Best Do School??

[Tanner82]

PT2MD & StrengthDoc = Way too proud of Texas guys

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[GoingCrazy]

Screw all those people bashing Texas. All they really know of the state comes from Politics and the News. If it makes you feel any better I think the NE smells like smog and piss, the mid west is too lazy/stupid to care about much, and the west coast is too stuck up and gay to notice anyone but themselves.

 

[EEL08]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apMyjOAacyA

That's pretty funny. I live in Texas and I haven't even seen that one. I actually had a friend from back home (IL) ask me if everyone here is like the president. Yeah because the entire population of one state are all alike, right? That being said, I'm not overly fond of living in this part of Texas. I'm sure other places like Austin would be nice to live in but I'm planning on being out of here in less than a year. I'm sure the die hard Texas lovers won't miss me.

 

[PT2MD]

PT2MD & StrengthDoc = Way too proud of Texas guys

Sans the beer gut.

 

[Tanner82]

Screw all those people bashing Texas. All they really know of the state comes from Politics and the News. If it makes you feel any better I think the NE smells like smog and piss, the mid west is too lazy/stupid to care about much, and the west coast is too stuck up and gay to notice anyone but themselves.

hahahahaha, did you seriously just steal the quote from the youtube comment and use it as a SDN post? 5 comments down on the youtube video? Wow... I'm speech-less.

 

[CTrainSJU]

hahahahaha, did you seriously just steal the quote from the youtube comment and use it as a SDN post? 5 comments down on the youtube video? Wow... I'm speech-less.

AHAHAHAHA!

 

[StrengthDoc]

PT2MD & StrengthDoc = Way too proud of Texas guys

Guilty...and with a little of the beer gut.


(But without the "Don't Mess With Texas" tattoo)





..........(Yet)

 

[TexasTriathlete]

Don't Mess With Texas is the slogan for an anti-littering campaign, and it is one of the best ad campaigns ever. It put GSD&M on the map as an ad agency, and now, they are the proud employers of hundreds of very hot girls who are right out of college.

 

[MossPoh]

Screw all those people bashing Texas. All they really know of the state comes from Politics and the News. If it makes you feel any better I think the NE smells like smog and piss, the mid west is too lazy/stupid to care about much, and the west coast is too stuck up and gay to notice anyone but themselves.

Lazy yes...stupid no. Actually, the other week a study came out showing the midwest and west coast read more than the rest of the country. Kind of an interesting argument since politics, news, and hearsay are what most people base their opinions on anyway.

Smog patterns begin in china and then catch up and funnel through the PA area with the jet stream...which leaves a lot of the northeast free. The west...well they are the west. Although, your argument for the west could be pinned with texas as well. You can bash pretty much anywhere..not that tough. Whenever I travel somewhere I ask the cab driver what he thinks of the area, since they tend to be brutally honest. Houston was described as a "damp hell". I am just kind of prodding stuff right now since I really don't give a damn. As long as you aren't one of those dirty alaskans.

 

[TexasTriathlete]

Houston is a damp hell. Dallas is the most pretentious city on earth, with the exception of LA. But I can find no fault with the ATX

 

[t-funk]

I wouldn't exactly call midwesterners lazy or stupid. We have some of the best public schools in the nation which are usually ranked up at the top with New England schools. And everyone talks about midwestern work ethic. Companies love to come to midwestern cities bc of the way work ethic is valued out here which might come from the agricultural background of our states. Just bc midwesterners don't rush around like their head just got chopped off yelling and being rude to everyone doesn't make them lazy. I wouldn't confuse laid back with lazy.

 

[PT2MD]

[Trying to pull the thread out of a nosedive]

Lot's of nice places to live out there gang...let's play nice. Hard for me to characterize certain areas as lazy, stupid, or otherwise. Hell I have a few folks in my own family meeting that description.

As for my beloved Houston being a "damp hell". Well that's just, like, your opinion man. It's my damp hell and I love it regardless.

 

[TexasTriathlete]

Well that's just, like, your opinion man.

