Doctoral Student Potentially Transitioning to Medical School

[neuroguy101]

---

Members don't see this ad.

There are similar posts on here so I apologize for redundancy -

I am currently nearing the end of my doctoral program (Neuropsychology) and may use it as a stepping stone to medical school. I had an undergraduate minor in Human Biology, so many pre-med courses are done. However, there are others such as Organic Chemistry, Physics, etc. that will need to be taken.

It is worth noting that my career goals currently remain the same (clinical research-based), but I believe that medical school would round-out my knowledge and improve my ability to recognize patterns and dissect the issues on which my research is focused.

Has anyone followed this educational trajectory, specifically from my field of study? While courses at a community college may be an easy route, are there options at more well-known schools to fill in these gaps in prerequisites prior to medical school applications? My concern is that my current schedule would not allow for significant time for these courses, specifically attendance of courses/labs - I could manage the assignments/studying outside of class. However, waiting until my schedule does permit to the optimal degree would potentially create a gap in my education rather than allowing my transition to be smooth and devoid of a gap-year. Further, I have a one-year internship and two-year fellowship in neuropsychology ahead.

Any suggestions or personal experiences will be greatly appreciated.

 

[xyzdt]

Speaking anecdotally, it's definitely been done before.

Source: A friend of a friend told me he couldn't get in as an undergrad. He finished his PhD and applied again and got accepted. He was pretty research focused and approached his apps from that angle.

 

[hebrewBAMmer]

This definitely can be done. I literally just finished my PhD (in chem/applied math) in January and will be matriculating this summer. If you have any questions about it, let me know.

I think I read that as nontrads, it's perfectly fine to take some of the science courses as CCs since we have a lot more financial responsibilities than traditional students so doing them at non-CC's is generally much harder so we get a lot of leeway. Personally, I'd either take a class while finishing your PhD (I took math courses when doing mine), or just do them during the year after you finish your thesis. You just need to have them done by the time you matriculate, not apply.

 

[at_pitt]

Can be done - with lots of hard work, dedication and family support (just had my wife's support ).

I wanted to pursue medical school in my 2nd year of PhD. My mentor heard this and went crazy, so had to change my lab. Then I joined another lab, finished my PhD (Pharmacology) in a focused manner. In my last year, I again proposed to my mentor that I plan to go to med school. My mentor shot down the idea - prolly mentor was worried that I'd take away time from research. Moreover, I did not have many pre-reqs. Anyway, finished my PhD and joined postdoc. Within 1 year of postdoc, I started pre-req courses at a nearby university (morning and evening classes 2 courses per semester). Also took MCAT in June 2017 - I know super late! Prepared my applications and submitted around mid- September.

My main focus was DO schools as I appreciate their holistic approach towards patient care. Interviewed and accepted. Starting med school soon.

 

[AA1212]

It definitely can be done if that's your passion but you have to be very strategic & dedicated to your plans.

From personal experience, I recently finished my PhD in December and thinking about doing a 1-year post-doc at a medical school before entering a SMP in Fall 2019 (less than stellar undergraduate grades & missing 1 year of organic). Planning to hopefully matriculate Fall 2020.

I have come across a handful of PhD to MDs and they all the said the same thing about going this route (probably has been highlighted before on this forum):

1) It is the hardest & most expensive route
2) You will most likely be questioned during your medical school interview why after spending so much time in your PhD do you want to pursue your MD degree
3) You may not see the financial gain now but this route like other graduate school degrees is about delayed gratification and will pay-off in the long run
4) It is a marathon not a race

One of the PhDs to MDs I met did a PhD, a four year post doc, med school, and now is in neurosurgery residency (prob going to be around mid-40s when he is deemed an attending), so age as they say is just a number.

Hopefully this helped your perspective out a little bit and good luck!

 

[PipetteDreams]

Seeing as it doesn't sound like you have institutional support to take your classes through your current University, community college (or other local college) may be your best bet.

I am about to matriculate this fall. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions. I'm also happy to share my personal statement with you, so you can see how I used my PhD in my personal statement. You'll definitely want to make it say "I have a plan, and this is how everything I'm doing works towards that plan," rather than "I realized being a lab rat my whole life and fighting for tenure/R01s was not for me."

