No longer pursuing dental school

[ddstobe123]

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Hi everyone. Why do you want to become a dentist? Do you think the debt will be worth it (general practice)?

I've been going over the cost of dental school over and over again in my head but it just doesn't add up. For those who don't plan on specializing, how do you justify the cost of dental school with the outlook of the profession? Also, let's not forget the lower pay you'd receive as an associate early on in your career and the more debt you'd be taking on if you were to buy your own practice.

I feel like the "golden age of dentistry" is over. The older dentists now who are well off went to school before tuition increased by 100+%. Doesn't anyone realize that things won't be the same when we're 40-50?

Not trying to put the profession down, but for this reason and many more, I've decided dentistry is not something I'd like to pursue. Obviously I'm on a pre-dent forum, I don't mean to offend anyone, I'm just curious to see what everyone's opinions are 😕.

***And sure, money isn't everything, but when you're investing your precious twenties (at least most of us are) and hundreds of thousands of dollars into this, I would hope that it'd pay off.

 

[Ferneezy]

but you didn't tell us what you're going to do instead.

that's the most important part of this thread.

 

[ddstobe123]

i wish i knew 🙂

 

[periopocket]

i wish i knew 🙂

If you have the stats go into medicine! It's less of a risk financially speaking. But the lifestyle will suck compared to dentistry.

 

[bpester]

The same could be true for a lot of healthcare professions, but at the very least you are your own boss, set your own schedule, and have job security. I

 

[periopocket]

The same could be true for a lot of healthcare professions, but at the very least you are your own boss, set your own schedule, and have job security. I

All the things you have just stated about dentistry are only true once you own your own practice.

 

[InterproximalDK]

Hi everyone. Why do you want to become a dentist? Do you think the debt will be worth it (general practice)?

I've been going over the cost of dental school over and over again in my head but it just doesn't add up. For those who don't plan on specializing, how do you justify the cost of dental school with the outlook of the profession? Also, let's not forget the lower pay you'd receive as an associate early on in your career and the more debt you'd be taking on if you were to buy your own practice.

I feel like the "golden age of dentistry" is over. The older dentists now who are well off went to school before tuition increased by 100+%. Doesn't anyone realize that things won't be the same when we're 40-50?

Not trying to put the profession down, but for this reason and many more, I've decided dentistry is not something I'd like to pursue. Obviously I'm on a pre-dent forum, I don't mean to offend anyone, I'm just curious to see what everyone's opinions are 😕.

***And sure, money isn't everything, but when you're investing your precious twenties (at least most of us are) and hundreds of thousands of dollars into this, I would hope that it'd pay off.

You better decide soon or your "precious twenties" will be gone and it will not have paid off for you partner. My advice is to quit whining, pay off student loans like everyone else, you will be able to live more than comfortably on an associate salary with that monthly automatic withdraw. On second thought, forget it, you continue to buy into everything you read on the internet, move to rural Montana and start preparing for the Apocalypse. Meanwhile, Ill be down here with some extra letters after my name.

 

[Ionz]

You better decide soon or your "precious twenties" will be gone and it will not have paid off for you partner. My advice is to quit whining, pay off student loans like everyone else, you will be able to live more than comfortably on an associate salary with that monthly automatic withdraw. On second thought, forget it, you continue to buy into everything you read on the internet, move to rural Montana and start preparing for the Apocalypse. Meanwhile, Ill be down here with some extra letters after my name.

There's no need to be sardonic and offensive, the OP was merely stating his decision. Plus, his points do have some merit, and it's not all false info lying around on the internet like you made it out to be.

OP: I hope you find what you are looking for. It's true that we are dedicating the "precious twenties" and hundreds of thousands of dollars to this profession, but it's definitely a worthwhile investment to many of us. 🙂

 

[JAWSSS]

Hi everyone. Why do you want to become a dentist? Do you think the debt will be worth it (general practice)?

