Graduated with low GPA, but I'm ready to to make a comeback. HELP!

[negasi]

I don't want to focus too much on my sob story, but the gist of it was my biggest support system passed away during undergrad and I spiraled. To get straight to the point, I graduated in the spring with a 2.7 GPA, have over hundreds of community service hours, research, and I'm currently a CMA. As a CMA, I also get to scribe and the clinic is actually under my university's med school, so I'm working with providers who also teach and are on the ADCOM (I haven't asked them for any pointers yet, because I'm fairly new and don't want to seem pushy). Anyway, I have been trying to come up with a plan, but it's pretty overwhelming. Please help if you can.

My original plan was to keep working as a CMA, while studying for the GRE and apply to some masters programs. I can fully admit that I am not ready to take the MCAT, so under my impression, I believe that many SMPs won't go for it. I wanted to take some DIY post-bacc courses at the university in the meantime, but many of the pre-reqs that I need are offered during the day, which is impossible for me to do since my work schedule is 8-5. The only option I'm left with is CC. All I've heard from undergrad advisors are that it won't look as good. Since my degree is in psychology, I didn't really need math, so I was going to take trig at the CC, which is prereq for physics. I also wanted to take orgo 1. I did attempt it once during the summer when COVID happened, which caused classes to be online and I dropped it (considering everything that was going on).

Should I still apply for a regular masters program while also doing my prereqs? Should I instead do a DIY postbacc, work in a research lab at a university/CMA/whatever else health related, study for MCAT, then apply for an SMP? I don't want to waste thousands of dollars on a regular MS, when I should have just done a DIY then apply for a SMP. The reason why I listed research lab, because 1. I think it will help me stand out, 2. as a university employee, I can get some courses paid, and 3. I actually loved research. Hopefully, I can work in a lab that does not have a strict 8-5 schedule.

Before undergrad, there was no way I would ever think that I would be in this position, but that's life. I own up to the fact that I simply was not mature enough and I was still finding myself after losing my dad. Anyway, I'm so motivated now and I no longer give in to self doubt. Please help me out in anyway possible. No fluff, I can handle it. Thank you guys!

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[Crayola227]

I think the warnings away from CC courses are overstated.

You want to be sure the CC has a decent rep, that you completely excell in the courses, and that it's obvious from your application why you were at CC (like full time job from 8-5), and you want to follow up CC courses with some upper division science at the uni level, where you also excell.

Couple all that with a solid MCAT, and it won't really matter that you took some courses at the CC.

 

[jhmmd]

DIY post-bacc, invest in a solid MCAT prep course, and knock the MCAT out of the park

 

[Bonne Nuit]

I don't want to focus too much on my sob story, but the gist of it was my biggest support system passed away during undergrad and I spiraled. To get straight to the point, I graduated in the spring with a 2.7 GPA, have over hundreds of community service hours, research, and I'm currently a CMA. As a CMA, I also get to scribe and the clinic is actually under my university's med school, so I'm working with providers who also teach and are on the ADCOM (I haven't asked them for any pointers yet, because I'm fairly new and don't want to seem pushy). Anyway, I have been trying to come up with a plan, but it's pretty overwhelming. Please help if you can.

My original plan was to keep working as a CMA, while studying for the GRE and apply to some masters programs. I can fully admit that I am not ready to take the MCAT, so under my impression, I believe that many SMPs won't go for it. I wanted to take some DIY post-bacc courses at the university in the meantime, but many of the pre-reqs that I need are offered during the day, which is impossible for me to do since my work schedule is 8-5. The only option I'm left with is CC. All I've heard from undergrad advisors are that it won't look as good. Since my degree is in psychology, I didn't really need math, so I was going to take trig at the CC, which is prereq for physics. I also wanted to take orgo 1. I did attempt it once during the summer when COVID happened, which caused classes to be online and I dropped it (considering everything that was going on).

