Anyone else's slides filled with disorganized, useless information?

[LuluLovesMe]

I didn't know it was possible to have lecture objectives clearly stated and still be able to create a powerpoint with not a single useful piece of information.

Take 50 slides filled with way too much text and notes. The lecturer glosses over all the details (after all how could you not when the class is only 1 hour) then says "don't worry about the details. Just understand the big picture." The **** does this mean? Maybe you should have only put the information you want us to retain in the slide.

Or how about 5-6 slides of random studies or long lists of things and then saying "I just want you to get an appreciation for the breadth of the subject."

Or how about having a clear list objectives and seemingly randomly scattering slides related to each objective as evenly as possible throughout the 50 slide presentation?

/Rant

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[DetectiveAlonzo]

I feel you homie. Our professors straight up told us that they are required to put down objectives from the course directors... but everything in the slides is important lol

So pretty much...

it means know every damn slide lolol

 

[Anicetus]

I didn't know it was possible to have lecture objectives clearly stated and still be able to create a powerpoint with not a single useful piece of information.

Take 50 slides filled with way too much text and notes. The lecturer glosses over all the details (after all how could you not when the class is only 1 hour) then says "don't worry about the details. Just understand the big picture." The **** does this mean? Maybe you should have only put the information you want us to retain in the slide.

Or how about 5-6 slides of random studies or long lists of things and then saying "I just want you to get an appreciation for the breadth of the subject."

Or how about having a clear list objectives and seemingly randomly scattering slides related to each objective as evenly as possible throughout the 50 slide presentation?

/Rant

The ultimate "welcome to medical school".

 

[FindMeOnTheLinks]

just wait till 2nd year


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[Psai]

You need to memorize as many details as possible and understand how they fit together. Not joking. You just don't have the perspective to see it.

 

[3characterslong]

Guest lecturers tend to be the worst about this. Thanks Mr. Famous Osteopath, I now have 20 flashcards filled with "Ulnar Collateral Ligament" as the answer, but I couldn't even begin to point it out on the body (in Anatomy no less). You need to start with the basics and then work up, not vice versa.

Otherwise though, I find most class lectures are fairly organized.

 

[Redpancreas]

I didn't know it was possible to have lecture objectives clearly stated and still be able to create a powerpoint with not a single useful piece of information.

Take 50 slides filled with way too much text and notes. The lecturer glosses over all the details (after all how could you not when the class is only 1 hour) then says "don't worry about the details. Just understand the big picture." The **** does this mean? Maybe you should have only put the information you want us to retain in the slide.

Or how about 5-6 slides of random studies or long lists of things and then saying "I just want you to get an appreciation for the breadth of the subject."

Or how about having a clear list objectives and seemingly randomly scattering slides related to each objective as evenly as possible throughout the 50 slide presentation?

/Rant

You have to know all of it. Don't waste your breath complaining about it now like I did. It seems ridiculous but it's all fair game for the USMLE. Every detail in some form is linked to the etiology, pathophysiology, epidemiology, presentation, treatment, or management of a medical condition. It's hard to make all the connections now but they're there.


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[Promethean]

Okay, one of our lecturers likes to use nature pictures, mandelbrots, and alex grey psychedelic paintings as frequent slides in his lectures. He might have 100 slides in a powerpoint, but only have 20-30 with actual testable material. I think that he thinks that this lightens the mood or something. Someone must have told him once that adding in a little levity, a little nonsense, makes the lecture less dry... and he really just took that straight to heart. Bless him.

You aren't always going to get the information that you need in an clear, straightforward, distraction free presentation. Just wait until you have to talk to a patient for half an hour about what they had to get on their shopping trip and how excited they were about going to their grandson's tuba recital just to get to the details about their intermittent claudication and dyspnea on exertion. No, it is totally better and more efficient and more respectful of your time if people will just get to the point and keep it simple, but they won't always.

Getting irritated by it just wastes even more of your time and distracts you from pulling out all the useful info that you can. Laugh about it and keep moving forward.

