MSAR 2019 is out

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NerdTheRaging said:
Can anyone be a pal and provide the 25%, median, 75% MCAT and GPA for Einstein? For acceptees and matriculants, please. I will give you The biggest pre med love hug ever.
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Accepted
MCAT:513/516/518
gpa:3.72/3.83/3.92

Matriculated
MCAT:514/515/517
gpa:3.71/3.82/3.93
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Can someone please post provide the 25%, median, 75% MCAT and GPA for Oklahoma? For acceptees and matriculants Thank you
 
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TempuraOreos said:
Dang, according to this MSAR, my MCAT would have barely scratched the 10th%tile of a bunch of the top schools I applied to this cycle. That's wild!
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I think every accepted student will feel lucky when they view the next MSAR stats come out. Good luck to the freshman premeds who will need to pack their bags for the Caribbean with a 510.

Side note, I saw your other post about deciding between *insert top 10 school here*. Have you decided on where you're going?
 
samualjhatfield said:
All y’all askin...just pay the $28. It is the cheapest part of your application except for Casper...
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Some might be asking because they are already accepted and don't want to waste 28$ just for a quick average. I remember complaining about people asking last year 😉
 
efle said:
Oh yikes that makes it even worse. It's not that they are just shy of a significantly higher average. It's that half of 524+ and half of 514 are literally indistinguishable from each other.
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Well this is honestly good news to those of us who didn't get a high MCAT :/
 
TempuraOreos said:
Dang, according to this MSAR, my MCAT would have barely scratched the 10th%tile of a bunch of the top schools I applied to this cycle. That's wild!
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The current MSAR is for the applicants from last year. We were always looking at 2 year old data. Now, it shows us what the most recent standards that we were competing against were. Your MCAT did in fact barely scratch the 10%tile of schools you applied to, as did mine.
 
efle said:
Unless my stats basics are completely failing me right now, doesn't this chart also show that half of 524-528 scorers would be contained within the 80% CIs of values 10 points lower? Like if most people up there wouldn't even be outliers in a 514 avg classroom, let alone 518 or 520, what the hell are they in such high demand for?
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yah thats right, but the marginal increase in the floor would be *something*. Not arguing the differences are meaningful, but there might be some marginal performance benefit obtained at 524+
 
scrapy said:
The current MSAR is for the applicants from last year. We were always looking at 2 year old data. Now, it shows us what the most recent standards that we were competing against were. Your MCAT did in fact barely scratch the 10%tile of schools you applied to, as did mine.
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I think it actually shows the year PRIOR to you, that is, it's the group of students that just enrolled into M1 about 6-7 months ago.

The cohort you guys just competed against is probably going to turn out even more skewed.
 
efle said:
I think it actually shows the year PRIOR to you, that is, it's the group of students that just enrolled into M1 about 6-7 months ago.

The cohort you guys just competed against is probably going to turn out even more skewed.
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I'm just thinking that schools use this 1 year old data when accepting people. Maybe the data that results from our cycle will have even steeper standards, but that's just because schools are able to trade up overall as more qualified applicants apply. I think MSAR data that represents us next year will be but a mere reflection, whereas what we see now is what the school has in mind.
 
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samualjhatfield said:
I mean, you can enter your MCAT and GPA now...That feature alone is worth $3 of ‘nifty’ points.
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Meh... I always felt it was a bit ridiculous how we have to pay for this in the first place. It's just GPA/MCAT data.
 
doctorcocter said:
Meh... I always felt it was a bit ridiculous how we have to pay for this in the first place. It's just GPA/MCAT data.
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The GPA/MCAT data is probably one of the least informative pieces of information about a school itself in MSAR.
 
doctorcocter said:
Meh... I always felt it was a bit ridiculous how we have to pay for this in the first place. It's just GPA/MCAT data.
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You can judge in-state bias, military friendliness, non-read friendliness, the different pathways/programs, the average indebtedness, housing options etc.
 
Would it be possible to obtain the 25%, median, 75% MCAT and GPA for acceptees and matriculants for OHSU? Thank you so much!!
 
doctorcocter said:
I disagree. It's what the last 4 pages have mostly been about.
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Because those are the things students are most concerned about when they are just worrying about getting in.

Once the hurdle of “Am I good enough” is cleared, The truly important information about the schools is the rest of it.
 
Well, you can look up the instate vs out-of-state percentages interviewed for public programs. If that lets you cross off any state schools that are unfriendly to out-of-state applicants, then it's paid for itself several times over. Primary+secondary ain't cheap. A lot of people probably waste hundreds of dollars on certain state schools because they never know about that tool.
 
efle said:
Well, you can look up the instate vs out-of-state percentages interviewed for public programs. If that lets you cross off any state schools that are unfriendly to out-of-state applicants, then it's paid for itself several times over. Primary+secondary ain't cheap. A lot of people probably waste hundreds of dollars on certain state schools because they never know about that tool.
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That is why University of Washington still gets >7000 OOR applications every year...people look at the publicly available data and see “WTF, this T20 school has low tuition and only a 3.7/510 average!? And it’s in Seattle!” When they literally do not accept anyone outside of WWAMI.
 
samualjhatfield said:
That is why University of Washington still gets >7000 OOR applications every year...people look at the publicly available data and see “WTF, this T20 school has low tuition and only a 3.7/510 average!? And it’s in Seattle!” When they literally do not accept anyone outside of WWAMI.
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I think Wyoming+AMI might be part of that 7000 though? Or does the MSAR know to include all of WWAMI under "instate"?
 
efle said:
I think Wyoming+AMI might be part of that 7000 though? Or does the MSAR know to include all of WWAMI under "instate"?
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This year there were 8000 OOS, so I lowered it by 1,000. Figured that there were as many WAMI applicants as there were Washington.
 
