Fuller Theological Seminary PsyD Program

[CaliforniaPsyD]

help, please! I'm trying to narrow down my PsyD program choices before the April 15th deadline and I thought I would get the opinion of you internet experts who may have some light to shine on what I beleive is my ideal program... I am really leaning towards Fuller Theological Seminary's PsyD program in Pasadena. Does anyone have any more information or qualified opinions on this school (besides cost, please! I've sorted that aspect)?

Specifically, I am hoping to get some more information about these topics:

APA match rates and placement sites: what was the most recent match rate for Fuller PsyD students to APA-accredited internships (this year)? Does anyone know any specific APA placements students acheived?

Comprehensive exams: when do these exams take place, what is their format, and what preparation is offered/available?

Practicum experiences: Does anyone know specifics about what practicum expereinces are available for PsyD students besides the on campus FPFS clinic?

Course options: I have found a description of the courses offered Spring 2016 on Moodle, but I am hoping to find a more extensive listing and description of courses that satisfy each of Fuller's PsyD requirements.

Thank you so much for your help, any information about Fuller would be so appreciated.

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[erg923]

help, please! I'm trying to narrow down my PsyD program choices before the April 15th deadline and I thought I would get the opinion of you internet experts who may have some light to shine on what I beleive is my ideal program... I am really leaning towards Fuller Theological Seminary's PsyD program in Pasadena. Does anyone have any more information or qualified opinions on this school (besides cost, please! I've sorted that aspect)?

Specifically, I am hoping to get some more information about these topics:

APA match rates and placement sites: what was the most recent match rate for Fuller PsyD students to APA-accredited internships (this year)? Does anyone know any specific APA placements students acheived?

Comprehensive exams: when do these exams take place, what is their format, and what preparation is offered/available?

Practicum experiences: Does anyone know specifics about what practicum expereinces are available for PsyD students besides the on campus FPFS clinic?

Course options: I have found a description of the courses offered Spring 2016 on Moodle, but I am hoping to find a more extensive listing and description of courses that satisfy each of Fuller's PsyD requirements.

Thank you so much for your help, any information about Fuller would be so appreciated.

1. This should be provide on their website and if not you can look it up via APPICs website

2. Is this really a criteria for program selection for you? Why?

3. Didn't you ask this when you interviewed and/or was it not provided by faculty at the interview? Did you not get to meet with any of the current grad students to discuss this? If not, seems like a red flag to me.

4. program website? University online course catalogue?

 

[WisNeuro]

I'd be more concerned about the huge debt load and poor match rates than anything else.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Their APA-acred match rate has ranged from 15%-45%, per their outcomes data; that is really bad. Also, $35k+ /yr in tuition..,plus high cost of living, etc.

 

[WisNeuro]

Their APA-acred match rate has ranged from 15%-45%, per their outcomes data; that is really bad. Also, $35k+ /yr in tuition..,plus high cost of living, etc.

Mean number of years recently to finish is 6+, 6x35k = 210,000 for tuition alone. Who know how much more for cost of living, add on more time if you don't match and want to wait another year for an accredited position. Yikes.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

I'd be more concerned about the huge debt load and poor match rates than anything else.

Thanks for your reply, WisNeuro. Like I said I have prepared for the cost so that is not an issue for me, luckily. Their match rates are 50-60% according to their APA published stats, so I am not sure why that would be a concern since I have no doubt I will be in the 50-60% of students with the required grades, relavent and high amount of practicum experience, good interviews/references, etc...not to mention that I will be able to move anywhere in the country so location will not limit where I can apply. I already have many research publications, presentations, and experience on my CV and will continue to add to this in grad school so I don't mind if half the students don't get an APA internship since they likely have different amounts of experience or other factors I am not facing (like having a family they need to stay near so only being able to apply locally...LA being one of the most competitive areas to obtain an internship in). If I am missing something here in what is required to attain an APA internship then please enlighten me since it could be an important deciding factor.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

T

Mean number of years recently to finish is 6+, 6x35k = 210,000 for tuition alone. Who know how much more for cost of living, add on more time if you don't match and want to wait another year for an accredited position. Yikes.

That's okay actually, I've got the cost covered so it's everything else I'd like to focus on that could help me make up my mind thanks!

