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I think the program can rank you even with AAMC ID
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wallebergsyndrome said:
it can appear using AAMC ID check NRMP website
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No--you have to be registered with the NRMP in order to be ranked in the NRMP--that's why the program called the OP in the first place (which was nice of them to do). Once registered with NRMP, programs can use various methods to locate an applicant, including AAMC ID, NRMP ID, or just the name. OP--since it's impossible to know whether or not programs skipped you when they couldn't find your name, or if they just haven't completed their ROL yet, it is probably worth a call to the PC to let them know you are now in the system. Even if a program has certified their list, they can add you and recertify up to the deadline. PCs will often enter the ROL, but only the PD can certify.
 
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mcl said:
No--you have to be registered with the NRMP in order to be ranked in the NRMP--that's why the program called the OP in the first place (which was nice of them to do). Once registered with NRMP, programs can use various methods to locate an applicant, including AAMC ID, NRMP ID, or just the name. OP--since it's impossible to know whether or not programs skipped you when they couldn't find your name, or if they just haven't completed their ROL yet, it is probably worth a call to the PC to let them know you are now in the system. Even if a program has certified their list, they can add you and recertify up to the deadline. PCs will often enter the ROL, but only the PD can certify.
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Thank you for your input, that was my general thought process as well. I'll contact the programs and let them know.Maybe I'm just being paranoid. I just hope it doesn't change their decision whether to rank me or not any more.
 
I'm coming to terms with the possibility that I might have to SOAP into a prelim this March. I am ranking categorical programs highly to avoid this possibility, but there are a few advanced programs that I really like and I'm willing to SOAP to have the opportunity to train there.

Can you share your thoughts regarding predictors for success in SOAP? The data says that US-MDs tend to do better than others, and I assume prelim programs will try to pick applicants that will give them the least trouble: high scores, few red flags, with a PGY2 lined up (so the applicant doesn't have to take time off for interviews). I also assume (with less confidence) that an applicant's chances to SOAP into a prelim are better if his/her advanced program is really well-known/highly ranked.

1. If an applicant is partially matched, can programs participating in SOAP see the applicant's advanced program?
2. Is a partially matched applicant more likely to find success (a PGY1 spot) during SOAP than a student without one? In other words: are partially matched applicants more "attractive" to programs than unmatched applicants?
 
1. We can see that you're matched to an Adv program, but we don't know which one. You can contact the NRMP and they will tell you what city you are in, as that might impact where you want to be for prelim.

2. Yes, for all the reasons you've listed.
 
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aProgDirector said:
1. We can see that you're matched to an Adv program, but we don't know which one. You can contact the NRMP and they will tell you what city you are in, as that might impact where you want to be for prelim.

2. Yes, for all the reasons you've listed.
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Thanks for this input. I have three great institutions A, B, and C at the top of my list with both Cat and Adv programs. My true preference is:

Cat A
Cat B
Adv A
Adv B
Cat C
Adv C

But I'm honestly so afraid of SOAP so I'm tempted to rank my three Cat programs before any advanced. I wish there were stats about the % of partially matched applicants who are successful in SOAP.
 
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Do positive things from the PC mean anything? Dumb question since even PD comments are taken with a grain of salt, but wondering since PCs also have a say in the rank list, no?

If not, carry on...
 
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recycledpaper said:
Do positive things from the PC mean anything? Dumb question since even PD comments are taken with a grain of salt, but wondering since PCs also have a say in the rank list, no?

If not, carry on...
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Having someone in your corner is NEVER a bad thing, it depends on the program if they ask the PC for feedback (and how long he or she has been in that role).

Far more common is the opposite where an applicant is at some point rude/standoff-ish/unprofessional to the PC - all it takes is a quick comment to the PD or the ranking committee and that applicant’s application is toast.
 
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recycledpaper said:
Do positive things from the PC mean anything? Dumb question since even PD comments are taken with a grain of salt, but wondering since PCs also have a say in the rank list, no?

If not, carry on...
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A good friend of mine was ranking transitional year programs. We're both Caribbean US FMGs. This was 16 years ago. She had stellar numbers, but, also, just really hit it off well with the PC at one program. She was ranked to match (in the top 8, of an 8 position program). She found this out (from the PC) during the year (although the PC didn't tell her which number). They still keep in touch.

I don't know if it was the reason, but it certainly didn't hurt. As my esteemed colleague above said, having ANYONE in your corner is an asset.
 
