Dental school debt 400k

[dieanotherday]

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Making 120k a year leaves you with 87k after tax. 400k at 6.8% for 4 years will require a monthly payment of $9500 a month or $114k a year. So no it is not possible to pay it off in 4 years earning 120k a year.

To pay it off it 4 years you would need to make 160k a year with 100% of your after income tax going towards loan payments. So if you live with your parents and they pay for car, gas, food, malpractice, disability, life and health insurance for you while you do not spend a single dime for 4 years then yes it would be possible but not practical.

or get married to someone willing to support you.
he/she invests in your professional education through funding cost of living and health insurance etc and after 5 years of loan repayment you would be able to fatten up the 401k's and IRA's of both you and your spouse.

EDIT: nevermind glimmer brought up the same point. 😛

 

[warmbroom]

I'm not sure how you can tell that they are successful or unsuccessful dentists but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. I also never said that 400k debt-ers are screwed, I'm just saying that their expectation of a "doctor lifestyle" after dental school will be delayed 10-15 years. And most of the students are extremely unaware of this so should be made aware by plugging in the calculations themselves.



This is true but if you are OOS you will be paying close to that number no matter where you go. Thats why I said go to a state dental school.

Having jumped around that site from time to time I'd say you're probably being a little fast and loose with who you refer to as mediocre.

Also, I wouldn't be so fast to assume that you will be better than those who came before you. I doubt we are more focused on the business side of things than they were.

You guys are right. That was a stupid comment. I shouldn't be posting when I'm so sleep deprived! 🙂

 

[Cello]

Yes that is true I would not have entered dentistry if I had 400k debt at 6.8% but that is my opinion on myself. And dentistry would not have been worth it for me since I would like a reasonable amount of disposable income in my 20s and that would not be possible if my debt had doubled with that kind of interest rate.

Wouldn't we all? Out of curiosity, what would you have done? The doom and gloom is literally everywhere.

Airline pilots typically have $70,000+ in debt only to start for a regional at $16,000 annually... They are never home either and live in makeshift apartments they've all gone in on together throughout the country. Physicians are feeling the pinch as their incomes have increased the least of any healthcare practitioner over the last two decades but they still pay about what we do for their education with the added problem that they make a relatively low wage during their residency. Lawyers graduate with $150,000+ in debt only to find themselves making $10 an hour as an intern for a corporate lawfirm which is itself likely the last of a dying breed as online legal services abound. There is a huge glut of PhDs and researchers now find themselves without funding and increasingly, without jobs.

What if you end up getting married to another in-debted dentist with even bigger loans?

Actually, this would be the ideal situation. There is a nominal income threshold which, once reached, people's happiness sort of tapers off. That number a few years back was around $80,000 gross income per year before taxes (I doubt it's changed much). Most people don't earn that. In the case of most professionals, they will earn that, but due to student loans it will be like they don't. That said, if a dentist earns $120,000 but after paying their loans feels more like $40,000, then it wouldn't be too bad to have two dentists each owing twice as much debt but together earning the nominal $80,000 household income. That's not a bad deal at all. Once their loans are paid off entirely, they will live VERY well, as opposed to the spouse who only earns $40,000 with no room for potential growth.

So many people on sdn bring up this argument. Have you ever wondered why this is the exception and not the norm? There are quite a few reasons, but it basically boils down to most dentists being horrible businessman. True, not every dentist can make $400k+ but it can happen if you are smart about your career.

Too many people on this forum try and scare people away from dentistry with threats of decades of eating Ramen noodles and having to drive a beater car for the rest of their lives. There is plenty of money to be made in dentistry. Understand that yes, it is a ton of debt, and you should limit it as much as possible, but that if you really want a career in dentistry, you will be financially okay as long as you aren't an idiot.

There is a finite amount of money the general public is willing to spend on dental care. That amount may be slightly elastic, but not enough to accommodate all currently practicing dentists earning $400,000 because they all suddenly try harder and up their game.

 

[Silent Cool]

A few points:

1) If you want to reach your income potential in dentistry, you need to *buy* a practice. A modest practice will cost you 400K.

2) Stop quoting average debt loads. They are deceiving and not reflective of the debt required of those who are *borrowing* for their education. Rather, they reflect the fact that ~50% of students have their parents footing the bill. Just recently I came across a thread on dentaltown in which the dentist was talking about how he is going to pay for his kid's 400K dental school. Another dentist on there said that he expects to pay 300K for each of his daughter's *undergraduate* educations. Average debts are BS. Assume borrowing at the COA and factor interest accumulation--from day one.