 

[WisNeuro]

Their match rates are 50-60% according to their APA published stats, so I am not sure why that would be a concern since I have no doubt I will be in the 50-60% of students with the required grades.

The APPIC stats for APA accredited internships have actually been 25-71% And, I'm sure all of the students think they'll be in that 25-71 that match.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

1. This should be provide on their website and if not you can look it up via APPICs website

2. Is this really a criteria for program selection for you? Why?

3. Didn't you ask this when you interviewed and/or was it not provided by faculty at the interview? Did you not get to meet with any of the current grad students to discuss this? If not, seems like a red flag to me.

4. program website? University online course catalogue?

1. While they do have to provide this each year they haven't updated 2016's data yet so I'm hoping someone may know. Can you show me where APPIC's website shows Fuller's APA match rates for this year...I couldn't find the data.

2. It's a question I'd like answered, yes. A lot of the schools I looked at, all APA accredited, don't have a great support network for students from the faculty. This was most apparent when students described their experiences preparing for cumulative exams and having no guidance with preparing. I also just want to know more about what to expect before I pick a school so if you know more than me on this issue please let me know!

3. Yes again, but a list or some more detailed descriptions of any site options would be really helpful. Did you go to Fuller or know someone who does to shine some light on their practicum options?

4. THANK YOU! I cannot describe how much you helped me with this one. Obviously I went through everthing on their clinical psychology website but when I googled the actual phrase you used it took me to a seperate website with course descriptions. Thank you thank you erg923.

 

[Ardor]

Didn't you just post a thread about PGSP-Stanford vs. Fuller and nobody recommended you choose Fuller? This thread feels like a bit of confirmation bias rather than actual info seeking.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Their match rates are 50-60% according to their APA published stats, so I am not sure why that would be a concern since I have no doubt I will be in the 50-60% of students...

Most/all of your classmates are going to be accustomed to being a top student, so the competition is very different than most undergrad experiences. Everyone believes they will be the exception to the rule, particularly in grad school.

If I am missing something here in what is required to attain an APA internship then please enlighten me since it could be an important deciding factor.

The competition is steep and keeps increasing. There are efforts to require APA-acred only training, which will further squeeze marginal and poor programs. Fuller is not competitive nationally.

 

[smalltownpsych]

I would be concerned about getting good practicum placements when you have to compete with more respected programs in that same geographical area. Socal is where my program was and it was highly competitive and my program had a good rep which led to good placements which leads to APA match which leads to good job opportunities.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I know one or two folks who attended Fuller and may be able to ask about some of the specifics. Didn't hear them talk about their cumulative exams, but I know they completed experimental dissertations. I also know the ones who attained accredited internships secured practica at sites outside Fuller, I believe through their own networking. I might be able to double check on that as well.

 

[hamsterpants]

Didn't you just post a thread about PGSP-Stanford vs. Fuller and nobody recommended you choose Fuller? This thread feels like a bit of confirmation bias rather than actual info seeking.

Ding. Ding. Ding. I would go to Fuller since you are working very hard to make it an attractive option.

 

[hamsterpants]

1. While they do have to provide this each year they haven't updated 2016's data yet so I'm hoping someone may know. Can you show me where APPIC's website shows Fuller's APA match rates for this year...I couldn't find the data.

2. It's a question I'd like answered, yes. A lot of the schools I looked at, all APA accredited, don't have a great support network for students from the faculty. This was most apparent when students described their experiences preparing for cumulative exams and having no guidance with preparing. I also just want to know more about what to expect before I pick a school so if you know more than me on this issue please let me know!

3. Yes again, but a list or some more detailed descriptions of any site options would be really helpful. Did you go to Fuller or know someone who does to shine some light on their practicum options?

4. THANK YOU! I cannot describe how much you helped me with this one. Obviously I went through everthing on their clinical psychology website but when I googled the actual phrase you used it took me to a seperate website with course descriptions. Thank you thank you erg923.

Can you speak with any of the grad students you interviewed with? A reputable school should offer students you can speak with during this decision period. I often have convos with those who are weighing offers between my school and another option.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

I know one or two folks who attended Fuller and may be able to ask about some of the specifics. Didn't hear them talk about their cumulative exams, but I know they completed experimental dissertations. I also know the ones who attained accredited internships secured practica at sites outside Fuller, I believe through their own networking. I might be able to double check on that as well.

