Need Some Useful Advice

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Dr.Inviz

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Ever since my recent interview, I have been thinking about quitting the entire process and re-taking the MCAT. Having acknowledged exagerrated BS that is on a particular letter has made me realize why I have not heard from any school that screens interviews based on a complete file (except one school somehow). My family situation is getting worse and my mom's hour long phone convos busting my ass about me not doing well enough on the MCAT is making things worse and adding to the tension that already exists within the family, which undoubtedly puts more pressure on myself. I really feel that I must stay in-state for medical school to put everyone, and myself, more at ease. I did the same for undergrad mainly for family and didnt bother to apply anywhere else. I also have a wonderful RA job that would be located 5 mins from the medical school campus. My only problem is that I could be giving up potential acceptances in the name of taking a year off, retaking the mcat, and MAYBE getting into the instate med school. I guess me being more or less sarcastic lately is because of the several things going on, and finally, I want some advice ... normally I'd go to a real advisor, like a premed advisor, but the person is the one who wrote exagerrated BS and apparently fosters much hatred and bitter sentiments towards me and unprofessionally decided to write it in my letter rather than confronting me about it ... shocking.

I guess my questions is, what am I to do ... ? Thanks.
 
Ever since my recent interview, I have been thinking about quitting the entire process and re-taking the MCAT. Having acknowledged exagerrated BS that is on a particular letter has made me realize why I have not heard from any school that screens interviews based on a complete file (except PCOM-GA somehow). My family situation is getting worse and my mom's hour long phone convos busting my ass about me not doing well enough on the MCAT is making things worse and adding to the tension that already exists within the family, which undoubtedly puts more pressure on myself. I really feel that I must stay in-state for medical school to put everyone, and myself, more at ease. I did the same for undergrad mainly for family and didnt bother to apply anywhere else. I also have a wonderful RA job that would be located 5 mins from the medical school campus. My only problem is that I could be giving up potential acceptances in the name of taking a year off, retaking the mcat, and MAYBE getting into the instate med school. I guess me being more or less sarcastic lately is because of the several things going on, and finally, I want some advice ... normally I'd go to a real advisor, like a premed advisor, but the person is the one who wrote exagerrated BS and apparently fosters much hatred and bitter sentiments towards me and unprofessionally decided to write it in my letter rather than confronting me about it ... shocking.

I guess my questions is, what am I to do ... ? Thanks.


If you wait for a year to get accepted into in state school, you are loosing on average $150000. Sacrificing a year means loosing one year of salary as a doctor. If there is significat difference in tution and living expenses, then go for it. Otherwise it is not worth it. Whatever you do, good luck.
 
If your getting interviews, go on them.... and if you get accepted and you like to school, then go.... But this whole process it a pain in the ass... I ended up retaking the damn mcat 3 times because Id get an interview then they would waitlist me... Its a good idea to start looking over the mcat stuff because if you dont get in you will probably wanna retake it to improve your chances next time... also, get somebody else to write your lor's if they werent helping.. I had some problems with a professor telling me that oh yeah Im mailing it this week and eventually I ended up missing the deadline for 4 of the schools I had applied..
 
Do what you have to do. Inevitably, this comes down to how much you value 1) going to med school 2) the money you've already spent 3) keeping doors open (if you turn down acceptances and don't matriculate somewhere, schools are going to ask questions..)

My situation is somewhat similar. I have dated a girl for the better part of 7 years... we are engaged, yet it looks as though I may have to move 600 miles away bc I didn't get a better GPA. Will I move? Yes, because this is a career decision and she fully supports me (although she is not happy to relocate). Your family can either support that decision or not.

Unfortunately, the decisions you make carry much more burden than they used to only a few years ago. Growing up is a tough time for all of us, so I wish you the best of luck with your decision! Taking a year off isn't the end of the world if you are REALLY going to work at the MCAT. I spent a semester studying for about 10 hours weekly outside of Kaplan (9 hours/wk). It takes work and perserverance and actually working through entire exams... you have to work on not only studying by improving your test-taking ability through actually timing yourself by section and/or passage. Every little thing counts on test-day.

Best of luck to you and let me know if there is anything that I can help you with...:luck:
 
If your getting interviews, go on them.... and if you get accepted and you like to school, then go.... But this whole process it a pain in the ass... I ended up retaking the damn mcat 3 times because Id get an interview then they would waitlist me... Its a good idea to start looking over the mcat stuff because if you dont get in you will probably wanna retake it to improve your chances next time... also, get somebody else to write your lor's if they werent helping.. I had some problems with a professor telling me that oh yeah Im mailing it this week and eventually I ended up missing the deadline for 4 of the schools I had applied..

well, my professors wrote me stellar LORs, the problem is the premed committee letter written by my premed advisor ...

also, instate tuition would be 11K per year, while I'd be getting about 7.3K from my RA job .. and no living expenses.
OOS schools would be 30K+, not including living costs and other stuff.

I have a 3.7 cum, 3.6 sci GPA and my current MCAT is a 24, and no, I was never satisfied with it; however, I felt I'd be okay regardless. Problem is, as things are getting closer into it, things with my family have been detoriating (not only because of this, there have been several reasons and my family was really never stable) ...

I feel I could probably get into the DO schools that have granted me an interview based on my ability to defend myself given off-guard situations, as was presented in my recent interview. They must also take everything else into consideration and not strictly the BS premed letter ...

however, I still face several dilemmas either way ... and am not sure what to do.
 
If you wait for a year to get accepted into in state school, you are loosing on average $150000. Sacrificing a year means loosing one year of salary as a doctor. If there is significat difference in tution and living expenses, then go for it. Otherwise it is not worth it. Whatever you do, good luck.

That was exactly my father's opinion of it all .. and which is why I had applied Mid October and was complete by end of Nov/beginning of Dec.

I really did not wish to apply for this cycle, but was pretty much threatened to do so by my father (or I'd get cut off). So, I applied. Now, my mom isnt happy because I will have to likely be out of the state (she doesnt care DO or MD, she understands everything but just doesnt want me to be out of state because of the family problems, and my dad's not happy now that he found out I have applied to osteopathic schools and received only interviews from them ... and recently he had bypass surgery and is taking advantage of it by not doing anything at all and forcing us to do every little thing ...)

