Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention

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Hey @Goro a little update:

I'm up to 46 credits of a DIY post-bacc (taking med school pre-reqs) with a 4.0 GPA bringing my AMCAS GPA up to a 3.32 and my BCPM GPA up to a 3.91. I did an EMT class over the summer and passed the NREMT exam (have to file some papers with the state to complete the license). I'm hoping to start working in the ER and on an ambulance. Also still trying to get more volunteer/service hours. I know my GPA is not competitive but it is what it is at this point. If I ace my remaining pre-reqs I think the highest I can get it would be ~3.38. I'm going to focus on doing well on the MCAT. I know I want to do the best that I can, but what should be the minimum I should be aiming for?

I've been reading threads on SDN as well as talking to med school admissions people (people making the decisions on which students to admit) about taking post-bacc courses at a CC vs 4-year institution. I've gotten mixed feedback. I am taking classes at the local CC as they are free for me and it fits better with my work/family responsibilities. How much will this ding me?

I am definitely applying to UIC and SIU and I think SIU might be my best shot as I'm from Central Illinois. What DO programs would you recommend I look at?

Thanks for all that you do here!

 

[Goro]

Hey @Goro a little update:

I'm up to 46 credits of a DIY post-bacc (taking med school pre-reqs) with a 4.0 GPA bringing my AMCAS GPA up to a 3.32 and my BCPM GPA up to a 3.91. I did an EMT class over the summer and passed the NREMT exam (have to file some papers with the state to complete the license). I'm hoping to start working in the ER and on an ambulance. Also still trying to get more volunteer/service hours. I know my GPA is not competitive but it is what it is at this point. If I ace my remaining pre-reqs I think the highest I can get it would be ~3.38. I'm going to focus on doing well on the MCAT. I know I want to do the best that I can, but what should be the minimum I should be aiming for?

I've been reading threads on SDN as well as talking to med school admissions people (people making the decisions on which students to admit) about taking post-bacc courses at a CC vs 4-year institution. I've gotten mixed feedback. I am taking classes at the local CC as they are free for me and it fits better with my work/family responsibilities. How much will this ding me?

I am definitely applying to UIC and SIU and I think SIU might be my best shot as I'm from Central Illinois. What DO programs would you recommend I look at?

Thanks for all that you do here!

You'll be fine. Adcoms understand that people have lives and responsibilities.

I cannot recommend schools without an MCAT score. I don't do hypotheticals

 

[triplejay]

Hi @Goro first time poster here, just looking for some advice.
I am a current senior heading into last semester of undergrad and so far I have a 3.45 cGPA with a progression of 3.38 > 3.4 > 3.59 and a 3.38 sGPA with 3.57 > 3.25 > 3.46, which I know is not the strongest trend and I am certainly aiming to get a stronger senior year. I have a 516 balanced MCAT, but I'm afraid my lack of a strong upward trend is going to hold me back here.
I was thinking of applying this upcoming cycle, but now I'm not sure. I have decent ECs with 500+ hrs clinical experience (EMT, scribe, med assistant), 70 hrs non-clinical (am currently looking for more these couple months), 60 hrs shadowing, and about a yr worth of research in a vascular biology lab with a Journal Club presentation, 1 yr gen chem TA, and 2 yrs fraternity leadership.
Should I be looking at a DIY postbacc or should I apply? I am a NJ resident if that helps.
I have also been advised to apply and also take classes at the same time, and eventually send in fall grades as an update. Would this work too?
Thanks so much!

 

[Goro]

Hi @Goro first time poster here, just looking for some advice.
I am a current senior heading into last semester of undergrad and so far I have a 3.45 cGPA with a progression of 3.38 > 3.4 > 3.59 and a 3.38 sGPA with 3.57 > 3.25 > 3.46, which I know is not the strongest trend and I am certainly aiming to get a stronger senior year. I have a 516 balanced MCAT, but I'm afraid my lack of a strong upward trend is going to hold me back here.
I was thinking of applying this upcoming cycle, but now I'm not sure. I have decent ECs with 500+ hrs clinical experience (EMT, scribe, med assistant), 70 hrs non-clinical (am currently looking for more these couple months), 60 hrs shadowing, and about a yr worth of research in a vascular biology lab with a Journal Club presentation, 1 yr gen chem TA, and 2 yrs fraternity leadership.
Should I be looking at a DIY postbacc or should I apply? I am a NJ resident if that helps.
I have also been advised to apply and also take classes at the same time, and eventually send in fall grades as an update. Would this work too?
Thanks so much!

