Help from DVM or DVM's to be... need advice PLEASE

[Pet24]

I graduated high school in California and went on to working with animals, I began as a vet assistant and moved on to becoming a vet tech with no school only from experience and referrals. I have hours of volunteer work at shelters and clinics that I kept track of. Overall my experience working with animals in a medical field have been 5 years and my ambitions have grown much bigger and I now want to pursue a career as a DVM.

I have no idea where to start and I am trying to reach out and see who can help me just by giving me an idea of where to go first. I am trying to avoid falling into deep debt because I want to open one day a successful practice in a low income area. These years it's been hard to see many people bring in sick pets that doctors won't treat due to clients not being able to afford it, which has made me feel useless and I want to change that. I appreciate any guidance or help I can receive. Like I said I haven't been to school since I graduated high school and i currently live between Cali and Nevada but considering to move to Colorado but if prerequisites can be completed in NV at a much lower cost then I can stay until I finish them.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[nohika]

You'll want to probably start at a community college (it'll be cheaper). Unfortunately as to not wanting to get into deep debt - take a look at the cost of attendance for these schools. You're going to be in debt (and quite a bit of debt) unless you have at least six figures to cover your expenses. Or unless you take an extra year off and live in a cheap-coa state and become in-state there. There's a reason there's not a lot of vets in lower-cost areas. It's not because they're all spending wildly.

You won't 100% need a bachelor's degree, but I'd recommend it. At the very least you'll need "the basics" - 1 year of genbio, 1 year genchem, 1 year orgo, 1year physics, and biochem (and occasionally genetics or micro depending where you want to apply).

I know you want to help the animals that owners can't afford, and I understand where that's coming from. But you have to consider that most practices won't stay in business if they give their services away just because people can't afford them.

 

[Pet24]

You'll want to probably start at a community college (it'll be cheaper). Unfortunately as to not wanting to get into deep debt - take a look at the cost of attendance for these schools. You're going to be in debt (and quite a bit of debt) unless you have at least six figures to cover your expenses. Or unless you take an extra year off and live in a cheap-coa state and become in-state there. There's a reason there's not a lot of vets in lower-cost areas. It's not because they're all spending wildly.

You won't 100% need a bachelor's degree, but I'd recommend it. At the very least you'll need "the basics" - 1 year of genbio, 1 year genchem, 1 year orgo, 1year physics, and biochem (and occasionally genetics or micro depending where you want to apply).

I know you want to help the animals that owners can't afford, and I understand where that's coming from. But you have to consider that most practices won't stay in business if they give their services away just because people can't afford them.

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, I know it can be hard to become a vet especially now days with a very low debt in the end but I was inspired by a vet that has a small practice in Los Angeles charging little to no cost for treatments of course it was on a case by case basis but I want to make it possible as of right now definitely a community college but what classes should I take first just these(1 year of genbio, 1 year genchem, 1 year orgo, 1year physics, and biochem) or is there anymore? Lets say I go tomorrow to apply to my nearest community college, what courses should I take before even considering applying to any DVM program. Or what state would you suggest would be much lower cost than Nevada? I am willing to move anywhere as long as I can find a lower cost tuition.

And maybe this is getting ahead of myself but maybe you can answer this, is there any DVM program you've seen out there that is low cost compared to the rest and is it worth it or should I just stick to either of my two options, I had in mind either Michigan or Colorado.

Again Thank you for your time to respond I greatly appreciate it

 

[MixedAnimals77]

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, I know it can be hard to become a vet especially now days with a very low debt in the end but I was inspired by a vet that has a small practice in Los Angeles charging little to no cost for treatments of course it was on a case by case basis but I want to make it possible as of right now definitely a community college but what classes should I take first just these(1 year of genbio, 1 year genchem, 1 year orgo, 1year physics, and biochem) or is there anymore? Lets say I go tomorrow to apply to my nearest community college, what courses should I take before even considering applying to any DVM program. Or what state would you suggest would be much lower cost than Nevada? I am willing to move anywhere as long as I can find a lower cost tuition.

And maybe this is getting ahead of myself but maybe you can answer this, is there any DVM program you've seen out there that is low cost compared to the rest and is it worth it or should I just stick to either of my two options, I had in mind either Michigan or Colorado.

Again Thank you for your time to respond I greatly appreciate it

For low cost vet schools you picked some of the most expensive IS and OSS vet schools. I'd recommend NC for price. Check out VIN tuition map on Google will give you a idea of prices for down the future.

Sent from my HTCD160LVW using SDN mobile

 

[DVMDream]

Vet school is expensive.

Medicine is expensive.

Veterinary clinics are small businesses and have a goal of generating an income like every other small business.

Yes, it is hard to see those who can't afford treatment for their pets. But a pet is a luxury, not a right.

You can't treat every animal for free or discount all services as you'd go out of business. Even if you graduated vet school with no debt, you are still a person who will have bills that need to be paid. And you get that money as a vet from clients... if you discount all things you don't get money and can't pay your own mortgage, electricity, gas, phone, etc bills.

If you want to be a vet, you should get somewhat comfortable with the above.

Now, you need to do some research, go to a vet school website, look up what the application requires, get those things. Look at multiple schools, decide which ones you wish to apply, get the prereqs necessary. Really is more or less that straightforward.

 

[Pet24]

For low cost vet schools you picked some of the most expensive IS and OSS vet schools. I'd recommend NC for price. Check out VIN tuition map on Google will give you a idea of prices for down the future.

These are just two I was recommended by the doctors I work with not ones I am set on, nothing's set yet I have to go step by step but just throwing those out to see what people think about it. I will definitely look into NC thanks for the advice

 

[Pet24]

Vet school is expensive.

Medicine is expensive.

Veterinary clinics are small businesses and have a goal of generating an income like every other small business.