Say what you want about the tenets of national socialism... at least its an ethos.

 

[Beau Geste]

I wouldn't exactly call midwesterners lazy or stupid. We have some of the best public schools in the nation which are usually ranked up at the top with New England schools. And everyone talks about midwestern work ethic. Companies love to come to midwestern cities bc of the way work ethic is valued out here which might come from the agricultural background of our states. Just bc midwesterners don't rush around like their head just got chopped off yelling and being rude to everyone doesn't make them lazy. I wouldn't confuse laid back with lazy.

LOL RURAL midwesterners are laid back.

Try to get through traffic in Chicago dodging the suburban soccer moms in their monster trucks/vans/SUVs. And you get honked at to move BEFORE the light turns green.

There are stigmas about every place. To everyone, if you're accepted somewhere and it's not your dream location, just shut up and go to school. You're going to be a doctor someday now that you made it that far, so suck it up.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Houston is a damp hell. Dallas is the most pretentious city on earth, with the exception of LA. But I can find no fault with the ATX

Too hot, and the people are cold -- at least they were in 1999-2002 when I lived there. I remember shopping at Central Market once checking out teas, and this stranger started talking to me about different brands, etc. It was utterly bizarre because that just never happened in Austin. It happens regularly every other place I've lived, but not there. And don't get me started on the drivers and the complete hostility to public transportation or any type of change. The last time they voted down lightrail was the sign for me that I just had to get out of there -- not the place for me. Yeah, I know they finally approved it, but I had always heard Austin was some sort of liberal mecca, and it was totally disillusioning to realize that overall it's a conservative town.

After that I moved to Portland, OR, which is indeed the greatest city in the US. What sucks is that in Oklahoma everybody is just super impressed that I lived in Austin and wants to talk to me about how great that must have been, and they have no interest in hearing about how fantastically great PDX was.

Speaking of the midwest, I think Iowa was ranked as having one of the highest high school graduation rates in the country.

 

[TexasTriathlete]

What you just said makes no sense.

It wasn't lightrail, in general, that they were voting down. It was the crappy proposal that would ultimately result in a lightrail that got voted down. And none of what you mentioned has anything to do with liberal or conservative. I'd say that this place is pretty socially diverse.

I like it because it is a very active, outdoorsy town. Honestly, that is the most important thing to me.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

What you just said makes no sense.

It wasn't lightrail, in general, that they were voting down. It was the crappy proposal that would ultimately result in a lightrail that got voted down. And none of what you mentioned has anything to do with liberal or conservative. I'd say that this place is pretty socially diverse.

I like it because it is a very active, outdoorsy town. Honestly, that is the most important thing to me.

You can view it that way, but I disagree. Everyone at that time just wanted to build more roads. Yay! Maybe diverse but I saw a lot of Texas (read conservative) ideas floating around. This was also when they built the MLK statue on campus, and man was there some racism going down. Pretty sad that they had to put the statue essentially in an untraveled part of campus and have a security guard by it at all times. Not to mention The Daily Texan was full of letters about how the civil war was about states' rights. What is this -- Mississippi in 1920?

The city was also full of huge SUVs with big W stickers on them. Sure, you met some liberal folks at Wheatsville, but that's it.

And again, too hot to enjoy the outdoorsy stuff. It's got nothing on the real mountains or the ocean. Glad you like it, but it wasn't my cup of tea.

I've got to say I also find it seriously amusing how you Texas folks get actually irritated if people admit they didn't like living there. Sad to say, but I've gotten in fights before because people got mad at me for saying I didn't like living in Austin. Why care if other people don't like your city as much as you do?

 

[TexasTriathlete]

First of all, it sounds like you are locked into the narrow "there are only two political ideologies, and everyone fits perfectly into one of them" mindset. Additionally, if you're getting in fights with people because you said you didn't like austin, and this has happened more than once, you probably need to take a look at yourself. Nobody gets in fights about that, unless there's more to the story.