3) If you specialize, most specialties will charge you tuition. Considering interest, if you attend a private school, you will likely have ~7-800K of debt--before practice purchase.

good luck.

 

[Cello]

2) Stop quoting average debt loads. They are deceiving and not reflective of the debt required of those who are *borrowing* for their education. Rather, they reflect the fact that ~50% of students have their parents footing the bill. Just recently I came across a thread on dentaltown in which the dentist was talking about how he is going to pay for his kid's 400K dental school. Another dentist on there said that he expects to pay 300K for each of his daughter's *undergraduate* educations. Average debts are BS. Assume borrowing at the COA and factor interest accumulation--from day one.

This is interesting all by itself if for no other reason than the fact that these dentists you refer to are paying $400,000 in one case and $600,000 in the other to put their children through college... We're not talking about their mortgage, car payments, insurance, retirement, etc. These DENTISTS have enough money to service all of their debts and still pay as much for their kids' undergraduate schooling as we're afraid to pay for dental school. No one here is going to be rich their first five years out of dental school. Fifteen years out and I'm sure everyone will be doing well for themselves if they work hard.

 

[Silent Cool]

This is interesting all by itself if for no other reason than the fact that these dentists you refer to are paying $400,000 in one case and $600,000 in the other to put their children through college... We're not talking about their mortgage, car payments, insurance, retirement, etc. These DENTISTS have enough money to service all of their debts and still pay as much for their kids' undergraduate schooling as we're afraid to pay for dental school. No one here is going to be rich their first five years out of dental school. Fifteen years out and I'm sure everyone will be doing well for themselves if they work hard.

Well, for further reference, the first person was ranked as the best dentist in his city, and the second person is married to a dentist. They have also been out ~20 years each.

 

[Realitydentalstudent]

This is interesting all by itself if for no other reason than the fact that these dentists you refer to are paying $400,000 in one case and $600,000 in the other to put their children through college... We're not talking about their mortgage, car payments, insurance, retirement, etc. These DENTISTS have enough money to service all of their debts and still pay as much for their kids' undergraduate schooling as we're afraid to pay for dental school. No one here is going to be rich their first five years out of dental school. Fifteen years out and I'm sure everyone will be doing well for themselves if they work hard.

Hey cello I saw your wonderful number crunching threads in your signature, amazing job! Was wondering if you could make a thread incorporating the monthly loan repayments on a 400k loan with a 120k income minus federal and state tax.

Also minus the necessities
Housing
Food
Bills
Health insurance $10000/year
Malpractice insurance $2000/year
Disability insurance $4000/year
Car insurance
CE and CE related travel expenses (although I believe this is tax deductible)

I believe this will enable pre-dents to better make their decision on whether to a attend 400k schools.

 

[wb1]

Well, for further reference, the first person was ranked as the best dentist in his city, and the second person is married to a dentist. They have also been out ~20 years each.

Twenty years ago, the dental tuitions are probably a lot less than now.

Let's say some 22 years old who are contemplating about alternative to dentistry. What other careers would you recommend?

 

[dieanotherday]

Hey cello I saw your wonderful number crunching threads in your signature, amazing job! Was wondering if you could make a thread incorporating the monthly loan repayments on a 400k loan with a 120k income minus federal and state tax.

Also minus the necessities
Housing
Food
Bills
Health insurance $10000/year
Malpractice insurance $2000/year
Disability insurance $4000/year
Car insurance
CE and CE related travel expenses (although I believe this is tax deductible)

I believe this will enable pre-dents to better make their decision on whether to a attend 400k schools.

my husband made a loan repayment calculator for that
i can have him factor in cost of living expenses that is user input friendly 🙂

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/dental-school-loan-calculator-simulator.1052236/

 

[Silent Cool]

Twenty years ago, the dental tuitions are probably a lot less than now.

Let's say some 22 years old who are contemplating about alternative to dentistry. What other careers would you recommend?

That, too.

For a relatively young person, I would recommend the military. It's worth it if you have a number of years ahead of you.

 

[Cello]

Twenty years ago, the dental tuition are probably a lot less than now.