My whole intention was to retake the MCAT, hopefully score well, and apply only instate; however, knowing my MCAT situation, I knew I couldnt this year ...

I feel that the average age of MS-1s is around 23 or 24, im only 21 .. I am unattached ... I dont know what to do because everything is so complicated.
 
That was exactly my father's opinion of it all .. and which is why I had applied Mid October and was complete by end of Nov/beginning of Dec.

I really did not wish to apply for this cycle, but was pretty much threatened to do so by my father (or I'd get cut off). So, I applied. Now, my mom isnt happy because I will have to likely be out of the state (she doesnt care DO or MD, she understands everything but just doesnt want me to be out of state because of the family problems, and my dad's not happy now that he found out I have applied to osteopathic schools and received only interviews from them ... and recently he had bypass surgery and is taking advantage of it by not doing anything at all and forcing us to do every little thing ...)

My whole intention was to retake the MCAT, hopefully score well, and apply only instate; however, knowing my MCAT situation, I knew I couldnt this year ...

I feel that the average age of MS-1s is around 23 or 24, im only 21 .. I am unattached ... I dont know what to do because everything is so complicated.

Hmm...I am confused, what is the deal with your dad? Whether, DO/MD you will be a doctor. Get there any way you can. There is not really much of a difference btw the two. What state schools are you trying to attend? The bottom line, even though it is a tough one, you have to decide what works for you...believe me, I understand wanting to make your parents happy...but eventually you have to live your life.👍
 
That was exactly my father's opinion of it all .. and which is why I had applied Mid October and was complete by end of Nov/beginning of Dec.

I really did not wish to apply for this cycle, but was pretty much threatened to do so by my father (or I'd get cut off). So, I applied. Now, my mom isnt happy because I will have to likely be out of the state (she doesnt care DO or MD, she understands everything but just doesnt want me to be out of state because of the family problems, and my dad's not happy now that he found out I have applied to osteopathic schools and received only interviews from them ... and recently he had bypass surgery and is taking advantage of it by not doing anything at all and forcing us to do every little thing ...)

My whole intention was to retake the MCAT, hopefully score well, and apply only instate; however, knowing my MCAT situation, I knew I couldnt this year ...

I feel that the average age of MS-1s is around 23 or 24, im only 21 .. I am unattached ... I dont know what to do because everything is so complicated.

By looking at your situation, waiting for a year may be better option for you. Your dad will be in better condition. You will have time to study for MCAT and get better score.
 
Hmm...I am confused, what is the deal with your dad? Whether, DO/MD you will be a doctor. Get there any way you can. There is not really much of a difference btw the two. What state schools are you trying to attend? The bottom line, even though it is a tough one, you have to decide what works for you...believe me, I understand wanting to make your parents happy...but eventually you have to live your life.👍

There's only 2, and I live in the biggest city of the state. I am trying to attend the school that is in that city.
 
It's important for you to decide how many times you are willing to apply to get what you want. I suggest applying more broadly with a 24. Otherwise retake the MCAT.

:luck:
 
I suggest applying more broadly with a 24. Otherwise retake the MCAT.

:luck:

more broadly? I already applied to about 4 DO schools and 2 MD schools. Not much you can do with a 24 mcat. Received invites from 3 DO schools so far and recently had an interview at one of them.

I'll retake then.
 
There's only 2, and I live in the biggest city of the state. I am trying to attend the school that is in that city.


Have you been accepted anywhere? If so, make yourself a pro and con list about going to where you have been accepted in the fall and waiting another year. Think about DO/MD, which you would rather be, your family situation, etc. I know you want to go instate because it is cheaper...I was in the same boat. However, I am in Alabama, which only has two state schools, and to get in you have to have really high stats, 3.8 GPA, 30+MCAT. Plus I have a scholarship to go instate (not issued by the medical schools). However, I had to look at my situation, and think, I have been accepted out of state...sure I will have to take out loans, but I will be able to pay them back. If I have to wait and take the MCAT again (which I refuse to do anymore😀 )it is no telling how long it would take me to get into UAB or USA. So I have decided to go where I have been accepted. However, this is me. Just think about what you want the most. If you want to raise you MCAT score, then take the year off or how ever long it takes and ace the MCAT and get a 30.:luck:
 
Do what you have to do. Inevitably, this comes down to how much you value 1) going to med school 2) the money you've already spent 3) keeping doors open (if you turn down acceptances and don't matriculate somewhere, schools are going to ask questions..)

My situation is somewhat similar. I have dated a girl for the better part of 7 years... we are engaged, yet it looks as though I may have to move 600 miles away bc I didn't get a better GPA. Will I move? Yes, because this is a career decision and she fully supports me (although she is not happy to relocate). Your family can either support that decision or not.

Unfortunately, the decisions you make carry much more burden than they used to only a few years ago. Growing up is a tough time for all of us, so I wish you the best of luck with your decision! Taking a year off isn't the end of the world if you are REALLY going to work at the MCAT. I spent a semester studying for about 10 hours weekly outside of Kaplan (9 hours/wk). It takes work and perserverance and actually working through entire exams... you have to work on not only studying by improving your test-taking ability through actually timing yourself by section and/or passage. Every little thing counts on test-day.

Best of luck to you and let me know if there is anything that I can help you with...:luck:

How did you go about studying the MCAT? Do you have advice and tips on the study method? I am not the best test taker, but I also feel that with more studying I can probably lift my score. In addition, what was your schedule like when studying? I cant quite afford Kaplan Courses or whatever, but, I do have study materials .. its just, I dont seem to be a great studier for it I guess?
 
Have you been accepted anywhere? If so, make yourself a pro and con list about going to where you have been accepted in the fall and waiting another year. Think about DO/MD, which you would rather be, your family situation, etc. I know you want to go instate because it is cheaper...I was in the same boat. However, I am in Alabama, which only has two state schools, and to get in you have to have really high stats, 3.8 GPA, 30+MCAT. Plus I have a scholarship to go instate. However, I had to look at my situation, and think, I have been accepted out of state...sure I will have to take out loans, but I will be able to pay them back. If I have to wait and take the MCAT again (which I refuse to do anymore😀 )it is no telling how long it would take me to get into UAB or USA. So I have decided to go where I have been accepted. However, this is me. Just think about what you want the most. If you want to raise you MCAT score, then take the year off or how ever long it takes and ace the MCAT and get a 30.:luck:

DO or MD is irrelavent for me, I could go either way. If AL had a DO school, I'd apply there.