I've been going over the cost of dental school over and over again in my head but it just doesn't add up. For those who don't plan on specializing, how do you justify the cost of dental school with the outlook of the profession? Also, let's not forget the lower pay you'd receive as an associate early on in your career and the more debt you'd be taking on if you were to buy your own practice.

I feel like the "golden age of dentistry" is over. The older dentists now who are well off went to school before tuition increased by 100+%. Doesn't anyone realize that things won't be the same when we're 40-50?

Not trying to put the profession down, but for this reason and many more, I've decided dentistry is not something I'd like to pursue. Obviously I'm on a pre-dent forum, I don't mean to offend anyone, I'm just curious to see what everyone's opinions are 😕.

***And sure, money isn't everything, but when you're investing your precious twenties (at least most of us are) and hundreds of thousands of dollars into this, I would hope that it'd pay off.

This applies to most health professions. Please go read the forums on the DO or MD side that talk about how crushing their debt will be. Allnurses.com and you can read the hundreds of threads of pre-nurses that are worried about their $80,000 of tuition for a one year accelerated program. The world will need dentists for FAR beyond the foreseeable future and I have wanted to be a dentist since I was in high school.

Even though I have had a desire to become a dentist for so long, I have also thought of the "money." Go have a look at the 'NHSC application process thread.' I have been on there for months worrying about the outcome of this scholarship (a full-ride). If I get it, I will not only be debt-free, I will get paid about $60,000 over four years to attend dental school. There are ways to reduce the debt load in dental school if you are persistent.

Scholarship or no scholarship everyone will be fine. The "golden years" of dentistry might be over... But, these are still wonderful years that, when compared to other professions right now, are the "golden years."

For my money situation, I am happy with the waters being rough now rather than later.

Good luck with your career hunt.

 

[ddstobe123]

You better decide soon or your "precious twenties" will be gone and it will not have paid off for you partner. My advice is to quit whining, pay off student loans like everyone else, you will be able to live more than comfortably on an associate salary with that monthly automatic withdraw. On second thought, forget it, you continue to buy into everything you read on the internet, move to rural Montana and start preparing for the Apocalypse. Meanwhile, Ill be down here with some extra letters after my name.

LOL.... good for you, bud.

 

[cs5910]

Best of luck to you, ddstobe123! I definitely understand your fears and hesitations. I start studying vet med in a month and I am terrified about the income: debt ratio that has plagued my field. I guess I am not as brave as you are to turn away from a life long dream (for me at least). Maybe this is just me getting cold feet right before I start... but these same fears about vet med definitely cross my mind on a daily basis! I hope you find what you are looking for and enjoy your future career path, whatever it may be!

 

[ddstobe123]

There's no need to be sardonic and offensive, the OP was merely stating his decision. Plus, his points do have some merit, and it's not all false info lying around on the internet like you made it out to be.

OP: I hope you find what you are looking for. It's true that we are dedicating the "precious twenties" and hundreds of thousands of dollars to this profession, but it's definitely a worthwhile investment to many of us. 🙂

Thank you! I hope so too. I respect all those who pursue to profession and wish everyone the best!

Best of luck to you, ddstobe123! I definitely understand your fears and hesitations. I start studying vet med in a month and I am terrified about the income: debt ratio that has plagued my field. I guess I am not as brave as you are to turn away from a life long dream (for me at least). Maybe this is just me getting cold feet right before I start... but these same fears about vet med definitely cross my mind on a daily basis! I hope you find what you are looking for and enjoy your future career path, whatever it may be!

Thank you! I was very reluctant to admit that this was not something I wanted to pursue. It was not only the fear of debt, as I worked more and more with dentists I learned that this was just not something I was passionate about. Good luck with your endeavors!

 

[Silent Cool]

heh.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=971175

 

[InterproximalDK]

There's no need to be sardonic and offensive, the OP was merely stating his decision. Plus, his points do have some merit, and it's not all false info lying around on the internet like you made it out to be.

