Biden Out of Race

[UscGhost]

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I think it’s sad that so many people who are so incredibly lucky to live in the greatest country on Earth, have the audacity to hate it so much.

Everyone is very lucky to be here. Doesn't mean we are blind to the problems here.

Surprising that some are so quick to give in to blind allegiance

 

[nimbus]

The Pax Americana has been far from perfect, with some terrible decisions made. But imagine a world where China, Russia, Iran, etc are the superpowers. I think the world will be longing for what was lost.

Those are some big countries. They make up a significant proportion of “the world”.

 

[DocMcCoy]

That’s called free speech. The first amendment

I support the right to say all kinds of stupid things. Doesn’t make it any less sad.

Everyone is very lucky to be here. Doesn't mean we are blind to the problems here.

Surprising that some are so quick to give in to blind allegiance

If you look at the geopolitical landscape, and your first thought is the US is the problem, then you don’t understand what it is to be an American or you don’t want to be an American. You want the country to fundamentally be un-American.

 

[nimbus]

I support the right to say all kinds of stupid things. Doesn’t make it any less sad.




If you look at the geopolitical landscape, and your first thought is the US is the problem, then you don’t understand what it is to be an American or you don’t want to be an American. You want the country to fundamentally be un-American.

People have different ideas about what it means to be American. That’s what makes us great!!

 

[UscGhost]

I support the right to say all kinds of stupid things. Doesn’t make it any less sad.




If you look at the geopolitical landscape, and your first thought is the US is the problem, then you don’t understand what it is to be an American or you don’t want to be an American. You want the country to fundamentally be un-American.

I am not interested in solving the economic, social, political, or any of the problems that exist in other countries. US meddling in other countries tends to backfire.

We have plenty of problems that need fixing here. Unless you presume to argue that our systems of healthcare, budget, political, education are working flawlessly? If so, you are blind

 

[Splenda88]

I am not interested in solving the economic, social, political, or any of the problems that exist in other countries. US meddling in other countries tends to backfire.

We have plenty of problems that need fixing here. Unless you presume to argue that our systems of healthcare, budget, political, education are working flawlessly? If so, you are blind

Why are you taking like MAGA?

 

[nimbus]

 

[Southpaw]

I support the right to say all kinds of stupid things. Doesn’t make it any less sad.




If you look at the geopolitical landscape, and your first thought is the US is the problem, then you don’t understand what it is to be an American or you don’t want to be an American. You want the country to fundamentally be un-American.

If we attack another nation I want American success and I want the value of human life to be preserved by all sides.

I could state, alternatively, that Trump should involve Congress, or explain the reasoning on why Gabbards intel (American intel…) was wrong, or ask what has changed in Iran over the past few months.

Instead we got some Truth Social posts with a litany of thoughts that are often all over the place.

If anyone, ANYONE, has put American military lives in danger in the preceding months it’s been Pete Hegseth. And his job seems secure. Why, beyond the simple fact that Trump likes him, escapes me.

 

[Lab Lover]

It’s widely acknowledged that we have supported terrorism and terrorists when we think it will suit our needs. Nicaraguan Contras, mujahideen Islamists in Afghanistan, you name it. We call them freedom fighters until we or they switch alliances. Terrorism is a relative term.

1953 Iranian coup d'état - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/the%20central%20intelligence%20%5B15369853%5D.pdf

Yup. War is the continuation of Politics by other means. Terrorism is the continuation of War by other means.

 

[Lab Lover]

People have different ideas about what it means to be American. That’s what makes us great!!

New York Times: Study shows the downsides of diversity​

The downside of diversity - The New York Times

Automatically translated by DeepL:

It is becoming increasingly popular to speak of ethnic diversity as a societal strength. From multicultural festivals to pronouncements by political leaders, the message is the same: Our differences make us stronger.

However, a large new study based on detailed surveys of nearly 30,000 people across America comes to exactly the opposite conclusion. Harvard political scientist Robert Putnam – famous for “Bowling Alone,” his 2000 book on the decline of civic engagement – has found that the greater the diversity in a community, the fewer people vote and the less they volunteer, donate to charity, and work on community projects. In the most diverse communities, neighbors trust each other only half as much as in the most homogeneous environments. The study, the largest ever conducted on civic engagement in America, found that virtually all indicators of civic health are lower in more diverse environments. “The magnitude of the effect is shocking,” says Scott Page, a political scientist at the University of Michigan.