There is a lot more to being liberal or conservative than what you drive or whether or not you shop at wheatsville.

 

[TexasTriathlete]

First of all, it sounds like you are locked into the narrow "there are only two political ideologies, and everyone fits perfectly into one of them" mindset. Additionally, if you're getting in fights with people because you said you didn't like austin, and this has happened more than once, you probably need to take a look at yourself. Nobody gets in fights about that, unless there's more to the story.

There is a lot more to being liberal or conservative than what you drive or whether or not you shop at wheatsville.

 

[PT2MD]

I've got to say I also find it seriously amusing how you Texas folks get actually irritated if people admit they didn't like living there. Sad to say, but I've gotten in fights before because people got mad at me for saying I didn't like living in Austin. Why care if other people don't like your city as much as you do?

We don't mind if you don't like it...by all means stay put. I do find it hilarious when folks complain about the weather. Regardless if you are a conservative or liberal, most people in Texas (read real men) stop whining about weather conditions after their testicles descend. Did you really get into a fight about Austin? Sounds like you are either very immature or lying. In either case you probably fit right in in your village.

I'm trying to bug out of this thread but ridiculous posts keep pulling me back in.

 

[Concubine]

When I interviewed, I was pretty impressed with their rotation quality. Doing your clinical rotations in a large underseved city with virtually no competition with residents would be pretty sweet.

 

[Mista Suprane]

PCOM has 1) a larger alumni base

has very little effect on academic allopathic spots.

2) a longer history

has very little effect on academic allopathic spots.

3) an established reputation

has very little effect on academic allopathic spots.

4) is in close proximity to large academic hospitals

i'll give you this one, but does proximity of the physical plant really matter for the first two years? what if your family is from philly and you go to LECOM for two years, and just go back home for 3rd and 4th year? you have the same proximity.

5) shares rotations with Jeff, Penn, Drexel, and Temple students...

so do LECOM students, at frankford, lankenau, and einstein in philly with jeff students (30-40 students per LECOM class rotate in philly), and west penn and mercy hospital in pittsburgh with jefferson and temple students (50-60 students per LECOM class rotate in pittsburgh).

and how does this help you land an academic allo spot? you failed to explain that.

Again, LECOM is a fine school, but it's no PCOM, IMO.

agreed, but it does not provide you an advantage for top allo spots. which is the only thing i am saying. go compare the matchlists from '07.

oh, and also agreed on pure location. i lived in philly for two years, and erie for two years. i love philly. erie sucks.

to summarize to those reading: PCOM is probably the best DO school. LECOM is not. but if your dream is to go to an academic university program, PCOM will provide you no advantage over LECOM.

 

[PT2MD]

I'll give you three guesses where Mista Supreme went to medical school, but you're only going to need one.

 

[Kuba]

I'll give you three guesses where Mista Supreme went to medical school, but you're only going to need one.

lol. Nova is best, hands down. Duh!

 

[osli]

So the criteria is size, alumni base, age, prestige, and university affiliation?

Hmm...

Size... KCUMB... check. Depends on your criteria for measuring "size" I guess, but the classes are some of the largest and every single thing on campus and affiliated with the school is there for the education of those students, nothing else.

Alumni base... KCUMB... check. Large classes over many decades means thousands of practicing alumni. 7000+ graduates.

Age... KCUMB... check. 90+ years old.

Prestige... KCUMB... check. The school went through a not so prestigious period in the 80's after it's primary affiliated hospital was closed, but in the past 20 years it has made enormous strides and in the last decade has become one of the most respected of all DO schools.

University affiliation... KCUMB... nope. I guess here is where I would disagree with the criteria (though all seem very arbitrary). Here's what I noticed when interviewing at large university and/or teaching hospital affiliated schools, both DO and MD: administration and faculty were there for three reasons... (1) patients (medicine is still a business), (2) research (for the vast majority of faculty I encountered, teaching a class here or there seemed like more of an irritating requirement than a joy), and a distant (3) for the students. I like the idea that every building, every faculty member, every administrator and staff person is there for the students. The only mission the school has is educating students, and they do that exceptionally well. I think that fact surfaces in the great board pass rates despite entering MCAT averages (and I think that is telling), as well as the superb clinical training that students begin receiving from day 1 - like taking histories from patient actors and interacting with a suite of human patient simulators from the very first weeks on campus.