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On March 9th, I believe we are told whether we are eligible for SOAP or not. Does this mean we didn't match if we are eligible, or does it mean that in case we don't match then we could do SOAP?
 
richa11 said:
On March 9th, I believe we are told whether we are eligible for SOAP or not. Does this mean we didn't match if we are eligible, or does it mean that in case we don't match then we could do SOAP?
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The latter.
 
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First of all, thank you to the Program Coordinators for taking the time to answer our questions!

I am an IMG from a UK school who wants to match into a Preliminary surgery program in SOAP. I just found out that the fellowships I want to do in the future requires a year of surgery, so this would be ideal for me. Would it be inappropriate to contact the programs before SOAP week who, historically, always have vacancies about my interest in their program? I just want to convey my genuine interest before I'm just another name of thousands of applicants. Any advice would be appreciated! Thanks!
 
daretoderm said:
First of all, thank you to the Program Coordinators for taking the time to answer our questions!

I am an IMG from a UK school who wants to match into a Preliminary surgery program in SOAP. I just found out that the fellowships I want to do in the future requires a year of surgery, so this would be ideal for me. Would it be inappropriate to contact the programs before SOAP week who, historically, always have vacancies about my interest in their program? I just want to convey my genuine interest before I'm just another name of thousands of applicants. Any advice would be appreciated! Thanks!
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Be careful, here. It’s a SOAP violation to contact (or have someone on your behalf) a program before they initiate contact with you. Here’s the PDF.

http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/2018-SOAP-FAQS-Applicants.pdf

What you are proposing is to contact them BEFORE SOAP begins. That seems to be a little different, and I don’t know how to advise on that. I probably wouldn’t do it, myself because of these rules. This is sort of a moot conversation, as SOAP starts on Monday.

You also have to be SOAP eligible to even consider doing this, are you? Did you not have any interviews at all this season?
 
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AdmiralChz said:
Be careful, here. It’s a SOAP violation to contact (or have someone on your behalf) a program before they initiate contact with you. Here’s the PDF.

What you are proposing is to contact them BEFORE SOAP begins. That seems to be a little different, and I don’t know how to advise on that. I probably wouldn’t do it, myself because of these rules. This is sort of a moot conversation, as SOAP starts on Monday.

You also have to be SOAP eligible to even consider doing this, are you? Did you not have any interviews at all this season?
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Thanks for the response. Yeah, I'm talking about contacting them before SOAP. I applied for a competitive specialty without a backup (stupid I know), and I have not received any interviews. My Step 2 CK came in a bit later than I hoped for as well. In any case, I am SOAP eligible and thought this might be a good way to show my interest, especially since I did not apply to surgical prelims in the main match and now I actually want/need to do it for future fellowship goals!
 
daretoderm said:
Thanks for the response. Yeah, I'm talking about contacting them before SOAP. I applied for a competitive specialty without a backup (stupid I know), and I have not received any interviews. My Step 2 CK came in a bit later than I hoped for as well. In any case, I am SOAP eligible and thought this might be a good way to show my interest, especially since I did not apply to surgical prelims in the main match and now I actually want/need to do it for future fellowship goals!
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You're using the word "fellowship" in an atypical manner. Fellowship in the US usually refers to specialty training after basic training. Your username suggests the competitive field you're applying to is Derm. Derm is a residency, not a fellowship. Same with Rads, Neuro, or anything else that would come after a single prelim year. It's mostly semantics, since training is training. What were you planning on doing after this surgery year?
 
aProgDirector said:
You're using the word "fellowship" in an atypical manner. Fellowship in the US usually refers to specialty training after basic training. Your username suggests the competitive field you're applying to is Derm. Derm is a residency, not a fellowship. Same with Rads, Neuro, or anything else that would come after a single prelim year. It's mostly semantics, since training is training. What were you planning on doing after this surgery year?
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Maybe I didn't explain myself fully. I meant fellowship as it should be used aka after residency I would like to complete a dermatologic surgery fellowship. Some of them require 1 year of general surgery residency, so a prelim year is beneficial for me. Sorry if that wasn't clear!

After the surgery year I would be better equipped to do a Dermatology Clinical Research fellowship, as a vast majority of them require completion of a PGY1 year prior to starting.
 
daretoderm said:
Maybe I didn't explain myself fully. I meant fellowship as it should be used aka after residency I would like to complete a dermatologic surgery fellowship. Some of them require 1 year of general surgery residency, so a prelim year is beneficial for me. Sorry if that wasn't clear!