I can't thank you enough for putting in that effort to help me out, I really appreciate it and that information would be so beneficial.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

Can you speak with any of the grad students you interviewed with? A reputable school should offer students you can speak with during this decision period. I often have convos with those who are weighing offers between my school and another option.

I've emailed the school to get some current students' emails/contact information but in the mean time I thought I should open it up to the wise people sometimes found on here in case it takes them a few days to get back to me/to get additional opinions.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

I am,

Ding. Ding. Ding. I would go to Fuller since you are working very hard to make it an attractive option.

definitely, but I don't want to make my decision and then learn something negative about the school I had overooked. I'm determined to do a thorough search of all the information before I attend but my heart is definitely with Fuller...just want to make sure it is the practical choice as well. I got into PGSP-Stanford which is nationally ranked much higher but I think my quality of life will be, completely personally, so much higher in LA not to mention that it is 20K cheaper and SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper to live in LA suburbs than San Francisco where I would end up if I attended PGSP.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

Most/all of your classmates are going to be accustomed to being a top student, so the competition is very different than most undergrad experiences. Everyone believes they will be the exception to the rule, particularly in grad school.



The competition is steep and keeps increasing. There are efforts to require APA-acred only training, which will further squeeze marginal and poor programs. Fuller is not competitive nationally.

Would how competitive it is nationally be an issue for anything other than attaining that APA internship? I plan to continue to buld my already significant network in PAsadena and eventually set up private practice there.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

I would be concerned about getting good practicum placements when you have to compete with more respected programs in that same geographical area. Socal is where my program was and it was highly competitive and my program had a good rep which led to good placements which leads to APA match which leads to good job opportunities.

Exactly. That's why I am looking for more information about Fuller's practicum sites. I want to know which sites they have these connections with so I know where my guaranteed options are versus my "reach" practicums, etc. Its on campus clinic I would be guaranteed to work at for 1 year is impressive, so that leaves 3 other practicums I need to choose/be accepted into out of its total of 60 in the LA area.

 

[erg923]

I plan to continue to buld my already significant network in PAsadena and eventually set up private practice there.

You and how many hundreds others.

Search the yellow pages and count the amount of psychologists within a 30 square mile area of Pasadena.

Taking insurance will allow you access to larger pop. Prepare to work many unpaid hours. Prepare to be poor if you only want to work 40/hours week.. Cash/fee for service restricts pop access. Prepare to compete with those much more established than you. Prepare to work ALOT.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

Didn't you just post a thread about PGSP-Stanford vs. Fuller and nobody recommended you choose Fuller? This thread feels like a bit of confirmation bias rather than actual info seeking.

Since that thread descended into a totally pro-Stanford discussion, I started this one to specifically target information about Fuller - instead of comparing the two, since my last thread didn't help me learn anyting about Fuller.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Would how competitive it is nationally be an issue for anything other than attaining that APA internship? I plan to continue to buld my already significant network in Pasadena and eventually set up private practice there.

1. Securing an APA-acred internship is very important, as it is needed to get licensed. In CA you can get a license right now w/o APA-acred, but there is a push to req. APA-acred.
2. Being competitive for post-doc is also important, as it is req to get licensed.
3. You are competing w. grads from UCLA, Stanford, and other great programs, so name still matters. Eventually it matters less, but it matters more when you are fresh out.

 

[erg923]

1. While they do have to provide this each year they haven't updated 2016's data yet so I'm hoping someone may know. Can you show me where APPIC's website shows Fuller's APA match rates for this year...I couldn't find the data.

2. It's a question I'd like answered, yes. A lot of the schools I looked at, all APA accredited, don't have a great support network for students from the faculty. This was most apparent when students described their experiences preparing for cumulative exams and having no guidance with preparing. I also just want to know more about what to expect before I pick a school so if you know more than me on this issue please let me know!

3. Yes again, but a list or some more detailed descriptions of any site options would be really helpful. Did you go to Fuller or know someone who does to shine some light on their practicum options?

4. THANK YOU! I cannot describe how much you helped me with this one. Obviously I went through everthing on their clinical psychology website but when I googled the actual phrase you used it took me to a seperate website with course descriptions. Thank you thank you erg923.

No. I didnt attend fuller. Ive never heard of it, actually.