What about hospital affiliations for rotations? Check. From learning alongside other DO and MD students at several large teaching universities to a variety of rural settings, students have a choice of environments in dozens of states.

Research? Yep. One of the leaders as far as DO schools go. Few offer the opportunity to get involved in faculty research projects, let alone have summer research fellowship opportunities. But a big distinction between KCUMB and research heave MD universities is that the faculty are hear to teach students, and do research as a supplment, vs being primarily researchers who are forced to teach a class.

The point? I guess that all these criteria seem quite arbitrary, and in the grand scheme of things probably don't mean much at all. You could pick what you want and make a case for many schools. I do think there are probably several DO schools that are lacking in the connections and/or education areas, but aside from those the rest can probably be ranked in many different orders depending on the priorities of the student. If you are a good student at any of those, the name probably won't be holding you back from doing whatever it is you want.

 

[Meatwad]

Location? KCUMB < PCOM, at least to people used to living on the east coast. I don't think I'd want to live in the Midwest, the change of pace would be too much to deal with.

 

[spicedmanna]

Location? KCUMB < PCOM, at least to people used to living on the east coast. I don't think I'd want to live in the Midwest, the change of pace would be too much to deal with.

The "Midwest" isn't all corn fields and cows, you know.

KCMO is a fairly good-sized city and there is plenty of stuff to do there. Rumor has it that we have more fountains than just about anywhere in the world, except Rome. Personally, I think KCMO has a wonderful cityscape. Anyway, I practically grew up in the East Coast and near large cities, and I had absolutely NO problems adjusting to my new home in NKC. I really don't notice any significant pace difference.

 

[Ilikescience]

[Trying to pull the thread out of a nosedive]

Lot's of nice places to live out there gang...let's play nice. Hard for me to characterize certain areas as lazy, stupid, or otherwise. Hell I have a few folks in my own family meeting that description.

As for my beloved Houston being a "damp hell". Well that's just, like, your opinion man. It's my damp hell and I love it regardless.

The Dude speaks. Thanks Lebowski.

 

[TexasTriathlete]

You're killing your father, Larry.

 

[sexyman]

this is what happens when you *&^% a stranger in the #$%!!!

 

[sexyman]

Seriously though guys were all Americans where is the love? Even in jersey we argue about how people from south jersey suck compared to north or vice versa. Let us focus on the things we have in common.

Wow that was cheesy, sorry for that.

 

[MaximusD]

I'll admit I have a cursory understanding of the how large academic universities view pcom vs lecom on the whole...

but philly, which has some very large allopathic institutions might possibly show preference for a pcom grad... the head of a competitive specialty at a local academic center told me to apply to PCOM when I was scouting schools...

honestly, in the end it isn't the major factor or even close to the major factor.

Here's what I've learned matters for residencies..

1. Who you know.
2. Clinical evals
3. USMLE/COMLEX scores
4. Preclinical grades
5. etc
6. etc
7. school you attended, but if it leads to 1, then it might make a big difference...

 

[Doctor Bagel]

We don't mind if you don't like it...by all means stay put. I do find it hilarious when folks complain about the weather. Regardless if you are a conservative or liberal, most people in Texas (read real men) stop whining about weather conditions after their testicles descend. Did you really get into a fight about Austin? Sounds like you are either very immature or lying. In either case you probably fit right in in your village.

I'm trying to bug out of this thread but ridiculous posts keep pulling me back in.

No, not real fights, more like online fights and minor arguments with people who refuse to acknowledge that Austin isn't the bestest place ever for everyone. I can say that you and your Texas buddy have come back with exactly the statements I'd predict you'd make. So enjoy Austin, Dallas or wherever. Again, glad I'm not there and glad I'll never have to be there again. Hey, we're having something beautiful here called fall.