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efle said:
I think Wyoming+AMI might be part of that 7000 though? Or does the MSAR know to include all of WWAMI under "instate"?
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And that is what makes it misleading, even to people with MSAR. They see “300 OOS interviews with 130 OOS acceptances”. When every single one of those was a Wyoming+AMI.

And this story holds true for many public schools. Better not apply to UNC OOS without a 3.6/514. Etc.
 
https://www.aamc.org/download/321508/data/factstablea23.pdf

From this grid (which compiles the cycles for the past 2 recent years), on average around 2100 students with a 517+ and 3.8+ are admitted each year. So to be generous, I would say half of these students also have a 520+. Thus on estimation, 1050 students with a 520+ and 3.8+ are admitted each year. Out of the 12 schools that have average accepted stats of MCATs with 520, it's a safe bet to say that each school averages 50 students with a 520+ 3.8+. That means out of the approximately 1050 students who are applying each year with a 520+ 3.8+, around 3/5 are going to these schools. That's a crazy high proportion.

Seems like the stratification of students keep increasing as schools race to rank up

Also I wonder how Hofstra and WMed as new medical schools are attracting high caliber students
 
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TSHJB302 said:
I know someone who was a marine, had a 4.00 GPA, and a 515 MCAT. He only applied to two mid-tier schools because his wife just became a manager at her restaurant, so he had to stay nearby. So far he still hasn't heard back...super unfortunate.
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samualjhatfield said:
Just goes to show even with phenomenal stats and a 'wow' factor, the process is just too random to bank on applying to only a few schools.
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You don’t know the rest of his app. If all he did was write about being a marine, then that explains it. I know multiple military applicants with <4.0 and ~516 MCATs who got into top ten schools (including Harvard).
 
Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
You don’t know the rest of his app. If all he did was write about being a marine, then that explains it. I know multiple military applicants with <4.0 and ~516 MCATs who got into top ten schools (including Harvard).
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I’ve actually spoken to him about it at length and I do know the rest of his app. He was severely lacking in clinical experience. I posted mainly to show that grades and MCAT are not enough, especially if you don’t cast your net wide enough.
 
TSHJB302 said:
I’ve actually spoken to him about it at length and I do know the rest of his app. He was severely lacking in clinical experience. I posted mainly to show that grades and MCAT are not enough, especially if you don’t cast your net wide enough.
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That was really directed at the poster who replied to you.
 
doctorcocter said:
Meh... I always felt it was a bit ridiculous how we have to pay for this in the first place. It's just GPA/MCAT data.
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That's a very naive view of the data in MSAR. The info on # of people with post-bac experience, and the IS/OOS rations alone are worth the price to help help guide people. The $28 will be more than paid back by saving people money from not submitting wasted apps
 
New MSAR matches with AAMC data sheets which came out Last August or September. Why so late. It is pretty lame to have MSAR updated so late. I would say atleast 6 months late. This data will be updated after all the admissions are done for 2020 cycle.
With Medians going up 512 has become average as compared to few years ago when it was 510
 
Goro said:
That's a very naive view of the data in MSAR. The info on # of people with post-bac experience, and the IS/OOS rations alone are worth the price to help help guide people. The $28 will be more than paid back by saving people money from not submitting wasted apps
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Even so, this process often feels like it is designed to extract as much money out of applicants as humanly possibly. I think it's quite telling that you have to cough up 28$ just to get vital information needed to even begin planning your application.
 
wontonsoup said:
Even so, this process often feels like it is designed to extract as much money out of applicants as humanly possibly. I think it's quite telling that you have to cough up 28$ just to get vital information needed to even begin planning your application.
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The tuition bubble is a better target than the $28 spent for access to an incredibly useful document IMO
 
So if you don’t meet the 10 percentile for total MCAT score or for one of the subsections to a school would it be a waste of time applying there?
 
wontonsoup said:
Even so, this process often feels like it is designed to extract as much money out of applicants as humanly possibly. I think it's quite telling that you have to cough up 28$ just to get vital information needed to even begin planning your application.
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LukaDoncicLuk said:
The tuition bubble is a better target than the $28 spent for access to an incredibly useful document IMO
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samualjhatfield said:
Agreed. The entire application process (Primary, secondaries, interviews, etc.) costs about as much as the first month of Medical school.

The application price is a barrier for many, but it is the least expensive part of medical school.
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Medical school is a seller's market and has been for quite some time. We can whine and b***h all we want but we're also all the same suckers who are/were willing to give up an organ if it meant guaranteed admissions to a U.S. MD program. They keep raising the costs because they can. They'll stop when they can't. For those who truly can't afford the process, they have the FAP.
 
curbsideconsult said:
Medical school is a seller's market and has been for quite some time. We can whine and b***h all we want but we're also all the same suckers who are/were willing to give up an organ if it meant guaranteed admissions to a U.S. MD program. They keep raising the costs because they can. They'll stop when they can't. For those who truly can't afford the process, they have the FAP.
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Down side for FAP is it knocks out a HUUUGE chunk of students who are self supporting through school but they have middle class parents.
 
samualjhatfield said:
Same with say cGPA. Like, if you are <3.7 should you even apply T10 (assume median MCAT)
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It's definitely worth it to apply to top schools if you have a top MCAT. Even with a gpa of <3.4 there are some schools that will consider you if you have a >524 MCAT (from my experience). I can imagine that someone with a 3.5-3.7 would have a lot of success if they have a >524 MCAT
 
The score creep will likely continue to worsen:

A4EVJ9C.jpg


Also the score creep is well known: TIL one decade ago, average MCATs at top medical schools were ~32-34
 
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