I think you're fine for any DO school and possibly the New Jersey state schools, but that's it for MD. If you're boning for The latter you're going to need to do the post bacc or special master's program

 

[triplejay]

I think you're fine for any DO school and possibly the New Jersey state schools, but that's it for MD. If you're boning for The latter you're going to need to do the post bacc or special master's program

Ah okay that's what I figured anyways. As for timing, am I borderline enough to warrant a risk to take classes while applying this upcoming cycle and send in fall grades as updates or should I just wait a whole year to take classes and then apply the cycle after this upcoming one (so summer 2021)?
Also, I have read that you consider SMPs as a backdoor into med school. However, I've also seen how they're high risk, high reward and they're more for those with ~3.0 GPAs. Would a SMP be a better choice than a DIY postbacc of upper level science courses? Thanks again so much! Really appreciate it.

 

[Goro]

Ah okay that's what I figured anyways. As for timing, am I borderline enough to warrant a risk to take classes while applying this upcoming cycle and send in fall grades as updates or should I just wait a whole year to take classes and then apply the cycle after this upcoming one (so summer 2021)?
Also, I have read that you consider SMPs as a backdoor into med school. However, I've also seen how they're high risk, high reward and they're more for those with ~3.0 GPAs. Would a SMP be a better choice than a DIY postbacc of upper level science courses? Thanks again so much! Really appreciate it.

For MD schools? I don't a single strong SR year will be enough reinvention.

I lean to the SMP if you're boning for the MD.

 

[Bergamasque]

@Goro I just wanted to thank you for assisting so many of us with our reach dreams.

I have been on an upward trend since the beginning from 1.0,1.5,2.0,2.5,3.0,3.1 and 4.0 last semester. My GPA is currently closer to 2.85. How many semesters of 16 cr. each would I need before I apply to Medical School. Is 3 more semesters (62 total credits) of 3.7+ good enough for a URM (with documented ADHD, if that matters). MCAT AAMC FL1 predicts ~510.

 

[Goro]

@Goro I just wanted to thank you for assisting so many of us with our reach dreams.

I have been on an upward trend since the beginning from 1.0,1.5,2.0,2.5,3.0,3.1 and 4.0 last semester. My GPA is currently closer to 2.85. How many semesters of 16 cr. each would I need before I apply to Medical School. Is 3 more semesters (62 total credits) of 3.7+ good enough for a URM (with documented ADHD, if that matters). MCAT AAMC FL1 predicts ~510.

Yup. Fine trajectory!

 

[ThatguyLeeLee]

Hi Goro.
Greetings from SW Missouri!
I was hoping to get an adcom's perspective on my situation.

So I got out of the military in 2009, started undergrad in 2010. Had no idea what I wanted to do. Started out pretty strong with 4.0 semesters but life happened and education had to go on the back shelf. Here I am 2 semesters away from graduating.

Funny enough, about a year and a half ago when I hit rock bottom is when I decided I was actually really passionate about becoming a doctor. However, I have quite a few Ws on my transcript from trying to make it through multiple semesters but having to completely withdraw. In fact I have 14 of them. To make matters worse my gpa has taken quite a hit.. That being said I have aced the last two semesters and am optimistic about the last two.

If things go according to the plan I will graduate with a 3.3-3.4 cgpa and a 3.2 sgpa. Not very great, I know. I have set aside a dedicated schedule of 4 months to study for the MCAT but I'm worried that even if I did really well on it the combination of a 10+ year long undergrad, amount of Ws, and gpa are going to look fatal to anyone looking at my app.

As an adcom, do you think it's even worth trying at this point or should I just call it what it is and move on? I'll be turning 35 this year and am not opposed to an SMP or postbac.

 

[Raygore]

First post on SDN since I’m at a crossroads.