Yes, it is hard to see those who can't afford treatment for their pets. But a pet is a luxury, not a right.

You can't treat every animal for free or discount all services as you'd go out of business. Even if you graduated vet school with no debt, you are still a person who will have bills that need to be paid. And you get that money as a vet from clients... if you discount all things you don't get money and can't pay your own mortgage, electricity, gas, phone, etc bills.

If you want to be a vet, you should get somewhat comfortable with the above.

Now, you need to do some research, go to a vet school website, look up what the application requires, get those things. Look at multiple schools, decide which ones you wish to apply, get the prereqs necessary. Really is more or less that straightforward.

I definitely have in mind it will be expensive and I am comfortable with that i am aware that everyone has to make a living out of something what I am not ok with is vets that charge way more than they have to or try to scare people into paying huge amounts of money to keep their pets alive. I am also aware of what I can do to help myself like what you mentioned, go to a vet school website, look up application requirements and all that which is what i have been doing but I just joined and wanted to see if I would find someone that can guide me just like nohika. Still, I appreciate you taking the time to respond and thanks for the advice

 

[DVMDream]

what I am not ok with is vets that charge way more than they have to or try to scare people into paying huge amounts of money to keep their pets alive.

You aren't going to make many vet friends if you really think this is what vets are doing. We don't charge way more than we have to nor do we scare people into paying huge amounts to keep their pets alive. This is the BS we hear from clients that drives up the veterinary suicide rate.

 

[Pet24]

You aren't going to make many vet friends if you really think this is what vets are doing. We don't charge way more than we have to nor do we scare people into paying huge amounts to keep their pets alive. This is the BS we hear from clients that drives up the veterinary suicide rate.

I think we got off on the wrong foot, I did not mean every vet obviously but I did see it when working with some doctors. I mean why would I lie about something like this and doctors who I am close with would even admit that that is one of the reasons why they would open their own practice too. I didn't mean this in a way to offend anyone I am just giving a bit of background as to one of the reasons why I am motivated to become a DVM. I have also been inspired by many vets who keep their prices fair and pour their hearts into what they do which are the footsteps I want to follow.

 

[LetItSnow]

These years it's been hard to see many people bring in sick pets that doctors won't treat due to clients not being able to afford it,

I realize 100% that you probably didn't mean it that way, but as a doctor, it's a little offensive to read "that doctors won't treat due to ...."

It's not about me being some kind of jerk who refuses to treat your pet because you don't have money. It's about me not being able to treat your animal because you don't have money. I would LOVE to treat every animal through the door, but treatment costs money, and me and my staff have bills to pay and kids to feed and mortgages and everything just like everyone else, and I sure as heck can't just willy nilly give away free services because I want to.

The money issue is 1000% on the owner, not me. You get a pet, you should make sure you set aside financial resources to pay for it. And if you can't, you need to accept the limited care you can provide. It's not on me to take on that financial burden on behalf of strangers.

Anyway. Suggest in the future you consider how you're saying it, because your choice of language is not appropriate.

I definitely have in mind it will be expensive and I am comfortable with that i am aware that everyone has to make a living out of something what I am not ok with is vets that charge way more than they have to or try to scare people into paying huge amounts of money to keep their pets alive.

Yeah. Ok. How about you become a doctor and deal with the financial reality of things before you go accusing those of us who practice of that sort of behavior. You have NO idea what you're talking about.

 

[DVMDream]

I think we got off on the wrong foot, I did not mean every vet obviously but I did see it when working with some doctors. I mean why would I lie about something like this and doctors who I am close with would even admit that that is one of the reasons why they would open their own practice too. I didn't mean this in a way to offend anyone I am just giving a bit of background as to one of the reasons why I am motivated to become a DVM. I have also been inspired by many vets who keep their prices fair and pour their hearts into what they do which are the footsteps I want to follow.

Have you ever asked to look at a clinic's financial statement? How much the electricity, techs, water bill, rent, etc cost? Not to mention the doctors? How about the surgical table, surgical lights, dental machine, xray unit. Do you know how much one pack of monocryl suture is? Surgery blades, needles, syringes? Medications? Food? Those shelves don't magically stock themselves. Have you ever thought how much money it costs for upkeep? The xray machine needs to be serviced, so does the dental machine. Xray gowns, gloves and thyroid shields need to be inspected and replaced if any leaks. Do you know how much that is? Have you ever really thought about how much it will cost you to own and operate a clinic? I bet you haven't.

 

[Pet24]

Have you ever asked to look at a clinic's financial statement? How much the electricity, techs, water bill, rent, etc cost? Not to mention the doctors? How about the surgical table, surgical lights, dental machine, xray unit. Do you know how much one pack of monocryl suture is? Surgery blades, needles, syringes? Medications? Food? Those shelves don't magically stock themselves. Have you ever thought how much money it costs for upkeep? The xray machine needs to be serviced, so does the dental machine. Xray gowns, gloves and thyroid shields need to be inspected and replaced if any leaks. Do you know how much that is? Have you ever really thought about how much it will cost you to own and operate a clinic? I bet you haven't.

Am I talking with adults here?
I thought this would be a place to find reasonable people not people who would get butt hurt for a comment I made about someone who you don't even know of someone who I worked with close. I have been a supervisor at a veterinary before, I kept track of stocking shelves. It is sad to find someone with an attitude like yours so aggressive. You are not forced to answer all the questions on the forum. And if you do want to answer them all you have to come up with a more adult way of responding. Don't shove your frustration on me please.

 

[Pet24]

I realize 100% that you probably didn't mean it that way, but as a doctor, it's a little offensive to read "that doctors won't treat due to ...."

It's not about me being some kind of jerk who refuses to treat your pet because you don't have money. It's about me not being able to treat your animal because you don't have money. I would LOVE to treat every animal through the door, but treatment costs money, and me and my staff have bills to pay and kids to feed and mortgages and everything just like everyone else, and I sure as heck can't just willy nilly give away free services because I want to.