OP: I hope you find what you are looking for. It's true that we are dedicating the "precious twenties" and hundreds of thousands of dollars to this profession, but it's definitely a worthwhile investment to many of us. 🙂

You are both right, cost of attendance is ridiculous, but my point is that, unless you have your heart set on living some lavish lifestyle, you will make plenty of money even as an associate general dentist working four days a week to live a comfortable life, and once your loans are gone, it goes without saying that you take a little more home each month. I'm sure you are right, the money isn't going to be the same as it once was, but that doesn't mean you aren't going to make a good living. Solid effort, though, to all of those who continue to employ the poor outlook of dentistry and high student loans as scare tactics against those who are after a career in dentistry for the money, it worked for the OP, but not for me.

 

[ddstobe123]

heh.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=971175

👍👍👍
THAT'S what I'm talking about, people!

 

[Bottle]

the debt is bad and hurts a lot, but really? you're going to give up on your dream job since high school because of loans?

i hope you enjoy your "precious twenties" and see you at your regretting thirties.

 

[yappy]

GL OP. I think it's wise to weigh your options and go into a field that you think you'll be most successful in.

EDIT: Just thought I would throw this in because it applies to some comments above and the "golden age" comment. I think it is important to consider that there is really nothing new under the sun and today is not too different from the past. My father can tell me of days where homes mortgages were at 14% and the economy was performing worse than it is today.

A newly retired physician once gave me a piece of advice re: this subject. He told me that when he was entering medicine everyone told him not to do it as it was not worth it. The "golden age" had passed. He said that, even his father who was a physician, told him not to go into medicine because of the introduction of medicare. It turned out, according to him, that his career was fabulous and he out earned all of his older colleagues during his time in the profession. It reminded him of how people discourage young people today even though they don't have the slightest clue as to what will happen in the future.

 

[ddstobe123]

GL OP. I think it's wise to weigh your options and go into a field that you think you'll be most successful in.

Thanks, good luck to you, too!

the debt is bad and hurts a lot, but really? you're going to give up on your dream job since high school because of loans?

i hope you enjoy your "precious twenties" and see you at your regretting thirties.

I will have absolutely no regrets. I honestly feel liberated and I am glad I finally mustered up the courage to make this decision. I've worked many hours with dentists and learned enough about the profession to really truly know that this is not something I want to pursue.

Off to enjoy my PRECIOUS twenties going after a career (whatever it ends up being) I know I will be absolutely passionate about. Thanks!

 

[gn4]

It's a legitimate fear to have OP. But it depends on what you are going into to give up dentistry. Is dentistry going to be all sunshine and rainbows like it used to be, probably not, but it sure seems to me that it has a safer future than most of the other health fields.

I hope you find what you want to get into. Good luck.

 

[IsaacYankem]

TL;DR:

To OP: It's a good realization to have. You can surely make more money in I-Banking than in any healthcare field.

Becoming a dentist, or doctor for that matter, is not a license to print money. Rather, it is a field for certain people who genuinely enjoy the immense work involved to be a licensed practitioner. You will most probably live comfortably, but you're better off in finance if you want to chase a fleet of European sport cars and cavalcade of 20 something Stepford wives.

 

[dentalWorks]

Hi everyone. Why do you want to become a dentist? Do you think the debt will be worth it (general practice)?

I've been going over the cost of dental school over and over again in my head but it just doesn't add up. For those who don't plan on specializing, how do you justify the cost of dental school with the outlook of the profession? Also, let's not forget the lower pay you'd receive as an associate early on in your career and the more debt you'd be taking on if you were to buy your own practice.

I feel like the "golden age of dentistry" is over. The older dentists now who are well off went to school before tuition increased by 100+%. Doesn't anyone realize that things won't be the same when we're 40-50?

Not trying to put the profession down, but for this reason and many more, I've decided dentistry is not something I'd like to pursue. Obviously I'm on a pre-dent forum, I don't mean to offend anyone, I'm just curious to see what everyone's opinions are 😕.