I’m essentially a career changer/reinvention. My first two years of undergrad were atrocious as I was seeking a degree in accounting since it was what my family pushed me to do. Fast forward 3-4 years I finally caved and came back to school to pursue medical school.

Stats
cGPA ~ 2.5-2.6
sGPA ~ 3.1-3.2

Since restart of school

95 hours at 3.6

Last 60

cGPA -3.67

sGPA -3.7
I am seeking out dual degree programs, as it fits my career goals and emphasizes research.

I have the MCAT planned for May.

I am currently working on applications for PREP programs but am wondering if I should also apply for the 2020 cycle. As a minority in STEM and disadvantaged applicant I know I have additional opportunities for reinvention.

Should I focus on only PREP applications or identify reinvention schools?

Or possibly both, as in the PREP Schools and their med school affiliates?

I really appreciate the input and advice

 

[Goro]

First post on SDN since I’m at a crossroads.

I’m essentially a career changer/reinvention. My first two years of undergrad were atrocious as I was seeking a degree in accounting since it was what my family pushed me to do. Fast forward 3-4 years I finally caved and came back to school to pursue medical school.

Stats
cGPA ~ 2.5-2.6
sGPA ~ 3.1-3.2

Since restart of school

95 hours at 3.6

Last 60

cGPA -3.67

sGPA -3.7
I am seeking out dual degree programs, as it fits my career goals and emphasizes research.

I have the MCAT planned for May.

I am currently working on applications for PREP programs but am wondering if I should also apply for the 2020 cycle. As a minority in STEM and disadvantaged applicant I know I have additional opportunities for reinvention.

Should I focus on only PREP applications or identify reinvention schools?

Or possibly both, as in the PREP Schools and their med school affiliates?

I really appreciate the input and advice

As a career changer, I think that the PREP programs will be the way to go. Pick one that has MCAT prep.

 

[Raygore]

As a career changer, I think that the PREP programs will be the way to go. Pick one that has MCAT prep.

Thank you for the prompt response! I really appreciate the input.

I have spoken with probably 6-7 of the programs and the majority are wanting my MCAT to be completed before the start of the program or my MCAT prep to be done before the start of the program.

Should I hold off on applying for medical schools in the summer 2020 and plan for a gap year or second year of the PREP program?

 

[Goro]

Thank you for the prompt response! I really appreciate the input.

I have spoken with probably 6-7 of the programs and the majority are wanting my MCAT to be completed before the start of the program or my MCAT prep to be done before the start of the program.

Should I hold off on applying for medical schools in the summer 2020 and plan for a gap year or second year of the PREP program?

You apply when you are 100% ready

 

[Gakusei]

Hi @Goro ,

Thank you so much for making this guide! I've noticed that you tend to recommend about about 30 units of science for DIY post bac. Is 30 units a hard minimum? I tried to plan for 30 units total, but fell a bit short. I currently just started the second semester of my DIY post bac at my local state school. I took a full time load each semester, with 25 total science units after this semester. A few courses were prerequisites and the rest are upper division electives. Outside of science, I took a 3 unit non-science class last summer. 4.0 last semester, hopefully 4.0 again this semester. I graduated a few years ago with a sGPA of 3.27 and cGPA of 3.28 (no noticeable increasing trend) in a non-science degree from a T20. If I get a 4.0 this semester, my 25 unit post bac will raise my sGPA to 3.49 and my cGPA to 3.39. I also work part time in a clinical job while going to school.
1) Can I consider myself reinvented with 25 units or do I need to consider another year of school to hit past the 30 unit mark? With my poor undergraduate GPA, is I year of classes good enough to show an increasing trend? I don't particularly want to take a second year of courses as there are not many more science classes available at my post bac school due to impaction. However, I don't want to apply this cycle and waste the effort, time, and money I put into reinvention if 25 units will not be seen as strong enough when applying.
2) Would taking 1-2 more science classes over summer and/or next fall after applying be useful at all to show an increasing GPA trend for this cycle? Or will that really only be beneficial if I reapply?
3) I also have the option of taking a science course during the 1st half of summer session, ending the first week of July. There is only one course offered that is upper division and that I have not taken yet. That would put me at 28 science units. Is it worthwhile to do this and then apply in July? Will it make a noticeable difference? Or will that delay hurt me during the application cycle?
Outside of GPA, my extracurriculars are fairly strong. High number of clinical, volunteering, and research hours. MCAT scheduled for April. I am also CA ORM if that makes a difference. Please let me know your advice. Thank you!