The money issue is 1000% on the owner, not me. You get a pet, you should make sure you set aside financial resources to pay for it. And if you can't, you need to accept the limited care you can provide. It's not on me to take on that financial burden on behalf of strangers.

Anyway. Suggest in the future you consider how you're saying it, because your choice of language is not appropriate.



Yeah. Ok. How about you become a doctor and deal with the financial reality of things before you go accusing those of us who practice of that sort of behavior. You have NO idea what you're talking about.

It's been offensive to me to when clients come to me and say the same thing or post on yelp that our prices are unreasonable, I ve been a supervisor and I know what it feels like to get these kind of comments. I love what I do and i take my work seriously just because it's not my practice doesn't mean I won't treat it well like I would do with mine in the future. I observe from a clients point too so I can improve the vets I have worked at. I thought I was talking with adults. What is not appropriate about it? i am not pointing fingers or defaming a doctor or a practice i am simply pointing out my experience. It's you problem if you get hurt by what you read It's not on me to take on your emotional burden. And I think there has to be some compassion when you love what you do, I have volunteered at shelters and rescues and when a person decides to take in and rescue a pet I think there should be someone on there side to help them out for doing a good deed. I mean just have fair prices thats all no need to get so offensive. How hard is it to respond like nohika or mixedanimals, straightforward, helpful and polite.

 

[Pet24]

Have you ever asked to look at a clinic's financial statement? How much the electricity, techs, water bill, rent, etc cost? Not to mention the doctors? How about the surgical table, surgical lights, dental machine, xray unit. Do you know how much one pack of monocryl suture is? Surgery blades, needles, syringes? Medications? Food? Those shelves don't magically stock themselves. Have you ever thought how much money it costs for upkeep? The xray machine needs to be serviced, so does the dental machine. Xray gowns, gloves and thyroid shields need to be inspected and replaced if any leaks. Do you know how much that is? Have you ever really thought about how much it will cost you to own and operate a clinic? I bet you haven't.

Seems like you keep true to your profile description "Don't disturb the snowflake". I sure won't DVM Dream #snowflake

 

[Pet24]

I realize 100% that you probably didn't mean it that way, but as a doctor, it's a little offensive to read "that doctors won't treat due to ...."

It's not about me being some kind of jerk who refuses to treat your pet because you don't have money. It's about me not being able to treat your animal because you don't have money. I would LOVE to treat every animal through the door, but treatment costs money, and me and my staff have bills to pay and kids to feed and mortgages and everything just like everyone else, and I sure as heck can't just willy nilly give away free services because I want to.

The money issue is 1000% on the owner, not me. You get a pet, you should make sure you set aside financial resources to pay for it. And if you can't, you need to accept the limited care you can provide. It's not on me to take on that financial burden on behalf of strangers.

Anyway. Suggest in the future you consider how you're saying it, because your choice of language is not appropriate.



Yeah. Ok. How about you become a doctor and deal with the financial reality of things before you go accusing those of us who practice of that sort of behavior. You have NO idea what you're talking about.

I can't believe how rude you are. Why do they even allow people like you on here if you find something negative in everything? or did I just trigger you?

 

[FrostySparrow]

Basically getting an associates in biology along with some upper division courses will cover most vet school prereqs. A bachelors is highly recommended (and required for some schools). I'm applying without a bachelors currently and reapply with one next year if not accepted. This allows me a chance to get feedback on application and interview. This equates about 3-4 years depending on circumstances in your life. I would also highly recommend taking a communications course.
Being in the field I'm very surprised as to how your final few comments have been. I'm more than sure you being a tech you've interacted with your fair share of clients who despise vets and claim all to be money hungry and incapable of compassion. I have a very hard time believing any vet is solely in this profession for the money (fact is, unless speciality or something you don't make much... and to intern for speciality you make even less).
To be honest, your responses to these great contributors makes me doubt a bit in regards to your background in the field. It would definitely be best for you to expand your experiences to other scopes of practices!
While I understand the intent of becoming a vet, I agree that you can work on your phrasing. You will one day be the face of a practice, and how you speak to clients (and fellow veterinary professionals) makes a world of a difference.
Making friends here can help you a lot through the process! As anonymous as you think this is, I've come to learn it's not really... and you can really damage future relationships by reacting this way.

Best of luck in whatever you decide to do!

 

[Animal Midwife]

...is this another troll?

 

[LetItSnow]

It's been offensive to me to when clients come to me and say the same thing or post on yelp that our prices are unreasonable, I ve been a supervisor and I know what it feels like to get these kind of comments. I love what I do and i take my work seriously just because it's not my practice doesn't mean I won't treat it well like I would do with mine in the future. I observe from a clients point too so I can improve the vets I have worked at. I thought I was talking with adults. What is not appropriate about it? i am not pointing fingers or defaming a doctor or a practice i am simply pointing out my experience. It's you problem if you get hurt by what you read It's not on me to take on your emotional burden. And I think there has to be some compassion when you love what you do, I have volunteered at shelters and rescues and when a person decides to take in and rescue a pet I think there should be someone on there side to help them out for doing a good deed. I mean just have fair prices thats all no need to get so offensive. How hard is it to respond like nohika or mixedanimals, straightforward, helpful and polite.

Having "stocked shelves" and "volunteered in shelters" and "been a supervisor" doesn't mean squat. You have no idea what it's like to take on a ridiculous financial burden only to be attacked every. single. day. for being "greedy" and "not caring about animals" and all the rest of the crap that we have to put up with. Having "heard" those things isn't even remotely the same.

It's nice of you to "improve the vets you work with." I'm sure they appreciate being told how to do their job by someone who doesn't do it.

