d.o's not allowed to rotate at Rush anymore...

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For what it's worth, today was our annual Hospital Day, where we get to talk to PD's, Residents, and hospital reps from all over. I talked to a guy from a hospital in Michigan who said that they too are limiting who can rotate through their place because they have been getting too many requests to handle. They now only accept students from 5 allopathic hospitals and LECOM-- that's all-- on a first-come-first-served basis. The medical education office just couldn't handle all the requests anymore. He seemed to think that it wasn't all that uncommon these days. I'd venture a guess that the Rush thing may be the very same thing-- just too many requests to handle, so they had to limit it.
 
megboo said:
Sorry about that, I was listening to some Johnny Cash as well as Higwaymen tunes the other day and that song struck me that same. Coincidence be damned!
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If you have Itunes, check out a couple of Robert Earl Keen songs like "The Road Goes On Forever" or "Feeling Good Again". He's awesome. A great great songwriter who doesn't get the respect he deserves.

Also, I agree with gasapple about the non-trad point.

And, I am sick of having to defend myself because I don't automatically jump on the "OMG! It's the end of the world!" bandwagon. Perhaps it's the experience in me that tells me to wait and see what becomes of this situation before exploding and automatically spouting the us vs. them mentality and demand litigation.
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He was spot on. The issue isn't your station in life, the issue is how you treat others. I respect anyone that has gotten into medical school, but not enough to be run down by them. Especially when there are so many people on here who will help out without doing that. In the end, we've all done what we've done and we've all seen what we've seen and that deserves some mutual respect.
 
medhacker said:
Verifiable source is needed

If true, it's most likely basis for legal action.
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Go for it. Ryder in Miami and Parkland in Dallas also don't accept D.O.'s for surgery rotations...
 
Old Grunt said:
If you have Itunes, check out a couple of Robert Earl Keen songs like "The Road Goes On Forever" or "Feeling Good Again". He's awesome. A great great songwriter who doesn't get the respect he deserves.
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West Textures, by REK, is a great album. Also, check out "Swervin' in my Lane" (No Kinda Dancer) for some good fun. I also enjoy "It's the little things...". I saw him a few years back in Ft. Worth, TX at Sundance Square. Good times. 👍

Parkland doesn't accept DOs for surgical rotations? That's news to me. I guess with Southwestern and such they are booked solid. For some reason, I thought TCOM got in on some of the action there from time to time although I might be way off.
 
So I'm extremely confused. I thought the reason why so many new DO & MD schools are in the works right now, was because of the lack of students to fill up residency slots, and because of the 200,000 physician shortage that is supposed to arrive in 2020?

But what I gather from your comments, are that there are too many students already?? This actually makes me really nervous-- as the last thing I would ever want to happen is when I graduate (with my huge loan debt) I can't get a job, because there would be an overflow of physicians in a couple years. Do you think its possible the 200,000 shortage was an overprojection and many of us will have problems finding work?

What's going on here? Input anyone?😕

scpod said:
For what it's worth, today was our annual Hospital Day, where we get to talk to PD's, Residents, and hospital reps from all over. I talked to a guy from a hospital in Michigan who said that they too are limiting who can rotate through their place because they have been getting too many requests to handle. They now only accept students from 5 allopathic hospitals and LECOM-- that's all-- on a first-come-first-served basis. The medical education office just couldn't handle all the requests anymore. He seemed to think that it wasn't all that uncommon these days. I'd venture a guess that the Rush thing may be the very same thing-- just too many requests to handle, so they had to limit it.
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Shaniqua14 said:
So I'm extremely confused. I thought the reason why so many new DO & MD schools are in the works right now, was because of the lack of students to fill up residency slots, and because of the 200,000 physician shortage that is supposed to arrive in 2020?

But what I gather from your comments, are that there are too many students already?? This actually makes me really nervous-- as the last thing I would ever want to happen is when I graduate (with my huge loan debt) I can't get a job, because there would be an overflow of physicians in a couple years. Do you think its possible the 200,000 shortage was an overprojection and many of us will have problems finding work?

What's going on here? Input anyone?😕
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It's a topic of intense discussion in the medical student forums. In a nutshell, there's been an increase (ongoing) in the number of medical students through increased class sizes and new schools in an attempt to address the looming "baby boomer" health shortage. This is all a noble effort but for naught since there hasn't yet been a proportional increase in residency slots. Hence, there's an obvious potential bottleneck that we are all imploring the "powers that be" to promptly address...

So to reply to your concern, yes, I believe the bottleneck is in the offing...let's hope this is addressed soon.
 