And I don't have testicles. Sorry -- I guess that's why I didn't like the heat.

 

[MossPoh]

How is this thread still going? Well, depending on what you considered "going" I suppose.

 

[Meatwad]

The "Midwest" isn't all corn fields and cows, you know.

KCMO is a fairly good-sized city and there is plenty of stuff to do there. Rumor has it that we have more fountains than just about anywhere in the world, except Rome. Personally, I think KCMO has a wonderful cityscape. Anyway, I practically grew up in the East Coast and near large cities, and I had absolutely NO problems adjusting to my new home in NKC. I really don't notice any significant pace difference.

Well, I definitely wouldn't NOT apply to a great school like KCUMB or DMU just because of location; I could make up my mind after actually visiting the school. It's good to hear a guy from the east coast could adjust quickly to a very different part of America... there may be hope for someone like me to get out of their comfort zone after all!

Just curious, what do you think about the crime situation there? I believe KCMO was 6th in murder rates, and 4th in overall violent crime a year ago. I was shocked, I guess I did have the stereotype of the friendly farmer with a blade of grass hanging out of his mouth when I thought of the Midwest. Apparently I was dead wrong (no semi-pun intended). Once again, this wouldn't dissuade me from attending a school (hell, I'd go to Detroit, Baltimore, DC, Newark, etc.) but I suppose it should be somewhat of a factor in one's decision. I guess there's a lot of experience you could get in KCMO as far as trauma and emergencies go?

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Just curious, what do you think about the crime situation there? I believe KCMO was 6th in murder rates, and 4th in overall violent crime a year ago. I was shocked, I guess I did have the stereotype of the friendly farmer with a blade of grass hanging out of his mouth when I thought of the Midwest. Apparently I was dead wrong (no semi-pun intended). Once again, this wouldn't dissuade me from attending a school (hell, I'd go to Detroit, Baltimore, DC, Newark, etc.) but I suppose it should be somewhat of a factor in one's decision. I guess there's a lot of experience you could get in KCMO as far as trauma and emergencies go?

Lol, Kansas City has both a SWAT show and a 48 hours show where they do murder investigations, so yeah I guess crime's there. St. Louis beats it out, though -- I believe they had the top crime rate in the US recently. I've spent time in both cities and have had relatives who've lived there and never felt like they were in danger. Honestly it just depends on where you live and where you go. There was a lot of talk here about how the bad the area around KCUMB was way back when I applied, but it didn't strike me as particularly horrible when I interviewed. If you're worried, though, you can always just live somewhere else. My school is in about the most dangerous part of town, but the campus is always safe -- I have no doubt that KCUMB is the same.

And yeah, Kansas City's got nothing on places like Newark or Detroit.

 

[Meatwad]

And yeah, Kansas City's got nothing on places like Newark or Detroit.

True that. I think the crime rate adds some... flavor to the area. Where I live (NY) we have more crime as far as sheer numbers go, but KC and St Louis, like you mentioned, are far worse per capita to my knowledge. I bet going to dental school out there would give you a lot of practice; meth is big out there, right?

 

[spicedmanna]

Lol, Kansas City has both a SWAT show and a 48 hours show where they do murder investigations, so yeah I guess crime's there. St. Louis beats it out, though -- I believe they had the top crime rate in the US recently.

Yeah, I've heard some things along that line.

I've spent time in both cities and have had relatives who've lived there and never felt like they were in danger. Honestly it just depends on where you live and where you go. There was a lot of talk here about how the bad the area around KCUMB was way back when I applied, but it didn't strike me as particularly horrible when I interviewed. If you're worried, though, you can always just live somewhere else.

Exactly. The area around the school is a bit questionable, but it doesn't at all compare to, say, the Baltimore inner city. The CT, where a large percentage of students choose to live is about a block or two away from KCUMB. The apartment complex itself is pretty safe. Just don't go walking around alone at night, etc., although, I highly doubt it's that dangerous. The area probably looks worse than it is. I've never heard of any issue with students.