What you said was tactless at best, and outright offensive at worst. Deal with it.

 

[dyachei]

I graduated high school in California and went on to working with animals, I began as a vet assistant and moved on to becoming a vet tech with no school only from experience and referrals. I have hours of volunteer work at shelters and clinics that I kept track of. Overall my experience working with animals in a medical field have been 5 years and my ambitions have grown much bigger and I now want to pursue a career as a DVM.

I have no idea where to start and I am trying to reach out and see who can help me just by giving me an idea of where to go first. I am trying to avoid falling into deep debt because I want to open one day a successful practice in a low income area. These years it's been hard to see many people bring in sick pets that doctors won't treat due to clients not being able to afford it, which has made me feel useless and I want to change that. I appreciate any guidance or help I can receive. Like I said I haven't been to school since I graduated high school and i currently live between Cali and Nevada but considering to move to Colorado but if prerequisites can be completed in NV at a much lower cost then I can stay until I finish them.

You have a lot of questions to ask yourself. Why do you want to be a vet? Do you want to be personally responsible (and if it comes to it, liable) for a patient? If it's to help low income areas, how do you intend to do that? Will you be working for a charity or 501c3? How will you keep costs low?

You need to start by taking college level courses. Every vet school has prerequisites you must complete to matriculate into their programs. You need to start by first figuring out which colleges to apply to and then by taking the courses that satisfy their needs. You will likely go into deep debt unless you have a lot of help from home. Not necessarily from undergraduate level courses (some of which can be taken at a community college), but if you do get in to vet school, it costs a lot. I went to an in-state program at one of the cheaper schools and still graduated with 6 figures of debt. You will need to do well in these classes and it may be a challenge if you aren't used to being in school and getting into that mindset.

It's been offensive to me to when clients come to me and say the same thing or post on yelp that our prices are unreasonable, I ve been a supervisor and I know what it feels like to get these kind of comments. I love what I do and i take my work seriously just because it's not my practice doesn't mean I won't treat it well like I would do with mine in the future. I observe from a clients point too so I can improve the vets I have worked at. I thought I was talking with adults. What is not appropriate about it? i am not pointing fingers or defaming a doctor or a practice i am simply pointing out my experience.

As for this point, well there's a lot to be said about it. I've worked with and for many vets at this point in my life. I have met exactly 1 that was trying to make more money off of clients. He didn't increase costs of services, he simply added more services than required. So you may have experience with one of these doctors, but they are RARE. You may think that prices are increased in a way that is "unfair" to owners. When I charge $1200-1500 for an exploratory surgery, a lot goes into it. First there are the costs of consumables like suture, fluids, fluid lines, medications, lab reagents and slides, and cleaning materials. Then there are the costs of goods that I must spread out over every surgery to make my money back - that includes things like surgical instruments, radiology, suction, specialized instruments, and furniture (kennels, surgery table, exam tables, etc). THEN I need to pay my overhead which includes things like being able to keep the lights on and being able to pay the rent. Finally, I need to pay my staff. By the time all of this is said and done, I have spent roughly $500-700. The additional cost is because I can't see any other patients during that time and because the clinic has to make a profit. Why? Because if I can't improve the clinic, I won't be able to keep up with other clinics in the area in offering the best care possible - I won't be able to go to CE if I don't make a certain amount of profit each year. I won't be able to pay for a new blood analyzer when I need to. Those kinds of things. Also because this is a business, and people are allowed to charge for services to make money. Veterinarians are severely underpaid for the amount of school we undergo and the amount of debt we accumulate.

When I see low cost clinics in the area, I always check their prices. Often, they are able to offer vaccines at lower prices because the manufacturers give special pricing to 501c3 companies. They often are able to sell them for less than I can buy them for in those cases. This is the same for most equipment and monitoring that they offer. As a non-profit, they simply have more leeway than a private business. You also claim that many people are "rescuing" animals from shelters. I, personally, hate that terminology. People are adopting animals, not rescuing them. They get no privileges from private vets for doing this because people often adopt animals because THEY want them. They do get some privileges from the shelter - usually the pets are as up to date on vaccines as possible and have come spayed/neutered if possible. Often, if they were ill, the illnesses were treated first.

Finally, I must address your behavior in this thread. SDN does not tolerate name calling or insults to other users. Users disagreeing with you does not make them less adult than you. It simply means that they do not agree. Most of the people you have said are less than adult are practicing DVMs with more real world experience than you. That doesn't make your experience invalid, simply naive. It is not an attack on you, it is simply an observation with their experiences. It's easy to make judgements as a vet tech or assistant. It's less easy to make those same judgements when you have personal experience as a veterinarian.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

I can't believe how rude you are. Why do they even allow people like you on here if you find something negative in everything? or did I just trigger you?

Sometimes negative it important. Suggesting that someone shouldn't be allowed to voice their opinion (especially an experienced opinion) just because it isn't sunshine and rainbows is silly.

Look, you showed some ignorance (let's even be nice here and chalk it up to inexperience in the field; stocking shelves does not give you insight as to the managerial complexities of running a business) and then actual veterinarians on here corrected you and gave you some tough love/real world advice without sugar coating. LIS and DVMD *are* being helpful - they are warning you about an ideal that doesn't have a solid basis in reality. It got a bit testy, but what do you expect when you admittedly came off as a bit holier-than-thou with the whole "vets charging too much and scaring clients" and how you "improve the vets you work with" etc.

Try to see if from their perspective and see how your comments could have been interpreted, even if it was in good faith. Having an unrealistic expectation of finances in veterinary medicine is one thing, but some of what you said could have been taken badly, and people who are actually in the trenches could absolutely be a bit ticked off by it.