After the surgery year I would be better equipped to do a Dermatology Clinical Research fellowship, as a vast majority of them require completion of a PGY1 year prior to starting.
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If you applied to Derm and didn't get any interviews, how will doing a prelim surgery year make you competitive for a Derm spot next year? What's your backup to Derm?
 
ThoracicGuy said:
If you applied to Derm and didn't get any interviews, how will doing a prelim surgery year make you competitive for a Derm spot next year? What's your backup to Derm?
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I have been told to 'get my foot in the door' and do a preliminary year to gain clinical references from the US/prove myself clinically/make connections, etc. After doing the PGY1 year I am eligible for most of the Clinical Research Fellowships in Dermatology and from there I would apply to derm again. Obviously, if I can get a research fellowship without having to complete a PGY1 year that would be ideal as that would strengthen my application for derm specifically; I have interviewed for a few of these and waiting to hear back. I'm just trying to plan ahead for all possibilities.

Do you have any advice for me? All advice is appreciated!
 
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daretoderm said:
I have been told to 'get my foot in the door' and do a preliminary year to gain clinical references from the US/prove myself clinically/make connections, etc. After doing the PGY1 year I am eligible for most of the Clinical Research Fellowships in Dermatology and from there I would apply to derm again. Obviously, if I can get a research fellowship without having to complete a PGY1 year that would be ideal as that would strengthen my application for derm specifically; I have interviewed for a few of these and waiting to hear back. I'm just trying to plan ahead for all possibilities.

Do you have any advice for me? All advice is appreciated!
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The Derm nightmare.

I interviewed a young lady this year who has spent 4 years in a Research Lab, applying each year to Derm and somehow not making it. This year she decided to apply to medicine at the last moment. She would make a fine internist, but is having a hard time "letting it go". I don't know if she'll match to medicine without completely forgetting about Derm and starting to focus her application energy.

It is my long time experience that people (who are also good candidates) who really, really, really want to do Medicine can find a way. A community program, a J1-waiver job, whatever it takes, to start their career.

The same is just not true about Derm. Getting your foot in the door, doing a surg prelim, is not, in my experience going to help you at all with Derm. Research is the only recommended path for improving your application and if you need to do a PGY1 to do research (?), then, sure. But this is, as your idea suggests, a dream.
 
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Getting a derm spot in the US as an IMG is extremely challenging. You need stellar scores, great connections, and lots of luck. As mentioned above, a PGY-1 GS year is not going to help at all, other than you need a PGY-1 year of some sort. If you want our advice, you need to post your stats and your full plan.
 
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Hello! I have read this forum from the very first post to the last and I am amazed it is still active. My question is for the Program Coordinator. Is there any possibility for any applicant to be called again for an interview if that applicant did not match in your program from the previous season? The reason why I am asking is, I got interviewed in a Program, and did not match. Is there any chance that I will be called again for an interview in this Program if I apply again with a better and more competitive application? Thank you very much for offering information and advise for all of us. God bless!
 
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I have lost all faith in everything. I applied, had 10 interviews, worked hard to charm and be honest. I was nice to everybody and put my best foot forward. Now I feel hopeless and lost
 
ddmd said:
Hello! I have read this forum from the very first post to the last and I am amazed it is still active. My question is for the Program Coordinator. Is there any possibility for any applicant to be called again for an interview if that applicant did not match in your program from the previous season? The reason why I am asking is, I got interviewed in a Program, and did not match. Is there any chance that I will be called again for an interview in this Program if I apply again with a better and more competitive application? Thank you very much for offering information and advise for all of us. God bless!
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Yes. No guarantees. But it could happen.
 
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Geraltofrivia said:
I have lost all faith in everything. I applied, had 10 interviews, worked hard to charm and be honest. I was nice to everybody and put my best foot forward. Now I feel hopeless and lost
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It really is so hard. I have been crying since yesterday. When I read the email that I did not match it is so painful as It is not the first time. I am just keeping the faith that if i was offered an interview this season, I might still have a chance next season. All we can do is just focus now and improve our application and try again. I feel lost too because to be a doctor is all I wanted to be since I was a kid. We just have to keep trying, keep that faith and be strong. I have heard of stories that matched after second, third or fourth tries. By God's grace, hopefully we can make it too. Good luck to us!
 