***And sure, money isn't everything, but when you're investing your precious twenties (at least most of us are) and hundreds of thousands of dollars into this, I would hope that it'd pay off.

your concerns legitimate, its alot of money (I think nowadays, average cost of dental schools w/ living expense is about 400-450k). With that crazy 6.8-7.9 interest, it does scare the crap out of me.

however, being an ex-IT guy I can tell you, I would MUCH rather be in 1 million dollar debt, and "only" make 100-200k a year while owning my own practice than slaving the rest of my life for companies sitting down stairing at a computer screen coding away 8-5 everyday of the week till retirement (or suacide / whichever comes first).

the way I see it, there is still good money to be had in dentistry, it just won't happen immediately after graduation. im estimating, that the first 5-15 years out of graduation will be the "struggling" years, but I think afterwards, it will prove to be a good investment.

 

[jeffity]

your concerns legitimate, its alot of money (I think nowadays, average cost of dental schools w/ living expense is about 400-450k). With that crazy 6.8-7.9 interest, it does scare the crap out of me.

however, being an ex-IT guy I can tell you, I would MUCH rather be in 1 million dollar debt, and "only" make 100-200k a year while owning my own practice than slaving the rest of my life for companies sitting down stairing at a computer screen coding away 8-5 everyday of the week till retirement (or suacide / whichever comes first).

the way I see it, there is still good money to be had in dentistry, it just won't happen immediately after graduation. im estimating, that the first 5-15 years out of graduation will be the "struggling" years, but I think afterwards, it will prove to be a good investment.

That's where I'm at in life. Other career happened. Still enjoy business and marketing (background and degree), but it didn't have quite everything I need in the long run. I did my homework before the big change. I've lived enough to appreciate just being comfortable over riches with enjoying what I do and the change in quality of life as the real value here. I know I'll pay it all off eventually. We all will. But your concerns are certainly valid. Didn't you just start shadowing a few weeks ago? Guess it was productive if it was part of your dissuasion.

 

[NDPitch]

That's where I'm at in life. Other career happened. Still enjoy business and marketing (background and degree), but it didn't have quite everything I need in the long run. I did my homework before the big change. I've lived enough to appreciate just being comfortable over riches with enjoying what I do and the change in quality of life as the real value here.

Same here.

 

[UCSFx2017]

All fields have booms and busts. Heck, as early as the 80's people thought dentistry was over with the advent of fluoride-treated water and lower caries incidence. In fact, enrollment dropped and as a result many schools closed. Who could have predicted the wide range of cosmetic procedures that would become so popular in the 90's and 00's contributing to the rising GP salary? But then again, who could have predicted the recession of '08?

A healthy amount of fear is good but if both the intangible and tangible benefits outweigh the costs, dentistry will be a great career. Not everyone shares the same intangible benefits of enjoying dentistry itself, being a people-person, taking care of people out of genuine concern, and seeing the growth of a small business. Not everyone is equally wary of costs. As long as you are well-informed, only you can decide if dentistry is worth investing your time and money.

In any career involving higher-education, you're going to feel the effects of state disinvestment in tuition subsidy. Already, you're seeing it at the undergraduate level with interest rates set at 6.8% and tuition still rising.

 

[JAWSSS]

ddstobe's post history is funny to read. haha.

 

[UCSFx2017]

Here's an interesting read: http://www.ada.org/news/6173.aspx

 

[babowc]

There are lower cost alternatives, like state schools.

I don't think "cost" should be the biggest concern, rather whether you're actually fit for the profession or not. It sounds like whining to me...

 

[UCSFx2017]

There are lower cost alternatives, like state schools.

I don't think "cost" should be the biggest concern, rather whether you're actually fit for the profession or not. It sounds like whining to me...

Given enough time there will be no "cost alternatives". Economy's down, states are broke, higher-education's subsidy from the state is dropping, and meanwhile students are demanding more clinical hours, more instructors, and more advanced (expensive) equipment. Schools aren't going to sacrifice quality so what ends up happening is the costs are passed onto tuition and state-subsidized schools end up looking more and more like private schools.

