. PD is a fun guy, I like learning with sarcasm. Advocate Christ and these guys pass the 2am rule with flying colors. And while they are small and seem like a bare bones operation, they say they will help you do whatever you want in EM, and I believe them. Skies the limit.

Cons: My significant other does not like Phoenix (something she should have told me before interviewing there right?!?!) These guys, like Advocate Christ would be my 3 and 4 if I completely had my way. Also, maybe not as many resources available.

8) Northwestern -
Pros: Like Cincinnati, a good well thought out 4 year program. Lots of resources, good reputation, can go where ever you want to go when you graduate. PD is leaving, and he is quite legendary, but this program is robust enough it should not effect it. Just kind of weird you have no idea who the new one is going to be.

Cons: Did you go to a program where everything was awesome, it fit everything you wanted, but for some reason, it just didn't feel right? That is this program for me, and I still don't get it. During the whole interview day I was thinking, "this place is amazing, it should be in my top three, but why can't I picture myself here". I really liked all the residents, but I just left feeling like I wouldn't fit in well.

9) Stanford -
Pros: Well, lets get it out of the way, that name will carry you places, probably as high as Everest. And all because you get to see google and apple employees in the ED for 4 years (man if this were 3 years still it would be much higher). For me, I feel like they didn't want to admit that their patient population at Stanford is a "Stanford population". But doing rotation at all three sites seemed cool and maybe fixes that. I remember being impressed with the sim here. PD was great, really helped bring that Stanford vibe down a notch and make it more an every person kind of program instead of "ooooh its Stanford, fancy". But come on, California has the best weather in the country. Also getting a new ED at Stanford that you would get to be in your 3rd year if I remember right.

Cons: This is the third and final program I interviewed at that is 4 years. And their 4 years just didn't seem as worth while as the other two. Sold as finding a niche and decompressing, but really when you look at it, looked like more to decompress stuff. Not as much justification for a 4th year in my mind. Rather just enter the work force or do a fellowship than have loads of electives to dink around with. COL is bad, really bad, really really bad. And commute seems like it would be bad, about on UNC level.

10) Ohio State -
Pros: Really liked these guys. If you are looking for academics, this is a good place. PD gave the vibe that he wanted this place so academic that it would spilling out the windows. Residents here are awesome. Abercrombie ED! Am I right? Have a cancer ED, kind of cool. Honestly have a a vibe of being the 3 year equivalent of Northwestern to me. Just tons and tons of resources and money floating around. Columbus, in my opinion of course, the best city in Ohio.

Cons: not a lot. PD is kind of hard to talk to. One of the APD is really cool, the other was awkward and I feel I would spend 3 years avoiding that one. Honestly, I have no reason for them to be this low other than I just felt better at the other programs. Like I said, I would be happy at any of my top 10.

Rest of list:
Baylor-Scott and White, JPS, University of Utah, UTSW, Baylor.

My significant other and I decided that since we have been in Texas the last 4 years, it is time for a new adventure. We aren't from Texas originally anyway and we may end up coming back, so lets have a change for a bit. It was a bit gut wrenching though as I really loved Baylor-Scott & White and JPS, they would have been up there around 5,6,7. Utah, I just didn't fit in well there.

Declined interviews: UCSF, Christiana, MetroHealth, UNLV, Loma Linda, San Antonio, Georgetown, Beth Israel Deaconess,

Rejections either silent or outright: UC Davis, Denver, OHSU, U of Washington, Orlando, Carolinas, Brown (Denver and Carolinas the only ones that stung a bit)

Good luck everyone. Exciting times. Hopefully you aren't like me and preferring to match at you #2 or #3 instead of #1. Drop the ball on that.

