Are sneakers too casual for Second Look?

[br2pi5]

This type (with slacks):

Dress code is business casual

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[ciestar]

If they’re asking for business casual, I wouldn’t.

(I am a total sneaker girl and it KILLS me to not be able to wear any of my pretty shoes with my biz casual stuff)

 

[br2pi5]

Thank you!! I don’t think I will then. I cannot wear heels for the life of me or flats really, I find them uncomfortable. So dressy boots it is

 

[ciestar]

Thank you!! I don’t think I will then. I cannot wear heels for the life of me or flats really, I find them uncomfortable. So dressy boots it is

I also cannot do heels at all. I have many pairs of booties and a couple pairs of comfy flats for clerkships (people swear by Tieks and Rothy’s for comfort, but theyre EXPENSIVE)

 

[br2pi5]

I also cannot do heels at all. I have many pairs of booties and a couple pairs of comfy flats for clerkships (people swear by Tieks and Rothy’s for comfort, but theyre EXPENSIVE)

I’ve never heard of those brands but I’ll look into them, thank you!

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

My wife can’t wear heels at all either, but she has some nice shoes and a pair of wedges from The Walking Company. She likes them and says they don’t really hurt her feet.

 

[Rachapkis]

I would not wear sneakers to second look. I generally find that I am okay if I’m a bit overdressed, but unhappy if I am am underdressed. Why risk it, especially when you are entering a profession in which patients may judge competence (in many cases, inaccurately) by one’s dress.

 

[differentiating]

I personally think it’d be fine - it’s second look, you’re already in. Especially since few programs will even notice your shoes either way. But it’s up to you how seriously you’d want to take the business casual mandate.

 

[Crayola227]

I personally think it’d be fine - it’s second look, you’re already in. Especially since few programs will even notice your shoes either way. But it’s up to you how seriously you’d want to take the business casual mandate.

I disagree and I've written extensively on the subject of how to wear sneakers in the hospital. I think whatever you do, you need to strive for the blackest and plainest sneakers you can find (ie black sneakers with fluorescent yellow trim is not the best). To me the issue with the pictured shoes are that they are white and look like "skater" shoes. I think it's best, instead of a casual shoe, to go with actual athletic shoes in black, and be sure the rest of what you wear looks very professional. So I wouldn't even wear khakis or corduroy or the like, but actual slacks. I say this, because when you pair black athletic shoes with the right ensemble, people are more likely to assume foot issues than that you're just being lazy/overly casual. Anyone seeing a podiatrist would have been told not to wear "skater" type sneakers - so wearing them doesn't say anything particularly sympathetic about your need for comfort.

Dansko's either work for your feet, or they don't. This is why I've had some podiatrists tell me they're overrated for people who tend to have foot problems (unless what they needed was a huge, fixed, non-custom arch). In any case, some people will tell you Dansko's. I won't. HOWEVER I will tell you that as someone with crippling foot issues, that there are a few models of Dansko's that allow you to REMOVE the foot bed and insert your own orthotics. Those shoes tend to be more neutral, they may be nice for you off the shelf, or with inserts. I'm not a podiatrist and I'm not suggesting that anyone put on their feet or in their shoes anything that isn't over the counter, comfortable, and I suggest anything you do with your feet is with the blessing of a personal and qualified health care provider. In any case, some people with sensitive feet find they they can tolerate "dress" or business casual shoes (for me, I can sorta do ballet flats if I can get my orthotics in them and they have a neutral sole) if they have some sort of insert. Before I had custom orthotics I just used like Doc Scholl's gel inserts, they have various models that can be cut or fit dressy shoes, and are pretty slim but still cushion well).

 

[aldol16]

You're worrying about this way too much. Nobody cares what you wear. They're not going to revoke your acceptance or anything. Be comfortable, don't stress too much about your clothes, and use common sense. It's the one time in the application process when the school is trying to look good for you and not the other way around.

 

[Phoebus Apollo]

I wore the same pair of black Vans to each second look (technically a skater shoe lol... re: above post).

(Overall outfit = khakis, sweater, and black vans/sneakers).