 

[Promethean]

Oh, and this is why I have dozens of alternative resources that I can go to for information. Lecture didn't do it for me? Sweet, hit the text. Too dense, not enough clarity? There are probably 4 youtube videos on the topic, at least one of which will be by someone who is clear and concise.

I paid for subscriptions to boardsbeyond.com and for Dr. Najeeb and Sketchy Medical and Pathoma all very early, because those were all resources that I found to be ridiculously helpful. There are plenty more that are free, but these were content creators who were consistent in helping me get the info I needed quickly.

 

[GoodWillShunting]

Devil's advocate: imagine you are the lecturer. You really have no idea whether most of the class understand your "need-to-know" material. A large proportion of students don't give feedback (useful feedback or honest evaluations)- thus, what do you do? Examples galore. Beat the dead horse. Even if the students don't remember it, you pray to God that it rings a bell if students encounter it at some point in the future, and can, by Hail Mary and Joseph's testicles, somehow navigate or problem solve or recall other information/situations by saying "oh yeah, I think I remember something about the chacha study and aminoglycosides".

It's true- you don't have the encounter these later and they won't have connections/associations for a while. There's just too much in so little time, and you aren't used to these associations yet.

That being said, hell yeah, a lot of slides actually are pointless, with really no (or little) relevance. For all of these, I suggest patience, common sense, and alcohol.


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[Goro]

Do the professor (and your fellow students) a favor and point this out to them in a polite way.

We appreciate constructive criticism.

It's the only way we become better at our jobs.

My own slides are the way they are thanks to lots of student input.

I didn't know it was possible to have lecture objectives clearly stated and still be able to create a powerpoint with not a single useful piece of information.

Take 50 slides filled with way too much text and notes. The lecturer glosses over all the details (after all how could you not when the class is only 1 hour) then says "don't worry about the details. Just understand the big picture." The **** does this mean? Maybe you should have only put the information you want us to retain in the slide.

Or how about 5-6 slides of random studies or long lists of things and then saying "I just want you to get an appreciation for the breadth of the subject."

Or how about having a clear list objectives and seemingly randomly scattering slides related to each objective as evenly as possible throughout the 50 slide presentation?

/Rant

 

[Goro]

Everybody pay very careful attention: What Promethean is doing is exactly what top Boards scorers do!!!!

Oh, and this is why I have dozens of alternative resources that I can go to for information. Lecture didn't do it for me? Sweet, hit the text. Too dense, not enough clarity? There are probably 4 youtube videos on the topic, at least one of which will be by someone who is clear and concise.

I paid for subscriptions to boardsbeyond.com and for Dr. Najeeb and Sketchy Medical and Pathoma all very early, because those were all resources that I found to be ridiculously helpful. There are plenty more that are free, but these were content creators who were consistent in helping me get the info I needed quickly.

Well, there are ways for the professor to help the students determine if they're getting the material. One is to prove some practice questions. I also Don't get bent out of shape when students don;t pre-read materials, or have learned everything by the end of a 50 minute lecture...you're not vacuum cleaners. It's takes time to absorb all of the stuff we throw at you. Even George Clooney or Meryl Streep can't memorize their lines after one pass at a script.


Devil's advocate: imagine you are the lecturer. You really have no idea whether most of the class understand your "need-to-know" material. A large proportion of students don't give feedback (useful feedback or honest evaluations)- thus, what do you do? Examples galore. Beat the dead horse. Even if the students don't remember it, you pray to God that it rings a bell if students encounter it at some point in the future, and can, by Hail Mary and Joseph's testicles, somehow navigate or problem solve or recall other information/situations by saying "oh yeah, I think I remember something about the chacha study and aminoglycosides".

It's true- you don't have the encounter these later and they won't have connections/associations for a while. There's just too much in so little time, and you aren't used to these associations yet.

 

[Doctor-S]

Do the professor (and your fellow students) a favor and point this out to them in a polite way.

We appreciate constructive criticism.

It's the only way we become better at our jobs.

My own slides are the way they are thanks to lots of student input.