 

[Goro]

Hi @Goro ,

Thank you so much for making this guide! I've noticed that you tend to recommend about about 30 units of science for DIY post bac. Is 30 units a hard minimum? I tried to plan for 30 units total, but fell a bit short. I currently just started the second semester of my DIY post bac at my local state school. I took a full time load each semester, with 25 total science units after this semester. A few courses were prerequisites and the rest are upper division electives. Outside of science, I took a 3 unit non-science class last summer. 4.0 last semester, hopefully 4.0 again this semester. I graduated a few years ago with a sGPA of 3.27 and cGPA of 3.28 (no noticeable increasing trend) in a non-science degree from a T20. If I get a 4.0 this semester, my 25 unit post bac will raise my sGPA to 3.49 and my cGPA to 3.39. I also work part time in a clinical job while going to school.
1) Can I consider myself reinvented with 25 units or do I need to consider another year of school to hit past the 30 unit mark? With my poor undergraduate GPA, is I year of classes good enough to show an increasing trend? I don't particularly want to take a second year of courses as there are not many more science classes available at my post bac school due to impaction. However, I don't want to apply this cycle and waste the effort, time, and money I put into reinvention if 25 units will not be seen as strong enough when applying.
2) Would taking 1-2 more science classes over summer and/or next fall after applying be useful at all to show an increasing GPA trend for this cycle? Or will that really only be beneficial if I reapply?
3) I also have the option of taking a science course during the 1st half of summer session, ending the first week of July. There is only one course offered that is upper division and that I have not taken yet. That would put me at 28 science units. Is it worthwhile to do this and then apply in July? Will it make a noticeable difference? Or will that delay hurt me during the application cycle?
Outside of GPA, my extracurriculars are fairly strong. High number of clinical, volunteering, and research hours. MCAT scheduled for April. I am also CA ORM if that makes a difference. Please let me know your advice. Thank you!

I believe the more that you you can have in your streak of academic reinvention, the better. The 30 hrs for reinvention is my rule of thumb. IF you have a solid SR year prior to your post-bac work, that helps a lot!

 

[uchihastan]

Hi Goro,

I hope all is well. You provided me some great feedback last time we interacted! I have gotten some comments from other SNDers on whether or not an SMP is worth it for me v. DIY post bacc. I will add my stats below again as a refresher + the SMP I applied to. I am at a crossroads because I like the structure an SMP offers, esp. since this one does have a research component, but I am confused on what to do. Thank you in advance!!!

In terms of these courses, I have already completed some of them at GW:

Anatomy
Biochem (C)
Bioinformatics
Biostats (A-)
Cell Bio (B)
Developmental Biology or Embryology
Histology
Immunology
Med Micro OR Bacteriology and/or Virology
Molecular Bio or Genetics (A in molecular bio/C in genetics)
Neuroscience or Neurobiology
Parasitology (if offered)
Pathology
Physiology
Tumor or Cancer Biology (A-)


Again, here is a refresher of my stats:

I am a second semester African American senior interested in applying to medical school but my low GPA has me at a crossroads on how to go about it. I am interested in SMPs. GW in particular as I am a student there. Between the GWU master of science (SMP) and the graduate certificate program, they accept around 30 students. What are my chances? They look at GPAs above 3.0. I am also a senior at GW right now trying to apply ASAP bc its rolling admissions. Here are my stats so far:

Major: biology with concentration in cell and molecular biology
Minor: psychology