Given that I had my 1st interview this past week, no, I dont have acceptances yet. I applied pretty late in this cycle like I discussed previously and all my interviews are going on now ... i have one in a week and another in mid feb. ... after that, i will know if i am accepted or not.

I was told by a UAB director that if I had atleast a 28, I'd have a good chance at being accepted. USA told me a 27 is enough for Early Decision ...
 
The advice that everyone has given you is great advice... Just to add my $0.02 .. . "YOU'RE 21!!!" Retake your MCAT if you want to go MD, You'd be competitive with just a little higher of a score...your GPAs look awesome, you said you have good letter's of recc, and find out where you can apply and not have to send that pre-med letter or remedy what they've already wrote. From the doc's I've talked to, the LOR's turn out to be more like a background check or reference check (like when you apply to a job) and can make an "average" candidate look amazing, and a great candidate look like hell. Anyway, back to my original point, You're 21. Don't rush. You'll get in, & you have PLENTY of TIME. You're ahead of the game, in terms of age. One last thing, coming from a guy with a tiny detorioratED family. . . FAMILY COMES FIRST.
 
The advice that everyone has given you is great advice... Just to add my $0.02 .. . "YOU'RE 21!!!" Retake your MCAT if you want to go MD, You'd be competitive with just a little higher of a score...your GPAs look awesome, you said you have good letter's of recc, and find out where you can apply and not have to send that pre-med letter. From the doc's I've talked to, the LOR's turn out to be more like a background check or reference check (like when you apply to a job) and can make an "average" candidate look amazing, and a great candidate look like hell. Anyway, back to my original point, You're 21. Don't rush. You'll get in, & you have PLENTY of TIME. You're ahead of the game, in terms of age. And always remember, FAMILY FIRST.

again, I will repeat that my state only has MD schools. It isnt about md or do .. its about staying instate.

right now, I probably do look like a horrid applicant because of that premed letter of hell. oh well, cant satisfy everyone. everything else is stellar though, and I did receive great personal letters from docs Ive shadowed. another problem is that the state school I wish to attend truly values the premed letter, and would most likely question it if i didnt have it on file by the interview seeing how they know my school has a premed advisor. i feel so screwed all around right now.
 
again, I will repeat that my state only has MD schools. It isnt about md or do .. its about staying instate.

right now, I probably do look like a horrid applicant because of that premed letter of hell. oh well, cant satisfy everyone. everything else is stellar though, and I did receive great personal letters from docs Ive shadowed. another problem is that the state school I wish to attend truly values the premed letter, and would most likely question it if i didnt have it on file by the interview seeing how they know my school has a premed advisor. i feel so screwed all around right now.

How do you know your premedical committee wrote you horrible letter?
 
How do you know your premedical committee wrote you horrible letter?

it was quoted in my recent interview and suggested I know what it said in it because likely it will come up everywhere.

I received a pre-interview hold at a school because of it, and at the time, didnt know why.
 
again, I will repeat that my state only has MD schools. It isnt about md or do .. its about staying instate.

right now, I probably do look like a horrid applicant because of that premed letter of hell. oh well, cant satisfy everyone. everything else is stellar though, and I did receive great personal letters from docs Ive shadowed. another problem is that the state school I wish to attend truly values the premed letter, and would most likely question it if i didnt have it on file by the interview seeing how they know my school has a premed advisor. i feel so screwed all around right now.

Sorry to hear that. What did they put on your letter that was so bad? I know the committee at Auburn wont even recommend a student if they have negative things to say about him/her. Seems pretty dirty a school would do that to you.👎
 
Sorry to hear that. What did they put on your letter that was so bad? I know the committee at Auburn wont even recommend a student if they have negative things to say about him/her. Seems pretty dirty a school would do that to you.👎

I dont really wish to reveal what was said in the letter to an open forum. however, i do agree, even for me it was below the belt and quite unprofessional.

Also, I dont know who really is in the committee or whatnot, but, I get the feeling that ONLY my advisor wrote that letter ... based off her personal opinions of me, our interview, and the 3 professor LORs that were required.
 
I dont really wish to reveal what was said in the letter to an open forum. however, i do agree, even for me it was below the belt and quite unprofessional.

Understood. Well just wait for the outcomes of your interviews and then go from there. Maybe the other schools wont even notice or pay it that much attention.

Good Luck!👍
 
Understood. Well just wait for the outcomes of your interviews and then go from there. Maybe the other schools wont even notice or pay it that much attention.

Good Luck!👍

I wish ...

Maybe I will take the acceptance and pay the deposit ... and still retake in April. If I score a 30+, I'll decline. If I dont .. well, spare me.
 
You say that the advisor "exaggerated" something? That means that whatever it is that has been exaggerated is based in truth.

If it is exaggerated way out of proportion then you should be able to reasonably explain this at interviews.

If you can't then....well.....

It would help if you would just tell us what has been exaggerated. I can assure you that it wouldn't shock most of us.
 
I think you should do what makes you happy. Do you really want to stay instate or are you just doing it to please or help your family out? My family is pretty screwed up lately as well, must be the weather. Anyways, if I felt that a better opportunity was in another state I would hope that they would support me in anything that I feel I need to do. Do you think your family will do the same or are they pressuring you into staying in state. If they are pressuring you, dont feel bad just telling them that leaving is a better decision for you. Its your life, you only live it once, dont feel obligated to push aside your wants for your family. They will always be there for you. Im not saying dont be there for your family, but do what makes you happy. I think you are so young that you can afford to wait a year if you want to retake the MCAT, if anything you can just not release it and apply DO again next year and move out of state then when things settle down. Good Luck, I know you can do whatever you put your mind to. 🙂
 
I wish ...

Maybe I will take the acceptance and pay the deposit ... and still retake in April. If I score a 30+, I'll decline. If I dont .. well, spare me.