 

[JustPaws]

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, I know it can be hard to become a vet especially now days with a very low debt in the end but I was inspired by a vet that has a small practice in Los Angeles charging little to no cost for treatments of course it was on a case by case basis but I want to make it possible as of right now definitely a community college but what classes should I take first just these(1 year of genbio, 1 year genchem, 1 year orgo, 1year physics, and biochem) or is there anymore? Lets say I go tomorrow to apply to my nearest community college, what courses should I take before even considering applying to any DVM program. Or what state would you suggest would be much lower cost than Nevada? I am willing to move anywhere as long as I can find a lower cost tuition.

And maybe this is getting ahead of myself but maybe you can answer this, is there any DVM program you've seen out there that is low cost compared to the rest and is it worth it or should I just stick to either of my two options, I had in mind either Michigan or Colorado.

Again Thank you for your time to respond I greatly appreciate it

Seems like as a first step, you might want to sit down with an admissions counselor at your local community college and discuss that list of classes and what prerequisites are required before you can take them. Those aren't all first year classes, and there will be general biology and chemistry classes that come first.

 

[Pet24]

You have a lot of questions to ask yourself. Why do you want to be a vet? Do you want to be personally responsible (and if it comes to it, liable) for a patient? If it's to help low income areas, how do you intend to do that? Will you be working for a charity or 501c3? How will you keep costs low?

You need to start by taking college level courses. Every vet school has prerequisites you must complete to matriculate into their programs. You need to start by first figuring out which colleges to apply to and then by taking the courses that satisfy their needs. You will likely go into deep debt unless you have a lot of help from home. Not necessarily from undergraduate level courses (some of which can be taken at a community college), but if you do get in to vet school, it costs a lot. I went to an in-state program at one of the cheaper schools and still graduated with 6 figures of debt. You will need to do well in these classes and it may be a challenge if you aren't used to being in school and getting into that mindset.



As for this point, well there's a lot to be said about it. I've worked with and for many vets at this point in my life. I have met exactly 1 that was trying to make more money off of clients. He didn't increase costs of services, he simply added more services than required. So you may have experience with one of these doctors, but they are RARE. You may think that prices are increased in a way that is "unfair" to owners. When I charge $1200-1500 for an exploratory surgery, a lot goes into it. First there are the costs of consumables like suture, fluids, fluid lines, medications, lab reagents and slides, and cleaning materials. Then there are the costs of goods that I must spread out over every surgery to make my money back - that includes things like surgical instruments, radiology, suction, specialized instruments, and furniture (kennels, surgery table, exam tables, etc). THEN I need to pay my overhead which includes things like being able to keep the lights on and being able to pay the rent. Finally, I need to pay my staff. By the time all of this is said and done, I have spent roughly $500-700. The additional cost is because I can't see any other patients during that time and because the clinic has to make a profit. Why? Because if I can't improve the clinic, I won't be able to keep up with other clinics in the area in offering the best care possible - I won't be able to go to CE if I don't make a certain amount of profit each year. I won't be able to pay for a new blood analyzer when I need to. Those kinds of things. Also because this is a business, and people are allowed to charge for services to make money. Veterinarians are severely underpaid for the amount of school we undergo and the amount of debt we accumulate.

When I see low cost clinics in the area, I always check their prices. Often, they are able to offer vaccines at lower prices because the manufacturers give special pricing to 501c3 companies. They often are able to sell them for less than I can buy them for in those cases. This is the same for most equipment and monitoring that they offer. As a non-profit, they simply have more leeway than a private business. You also claim that many people are "rescuing" animals from shelters. I, personally, hate that terminology. People are adopting animals, not rescuing them. They get no privileges from private vets for doing this because people often adopt animals because THEY want them. They do get some privileges from the shelter - usually the pets are as up to date on vaccines as possible and have come spayed/neutered if possible. Often, if they were ill, the illnesses were treated first.

Finally, I must address your behavior in this thread. SDN does not tolerate name calling or insults to other users. Users disagreeing with you does not make them less adult than you. It simply means that they do not agree. Most of the people you have said are less than adult are practicing DVMs with more real world experience than you. That doesn't make your experience invalid, simply naive. It is not an attack on you, it is simply an observation with their experiences. It's easy to make judgements as a vet tech or assistant. It's less easy to make those same judgements when you have personal experience as a veterinarian.

World experience than me?? you don't even know these people these are all kept anonymous it's not like you need a license number to get on this forum literally anyone can get on here and say they are a DVM. Name calling??? insults??? umm no there was no name calling or insults just clarification which clearly at the beginning I wanted to avoid conflict but they just became more aggressive. And the profile name thing that is what her profile says. Then again I have to remember this is the internet and I will find all kinds of people on here even those who think they are above others.

 

[nohika]

World experience than me?? you don't even know these people these are all kept anonymous it's not like you need a license number to get on this forum literally anyone can get on here and say they are a DVM. Name calling??? insults??? umm no there was no name calling or insults just clarification which clearly at the beginning I wanted to avoid conflict but they just became more aggressive. And the profile name thing that is what her profile says. Then again I have to remember this is the internet and I will find all kinds of people on here even those who think they are above others.

Sigh. I kind of regret posting here now. LIS and DVMD are two of the most valuable members here. So is WTF (and nyanko and TT and all of the older-timers but I can't name everyone). They're people who take time out of their day to come here and talk with people entering the field and/or those in vet school/etc. And actually a decent chunk of us do know each other in real life. Vetmed is a small field. You never know who you're pissing off.

And no, you can't just come on this forum and get the marker that says "Veterinarian". It has to be verified by SDN.

I think you have a lot to learn before you can come even close to doing what you want to. And if you don't want to learn, or want to keep harping on the senior vets here (or anyone else attempting to help you)...please pick a different field.

 

[Pet24]

Seems like as a first step, you might want to sit down with an admissions counselor at your local community college and discuss that list of classes and what prerequisites are required before you can take them. Those aren't all first year classes, and there will be general biology and chemistry classes that come first.

