Non-Traditional Student Seeking Advice!!

[psychedelicstudies]

Hey everyone! I'm hoping I can get some advice on my situation. I am 24 years old and majored in bio in college while claiming pre-med. After graduation I worked as a research assistant in a lab on a GI disease. This experience along with talking to many, many doctors guided me away from medical school- I realized it was not what I pictured or wanted. I went into consulting in a benefits practice (health care, insurance, general employee benefits etc.) in an attempt to see if I liked the "business side of medicine." Although I certainly do not hate it here, I am missing the close connection to the clinical side of things. This realization has caused me to reflect on everything- what I am really passionate about, why I was attracted to med school originally, etc.

I've always been extremely passionate about and an advocate for mental health care. I've always loved psychology. I shied away from it because I had just assumed I would go to medical school, however, even when I would think of what specialty I would be in, I would always prefer mind-body/integrative medicine as it included a more holistic view of health and included mental health. I've also had my own personal journey/struggle in mental health (have been inpatient before- but I am doing great now!) and have let that hold me back from pursuing something in this field, but now I am really seeing it as a strength and it makes me want to be in this field even more. I really enjoyed research while I was doing it and even did an clinical research internship in college for a mind-body medicine institute. I think I would really love to be a scientist-practitioner and would love the flexibility too in the future to consult for health organizations/agencies etc. and work on developing optimal systems for mental health care.

The advice I'm seeking is how can I be competitive for a PhD program? I was a bio major and the only psych course I've taken is Intro to Psych. Many programs require upper level psych courses (understandably so), but to take 4-5 courses post-bacc is expensive, especially when you don't come out with a degree. Programs also require research experience- is my non-psych research enough/qualify me? Programs also require LORs preferably from research psychologists- is this an absolute necessity? I need to take the GRE, but I'm not as worried about it as I was for the MCAT.

What is my best plan of action? Do I quit my job, take these classes and then apply to a PhD program with non-research psychologist LORs? That kind of feels like a shot in the dark. Or do I aim for a Masters level program first and then revisit PhD in the future? I can't help but want to jump right in as the program will be long!

If I aim for a Masters level program, is it feasible to get an MPH along with this? Within mental health care, I am also interested in the system of it and potentially developing protocols/systems to better treat patients. I think it would be an amazing blend with a psychology degree and could really wrap things together for what I want to do (and even give added flexibility!).


I sincerely appreciate your insight!!

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[wtfook]

I think your best bet is to get some kind of psychology master's degree. They have psychology post bacc's or a clinical psych research master's where you can do a thesis. Then while you're there, join a lab, do lots of research, present, and ideally get some publications under your belt. You will likely not get into a doctoral program without any advanced psych classes or psychology research, definitely not a funded PhD or PsyD program.

I was 26 when I went back for my master's degree in mental health counseling. My ultimate goal was PhD. I had majored in psychology in college but did not have any recent psych research experience. I chose mental health counseling because in the event that I did not get into a PhD program, I could at least practice as a master's level clinician. This doesn't work for everyone, as those types of programs don't typically allow for a master's thesis and so less rigorous research experience unless you are active in seeking it for yourself. I was accepted into a fully funded PhD program and am in my first year now (I'm 29). I took me 2 rounds, partly due to geographically limiting myself, and partly probably due to degree of research experience.

I would not recommend an MPH as that would not get you the psychology classes you need to be competitive for a psychology doctoral program. Once you get to the doctoral level, they are interested in specificity of experience within that field. Psychology research. Psychology classes. A clear focus on what you want to research and whether that fits with the individual you are applying to work with. A master's in public health could be some icing on top but will not fulfill the meat of what they are looking for.

 

[singasongofjoy]

Second what wftook said above. I took a similar path for same reasons. Pysch undergrad major but practically nil in the way of research. Masters set me on the doctoral path. Granted it is a more expensive way to do it for someone who just needs research experience but in your case you need the classes too, so a masters program seems (in my opinion) a time-efficient way to get in some basic requirements for applying to doctoral programs, but you will want to make it focused on psych (rather than MPH) because there is a lot of discipline-specific stuff you will be expected to already know/be quite familiar with.