That is a great idea I think, but wont it be difficult to sign up for the april one now?
 
You say that the advisor "exaggerated" something? That means that whatever it is that has been exaggerated is based in truth.

If it is exaggerated way out of proportion then you should be able to reasonably explain this at interviews.

If you can't then....well.....

It would help if you would just tell us what has been exaggerated. I can assure you that it wouldn't shock most of us.

She claimed I was unprofessional in my dealings with her. Untrue. I always scheduled appointments with the secretary and attended them on time. On 2 separate occassions did I approach her while crossing paths to ask for quick advice (i.e. a class) because I knew I would not be able to get the advice needed in a timely manner. Furthermore, she I went to a premed conference with her and the other officers. She claimed I did not work well with others. This was untrue. She got all pissy because when they would go out to the bars to drink, I decided not to because I was under-age at the time and did not want to go to a bar and instead had decided to spend time in the mall built within the hotel area we stayed at and hang out with other guys from other schools that were there and were also underage, however, I never did anything without my group except for that time. I am also allergic to cigarette smoke, and she is a smoker and I know that smoking exists in bars. In addition, I am a vegetarian and so when we would plan to go out to eat, we discussed this and I said I'd be fine to go anywhere where there was a good option for me. We all planned to go Italian and Mexican for the different times. However, as we'd be ready to go, I heard the premed advisor say, "change of plans, I feel like I want some sushi .. or .. change of plans, I think we should go seafood .. or barbecue ..." (we had BBQ for lunch the day we arrived) ... so, I questioned it because of the lack of options for me. She told me I should "not be a dissenter because I'm here with the group." I never was a dissenter, but I also did not feel that was fair. Whatever. I went anyways and ate sides. She claimed I was rude to the waiter, wrong. Then, as the banquet was beginning, I was on my way to the table where my group was at ... but along the way, I saw friends I'd made and we spoke for a little bit before I joined the group. My advisor was like, you dont have to sit here, you can sit with them if you want. I was like, no I never suggested I didnt want to sit with you all, I came here with you guys ... do you not want me here? She didnt say anything after that. In addition, I forgot my vegetarian card, but I did tell the waiter that im a vegetarian .. so he brought out the vegetarian meal. She claimed I made a fuss, never happened.

She claimed I dont work well with others, that im a stalker, and that im unprofessional. Not true. but, whatever.

I was able to defend myself and explain everything at my recent interview, so that was not the problem. I just dont know how much they believe the letter and/or my defense and everything else that is on my file.
 
That is a great idea I think, but wont it be difficult to sign up for the april one now?

you think so?

heh, youre right. well, there is some in may avail =/.
 
WOW, That must have been one crazy letter. If you didnt like her and you got the bad vibe why did you ask her. I probably would have still asked my advisor too just because many schools like those kind of letters. That sucks alot. Sometimes I wonder what my advisor says about me. I cant ever get a read on her, she always gives these blank looks and stuff. I think she does this to everyone but I dunno. I tried to butter her up before she wrote my letter and everyone else on the committee loves me from classes I had with them so it was good I hope. Who knows. I wish I would be able to read all of the letters in my packet. 🙄
 
WOW, That must have been one crazy letter. If you didnt like her and you got the bad vibe why did you ask her. I probably would have still asked my advisor too just because many schools like those kind of letters. That sucks alot. Sometimes I wonder what my advisor says about me. I cant ever get a read on her, she always gives these blank looks and stuff. I think she does this to everyone but I dunno. I tried to butter her up before she wrote my letter and everyone else on the committee loves me from classes I had with them so it was good I hope. Who knows. I wish I would be able to read all of the letters in my packet. 🙄

Yeah, she has her faves and not so faves. I guess I was her not so fave. I had to ask her for it because everything goes through her and she knows this.

Ironically, she would frequently approach students without appointments and they'd do the same to her and hell, theyre off to medical school this year and last year. They must have been her faves I guess.

Furthermore, when I asked her if there was something in my premed letter that would cause a "red flag" to be sent off to a school, leading to that pre-interview hold, she asked me which school because she was surprised and quite shocked/alarmed that a school would do that (thus, claiming that theres nothing in my premed letter that i should be worried about) .. then, i tell her the school and a few weeks later I email her and ask her what came out of it, and she tells me that she didnt receive a reply. Then, I find out in this interview that my premed letter isnt all rosy.

If she lied about this, makes me wonder if she didnt actually contact the other school ... she knew what was in the letter, but decided not to tell me, even though I asked for information so that I may be able to properly address the issue if it came up in an interview ... and yes, it did. big time.
 
She claimed I was unprofessional in my dealings with her. Untrue. I always scheduled appointments with the secretary and attended them on time. On 2 separate occassions did I approach her while crossing paths to ask for quick advice (i.e. a class) because I knew I would not be able to get the advice needed in a timely manner. Furthermore, she I went to a premed conference with her and the other officers. She claimed I did not work well with others. This was untrue. She got all pissy because when they would go out to the bars to drink, I decided not to because I was under-age at the time and did not want to go to a bar and instead had decided to spend time in the mall built within the hotel area we stayed at and hang out with other guys from other schools that were there and were also underage, however, I never did anything without my group except for that time. I am also allergic to cigarette smoke, and she is a smoker and I know that smoking exists in bars. In addition, I am a vegetarian and so when we would plan to go out to eat, we discussed this and I said I'd be fine to go anywhere where there was a good option for me. We all planned to go Italian and Mexican for the different times. However, as we'd be ready to go, I heard the premed advisor say, "change of plans, I feel like I want some sushi .. or .. change of plans, I think we should go seafood .. or barbecue ..." (we had BBQ for lunch the day we arrived) ... so, I questioned it because of the lack of options for me. She told me I should "not be a dissenter because I'm here with the group." I never was a dissenter, but I also did not feel that was fair. Whatever. I went anyways and ate sides. She claimed I was rude to the waiter, wrong. Then, as the banquet was beginning, I was on my way to the table where my group was at ... but along the way, I saw friends I'd made and we spoke for a little bit before I joined the group. My advisor was like, you dont have to sit here, you can sit with them if you want. I was like, no I never suggested I didnt want to sit with you all, I came here with you guys ... do you not want me here? She didnt say anything after that. In addition, I forgot my vegetarian card, but I did tell the waiter that im a vegetarian .. so he brought out the vegetarian meal. She claimed I made a fuss, never happened.