What type of "support" are you looking for from faculty re: comps/quals? My faculty weren't discouraging in anyway, but comps are my job/responsibility, no one else's. The process was clear. We used the skills and knowledge gained over the course our training. This isnt undergrad. Faculty do not make study guides and hold after close test prep sessions. I hope you aren't looking for such a thing.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

You and how many hundreds others.

Search the yellow pages and count the amount of psychologist within a 30 square mile area of Pasadena.

Insurance will allow you access to larger pop. Prepare to work many unpaid hours Prepare to be poor if you only want to work 40/hours week.. Cash/fee for service restricts pop access. Prepare to compete with those much more established than you. Prepare to work ALOT.

You and how many hundreds others.

Search the yellow pages and count the amount of psychologists within a 30 square mile area of Pasadena.

Insurance will allow you access to larger pop. Prepare to work many unpaid hours Prepare to be poor if you only want to work 40/hours week.. Cash/fee for service restricts pop access. Prepare to compete with those much more established than you. Prepare to work ALOT.

Can you explain that a bit since it goes against everything the psychologists in Pasadena I have worked with have said? And my mentors in the field who are familiar with both schools. If you have any experience being a clinical psychologist in Pasadena I would appreciate your advice. This is so different to everything I've heard so I would like more details please to judge whether it is true that, as you say, I should go to a higher nationally ranked school to avoid all the misery you describe wheras if I go to Fuller then long unpaid hours and insurance battles are certainly my future.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

No. I didnt attend fuller. Ive never heard of it, actually.

What type of "support" are you looking for from faculty re: comps/quals? My faculty weren't discouraging in anyway, but comps are my job/responsibility, no one else's. The process was clear. We used the skills and knowledge gained over the course our training. This isnt undergrad. Faculty to not make study guides and hold after close test prep sessions. I hope you aren't looking for such a thing.

No just looking for all the information I can get on the school before I choose it. They haven't mentioned these tests and Stanford highlighted the importance of them so I decided to look into Fuller's. So can you please show me where APPIC's website shows Fuller's APA match rates for this year...I couldn't find the data you referred to.

 

[erg923]

Can you explain that a bit since it goes against everything the psychologists in Pasadena I have worked with have said? And my mentors in the field who are familiar with both schools. If you have any experience being a clinical psychologist in Pasadena I would appreciate your advice. This is so different to everything I've heard so I would like more details please to judge whether it is true that, as you say, I should go to a higher nationally ranked school to avoid all the misery you describe wheras if I go to Fuller then long unpaid hours and insurance battles are certainly my future.

What have you heard? That patients always show, no one works over 40/hours, carriers pays $200/hour for therapy, all your work hours are somehow billable, and most practice groups offer retirement plans and paid time off for their associates?

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

1. Securing an APA-acred internship is very important, as it is needed to get licensed. In CA you can get a license right now w/o APA-acred, but there is a push to req. APA-acred.
2. Being competitive for post-doc is also important, as it is req to get licensed.
3. You are competing w. grads from UCLA, Stanford, and other great programs, so name still matters. Eventually it matters less, but it matters more when you are fresh out.

Thanks, that makes sense. If the worst was to happen and I didn't get an APA internship, is it true I can stay at the grad school another year and reapply the next year? What would I spend that year doing - additional practicum/research to build my CV more? Is this a common practice for people who get turned down in their first round and are determined to attain an APA internship? Also you mention UCLA, but they don't have a PsyD program. Do some APA internships accept both PsyD and PhD students for the same position and expect the two schools of psychology to compete?

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

Thanks, that makes sense. If the worst was to happen and I didn't get an APA internship, is it true I can stay at the grad school another year and reapply the next year? What would I spend that year doing - additional practicum/research to build my CV more? Is this a common practice for people who get turned down in their first round and are determined to attain an APA internship? Also you mention UCLA, but they don't have a PsyD program. Do some APA internships accept both PsyD and PhD students for the same position and expect the two schools of psychology to compete?

Ah sorry, you meant for jobs post-grad didn't you? I see how that could be detrimental if my competition for a post-doc or job all come from big name schools.