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 231, Step 2: 241
EM rotations: H/H
Medical school region: Southeast
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Non-Trad with extensive work experience, combat vet, strong SLOE and LORs (makes all the difference)

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
Opportunity to be maximally challenged (academically and clinically), geography (ready to be closer to family), overall gut feel of the program, perceived happiness of hospital employees during tour (nurses, techs, janitors) as well as resident happiness, commitment to resident health, no preference of 3 vs 4 years, spouse consensus... One note: the issue of second looks comes up a lot.... I did one second look... I happened to be in the area for other business and since it was an early interview and a program I liked, I just wanted a little more time to see if my initial impression still stood... it solidified my decision on ranking

1) Yale:
(+) challenging academic environment with world class facilities, excellent PD who is a proven leader and who is looking to push the program to better itself, location (family and in-laws are in the NE, close to the mountains), I liked New Haven and esp its foodie scene, good pay vs. COL ratio, excellent benefits package, 4 year program that gives ample elective time, emphasis on research

2) Denver Health:
(+) reputation and intensity of training, location and opportunity for adventures on off time, COL, happiness of residents and hospital employees, program commitment to diversity, diversity of pt population and large catch area

(-) although only 8 hour shifts these residents work HARD, farther from family than I currently am, COL:salary ratio is not the greatest, sparse elective time for a 4 year program

3) Emory:
(+) Grady... used to work there, love it and its commitment to the city of Atlanta's most vulnerable populations, the mission of Grady unites the hospital staff and its a palpable commitment, you see EVERYTHING at Grady, young and dedicated program leadership, commitment to diversity, world class EMS

(-) location (love Atlanta, but looking to get out of the south), looking for a stronger academic emphasis, size of program, floor rotations and subsequent lack of elective time

4) Hershey/Penn State:
(+) COL, EMS Program esp flight, young motivated program leadership, location (maybe a little too close to family though), large catch area, peds hospital is top notch

(-) location (rural), homogeny of pt population, lack of resident diversity as well

5) Boston Medical Center:
(+) safety net hospital commitment, EMS program, reputation, diversity of pt population, size of residency, morale of hospital staff

(-) COL (cannot over emphasize this), rigid structure of program (first years do not do ANY procedures), Boston in general

6) UF Jax:
(+) reputation of program, training program malleable to each residents' strength, patient variety, COL, program leadership

(-) location, age and size of ED, lack of EMS program

7) UNC:
(+) strong program leadership, resident happiness, commitment to resident health, WakeMed experience, academic opportunities in Chapel Hill, COL

(-) location, traveling between WakeMed and Chapel Hill,

8) Staten Island University Hospital:
(+) program leadership and attending staff, sim program, resident happiness, hospital staff morale, size of program, only rotations outside ED are ICU rotations

(-) location, COL, peds experience, lack of strong academic backbone

9) Allegheny:
(+) location, resident happiness

(-) just did not have a good feel walking away from my interview although I cannot put my finger on exactly what, did not seem overly committed to Pittsburgh's underserved, feels overshadowed by UPMC

Other:
Admittedly, I over applied (~45 programs)... was a very late switch to EM and feared a late away rotation would hurt me (which Im sure it did in some part); after interview invitations started rolling it, I quickly turned down ones I was not interested in and ended up taking 9 interviews total;

Interviews turned down: Einstein in Philly, Drexel, Greenville, MUSC, Miami, UWashington..... overt rejections - UPMC (sent me 3 rejections... I get it, Im not going to just show up for an interview, UMaryland, Stanford, Austin, Maine, SUNY Upstate.... Waitlist: Carolinas, Temple

 

[doggydog]

Submitted anonymously, via Google Form.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: >245, Step 2: >245
EM rotations: H/H/H/H
Medical school region: Southeast, originally from West Coast
Anything else that made you more competitive:
Steady improvement from A's/B's in M1 year, to all A's in 2nd and third year. Research in US and education that led to a paper and a poster. 2nd pub in a crappy but PubMed searchable journal. Unique personal statement focusing more on outdoors than EM.

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
I did the couples match, and she is from the SE. Of course, since all relationships are equal, we "agreed" to apply pretty heavily to the SE, and accepted 3 West Coast interviews. Both of us are not huge fans of the snow, so while we did apply very broadly, once we started getting invites we drew a line above Maryland and above Oregon and said no thanks to anywhere above that. Both of us grew up <1 hr from the ocean, so we stuck (mostly) to the coasts. I am big into outdoors and golf, so we applied to places with decent outdoor activities. Finally, we both grew up in smaller towns, and realized during medical school how much we disliked huge sprawling concrete jungles.