She claimed I dont work well with others, that im a stalker, and that im unprofessional. Not true. but, whatever.

I was able to defend myself and explain everything at my recent interview, so that was not the problem. I just dont know how much they believe the letter and/or my defense and everything else that is on my file.

Well, again, my .02. That letter, like I said in my previous post, is the obvious reason in making a good candidate look like hell. So....what's the possibility of switching pre-med advisors??? Do you have more than one at your school? Is this lady a reasonable person at all - have you tried to talk to her? You seem like a great candidate and the only thing stopping you is the letter (and MAYBE the mcat score). I'd say you'd be doing yourself a lot of pain and suffering applying to a school with that letter, unless, like you said, you are able to explain yourself and they hear you out. There has to be a way around this... If you have your heart set on this school, give them a reason to challenge the letter that she wrote. If she's saying you don't work well with people, strengthen your resume so that she can't say that. Do you have stuff on your resume that show you're a team player? If you do, I hope you threw that at the interview board. If you don't get in, buckle down and score higher on the MCATs, beef up your resume and try again...you'll be OK.
 
Well, again, my .02. That letter, like I said in my previous post, is the obvious reason in making a good candidate look like hell. So....what's the possibility of switching pre-med advisors??? Do you have more than one at your school? Is this lady a reasonable person at all - have you tried to talk to her? You seem like a great candidate and the only thing stopping you is the letter (and MAYBE the mcat score). I'd say you'd be doing yourself a lot of pain and suffering applying to a school with that letter, unless, like you said, you are able to explain yourself and they hear you out. There has to be a way around this... If you have your heart set on this school, give them a reason to challenge the letter that she wrote. If she's saying you don't work well with people, strengthen your resume so that she can't say that. Do you have stuff on your resume that show you're a team player? If you do, I hope you threw that at the interview board. If you don't get in, buckle down and score higher on the MCATs, beef up your resume and try again...you'll be OK.


I actually have PLENTY of EC/Leadership things I listed in my AACOMAS and also in secondaries ... and I mentioned some of them in my responses in the interview ... I work well with others, and didnt complain about having to wait 2 hours for a 30 min. tour either ... it's not my style.

I just wouldnt know how to go about challenging the premed letter in an interview without it looking bad. You cant just say "there are things in there that the premed advisor has said that is exagerrated or untrue" .. esp. when the school can call in and listen to their ONLY "highly valued pre-med reject advisor" spout out more BS out of disgust in having by-passed her.

I dont consider her to be reasonable, she holds grudges and is vengeful. My friends also tend to agree. In general, if she likes you alot, you are in. If not .. well, heh.
 
Hmmm....I thought we had this figured out. I think my idea is the best one. What happened to that?:laugh: I am having computer problems so I wasn't online last night. I will IM you later.🙂
 
dr inviz-

i think in life, you will always do things that will make someone else unhappy, no matter how hard you try to please everyone. so in the end, you need to at least make yourself happy. only you know what the means; whether it means staying in state to be near your fam, or attending the school you are accepted to this year.

it sounds that you may have some deep down resentment towards applying DO only (i could be wrong, just what i see). if thats true, you will never be happy with your career, and ultimately your life. if thats the case, up the MCAT, and reapply to MD schools.

i am sure you have alot to think about, but remember that in the end, you are the one who has to live with these decisions 10, 15, 30 years down the road, not your mom and dad.

good luck!! and i hope my 2 cents didnt offend you in any way, because that was not my intent.
sasha
 
Hey Dr. Inviz, for some reason I've been on this forum more than usual the last week or so and I can't help but to notice the many sarcastic and sometimes crude remarks that you've made recently. As someone who communicates with people often for work it does irritate me somewhat to know that a person in a pre-professional forum talks to others like that and quite often from what I've seen. Regardless, if you seriously need advice and believe that the right advice will help you move forward in life then I will offer what I have from personal experience, but don't expect any sugarcoating from me.

First of all, be grateful for what you have already. And in particular the interviews that you have received and been on. I don't have the exact stats but the rate of acceptance after interviewing is many times higher than before getting an interview invite. If you are already 75% to 90% done with the application process at any school, why would you even consider quitting at this crucial point? All you have to do is sit back and wait to hear, there are no forms to fill out at that point if I'm not mistaken. Let's see, if you go on interviews you have the opportunity to sell yourself (in a wholesome way hopefully) and maybe check out the school and see if the students, faculty, and campus is right for you. While on the otherhand if you don't go then the chances of you getting another invite from the same school for the next year is pretty low and they will likely assume that what is on your bad pre-med letter is true. You've already invested time and money into this cycle, see it to the end and don't even consider quitting until it is late Feb or March when you know the schools are not interviewing anymore and you can get started on a new Personal statement and studying for the MCAT. Who knows, you may even get in an not have to worry about reapplying at all.

Second, the MCAT. Contrary to popular belief, aceing bio, chem, orgo and physics will not guarantee a 30+ on the test. It is its own thing with its own type of questions and the more familiar you are with the testing format the better you will do on the test. I HIGHLY recommend buying a set of the ExamKrackers Study books, ALL of them. And if you have time, buy the extra 1001 questions for each section and do as much as you can. I personally recommend BUYING the 1001 VERBAL questions book and doing EVERY passage in it (As it is the MOST IMPORTANT section on the test). I took the MCAT once in college after a Kaplan course and got a very good score (30 R), unfortunately it expired before I was able to use it. 3 years later I had to retake and using only the books as a study guide and spending a considerable amount of time studying I did just slightly better than my first time. From what I know there are much more dates you can take the test and the test will be shorter in the future so hopefully you can use that flexibility to your advantage. As for turning down any type of acceptance from any MD or DO school if you later get a 30+ or 40+ on the MCAT , if you do that you should withdraw from SDN (😉 ).