 

[erg923]

Thanks, that makes sense. If the worst was to happen and I didn't get an APA internship, is it true I can stay at the grad school another year and reapply the next year? What would I spend that year doing - additional practicum/research to build my CV more? Is this a common practice for people who get turned down in their first round and are determined to attain an APA internship? Also you mention UCLA, but they don't have a PsyD program. Do some APA internships accept both PsyD and PhD students for the same position and expect the two schools of psychology to compete?

Another year of delayed earnings, loan interest (assuming you are taking a crazy amount of loans) and paying Fuller money for registering for practicum, awesome!

Most internships will accept both. Some prefer Ph.Ds. Some only accept Ph.Ds.

 

[smalltownpsych]

If you have solid connections in the LA area, you can be successful. There are hundreds of psychologists, but there are hundreds of 1000s of people. The key is networking and marketing yourself and finding an effective niche. All of my contacts in the area seem to be doing well, but of course, I olny hang out with the ones who are successful so a bit of a sample bias there.

 

[erg923]

If you have solid connections in the LA area, you can be successful. There are hundreds of psychologists, but there are hundreds of 1000s of people. The key is networking and marketing yourself and finding an effective niche. All of my contacts in the area seem to be doing well, but of course, I olny hang out with the ones who are successful so a bit of a sample bias there.

I didn't say they couldn't be successful at that goal though. I said they should be prepared to work alot and hard. If they are Joe Smoe psychologist working 9-5 and accepting primarily medicaid and com insurance, they will not be amongst what I would call "successful" by Pasadena/SoCal standards

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

Another year of delayed earnings, loan interest (assuming you are taking a crazy amount of loans) and paying Fuller money for registering for practicum, awesome!

Most internships will accept both. Some prefer Ph.Ds. Some only accept Ph.Ds.

Thanks for your input but I'm asking about what I would spend that year doing academically/professionally not how it would affect me financially.

 

[erg923]

but I'm asking about what I would spend that year doing academically/professionally

I just told you. You would register for another practicum.... and pay Fuller money for it.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

I didn't say they couldn't be successful at that goal though. I said they should be prepared to work alot and hard. If they are Joe Smoe psychologist working 9-5 and accepting primarily medicaid and com insurance, they will not be amongst what I would call "successful" by Padadena/SoCal standards

Right but working 9-5 in private practice accepting primarily medicaid and com insurance is not my plan at all. I'm here to get information on Fuller specifically and you said you've never heard of it but if you know of anyone who has I would appreciate you putting me in contact.

 

[erg923]

Right but working 9-5 in private practice accepting primarily medicaid and com insurance is not my plan at all. I'm here to get information on Fuller specifically and you said you've never heard of it but if you know of anyone who has I would appreciate you putting me in contact.

There's nothing wring with working 9-5. My wife and kids appreciate it. So do our cats.

 

[CaliforniaPsyD]

If you have solid connections in the LA area, you can be successful. There are hundreds of psychologists, but there are hundreds of 1000s of people. The key is networking and marketing yourself and finding an effective niche. All of my contacts in the area seem to be doing well, but of course, I olny hang out with the ones who are successful so a bit of a sample bias there.

Ha, your bias is understandable. And what you're saying makes sense. I'm lucky that I have spent years working hard and it has paid off - I have developed a strong network and my mentors help me a lot with further networking, work opportunities, and marketing as you discussed. The effective niche is something I plan to narrow down during grad school as I pick a specialty from my varied and multiple interests. All I know now is it will be adults and the psychopathologies that have most interested me so far are PTSD, depression, anxiety...actually there are so many I've developed from all my internships to date that I'd be thrilled with the majority of practicum options. I might like to work with veterans, though my ultimate goal is to split my time between private practice and liasing with a hospital in some capacity, not to work full time at a VA. I have a lot of narrowing down to do in terms of my interests.

 

[MCParent]

Ha, your bias is understandable. And what you're saying makes sense. I'm lucky that I have spent years working hard and it has paid off - I have developed a strong network and my mentors help me a lot with further networking, work opportunities, and marketing as you discussed. The effective niche is something I plan to narrow down during grad school as I pick a specialty from my varied and multiple interests. All I know now is it will be adults and the psychopathologies that have most interested me so far are PTSD, depression, anxiety...actually there are so many I've developed from all my internships to date that I'd be thrilled with the majority of practicum options. I might like to work with veterans, though my ultimate goal is to split my time between private practice and liasing with a hospital in some capacity, not to work full time at a VA. I have a lot of narrowing down to do in terms of my interests.