8=9=10>>>>>>>>12's. However, I am all for 12's on the weekend to secure 2 weekends off a month.

3=4 (Wife is doing a 4 year specialty, both of us plan on doing a fellowship).

County=Community=Tertiary. Only level 1's. Integrated peds.

Housing nearish to the hospital so I can bike to work.

My dog factored way too much in my decision making.

I realized during interviews that external moonlighting was also playing heavily into my decision. I wanted to go to a place that would work you hard, but would have 15-17 shifts 3rd year to allow for moonlighting. While the money portion is nice, my main reasoning was that during 3rd year I would want to do some practicing in a double covered ED to figure out who I am as a physician without the backup of an attending.

I also found out along the way that 2 of the biggest things I was looking for in a program was to really enjoy the residents and city I was in. As I progressed through the trail, I found that in many cases program "name" inversely correlated with my overall satisfaction with the program.

Because this is the EM forum, I am going to rank the programs we interviewed at as if I did not have a ball and chain and was NOT couples matching. This list looks vastly different than our actual list. Thanks honey! Love you!

1) UAB (3 yr)
Rotated here, and absolutely loved my time there. Being a West Coaster, when I accepted the away and read more about the program, I had a brief WTF did I do moment, but stuck with it. Super happy I did. The faculty are out of this world amazing. I'm not sure if I drank the Kool-aid or something, but they made me feel like family. I loved my time with the residents as they all were very into teaching and all seemed super happy. Interview day did nothing to change the feeling. Dr. Edwards sells the program hard. 8's on weekdays, 12's on the weekend. Integrated peds 2nd and 3rd year. I realized how much I loved the pod system after working here, and comparing it to the other setups at my aways. Running a pod as an intern is fantastic experience to develop your flow. Work at a ton of huge events (Nascar, which I am not a fan of, but great experience for event medicine). Bham is cheap, and in my opinion is up-and-coming. Recently legalized microbreweries, so that scene is starting to pop up. Internal moonlighting 2nd year, external 3rd year. Ridiculous pathology since it is a tertiary and the only level 1 in all of Alabama. Bham is an interesting city, in that it has one of the top 10 richest suburbs in the nation, but North of the hospital has the 3rd highest violent crime rate in the nation (ahead of Chicago http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2016/10/01/most-dangerous-cities-america/91227778/). Also, earlier in the thread someone commented on the Bham traffic. The only time I experienced bad traffic was coming off a shift at 3pm. I stayed decently far from the hospital and had to use 65 each day.

Negatives: A lot of the residents are wifeyed up. Personally, I don't mind since I fall into this category as well. But if you are single, Bham may not be the most hoppin city ever. Also, no major sports teams which is a huge bummer (but at least the Barons games are fun). A huge, huge negative is that trauma airways are only the ED's during the resus shift. Hopefully this will be changing in the future, but until then anesthesia handles the airways outside of the shift.

2) UC Davis (3 yr)
This program seemed pretty cool. I liked most of the residents I met (although one of them was a bit snobbish and definitely rubbed my wife and I the wrong way. They were a third year though, so not worried about seeing them if I matched). The hospital was a bit meh, only 3 trauma bays that did not seem like they could flex that well. 10 hr shifts, which I appreciate since it is more honest (lets face it, in most cases an 8 hr shift is really more like 9). PD was very deep and introspective, plus he is from my neck of the woods. Cheaper housing (for Cali), most residents lived super close to the hospital and biked there. Honestly though, the biggest draw to this program was that I have a ton of family in Sacto. Plus, I grew up going to Lake Tahoe, and it is ~2 hrs away. Add in the fact that the beach is <2 hrs away, wine country is <2 hrs away, and the American River Bike Trail is the best trail in the nation, this place had everything I wanted. I'll also add that they have a health policy fellowship, which is something I'm interested in.