As for family issues, take this with a grain of salt because my family has been supportive for the most part. Plus they are also not native English speakers so they don't have the best grasp of what applying to med-school consists of so I tend to leave them in the dark if I think it'll be easier for me. It sounds like you family is having issues due to illness and probably just frustration due to that and as well as you applying to schools and possibly moving away. From an outsider's point of view it seems like you are conflicted because your father wants you to get into school, not matter where (though MD preferably), while you mother wants you to stay close to home to help take care of your father. Now this is about you, do you feel that you would better serve yourself (first) and your family by remaning close geographically no matter what the situation is, whether you are in school or not, or do you think that you would be better off getting into a med program and becoming a doctor even though you may be away for a few years, though after being established you may be able to help your parents with medical advice and money? It is a tough call but one that you must make for yourself. If you stay at home but can't get into school ever, that may build resentment for the rest of your life. Keep in mind that med-school is very intense so whether you are in the same city and state as your parents or whether you are across the country, you will have to study several hours each school night and during the weekends as well. Free time for family and friends as a med-student is a luxury not everyone can easily afford. The hardest part, and the one you should concentrate on still, is just getting in.

The last subject I will touch on is your pre-med letter that seems like a death sentence for your application. If you have gotten 3 interview invites then it may not be as bad as you think it is. With the way you described your relationship with your pre-med advisor, it would seem like she would either not write a letter for you at all or have ONLY negative things to say about you. I highly doubt that you would be getting any interview invites if this was the case. More likely, the letter has some good and some bad and she left it up to the schools to decide whether you are worth interviewing. I can tell you right now that speaking ill of anyone at an interview is pretty much the same as shooting yourself in the foot in terms of getting an acceptance. You definitely need to defend yourself but there are ways around that that does not involve putting down any specific person or institute. You wrote a bunch of conflicting instances between you and the pre-med advisor, and after reading it, it sounds like just a bunch of misunderstandings but you also come across as a whiner. Seriously. If she claimed you were "unprofessional" in the letter and at your interview you quickly disregard that and ACT "professional" then the letter will go away on its own. Nitpicking every detail of every instance on the otherhand... well it sort of proves her point no matter how exaggerating she may have been. (there is always the option of using an outside service to gather and send your letters so that the one from the pre-med advisor will not be included, this is risky but I am sure some SDN'ers have had success with it, perhaps they can tell you more about it)

Anyways, I don't think my post can be any longer. Do with this info what you will. It is mainly from personal experience (25 yrs. old, applied 3X, took MCAT twice, it's been 4 years since getting my BS) and from the advice of people much older and wiser than me. You are still young which is an advantage in some ways but it seems like you have some tough choices to make. Mature a little, stop spending too much time on SDN and focus on the issues you need to fix in your life. We rather hear your success stories as well as the helpful advice that you can give rather than a bunch of remarks that may be just stemming from personal frustration.

regards,
TerpDO
 
I really feel that I must stay in-state for medical school to put everyone, and myself, more at ease...I guess my questions is, what am I to do ... ? Thanks.

It sounds like you have almost answered your question before you started. If everyone would feel more at ease by spending a little extra time trying to get into the in-state school, then there is nothing wrong with that. So, what do you have to do to make that happen?

1) Work on the MCAT. Work on it like there's no tomorrow. It really is the greatest obstacle that you have right now. Treat it like a class, develop a plan, and spend the same amount of time that you would studying for a tough class.

2) Go out and get your own LORs. While your school may sense something strange with you not using a committee letter, I don't know of any schools that won't accept a few letters from your professsors as an alternative. Get some glowing appraisals from profs who know you well and just be prepared to answer the questions later (if they are asked).

3) Forget about that "you'll lose $150,000 by not going to school this year" stuff. You are 21; you'll have plenty of time to make money later. Most people are older than you when they matriculate anyway. Besides, think of the money you'll save by not flying around the country for interviews, or that $50,000 you will be spending on tuition next year.

I've always believed that people do their best work when they are happy. You've pretty much already said that everyone woud feel better with you at home. I know a few people now who are really smart, but they are struggling because of family issues. Don't put yourself in that position if you don't have to. When you matriculate, you want to be in the best position to succeed financially, spiritually and mentally all at the same time.
 
I actually have PLENTY of EC/Leadership things I listed in my AACOMAS and also in secondaries ... and I mentioned some of them in my responses in the interview ... I work well with others, and didnt complain about having to wait 2 hours for a 30 min. tour either ... it's not my style.

I just wouldnt know how to go about challenging the premed letter in an interview without it looking bad. You cant just say "there are things in there that the premed advisor has said that is exagerrated or untrue" .. esp. when the school can call in and listen to their ONLY "highly valued pre-med reject advisor" spout out more BS out of disgust in having by-passed her.

I dont consider her to be reasonable, she holds grudges and is vengeful. My friends also tend to agree. In general, if she likes you alot, you are in. If not .. well, heh.


if you have great LORs from your professors, why can't you send theirs instead of your pre-med advisor's letter when you re-apply next cycle (if you decide to retake the MCAT)? even though the school you want to get into puts great emphasis on the committee letter, having three really good letters from professors of the same university (that you've most likely interacted with more than you have with the advisor) would also look really good. three good letters vs. one bad. but also, if you reapply, there's a good chance they won't even remember you, so it's like starting off fresh.
 
Hey Dr. Inviz, for some reason I've been on this forum more than usual the last week or so and I can't help but to notice the many sarcastic and sometimes crude remarks that you've made recently. As someone who communicates with people often for work it does irritate me somewhat to know that a person in a pre-professional forum talks to others like that and quite often from what I've seen. Regardless, if you seriously need advice and believe that the right advice will help you move forward in life then I will offer what I have from personal experience, but don't expect any sugarcoating from me.

First of all, be grateful for what you have already. And in particular the interviews that you have received and been on. I don't have the exact stats but the rate of acceptance after interviewing is many times higher than before getting an interview invite. If you are already 75% to 90% done with the application process at any school, why would you even consider quitting at this crucial point? All you have to do is sit back and wait to hear, there are no forms to fill out at that point if I'm not mistaken. Let's see, if you go on interviews you have the opportunity to sell yourself (in a wholesome way hopefully) and maybe check out the school and see if the students, faculty, and campus is right for you. While on the otherhand if you don't go then the chances of you getting another invite from the same school for the next year is pretty low and they will likely assume that what is on your bad pre-med letter is true. You've already invested time and money into this cycle, see it to the end and don't even consider quitting until it is late Feb or March when you know the schools are not interviewing anymore and you can get started on a new Personal statement and studying for the MCAT. Who knows, you may even get in an not have to worry about reapplying at all.