• 3.28 cGPA at GW
  • My gpa at my university is 3.28 but that is without the credits I transferred. I took organic chem 1 and 2 at a community college over the summer and got A’s in both therefore my overall GPA is 3.32 is after factoring those in. I am hoping to get my GPA up to a 3.4 by the end of this semester- I am taking 16 credits
  • Also here is my yearly GPA (each just consisting of my grades that academic year):
    • Freshman GPA: 3.3
    • Sophomore GPA: 3.1
    • Junior: 3.36
    • Senior (Fall only): 3.49
• 3.06 sGPA
  • C+ in gen chem 1 and 2, C in biochem, and C in genetics everything else A’s and B’s
• Undergraduate (preclinical) research assistant at my university's medical school for one academic school year
• Learning assistant in an intro biology class for one semester + biology tutor for that same amount of time
• Marketing chair of iGEM as of Fall 2019- our org was created last semester
• Philanthropy chair of AXE (chemistry frat) since Fall 2019, member for 2 years, I also do chemistry tutoring through this organization
• Took a scribe class and did clinicals for a semester
• Taking a theory and research in clinical practice class this semester, will do more clinicals for that class as well--> I will do shifts at hospital + complete a research project with my group

 

[Goro]

Hi Goro,

I hope all is well. You provided me some great feedback last time we interacted! I have gotten some comments from other SNDers on whether or not an SMP is worth it for me v. DIY post bacc. I will add my stats below again as a refresher + the SMP I applied to. I am at a crossroads because I like the structure an SMP offers, esp. since this one does have a research component, but I am confused on what to do. Thank you in advance!!!

Impossible to answer given you have no MCAT score and you're not finished with the program. Did you get a C in the SMP? Not a good sign, but not lethal yet.

 

[wysdoc]

Impossible to answer given you have no MCAT score and you're not finished with the program. Did you get a C in the SMP? Not a good sign, but not lethal yet.

I think the OP is a senior at George Washington and trying to decide whether they need an SMP or not with a 3.28 GPA

 

[Goro]

I think the OP is a senior at George Washington and trying to decide whether they need an SMP or not with a 3.28 GPA

The rising GPA trend is very hopeful.

 

[uchihastan]

Impossible to answer given you have no MCAT score and you're not finished with the program. Did you get a C in the SMP? Not a good sign, but not lethal yet.

I only applied to the SMP I am still a senior in undergrad. Based on my stats I am wondering if an SMP is right for me? I've heard that its a waste of time (which I don't agree with but?), also that unless I get a 3.8 its worthless and other comments such as a DIY would suit me better. I am now confused on what to pursue. I did submit my application to GW's SMP yesterday though!

 

[Goro]

I only applied to the SMP I am still a senior in undergrad. Based on my stats I am wondering if an SMP is right for me? I've heard that its a waste of time (which I don't agree with but?), also that unless I get a 3.8 its worthless and other comments such as a DIY would suit me better. I am now confused on what to pursue. I did submit my application to GW's SMP yesterday though!

I suggest that with a decent MCAT score, try an app cycle, but also apply to an SMP as insurance.

 

[uchihastan]

I think the OP is a senior at George Washington and trying to decide whether they need an SMP or not with a 3.28 GPA

Thank you!!

 

[uchihastan]

I suggest that with a decent MCAT score, try an app cycle, but also apply to an SMP as insurance.

Gotcha, I already applied to an SMP yesterday but if I don't get in I will definitely do that! Thank you!

 

[heyheyMD_223]

Hi Goro,

I plan on only applying to DO school and my SMP school
Here are my stats:
UG cGPA: 2.9
UG sGPA: 2.7
SMP GPA: 3.3 (hard SMP taking medical school courses)

I have another year left in my SMP so I can probably get up to a 3.5 by December 2020. I will be taking my MCAT in June. Is there any MCAT score I can get that would get me into a DO school and if so which? Or am I better off sitting this coming cycle out and applying 2021?

 

[Shotapp]

Is there any MCAT score I can get that would get me into a DO school and if so which?

Do the best that you can...ideally at or above a 505 for DO. That smp gpa ain't look'in too good. Target the new DO schools.

 

[Goro]

Do the best that you can...ideally at or above a 505 for DO. That smp gpa ain't look'in too good. Target the new DO schools.

I agree 100% with my young protege. You wouldn't get much traction at my school, but with a strategic list and a good MCAT score, you should be able to find some love, heyhey.

 

[heyheyMD_223]

I agree 100% with my young protege. You wouldn't get much traction at my school, but with a strategic list and a good MCAT score, you should be able to find some love, heyhey.

What school list would be good with my stats?

 

[Goro]

What school list would be good with my stats?