The reason people are disagreeing with you is because we've all heard exactly the same thing from many, many students who go on to find that the rainbow bridge they expected did not materialize.

 

[Okazaki Frag Grenade]

I didn't read your other post so I'm sorry if you addressed this, but are you open/in favor of their religious integration?

 

[mlwg1]

The reason people are disagreeing with you is because we've all heard exactly the same thing from many, many students who go on to find that the rainbow bridge they expected did not materialize.

Plus you need to factor in that even students who do all the right things (go to funded PhD programs, author multiple papers, attain well-regarded externships) occasionally don't match. AKA yours truly- I matched for internship on the second try. Going to a poorly regarded program only makes the road that much more difficult.

 

[Peacemaker36]

If you have good mentors in the area, I would consult them and stay off SDN while you're making your decision. Especially if you have your heart set on Fuller. Unless, are your mentors giving you advice that you aren't trusting?

 

[PsyDr]

Just to clarify: you want advice but don't want to hear anything negative about your plan?

 

[smalltownpsych]

I didn't say they couldn't be successful at that goal though. I said they should be prepared to work alot and hard. If they are Joe Smoe psychologist working 9-5 and accepting primarily medicaid and com insurance, they will not be amongst what I would call "successful" by Pasadena/SoCal standards

In a competitive market, you sink or swim. That's for sure. Even on a smaller scale I compete with many therapists and counselors. Generating and converting referrals is a never ending task. Some are content with limping along with 10 to 15 hours a week of billing. They make about 50k doing that. So maybe it's not really that hard, you just have to set your sights low. Overhead in this job is pretty low so there are far too many in that category.

 

[erg923]

In a competitive market, you sink or swim. That's for sure. Even on a smaller scale I compete with many therapists and counselors. Generating and converting referrals is a never ending task. Some are content with limping along with 10 to 15 hours a week of billing. They make about 50k doing that. So maybe it's not really that hard, you just have to set your sights low. Overhead in this job is pretty low so there are far too many in that category.

I, like always, just want people to realize total compensation vs just the money. Making 50K in private practice is much different making 50K working for an employer, who is pouring money into retirement accounts, paid time off, insurance (medical and life), not to mention they cover all your overhead cost of doing business.

 

[MCParent]

Especially if you have your heart set on Fuller.

I think someone should call into the Dave Ramsay show and see what he says about this. I have a guess.

 

[smalltownpsych]

I, like always, just want people to realize total compensation vs just the money. Making 50K in private practice is much different making 50K working for an employer, who is pouring money into retirement accounts, paid time off, insurance (medical and life), not to mention they cover all your overhead cost of doing business.

That would be helpful information except that it relies on the person who pays 250k for their degree at a low match program having good business sense. Might want to subtract the over 1k a month in student loan payments from that figure too.

 

[erg923]

That would be helpful information except that it relies on the person who pays 250k for their degree at a low match program having good business sense. Might want to subtract the over 1k a month in student loan payments from that figure too.

VA gives loan repayment.

 

[WisNeuro]

VA gives loan repayment.

At some sites, not universally.

 

[MCParent]

That would be helpful information except that it relies on the person who pays 250k for their degree at a low match program having good business sense. Might want to subtract the over 1k a month in student loan payments from that figure too.

Yeah..... sometimes people post about the expensive schools saying "I've got the money handled." Really? You're rich? Because rich people don't get rich by blowing a quarter million....

 

[boomshakalaka]

Although this is anecdotal, Fuller PhD students are often more competitive than their PsyD counterparts. I want to also say their PsyD cohorts are huge. Also keep in mind that you will have to take courses toward a M.Div. In the LA Area, whether you get an APA internship or not is also very dependent on the types of practicum sites you train at. Training at one of the local VAs (LB, Sepulveda, Downtown, Loma Linda), UCLA Semel, Cedars, Patton, or other "big name" sites are your best bet. However, these sites are among the most competitive in an area with 11ty psychology programs. Given how many psychologists are in the LA/Pasadena/IE area it is VERY easy for students to settle by doing practicums at small, local CMHs or private practices. While this might meet degree requirements, you will be sorely disappointed come internship time when no one has heard of "Joe Pepitone's Pasadena Psychological Services."