Negatives: again, worried about the path. Not a ton of penetrating trauma, but a lot of blunt trauma. I had what was easily my least favorite encounter with an interviewer here, which was weird because I loved all of my other encounters with the faculty. My guess is the encounter was meant to be uncomfortable/combative.

3) VCU (3 yr)
Man, this is the one program I am most bitter about. I loved the interview day, I thought the residents were awesome, and Dr. Moll is so dope that his amazingness has been extolled all over this thread. The ED is fantastic, easily the best trauma setup I saw on the trail. The story of the chair and a PE is legend. Decent moonlighting opportunities. Adding 2 military spots to the incoming class will make for even better diversity. Richmond has so much history it is out of this world. The trolley tour was spectacular. Perly's has the best sandwiches I've ever had. My bitterness is that the other services here are not super great, especially the one my wife is going into.

Negatives: the only negative is that I can't rank it higher. This place honestly should be my #1.

4) Wake Forest (3 years)
Strongest peds experience on the trail, and integrated. Good trauma. Cheap living. Loved the PD, really hit it off with him and the rest of the faculty. Residents turned out en mass to the dinner. Seemed to have good pathology. Faculty seemed open to developing more fellowships if they had a resident that wanted to do the grunt work. Great outdoor opportunities. We own the trauma airways.

Negatives: Winston-Salem. I like the cheap COL, but dang dude this place seemed like it was just an overcast and dreary little city without much happening. Might have just been the time of year I was there. Few moonlighting opportunities. No US fellowship!

5) UNC (3 years)
Rotated here, loved my time. I thought that the WakeMed/UNC 40/60 split would be a detriment, but I actually really enjoyed the split. It is cool to see the difference in style and practice between academic EDs (UNC main) and community EDs (WakeMed). The highlight though was the lectures. Easily the best lectures I had during my rotations. I have the attention span of an 8 year old with ADHD who just chugged a 2 liter of Coca Cola to wash down his jumbo bag of skittles, and yet I was able to pay attention during all of the lectures because of how funny/interesting/engaging they were. The residents and faculty all were so engaging that you couldn't help but enjoy the time. Chapel Hill is an awesome city, as well as the surrounding areas. Great breweries, great hiking opportunities. A huge lake nearby.

Negatives: You are never the senior on an ICU month. While you may act like one while at WakeMed for ICU, you still have a private attending that is there. I really wanted the experience and practice of overseeing interns and run the whole ICU. The drive time between WakeMed and UNC main really is a bummer, even if you live between the two. The path at the main ED is kind of a bummer, I thought it was a bit weak. 11 hr shifts as an intern is a bit aggressive. Hardly anyone moonlights.

Also, I like vinegar-based BBQ, but its not my favorite type.

6) Wash U (4 years)
St. Louis is a cool city. The hospital is huge and is only getting bigger. The ED is well setup. Resus shift as an intern seems like a fantastic opportunity, as you are paired with a senior and get to participate in running codes. This was one of my last interviews, and I didn't realize to this point that as an intern, most places don't have you participate in the codes. Great pathology, lots and lots and lots of trauma (highest violent crime rate in America). Forest Park is right across from the hospital, and it has all of the outdoor activities, ever (seriously, it has any type of outdoor field you could want. golf. basketball. football. soccer. baseball. tennis. etc.). The free museums, zoo, and the like in the park are great activities. Budweiser factory tour is awesome (2 free beers on a free 30 min tour? I'm in). The area around the hospital has a ton of great restaurants. You can bike to work. COL is reasonable. Ices Plan & Fancy has the best boozy ice cream in the US. One of the few interviews where the PD showed up to the dinner, which I liked.

Negatives: Floor months are a bit much. Peds floor. Medicine Floor. I can do anything for a month, but I'd go crazy doing a peds floor month. The 4th year wasn't sold super well. Snow and ice storms are a huge bummer. Hardly anyone moonlights.

