Biden guilty on all counts

[NumTacos]

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It is true. He’s 81 years old with limited mobility and obvious cognitive decline. You want me to be impressed he didn’t f up a meeting? He’s one step (or fall) removed from the graveyard. Trump isn’t far off. But man, trying to make Biden look like the more physically capable choice (lunacy aside) is a losing strategy.

I’m trying to make him look like what he is, an octogenarian who is otherwise pretty healthy, can travel the world, meet with foreign leaders and answer questions from the press extemporaneously. I’m not asking you be impressed, and I get what you are doing here. Just pointing out that the caricature of him painted by folks like yourself just demonstrates that tribal alliances trump (no pun intended!) just being reasonable. It’s crazy that it has to be that way, but that’s where we are.

 

[aneftp]

The cliff comes and it comes quickly for many of these old politicians. Biden is 82 come election in November.

Look at the history of Diane Feinstein. Memory problems public knowledge for the last 3 years of her life. That’s just public knowledge. It was going on for years before it was being discussed in 2020 about her. And she was us senator. She can hide more in that position.

You can’t hide as president. They can prop up Biden as much as they can.

If people are concern about trump how he will act in office. Concerned about future events that may or may not happen.

I think it’s a fair assumption many people who oppose Biden have legitimate concerns how Biden will be able to last in office the next 4 years.

Since everyone is on the speculative path about future events

 

[psycho-matic]

That facts are that you didn’t vote for trump in 2020 and won’t vote for him in 2024.

Those are facts

Facts are blade voted for trump in 2020 and will vote for trump in 2024. Facts.

As for willful retention of classified documents. Trump hasn’t been convicted. He’s been not guilty twice during impeachment.

And Biden gets a free pass on his retention of classified documents because he had “poor memory”. So if trump claims poor memory. Does he get a pass on the same charges??

Full stop. Biden returned the documents when requested, so did Pence. Trump did not, despite multiple requests. There's evidence he was going to sell classified nuclear documents. Unintentional retention of documents vs deliberate, malicious intent.

The prosecutorial finding about Biden's alleged memory issues is not, in my opinion, not the main reason he wasn't charged. It's an additional finding. Biden did break the letter of the law. If he was tried, the charges would be less severe and sentencing lighter than Trump because of the lack of deliberate, malicious intent on the part of Trump.

I don't think a prosecutor would take such a case against Biden. That's just my opinion. I also think of Biden faced charges, so would Pence.

It's true Trump hasn't been convicted. The evidence against him is very incriminating, conviction or not. I feel that anyone who's capable of being honest with themselves would reach a similar conclusion. Trump is now a convicted felon. Biden is not.

Demented or not, Biden's administration is stable. Trump's administration was a circus. Trump did not listen to his advisors, did not listen to his own attorney general.

For the record, I am not saying every policy from the Trump administration was bad, nor do I agree with every single action of Biden's (i.e. our Afghanistan exit). I doubt any person agrees with every policy of any given president. But taken as a whole, I feel Biden's administration and policies have been positive and constructive. Trump sowed chaos, descent, and wepaonized the far right. Biden is a moderate. Trump would be a dictator if he could. How anyone can look at Jan 6 and not reach the conclusion he was at the very least a contributing cause to the insurrection baffles me. Even Mitch McConnell stated that Trump was responsible! If one can reach the conclusion that Trump was at least partially responsible and then vote for him a second time... How can you say you value our democracy? Trump is arguably more a threat to our democracy and world security than any terrorist group. He doesn't value our allies, even stated he might help Russia invade some of them. Now, I acknowledge that some people don't see it that way and have the right to have a different opinion. I won't shame them for it. But I don't have respect for anyone that chooses to support Trump.