Yes, one of the people on here gave me an idea of checking out NCSU, I am now looking into there pre-reqs so I can go to my nearby college and ask more info on those courses. Thank you

 

[Pet24]

Basically getting an associates in biology along with some upper division courses will cover most vet school prereqs. A bachelors is highly recommended (and required for some schools). I'm applying without a bachelors currently and reapply with one next year if not accepted. This allows me a chance to get feedback on application and interview. This equates about 3-4 years depending on circumstances in your life. I would also highly recommend taking a communications course.
Being in the field I'm very surprised as to how your final few comments have been. I'm more than sure you being a tech you've interacted with your fair share of clients who despise vets and claim all to be money hungry and incapable of compassion. I have a very hard time believing any vet is solely in this profession for the money (fact is, unless speciality or something you don't make much... and to intern for speciality you make even less).
To be honest, your responses to these great contributors makes me doubt a bit in regards to your background in the field. It would definitely be best for you to expand your experiences to other scopes of practices!
While I understand the intent of becoming a vet, I agree that you can work on your phrasing. You will one day be the face of a practice, and how you speak to clients (and fellow veterinary professionals) makes a world of a difference.
Making friends here can help you a lot through the process! As anonymous as you think this is, I've come to learn it's not really... and you can really damage future relationships by reacting this way.

Best of luck in whatever you decide to do!

It's not hard to respond polite and nice and not in an offensive way but to start off attacking??? Either way I got an idea of what this forum is and i know you 5 people are not the only DVM's or DVM's to be in this whole entire world. I know who I am and I've dealt with people like you before so best thing to do is just let you guys be. I thought I would find helpful, supportive people on here but just because you have a badge that says you've been on here for 5+ years doesn't mean you have the right to think you are better than others and thats speaks out a lot of what kind of person you are.

 

[dyachei]

World experience than me?? you don't even know these people these are all kept anonymous it's not like you need a license number to get on this forum literally anyone can get on here and say they are a DVM. Name calling??? insults??? umm no there was no name calling or insults just clarification which clearly at the beginning I wanted to avoid conflict but they just became more aggressive. And the profile name thing that is what her profile says. Then again I have to remember this is the internet and I will find all kinds of people on here even those who think they are above others.

Actually, I know both DVMD and LIS outside of SDN. And I know that they have been verified as doctors of vet med in order to get the tag.

You presented things in a manner that was offensive. It may not have been your intent. However, you repeatedly called users "not adult" when they disagreed with you. That starts to border insulting, which is why I mentioned it in a response to you here instead of as an official warning.

Almost nobody here thinks they are above others. Many here are sharing their experiences. Your insistence that you would help to improve DVMs because you know the client experience is the closest to anyone thinking they are above anyone else. Most DVMs have been clients before (or still are if they need certain types of care for their pets) and many have shadowed or worked at a variety of vet offices before earning their degree.

 

[dyachei]

It's not hard to respond polite and nice and not in an offensive way but to start off attacking??? Either way I got an idea of what this forum is and i know you 5 people are not the only DVM's or DVM's to be in this whole entire world. I know who I am and I've dealt with people like you before so best thing to do is just let you guys be. I thought I would find helpful, supportive people on here but just because you have a badge that says you've been on here for 5+ years doesn't mean you have the right to think you are better than others and thats speaks out a lot of what kind of person you are.

you are getting help and support, but it's not what you expected. And you're lashing out because people disagreed with you.

Support does not mean unequivocal agreement. The best things usually come from constructive criticism, which is what was presented here.

 

[Pet24]

Sometimes negative it important. Suggesting that someone shouldn't be allowed to voice their opinion (especially an experienced opinion) just because it isn't sunshine and rainbows is silly.

Look, you showed some ignorance (let's even be nice here and chalk it up to inexperience in the field; stocking shelves does not give you insight as to the managerial complexities of running a business) and then actual veterinarians on here corrected you and gave you some tough love/real world advice without sugar coating. LIS and DVMD *are* being helpful - they are warning you about an ideal that doesn't have a solid basis in reality. It got a bit testy, but what do you expect when you admittedly came off as a bit holier-than-thou with the whole "vets charging too much and scaring clients" and how you "improve the vets you work with" etc.

Try to see if from their perspective and see how your comments could have been interpreted, even if it was in good faith. Having an unrealistic expectation of finances in veterinary medicine is one thing, but some of what you said could have been taken badly, and people who are actually in the trenches could absolutely be a bit ticked off by it.

Ignorance?? complexities of running a business? Who exactly are you to tell me I don't know? You don't know me you don't know my work and you are already judging me just because you and your other buddies that have badges on here think you guys are better than me. You guys are making it seem like its impossible like never in a million years is it possible to find a doctor who does that. I didn't mean everyone or all of them but I guess something about this made you guys get triggered for some reason??? interesting

 

[dyachei]

I went out of my way to show you exactly where all the costs go and why 501c3 companies can offer things at a reasonable cost. I own my own clinic. I could have spent the time doing something else instead of giving you the perspective of a vet that owns a clinic.

 

[dyachei]

The way you presented information is why people made assumptions about your level of experience and knowledge. and just as they may not know you, you don't know them.

 

[Pet24]

you are getting help and support, but it's not what you expected. And you're lashing out because people disagreed with you.

Support does not mean unequivocal agreement. The best things usually come from constructive criticism, which is what was presented here.

What help? what constructive criticism?? I asked a simple question and so far they could not answer that, they immediately went to arguing about something else I pointed out. And that something else I pointed out triggered them and made them have this response. It's irrational for an adult to act this way. In no way is their negative comments helping. I am getting no help at all from them. I am ok disagreeing with other and i responded at the beginning of the post thread in a way to say ok we disagree but can we please move on to the real question to why I am here. But so far I only got more anger and aggressiveness.