“It would be regrettable if politically correct progressivism were to deny the reality of the challenge to social solidarity posed by diversity,” Putnam writes in the new report. "Equally regrettable would be if an ahistorical and ethnocentric conservatism were to deny that meeting this challenge is both feasible and desirable."

Putnam argues that there has been a significant decline in the US in “social capital,” a term he helped coin. Social capital refers to the social networks – be they friendships, religious communities, or neighborhood associations – that he believes are key indicators of citizens’ well-being. When social capital is high, Putnam says, communities are more livable places. Neighborhoods are safer, people are healthier, and more citizens vote.

The results of his new study come from a survey Putnam conducted among residents in 41 US communities, including Boston. Residents were categorized into the four main categories used by the US Census: Black, White, Hispanic, and Asian. They were asked how much they trusted their neighbors and members of each racial category, and they were asked about a long list of civic attitudes and practices, including their views on local government, their participation in community projects, and their friendships. In the more diverse communities, a bleak picture of civic desolation emerged, affecting everything from political engagement to the state of social bonds.

“People said, ‘I bet you forgot Factor X,’” Putnam says of the array of suggestions from colleagues to explain the differences. “There were 20 or 30 Xs.”

But even after statistically accounting for all of them, the correlation remained: Higher diversity meant lower social capital. In his findings, Putnam writes that people in more diverse communities tend to “distrust their neighbors, regardless of skin color, even withdraw from close friends, expect the worst from their community and its leaders, volunteer less, donate less to charity, and participate less in community projects, register less as voters, agitate more for social reforms, but believe less that they can actually make a difference, and gather unhappily in front of the television.”

“People living in ethnically diverse environments seem to ‘hunker down’ – that is, they withdraw like a turtle,” Putnam writes. And perhaps the most surprising result is that trust is lower not only between groups in a more diverse environment, but even between members of the same group.

Upvote8Downvote17Go to comments

 

[nimbus]

New York Times: Study shows the downsides of diversity​

The downside of diversity - The New York Times

Automatically translated by DeepL:

It is becoming increasingly popular to speak of ethnic diversity as a societal strength. From multicultural festivals to pronouncements by political leaders, the message is the same: Our differences make us stronger.

However, a large new study based on detailed surveys of nearly 30,000 people across America comes to exactly the opposite conclusion. Harvard political scientist Robert Putnam – famous for “Bowling Alone,” his 2000 book on the decline of civic engagement – has found that the greater the diversity in a community, the fewer people vote and the less they volunteer, donate to charity, and work on community projects. In the most diverse communities, neighbors trust each other only half as much as in the most homogeneous environments. The study, the largest ever conducted on civic engagement in America, found that virtually all indicators of civic health are lower in more diverse environments. “The magnitude of the effect is shocking,” says Scott Page, a political scientist at the University of Michigan.

“It would be regrettable if politically correct progressivism were to deny the reality of the challenge to social solidarity posed by diversity,” Putnam writes in the new report. "Equally regrettable would be if an ahistorical and ethnocentric conservatism were to deny that meeting this challenge is both feasible and desirable."

Putnam argues that there has been a significant decline in the US in “social capital,” a term he helped coin. Social capital refers to the social networks – be they friendships, religious communities, or neighborhood associations – that he believes are key indicators of citizens’ well-being. When social capital is high, Putnam says, communities are more livable places. Neighborhoods are safer, people are healthier, and more citizens vote.

The results of his new study come from a survey Putnam conducted among residents in 41 US communities, including Boston. Residents were categorized into the four main categories used by the US Census: Black, White, Hispanic, and Asian. They were asked how much they trusted their neighbors and members of each racial category, and they were asked about a long list of civic attitudes and practices, including their views on local government, their participation in community projects, and their friendships. In the more diverse communities, a bleak picture of civic desolation emerged, affecting everything from political engagement to the state of social bonds.

“People said, ‘I bet you forgot Factor X,’” Putnam says of the array of suggestions from colleagues to explain the differences. “There were 20 or 30 Xs.”