Also, my boss gave me 3-4 weeks to study for my MCAT. She was incredible. If you can swing that, I'm happy to share my strategy.

Lastly - you said "medical school would round-out my knowledge and improve my ability to recognize patterns." Admissions committees will not be pleased if you're using one of their spots so that you can become a more dynamic researcher (who uses patients as an improved model system for your experiments). This was one perception I fought against my whole application cycle, and I anticipate you will, too.

Good luck!!

 

[at_pitt]

The first thing really to get the admissions to look at your application is to get a decent MCAT score, good GPA and all-pre-reqs. A lot of schools say dont have cut offs, but they do (practically speaking). The softwares screen applicants on the basis of cut offs. I received a couple of automatic emails that I was disqualified due to confusion over coursework and then had to call admissions to correct it.

Even after clearing through all the screening steps, the application is then probably screened by the selection committee - mix of PhDs and MDs/DOs. This is really tricky. MDs are more open minded than PhDs at this stage (personal experience). However, PhDs have this mental block where they can't over the fact that someone with a PhD degree wants to go to medical school. Either it is ignorance, ego or stupidity - dont really know. But that's really tough to break through. Too stellar application with research background is a big NO NO. Lot of factors such as funding, maintaining a specific stats on student diversity, personal/professional bias, volunteering/health related community based activities, shadowing - and so much more plays a role in the decision even to send an invite for interview.

Agreed that this is the hardest route - prolly also the most expensive. But these are additional challenges to overcome as well. Talk to admission offices - check out their student composition. Some schools take PhDs, others do not prefer non-traditional candidates. Almost all schools want your application fee - and also your application to boost their applicant number. So, doing an initial research and picking out the right list of schools is critical for success.

Earlier, DO schools were a bit easier to get into. However that has changed (there are always exceptions even in MD schools ). Since the residency match programs are gonna combine in 2020, DO schools have been flooded with applications.

Smart thing to do:

1. Get a damn good score on MCAT
2. Get good GPA
3. Volunteer if you can (very important)
4. Leadership roles
5. Compelling essays - why do you want to transition to MD/DO from PhD
6. Meet with the admissions office folks in advance
7. Shadow physicians
8. APPLY EARLY - this is really really important.
9. STAY FOCUSED
10. Believe in yourself - the gratification of helping someone directly (as opposed to indirectly= working in the lab) is priceless.

And on top of that - keep that PhD or postdoc mentor of yours happy. Because you need your PhD degree on time. ;-)

 

[Goro]

OP, you don't need med school to accomplish your career aims. Your reasons are, in fact, lousy ones to go to med school.

 

[PipetteDreams]

OP, you don't need med school to accomplish your career aims. Your reasons are, in fact, lousy ones to go to med school.

Agreed. I gave OP benefit of the doubt, hoping that underpinning their desire be involved in clinical research, there was a greater need to help people by directly working with patients.

 

[neuroguy101]

OP, you don't need med school to accomplish your career aims. Your reasons are, in fact, lousy ones to go to med school.

PipetteDreams is correct - working directly with patients is still of high importance. As I mentioned, my doctoral degree is in a clinical program so I see my fair share of patients in both clinical and research settings, not merely clinical research settings. My stated reasons were merely a simplistic representation of my perceived need for medical school education for the sake of providing context to my actual question. My research is generally clinical, with some pre-clinical mouse work - career goals being aspirational to say the least - and to work clinically with the population in which I am interested, specifically in emergency settings, would be incredibly beneficial in both practical and personal domains. I could accomplish my research aims as a practicing MD with the crucial knowledge obtained through my current doctoral program. Ultimately, patients would benefit clinically and the field of assessment and ED test development would also be improved upon. Part of this is my belief that one must understand the clinical aspect if human research is to take all factors into account.

I'm confident that I can successfully illustrate this desire through my apps and have received positive feedback from MD/PhD and MD mentors, many of whom spend 80% of their time applying for grants (high-quality labs/settings), and somewhat less optimism from PhD-only mentors, regarding my specific reasons due to my research goals - if I am forced to place value judgments on their statements. I work with each of these professional populations and while many of these individuals do not necessarily need any further knowledge to conduct their current research, this is certainly a context- and education-based question that cannot be generalized to all areas of research.