Finish the SMP, and then come back with an MCAT score. I don't engage in hypotheticals.

 

[heyheyMD_223]

Finish the SMP, and then come back with an MCAT score. I don't engage in hypotheticals.

Would it be dumb to apply this cycle with a 3.3 submitting an app in August? I'm debating between trying a few schools now or if I should just wait until I finish the SMP and apply 21-22 cycle

 

[Goro]

Would it be dumb to apply this cycle with a 3.3 submitting an app in August? I'm debating between trying a few schools now or if I should just wait until I finish the SMP and apply 21-22 cycle

Your 3.3 GPA in the SMP would get you rejected at my school, and all MD.

You apply when you have the best possible app.

 

[L8rg8r]

You apply when you have the best possible app.

With that in mind, should I even consider applying this this upcoming cycle with a 2.98 uGPA (30 credits of 4.0 post-bacc included) and take the MCAT in July, or just forget about applying to medical school and take an SMP/Masters? I need 2 more post-bacc classes to raise uGPA to 3.0.

I was at a medical school symposium last weekend and every single medical school there ranging from Mayo Clinic to my state schools (FL) said that they will definitely consider graduate GPA as long as its in a hard science.

I'm leaning towards a Masters in Nanotechnology since it is offered at my school, and I could potentially get a stipend and continue working in the current lab I do research in. Otherwise I'd have to wait another year to apply to any other grad programs or move elsewhere.

 

[Goro]

With that in mind, should I even consider applying this this upcoming cycle with a 2.98 uGPA (30 credits of 4.0 post-bacc included) and take the MCAT in July, or just forget about applying to medical school and take an SMP/Masters? I need 2 more post-bacc classes to raise uGPA to 3.0.

I was at a medical school symposium last weekend and every single medical school there ranging from Mayo Clinic to my state schools (FL) said that they will definitely consider graduate GPA as long as its in a hard science.

I'm leaning towards a Masters in Nanotechnology since it is offered at my school, and I could potentially get a stipend and continue working in the current lab I do research in. Otherwise I'd have to wait another year to apply to any other grad programs or move elsewhere.

I suggest taking the MCAT and once you get your score, apply. BUT, at the same time, consider applying to a SMP as well.

Despite what you were told, we do not see SDNers with research MS's have much success.

 

[ducks_are _the best]

Does this include a 513+ for URM?

 

[Goro]

Does this include a 513+ for URM?

Nope, but it sure will help!!!

 

[uchihastan]

I suggest that with a decent MCAT score, try an app cycle, but also apply to an SMP as insurance.

Hi Goro,

I hope all is well. I applied to GW's SMP and got waitlisted. I know this is a difficult question to answer, but how high do you think my chances are of getting in? I am nowhere near prepared to take the MCAT anytime soon. I have an opportunity to work at GW hospital as a research assistant (I would interact with patients everyday by enrolling them in our studies and administering surveys). I want to extend my interest for this position ASAP but I cant guarantee my availability until I know the SMP official decision. Any advice? Thank you so much!!

 

[Goro]

Hi Goro,

I hope all is well. I applied to GW's SMP and got waitlisted. I know this is a difficult question to answer, but how high do you think my chances are of getting in? I am nowhere near prepared to take the MCAT anytime soon. I have an opportunity to work at GW hospital as a research assistant (I would interact with patients everyday by enrolling them in our studies and administering surveys). I want to extend my interest for this position ASAP but I cant guarantee my availability until I know the SMP official decision. Any advice? Thank you so much!!

Have no idea. I can't advise on getting into an SMP, just that doing so and doing well will improve your odds of getting into med school.

You are rejected from any program until you hear otherwise. Thus, it's better to go on with your life and plans. Remember, marathon now, not a sprint.