But even after statistically accounting for all of them, the correlation remained: Higher diversity meant lower social capital. In his findings, Putnam writes that people in more diverse communities tend to “distrust their neighbors, regardless of skin color, even withdraw from close friends, expect the worst from their community and its leaders, volunteer less, donate less to charity, and participate less in community projects, register less as voters, agitate more for social reforms, but believe less that they can actually make a difference, and gather unhappily in front of the television.”

“People living in ethnically diverse environments seem to ‘hunker down’ – that is, they withdraw like a turtle,” Putnam writes. And perhaps the most surprising result is that trust is lower not only between groups in a more diverse environment, but even between members of the same group.

Upvote8Downvote17Go to comments

So which race do you prefer?

 

[nimbus]

If we attack another nation I want American success and I want the value of human life to be preserved by all sides.

I could state, alternatively, that Trump should involve Congress, or explain the reasoning on why Gabbards intel (American intel…) was wrong, or ask what has changed in Iran over the past few months.

Instead we got some Truth Social posts with a litany of thoughts that are often all over the place.

If anyone, ANYONE, has put American military lives in danger in the preceding months it’s been Pete Hegseth. And his job seems secure. Why, beyond the simple fact that Trump likes him, escapes me.

Hegseth is a tall handsome white guy and he passes the loyalty to Trump test. That’s why Trump likes him.

 

[Lab Lover]

So which race do you prefer?

Agnostic. I do believe that people are inherently tribal. Racism is a problem in this country. But also throughout the world. Despite all the self flagellation we do over our biases, this is country is more tolerant and less racist than much of the world.

 

[nimbus]

Despite all the self flagellation we do over our biases, this is country is more tolerant and less racist than much of the world.

Are you arguing that this is good or bad?

 

[pgg]

The Pax Americana has been far from perfect, with some terrible decisions made. But imagine a world where China, Russia, Iran, etc are the superpowers. I think the world will be longing for what was lost.

Al the more reason that Trumpian isolationism, his antagonism of our allies, and his denigrarion of NATO is so appalling.

 

[pgg]

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/06/24/us/politics/iran-nuclear-sites.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

A preliminary classified U.S. report says the American bombing of Iran’s nuclear sites sealed off the entrances to two of the facilities but did not collapse their underground buildings, according to officials familiar with the findings.

The early findings conclude that the strikes over the weekend set back Iran’s nuclear program by only a few months, the officials said.




Glad we risked an actual war for that result.

But Trump said they were set back DECADES.

I don't think he's even lying intentionally. He just says whatever bombastic **** pops into his head and sounds good in the moment.

I wish he was actually lying. That would imply he knows (and cares) what the truth is, and is actively trying to conceal it. Presumably for some reason, even if that reason is nefarious.

 

[PainInTheAnes]

Al the more reason that Trumpian isolationism, his antagonism of our allies, and his denigrarion of NATO is so appalling.

I don’t know where the idea that Russia can be a world power comes from. That country is really poor overall, can barely take over parts of an even poorer country with only a little backing from the rest of the world.

Like who are the Russians who are capable of running the rest of the world’s financial system and corporations? The biggest companies in the world all reside in the USA, that’s never gonna change and that’s where real power comes from aside from nuclear weapons.

 

[MirrorTodd]

I don’t know what it is, but something tells me the operation wasn’t nearly the RESOUNDING succcess that he initially said it was…I just can’t put my finger on it.

 

[pgg]

It’s probably a little early to trust the first leaked report because you so badly want the I told you so moment.

Agreed. There was likely significant damage to the facilities. It's hard to believe that heavy, delicate, numerous pieces of equipment were moved in the days prior to the bombing.

The actual effects of the large bunker buster bombs, we don't know. There's surely some classified info. Maybe multiple successive hits within a few meters of each other dramatically improve the effect.

Effective or not though, it's still perfectly valid to question and criticise the decision to drop them in the first place.

We appear to have a tenuous ceasefire going, that alone was arguably worth the risk. I don’t understand rooting for any of this to be a failure.

We have a tenuous ceasefire to a unnecessary conflict that our ally needlessly escalated a couple weeks ago?

That's the bar for success in Trump's administration?

 

[Lab Lover]

Are you arguing that this is good or bad?