Should I still apply for a regular masters program while also doing my prereqs? Should I instead do a DIY postbacc, work in a research lab at a university/CMA/whatever else health related, study for MCAT, then apply for an SMP? I don't want to waste thousands of dollars on a regular MS, when I should have just done a DIY then apply for a SMP. The reason why I listed research lab, because 1. I think it will help me stand out, 2. as a university employee, I can get some courses paid, and 3. I actually loved research. Hopefully, I can work in a lab that does not have a strict 8-5 schedule.

Before undergrad, there was no way I would ever think that I would be in this position, but that's life. I own up to the fact that I simply was not mature enough and I was still finding myself after losing my dad. Anyway, I'm so motivated now and I no longer give in to self doubt. Please help me out in anyway possible. No fluff, I can handle it. Thank you guys!

My main concern about an SMP for you in the near future is that they're incredibly challenging. We don't have evidence (yet) that you can academically perform at the level required of an SMP. So I think your idea of DIY postbac is a good one. Start slow, build up your academic skills, prove to yourself that you can earn all As, then see where that takes you. If you're breezing through your postbac courses with improved study habits, then an SMP may be a solid option for you.

However, you should be able to take 100% of your remaining prerequisites on a DIY basis and (assuming you have a good MCAT score) be competitive for DO programs without having to do an SMP at all. You have, what, 60ish credits left to take? A 4.0 in ~60 consecutive postbac credits should be enough to demonstrate academic reinvention.

I try steer people away from CC prerequisites, all else being equal, because they're not allowed at some MD programs. But, in your case, I think you have to be very open to DO schools, and from everything I can tell, DO programs are a lot more friendly to CC prerequisites. I don't think it will really matter for your postbac. If CC is all your schedule allows, then that's what you have to do. Obviously, get 4.0s in everything.

Your ECs look great so far, keep it up.

 

[jhmmd]

My main concern about an SMP for you in the near future is that they're incredibly challenging. We don't have evidence (yet) that you can academically perform at the level required of an SMP. So I think your idea of DIY postbac is a good one. Start slow, build up your academic skills, prove to yourself that you can earn all As, then see where that takes you. If you're breezing through your postbac courses with improved study habits, then an SMP may be a solid option for you.

However, you should be able to take 100% of your remaining prerequisites on a DIY basis and (assuming you have a good MCAT score) be competitive for DO programs without having to do an SMP at all. You have, what, 60ish credits left to take? A 4.0 in ~60 consecutive postbac credits should be enough to demonstrate academic reinvention.

I try steer people away from CC prerequisites, all else being equal, because they're not allowed at some MD programs. But, in your case, I think you have to be very open to DO schools, and from everything I can tell, DO programs are a lot more friendly to CC prerequisites. I don't think it will really matter for your postbac. If CC is all your schedule allows, then that's what you have to do. Obviously, get 4.0s in everything.

Your ECs look great so far, keep it up.

I have heard this as well
Good post

 

[Darrow O'Lykos]

If you go the DIY route, understand that you have to complete all of that coursework and have the grades on your transcript prior to applying. AdComs treat projected/future coursework as unrelated to your app since they don't have a letter grade.

I'd personally recommend a SMP if you could get into one. I did the DIY postbacc route and regret it. You're going to spend the money either way, may as well do it through a recognized program. Many SMPs also have guaranteed interviews at their medical school and a pretty high conversion rate, which is a plus. Do some CC pre-reqs while working a job (satisfy the pre-reqs needed for your targeted SMPs of interest), then apply for a SMP.

It'll save you years of heartache.


edit: I also worked in research at a university prior to med school. I made a post a while back regarding my experience applying over 4 years if you want to read it in my signature.

 

[negasi]

I think the warnings away from CC courses are overstated.

You want to be sure the CC has a decent rep, that you completely excell in the courses, and that it's obvious from your application why you were at CC (like full time job from 8-5), and you want to follow up CC courses with some upper division science at the uni level, where you also excell.

Couple all that with a solid MCAT, and it won't really matter that you took some courses at the CC.