 

[dyachei]

What help? what constructive criticism?? I asked a simple question and so far they could not answer that, they immediately went to arguing about something else I pointed out. And that something else I pointed out triggered them and made them have this response. It's irrational for an adult to act this way. In no way is their negative comments helping. I am getting no help at all from them. I am ok disagreeing with other and i responded at the beginning of the post thread in a way to say ok we disagree but can we please move on to the real question to why I am here. But so far I only got more anger and aggressiveness.

That the way you presented the information can be taken in a bad way. You seem to keep missing that piece of it.

Your insistence that they are not acting like rational adults is bordering on insulting. This is an official mod warning that if you continue, you may be met with an infraction.

 

[dyachei]

If cost is truly a concern, all you have to do is open the thread at the top that says "READ THIS FIRST" and click on the costs of vet school link. It should give you an idea of in state and out of state prices for most schools. It's a little out of date, however.

 

[Pet24]

The way you presented information is why people made assumptions about your level of experience and knowledge. and just as they may not know you, you don't know them.

I know I don't know them and that is why at beginning of the thread i tried to cool them down in a polite way, trying to avoid this aggressive behaviour they have now but they just kept going at it. They did not even answer my question they just started to analyze some other thing I mentioned on my thread. And they talk about it like if it's impossible for that to happen like there is no way in the world that could ever happen. And like you pointed out, they don't know me so why are they attacking me when I mentioned what triggered them.

 

[dyachei]

I know I don't know them and that is why at beginning of the thread i tried to cool them down in a polite way, trying to avoid this aggressive behaviour they have now but they just kept going at it. They did not even answer my question they just started to analyze some other thing I mentioned on my thread. And they talk about it like if it's impossible for that to happen like there is no way in the world that could ever happen. And like you pointed out, they don't know me so why are they attacking me when I mentioned what triggered them.

They aren't required to answer any question. They can respond to any part of your post as long as they follow the Terms of Service

 

[Pet24]

If cost is truly a concern, all you have to do is open the thread at the top that says "READ THIS FIRST" and click on the costs of vet school link. It should give you an idea of in state and out of state prices for most schools. It's a little out of date, however.

It is a concern but at the end of the day I just need opinions from your experiences, the comment about NCSU being cheaper helped out a lot, I am looking into that school now and learned more when researched them. Cost is a concern but won't completely dictate my path. I came on here to see if i could find people that could give me more information on their personal experience. I know I can look online and I have been looking for some info online but I thought this place was great to meet people that are actually doing it and be able talk to them for some guidance.

 

[dyachei]

It is a concern but at the end of the day I just need opinions from your experiences, the comment about NCSU being cheaper helped out a lot, I am looking into that school now and learned more when researched them. Cost is a concern but won't completely dictate my path. I came on here to see if i could find people that could give me more information on their personal experience. I know I can look online and I have been looking for some info online but I thought this place was great to meet people that are actually doing it and be able talk to them for some guidance.

Again, look at the link I told you about. It was put together by a vet based on the actual costs of each school.

 

[Pet24]

They aren't required to answer any question. They can respond to any part of your post as long as they follow the Terms of Service

Oh god I know they are not and like i clearly said to one of them, you are not being forced to answer all the questions on the forum but if you are going to take the time to answer just be polite no need to get aggressive. That's all.

 

[dyachei]

Here's the direct link: Estimated Costs of Veterinary School

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Ignorance?? complexities of running a business? Who exactly are you to tell me I don't know? You don't know me you don't know my work and you are already judging me just because you and your other buddies that have badges on here think you guys are better than me. You guys are making it seem like its impossible like never in a million years is it possible to find a doctor who does that. I didn't mean everyone or all of them but I guess something about this made you guys get triggered for some reason??? interesting

I know I don't know them and that is why at beginning of the thread i tried to cool them down in a polite way, trying to avoid this aggressive behaviour they have now but they just kept going at it. They did not even answer my question they just started to analyze some other thing I mentioned on my thread. And they talk about it like if it's impossible for that to happen like there is no way in the world that could ever happen. And like you pointed out, they don't know me so why are they attacking me when I mentioned what triggered them.

Saying you are inexperienced, or even ignorant, is not an attack. Everyone was inexperienced and ignorant at one point, this is why we pursue education and experience. And, as someone who IS experienced in the field, I absolutely have the right to call out your inexperience when I see that it is giving you a tainted view of what is or is not common, realistic, or smart in the field. It's not about badges. It's about experience. Severel vets here have been members of this forum with our credentials verified for many years, and not an insignificant number of us also know each other, either directly or indirectly, outside of these forums as well.

It is a statement that was made based on this information you have presented and the fact that you are a) not a vet and b) have never owned or operated a veterinary clinic. No, you do not understand the complexities of running a clinic (which is, for all accounts and purposes, a business) and those of us who DO have experience doing that have been trying to give you some firm advice about why giving away discounted or free services is a dangerous business move and not something you should make a realistic goal of your practice in the future.

And yes, you know what? It is annoying and, to use your phrase, triggering, when we hear idealistic young pre vet insinuate that he or she wants to run a bad business model based on the fact that he or she hates vets who charge a lot of money or, in her opinion, put fear into clients for money. We hear those accusation all the time from clients who, like you, do not understand the finances of how clinics work and how giving away stuff for free is a slippery slope at best and a terrible business decision for your clinic and your employees at worst.

 

[Pet24]

Again, look at the link I told you about. It was put together by a vet based on the actual costs of each school.