7) Vanderbilt (3 yr)
I had a warm fuzzy feeling after my interview, but for some reason that feeling really started to fade as the season went on. I'm not sure why. Slovis and Wrenn are great. Academically wise it is the best program I interview at. Fantastic resources. A lot of event medicine opportunities, which is great (free country concert? sign me up.). 9 hr shifts. Nashville is one of the coolest cities in America, for all the dudes on this thread it is #1 destination for bachelorette parties in America right now. Post interview night was my favorite on the whole trail (some of the people you meet on the trail are just super awesome). Path seems pretty good. Major sports teams in the city are a plus. Great hiking trails nearby. No state income tax (!!!!).

Negatives: I didn't vibe with the residents as much as I thought I would. Seemed very "preppy" to me, and I didn't feel like I clicked with anyone in particular. I wasn't a fan of the way the ED was setup, but don't ask me why (more of a memory). My gut feeling as time wore on was telling me to go in a different direction.

That being said, I would have loved to be at Vandy, it is an awesome program, and I would recommend it to anyone.

8) UVA (3 years)
Easily my favorite residents on the trail. We absolutely clicked from the beginning. I was able to spend the postinterview night in Charlottesville, and loved the breweries around the town. Charlottesville is a cool little city with a ton of outdoor activities nearby. There is even a trail that goes around the whole city, complete with goats that are trained to eat a certain weed (yes, that is pretty fricken cool). They are building a new ED, which should be ready when we are 2nd or 3rd years. The current ED is pretty nice. Scribes! Longitudinal peds. Track system was a plus. Dr. Woods is a super funny guy, and seems like a great leader.

Negatives: seemed a bit workhorse-ish. I wasn't convinced the path was what I was looking for. Peds was not as strong as I'd like. No moonlighting!

Overall, I would have loved to have gone to this program because of how outstanding the residents are.

9) Emory (3 years)
County and trauma. If you like those two aspects of EM, this place is great. Easily the best academics of all the county programs I interviewed at. Brand new ED that is fricken huge. Seriously, easily the biggest ED I have every seen. The residents all seemed very close and were super easy-going. ED has admitting power, which is a great plus. No psych! Tons of teaching opportunities. Residents and faculty really do care about the social aspect of medicine.

Negatives: Residents get crushed. Not saying this is a bad thing, but they work extremely hard. Better to sweat in residency than as an attending right? Floor month. Hardly anyone moonlights (because you work so hard). I think the new PD is going to be great, but something to consider.

Overall, great program.

10) Hopkins (4 years)
As with others on this thread I was surprised at how much I enjoyed this program. They seem to have a great setup. I'm glad to see trauma at the Shock Trauma center is gone, but they kept the trauma anesthesia rotation at Shock Trauma. MOST of the residents seemed down to earth, a couple were a bit pretentious (cool bro, glad to hear you interviewed at the top 12 programs according to Doximity. Can we talk about something else?). I spent 4 days in Baltimore to knock out both EM program interviews, and I was decently impressed with the city. It seems that some parts are undergoing some gentrification. Still though, it is amazing that one street will have beautiful row houses, and the next is the wild west. The hospital was nice, the ED is well setup. It's cool to see so much medical history in one place. The 4th year was sold pretty well with the track system. 8's 2nd through 4th year. Tons of critical care. Cool tour of the city.

Negatives: All 12's as interns, 8s and 12s as PGY2. Driving deep to lecture could suck. Few people moonlight. I'd prefer a different city than Baltimore. Interview day is way, way too long. Did not like my interaction with one of the interviewers.

11) UF Gainesville (3 years)
First interview, and they ruined us with their dinner. Perfect medium rare steak, lobster mac and cheese, and green beans. 2 beers. Delicious. Residents were all fun to hang out with, great turnout to dinner. Great resident diversity in terms of where they were from. No floor months. 8hr weekday shifts, 12s on weekends. Scribes as interns! Internal moonlighting 2nd year, external 3rd year. ED owns airway. Cheap COL.