I live north of the city and my area is extremely safe; there is a very good police to resident ratio...it's almost excessive. There's really no crime where I live. I'm only 5 minutes from the school, too. It's a beautiful community; there are many similar communities in the vicinity of the KCMO area. Some folks opt to live in Overland Park, KS, too, but that's a bit far for my taste. Anyway, the point is that you are in class from 8-5 most days and then you go home. You are pretty safe.

I think a lot of times it's a question of reference point. If you've lived in smaller, perhaps less urban areas in the past, you may think one thing, but if you've lived in really urban areas with lots of crime, then you may think another thing. I personally don't think the area surrounding KCUMB is that bad at all. Again, it just looks rough around the edges.

My school is in about the most dangerous part of town, but the campus is always safe -- I have no doubt that KCUMB is the same.

And yeah, Kansas City's got nothing on places like Newark or Detroit.

Yup, the campus is perfectly safe.

 

[PT2MD]

And I don't have testicles. Sorry -- I guess that's why I didn't like the heat.

...must be.

 

[Beau Geste]

St. Louis may be a murder haven, but, and this goes for all cities - your odds on staying safe are pretty good if you aren't stupid.

By stupid, I mean living in a high-crime area, parking/walking down on dimly-lit alleys, etc.

And, this thread just goes to strengthen the fact that DOs rock in all parts of the country.

BTW - Austin sucks. Sorry.

 

[PT2MD]

BTW - Austin sucks. Sorry.

Impressive analysis.

 

[Meatwad]

Impressive analysis.

I agree that Austin sucks. Now that two people have agreed upon it, doesn't that make the assertion much more credible?

 

[PT2MD]

I agree that Austin sucks. Now that two people have agreed upon it, doesn't that make the assertion much more credible?

Your right. Now if we can get the other 750,000 to see it our way.

 

[Beau Geste]

Your right. Now if we can get the other 750,000 to see it our way.

It's you're.

 

[Beau Geste]

Impressive analysis.

Thanks! I thought so

 

[PT2MD]

It's you're.

You've won THIS round Saluki. This argument is a little childish however. Kinda like comparing verbal and written scores on the MCAT.

 

[Beau Geste]

You've won THIS round Saluki. This argument is a little childish however. Kinda like comparing verbal and written scores on the MCAT.

OMG! My ears are bleeding! You said the M-word!!!!!

*runs away screaming*

 

[DOEYEGUY]

Derm is PGY-2 and beyond. Nova only lists internship locations in their match lists.

I graduated with the NSUCOM class of 2006 and I know of at least 3 people from my class in dermatology residencies right now. I've been trying to get NSU to update how they do their match list for a while now.

 

[Meatwad]

I graduated with the NSUCOM class of 2006 and I know of at least 3 people from my class in dermatology residencies right now. I've been trying to get NSU to update how they do their match list for a while now.

Awesome job on getting ophtho, by the way.

 

[AwesomO]

If I was applying again the two things I would of look at would be 1) Cost and 2) clinical rotations.

Tuition at most DO schools is horrendous. Go where it's the cheapest or where they will give you the most financial aid (in terms of scholarships not loans).

Clinical rotations, some DO schools have the most absurd rotation sites. If you have inferior rotations you are going to be behind when it comes time to doing Sub Is in your 4th year. Thats not too mention the start of intern year.

I wouldn't put any weight on the first two years. I spent most of that time skipping class and reading on my own. As far as board prep, I wound up paying for Kaplan anyway. That and listening to Goljan was enough to do well on boards.

Prestige? Forget about it. Any residency that is looking for prestige is going to group all osteopathic schools together. I guess the one caveat would be a school like Penn may be more familiar with a school they are familiar with like PCOM. However when applying to med school most people have no idea what they want to do for residency much less where they want to do it. I guess if you are permanently tied down to a certain city then it would be wise to pick a school in that city as you are more likely to match there.