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If a student scrambled into a backup specialty and then was offered a spot in their first choice specialty later on, how likely are programs to let the student out of their obligation to start in their SOAPed program?
 
TrickyRicky121 said:
If a student scrambled into a backup specialty and then was offered a spot in their first choice specialty later on, how likely are programs to let the student out of their obligation to start in their SOAPed program?
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I would think some might be tempted to say yes just to avoid a bitter resident poisoning the well but I could also see them saying no unless they had another resident lined up

(Just thinking out loud)
 
Why is it that programs are so concerned about having a full class? It seems like programs act like having an empty spot is the worst thing. Just curious. I’m not saying they shouldn’t act this way. I just don’t know what the problem is with it.
 
TrickyRicky121 said:
Why is it that programs are so concerned about having a full class? It seems like programs act like having an empty spot is the worst thing. Just curious. I’m not saying they shouldn’t act this way. I just don’t know what the problem is with it.
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Meat needs to get moved.
 
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TrickyRicky121 said:
Why is it that programs are so concerned about having a full class? It seems like programs act like having an empty spot is the worst thing. Just curious. I’m not saying they shouldn’t act this way. I just don’t know what the problem is with it.
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I have "fixed services" that need a certain number of interns each block. I might need 4 interns at the VA, 8 on the wards, 3 in the ICU, 2 for night float, etc. Then, I want each intern to have a specific curriculum -- a certain number of inpatient blocks, 1 elective, 1 ED block, etc. When I'm short an intern, the "fixed" blocks they would have been assigned end up falling to someone else, as I can't just leave a slot open. This then decreases elective or outpatient time for the remaining interns. Hence, having the exact right number of interns is important.

I could fix all of this by building more redundancy into the schedule -- I could build my system so that everything all fits if I have n-1 interns, and then if I get my full n interns I have some extra flexibility. But even that is complicated, as I need each intern to get enough ICU, ward, etc time. A good example: I have both teaching and non teaching ward teams. Theoretically, if I had an extra intern, I could just assign them to a non-teaching team. But my hospitalists don't want an inefficient intern (esp one early in the year) messing up their highly streamlined teams, and these teams can have SubI's on them, or visiting students, and then we end up with too many learners on a team.

Basically, this is a longer explanation of @gutonc's very concise summary.
 
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Hello. :) To the Program Director, Program Coordinator or anyone who can give information :) Now that the match is over, and SOAP is done, I, like many other aspiring doctors, will start preparing again for the application on September 2018 [heart breaking but no choice but to be strong and move on :( ]. Will it be offensive to the program director in a program I was interviewed in and not matched to ask for some pointers on what made my application weak? Could I ask the program, what were they looking for in a candidate to be accepted to the Program? If so, how can I do that in the most humble and least offensive way? I was thinking that the feedback will guide repeat applicants on how to improve our applications and make it more competitive. There must be a reason why we were not ranked, or not ranked highly. I wish that NRMP also releases to us how we were rank in a program. This will really help us to figure out if we are a strong or weak applicant and help us to do better next time. Thank you!
 
Can the Admin please change the title of this thread to "Ask the Program Director" from "Ask the Program Coordinator" since I haven't seem a PC respond to this thread for years, only PDs respond.
 
ddmd said:
Hello. :) To the Program Director, Program Coordinator or anyone who can give information :) Now that the match is over, and SOAP is done, I, like many other aspiring doctors, will start preparing again for the application on September 2018 [heart breaking but no choice but to be strong and move on :( ]. Will it be offensive to the program director in a program I was interviewed in and not matched to ask for some pointers on what made my application weak? Could I ask the program, what were they looking for in a candidate to be accepted to the Program? If so, how can I do that in the most humble and least offensive way? I was thinking that the feedback will guide repeat applicants on how to improve our applications and make it more competitive. There must be a reason why we were not ranked, or not ranked highly. I wish that NRMP also releases to us how we were rank in a program. This will really help us to figure out if we are a strong or weak applicant and help us to do better next time. Thank you!
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You can absolutely ask. Chances are, you'll get a pretty generic answer -- competitive year, other people were more competitive than you, etc. You might get some useful feedback. You might get told it had something to do with the medical school you came from / USMLE scores / grades - things that you can't change at all.