I am arguing that it is a fact. I am arguing that cultures and governments recognize this fact and create positive incentives for good behavior and negative incentives for bad behavior. Good behavior defined as citizenship, tolerance, hard work, etc. Negative incentives for bad behavior defined as the opposite of the preceding plus things like substance abuse, out of wedlock births, etc. I am arguing that cultures and governments that are more successful are better. Yes I do mean better.

 

[cchoukal]

I don’t know where the idea that Russia can be a world power comes from. That country is really poor overall, can barely take over parts of an even poorer country with only a little backing from the rest of the world.

Like who are the Russians who are capable of running the rest of the world’s financial system and corporations? The biggest companies in the world all reside in the USA, that’s never gonna change and that’s where real power comes from aside from nuclear weapons.

I get that point, but I guess I'm not so sure that once the US becomes less predictable, less organized, less governed by predictable norms, if it will be such a chip-shock that companies would locate here, or be as quick to do business here.

 

[DocMcCoy]

We have a tenuous ceasefire to a unnecessary conflict that our ally needlessly escalated a couple weeks ago?

That's the bar for success in Trump's administration?

Ya it’s a low bar no argument there. By no means does it suggest the sweeping success of the current administration. At the same time it would appear to have been the right move at the time, or at least a sound move. How high does the bar have to be to be able to say at least he didn’t monumentally screw this one up? I just don’t understand the partisan entrenchment and willingness to die to the last man to prevent the loss of an inch of ground. At this rate we can have a 100 year ceasefire, a century of peace and no nuclear advancement in Iran, but one minute after the left would still blame this administration

 

[DocMcCoy]

So which race do you prefer?

Human.

 

[Lab Lover]

Human.

The problem is that many peoples think of other races, ethnic groups, religions as less than human. It is how people can do the terrible things to each other that has been done throughout history.

 

[DocMcCoy]

The problem is that many peoples think of other races, ethnic groups, religions as less than human. It is how people can do the terrible things to each other that has been done throughout history.

We are all made from the same dying stars. The fact that we haven’t yet evolved past our ignorant tribalism is why this planet is still a meat grinder. It’s why the far left policies which are shoehorned into the center by the party’s leadership are nothing but romanticized, head in the clouds, pipe dreams. And it’s why the rest of us have to be grounded in realism for the next 1000 lifetimes or so.

 

[Southpaw]

At the same time it would appear to have been the right move at the time, or at least a sound move.

Why do you say this ?

 

[DocMcCoy]

Why do you say this ?

It expedited an Israeli ceasefire with no apparent military/economic loss, in a move no other military in the world could accomplish.

Other paths could have led to Israel still dropping bombs or further military/economic escalation.

That’s how I see it? Sincerely, what am I missing?

 

[chessknt]

I am arguing that it is a fact. I am arguing that cultures and governments recognize this fact and create positive incentives for good behavior and negative incentives for bad behavior. Good behavior defined as citizenship, tolerance, hard work, etc. Negative incentives for bad behavior defined as the opposite of the preceding plus things like substance abuse, out of wedlock births, etc. I am arguing that cultures and governments that are more successful are better. Yes I do mean better.

What is the negative incentive for out of wedlock birth and how is that remotely relevant to racism?

 

[passiveobserver1979]

The flip side to that is Israel would never agree to a cease fire if they did not believe their short term objectives were met. So I guess we will wait and see. I know the left is dying to find any scrap of evidence to downplay the successful campaign, but little early to say what the long term ramifications are.

Israel didn’t attack Iran because they thought Iran was imminently going to have a nuke. They did it because Netanyahu wanted attention focused off his corruption trial. But he bit of more than he could chew. Iran wasn’t short of missiles and they penetrated the Iron Dome like no one has done before. If the war continued for a few more days Tel Aviv would have started looking like Gaza. That would hurt Netanyahu’s electoral chances and therefore he got Trump to get him a quick exit.

 

[DocMcCoy]

Israel didn’t attack Iran because they thought Iran was imminently going to have a nuke. They did it because Netanyahu wanted attention focused off his corruption trial. But he bit of more than he could chew. Iran wasn’t short of missiles and they penetrated the Iron Dome like no one has done before. If the war continued for a few more days Tel Aviv would have started looking like Gaza. That would hurt Netanyahu’s electoral chances and therefore he got Trump to get him a quick exit.