Let's say some 22 years old who are contemplating about alternative to dentistry. What other careers would you recommend?

Costco.

Not joking.

When I worked there (notice though that I quit) I was working with cashiers who made $55,000 in 2008. Today they make more than $60,000 with just a high school diploma. Store managers make $120,000+ easily. If you can see yourself being chastised for not having yellow bananas, or because the granola bars were moved from aisle 6 to aisle 8, then go for it!

You could also try sales (which can be a tough and stressful profession), or perhaps the banking industry, though I hear that gig is played out. If you don't have a passion for healthcare though, then I really think you should look into Costco. The idea of a safe and future-proof profession is almost certainly a relic from our parents' era. Even if you're an engineer (another decent choice), you will likely switch companies multiple times throughout your career. If you're really into money, you could work at an oil field. Having done a similar job myself though, I warn you that it's difficult and tedious work.

The problem isn't dentistry, or medicine, or even higher education. With globalization, the United States economy is undergoing a major transition as nations like India, China, and Brazil are becoming economic powers in their own right. This has had a tremendous impact on the US economy, and the entire 'Western World' in general. There may be some point in the distant future where things become balanced again, but that will possibly mean that everyone here has to make do with earning less, while people in the BRIC nations will be happy to be earning more. We are on target to be the first generation of Americans in modern history with less opportunity and wealth than our parents had. Gone are the days when the US had 50% of the wealth and industry on Earth.

Hey cello I saw your wonderful number crunching threads in your signature, amazing job! Was wondering if you could make a thread incorporating the monthly loan repayments on a 400k loan with a 120k income minus federal and state tax.

Also minus the necessities
Housing
Food
Bills
Health insurance $10000/year
Malpractice insurance $2000/year
Disability insurance $4000/year
Car insurance
CE and CE related travel expenses (although I believe this is tax deductible)

I believe this will enable pre-dents to better make their decision on whether to a attend 400k schools.

I could probably whip something up if dieanotherday's husband doesn't have the time to get around to it.

That, too.

For a relatively young person, I would recommend the military. It's worth it if you have a number of years ahead of you.

Is there a reason the person should be relatively young? I would have thought it would be even more important for the older graduate to get a handle on their debt ASAP than a youngster.

 

[Realitydentalstudent]

.

 

[Realitydentalstudent]

my husband made a loan repayment calculator for that
i can have him factor in cost of living expenses that is user input friendly 🙂

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/dental-school-loan-calculator-simulator.1052236/

That would be fantastic if he could!

 

[sengineer]

The OP is quite right in posting the realistic warning of the cost. In fact overall US student loan debt is over 1 trillion so this goes beyond just the universities. For those coming straight out of high school, undergrad it is a worthy investment despite the high costs but trying to get into a state school is of course better. You should set yourself up to not live a lavish life after graduating because it just makes sense but the choice of the career is job security and planning for your later years. Some people are lucky and get tuition paid for and those are the rich ppl out there; if you were not born with a silver spoon in your mouth, then do not expect riches.

 

[sengineer]

I just want to add as well, that the ppl I have met thus far in both medical and dental fields all had financial support in some way or the other. Be it living with parents to pay all other expenses or paying the tuition costs. For those who are on their own in every regard, I feel its an impossible decision to make in taking on so much loans. If the schools allowed a more flexible course schedule for these type of students it may give them a chance to make money on the side.

 

[Silent Cool]

Costco.

Not joking.

When I worked there (notice though that I quit) I was working with cashiers who made $55,000 in 2008. Today they make more than $60,000 with just a high school diploma. Store managers make $120,000+ easily. If you can see yourself being chastised for not having yellow bananas, or because the granola bars were moved from aisle 6 to aisle 8, then go for it!

You could also try sales (which can be a tough and stressful profession), or perhaps the banking industry, though I hear that gig is played out. If you don't have a passion for healthcare though, then I really think you should look into Costco. The idea of a safe and future-proof profession is almost certainly a relic from our parents' era. Even if you're an engineer (another decent choice), you will likely switch companies multiple times throughout your career. If you're really into money, you could work at an oil field. Having done a similar job myself though, I warn you that it's difficult and tedious work.