I still think this really doesn't have much to do with DO discrimination, AOA politics, or anything else of that manner ... I think (like it has been stated) it has to do with room to rotate at hospitals, and ways in which it is being kept under control.
 
Rush was never stopping DO residents. It is/was student rotations that were in question. And there are shortages on some specailties, not all.

Marcia
 
JaggerPlate said:
I still think this really doesn't have much to do with DO discrimination, AOA politics, or anything else of that manner ... I think (like it has been stated) it has to do with room to rotate at hospitals, and ways in which it is being kept under control.
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If that's the case, you can't blame Rush. The allopathic students there matriculated with the expectation that their institution would be able to provide clinical rotations to them.

The D.O. students at schools that don't have their own hospitals knew they would have to travel around, so it's just a bad break for them that their options have been limited.
 
Old Grunt said:
I
I am 29 and I've seen more things in combat then I care to relate on an internet forum.
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Wait, you don't know that SDNer can be awarded a CIB? Where have you been?
 
Old Grunt said:
If that's the case, you can't blame Rush. The allopathic students there matriculated with the expectation that their institution would be able to provide clinical rotations to them.

The D.O. students at schools that don't have their own hospitals knew they would have to travel around, so it's just a bad break for them that their options have been limited.
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Yup ... I agree. However, I don't think that DO students who chose to attend a school without a hospital made a bad decision or are SOL or anything ... but I really don't think it's more than what I listed earlier. Shouldn't be a continuing problem at all.
 
My feeling is that things are getting crowded at some of the "better" hospitals. People want to rotate where there are good residencies and good fellowships available-- it's that simple. There are plenty of places to rotate in small hospitals without a lot to offer. The problem is that there are not enough of those good programs, and DOs have fallen way behind.

Yes, there are problems these days, especially with Osteopathic GME, but a lot of people are trying to make improvements. We have relied too long on existing allopathic programs to provide our education. I think one of the main problems with Osteopathic GME right now is that in order to start a new program you have to have a director who is board certified by an osteopathic board-- an MD won't do. That's written in the AOA bylaws, but people are trying to change it. For example: Bayfront Corpus Christi is opening a new Osteopathic IM residency. The hospital has a heart center and they want to open a cardio fellowship as well-- but they can't do it without a board certified DO. They thought they had one, but he ended up going to Las Vegas instead.

If you really want to "jumpstart" Osteopathic education you'll need more GME programs. New GME programs will lead to more opportunities for students as well. Talk to the people you know about changing this rule. Let the AOA know your point of view.
 
JaggerPlate said:
Yup ... I agree. However, I don't think that DO students who chose to attend a school without a hospital made a bad decision or are SOL or anything ...
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No, I agree. They are just SOL if they wanted to do their rotations at Rush.

but I really don't think it's more than what I listed earlier. Shouldn't be a continuing problem at all.
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Hopefully not. We need doctors and the system is not served by throwing additional hurdles in the way of students.
 
RockfordWF said:
Go for it. Ryder in Miami and Parkland in Dallas also don't accept D.O.'s for surgery rotations...
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Sure

I charge $150/hr. Unless you are a PCOM student or I need to represent a relative or my friend. And considering I have basically had an internship in what relates to how the AOA has won these cases in the past, consider my rate a bargain.

Since I am not interested in rotating at any of those places, I do not need to pursue legal action at any of these places, for myself. If you or anyone else, can't/wish not afford my services, you may contact the AOA legal department, which will be glad to inform you if you do have a case, and they will do this AT NO COST TO YOU.

Otherwise, you may PM me as you read this, and I will start billing you as soon as your PM arrives. 😍
 
Old Grunt said:
The D.O. students at schools that don't have their own hospitals knew they would have to travel around, so it's just a bad break for them that their options have been limited.
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For the record, let me emphasize one more time that any new med school which cannot guarantee all 4 years of training on-site should not be allowed to get accredited. That goes for both MD and DO programs.

If your institution doesnt have a medical center large enough to place all the med students, then it just proves that you dont need a medical school in that location in the first place.

I think its hilarious that all of these schools are opening up screaming DOCTOR SHORTAGE when they cant even place their own students. Absolutely ridiculous. 👎
 
medhacker said:
Sure

I charge $150/hr. Unless you are a PCOM student or I need to represent a relative or my friend. And considering I have basically had an internship in what relates to how the AOA has won these cases in the past, consider my rate a bargain.

Since I am not interested in rotating at any of those places, I do not need to pursue legal action at any of these places, for myself. If you or anyone else, can't/wish not afford my services, you may contact the AOA legal department, which will be glad to inform you if you do have a case, and they will do this AT NO COST TO YOU

Otherwise, you may PM me as you read this, and I will start billing you as soon as your PM arrives. 😍
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So do I, but for speech therapy.
 