Negatives: Pay for parking. A lot of at home work (most residents hardly chart during their shifts). Some outdoors, but not a ton. Too much of a college city for me at this point in my life.

12) MUSC (3 years)
Charleston is a great city. PD was a lot of fun. Residents go hard when hanging out (I loved it). Interview day was short and to the point (start at 1245, end at 345, this is how it should be!!!!). All the residents are close.

Negatives: I worry about the path. Residency is small (6 per class, denied for adding spots this year). I wanted something a bit bigger.

13) U Maryland (3 years)
Best known faculty on the trail. They have Mattu, end of story. Trauma is great, obviously.

Negative: Super workhorse program. Lots of 12s. Too many sites with too much driving to DC. Peds not integrated. A couple of residents admitted this was low on their ROL, which is a red flag.

14) OHSU (3 years)
Rotated here, was very disappointed. On the plus side, Portland is an awesome city. Lots of great outdoors. Lots of great breweries. Lots of great restaurants. The view from the top of the tram makes my day, everyday. Residents are paid to ride their bike to work. All 8s or 9s. Very academic.

Negatives: Did not hit it off with the residents. Seemed pretentious to me. I got the feeling the program is a bit complacent and had an air of superiority since they have no competition in the state (only EM program). Path is weak at the main hospital, they received a lot of trauma transfers, which is great for surgery but sucks for EM (they are already stabilized). We weren't able to rotate at the outside sites or the VA, so I can't comment on them. Super, super academic.

15) Stanford (4 years)
Also disappointed with this program. Building a new ED, which should be cool, if it is done when we get there. Newly 4 years, but didn't give us a great reason why. I was impressed at the amount of county experience they received. Having an outdoor ED tent seems cool?

Negatives: All 12s, all 4 years. Residents looked extremely overworked. This may change when they have 4 full 4 year classes? Felt that the program was emphasizing that they "we are Stanford, so you should come here." Palo Alto is ridiculously overpriced. Most residents said the $60k salary + $6k living stipend wasn't enough, and they either lived deep or were getting loans from their parents. The subsidized housing would be great, but it is on a lottery system (so don't count on getting in), and they don't allow pets at the best places.

16) UF Jacksonville
Great county feel. Great peds (they have some of the leaders in the field). Great resident turnout at the dinner. So much beer at the dinner. Fantastic trauma and path. 8s and 10s.

Negatives: Floor month. Didn't feel like academics were as emphasized. Old ED. I can't tell you how many times "our patients are really sick" was said. I lost count at 20. Super workhorsey.

17) Jackson Memorial (U Miami)
I did not rank this program. I fully understand that this means I might have to SOAP into an IM, FM, or transition/prelim year. I am okay with that. I won't rag on this program here, but I recommend you interview their and see for your own eyes. Might be okay in a few years once they have ironed out the kinks.

Other:
My wife and I applied very broadly, I applied to 49 programs and she applied to 60 (including prelims). I received Interviews at 43 of the programs. I had zero outright rejections. Withdrew from ~10 very early in the cycle for various reasons (outside of geographical area, not appealing to the wife, one due to wife having a very disagreeable interaction with residents at a conference). Of those, I had not heard from Cook County, Boston Med, San Diego, Duke, Indiana. Waitlisted at 1 (UCSF), withdrew before hearing if I got off the waitlist.

 

[Apollyon]

Rest of list:
In no particular order BIDMC, Wisconsin, MCW, Johns Hopkins, UMich, Duke, Resurrection, Rush

Still quite stupid, and NOT a rank list. Just like a person said, what about when another person ranked those places highly?

 

[gamerEMdoc]

Woah, I don't check SDN for one day... this thread escalated quickly.

Regarding programs seeing the anonymous ROL reviews, I honestly just get excited to see my program listed somewhere and to read the feedback. The position on the list doesn't matter much, as long as the student is being objective and fair and not making rude comments, and I've yet to see anyone say anything about the program I'm at on this thread that wasn't fair honest opinion and constructive. For many community hospitals out there that have to compete with bigger name places, its great just to see your name out there, especially when you are a relatively new program. I get excited when I see my program listed because I can see what people honestly thought about us on the interview trail. That feedback is important. I certainly don't begrudge any student re: where they have us on their list. Sure, programs want to be liked as much as students do, but in the end everyone should be hoping for the students best interests, the programs will be fine, they'll fill their spots one way or another.