Thank you for replying! Yes, I don't plan on taking all of my upper division science courses at a CC, just some of the more "basic" ones. Thanks again!!

 

[negasi]

My main concern about an SMP for you in the near future is that they're incredibly challenging. We don't have evidence (yet) that you can academically perform at the level required of an SMP. So I think your idea of DIY postbac is a good one. Start slow, build up your academic skills, prove to yourself that you can earn all As, then see where that takes you. If you're breezing through your postbac courses with improved study habits, then an SMP may be a solid option for you.

However, you should be able to take 100% of your remaining prerequisites on a DIY basis and (assuming you have a good MCAT score) be competitive for DO programs without having to do an SMP at all. You have, what, 60ish credits left to take? A 4.0 in ~60 consecutive postbac credits should be enough to demonstrate academic reinvention.

I try steer people away from CC prerequisites, all else being equal, because they're not allowed at some MD programs. But, in your case, I think you have to be very open to DO schools, and from everything I can tell, DO programs are a lot more friendly to CC prerequisites. I don't think it will really matter for your postbac. If CC is all your schedule allows, then that's what you have to do. Obviously, get 4.0s in everything.

Your ECs look great so far, keep it up.

Right now, CC is what my schedule allows, but I was hoping maybe by next year, I could find a research posititon. What do you think about that or should I stick with CMA? Being that I have a low GPA, I'm hoping to do something that enhances my application in just the slightest way! I obviously need all the points I can get.

Also, I am super open to DO schools! I'm pretty real with myself haha. Thank you so much for replying!

 

[negasi]

DIY post-bacc, invest in a solid MCAT prep course, and knock the MCAT out of the park

Thank you so much!

 

[negasi]

If you go the DIY route, understand that you have to complete all of that coursework and have the grades on your transcript prior to applying. AdComs treat projected/future coursework as unrelated to your app since they don't have a letter grade.

I'd personally recommend a SMP if you could get into one. I did the DIY postbacc route and regret it. You're going to spend the money either way, may as well do it through a recognized program. Many SMPs also have guaranteed interviews at their medical school and a pretty high conversion rate, which is a plus. Do some CC pre-reqs while working a job (satisfy the pre-reqs needed for your targeted SMPs of interest), then apply for a SMP.

It'll save you years of heartache.


edit: I also worked in research at a university prior to med school. I made a post a while back regarding my experience applying over 4 years if you want to read it in my signature.

Hey! So, I read your post and it's given me a lot of hope. From what I understand, I would be able to show that my past circumstances wouldn't be an issue if I aced a SMP? okay, great! What did the assistant admissions dean have to say about you doing research? Do you feel as though you would have needed it plus the SMP or could you have done without it had you done an SMP? Sorry, if that's confusing. I hope you understand lol

 

[negasi]

@JanetSnakehole If you don't mind, how did you find your study style? I find that it's something I still struggle with to find a study habit that works for me.

 

[Darrow O'Lykos]

Hey! So, I read your post and it's given me a lot of hope. From what I understand, I would be able to show that my past circumstances wouldn't be an issue if I aced a SMP? okay, great! What did the assistant admissions dean have to say about you doing research? Do you feel as though you would have needed it plus the SMP or could you have done without it had you done an SMP? Sorry, if that's confusing. I hope you understand lol

Correct. It's understandable that your personal tragedy in college strongly impacted your academic performance. But they can't accept you on blind faith that you're now a viable commodity without the proof to back it up. You have to show them you can excel in school now and in the future. SMPs are excellent options for people that either need to re-invent their GPA by showing success in a sizeable chunk of recent, rigorous academic coursework, or for those whom change careers and need to suddenly come up with a competitive application in a short timeframe. Either way, admissions committees need to know that an applicant can excel through the rigor of the medical school curriculum, regardless of whether or not they think your past hardships will make you a more empathetic physician.