The problem isn't dentistry, or medicine, or even higher education. With globalization, the United States economy is undergoing a major transition as nations like India, China, and Brazil are becoming economic powers in their own right. This has had a tremendous impact on the US economy, and the entire 'Western World' in general. There may be some point in the distant future where things become balanced again, but that will possibly mean that everyone here has to make do with earning less, while people in the BRIC nations will be happy to be earning more. We are on target to be the first generation of Americans in modern history with less opportunity and wealth than our parents had. Gone are the days when the US had 50% of the wealth and industry on Earth.



I could probably whip something up if dieanotherday's husband doesn't have the time to get around to it.



Is there a reason the person should be relatively young? I would have thought it would be even more important for the older graduate to get a handle on their debt ASAP than a youngster.

I just meant that because of the military time committment, joining is more practical for someone on the younger side (though certainly not out of the question for an older student). Just depends on one's priorities, values, etc...

 

[wolfchild007]

I've never met a poor dentist. $0.02

 

[Realitydentalstudent]

I've never met a poor dentist. $0.02

Probbaly because you have not met a dentist who had to pay 400k for his education

 

[ktran17]

It depends on how much you want it and what you'll sacrifice to get it done. For example, the state funded NHSC loan repayment programs can offer 20-50k per year in loan repayment (depending on site and state). Some of them even include a high starting salary 120k + benefits and also will provide living.

If you have a 120k per year salary +35k lrp+ rent covered even for two years, you can do some serious damage to your loan. Btw, that 35k is tax exempt making LRP's even more worth it. IHS has something similar as well. However, you'll have to make certain sacrifices like working in a rural community in a state you probably have not seen yourself living in.

To me, I can live with this because I went into dentistry to help people. What better way then helping one of the most undeserved community while tackling your loans at the same time?

I'm currently waitlisted for the HPSP and have accepted my fate. You can only plan so much in life and sometimes you just have to enjoy what you have. I'm truly grateful for the opportunities I've had so far in this country and do not regret my decision to pursue dentistry!

 

[ChrisM07]

I don't understand why someone would apply to, much less attend, a dental school that would leave them $400k in debt when they are finished. There are plenty of other schools that are much cheaper. At the end of the day, patients do NOT care where their dentist went to school. As long as he/she is a D.M.D or D.D.S it doesn't matter.

Some people do not have the luxury to pick, and be chosen at, the cheaper alternatives. I don't think it always has to do with the name either.

 

[Troyvdg]

I don't understand why someone would apply to, much less attend, a dental school that would leave them $400k in debt when they are finished. There are plenty of other schools that are much cheaper. At the end of the day, patients do NOT care where their dentist went to school. As long as he/she is a D.M.D or D.D.S it doesn't matter. Taking on $400k in student debt is a simply a bad business decision.

However, there are plenty of options to help pay down student debt if you've taken on too much debt. Military options are available as well as practicing in under served areas. Future students/current students need to look more into the financials of becoming a dentist. The income potential for a dentist is excellent and if you make the right decisions along the way you can have a great lifestyle.

Some people don't have a choice, whether it's due to lower stats, not being accepted to their state school, or simply having two very expensive state schools (my scenario). All the more reason I agree with the second half of your post.

 

[TheWeeIceMan]

I've never met a poor dentist. $0.02

Well, that settles it.

 

[wolfchild007]

Well, that settles it.

It does though. Everyone on this forum is acting like they're condemned to a life of poverty if they go to a private/OOS school. Yea it sucks but it's not a life ruining thing.

 

[jenfromdablock]

Or you can just do IBR for 25 years.

 

[Ferneezy]

Or you can just do IBR for 25 years.

good luck on your personal tax bomb goals in ~30 years from now

 

[amfassz]

good luck on your personal tax bomb goals in ~30 years from now

as opposed to paying 5k a month for 10+ years?

pick your poison either now or later

at least on ibr you have money to invest

 

[Ferneezy]

as opposed to paying 5k a month for 10+ years?

pick your poison either now or later

at least on ibr you have money to invest

what i would do if facing down a $400k .edu magnum pointing at my head:
1) stretch repayment terms to 30 years
2) work my ass off for one or two years somewhere with a low cost of living, in a position where i can earn as close to $200k as possible to do only three things (fund retirement, save liquid cash, service school loans...in that order of importance)
3) take those two years of documented production (keeping track's important) to a bank, with a business plan, to obtain a loan for the practice i wish to acquire. which practice? why, the one i've chosen after due diligence while doing number two above. it's not like i'd have much of a life.
4) ????
5) bullet dodged

debt isn't something to be afraid of, especially when it comes to this profession. and it goes without saying it should be minimized, but it's merely a tool. like fire. use it correctly and you can accomplish your goals in life, but the moment you disrespect it, it will kill you.