 

[Spydra]

It sounds like you are debating between MPH and Psychology and aren't sure which would be the best fit for you. I don't know enough about MPH to say how much overlap there is with Psychology, but it might be wise to take a year off and explore both before diving into a Master's program. Master's degrees are often unfunded and that's a huge investment and a lot of time if it ends up not being what you want or need. For Psych I would say volunteer in a lab (paid RA positions might be an option, but are competitive) and also get some experience in MPH volunteer or paid. The suggestions above make sense if it turns out Psychology is where your heart is, but what if it isn't? Could you take the combination of Bio undergrad/Psych Master's and transition into MPH or would you need to get another degree? There also might be a completely different degree that would better merge the two fields and lead you to career options that make you happy.

 

[deleted656923]

@psychedelicstudies Regarding your potential joint interest in Public Health, there is actually one reputable program that I know of that offers a joint MPH & Ph.D Clinical Psychology track: UAB Medical Clinical Psychology Doctoral Program in Birmingham, Alabama. It's fully funded (i.e., fully paid tuition plus $22K/year stipends), and you can also earn a Masters of Arts in Clinical Psychology along the way too. Generally, though, Clinical Psychology programs with a joint MPH track aren't very common.

 

[psychedelicstudies]

@wtfook @singasongofjoy @Spydra If a PhD in clinical psychology is where I decide is best, are there alternatives to getting a MS first? As you mentioned, it's expensive! Perhaps an alternative would be research + taking classes. Do you know of people who worked in fields other than research/clinical before applying to a PhD program? I guess what I'm asking is can I work in some type of healthcare consulting (typically pays more) while I take classes or do I absolutely need to be doing research or clinical?

 

[singasongofjoy]

@wtfook @singasongofjoy @Spydra If a PhD in clinical psychology is where I decide is best, are there alternatives to getting a MS first? As you mentioned, it's expensive! Perhaps an alternative would be research + taking classes. Do you know of people who worked in fields other than research/clinical before applying to a PhD program? I guess what I'm asking is can I work in some type of healthcare consulting (typically pays more) while I take classes or do I absolutely need to be doing research or clinical?

My guess is that to be competitive for funded programs, you are going to need some solid research experience wiht at least some presentations/posters, if not publications. You might be able to get that outside of a master's program while doing something that pays OK money... I dunno. A paid RA position while taking classes would probably be the ideal IMO but others may have different opinions. Good luck!

 

[wtfook]

@wtfook @singasongofjoy @Spydra If a PhD in clinical psychology is where I decide is best, are there alternatives to getting a MS first? As you mentioned, it's expensive! Perhaps an alternative would be research + taking classes. Do you know of people who worked in fields other than research/clinical before applying to a PhD program? I guess what I'm asking is can I work in some type of healthcare consulting (typically pays more) while I take classes or do I absolutely need to be doing research or clinical?

Unless your GPA is abysmal, you don't really NEED a master's degree at all. When I was interviewing at clinical programs, it seemed like many candidates had simply done the RA route. However, they were also psych majors. They worked as a research assistant somewhere (typically they have a 1-2 year commitment) and then applied. I would focus on doing something, anything, related to psychology. It is ESPECIALLY helpful if that is within your area of interest. Otherwise, when you are interviewing at programs they will look at your qualifications and go, "why is this person applying to work with me on schizophrenia when all your research the last 2 years has been on childhood development?" You can swing it if it's somewhat related like psychopathology in adults. Work with children and families. Etc... However, if you're just doing random stuff in a medical field that's completely unrelated to mental health and you're not interested in health psychology, it probably wont help you to much. RA jobs don't necessarily pay amazing, but they could probably get you rent and food. Taking additional classes might be helpful since having taken NO psych classes outside of intro to psych might count against you. most programs would like to see that you've taken at least SOME classes in psychology. A bacc program or a clinical master's could be helpful.