JaggerPlate said:
Yup ... I agree. However, I don't think that DO students who chose to attend a school without a hospital made a bad decision or are SOL or anything ... but I really don't think it's more than what I listed earlier. Shouldn't be a continuing problem at all.
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I'm sorry, but it absolutely matters if your med school has a medical center of sufficient size to support all the students.

I bet you bottom dollar that at least 75% of these new schools (both MD and DO) wont have enough clinical slots and will have to farm out people to locations elsewhere, probably out of state. Thats pathetic.
 
megboo said:
So do I, but for speech therapy.
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That should prove difficult to bill over email, no? :laugh:

or rather, provide services for, over email... ehem 😉
 
MacGyver said:
For the record, let me emphasize one more time that any new med school which cannot guarantee all 4 years of training on-site should not be allowed to get accredited. That goes for both MD and DO programs.

If your institution doesnt have a medical center large enough to place all the med students, then it just proves that you dont need a medical school in that location in the first place.

I think its hilarious that all of these schools are opening up screaming DOCTOR SHORTAGE when they cant even place their own students. Absolutely ridiculous. 👎
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You obviously have your opinion, and it is obviously irrelevant to the sitation at hand.
 
medhacker said:
That should prove difficult to bill over email, no? :laugh:

or rather, provide services for, over email... ehem 😉
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I was gonna say - I bill over the internet all the time.

Yeah, I gotta provide services in person, except for my documentation stuff.

I can't wait to be a doc though. Therapy is boring (for me. It's a fine, fine field and I wouldn't stop anyone from doing it).
 
All the bull aside, this is very disconcerning. I really wish the AOA would get their head on straight. I must admit though that I am not familiar with them, but to start I would stop opening new schools and start improving the GME. No new ideas but I am starting to get worried.
 
MacGyver said:
I'm sorry, but it absolutely matters if your med school has a medical center of sufficient size to support all the students.

I bet you bottom dollar that at least 75% of these new schools (both MD and DO) wont have enough clinical slots and will have to farm out people to locations elsewhere, probably out of state. Thats pathetic.
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I am not going to agree or disagree with you either way, but what I am saying is that this situation (no matter how much validity it may have) is not the fault of the student. If an applicant has worked their ass off for four years in undergrad and has acceptance to ONE school that doesn't have on site rotations, are they foolish for taking it?? Absolutely not. Some people don't have the options of selecting a program that can offer this, and it's no secret which DO programs have on site rotations. Students may know that they have to leave for clinicals, but if it's their only choice or they know this ... they aren't foolish, or pathetic, or anything else.

I'm fairly certain that your problem with this situation lies higher up (AOA etc), but this whole thread is just going to go down in flames with people bagging on schools who don't have on site, then students from these schools will fire back ... etc etc.
 
Unify DOs and future DOs! Why do you think the nursing associations (ANA for one) have so many problems and issues seeing their agendas come to fruition?! It's because they will not unite!

UNITE!

Unite the clans! Unite them!

br_05.jpg


Braveheart2.jpg
 
megboo said:
Um, Robert the Bruce betrayed William Wallace in that movie.

but yes, DOs need to come together on this.
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I know that but that's beside the point! Still funny though - you know, I thought about that at the time...

But he (Sir Robert the Bruce) regretted it to the bitter end and ultimately led the Scots (DOs) to victory at Bannockburn!


UNITE! UNITE!


I'm more like Stephen - "It's my island."

st_21.jpg


"In order to find his equal, an Irishman is forced to talk to God. Yes, Father. The Almighty says don't change the subject; just answer the fooking question."
 
megboo said:
So you're saying that someone needs to betray the most inspiring DO out there before we have success?

😕

How about an underdog story!
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Oh man, we've already been betrayed by the establishment (insert anything here) - now we must UNITE! :meanie:
 
I think the point he was trying to make is that one of us here has to have sex with Sophie Marceau. If that's what it takes to end DO discrimination, I'll take one for the team.
 
megboo said:
And, I am sick of having to defend myself because I don't automatically jump on the "OMG! It's the end of the world!" bandwagon. Perhaps it's the experience in me that tells me to wait and see what becomes of this situation before exploding and automatically spouting the us vs. them mentality and demand litigation.
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You wouldn't last 10 seconds at an allopathic school unless you learn how to freak the **** out about everything a little better. And what happened to TJ Lux? I thought he had a future in the league.
 