Agree 100% with @Goro ... constructive/productive feedback is extremely useful and welcome. Each semester, I modify/revise my lectures based on student feedback. I appreciate students' comments and value their comments. After all, they (you) are going to be my future colleagues and I want they (you) to do well. 🙂

 

[giantswing]

I only started scoring above average when I went over info from multiple sources, like three or four diff sources, in addition to notes

 

[Azete]

I sort of question how "fair game" a lot of the extra stuff is for USMLE. I hear this all the time, but as I review and practice, I have never gotten a question wrong because I didn't memorize some random transcription factor.

There's a fine line between PhD depth and med student depth and some professors suck at this balance.

 

[Milotic]

I sort of question how "fair game" a lot of the extra stuff is for USMLE. I hear this all the time, but as I review and practice, I have never gotten a question wrong because I didn't memorize some random transcription factor.

There's a fine line between PhD depth and med student depth and some professors suck at this balance.

All hail the God-like memory capabilities of Azete. The only reason i MISS questions is because I don't remember every little detail. Not because I "read the question wrong." Wanna trade?

 

[Azete]

All hail the God-like memory capabilities of Azete. The only reason i MISS questions is because I don't remember every little detail. Not because I "read the question wrong." Wanna trade?

Maybe I misspoke, but I absolutely miss questions from lack of memory. My point was the stuff I don't remember is usually big stuff that I should know (as in it's in FA), and not a random detail from my professor's research.

 

[Redpancreas]

Maybe I misspoke, but I absolutely miss questions from lack of memory. My point was the stuff I don't remember is usually big stuff that I should know (as in it's in FA), and not a random detail from my professor's research.

Get yourself out of this mindset as soon as possible. It's all important. Even that transcription factor possibly. FA is obviously HY but have you stopped to think what it is? Basically all it is is people taking quick facts from UWorld and what ppl coming out of the exam say was tested to make a HY outline. Yes it's high yield but I'd say a good 25% of stuff isn't from UFAP.


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[37Base]

Anyone ever just review ONLY the learning objectives and blow off all the other misc. details in the powerpoints?

Doesn't work for every class, because in some classes the objectives are so broad. EG. anatomy: "learn all the nerves of the back muslces"


I have a friend who swears by this method for other classes. She does above average.

 

[FindMeOnTheLinks]

Anyone ever just review ONLY the learning objectives and blow off all the other misc. details in the powerpoints?

Doesn't work for every class, because in some classes the objectives are so broad. EG. anatomy: "learn all the nerves of the back muslces"


I have a friend who swears by this method for other classes. She does above average.

If you do this you will miss out on learning valuable concepts that are important to know. Try to learn things as well as you can. Stuff comes back around 2nd year and you need to know it.


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[Foot Fetish]

My strategy lately has been to just memorize everything. If its on the powerpoint or in the professors lecture notes, I know it cold. I make so many passes through the material that I can sometimes quote it verbatim as it appears in the ppt / professor's notes...I got 100% on the last batch of exams. Note that I do spend an inordinate amount of time studying though. While other kids are making time to do all sorts of fun, recreational activities, I just stay at home and study all day. 6-8 hours per day, more on the weekend. Not sure if its worth it.

 

[piii]

My strategy lately has been to just memorize everything. If its on the powerpoint or in the professors lecture notes, I know it cold. I make so many passes through the material that I can sometimes quote it verbatim as it appears in the ppt / professor's notes...I got 100% on the last batch of exams. Note that I do spend an inordinate amount of time studying though. While other kids are making time to do all sorts of fun, recreational activities, I just stay at home and study all day. 6-8 hours per day, more on the weekend. Not sure if its worth it.

Knowing everything isn't going to make you a good doctor. If you don't do other things, like clinical work or social stuff, you may just forget how to talk to a real person and not just an online message board. Maybe you won't get into those nice residencies because you'll be one dimensional. And there's plenty of academically average students that crush step 1.

 

[Stagg737]

Anyone ever just review ONLY the learning objectives and blow off all the other misc. details in the powerpoints?

Doesn't work for every class, because in some classes the objectives are so broad. EG. anatomy: "learn all the nerves of the back muslces"


I have a friend who swears by this method for other classes. She does above average.