Second, the MCAT. Contrary to popular belief, aceing bio, chem, orgo and physics will not guarantee a 30+ on the test. It is its own thing with its own type of questions and the more familiar you are with the testing format the better you will do on the test. I HIGHLY recommend buying a set of the ExamKrackers Study books, ALL of them. And if you have time, buy the extra 1001 questions for each section and do as much as you can. I personally recommend BUYING the 1001 VERBAL questions book and doing EVERY passage in it (As it is the MOST IMPORTANT section on the test). I took the MCAT once in college after a Kaplan course and got a very good score (30 R), unfortunately it expired before I was able to use it. 3 years later I had to retake and using only the books as a study guide and spending a considerable amount of time studying I did just slightly better than my first time. From what I know there are much more dates you can take the test and the test will be shorter in the future so hopefully you can use that flexibility to your advantage. As for turning down any type of acceptance from any MD or DO school if you later get a 30+ or 40+ on the MCAT , if you do that you should withdraw from SDN (😉 ).

As for family issues, take this with a grain of salt because my family has been supportive for the most part. Plus they are also not native English speakers so they don't have the best grasp of what applying to med-school consists of so I tend to leave them in the dark if I think it'll be easier for me. It sounds like you family is having issues due to illness and probably just frustration due to that and as well as you applying to schools and possibly moving away. From an outsider's point of view it seems like you are conflicted because your father wants you to get into school, not matter where (though MD preferably), while you mother wants you to stay close to home to help take care of your father. Now this is about you, do you feel that you would better serve yourself (first) and your family by remaning close geographically no matter what the situation is, whether you are in school or not, or do you think that you would be better off getting into a med program and becoming a doctor even though you may be away for a few years, though after being established you may be able to help your parents with medical advice and money? It is a tough call but one that you must make for yourself. If you stay at home but can't get into school ever, that may build resentment for the rest of your life. Keep in mind that med-school is very intense so whether you are in the same city and state as your parents or whether you are across the country, you will have to study several hours each school night and during the weekends as well. Free time for family and friends as a med-student is a luxury not everyone can easily afford. The hardest part, and the one you should concentrate on still, is just getting in.

The last subject I will touch on is your pre-med letter that seems like a death sentence for your application. If you have gotten 3 interview invites then it may not be as bad as you think it is. With the way you described your relationship with your pre-med advisor, it would seem like she would either not write a letter for you at all or have ONLY negative things to say about you. I highly doubt that you would be getting any interview invites if this was the case. More likely, the letter has some good and some bad and she left it up to the schools to decide whether you are worth interviewing. I can tell you right now that speaking ill of anyone at an interview is pretty much the same as shooting yourself in the foot in terms of getting an acceptance. You definitely need to defend yourself but there are ways around that that does not involve putting down any specific person or institute. You wrote a bunch of conflicting instances between you and the pre-med advisor, and after reading it, it sounds like just a bunch of misunderstandings but you also come across as a whiner. Seriously. If she claimed you were "unprofessional" in the letter and at your interview you quickly disregard that and ACT "professional" then the letter will go away on its own. Nitpicking every detail of every instance on the otherhand... well it sort of proves her point no matter how exaggerating she may have been. (there is always the option of using an outside service to gather and send your letters so that the one from the pre-med advisor will not be included, this is risky but I am sure some SDN'ers have had success with it, perhaps they can tell you more about it)

Anyways, I don't think my post can be any longer. Do with this info what you will. It is mainly from personal experience (25 yrs. old, applied 3X, took MCAT twice, it's been 4 years since getting my BS) and from the advice of people much older and wiser than me. You are still young which is an advantage in some ways but it seems like you have some tough choices to make. Mature a little, stop spending too much time on SDN and focus on the issues you need to fix in your life. We rather hear your success stories as well as the helpful advice that you can give rather than a bunch of remarks that may be just stemming from personal frustration.

regards,
TerpDO

Dont worry, I did not bash the advisor .. they asked me what I thought of her despite what was in there. I simply said she is a wonderful person who gives great advice. I'll take what she said as a learning experience because everyday you learn something. While I wish I could have known this from her personally rather than through the letter, all is fair. I simply left it at that.

I dont think I posted anything suggesting myself to be a "whiner" but its okay.

Dr. Mom, you're right, I simply wanted to gain more perspectives. No offense, right?

I guess I'll see how things go, no sense in quitting now from what I am reading.

Thanks.
 
if you have great LORs from your professors, why can't you send theirs instead of your pre-med advisor's letter when you re-apply next cycle (if you decide to retake the MCAT)? even though the school you want to get into puts great emphasis on the committee letter, having three really good letters from professors of the same university (that you've most likely interacted with more than you have with the advisor) would also look really good. three good letters vs. one bad. but also, if you reapply, there's a good chance they won't even remember you, so it's like starting off fresh.

That would be the plan. I just wasnt sure if I should go that route or stick it out and take wherever I can get in. I know that its not smart to decline acceptances to wait out another year; however, wasn't sure if I ought to or not. Im sure nobody has experience in having done this ...
 
Just being totally honest, but it sounds like getting out of state might be the best thing that ever happened for you.

Do you mind me asking how far from home your undergrad institution is?

I too went through a bunch of family stuff as I was finishing my undergrad, and it sucks.
 
Dont worry, I did not bash the advisor .. they asked me what I thought of her despite what was in there. I simply said she is a wonderful person who gives great advice. I'll take what she said as a learning experience because everyday you learn something. While I wish I could have known this from her personally rather than through the letter, all is fair. I simply left it at that.

I dont think I posted anything suggesting myself to be a "whiner" but its okay.

Dr. Mom, you're right, I simply wanted to gain more perspectives. No offense, right?


I guess I'll see how things go, no sense in quitting now from what I am reading.

Thanks.