Man you really took a deep dive down the rabbit hole on this one.

The iron dome was reported as 65-90 percent effective while Iran burned through reportedly 2/3 of its missile stock pile, the Iranian drones didn’t even cross the border. Casualty rate was like 10:1 with very few Israeli military assets compromised. The IDF were conducting looney toon style assassinations and killing military leadership and nuclear scientists by the dozens while Iran was haphazardly and ineffectually lobbing missiles at civilian targets.

 

[PainInTheAnes]

Man you really took a deep dive down the rabbit hole on this one.

The iron dome was reported as 65-90 percent effective while Iran burned through reportedly 2/3 of its missile stock pile, the Iranian drones didn’t even cross the border. Casualty rate was like 10:1 with very few Israeli military assets compromised. The IDF were conducting looney toon style assassinations and killing military leadership and nuclear scientists by the dozens while Iran was haphazardly and ineffectually lobbing missiles at civilian targets.

You can almost hear the joy in the post where this person says “Tel Aviv would look like Gaza”.

That sort of mask off moment for the last 2 years was what made me vote for Trump lol

 

[aneftp]

What is the negative incentive for out of wedlock birth and how is that remotely relevant to racism?

Divorce lawyers can’t touch out of wedlock birth. It’s too complicated for them to make money because divorce laws tie marriage and child support together and lawyers can rack up 500k in billable hours if the couple is married with children

So it’s a negative incentive for divorce lawyers. They want you to be married and than divorce with kids.

It makes it’s harder for lawyers and the govt to tie divorce and child support together.

 

[linkin06]

Man you really took a deep dive down the rabbit hole on this one.

The iron dome was reported as 65-90 percent effective while Iran burned through reportedly 2/3 of its missile stock pile, the Iranian drones didn’t even cross the border. Casualty rate was like 10:1 with very few Israeli military assets compromised. The IDF were conducting looney toon style assassinations and killing military leadership and nuclear scientists by the dozens while Iran was haphazardly and ineffectually lobbing missiles at civilian targets.

So then what was the imminent threat then? Why did we have diplomatic meetings set at Doha before Netanyahu launched his war? War should be a last resort

 

[DocMcCoy]

So then what was the imminent threat then? Why did we have diplomatic meetings set at Doha before Netanyahu launched his war? War should be a last resort

Israel is already at war! they have been wanting to attack Iran over “imminent” nuclear ambitions for YEARS. They also seem to hold Iran partly accountable for October 7th. They’ve also skirmished as recently as last year. Anyone standing back and wondering how this could have happened has been living in a cave for the past several years.

That is by no means to say it is justified, it’s just facts. I’ll even throw you a bone and say MAYBE there was some political motivation to take eyes off Gaza and bring some support back for the war. The fact is, it happened and there were no headwinds to stop it from happening. It is apparently over or at least is cooling down. If the US didn’t get involved you think we would have a cease fire right now? I wonder how this would have played out under a Kamala or Biden administration, and then I realize how glad I am they aren’t in charge.

 

[zizzer]

Iran is about the only thing I think Trump has handled fine. Everything else, including the Russia-Ukraine war, has been a disaster.

It's interesting how democrats were tougher on Russia but not on Iran. Republicans were originally tough on Russia until they became cartoonish sycophants to Donald Trump.

 

[We'llBeDoneIn15Minutes]

Israel didn’t attack Iran because they thought Iran was imminently going to have a nuke. They did it because Netanyahu wanted attention focused off his corruption trial. But he bit of more than he could chew. Iran wasn’t short of missiles and they penetrated the Iron Dome like no one has done before. If the war continued for a few more days Tel Aviv would have started looking like Gaza. That would hurt Netanyahu’s electoral chances and therefore he got Trump to get him a quick exit.

Man that is one wild conspiracy theory with all kinds of crazy assumptions 🤣

 

[We'llBeDoneIn15Minutes]

I wonder how this would have played out under a Kamala or Biden administration, and then I realize how glad I am they aren’t in charge.

God help us all is my only thought to that hypothetical situation.

 

[We'llBeDoneIn15Minutes]

Iran is about the only thing I think Trump has handled fine.

