Need some advice from military veterans who enlisted before applying

[sky1025]

Hello all,

I will really appreciate if any veterans out there can give me some feedback on their military experiences. To begin with, I am a DACA recipient in CA (lived here since 2002) and graduated from UCLA last year with BS in Physiology. I planned on applying to medical schools this upcoming cycle since I finished my pre-reqs, MCAT, and had plenty of clinical experience (some research, but focused more on clinical experience because I found research did not interest me so much).

However, applying as DACA was always a great concern for me, and last year the Army expanded MAVNI (which allows non-citizens with foreign language knowledge or health specialty to join) to DACA recipients until FY 2016 and I just decided to enlist this month, which will put me in an expedited process to US citizenship. I'm hopeful this will put me in a good situation when I apply in the future with extraordinary background and experiences.

And here is where I have some questions for you guys:

1) I was contemplating going in as between Active Duty and Army Reserve, but decided to go in as Active Duty because I know I want as less distraction as possible when I go to medical school. I thought of the possibility of unpredictable deployment and consistent physical training during medical school that can really mess up my education. But if there's anyone out there who had done AR during medical school, how were your experiences? Will it be better for me to just finish my obligation and concentrate on education afterwards?

2) Will I be able to take classes during my service? I'm thinking about MOS 68 series, so I know that will be a big factor. But I recently contacted numerous medical schools and their admissions office told me it is recommended to show recent academic success before applying. This can show I am still academically prepared for medical schoo.

3) MAVNI obligation is 8 years. at least 4 yrs AD and the rest IRR. How likely is it to be called back during IRR (which will be when I apply/will be attending medical school).

4) One recruiter told me I am eligible for OCS when I am not (not a US citizen) and told me against going in as an enlist. Even if I do, he told me to apply for OCS in the earliest opportunity but I honestly don't know what the differences could be. Does this really matter?

5) How did you like the military experience as an enlist? Do you think it helped you in becoming a better doctor? IMO I will enjoy it a lot since I am really into serving others and staying physically active, but there are others who are concerned for obvious reasons.

Thank you in advance to everyone who cared to share your opinions. Sorry I have so many questions, but I just have a lot of things going on in my mind at this moment.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Gibby]

OP, those are some complicated questions. PM me and I can give you some insight. I am not in medical school yet (applying this cycle), but I know the military. Currently an Aviation Officer and UH-60 pilot for the National Guard. I've been active duty as well. I think I can help or at least point you in the right direction.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[68PGunner]

PM me if you want more details on the enlisted side. Things end up working out for me. However being an enlisted soldier in a line unit sucks major balls.

 

[Gibby]

PM me if you want more details on the enlisted side. Things end up working out for me. However being an enlisted soldier in a line unit sucks major balls.

He speaks truth...lots of valuable growth, but major balls.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[KaBoom'd]

You ask some tough questions. I'm applying this year as well, but one benefit to service is perspective. If I were 18-20 years old again, I'd do it all over the same way. Beware that everyone's experience is unique; some don't remember it as fondly as others.

I was enlisted active for nearly 8 years, but 68PGunner probably had a much different experience than I. The line is a tough world looking in from the outside. As a rule, I wouldn't plan on being able to take any classes the first 2 years of a 4 year contract. It could definitely happen, but not something to count on. The last thing you want to do is show up to your first unit and ask about getting time for classes day 2. Online is a different deal.

How is your GPA now? I only ask because you most likely won't be able to do major gpa repair while you're active. If you want to take a couple courses your final year to show you can still do the work, that's one thing. But, in my uneducated opinion, doing well on the MCAT the year before you apply with good coursework that is only 4 or 5 years old should be fine I would think? Someone stop me if I'm wrong.

Either way, if medical school is your goal then definitely do something medical in service. It will make all of those other experiences like shadowing and clinical time much easier to come by. Good luck, and pm me if you have any questions as well, but start with your man 68PGunner.

Sent from my SM-N910P using SDN mobile

 

[Tipsy McStagger]

1) I was contemplating going in as between Active Duty and Army Reserve, but decided to go in as Active Duty because I know I want as less distraction as possible when I go to medical school. I thought of the possibility of unpredictable deployment and consistent physical training during medical school that can really mess up my education. But if there's anyone out there who had done AR during medical school, how were your experiences? Will it be better for me to just finish my obligation and concentrate on education afterwards?

You will have significant difficulty being in the reserves and trying to attend medical school simultaneously. It will be impossible to do both active duty and medical school simultaneously. My suggestion would be to enlist active duty, spend your active time and then apply for medical school during your IRR time.

2) Will I be able to take classes during my service? I'm thinking about MOS 68 series, so I know that will be a big factor. But I recently contacted numerous medical schools and their admissions office told me it is recommended to show recent academic success before applying. This can show I am still academically prepared for medical schoo.