Ultimately my job in clinical research was the cherry on top of a cake that I didn't have. It would've vaulted me over other applicants had I already shown the same academic achievement. In other words, it was a nice thing to have, but completely unnecessary, especially without the needed high GPA. You can garner a medical school acceptance without it. I will say that my job allowed me to build strong relationships with my clinical mentors, whom wrote my LORs and went up to bat for me when the dean of admissions at my school called them like they do for all applicants they interview. But if I could do it all over again, I'd get myself into a SMP after the first or second year of working after college and just gone that route. My job in clinical research was rewarding and will influence my career, but entirely unnecessary in order to get into medical school.

My understanding of your situation is that you may not currently have the grades needed to get into a SMP (or even the needed pre-reqs). My advice to you would be this:

• Assess how many more classes you need to satisfy the pre-reqs at the SMPs you are considering.
• Enroll in as many of these as you can for the upcoming Spring semester (also, see if there happen to be any offered over the winter semester. Unlikely for science courses, but you never know. Do some digging around.)
• Regarding the above point, only enroll in as many as you feel comfortable while acing all of them. If you truly want to get into med school, your #1 priority hence forth is getting an A/A- in every single class you add to your transcripts moving forward. No excuses. This may require you to leave your job and take out loans. Doing these pre-reqs at a community college should be okay, but check with the SMPs you are interested in. I think CCs are a far more affordable option and the right path for someone in your position as a recent college grad.
• Depending on how you do in the Spring (and if that even gets you to where you need to be with satisfying pre-reqs for a SMP), consider applying to SMPs. Many have application deadlines as late as May for June/July starts. You can indicate to them that you are doing well in your current coursework, and some SMPs may extend conditional acceptances depending on your final grades in the Spring (although that isn't the norm--contact the SMPs in your area. If you can get final grades in before the application deadline passes, do that and then apply.)
• If you get into a SMP starting Summer '22, you're set, and you just need to kill it, and you can hopefully get accepted to your SMP's med school for Summer '23. Even if you don't, you can then apply to med school in Summer '23 with a killer application for EY24.
• If even loading up coursework in the Spring won't get you enough pre-reqs to make it into a SMP, keep working at your job and still do 6-12 hours worth in the Spring and then the Summer. Potentially the Fall as well. You'd then be looking at applying to and being accepted to enroll in a SMP in Summer '23 with the hope of converting to your SMP's med school in the Summer '24. It may sound disheartening to only be starting medical school 2-3 years from now, but I promise you that it's worth it. It took me 4 years of applications and I wish I could have shaved it down to 2 years from college to starting. If you really want this, you'll do the right thing and put in the work to prove it to adcoms. They won't accept you otherwise.

Don't bother with the GRE or a Master's in anything else as it will not suffice for what you need to apply to med school. If you are deficient in BPCM science GPA, a MBA/MPH isn't going to help you. SMP programs will also prepare you for the MCAT which you'd take in the Spring of your SMP in preparation for applying to med school that Summer (if they don't convert you automatically to start that summer).

edit: as much as we'd hope our professional connections would help us at our university of employment to get into their medical school, they absolutely will not help. It would've helped in the past, but Adcoms have changed and strictly do not take into account influences from faculty at their own school (for the most part). Remove that fantasy of working at a med school having any hope of an impact on your application to that med school. Speaking from 5 years experience on that one. It might help my recommendations to know what your state of residence is.

 

[Goro]

I don't want to focus too much on my sob story, but the gist of it was my biggest support system passed away during undergrad and I spiraled. To get straight to the point, I graduated in the spring with a 2.7 GPA, have over hundreds of community service hours, research, and I'm currently a CMA. As a CMA, I also get to scribe and the clinic is actually under my university's med school, so I'm working with providers who also teach and are on the ADCOM (I haven't asked them for any pointers yet, because I'm fairly new and don't want to seem pushy). Anyway, I have been trying to come up with a plan, but it's pretty overwhelming. Please help if you can.