I never felt underdressed. I kind of liked the Vans because the rest of my outfit felt dressy-ish and I want people to know I don’t take myself too seriously. But maybe that’s just me.
Besides, there are no patients, so my only goal is to convey that I am being respectful of the institution but I don’t feel like I need to say Hey I Am a Professional so much as Hey, I Put A Bit of Thought Into This AND Took A Shower!

 

[Crayola227]

I wore the same pair of black Vans to each second look (technically a skater shoe lol... re: above post).

(Overall outfit = khakis, sweater, and black vans/sneakers).

I never felt underdressed. I kind of liked the Vans because the rest of my outfit felt dressy-ish and I want people to know I don’t take myself too seriously. But maybe that’s just me.
Besides, there are no patients, so my only goal is to convey that I am being respectful of the institution but I don’t feel like I need to say Hey I Am a Professional so much as Hey, I Put A Bit of Thought Into This AND Took A Shower!

I approve because they were black. And you didn't wear jeans or a graphic T.

 

[Crayola227]

You're worrying about this way too much. Nobody cares what you wear. They're not going to revoke your acceptance or anything. Be comfortable, don't stress too much about your clothes, and use common sense. It's the one time in the application process when the school is trying to look good for you and not the other way around.

For some reason I thought this was for the Match. In second looks for residency, they absolutely could change your rank after your second look. I agree for med school, after acceptance, a more casual shoe isn't likely to be that damaging.

However, I personally kind of hate this attitude where I feel like people are trying to "get away" with as much as they can re: dressing as casual as possible in medicine.

Keep in mind, that anyone you interact with whenever you step foot onto a medical education campus/hospital, you could end up working with more closely than you would think possible (this is true of even the parking attendant booth staff). Some of my fellow applicants ended up being friends of mine when school started! Some of the attendings I ended up on wards with.

Point being, now I'm in a position to evaluate all manner of people in the field. And despite my age, I'm one of the curmudgeonly types when it comes to professional appearance. I don't appreciate it when I think people are trying to be too casual in any professional setting. Hemline not to hospital code (ie more than 2 inches above the knee?)? No panty hose (don't care it's not in the code)? Bra straps showing? Sneakers that aren't black/brown/grey mostly (sometimes you can't find ones that fit that have no colour trim to them) in a non-surgical setting? (in surgery almost anything closed toe goes for footwear) I'm secretly judging you and looking at you even more closely to see more about your attitudes towards professionalism.

So, could I be the one interviewing you or leading you on a second look, and then one day be in a position to evaluate you? Sure. If what you wore stood out as particularly casual would I remember, and not in a positive way? Good chance. Would I try not to hold it against you if I thought you were otherwise professional? Probably. Is there a chance it would still bias me unconsciously? Possibly, can't rule it out.

So I have no idea why people choose to anguish over these questions (or not anguish enough). The fact it's a question basically assumes all that I have said is understood to be a risk of underdressing. Just follow whatever are the professional dress guidelines, almost all schools/hospitals have printed ones you can refer to even, if you really want to "push the boundaries." As I said, the only place I have ever deviated from these guidelines was for medical reasons (foot pain I tried to treat with interventions beyond athletic shoes) and even then, I did my best to get ones with an appearance that most closely matched the code.

Please don't wear white athletic shoes, you should be able to obtain more professional looking ones, that are comfortable, and affordable.

When I first started shadowing as a pre-med, I didn't own any slacks. That's right, I lived a life so not classy that I didn't own a single pair. Ripped jeans and skintight low cut tops are my day to day uniform (even now). I went and bought slacks, and figured they were an investment in my career. Same when you get a suit and professional shoes for your med school interviews. Whatever professional wear you invest in, you will be able to use as you will need them for the rest of your career.

So use the second look as an impetus to select comfortable business casual shoes you will need, rather than making do with white sneakers.