Might be fine for lectures, but unless your professors are the greatest faculty ever and teach specifically to boards she's screwing herself over for the most important test of her career.

 

[Affiche]

YES THANK YOU FOR THIS RANT. I can't believe how terrible some slides are.

I have started straight up deleting objectives/highlights slides and anything with a useless image on it. I'm sick of opening a PowerPoint and seeing 72 slides for 25 slides of material. I print the PowerPoint, skim through it and highlight anything that's important for an outline of the big picture, referencing Lippincotts for any slide or concept that isn't explained well on the slides, then make a very big-picture outline/flowchart/pathway of the lecture's topic. Once I can see how it all fits together, I throw the details into Anki cards and move on.

Can we also laugh at the images that some lecturers choose? Why give me a slide full of detail and then provide an image with ''X Y and Z not pictured here''? I end up spending a ridiculous amount of time looking up images/videos/definitions that properly explain things when that should have been included from the start.

 

[shouldigomd]

Powerpoint has destroyed education in many respects. Luckily there is youtube that can do a better job of teaching virtually any topic. I think a huge problem is how lazy some teachers are when it comes to changing powerpoints. They let mistakes just sit there for years and years.

Objectives are either a love them or hate them. I hated them and decided to be a detail memorizer. Sometimes it helps and sometimes it hurts ... there is no better way only your way. I had a friend who was a great test taker and only studied objectives. He usually did a little better than me on tests but I did a little better than him on step. The bottom line is you have to make sure you cover the core topics and understand how they fit together / compare. Whether it is biochem and pathways or physiology and comparing cardio and pulmonary.

 

[Azete]

Get yourself out of this mindset as soon as possible. It's all important. Even that transcription factor possibly. FA is obviously HY but have you stopped to think what it is? Basically all it is is people taking quick facts from UWorld and what ppl coming out of the exam say was tested to make a HY outline. Yes it's high yield but I'd say a good 25% of stuff isn't from UFAP.

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Yeah you're not telling me anything I don't know -- there's just not enough hours in a day for me to memorize every detail. I take care of myself first, then do med school with the remaining time. If I score poorly on boards because I got 8 hours of sleep every night instead of memorizing the structure of acyclovir then so be it. I have a 4.0 in my last 3 blocks so I think my method is fine.

 

[Affiche]

I also get get bent out of shape when students don;t pre-read materials

I don't pre-read materials. I tried to at first and then realized half the powerpoint was just "for my own interest" and that it was taking way too long to pre-read anyway. It's a much more efficient use of my time to hear the professor sort out the important vs extraneous info for me, then study it on my own after hearing the brief run down of concepts.

 

[Goro]

I must apologize. ..I meant to write " I don't get bent out of shape...."

And how is med school treating one of my fave SDNers?

I don't pre-read materials. I tried to at first and then realized half the powerpoint was just "for my own interest" and that it was taking way too long to pre-read anyway. It's a much more efficient use of my time to hear the professor sort out the important vs extraneous info for me, then study it on my own after hearing the brief run down of concepts.

 

[CherryRedDracul]

95% of PowerPoint lectures I see are awful. Too many words.

Less is more. The less text I've put on my slides, the more compliments I've received. Too much text overwhelms the audience and distracts from the most important source of info: the presenter. Don't rely on your slides to present. They're an adjunct. As for class slides, if they seem like they're full of junk, I'll peruse through them quickly and study the material my own way because that's more fun.

 

[Affiche]

I must apologize. ..I meant to write " I don't get bent out of shape...."

And how is med school treating one of my fave SDNers?

Oh, good! Some professors do get irritated so you never know.

So far, so good! First round of midterms went great and school is generally much more manageable than I expected it to be!

 

[Mr Roboto]

One of our professors repeats each concept 2-3x using different cartoons. His philosophy is that one of them will stick. He also repeats the important (eg tested) parts in text.

First exam I was freaked out by all the slides and info, didn't do so great. Second exam I deleted anything that felt extraneous, and did much better.

