Loans for UMHS

[meddreamer21]

Hi!
I'm US.
I understand all problems of Caribs, not decide yet. When I do my research, I saw that UMHS has amazing match rate pretty same as SGU and Ross. Same anesthesia residency program have similar numbers of resident from all of 3. While SGU and Ross seems to total about 500k, UMHS significantly cheaper. BUT, I have no co-signer in states. Is that even possible to get loan for COA in UMHS without cosigner?

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[Gambino.]

"amazing match rate" lmao. The match rate only takes into account the percentage of people that pass and according to the latest info given to the world directory of medical schools, they have a whopping ~45% graduation rate. So of those 45%, 90% get a residency if UMHS is reporting accurately. So their real rate is closer to 40%.

Stop and think as to why UMHS doesn't have access to financial aid loans. It's because those loans require certain metrics from the school and they don't have to comply with that if they don't take the loans.

To answer your question though, it is next to impossible to secure all those loans privately without a cosigner or income stream.

 

[meddreamer21]

"amazing match rate" lmao. The match rate only takes into account the percentage of people that pass and according to the latest info given to the world directory of medical schools, they have a whopping ~45% graduation rate. So of those 45%, 90% get a residency if UMHS is reporting accurately. So their real rate is closer to 40%.

Stop and think as to why UMHS doesn't have access to financial aid loans. It's because those loans require certain metrics from the school and they don't have to comply with that if they don't take the loans.

To answer your question though, it is next to impossible to secure all those loans privately without a cosigner or income stream.

I'm glad you reply! I saw your posts about Caribs. If I calculate correctly COA of all 3 without food and interest is SGU(405k), Ross (366k), AUC(325k). I know people from my undergrad who went mostly to SGU and secure non FM-IM residency after it. However, I'm still ok with being FM/IM. Do you think there is any difference in match rate/success between thoose three?

 

[meddreamer21]

From world directory of medical schools I got this for 2019. However, it seems also strange, since I'm constantly hearing that SGU and Ross mostly same and the best, but AUC reports better results?

AUC	86,81055156
SGU	74,09152086
ROSS	75,47393365
MUA	70,4
UMHS	46,66666667

 

[stethan]

"amazing match rate" lmao. The match rate only takes into account the percentage of people that pass and according to the latest info given to the world directory of medical schools, they have a whopping ~45% graduation rate. So of those 45%, 90% get a residency if UMHS is reporting accurately. So their real rate is closer to 40%.

Stop and think as to why UMHS doesn't have access to financial aid loans. It's because those loans require certain metrics from the school and they don't have to comply with that if they don't take the loans.

To answer your question though, it is next to impossible to secure all those loans privately without a cosigner or income stream.

This is not necessarily true. Regarding the reason why UMHS doesn't have federal aid, oftentimes, it is also because federal aid, although considered great, is very quite a lot to deal with. From the need to have the majority of students be international to other metrics, it's not an easy thing to manage. Sure, lack of quality can prevent a school from having or wanting federal loans, but Sallie Mae is just as good, to be honest (in terms of getting funds for education). From the school's point of view, either they are just fine with Sallie Mae, or they can't qualify for federal. With their track record and history, I assume not the latter.

From world directory of medical schools I got this for 2019. However, it seems also strange, since I'm constantly hearing that SGU and Ross mostly same and the best, but AUC reports better results?

AUC	86,81055156
SGU	74,09152086
ROSS	75,47393365
MUA	70,4
UMHS	46,66666667

This data is self-reported, FYI.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

You need to expect IM/FM if you go Caribbean

 

[Gambino.]

From world directory of medical schools I got this for 2019. However, it seems also strange, since I'm constantly hearing that SGU and Ross mostly same and the best, but AUC reports better results?

AUC also has the smallest class size so the results can vary easier year by year but a 10% difference between them vs a 30% with UMHS is quite a stark difference. AUC is also owned by Adtalem, which also own Ross so you shouldn't expect vast differences as far as the class/reqs between them.