 

[differentiating]

I disagree and I've written extensively on the subject of how to wear sneakers in the hospital. I think whatever you do, you need to strive for the blackest and plainest sneakers you can find (ie black sneakers with fluorescent yellow trim is not the best). To me the issue with the pictured shoes are that they are white and look like "skater" shoes. I think it's best, instead of a casual shoe, to go with actual athletic shoes in black, and be sure the rest of what you wear looks very professional. So I wouldn't even wear khakis or corduroy or the like, but actual slacks. I say this, because when you pair black athletic shoes with the right ensemble, people are more likely to assume foot issues than that you're just being lazy/overly casual. Anyone seeing a podiatrist would have been told not to wear "skater" type sneakers - so wearing them doesn't say anything particularly sympathetic about your need for comfort.

Dansko's either work for your feet, or they don't. This is why I've had some podiatrists tell me they're overrated for people who tend to have foot problems (unless what they needed was a huge, fixed, non-custom arch). In any case, some people will tell you Dansko's. I won't. HOWEVER I will tell you that as someone with crippling foot issues, that there are a few models of Dansko's that allow you to REMOVE the foot bed and insert your own orthotics. Those shoes tend to be more neutral, they may be nice for you off the shelf, or with inserts. I'm not a podiatrist and I'm not suggesting that anyone put on their feet or in their shoes anything that isn't over the counter, comfortable, and I suggest anything you do with your feet is with the blessing of a personal and qualified health care provider. In any case, some people with sensitive feet find they they can tolerate "dress" or business casual shoes (for me, I can sorta do ballet flats if I can get my orthotics in them and they have a neutral sole) if they have some sort of insert. Before I had custom orthotics I just used like Doc Scholl's gel inserts, they have various models that can be cut or fit dressy shoes, and are pretty slim but still cushion well).

I’d argue that the hospital and a second look are two different situations, but I think we do fundamentally disagree on what sort of dress is unprofessional. I think as long as you look “put together”, that’s professional dress - even if your sneakers are white instead of black or you’re wearing a skirt without pantyhose. If they’re clean, patients legitimately won’t care. I’d personally hate to be at a school or program that was so anal about something so unimportant, so if it decreased my chances of matching there, it’d probably be worth it.

 

[aldol16]

For some reason I thought this was for the Match. In second looks for residency, they absolutely could change your rank after your second look. I agree for med school, after acceptance, a more casual shoe isn't likely to be that damaging.

Well, yes, because for second look for residency, they may not have necessarily ranked you yet. For the most competitive places, you have to show up to their second look to even be ranked. There are no surprises at those programs. They know who they're going to get.

Keep in mind, that anyone you interact with whenever you step foot onto a medical education campus/hospital, you could end up working with more closely than you would think possible (this is true of even the parking attendant booth staff). Some of my fellow applicants ended up being friends of mine when school started! Some of the attendings I ended up on wards with.

So, could I be the one interviewing you or leading you on a second look, and then one day be in a position to evaluate you? Sure. If what you wore stood out as particularly casual would I remember, and not in a positive way? Good chance. Would I try not to hold it against you if I thought you were otherwise professional? Probably. Is there a chance it would still bias me unconsciously? Possibly, can't rule it out.

Yeah, this is why you don't ever dress sloppily. If you come to a second look even in a cutoff and beach clothes, that won't reflect well on you. But if you go in casual clothing that isn't flashy, you're not going to stand out much. To say that somebody there is going to remember you, evaluate you year(s) down the line, recall why they didn't like you, and then let that color their evaluation of you is a stretch, I think. If it really happens, that says something more about the evaluator than you.

 

[teenyfish]

I agree with @aldol16. In my job I frequently supervise interns and there is only one instance that I remember someone negatively because of their clothing choice. This person wore a stained, ripped T-shirt and combat boots to a professional outcomes event for our participants because they were going to a concert after. That will always be the first thing I'll remember about them, even before the fact that they were generally good at their role. All of our interns who probably wore jeans and some nice looking sneakers? Doesn't even register for me.

I think you'd be okay? If you wanted to play it safe maybe look into some flats? I have loafers from years ago at J.Crew and they've broken in to the point where they're like slippers, but still look like I've dressed up a bit!

 

[br2pi5]

hi everyone!! thank you for your suggestions. I ended up not wearing the sneakers but to be honest I feel like I could have worn them. People wore different types of casual to second look, some more dressed up, others as casual as wearing jeans/sneakers so up to one's discretion, I guess!