You can take some classes, but they will likely not be significant for medical school admissions. Depending on the unit to which you are assigned, you will have some time or practically no time to work on these classes. I would recommend that you dedicate the next few years toward your service and any non-academic aspects of your application should come in the nature of shadowing.

3) MAVNI obligation is 8 years. at least 4 yrs AD and the rest IRR. How likely is it to be called back during IRR (which will be when I apply/will be attending medical school).

Tough question, as of now I'd say it's highly unlikely. I left at a time when people in my unit were being called back regularly. When I left they had a deal where you could join the national guard and that would prohibit them from recalling you to active duty. You also had a 2 year reprieve from being deployed again. In 4 years time it is difficult to say what the military-political climate will be; this is what will ultimately determine whether you will be recalled or not.

4) One recruiter told me I am eligible for OCS when I am not (not a US citizen) and told me against going in as an enlist. Even if I do, he told me to apply for OCS in the earliest opportunity but I honestly don't know what the differences could be. Does this really matter?

You need a security clearance to be an officer. I think you must be a US citizen to even obtain a "Secret" level clearance. Just focus on staying enlisted.

5) How did you like the military experience as an enlist? Do you think it helped you in becoming a better doctor? IMO I will enjoy it a lot since I am really into serving others and staying physically active, but there are others who are concerned for obvious reasons.

Best and worst times of my life. I won't say it will make me a better doctor, but it definitely gave me perspective that can't be gained any other way.

 

[68PGunner]

Disclaimer:

I advise the OP to go reserve to get his citizenship while maintaining the flexibility to work on his medical school application. Once accepted, the OP should take his branch HPSP in order to avoid any distraction during his medical school and residency years. If possible, I advise him to avoid the military period. However, if the military is necessary, this is in my opinion his best course of action.

 

[Tipsy McStagger]

Disclaimer:

I advise the OP to go reserve to get his citizenship while maintaining the flexibility to work on his medical school application. Once accepted, the OP should take his branch HPSP in order to avoid any distraction during his medical school and residency years. If possible, I advise him to avoid the military period. However, if the military is necessary, this is in my opinion his best course of action.

This plan is definitely feasible. I think the reason I counseled against it was because OP already has a college degree, seemed decided on joining and has finished all pre-reqs. I am not a big fan of HPSP unless you know that military medicine is what you really want to do, and I think that is a difficult decision to make before you know what you will specialize in (which usually won't happen until you're well into med school).

"Avoiding the military period" is not at all bad advice, especially considering we've been at war for the past 15 years. Even though things at home do not appear to be representative of that, military men and women are in fact put in harms way on a daily/nightly basis. It's difficult to appreciate that unless/until you've been under that pressure. But I also can't comment on what the landscape is like for a non-US citizen trying to gain admittance to a US allopathic or osteopathic medical school.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Being a reservist in medical school is a bad idea. OP, the opening of MAVNI to DACA folks is a potential very short window to fix your immigration status and one you should jump on (you are making the right decision). Enlisting in the Army is not going to be the high point of your life but you get a bigger prize than anyone else I know and that changes the calculus (someone could sue and kill the DACA program tomorrow and you could be back to being deported to a place you may not even remember). Who knows what will happen this fall but once you are in the Army, you'll get to the finish line. IMO, you should look at your service time as separate from your future goals. Get citizenship, finish your obligation and depart the service a honored Veteran with voc rehab and GI Bill benefits. Then apply to medical school after the military. They won't care that your grades are old. Your story will be compelling. If you are competitive statistically for med school now, you'll be competitive in a few years. Don't worry about getting a medical MOS. Avoid being a grunt. Don't sweat the IRR time.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Disclaimer:

I advise the OP to go reserve to get his citizenship while maintaining the flexibility to work on his medical school application. Once accepted, the OP should take his branch HPSP in order to avoid any distraction during his medical school and residency years. If possible, I advise him to avoid the military period. However, if the military is necessary, this is in my opinion his best course of action.

Disagree. This takes 4 years of pain and turns it into 2 decades. He should enlist, keep his head down and GTFO as soon as his donut of misery is complete. He'll be smarter than every officer he meets but that won't make him unique.

 

[Gastrapathy]

I also thought MAVNI for DACA didn't include spanish speakers. I hope you speak a critical language and haven't been strung along.

 

[sky1025]

Thank you. I really appreciate all the replies. I just wanted to update my status with everyone who bothered to care about my situation haha. I decided to enlist as an active duty. The whole MAVNI program closed indefinitely at the end of June, and I was one of the lucky few people who swore the oath right before it closed. I chose AD over reserves because since I knew joining the military was the best option for me at the moment, I wanted to go all for it.
I've been staying away from this thread because I was afraid of seeing other responses that could have discouraged me about my decision. But now I feel like it was the right choice, and I am just grateful I decided to join.

I just hope I get to enjoy the next few years in service like nothing else in m life regardless of other negatives that may come with it. And then apply once I am honorably discharged. At the moment, I wasn't sure if I wanted to pursue military medicine even before putting myself into the field. Now I am just waiting for my SSBI to finish before I ship out in June next year. I don't get to select my MOS before the investigation is cleared, so I am just thinking about which MOS could really help me in the future.In the meantime, I am just living my life with a full-time work and a lot of future soldier training.