Sure, lack of quality can prevent a school from having or wanting federal loans, but Sallie Mae is just as good, to be honest (in terms of getting funds for education). From the school's point of view, either they are just fine with Sallie Mae, or they can't qualify for federal. With their track record and history, I assume not the latter.

Any school that can get federal loans would, it drastically increases the amount of students that can join their cohort. It is more of a headache for the school because the Dept of Ed. holds them more accountable for student outcomes and certain metrics regarding graduation rate and STEP pass rates.

This data is self-reported, FYI.

Self reported from the school to their accrediting agency which reports to WFME with consequences for falsifying data I believe. There's room for lying but at least for the Ross rate it sounds ballpark correct given the last class sizes when compared to the match list numbers.

 

[meddreamer21]

AUC also has the smallest class size so the results can vary easier year by year but a 10% difference between them vs a 30% with UMHS is quite a stark difference. AUC is also owned by Adtalem, which also own Ross so you shouldn't expect vast differences as far as the class/reqs between them.



Any school that can get federal loans would, it drastically increases the amount of students that can join their cohort. It is more of a headache for the school because the Dept of Ed. holds them more accountable for student outcomes and certain metrics regarding graduation rate and STEP pass rates.



Self reported from the school to their accrediting agency which reports to WFME with consequences for falsifying data I believe. There's room for lying but at least for the Ross rate it sounds ballpark correct given the last class sizes when compared to the match list numbers.

If rank Carib school, SGU, ROSS > AUC, AUA > MUA, SABA, SMUSOM?

 

[Gambino.]

If rank Carib school, SGU, ROSS > AUC, AUA > MUA, SABA, SMUSOM?

I think all that really should be considered would be the big 3. There's no reason to try and pinch pennies with a lesser known school as it doesn't matter how much you save if you don't match but if i had to, I'd rank them on a basis of name recognition, pass rate, match rate something along the lines of this.

T1: SGU = Ross = AUC
T2: Saba, AUA, MUA, UMHS
T3: SMUSOM, Trinity, SJSM, Xavier (Channel dedicated to uncovering lies of XUSOM/other schools by a former faculty)
T4: everything else

 

[meddreamer21]

I think all that really should be considered would be the big 3. There's no reason to try and pinch pennies with a lesser known school as it doesn't matter how much you save if you don't match but if i had to, I'd rank them on a basis of name recognition, pass rate, match rate something along the lines of this.

T1: SGU = Ross = AUC
T2: Saba, AUA, MUA, UMHS
T3: SMUSOM, Trinity, SJSM, Xavier (Channel dedicated to uncovering lies of XUSOM/other schools by a former faculty)
T4: everything else

Oh, I was told on reddit, AUA part of big 4 and they have big scholarships. Of course these scholarships not worth at the end if you don't match.

 

[meddreamer21]

So, I like AUC in general, it is not worse than SGU and ROSS?

 

[gyngyn]

Sure, lack of quality can prevent a school from having or wanting federal loans, but Sallie Mae is just as good, to be honest (in terms of getting funds for education).

One of the greatest benefits of Title IV is the option to use federal payback mechanisms.
A school either fails to meet minimum requirements to qualify or chooses to deny access to their students. An example of the latter is Northstate. Either way, this should be a warning to any prospective student (in addition to the above-mentioned cautions general to all Caribbean schools).

 

[Gambino.]

Oh, I was told on reddit, AUA part of big 4 and they have big scholarships. Of course these scholarships not worth at the end if you don't match.

AUA was real shady when I was applying there before I had the knowledge I do. They also had a string of alleged staff sexual assault allegations as well as a rather prolific leak of their student transcripts a few years back. The only people I know that went there are a few that failed out of Ross or couldn't get into the big 3. Regardless, I'd put them below the big 3. There even used to be a website called americanuniversityofantigua that highlighted all of these but I can no longer find it so it either got suppressed by google or was taken down. It used to be on the first page of searches back in 2019 when I was researching schools.