"Public dental schools are under more pressure to make up for decreases in state support by increasing tuition and fees," he [Dr. Valachovic] said. "The differential in the total cost of a dental education at private and public institutions is becoming less and less."

http://www.ada.org/news/6173.aspx

 

[ToothbrushBuddy]

I honestly can't think of a better career for the cost of the education. If I don't get into dental school, I can look forward to the back-breaking work of being a CNA for the rest of my life earning just a little more than minimum wage. Dentistry is such a great career even though the cost of the education is ridiculously expensive.

 

[NMC2010]

Aren't you supposed to go into a career because you enjoy it, not solely for monetary purposes? If you're considered about the issue of dentistry not being profitable to you, don't join. If you want to join because you have a passion for the career, then do it regardless of how much the school costs. Though, rest assured, the average salary of general dentists is ~ $145,000/ year. The low end is $100,000/ year. Yes it will be more difficult starting out, but eventually you will be able to pay off your debt and have a rewarding career. It may take you 10-20 years, but it is certainly doable.

 

[Illfavor]

Aren't you supposed to go into a career because you enjoy it, not solely for monetary purposes?

Sort of, but not really. You're right, you shouldn't do most things solely for the money. I went into classical musical because it's the thing I love the most in the world. It's also a dead end, with even the absolute best and brightest having to face the reality of the modern economy and the drastically reduced demand for the craft. So no, you can't just "do what you want" and not worry about money. I have talked to perhaps 60 musicians about this exact thing, and 99% of them (even the ones with excellent careers and the most coveted jobs in the industry) have said it's time to abandon ship. The only folks who think I've made mistake are the ones teaching in giant public universities with full benefits and six figure salaries. Dentistry is a field where hard work may make you really well off, and at least you'll be comfortable. That is way better than many fields.

 

[Teeths]

Aren't you supposed to go into a career because you enjoy it, not solely for monetary purposes? If you're considered about the issue of dentistry not being profitable to you, don't join. If you want to join because you have a passion for the career, then do it regardless of how much the school costs. Though, rest assured, the average salary of general dentists is ~ $145,000/ year. The low end is $100,000/ year. Yes it will be more difficult starting out, but eventually you will be able to pay off your debt and have a rewarding career. It may take you 10-20 years, but it is certainly doable.

Just my two cents, and I'm not trying to be rude, but consider this:

How can students say they have a PASSION for dentistry when they've never even worked in a mouth? Most pre-dents have only shadowed, which typically means observing, since it would be illegal to actually participate in the procedures without a degree. There has to be other aspects of the career that entice people to explore the profession. Some that come to mind are that it's a health profession, a service to people, there's great potential to own and operate a business, live a comfortable life, have hours that aren't out the wazoo so you can still be involved with your family, etc etc. I'm just bringing this up because most only have an idea of what dentistry is like, not what it actually is. Saying that you enjoy dentistry is a little silly at this point. It's not like a musician where you can learn to play an instrument fairly easily at your own free will... you don't have to take on 4 years of rigorous coursework.

Just something to keep in mind when asked the 'why dentistry' question at interviews!

 

[free99]

you can learn to play an instrument fairly easily

Maybe the jaw harp and recorder, yeah. 😉

 

[woodloga]

Just my two cents, and I'm not trying to be rude, but consider this:

How can students say they have a PASSION for dentistry when they've never even worked in a mouth? Most pre-dents have only shadowed, which typically means observing, since it would be illegal to actually participate in the procedures without a degree. There has to be other aspects of the career that entice people to explore the profession. Some that come to mind are that it's a health profession, a service to people, there's great potential to own and operate a business, live a comfortable life, have hours that aren't out the wazoo so you can still be involved with your family, etc etc. I'm just bringing this up because most only have an idea of what dentistry is like, not what it actually is. Saying that you enjoy dentistry is a little silly at this point. It's not like a musician where you can learn to play an instrument fairly easily at your own free will... you don't have to take on 4 years of rigorous coursework.