My original plan was to keep working as a CMA, while studying for the GRE and apply to some masters programs. I can fully admit that I am not ready to take the MCAT, so under my impression, I believe that many SMPs won't go for it. I wanted to take some DIY post-bacc courses at the university in the meantime, but many of the pre-reqs that I need are offered during the day, which is impossible for me to do since my work schedule is 8-5. The only option I'm left with is CC. All I've heard from undergrad advisors are that it won't look as good. Since my degree is in psychology, I didn't really need math, so I was going to take trig at the CC, which is prereq for physics. I also wanted to take orgo 1. I did attempt it once during the summer when COVID happened, which caused classes to be online and I dropped it (considering everything that was going on).

Should I still apply for a regular masters program while also doing my prereqs? Should I instead do a DIY postbacc, work in a research lab at a university/CMA/whatever else health related, study for MCAT, then apply for an SMP? I don't want to waste thousands of dollars on a regular MS, when I should have just done a DIY then apply for a SMP. The reason why I listed research lab, because 1. I think it will help me stand out, 2. as a university employee, I can get some courses paid, and 3. I actually loved research. Hopefully, I can work in a lab that does not have a strict 8-5 schedule.

Before undergrad, there was no way I would ever think that I would be in this position, but that's life. I own up to the fact that I simply was not mature enough and I was still finding myself after losing my dad. Anyway, I'm so motivated now and I no longer give in to self doubt. Please help me out in anyway possible. No fluff, I can handle it. Thank you guys!

Read this:

• Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention

 

[Bonne Nuit]

Right now, CC is what my schedule allows, but I was hoping maybe by next year, I could find a research posititon. What do you think about that or should I stick with CMA? Being that I have a low GPA, I'm hoping to do something that enhances my application in just the slightest way! I obviously need all the points I can get.

Also, I am super open to DO schools! I'm pretty real with myself haha. Thank you so much for replying!

You're welcome! I think you should stick with your CMA job to continue enhancing your application. It sounds like excellent clinical experience and networking! Research is of course nice to have, but I think excellent clinical experiences will serve your future application better, especially since you'll likely be applying to lots of DO schools. DO schools will really value your clinical experiences, and won't care as much if your app lacks research.

If the CMA position ever allows you to function in a leadership capacity (for example, mentoring new hires, leading training sessions, etc) definitely seek those opportunities out so you can write about them on your application.

If you're really jonesing to do some research, see if you can connect with a lab or PI that will allow you to do some work on a part-time basis in addition to your CMA job.

@JanetSnakehole If you don't mind, how did you find your study style? I find that it's something I still struggle with to find a study habit that works for me.

Trial and error, my friend. I was also a psych major turned postbac premed, and I cannot emphasize enough the importance of starting slow as you become accustomed to the hard sciences.

You can start by taking a single class and see how you do. If you do well, then take 2 courses the next semester. Depending on your work schedule, you may not be able to take more than 2 classes in a semester. And you need to be prepared to put in the hours. It wasn't a ton of fun, if I'm being honest. Most semesters of my postbac were just a terribly boring grind where I was either working or studying for 65-80 hours per week. Would squeeze in a few hours of ECs here and there. I sometimes felt like I was more machine than human, lol. But it's what I had to do to get 4.0s in everything. I don't want to make you anxious about this, because it's absolutely doable, but I think it's healthy to be a little intimidated by the material.

At the beginning of every class, go over the syllabus line by line and ensure you know exactly what you need to do to get a 4.0 (or as close to it as possible). Prioritize your efforts according to the weight of assignments, quizzes, problem sets, and exams. Treat getting 4.0s like a game, because it basically is. Other strategies that worked for me: doing every single extra credit opportunity possible, even if I was already above the 4.0 mark; doing every single practice problem assigned or recommended, even if not for a grade; utilizing 3rd party resources like YouTube channels and Khan academy; figuring out which professors were the easiest graders/offered the most extra credit and signing up for their classes; going to lots of office hours for pointers; and using the tutoring center when needed.

If you run into a rough patch, talk to your professor, talk to upperclassmen who have already taken the class, and/or come back here for advice. We can help you out if you get stuck.