 

[jenfromdablock]

what i would do if facing down a $400k .edu magnum pointing at my head:
1) stretch repayment terms to 30 years
2) work my ass off for one or two years somewhere with a low cost of living, in a position where i can earn as close to $200k as possible to do only three things (fund retirement, save liquid cash, service school loans...in that order of importance)
3) take those two years of documented production (keeping track's important) to a bank, with a business plan, to obtain a loan for the practice i wish to acquire. which practice? why, the one i've chosen after due diligence while doing number two above. it's not like i'd have much of a life.
4) ????
5) bullet dodged

debt isn't something to be afraid of, especially when it comes to this profession. and it goes without saying it should be minimized, but it's merely a tool. like fire. use it correctly and you can accomplish your goals in life, but the moment you disrespect it, it will kill you.

Sounds like a plan to me

 

[Screwtape]

debt isn't something to be afraid of, especially when it comes to this profession. and it goes without saying it should be minimized, but it's merely a tool. like fire. use it correctly and you can accomplish your goals in life, but the moment you disrespect it, it will kill you.

should be: "it will burn you"- ties it all together. Also, debt will not kill you.

 

[Ferneezy]

creative liberties.

i could have used gun instead of fire to keep the metaphor 100% juicy, but that might have offended some of our more sensitive members.

edit: and the way some sdners talk about the entrance fee to dentistry, you'd think they were checking in for a permanent stay in shawshank

 

[Demilaax]

I plan to default on all of my loans and move to Russia once I can practice.

 

[jenfromdablock]

Or you can just wait until the student loan bubble bursts and we get bailed out.

 

[Screwtape]

Or you can just wait until the student loan bubble bursts and we get bailed out.

IF this ever does happen, I can almost guarantee people in "high-earning" professions will be exempt. After all the moaning about debt, a newly minted dentist can pay back $500k+ in their lifetime. It just will not be fun and it will take a long time.

I do not think most people with [insert any low-paying major like art] could pay back $100K+, ever. Some people are in that very situation.

For example, look at what the government is considering doing about the IBR program. The goverment wants as much money as possible. http://askheatherjarvis.com/blog/presidents-budget-unsettling-to-high-debt-student-loan-borrowers

 

[ktran17]

IBR is not even a good program. Your balance after 25 years becomes taxable income. Based on the progressive movement of U.S. tax policies, we can only assume that higher level income earners will get taxed at a higher rate..

In addition, I personally am not doing it because I think its irresponsible to place the burden on tax payers, especially the middle class..

To each his own I guess..

 

[jenfromdablock]

IBR is not even a good program. Your balance after 25 years becomes taxable income. Based on the progressive movement of U.S. tax policies, we can only assume that higher level income earners will get taxed at a higher rate..

In addition, I personally am not doing it because I think its irresponsible to place the burden on tax payers, especially the middle class..

To each his own I guess..

For 400k after 25 years on IBR, the tax bomb is about 180k

 

[Ferneezy]

For 400k after 25 years on IBR, the tax bomb is about 180k

on top of whatever your income tax is as a dentist in your 25th year of practice.

lol. no. thanx.

 

[ktran17]

on top of whatever your income tax is as a dentist in your 25th year of practice.

lol. no. thanx.

The tax brackets will change too..

@jenfromdablock

The government does things for their own interest, not ours. With the 180k tax bomb from ibr and also the owed income tax you will have during the 25th year as a dentist, there will be some dentists who won't be prepared to pay it all off at once.

That's exactly what the government wants because they'll say , it's ok "you can pay in installments, but you'll have to pay interest!"

The government wants to put professional people in a perpetual cycle of debt, so they can squeeze as much money from us as possible.

 

[jenfromdablock]

on top of whatever your income tax is as a dentist in your 25th year of practice.

lol. no. thanx.

That income tax for the 25th year was going to be present regardless....so you can't count that as a penalty.

 

[Ferneezy]

That income tax for the 25th year was going to be present regardless....so you can't count that as a penalty.

once you pay attention to how your municipality, your county, your state, and especially your country utilizes the tax funds they bleed you for...you'll count every tax as a penalty.

i know i do.