LOL! Of course I am right. I am always right. Don't you know that by now? HA! Just kidding.😉 :laugh: :meanie: Of course, no offense taken. It is always good to get others's opinions.👍 😀
 
As an adult who will be taking care of patients one day, it scares me that you are this incapable of making decisions as important as this for yourself- this is your life, and not your parents'- time to leave the nest~ 21 years old right? Yes your MCAT is really low, but if you have been accepted in this crapshoot process, GO. If you want to be a physician, GO. There are many people who WISH they could get in ANYWHERE in the US, DO or MD-but won't: and yes, some of them probably even have good stats. If not, twiddle your thumbs and waste more time, I'm sure it will help..... :idea:
 
Just being totally honest, but it sounds like getting out of state might be the best thing that ever happened for you.

Do you mind me asking how far from home your undergrad institution is?

I too went through a bunch of family stuff as I was finishing my undergrad, and it sucks.

its about 25-30 mins from where I live. Although, my current residence is 5 mins from the campus.

You are probably right. I do need to get out of this state, I dont think I have ever had the worst time anywhere else but here.

Thanks guys for all the advice.
 
As an adult who will be taking care of patients one day, it scares me that you are this incapable of making decisions as important as this for yourself- this is your life, and not your parents'- time to leave the nest~ 21 years old right? Yes your MCAT is really low, but if you have been accepted in this crapshoot process, GO. If you want to be a physician, GO. There are many people who WISH they could get in ANYWHERE in the US, DO or MD-but won't: and yes, some of them probably even have good stats. If not, twiddle your thumbs and waste more time, I'm sure it will help..... :idea:

I'm glad things are rosy peaches and not so complicated for you. I did not bother to discuss every little thing that makes it complicated, nor do I wish to do so. If you've gotten in somewhere, congrats ...
 
Do you honestly think you are the only one who has an incredibly complicated situation? EVERYONE has a LOT of issues, ( ppl. w/ diseases, kids, spouses, good jobs they or someone else must leave, homes, etc., etc., etc....... and they still persevere and go to medical school for their own good and that of their future patients. And no, nobody wants to hear every detail of how difficult it is/was for YOU. There are others walking around you every day who have it MUCH, MUCH worse. I was under the impression you were holding an acceptance already, but I may be mistaken. Being that you are so young, it it possible I was too hasty before- some time off to maybe leave the country or go out into the world and work a bit might help put some perspective on the good fortune you have before you.



Originally Posted by Dr.Inviz

"I'm glad things are rosy peaches and not so complicated for you. I did not bother to discuss every little thing that makes it complicated, nor do I wish to do so. If you've gotten in somewhere, congrats ..."
 
Do you honestly think you are the only one who has an incredibly complicated situation? EVERYONE has a LOT of issues, ( ppl. w/ diseases, kids, spouses, good jobs they or someone else must leave, homes, etc., etc., etc....... and they still persevere and go to medical school for their own good and that of their future patients. And no, nobody wants to hear every detail of how difficult it is/was for YOU. There are others walking around you every day who have it MUCH, MUCH worse. I was under the impression you were holding an acceptance already, but I may be mistaken. Being that you are so young, it it possible I was too hasty before- some time off to maybe leave the country or go out into the world and work a bit might help put some perspective on the good fortune you have before you.



Originally Posted by Dr.Inviz

"I'm glad things are rosy peaches and not so complicated for you. I did not bother to discuss every little thing that makes it complicated, nor do I wish to do so. If you've gotten in somewhere, congrats ..."

I am definitely aware of people having difficult situations. I do have a couple of jobs already and I enjoy those jobs, so its not a big deal for me. No, its not flipping burgers like many people do, but its still a job. I dont have acceptances yet, I'm currently working my way though the interviews. I have 2 left at this point. My point was that I received interviews by schools that didnt screen my file, the ones that did screen my file I havent heard from (except 1). Anyways, I'm done saying anything further to you, as it appears that you may be a non-trad who is quite bitter .. if not, then apologies.

Goodluck.
 
I am definitely aware of people having difficult situations. I do have a couple of jobs already and I enjoy those jobs, so its not a big deal for me. No, its not flipping burgers like many people do, but its still a job. I dont have acceptances yet, I'm currently working my way though the interviews. I have 2 left at this point. My point was that I received interviews by schools that didnt screen my file, the ones that did screen my file I havent heard from (except 1). Anyways, I'm done saying anything further to you, as it appears that you may be a non-trad who is quite bitter .. if not, then apologies.

Goodluck.

What do you mean you "received interviews from people that didnt screen my file". Why would they give you an interview without looking at your file. I find that very hard to believe that someone would choose you out of thousands of students without actually looking at everything in your file, not just GPA and MCAT. I am sure they read your letters before giving you an interview, and they probably think that having 3-4 good LOR's out weighs the one bad LOR.
 
I think you should still keep your head up. If you get an acceptance GO THERE! even if it is out of state. Sometimes parents don't know the best for you, but if you really feel you must stay instate because of money reasons then...thats what you have to do. Don't give up yet. If not this year then retake the mcat and try it again.
 
What do you mean you "received interviews from people that didnt screen my file". Why would they give you an interview without looking at your file. I find that very hard to believe that someone would choose you out of thousands of students without actually looking at everything in your file, not just GPA and MCAT. I am sure they read your letters before giving you an interview, and they probably think that having 3-4 good LOR's out weighs the one bad LOR.

One school sent me an invite 8 days after receiving my secondary. All they had was my DO letter. I wasn't even complete till afterwords. Same goes with with the other, except, they gave me an invite based off my stats and my secondary alone ... hadnt received my DO letter or even processed my apps ... I wasnt complete at either when I received my invites ...
 
I think you should still keep your head up. If you get an acceptance GO THERE! even if it is out of state. Sometimes parents don't know the best for you, but if you really feel you must stay instate because of money reasons then...thats what you have to do. Don't give up yet. If not this year then retake the mcat and try it again.

Thanks!
 
... without actually looking at everything in your file, not just GPA and MCAT. I am sure they read your letters before giving you an interview...

Some schools will give interviews without a file being complete based just on GPA, MCAT and primary app. Some schools (WVSOM, for instance) will give you an acceptance based on just GPA and MCAT without ever having an interview.
 
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