 

[MedHock9608]

Hi! Im a little late to this forum but looking for some advice. I am a Canadian applicant, looking to do MD/DO in the states. My CGPA is low, around a 3.3 with my SGPA, slightly higher. I have a rising trend with my last 3 years 3.65+. I got accepted to Pitt BMP (SMP program) and waiting on Boston MAMS. I have also got acceptances to traditional MSc. programs in Canada with funding due to my research background and upward trend. SMPs are extremely expensive and with the limited medical school options in Canada and most having GPA cut offs 3.6/3.7, I am hoping to gain admission into a MD/DO in the states. Any advice if I should do the SMP despite the cost? will it help? I would work to get the highest gpa I can during it and do as well as I can on the MCAT afterwards (haven't taken it yet, practice scores from before was around 507-509). Or should I stay in Canada and complete the MSc for free essentially and hopefully that helps make me stand out as a graduate for SOME schools?

 

[Goro]

Hi! Im a little late to this forum but looking for some advice. I am a Canadian applicant, looking to do MD/DO in the states. My CGPA is low, around a 3.3 with my SGPA, slightly higher. I have a rising trend with my last 3 years 3.65+. I got accepted to Pitt BMP (SMP program) and waiting on Boston MAMS. I have also got acceptances to traditional MSc. programs in Canada with funding due to my research background and upward trend. SMPs are extremely expensive and with the limited medical school options in Canada and most having GPA cut offs 3.6/3.7, I am hoping to gain admission into a MD/DO in the states. Any advice if I should do the SMP despite the cost? will it help? I would work to get the highest gpa I can during it and do as well as I can on the MCAT afterwards (haven't taken it yet, practice scores from before was around 507-509). Or should I stay in Canada and complete the MSc for free essentially and hopefully that helps make me stand out as a graduate for SOME schools?

Canadian med schools are outside my knowledge base.

For US, do the SMP at a US med school with some sort of linkage. Your best bet on the data here will be with DO.

 

[uchihastan]

Have no idea. I can't advise on getting into an SMP, just that doing so and doing well will improve your odds of getting into med school.

You are rejected from any program until you hear otherwise. Thus, it's better to go on with your life and plans. Remember, marathon now, not a sprint.

Thank you so much!! I will go ahead and move on with other plans!

 

[Vanilla96]

Hi Goro; hope you are staying safe. I have gotten in to multiple SMPs (Toledo, EVMS, NJMS, etc.) with my current stats of 3.3cGPA, 2.8sGPA (very strong upward trends, and final 2 semester of college will be 3.8 and 4.0) and 510 MCAT. The first two of the programs i listed have strong linkages to the respective med school; I am wondering if it would be worth it to apply widely to other MD programs while completing the SMP? I would be applying solely to the schools on your list (and not all of them), + my state (NJ) schools.

 

[Goro]

Hi Goro; hope you are staying safe. I have gotten in to multiple SMPs (Toledo, EVMS, NJMS, etc.) with my current stats of 3.3cGPA, 2.8sGPA and 510 MCAT. The first two of the programs i listed have strong linkages to the respective med school; I am wondering if it would be worth it to apply widely to other MD programs while completing the SMP? I would be applying solely to the schools on your list (and not all of them), + my state (NJ) schools.

It's pointless to apply to MD programs while you are in an SMP because you haven't proved yourself. By the time you apply with a semester of Fall grades (hopefully good ones), it will be too late int he app cycle. No med school will consider you while you simply IN the SMP, you have to pass the audition

Take your time, they're not going anywhere.

 

[RocuROMANium]

@blueflowers122 I had nearly identical stats as you when I graduated a few years ago. I needed 60 credits of 4.0 to get both of my gpa’s to 3.0 so I had about the same credit hours too. I think you should do option 2 because so many schools screen at 3.0. Also, its better to sharpen up your study habits and to discover new studying strategies while in undergrad than throwing yourself into a fire that is an SMP.

Personally, I did option 2, got my gpa’s above 3.0 and I’m currently studying for the MCAT right now and will apply to MS this cycle. An SMP is my absolute last resort.

 

[ndcpjf]

Needing advice right now. So far I've graduated with a 2.99 sGPA, trended from 2.38->2.83->3.15->4.0. I've also got a 514 MCAT 130/130/124/130. Overall I plan to take 12 credit hours of post-bacc which should hopefully bring up my gpa, provided I maintain a 4.0. Is an SMP program a better decision?
I've also got around 1000+ clinical volunteering hours and ~100 non-clinical volunteering hours both with leadership positions, a small summer research publication, 1400 hours of employed clinical work.