I definitely would not discourage students from posting their ROL. If they are worried it may affect their spot on a programs list, then post it after NRMP closes. But I'd keep posting, because I think the feedback for other students, and to a lesser extent, programs (if there are any others out there lurking on the forums) is helpful.

 

[LilKangaroo]

Would consider myself a pretty average to below average applicant.

Applicant Summary:
Step 1: 230s, Step 2: 250s
EM rotations: H/H/H
Med school (and rotations) in the Midwest
Not AOA; probably bottom quarter in pre-clinicals, clinical grades pushed me to about the median of my class
3rd grades were a mix of H/HP/P
Very involved in organized medicine at a national level.
Lots of a research in a different field, had a change of heart in 3rd year.
Many comments about strong letters.
My mother had a pretty bad accident and her recovery was long and difficult and really affected me emotionally and academically. I went part time in my second year of medical school to help my family take care of her. Not a true LOA, but bad enough.

Main Considerations in Creating this ROL:
I only applied to 3 year programs in the Midwest.
Ended up wanting a more academic environment.
Pediatric experience is important to me.
I wanted to work with very sick patient populations.
It mattered more how I got along with faculty than residents (it was rare for me to have a bad interaction with residents).

1. Medical College of Wisconsin
(+) Very well run traumas (one of my attendings at an away site was trained there and told me about it), best pediatric experience I've seen on the trail - 60k volume in the Peds ED, Froedert used to be the county hospital and continues to serve the population, beautiful campus
(-) I don't like Milwaukee

2. Mayo
(+) I drank the kool aid, seems like a great place to learn how to deal with very sick people, great work life balance (only two rotations with call), got along with the residents
(-) Rochester is kind of a strange town, I think there is enough to do for fun, but worried about spouse's job opportunities

3. University Hospitals Case Western
(+) New PD and Chair were my favorite people on the trail, great energy from both of them, really felt like home to me, loved Cleveland and NE Ohio in general
(-) Just became a Level I Trauma with anesthesia at the airway (said they would get it to only ED at airway within a year), transitions are scary times to jump into a program, did not care for the old PD who still works there

4. University of Kentucky
(+) Very, very sick population of patients from a large encatchment area, loved Lexington
(-) Kentucky is very conservative, spouse does NOT want to go here

5. Detroit Receiving Hospital Wayne State
(+) Great reputation, really feels like down and dirty ER, great relationship with trauma surgery service, loved Detroit
(-) May be a little too down and dirty with just curtains in between patients (not necessarily my philosophy on patient care), didn't click with the faculty as much as I would have hoped

6. Henry Ford
(+) Again, great reputation, more money than DRH, great academic center with plenty of research and EM big wigs
(-) Not a very good pediatric experience at all (actually gave me a pit in my stomach when they talked about how little they do with kids), hospital was kept up well, but very old fashioned (trivial, I know)

Then my 3 rotations

Rest of list in alphabetical but not rank order (I don't think I'll fall below my rotations):
Beaumont, Mizzou, Nebraska, Penn State, SIU, UT Murfreesboro, Western Michigan

Not ranking:
Summa Akron

Invited, did not attend (due to not wanting to live in that location and having enough interviews):
Presence Resurrection, Advocate Christ, Mercy St. Vincent

Applied to 40 3-year programs in the Midwest, got interviews offers at a total of 20 after withdrawing from 10 in late October before hearing anything back.

Rank list changed, kind of drastically, largely due to discussions with spouse. Thought I'd share and add in my away rotations. Almost of all of this list is based on gut feeling, which is different for everyone, so please take it with a grain of salt.