 

[Gambino.]

So, I like AUC in general, it is not worse than SGU and ROSS?

It's more or less the same. I actually liked AUC's class policies more than Ross when I was starting out but didn't look into them much when applying; carib schools change their policies rather often though (e.g. when I was applying SGU had mandatory in-person lecture which I didn't like compared to viewing it through Panopto at my own pace but they have since amended this policy I believe) so idk if it's still the same. It's nice if you prefer that island or want smaller class sizes but doesn't really change much of the end goal vs the other 2.

 

[meddreamer21]

It's more or less the same. I actually liked AUC's class policies more than Ross when I was starting out but didn't look into them much when applying; carib schools change their policies rather often though (e.g. when I was applying SGU had mandatory in-person lecture which I didn't like compared to viewing it through Panopto at my own pace but they have since amended this policy I believe) so idk if it's still the same. It's nice if you prefer that island or want smaller class sizes but doesn't really change much of the end goal vs the other 2.

AUC seems have best island and advertise on campus 1BR housing cheaper than shared ones in Ross. I have low MCAT, but high GPA 3.95. Do you think there should be a problem with big 3? Also, how performance on MCAT compare to USMLE. For now, USMLE seems for me more straightforward, since i'm not english native.

 

[Gambino.]

AUC seems have best island and advertise on campus 1BR housing cheaper than shared ones in Ross. I have low MCAT, but high GPA 3.95. Do you think there should be a problem with big 3? Also, how performance on MCAT compare to USMLE. For now, USMLE seems for me more straightforward, since i'm not english native.

Depends how low but high GPA does make up for low MCATs in carib schools (I know people with 3.7+ but mid 480s MCAT that were accepted into Ross for example). Most students have high GPA low MCAT or low GPA middle/high MCAT. Average MCAT for a Ross student is around a 493-495 if I remember correctly and average GPA was like 3.2-3.4.

I believe the data shows a correlation between higher MCAT scores and higher STEP 1 pass rates while GPA isn't as strongly correlated. USMLE shouldn't be understated though, it is a difficult exam, much more so than the MCAT. If you have that high of a GPA I'd recommend another try at the MCAT as even something in the low 500s can allow you to get into a DO school.

 

[meddreamer21]

Depends how low but high GPA does make up for low MCATs in carib schools (I know people with 3.7+ but mid 480s MCAT that were accepted into Ross for example). Most students have high GPA low MCAT or low GPA middle/high MCAT. Average MCAT for a Ross student is around a 493-495 if I remember correctly and average GPA was like 3.2-3.4.

I believe the data shows a correlation between higher MCAT scores and higher STEP 1 pass rates while GPA isn't as strongly correlated. USMLE shouldn't be understated though, it is a difficult exam, much more so than the MCAT. If you have that high of a GPA I'd recommend another try at the MCAT as even something in the low 500s can allow you to get into a DO school.

I have 498 MCAT. I think passage system and tricky questions on MCAT make me suffer because of English. So, in your opinion USMLE S1 was harder than MCAT? But it was harder because of amount of information needed or how exam is written? For example when I do diagnostic DAT (I got 23-24, which is high for most school; DAT is easier than MCAT in general, but also it has no passages. more straightforward)

 

[Gambino.]

I have 498 MCAT. I think passage system and tricky questions on MCAT make me suffer because of English. So, in your opinion USMLE S1 was harder than MCAT? But it was harder because of amount of information needed or how exam is written? For example when I do diagnostic DAT (I got 23-24, which is high for most school; DAT is easier than MCAT in general, but also it has no passages. more straightforward)

I mean people may feel differently but USMLE questions are also worded in a way to trip you up in my experience. The questions are knowledge based but they do love throwing in red herring info or stating things in a way they can be misconstrued. This is how the questions are written on NBME/Uworld/CBSSA but I haven't taken the real deal yet due to having to take a medical LOA after pre-clinicals were finished. I recently got that diagnosed and started on treatment so I should be taking it in the coming months finally.