You have to throw in sealing the border. We literally are coming off an administration that for 4 years said they can't possibly do a thing to make the border more secure, and Trump locked it shut basically overnight. Impressive. Period.

Iran and the border are big wins. The Big Beautiful Bury the Country Bill and the debt are pretty much tied together and get an F. It's a left wing spenders dream bill.

Tariffs and the associated Trade War get an incomplete. If tariffs are used to negotiate better trade deals that's fine, but Trumpers also say permanent tariffs help raise government money to replace taxes and that gets an F. Tariffs negatively affect competitive free markets that we all benefit from, income taxes don't.

 

[Southpaw]

It expedited an Israeli ceasefire with no apparent military/economic loss, in a move no other military in the world could accomplish.

Other paths could have led to Israel still dropping bombs or further military/economic escalation.

That’s how I see it? Sincerely, what am I missing?

Agree w you but I’m not sure if our goal was to attack Iran so that Israel would agree to a ceasefire. Is America better off or safer bc we bombed Iran? Maybe I’m missing it but I don’t see it.

 

[Southpaw]

You can almost hear the joy in the post where this person says “Tel Aviv would look like Gaza”.

That sort of mask off moment for the last 2 years was what made me vote for Trump lol

It’s rather sad to me that Gaza looks like Gaza and the world goes ‘meh’. What if Tel Aviv did in fact look like Gaza? WW3, right?

 

[Southpaw]

Israel is already at war! they have been wanting to attack Iran over “imminent” nuclear ambitions for YEARS. They also seem to hold Iran partly accountable for October 7th. They’ve also skirmished as recently as last year. Anyone standing back and wondering how this could have happened has been living in a cave for the past several years.

That is by no means to say it is justified, it’s just facts. I’ll even throw you a bone and say MAYBE there was some political motivation to take eyes off Gaza and bring some support back for the war. The fact is, it happened and there were no headwinds to stop it from happening. It is apparently over or at least is cooling down. If the US didn’t get involved you think we would have a cease fire right now? I wonder how this would have played out under a Kamala or Biden administration, and then I realize how glad I am they aren’t in charge.

Democrats are just as close to Israel as Republicans. They take that AIPAC money just as readily. Not the Bernie or the AOC Dem, but surely the Pelosi/Schumer Dem. Recall Kamala’s underperformance in MI was felt largely bc she wouldn’t distance herself from the Israeli govt or take a strong stance on Gaza.

Maybe Dems don’t bomb Iran? They’d certainly defend Israel just as readily. I really see no difference in Israeli ties/closeness between Dems and Republicans.

 

[PainInTheAnes]

It’s rather sad to me that Gaza looks like Gaza and the world goes ‘meh’. What if Tel Aviv did in fact look like Gaza? WW3, right?

Does the world go “meh?”

I recall this help to lose an election for the democrats 7 months ago because their world didn’t go “meh”.

Also I remember people in most major cities of the world chanting some awful things, but definitely not “meh”

 

[Southpaw]

Does the world go “meh?”

I recall this help to lose an election for the democrats 7 months ago because their world didn’t go “meh”.

Also I remember people in most major cities of the world chanting some awful things, but definitely not “meh”

Is Israel still bombing Gaza? Is their plan currently to occupy Gaza? Have they expanded yet again into the West Bank? Are journalists allowed to cover the atrocities in Gaza? Yes, in the fact the world has let it all pass.

Switch the scenario. Assume the Palestinian authority had an army and a navy and an Air Force. Let’s say they attack Tel Aviv. Would the worlds response be the same as it has been as Israel, the goliath, has absolutely crushed Gaza?

Help to lose an election? What’re you talking about? There’s no difference between Dems and Repubs on Israel.

 

[Southpaw]

Also I remember people in most major cities of the world chanting some awful things, but definitely not “meh”

I don’t know what this means really as rallies or chanting doesn’t mean an end to the war. Also one of Trumps first actions was to kick out Palestinian supporting students.

 

[PainInTheAnes]

Is Israel still bombing Gaza? Is their plan currently to occupy Gaza? Have they expanded yet again into the West Bank? Are journalists allowed to cover the atrocities in Gaza? Yes, in the fact the world has let it all pass.

Switch the scenario. Assume the Palestinian authority had an army and a navy and an Air Force. Let’s say they attack Tel Aviv. Would the worlds response be the same as it has been as Israel, the goliath, has absolutely crushed Gaza?