Yes I took a look at that. It's sad to know that you can't runaway from people like this, not even in a forum where you are supposed to be dealing with professionals. And no need to be met with ridiculous infractions. I no longer have interest in this place I see what kind of people there are on here and I don't want to be part of such negative comments or arguments. I don't see anyone in their right mind thinking its ok to act like this to a person new to this forum or in any place in life. Thinking they are above them just because they assume that they have lower experience. I know who I am and no matter what I would never treat anyone like **** just like you guys did so I definitely realize this place is not for me. I don't want to have any connection to these people and I know not everyone on this forum is like that I know there might have been thousands and thousands of people who can help me on here but sadly the few on here that act like this drive some away.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Yes I took a look at that. It's sad to know that you can't runaway from people like this, not even in a forum where you are supposed to be dealing with professionals. And no need to be met with ridiculous infractions. I no longer have interest in this place I see what kind of people there are on here and I don't want to be part of such negative comments or arguments. I don't see anyone in their right mind thinking its ok to act like this to a person new to this forum or in any place in life. Thinking they are above them just because they assume that they have lower experience. I know who I am and no matter what I would never treat anyone like **** just like you guys did so I definitely realize this place is not for me. I don't want to have any connection to these people and I know not everyone on this forum is like that I know there might have been thousands and thousands of people who can help me on here but sadly the few on here that act like this drive some away.

You are a preveterinary student. Many of us here are current vets students and some are veterinarians. We're not assuming you have less experience, it is a statement of fact - just be humble and own it. It's not about being better than anyone else, it is about KNOWING more than someone else. It's not judgement, it's fact. If you can't handle someone with more experience correcting you, and interpret that as them "treating you like ****", then I'm not sure how you're going to do in vet school.

 

[Pet24]

Saying you are inexperienced, or even ignorant, is not an attack. Everyone was inexperienced and ignorant at one point, this is why we pursue education and experience. And, as someone who IS experienced in the field, I absolutely have the right to call out your inexperience when I see that it is giving you a tainted view of what is or is not common, realistic, or smart in the field. It's not about badges. It's about experience. Severel vets here have been members of this forum with our credentials verified for many years, and not an insignificant number of us also know each other, either directly or indirectly, outside of these forums as well.

It is a statement that was made based on this information you have presented and the fact that you are a) not a vet and b) have never owned or operated a veterinary clinic. No, you do not understand the complexities of running a clinic (which is, for all accounts and purposes, a business) and those of us who DO have experience doing that have been trying to give you some firm advice about why giving away discounted or free services is a dangerous business move and not something you should make a realistic goal of your practice in the future.

And yes, you know what? It is annoying and, to use your phrase, triggering, when we hear idealistic young pre vet insinuate that he or she wants to run a bad business model based on the fact that he or she hates vets who charge a lot of money or, in her opinion, put fear into clients for money. We hear those accusation all the time from clients who, like you, do not understand the finances of how clinics work and how giving away stuff for free is a slippery slope at best and a terrible business decision for your clinic and your employees at worst.

XD XD Buddy buddy chill out you are not above anyone, climb down and don't worry I have no interest in staying in this group so just save it for someone else who joins this group. I don't know who in their right mind would tolerate this kind of treatment but good luck.

 

[dyachei]

XD XD Buddy buddy chill out you are not above anyone, climb down and don't worry I have no interest in staying in this group so just save it for someone else who joins this group. I don't know who in their right mind would tolerate this kind of treatment but good luck.

actually, she is, since she sometimes teaches vet students...

 

[dyachei]

Maybe consider that your initial comments could be taken the wrong way and learn more about communication styles. Also consider that calling people not rational adults is pretty insulting when several people did respond politely. yes, they disagreed with you and gave you more information. That's not rude. that's helpful

I'm sorry you feel like SDN is not for you. It isn't for everyone.

 

[Pet24]

You are a preveterinary student. Many of us here are current vets students and some are veterinarians. We're not assuming you have less experience, it is a statement of fact - just be humble and own it. It's not about being better than anyone else, it is about KNOWING more than someone else. It's not judgement, it's fact. If you can't handle someone with more experience correcting you, and interpret that them them "treating you like ****", then I'm not sure how you're going to do in vet school.

Just be humble hahahaha because you are of course thats right XD this is getting to funny, funny to the point where i come to realize it's pointless to argue with someone like you on here. Take care buddy and learn to be humble yourself just because you are or are studying to be does not give you the right to treat others like this

 

[DVMDream]

This is comical. Also, I did answer your question, I'm not doing the leg work for you....I figured out classes/college needed for vet school when I was about 12. You can do it, it really is as simple as look up prereqs go to undergrad, obtain them.

And get better experience in the business side of vet med.

 

[Pet24]

Maybe consider that your initial comments could be taken the wrong way and learn more about communication styles. Also consider that calling people not rational adults is pretty insulting when several people did respond politely. yes, they disagreed with you and gave you more information. That's not rude. that's helpful

I'm sorry you feel like SDN is not for you. It isn't for everyone.

Initial comments?? what? did you not read? I was being polite at the beginning not confrontational I would have been ok with the first responses but they just kept pushing it and that is something I wont tolerate so good luck with your group of "elite" thinkers

 

[Animal Midwife]

@Pet24, I'm only a pre-vet and even I've noticed you're getting way too worked up about this. Everyone's just giving you an honest outlook of this field. That's all.

 

[Pet24]

This is comical. Also, I did answer your question, I'm not doing the leg work for you....I figured out classes/college needed for vet school when I was about 12.
You can do it, it really is as simple as look up prereqs go to undergrad, obtain them.

And get better experience in the business side of vet med.

Leg work for me Oh yes can you apply for some scholarships for me? and hmm lets see umm talk to my counselor? be serious please just because you were 12 and found out what to do gives you know right to use that as a way of saying I should know by now. I just came here and asked a simple question you didn't have to answer it or even care about it. Or you could've just use said "You can do it, it really is as simple as look up prereqs go to undergrad, obtain them." as an answer and that would have been waaaaaay more useful than all this arguing.