1. MCW
-As above

2. University of Wisconsin
This is my home institution. I love the leadership, I was a little worried about the patient population. I'm likely to go into academics and I do think this is a strong institution to do that from. Ended up ranking here per spouse's preference.

3. Mayo
-As above

4. University of Kentucky
-As above
-This moved above Case Western via the "coin flip" test, which is mostly gut feeling.

5. Case Western, University Hospitals
-As above
-My preference for Kentucky likely stems from the new trauma situation at the hospital, which should be EM run by the time I start here, but is still unsettling.

6. Henry Ford
-As above
-Changed when really reflecting on what I wanted from my residency program, which would be foot in the door to academics. Was a very tough call between here and DRH so I went with the bigger name.

7. University of Iowa
Rotated here, loved the faculty, the residents, Iowa City, and my best friend from high school is finishing MSTP here. I know I will be happy if I match here. Volume is lower than other places but I had some awesome experiences here and learned at lot. Internal medicine month at the VA is a big turn off, but it's just one month.

8. Wayne State, Detroit Receiving Hospital
-As above
-Had to weigh in the fact that I know I would be very, very happy and comfortable at Iowa. This was a gut decision.

9. Beaumont
Residents here were the happiest I'd seen on the trail. New ED expansion is great. Hospital is pretty. I got along really well with the faculty. Like I said, I really like Detroit and this was the "weakest" and least academic of the places I applied in Detroit.

10. University of Illinois - Peoria
Rotated here, this was the place I was born. I really don't like the layout of the ED because the pod system was kind of suffocating. EM only does airway on Level 1 trauma where as EM did airway on every trauma at other institutions I rotated at. I learned A LOT here, I know I will get a very good education, but I wasn't happy here during my month for whatever reason and that colored my experience.

11. University of Tennessee - Murfreesboro
I liked Murfreesboro, I liked the residents, I liked the faculty, but I couldn't shake a pit in my stomach feeling after interview day here. I think it was largely because its a new program and a little bit of the fear of the unknown. I love the idea of 9 months in the ED during intern year.

12. University of Nebraska
This was a disappointment on interview day for indescribable reasons - as in, I can't put my finger on it. I was looking forward to this interview, maybe I played it up too much in my mind, but expectations were not lived up to. I don't really like Omaha.

13. Southern Illinois University
Another pit in my stomach feeling after interview day. Just can't see myself super happy in Springfield, despite growing up an hour away from it. My friend's boyfriend's brother is a resident here, she said he was pretty unhappy. One of the home students who was also interviewing was kind of a jerk, stupid reason, but it didn't leave a great impression when the students act that way.

14. Penn State University
Another place I was really excited to interview at and left disappointed at the end of the day. I really, really don't like Hershey and could not see myself being happy living there. I did like the hospital, found it hard to connect with some of the faculty and residents. Did have a great time with an interviewer that one the residents said was usually intimidating, which I found amusing.

15. Mizzou
I really liked Columbia and the residents here. I did not connect well with most of the faculty interviewing me. Didn't interview with the PD, but something about his opening talk made me realize that we didn't have similar visions. I also think not all the faculty are totally on board with teaching residents as this is a new program and many signed contracts before the residency started.

16. Western Michigan
Considered not ranking this program. The former PD made what I considered a disrespectful comment about my struggle with what happen to my mom and I knew I wouldn't feel supported here if another crisis happened. I was also pretty ornery from the extremely long tour. I'm not big into pre-hospital medicine so the EMS part did not sway me.

 

[namethatsmell]

Still quite stupid, and NOT a rank list. Just like a person said, what about when another person ranked those places highly?

Normally I'd agree with you. However given the event from yesterday I'm giving props to people for still posting their lists.

Good luck to you all.

 

[Apollyon]

Normally I'd agree with you. However given the event from yesterday I'm giving props to people for still posting their lists.

Good luck to you all.

I still stand by it. Either the list is total bull****, or this person, who spent so much (apparent) time to write it up, shows either a petty streak, or such bad judgment, that they would go out of their way, to increase effort, for no discernable, reasonable, evident, or logical reason.