Also, does school rank count at all in medical school admission decisions? My undergrad university and post bacc university would probably be considered T20 universities. Any insight is appreciated, thanks.

 

[Shotapp]

Hi @Goro
About to graduate from a 4 year with cGPA 2.7, sGPA 2.31(self calculated) in June. BS Biology. White F, US Citizen, Immigrant from Europe.
Did not take MCAT yet.
Projections show that if I take 55 credits (average 4.0) or 110 credits (average 3.5) my cGPA will rise to 3.0. That will also increase sGPA to ~2.5.
Will retake Pre-Calc (D) and Calc 2 (D) at a CC. Need to take Physics 3 (pre req), maybe at a CC.
Question 1: What is my direction? In what order should I do things?
--- Option 1: Study this summer, take MCAT in the fall, and in the early Winter of this year applying to SMP/Post/Bac Programs hosted by MD/DO schools that accept below 3.0 cGPA. Raise clinical hours (Scribe/EMT/MA) for the next few months. Sometime take Physics 3 at CC with 1 retake of a D course, and an easier science course. Mostly likely have below 3.0 gpa when I apply to SMP/Post-Bacc.
--- Option 2: Start this summer (quarterly acceptance) at a CC "Pre-Health Post-Bacc Record Enhancer" made for pre-meds with low gpa's who already graduated, take high level biology classes until I raise my cGPA to a 3.0. Need 55-110 credits if average is 4.0-3.5. Raise clinical hours with full time job. Take MCAT when cGPA is a 3.0. Afterwards apply to a competitive SMP program with linkage/guaranteed interview where the screen is at cGPA 3.0.

What is the path I should take? What path will increase my chances for MD/DO acceptance? Primary concern is low GPA. I am prepared to fully dedicate myself to "reinvention". I just need direction. Thank you for your time and reading!

Go with option 2. Take upper level sciences and retake pre-reqs you received below Cs in until your cumulative GPA is a 3.0. Do your utmost best to get close to a 4.0 in 55 credit hours (110 will take too long). Take the MCAT when you are absolutely ready (hitting your target scores on AAMC FLs). You've got a long way to go. Take it one day at a time and one step at a time.

Listen to @DT III

 

[Goro]

Needing advice right now. So far I've graduated with a 2.99 sGPA, trended from 2.38->2.83->3.15->4.0. I've also got a 514 MCAT 130/130/124/130. Overall I plan to take 12 credit hours of post-bacc which should hopefully bring up my gpa, provided I maintain a 4.0. Is an SMP program a better decision?
I've also got around 1000+ clinical volunteering hours and ~100 non-clinical volunteering hours both with leadership positions, a small summer research publication, 1400 hours of employed clinical work.

Also, does school rank count at all in medical school admission decisions? My undergrad university and post bacc university would probably be considered T20 universities. Any insight is appreciated, thanks.

I lean to SMP as a the higher risk, but higher reward.

I don't think that school rank will help you all that much.

 

[acslater99]

I understand medical terminology isn’t accepted as sGPA, but under accomas it states every class listed under health sciences accepts as sGPA.

My institution has medical terminology listed under health sciences (HSC4537, to be exact). Would that technically be accepted as sGPA for aacomas?

Thanks

 

[deleted555445]

Are there any institutions that are explicit about highly prioritizing/only looking at most recent x number of credits? Or are reinventor schools mostly determined based on experienced results?

 

[Goro]

Are there any institutions that are explicit about highly prioritizing/only looking at most recent x number of credits? Or are reinventor schools mostly determined based on experienced results?

Wayne State for one. Strongly suggest that you look at Admissions websites, and also the data in MSAR about what % of the class has a graduate degree and/or post bac coursework

 

[deleted555445]

Wayne State for one. Strongly suggest that you look at Admissions websites, and also the data in MSAR about what % of the class has a graduate degree and/or post bac coursework

Thanks!

 

[acslater99]

I understand medical terminology isn’t accepted as sGPA, but under accomas it states every class listed under health sciences accepts as sGPA.

My institution has medical terminology listed under health sciences (HSC4537, to be exact). Would that technically be accepted as sGPA for aacomas?

Thanks

@Goro can you confirm or deny this?

Thank you!