People like to criticize Biden for the border problems when the Republican majority House rejected a bipartisan bill at Trump's behest. It's absolutely disgusting. I have no respect for the GOP, save a few select individuals. Biden helped pass the infrastructure bill, a bipartisan effort. He compromised and didn't get everything he wanted. Our economy is booming (some disagree) , but either way people give too much credit to the presidency. He's one man (or woman). He can only do so much. The constitution is set up that way, intentionally. When the economy is doing well, approval rating goes up. When the economy is bad, approval rating goes down. Reality is it's very complex and the executive branch has only a small part in the overall economical picture. Reality is much of the COVID related debt was incurred under Trump. Do I blame him for that? No. Passing the economic stimulus checks into law was the right thing to do. But some people like to forget that inconvenient truth and blame the Biden administration. Really, can someone explain the level of Hate that Biden provokes in some people? I don't get it.

Biden stood up to Russia and China. He has been an arch supporter of Ukraine and would defend Taiwan in an invasion. He has stood by Israel even as he disagrees with how they are managing the war. What has Trump said or done that indicated any regard for our allies? He negotiated lower prices for certain drugs with Medicare. I'll stop, but I think Biden had been overall positive.

Some people on here say Biden is boring or he's not making waves or is not an impressive candidate. Say that both sides have not put forth an impressive candidate. But I ask, what would an impressive candidate look like? The purpose of the presidency is to ensure the continued stability of our democracy, to sign bills into law, to defend our country from enemy threats, to lead on the world stage, etc. Why does a president need to make waives? That's not their job, in my opinion. Trump made waves and the outcome was not good for our country

Lastly, I think it's clear there's a systemic issue with the storage of classified documents. There should be a paper trail for any given document, and a designated individual, independant of the executive branch, that keeps track of them. There should be a record of what's signed out and who signed it out, and vice versa for the document's return. Any document not returned should be flagged. A classified document the president borrows should never leave the Whitehouse, unless there's a valid reason. Any document leaving the Whitehouse should have a trail and the reason it was taken somewhere else documented. It's common sense. That doesn't excuse refusal to return a document, by anyone.

 

[psycho-matic]

Look at the history of Diane Feinstein. Memory problems public knowledge for the last 3 years of her life. That’s just public knowledge. It was going on for years before it was being discussed in 2020 about her. And she was us senator. She can hide more in that position.

I think it’s a fair assumption many people who oppose Biden have legitimate concerns how Biden will be able to last in office the next 4 years.

Since everyone is on the speculative path about future events

Future behavior is best predicted by past behavior, is it not? Even if Trump doesn't do anything major like subvert an election, lead an insurrection, refuse to leave office, etc. how can we trust him to lead our country?

The concerns about Biden's cognition may have merit, but unlike Feinstein, the president is at least evaluated by a physician. What more can we do? If Biden becomes unable to continue his duties, that's the very reason we have a vice president. At least Harris is a known entity.

To play devil's advocate, we know little about Trumps health. He refused to have his medical exam released to the public, if I recall correctly. Trumps health is arguably also a wild card. Who's to say he doesn't develop dementia or drop dead from a stroke while in office? What of his VP? We don't have Pence to rely on like before. At this point, his choice of VP is an unknown. At least Harris won't try to upend our democracy

I think we should choose based on the information we have available today, not on what might or might not happen tomorrow.

 

[DocMcCoy]

Full stop. Biden returned the documents when requested, so did Pence. Trump did not, despite multiple requests. There's evidence he was going to sell classified nuclear documents. Unintentional retention of documents vs deliberate, malicious intent.

The prosecutorial finding about Biden's alleged memory issues is not, in my opinion, not the main reason he wasn't charged. It's an additional finding. Biden did break the letter of the law. If he was tried, the charges would be less severe and sentencing lighter than Trump because of the lack of deliberate, malicious intent on the part of Trump.

I don't think a prosecutor would take such a case against Biden. That's just my opinion. I also think of Biden faced charges, so would Pence.

It's true Trump hasn't been convicted. The evidence against him is very incriminating, conviction or not. I feel that anyone who's capable of being honest with themselves would reach a similar conclusion. Trump is now a convicted felon. Biden is not.

Demented or not, Biden's administration is stable. Trump's administration was a circus. Trump did not listen to his advisors, did not listen to his own attorney general.