 

[meddreamer21]

I mean people may feel differently but USMLE questions are also worded in a way to trip you up in my experience. The questions are knowledge based but they do love throwing in red herring info or stating things in a way they can be misconstrued. This is how the questions are written on NBME/Uworld/CBSSA but I haven't taken the real deal yet due to having to take a medical LOA after pre-clinicals were finished. I recently got that diagnosed and started on treatment so I should be taking it in the coming months finally.

I thought you are already graduated Ross. Don't know why I thought that. Hope you will get well soon and nail steps!

 

[deleted1172364]

"amazing match rate" lmao. The match rate only takes into account the percentage of people that pass and according to the latest info given to the world directory of medical schools, they have a whopping ~45% graduation rate. So of those 45%, 90% get a residency if UMHS is reporting accurately. So their real rate is closer to 40%.

Stop and think as to why UMHS doesn't have access to financial aid loans. It's because those loans require certain metrics from the school and they don't have to comply with that if they don't take the loans.

To answer your question though, it is next to impossible to secure all those loans privately without a cosigner or income stream.

Thy don’t have access to us federal loans because legally they can’t. The big Caribbean schools passed a law together that blocks any one of them from getting their hands on it. I feel it’s only a matter of time before they are allowed to have it.

 

[medschoolletsgo]

Thy don’t have access to us federal loans because legally they can’t. The big Caribbean schools passed a law together that blocks any one of them from getting their hands on it. I feel it’s only a matter of time before they are allowed to have it.

Here's what they told us in November 23.

• UMHS is NOT eligible to apply for participation in the US Federal Student Aid programs
• § As you may recall from entrance counseling, UMHS does not meet the criteria for an eligible institution as outlined in the Higher Education Act as reauthorized (the set of laws governing the federal student aid programs)
• · The law requires Foreign Medical Schools to “have had a clinical training program approved by a State prior to January 1, 2008”
• o UMHS was not developed to this point by this date
• o Until this language is redacted or revised, UMHS will not qualify for federal student aid.

 

[Highlander455]

All i need now is someone who can tell me where to get a room to rent. budget 300 -500$/mon

First of all, you would likely get a better response to this post if it was in its own thread instead of cross posted to several unrelated threads.

Second, and I'm sure others will correct me if they think I'm wrong, based on my knowledge of typical rents in St Maarten, I suspect your housing budget is completely unrealistic.

For comparison, shared AUC student housing is $5,000 US per semester. This is roughly double the top of your budget. Most 2 br apartments that you might share with a roommate will go for at least $2,500 US a month, making your half over $1,000 a month.

Not wanting to be discouraging, but even if you find a room at $300 to $500 a month, I suspect it will be far from ideal, eg no internet included, poor quality accommodations, far from campus, shopping, restaurants, etc.

The sad reality is St Maarten is a tourist island and it is an expensive place to live.

Finally, I'm concerned that if you're this far off in your estimates and budgeting for rents, and operating on this tight a budget, there is a high probability you will not be able to afford to complete the program and will end up thousands of dollars in debt with nothing to show for it. Completing a degree at AUC or any Carribean school is going to run you $300,000 to $400,000. Your housing challenges won't stop once yiu leave the island. You will have to find housing over and over again in various locations for elective rotations.

Im not anti Caribbean, but its not an easy route for many reasons.

Bottom line, I strongly encourage you to take a hard look at your budget and ensure it is realistic.

All that said, if you are determined to pursue this, check out the links below for housing resources:

American University of the Caribbean Housing

American University of the Caribbean Housing - There are multiple housing options to consider when attending AUC in Sint Maarten or in the UK. Let AUC's medical school help you find a home that's safe and comfortable for your studies.

www.aucmed.edu

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[kelvindown]

Thanks Highlander455

I know is going to be hell. the odd are against me that I already know. I pray I find someone who can recommend me to landlord to rent a place for that budget. Thanks anyway for your feedback