 

[sliceofbread136]

I only started scoring above average when I went over info from multiple sources, like three or four diff sources, in addition to notes

Does your school test with nbme? If not then I think this is bad advice

 

[giantswing]

Does your school test with nbme? If not then I think this is bad advice

We had both a school written and nbme. Worked for me.

 

[Promethean]

Does your school test with nbme? If not then I think this is bad advice

Depends. Is your goal to score well on the exams at your school, or is it to lay down a base of information that will serve you for the rest of your career? It is only bad advice if you lose all perspective and let yourself believe that pre-clinical grades are the ultimate determinant of your future. No matter how you are tested, if you have a thorough understanding of the material, you are going to pass and probably do quite well. The strategy isn't to abandon your class notes, but to supplement them as needed.

I have decided to sacrifice a few points on my pre-clinical grades (if necessary) to ensure that I have thorough understanding of the concepts and the high yield details that will matter to me. I use as many resources as I need to develop that foundation. That may mean that I don't spend as much time memorizing minutia from a powerpoint, and so don't get a professor's pet question right.

That has happened a couple of times this week, when the professor's notes included a "fact" that disagreed with every other resource. I got her question wrong, but I am quite confident that I understand the idea and that she is incorrect in her interpretation of the concept. That certainty is worth more than the point ever would be.

 

[shouldigomd]

Depends. Is your goal to score well on the exams at your school, or is it to lay down a base of information that will serve you for the rest of your career? It is only bad advice if you lose all perspective and let yourself believe that pre-clinical grades are the ultimate determinant of your future. No matter how you are tested, if you have a thorough understanding of the material, you are going to pass and probably do quite well. The strategy isn't to abandon your class notes, but to supplement them as needed.

I have decided to sacrifice a few points on my pre-clinical grades (if necessary) to ensure that I have thorough understanding of the concepts and the high yield details that will matter to me. I use as many resources as I need to develop that foundation. That may mean that I don't spend as much time memorizing minutia from a powerpoint, and so don't get a professor's pet question right.

That has happened a couple of times this week, when the professor's notes included a "fact" that disagreed with every other resource. I got her question wrong, but I am quite confident that I understand the idea and that she is incorrect in her interpretation of the concept. That certainty is worth more than the point ever would be.

Why not just approach the teacher and ask.... I find it hard to believe you are finding multiple errors that they are testing you on and you are missing because of your superior knowledge of the subject.

 

[HybridEarth]

I've always wondered why other schools have 100 slides a day while I have 30-40... we literally have no BS slides, just memorize it all and know all the concepts, high density but no fluff. I can imagine how annoying it would be to sift through that many slides to find what's important.


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[Dandine]

Is it just me or am I starting to realize that test-taking is much more of a mind-reading challenge than anything?

(First post on the MD forum btw. Hello all. Stay healthy. Be amazing.)

 

[Goro]

I suspect that The Powers That Be in the Dean's office ordered a maximum slide count/lecture hour. My own Dean did this, and thank God for it. I have colleagues who had no problem with 200 slide lectures. I am NOT making that up!

At one contentious faculty meeting years ago, another colleague voiced his opinion that so many slides was "sadistic".

I reiterate, the only way your faculty will get better is if you give them an earful (constructively). Don't enable them by being quiet.

I've always wondered why other schools have 100 slides a day while I have 30-40... we literally have no BS slides, just memorize it all and know all the concepts, high density but no fluff. I can imagine how annoying it would be to sift through that many slides to find what's important.


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[Promethean]

Why not just approach the teacher and ask.... I find it hard to believe you are finding multiple errors that they are testing you on and you are missing because of your superior knowledge of the subject.

I have significant clinical background / familiarity with how many medications and lab tests are actually used in the real world.

I'm not saying that I know better than all my profs. I'm in school for a reason. But it does happen that there are pedantic points where, when I do approach the teachers and ask, they say "We don't know clinical. We are presenting it this way to illustrate a concept. It may not map into reality." So, if you know reality better than you know someone's pet theory, you may miss points on their exam. Oh, well. Can't win 'em all.