TexasTriathlete said:
I think the point he was trying to make is that one of us here has to have sex with Sophie Marceau. If that's what it takes to end DO discrimination, I'll take one for the team.
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LMAO! Man, how the hell is TT always SPOT ON!
 
megboo said:
LOL

okay, okay.
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Umm, directors and medical colleagues that aren't DO friendly are equivalent to Longshanks and will ultimately be defeated. Yea, that works...
 
megboo said:
W.T.F.?
Blasphemy.

SIU has a playoff game this weekend btw 😀 - for pigskin.
SIU b-ball will dominate IU and redeem themselves.
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My boys are going to dominate #1 UCLA this weekend on their floor.

Actually, we will probably get spanked. We are too young. But if Darren Collison is out again, DJ Augustin will have a field day, and he is probably a top-3 point guard in the country. Our team is freaking small though. I don't think we can really justify our #7 ranking at this point. Time will tell.
 
TexasTriathlete said:
My boys are going to dominate #1 UCLA this weekend on their floor.

Actually, we will probably get spanked. We are too young. But if Darren Collison is out again, DJ Augustin will have a field day, and he is probably a top-3 point guard in the country. Our team is freaking small though. I don't think we can really justify our #7 ranking at this point. Time will tell.
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Yeah we're still waiting to see if Clemmons will be available for the Sat. game.

I'm really impressed with how well the SIU football and b-ball teams have taken off in the past 3-4 years.

If they can keep building their recruiting, I see them in the sweet 16 many years to come 😀

Although football might have a rough year next year.
 
Ok I remember Carr, but Frazier was well before my time. But I know who he is.

When I did strength and conditioning with UT, I was fortunate enough to work with our final four team, including TJ Ford (won several national player of the year awards that year) and Royal Ivey, both of whom are in the league now. We also recruited Lamarcus Aldridge and Daniel Gibson at that time. We are starting to put some pretty good players in the NBA.
 
I don't think we're going to put any players in the NBA next year. Maybe Falker, but I don't think he wants to go that direction. He's an intellectual or sthg.

I really don't care about the NBA (the Now Boring Association). College ball is where it's at.
 
megboo said:
I don't think we're going to put any players in the NBA next year. Maybe Falker, but I don't think he wants to go that direction. He's an intellectual or sthg.

I really don't care about the NBA (the Now Boring Association). College ball is where it's at.
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HAHAHAHAHAH Whewww ... THANK YOU. I get the weirdest looks from people when I tell them I've stopped watching NBA ball this season because it is boring as hell, I am glad someone else agrees!! And yes ... NCAA (more specifically UCLA ball) is where it's at.
 
The thing about the NBA is that the players are so freaking good. Also, I know three people pretty well who are in the NBA, so its hard not to pull for them.

On the other hand, I know Brad Womack (the most recent bachelor) extremely well, and I never watched a single episode of that nonsense.
 
TexasTriathlete said:
I know Brad Womack (the most recent bachelor) extremely well, and I never watched a single episode of that nonsense.
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brad_womack.jpg


Say it ain't so, TT...you and Bradley go to the spa together?
 
gasapple said:
Say it ain't so, TT...you and Bradley go to the spa together?
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No way! That guy was hilarious! I never actually watched the show but I do watch The Soup all the time. It always showed clips of how stupid the girls were. That guy Bradley laughed all the time and seemed to think the girls were dumb too. It seemed like he thought all of it was ridiculous which was funny.
 
He works out at my gym a lot. I have known him for years. I used to work with his brother.

Those guys are freaking great. Incredibly nice people.

He told me he had fun with it. I haven't talked to him since it ended though, and he wasn't allowed to talk about it before then (or at least give any details), so I didn't ask.
 
TexasTriathlete said:
He works out at my gym a lot. I have known him for years. I used to work with his brother.

Those guys are freaking great. Incredibly nice people.

He told me he had fun with it. I haven't talked to him since it ended though, and he wasn't allowed to talk about it before then (or at least give any details), so I didn't ask.
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Yeah he seemed a little too nice and down to earth for a reality show. (From what I saw on The Soup anyway) Also a little too nice and down to earth for the gold diggers that go on reality shows. (Again my reference is The Soup)
 
gasapple said:
West Textures, by REK, is a great album. Also, check out "Swervin' in my Lane" (No Kinda Dancer) for some good fun. I also enjoy "It's the little things...". I saw him a few years back in Ft. Worth, TX at Sundance Square. Good times. 👍
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I've got all of his albums. I've seen him more times than I can count. Unlike TX, it's pretty easy to get into a REK show in Louisiana. He puts on a great show.

I used to like Pat Green as well, until he sold out.
 
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