Knowing how you're ranked won't help you at all, without knowing how everyone else was ranked and where they matched. Let's say you were ranked #200. How would that help you? Or not ranked at all? (the only thing that would help with is not reapplying next year to that program). Programs do not want to advertise how far down their rank lists they go.

It's a Wash said:
Can the Admin please change the title of this thread to "Ask the Program Director" from "Ask the Program Coordinator" since I haven't seem a PC respond to this thread for years, only PDs respond.
Click to expand...

Then you've missed one of the best. They posted on the last page.
 
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aProgDirector said:
You can absolutely ask. Chances are, you'll get a pretty generic answer -- competitive year, other people were more competitive than you, etc. You might get some useful feedback. You might get told it had something to do with the medical school you came from / USMLE scores / grades - things that you can't change at all.

Knowing how you're ranked won't help you at all, without knowing how everyone else was ranked and where they matched. Let's say you were ranked #200. How would that help you? Or not ranked at all? (the only thing that would help with is not reapplying next year to that program). Programs do not want to advertise how far down their rank lists they go.



Then you've missed one of the best. They posted on the last page.
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Thank you so much for the input Doc! Much appreciated :)
 
gutonc said:
The Tissue is the Issue | GRACE :: Lung Cancer
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Well, ****! I heard this from the IM folks at Duke (where we saw a LOT of cancer) - "tissue is the issue". There were patients I was absolutely, 100%, balls to the wall, sure that they had cancer, but I, in the ED, had the "out" that "tissue is the issue" - I didn't have to be the "bad guy", even though, logically, I knew what it was. But, it was only after the biopsy that the onc doc, or the surgeon, had to bear the literal bad news.
 
And, that reminds me of a guy I saw last year - circumferential lesion on CT (the true "apple core lesion"), but the radiologist would NOT, no matter what, say what it suggested (which, I thought, was either crazy, or, more likely, such absolute cowardice). So, I call the guy the next day, and tell him he has to follow up, soon, and, I'll be damned if this guy wasn't THE nicest guy on the phone. I mean, I'm pleasant on the phone, but this guy made me smile. That made me feel really bad, because, nicer the patient, more vicious the cancer death. I haven't had the guts to look up this guy. God's honest truth, I don't know if he ended up with an APR, or kept his ass hole.
 
ddmd said:
Hello. :) To the Program Director, Program Coordinator or anyone who can give information :) Now that the match is over, and SOAP is done, I, like many other aspiring doctors, will start preparing again for the application on September 2018 [heart breaking but no choice but to be strong and move on :( ]. Will it be offensive to the program director in a program I was interviewed in and not matched to ask for some pointers on what made my application weak? Could I ask the program, what were they looking for in a candidate to be accepted to the Program? If so, how can I do that in the most humble and least offensive way? I was thinking that the feedback will guide repeat applicants on how to improve our applications and make it more competitive. There must be a reason why we were not ranked, or not ranked highly. I wish that NRMP also releases to us how we were rank in a program. This will really help us to figure out if we are a strong or weak applicant and help us to do better next time. Thank you!
Click to expand...
i think that is an excellent idea ...wait til maybe April or May when things have settled down.
 
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Hello PD,

I am asking for some advice on the behalf of a friend. I do not want to be insensitive to those that did not match and wish everyone the best. My friend is an AMG MD who applied to general surgery with some backup programs because of low scores. He was expecting a surgery outcome but received the backup. He is now devastated and is regretting his decision to rank the backup options. What can he do? I see many posts on switching from surgery/OB etc to medicine/family. Is this possible in the other direction? He is willing to do anything at this point. Thanks in advance, any advice is greatly appreciated.
 
Doctorsnowboard said:
Hello PD,

I am asking for some advice on the behalf of a friend. I do not want to be insensitive to those that did not match and wish everyone the best. My friend is an AMG MD who applied to general surgery with some backup programs because of low scores. He was expecting a surgery outcome but received the backup. He is now devastated and is regretting his decision to rank the backup options. What can he do? I see many posts on switching from surgery/OB etc to medicine/family. Is this possible in the other direction? He is willing to do anything at this point. Thanks in advance, any advice is greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...
The “anything” is show up for the residency they matched in and do a good job
 
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Doctorsnowboard said:
Yes, I know that is a necessary step but is a switch going to be possible or likely?
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Yes, people can and do switch throughout the course of time. He may want to disclose this to the pd after the first quarter so that they can work mutually to balance each other’s educational goals
 
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