Help to lose an election? What’re you talking about? There’s no difference between Dems and Repubs on Israel.

If you’re talking about sovereign entities doing something then that’s different.

I’m referring to the protest movements. Those have a lot of impact on policy in their respective countries, including in the USA where people actually justified not voting for Joe Biden on the basis of the response to this situation.

That feels like individual people doing their best to change the situation and not shrugging it off.

I also think many countries, albeit the most autocratic and regressive ones, are very upset in the UN and passing all sorts of condemnations against Israel. They’re impotent to do anything but they didn’t shrug it off.

 

[Southpaw]

If you’re talking about sovereign entities doing something then that’s different.

I’m referring to the protest movements. Those have a lot of impact on policy in their respective countries, including in the USA where people actually justified not voting for Joe Biden on the basis of the response to this situation.

That feels like individual people doing their best to change the situation and not shrugging it off.

I also think many countries, albeit the most autocratic and regressive ones, are very upset in the UN and passing all sorts of condemnations against Israel. They’re impotent to do anything but they didn’t shrug it off.

let me know when the UN gets an army or the power to do anything other than put words on paper. Israel has illegally occupied the West Bank since 1967. Has the UN or anyone actually done anything? You think Netanyahu cares what the UN says? Doesn’t seem to.

No, I don’t think the protests have made any difference whatsoever. Certainly people should protest and put forth a voice, and Trump clearly doesn’t want a pro Palestinian voice on American streets, but I can’t see that it’s done anything for Gazans or to stop Netanyahu from dropping bombs on a building full of women and kids bc his intel said there had been a Hamas terrorist there sometime recently.

Again I see no difference on Dem/Repub policy or goals with regard to Israel. They all take the AIPAC money. It was felt Harris underperformed in MI bc she didn’t take a strong enough pro-Palestinian stance.

 

[DocMcCoy]

You have to throw in sealing the border. We literally are coming off an administration that for 4 years said they can't possibly do a thing to make the border more secure, and Trump locked it shut basically overnight. Impressive. Period.

Iran and the border are big wins. The Big Beautiful Bury the Country Bill and the debt are pretty much tied together and get an F. It's a left wing spenders dream bill.

Tariffs and the associated Trade War get an incomplete. If tariffs are used to negotiate better trade deals that's fine, but Trumpers also say permanent tariffs help raise government money to replace taxes and that's gets an F. Tariffs negatively affect competitive free markets that we all benefit from, income taxes don't.

💯. The execution of large swaths of the agenda have been pretty bad (doge, tariff roll out) even though the themes are consistent with conservative goals. But there is a predictable counter narrative manufactured with every action the administration takes. They are getting hit from all sides even where it doesn't make sense to hit them.

The minute after we bombed Iran, we started hearing about war without congressional authorization and impeachment. That obviously fell flat as soon as the left remembered recent history. So they pivoted to a failed mission narrative based on a leaked preliminary battle damage assessment that didn’t gel with Trumps use of the word “obliterated”. Just give a nod and move on, or don’t cover it at all. Don’t manufacture a bunch of BS and sell it as news because you hate everything Trump stands for.

It leads to one becoming totally desensitized to any Trump coverage even when there are A LOT of valid criticisms.

 

[passiveobserver1979]

I will go out on a limb and say that Kamala lost the election for not supporting Gaza. If she had taken a stronger line against Netanyahu she would have.
Note recently how Zohran Mamdani beat Cuomo handily by supporting Palestinians .

 

[DocMcCoy]

It’s rather sad to me that Gaza looks like Gaza and the world goes ‘meh’. What if Tel Aviv did in fact look like Gaza? WW3, right?

Switch the scenario. Assume the Palestinian authority had an army and a navy and an Air Force. Let’s say they attack Tel Aviv. Would the worlds response be the same as it has been as Israel, the goliath, has absolutely crushed Gaza?

The problem here is, whether or not it’s right, Israel has a significant amount of political armor due to October 7th.

 

[DocMcCoy]

NATO allies agree to higher 5% defense spending target

U.S. President Donald Trump has been exercising pressure for NATO allies to increase their defense spending across both of his terms in office.

www.cnbc.com