 

[jenfromdablock]

once you pay attention to how your municipality, your county, your state, and especially your country utilizes the tax funds they bleed you for...you'll count every tax as a penalty.

i know i do.

Taxes are taxes regardless of their use. You're trying to say that the 25th tax bomb is pretty bad considering you're also paying your 25th year's income tax and I'm saying that income tax is there regardless of IBR or not.

 

[TheWeeIceMan]

Taxes are taxes regardless of their use. You're trying to say that the 25th tax bomb is pretty bad considering you're also paying your 25th year's income tax and I'm saying that income tax is there regardless of IBR or not.

I'm not sure I follow this logic. You'll have to come up with an additional 180k out of pocket on that 25th year, no matter how you want to spin it. Saying "taxes are there regardless" doesn't make a lot of sense when you are talking about massive differences in the amount you will owe.

 

[jenfromdablock]

I'm not sure I follow this logic. You'll have to come up with an additional 180k out of pocket on that 25th year, no matter how you want to spin it. Saying "taxes are there regardless" doesn't make a lot of sense when you are talking about massive differences in the amount you will owe.

180k 25 years from now is worth a lot less than 180k in 2014.

Moreover, if you anticipate the tax bomb, you can save up.

 

[ktran17]

180k 25 years from now is worth a lot less than 180k in 2014.

Moreover, if you anticipate the tax bomb, you can save up.

You're assuming the tax brackets are going to stay the same and will not be adjusted for inflation. Which is a bad assumption given historical tax trends of the U.S.

 

[jenfromdablock]

You're assuming the tax brackets are going to stay the same and will not be adjusted for inflation. Which is a bad assumption given historical tax trends of the U.S.

Brackets or not, the top marginal tax rate won't go higher than 39.6%

 

[NDPitch]

Brackets or not, the top marginal tax rate won't go higher than 39.6%

????

In the 70s the top marginal tax rate was 70%. In the 80s it was 50%. Trust me, they'll go higher than 39.6%. The fatted calf will get its money one way or another. Don't trust the federal government. It's highly corrupt and full of filthy individuals, in my honest opinion.

 

[jenfromdablock]

????

In the 70s the top marginal tax rate was 70%. In the 80s it was 50%. Trust me, they'll go higher than 39.6%. The fatted calf will get its money one way or another. Don't trust the federal government. It's highly corrupt and full of filthy individuals, in my honest opinion.

Yeah and it was 90% during the Eisenhower administration but no one actually paid that much. It's a line liberals (like myself) use to defend high tax rates for the, but no one ever paid 70% of the income above $250,000 to the IRS. That just didn't happen.

Trust me, it won't go higher than 40% max.

 

[Miley Cyrus.]

Studies have been done and all conclude that raising taxes on ppl making above 250k won't do squat. In order to raise some real tax revenue, you are going to need to raise taxes on EVERYONE. More than 40% of the ppl in this country pay no federal income tax.

I agree with NDPitch, the government is full of slimebags, both on the Republican side and the Democrat side.

 

[yappy]

I feel like dentistry is a great career; however, 400k+ debts are going to make winners and losers in dentistry; which, is somewhat unprecedented. Those with lower debts are setting themselves up to live a good life, financially, without having to hit it out of the park once they're practicing. 400k+ worth of debt is like putting weights on your feet - you can still do well but you're going to have to have a proportional increase in your success during working years. Some people with this debt will not reach professional success and be the "losers" in the field.

For those that manage to keep their debts very low and build/inherit a successful practice?

 

[Cello]

????

In the 70s the top marginal tax rate was 70%. In the 80s it was 50%. Trust me, they'll go higher than 39.6%. The fatted calf will get its money one way or another. Don't trust the federal government. It's highly corrupt and full of filthy individuals, in my honest opinion.

The top marginal tax rate was above 90% during what is arguably this nation's finest economic period (the 50's and 60's). The thing is, that tax rate only applied if you earned more than $400,000 annually (which today would be more like $4 or $5 million).

That tax policy actually helped to create the strong middle class we enjoyed during that period. Because executives would rather invest the money back into their company than give it to the federal government, employees enjoyed pension plans, healthcare, higher wages, paid vacation, etc.

 

[jenfromdablock]

IBR/PAYE all the way.