Thank you everyone, and best of luck to all of you in your life in whatever you do; esp @KaBoom'd - with your application this year.

 

[trev5150]

major balls.

i hear he got promoted to LtCol, edging out Maj, Issues, Maj, Uproar, Maj. Considerations, Maj. Catastrophe and Maj. Delays. He's on the fast track to General Mayem.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Yikes. I thought the window might be short but I didn't think it was 6 weeks. The first couple years will go by quickly. Don't tell anyone of your aspirations to be a MD. Good luck

 

[trev5150]

How to survive an enlistment:
1 - Do your job well.
2 - STFU, don't bitch and moan about how much it sucks.
3 - Save your money, don't buy anything - houses, cars, big stereos
4 - Don't get married
5 - Don't have any kids
6 - Don't waste any of your tuition money or GI Bill benefits on online schools or courses.
7 - Don't put any money into TSP, unless you plan on retiring from the military or federal service. They make it a pain in the a$$ to roll over to 401K. You're better off taking that money and making a max annual contribution to an IRA.
8 - Enlisted service will insult your intelligence every single day. You will be spoken to as if you are a complete *****. Don't react. Just follow 1-8, keep calm and carry on.

 

[Red Lobster Actual]

so I am just thinking about which MOS could really help me in the future.

18D

I am half jesting of course. However, being half serious there is one medical school in the US that will de facto give you an acceptance if you come from that community assuming you have par GPA and MCAT. Then again, finishing the Q Course is...heh...difficult to put it mildly and the possibility of career ending disability and death is non-trivial. Plus, going down that path will increase your enlistment time.

Otherwise, what ever job they put you in, just do it diligently like everyone else said above.

Stay healthy...you would not want to do anything to prevent you from boot camp in a year.

Good luck, by the end of the next few years you will have definitely earned your citizenship.

 

[esob]

My only advice is that if you get an advanced medical specialty (like lab tech), make sure you have crystal clarity on what they will be offering for college credit, lest you end up like me with 60 semester hrs of B's (even though my performance was all A's) since my courses were considered P/F. If you're a D student then free B's seems like a win but when you're an A student and applying to medical schools with that many B's it can crush your GPA.

 

[sky1025]

Thanks for all the inputs.

Don't tell anyone of your aspirations to be a MD

Do you think it's also a bad idea to inform my sergeants or COC in the unit? I thought it might help me find clinical/shadowing opportunities with the Army physicians or surgeons.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

How to survive an enlistment:
1 - Do your job well.
2 - STFU, don't bitch and moan about how much it sucks.
3 - Save your money, don't buy anything - houses, cars, big stereos
4 - Don't get married
5 - Don't have any kids
6 - Don't waste any of your tuition money or GI Bill benefits on online schools or courses.
7 - Don't put any money into TSP, unless you plan on retiring from the military or federal service. They make it a pain in the a$$ to roll over to 401K. You're better off taking that money and making a max annual contribution to an IRA.
8 - Enlisted service will insult your intelligence every single day. You will be spoken to as if you are a complete *****. Don't react. Just follow 1-8, keep calm and carry on.

Great post, but I disagree with 3 and 4. I got married after being in for a little over a year, and while it made going away more difficult, it made the ridiculous **** that happens in port a lot easier. Same with my two kids.

Don't waste your TA or GI Bill on online labs or prereq courses, for sure.

And read number 8 over and over again. Try to remember why you're doing it. Four years flies by in the service.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Thanks for all the inputs.



Do you think it's also a bad idea to inform my sergeants or COC in the unit? I thought it might help me find clinical/shadowing opportunities with the Army physicians or surgeons.

Only towards the end of your service commitment. Telling your CoC will ensure you never get sent to cool schools or given any interesting opportunities. Telling your peers will produce one of two reactions: 1) they will resent you for aspiring to something else (if they are enlisted lifers, or 2) they will not care. No real benefit either way.

I only told my CoC because I need their approval to submit my EMDP2 package. Luckily, they were/are supportive.

 

[trev5150]

Thanks for all the inputs.



Do you think it's also a bad idea to inform my sergeants or COC in the unit? I thought it might help me find clinical/shadowing opportunities with the Army physicians or surgeons.

Everything you plan to do after you get out is none of anyone's business. Any commander's duty is to get the most out of you while you're there. What you want to is a dead-last concern. If you're not in a medical MOS you're not going to get any clinical experience of any value.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Enlisted or officer? There's a difference. Either way, you're one of the lucky ones. I came to regard weddings as pregnancy announcement/pre-divorce parties.

Enlisted.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Disagree with #7. The G Fund in TSP is very useful in retirement. If you have any $ in TSP, you can add more later ( after service). You should keep a little there to keep your options open.