How crucial is non-clinical volunteer work

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RogueBanana

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Looking for opinions:

Lets say an applicant has:

Good Stats
Strong Leadership ECs
Good Clinical Experience (volunteer, shadowing & interning)
Good LORs
Publications/Research
Team Activities


BUT

no classical volunteer work listed on the primary application
(food shelter, homeless,community service, etc..)

would that tank the applicant in the eyes of the ADCOMs?


My roommate and I are arguing as to weather this would have a large enough effect to kill an application.

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For experiences, the priority ratings are

Healthcare experience > community service/volunteer experience > experience with underserved populations > navigated through cultural barriers or challenges > leadership experience >> research experience
 
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Process is way too random to predict. Being an overall productive individual will help you get in... the position that you are productive in is much less important than the productivity itself. (So long as you have good knowledge of what you are getting yourself into - this is a huge point because medical schools spend lots of money on each student, so avoiding drop-outs is of high priority.)
 
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Process is way too random to predict. Being an overall productive individual will help you get in... the position that you are productive in is much less important than the productivity itself. (So long as you have good knowledge of what you are getting yourself into - this is a huge point because medical schools spend lots of money on each student, so avoiding drop-outs is of high priority.)
So say this person has shown they are productive (publications, holding multiple leadership positions, founding organizations)
They will be looked at in a holistic matter? I always find the application process to be so illogical. We have numeric metrics and statistics, but sometimes we move away from them away in favor of the in-tangibles. Funny how the world works.
 
BTW, does tutoring kids (high school, middle school) for free count for both non-clinical and leadership? That's all I did for those categories. I did that 3~ hours every week for years before even thinking about applying to med school. I stopped now to do clinical things.
 
BTW, does tutoring kids (high school, middle school) for free count for both non-clinical and leadership? That's all I did for those categories. I did that 3~ hours every week for years before even thinking about applying to med school. I stopped now to do clinical things.
AMCAS has a section on the work activities section specifically for tutoring
 
You are right. I didn't even read the whole AMCAS. I did tutoring 20 hours/week in my junior and senior years in college. That was paid. The kid thing was for free. All of them go under tutoring then?

That can't be right. They also have a category for "extracurricular activities" which basically encompasses everything.
 
You are right. I didn't even read the whole AMCAS. I did tutoring 20 hours/week in my junior and senior years in college. That was paid. The kid thing was for free. All of them go under tutoring then?

That can't be right. They also have a category for "extracurricular activities" which basically encompasses everything.
pretty sure there is a paid/unpaid option for tutoring. If not, list the paid tutoring as a work experience and the volunteer work under tutoring.
 
Yes.


BTW, does tutoring kids (high school, middle school) for free count for both non-clinical and leadership? That's all I did for those categories. I did that 3~ hours every week for years before even thinking about applying to med school. I stopped now to do clinical things.
 
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You can label tutoring kids for free as volunteer, non-clinical or as tutoring. It is your choice. You might not call it leadership unless you were leading a group of tutors (peer leader).

Many adcom members put a high value on service to others, particularly service to those who are not able to help themselves. Medicine is a service industry and the service is to all strata of society so having experience with the people you might not meet in everyday life and that you will care for as a student and resident (little to no choice in who you serve as a trainee, more when you are a practitioner) is important.

Just as you might get away with having a healthy offspring despite smoking, drinking and eating junk food, you might get into medical school without non-clinical volunteering but you might sleep better at night knowing you've done your best to assure a good outcome.
 
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You are right. I didn't even read the whole AMCAS. I did tutoring 20 hours/week in my junior and senior years in college. That was paid. The kid thing was for free. All of them go under tutoring then?

That can't be right. They also have a category for "extracurricular activities" which basically encompasses everything.
For AMCAS, you can list the job as Teaching or Employment. For the kid thing, you can list it as Teaching or Volunteer.

For AMCAS, in general, tutoring would not be looked at as Leadership, as you are not leading peers (aka, other tutors). But if you feel some elements of what you did were leadership-y, like taking initiative and applying new approaches to learning, etc, include those in your description to get "credit" for them.

Edit: ninjaed by LizzyM, the speed typist.
 
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Would managing a team of undergraduate researchers in your lab be considered peer leadership? While not every new undergraduate was allowed to stay, I solely coordinated schedules, taught them new techniques, assigned work, review expectations, etc.
 
Would managing a team of undergraduate researchers in your lab be considered peer leadership? While not every new undergraduate was allowed to stay, I solely coordinated schedules, taught them new techniques, assigned work, review expectations, etc.
Yes, I think that could be a valid entry under the heading "leadership" and the hours spent on it subtracted from the hours you'd otherwise count as "research".
 
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You can label tutoring kids for free as volunteer, non-clinical or as tutoring. It is your choice. You might not call it leadership unless you were leading a group of tutors (peer leader).

Many adcom members put a high value on service to others, particularly service to those who are not able to help themselves. Medicine is a service industry and the service is to all strata of society so having experience with the people you might not meet in everyday life and that you will care for as a student and resident (little to no choice in who you serve as a trainee, more when you are a practitioner) is important.

Just as you might get away with having a healthy offspring despite smoking, drinking and eating junk food, you might get into medical school without non-clinical volunteering but you might sleep better at night knowing you've done your best to assure a good outcome.
So say this candidate volunteered at a clinic for multiple hundred hours longer than they had to because they felt a commitment to the patients. Would that demonstrate such a commitment to serving a diverse population?
 
So say this candidate volunteered at a clinic for multiple hundred hours longer than they had to because they felt a commitment to the patients. Would that demonstrate such a commitment to serving a diverse population?

Some adcom members see that as "clinical" and while they can see that pre-meds want to be involved in "clinical" activities (although applicants have minimal skills in most cases), what they want to see is a willingness to serve people in ways that you are capable through non-clinical volunteering. Some believe that non-clinical volunteering is not "two birds with one stone" and therefore more indicative of a willingness to help the needy solely because they are in need of help and not because it "counts" as "clinical".
 
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Idk what the# of hours or whatever did for me, but my non-clinical volunteering has given me excellent stories to talk about in essays and interviews.
 
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Looking for opinions:

Lets say an applicant has:

Good Stats
Strong Leadership ECs
Good Clinical Experience (volunteer, shadowing & interning)
Good LORs
Publications/Research
Team Activities


BUT

no classical volunteer work listed on the primary application
(food shelter, homeless,community service, etc..)

would that tank the applicant in the eyes of the ADCOMs?


My roommate and I are arguing as to weather this would have a large enough effect to kill an application.
No
 
Many adcom members put a high value on service to others, particularly service to those who are not able to help themselves. Medicine is a service industry and the service is to all strata of society so having experience with the people you might not meet in everyday life and that you will care for as a student and resident (little to no choice in who you serve as a trainee, more when you are a practitioner) is important.
Thank you to @LizzyM and @Goro and @Lawper for providing useful comments about the importance of volunteering one's time in service to others. Many AdComs pay extra attention to those types of non-clinical volunteer hours/descriptions/ECs (coupled with the rest of the usual stuff - sGPA and MCAT).

By the way, and in case you're curious: many AdComs themselves participate in pro bono volunteer service because they/we really do care about others.
 
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