For the record, I am not saying every policy from the Trump administration was bad, nor do I agree with every single action of Biden's (i.e. our Afghanistan exit). I doubt any person agrees with every policy of any given president. But taken as a whole, I feel Biden's administration and policies have been positive and constructive. Trump sowed chaos, descent, and wepaonized the far right. Biden is a moderate. Trump would be a dictator if he could. How anyone can look at Jan 6 and not reach the conclusion he was at the very least a contributing cause to the insurrection baffles me. Even Mitch McConnell stated that Trump was responsible! If one can reach the conclusion that Trump was at least partially responsible and then vote for him a second time... How can you say you value our democracy? Trump is arguably more a threat to our democracy and world security than any terrorist group. He doesn't value our allies, even stated he might help Russia invade some of them. Now, I acknowledge that some people don't see it that way and have the right to have a different opinion. I won't shame them for it. But I don't have respect for anyone that chooses to support Trump.

People like to criticize Biden for the border problems when the Republican majority House rejected a bipartisan bill at Trump's behest. It's absolutely disgusting. I have no respect for the GOP, save a few select individuals. Biden helped pass the infrastructure bill, a bipartisan effort. He compromised and didn't get everything he wanted. Our economy is booming (some disagree) , but either way people give too much credit to the presidency. He's one man (or woman). He can only do so much. The constitution is set up that way, intentionally. When the economy is doing well, approval rating goes up. When the economy is bad, approval rating goes down. Reality is it's very complex and the executive branch has only a small part in the overall economical picture. Reality is much of the COVID related debt was incurred under Trump. Do I blame him for that? No. Passing the economic stimulus checks into law was the right thing to do. But some people like to forget that inconvenient truth and blame the Biden administration. Really, can someone explain the level of Hate that Biden provokes in some people? I don't get it.

Biden stood up to Russia and China. He has been an arch supporter of Ukraine and would defend Taiwan in an invasion. He has stood by Israel even as he disagrees with how they are managing the war. What has Trump said or done that indicated any regard for our allies? He negotiated lower prices for certain drugs with Medicare. I'll stop, but I think Biden had been overall positive.

Some people on here say Biden is boring or he's not making waves or is not an impressive candidate. Say that both sides have not put forth an impressive candidate. But I ask, what would an impressive candidate look like? The purpose of the presidency is to ensure the continued stability of our democracy, to sign bills into law, to defend our country from enemy threats, to lead on the world stage, etc. Why does a president need to make waives? That's not their job, in my opinion. Trump made waves and the outcome was not good for our country

Lastly, I think it's clear there's a systemic issue with the storage of classified documents. There should be a paper trail for any given document, and a designated individual, independant of the executive branch, that keeps track of them. There should be a record of what's signed out and who signed it out, and vice versa for the document's return. Any document not returned should be flagged. A classified document the president borrows should never leave the Whitehouse, unless there's a valid reason. Any document leaving the Whitehouse should have a trail and the reason it was taken somewhere else documented. It's common sense. That doesn't excuse refusal to return a document, by anyone.

maybe a bit of rationalizing to justify your opinions on the two candidates here.

I’ll preface this by saying I agree the way Trump mishandled documents is not the same as Biden. However, if a cornerstone of your argument is Trump malicious intent, justified by “evidence he was going to sell nuclear documents” you need to back that up with a lot more than anecdotes from a disgruntled niece without sounding like a tinfoil hat lunatic. That’s a play right out the MAGA handbook.

“Demented or not, Bidens administration is stable”. If, in fact the leader of the free world is demented, or insane I don’t think one can argue limits of executive power to justify why it’s ok for them to stay in office as long as the wheels of government keep turning. It’s also some mental gymnastics to use the same argument to justify the limited success of a Biden presidency, but Trump was capable of X,Y,Z, almost destroying the country. They are both “just one man” and the constitution protects us…


Yes people like to criticize Biden on the border. A large part of that is rolling back effective executive action, litigating state action, and only of very recently using the executive capacity of the president largely in a response to poor polling data and voter sentiment.

“Our economy is booming”, “when the economy is doing well approval ratings go up”. I don’t disagree that the president is largely just along for the ride, but then why are Bidens approval ratings so low during such an economic boom?