Just something to keep in mind when asked the 'why dentistry' question at interviews!

Not to argue but...

I'll say that some people may have went to another country and while there may have been able to work in the mouth and do things that the US's laws wouldn't allow? Worked in some awesome remote mountain villages with equiptment you might imagine would be in a location like that. Maybe participated in procedures like extractions (molars and incisors), injections, tied up a few sutures, filled a cavity. Who knows! 🙂 If they did, that may have silidified the fact that dentistry is for them and its a profession they actually can and will enjoy doing for the rest of their life.

 

[sacapuntas]

Not to argue but...

I'll say that some people may have went to another country and while there may have been able to work in the mouth and do things that the US's laws wouldn't allow? Worked in some awesome remote mountain villages with equiptment you might imagine would be in a location like that. Maybe participated in procedures like extractions (molars and incisors), injections, tied up a few sutures, filled a cavity. Who knows! 🙂 If they did, that may have silidified the fact that dentistry is for them and its a profession they actually can and will enjoy doing for the rest of their life.

Just a heads up, if you say you did these things at an interview you are looking at a sure rejection as schools are looking for ethical students.

 

[woodloga]

Just a heads up, if you say you did these things at an interview you are looking at a sure rejection as schools are looking for ethical students.

I've just heard stories. Alot of it is assisting to an extent that you might not be able to do in an office in the states. Good hands on, in the field work. No matter what, just people trying to see if they love
It and become a future dentist.

 

[y3nd0]

Just my two cents, and I'm not trying to be rude, but consider this:

How can students say they have a PASSION for dentistry when they've never even worked in a mouth? Most pre-dents have only shadowed, which typically means observing, since it would be illegal to actually participate in the procedures without a degree. There has to be other aspects of the career that entice people to explore the profession. Some that come to mind are that it's a health profession, a service to people, there's great potential to own and operate a business, live a comfortable life, have hours that aren't out the wazoo so you can still be involved with your family, etc etc. I'm just bringing this up because most only have an idea of what dentistry is like, not what it actually is. Saying that you enjoy dentistry is a little silly at this point. It's not like a musician where you can learn to play an instrument fairly easily at your own free will... you don't have to take on 4 years of rigorous coursework.

I half agree with what you say. I think passion FOR dentistry and passionate ABOUT dentistry falls on a very thin line of "synonymous". I know a lot of people who want to pursue dentistry because braces changed their outlook on life (I was once in this boat). They're so set on wanting to do the same for others, so passionate about their goals about giving someone that beautiful smile. Their goal happens to be intertwined with becoming a dentist. So they're passionate about their goal to become a dentist... sometimes it's easier to say that you're passionate for dentistry to show how strongly you want to become one. I'm not sure if the people are distinguishing the difference when they actually say that, but that's what I take it as. (I don't think you can get a true passion for dentistry until you get hands on experience.)

(Sorry, I just realized I jumped in on the convo. 😛)

 

[Hawkteeth]

I've just heard stories man. Who says this isn't ethical? Some
States have different laws than others, some countries have differnet laws. Nothing unethical about it. But maybe your own beliefs are different and that's ok.

If your applying to a US dental school it's unethical. If you have a different opinion keep it to yourself, dental schools frown very heavily on stuff like that.

 

[Jonas586]

I've just heard stories. Alot of it is assisting to an extent that you might not be able to do in an office in the states. Good hands on, in the field work. No matter what, just people trying to see if they love
It and become a future dentist.

Definitely not ethical.

 

[LaughingGas]

1+ for unethical. You need to think that for some people's experience, the patients were at risk even with a dentists' supervision.

For me, when it comes to "practicing dentistry for experience", it's no different to this video.

 

[experiment626]

1+ for unethical. You need to think that for some people's experience, the patients were at risk even with a dentists' supervision.

For me, when it comes to "practicing dentistry for experience", it's no different to this video.

I remember watching this on Taboo. It is sad to see how bad the conditions are.