Official 2015-2016 "What Are My Chances" Thread

[75kg]

Hey all - Long time lurker turned new member. Last WAMC thread is from two years ago so it might be time for a new one. Last thread's format from LimbicResponse (thanks!) seemed to work well for most, so here we go:

Step 1:
Step 2 CK/ CS:
School:
Class Rank:
Grades in Clerkship:
AOA:
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars:
Red Flags: (step failures, etc)
Overview of where you want to end up:

It would be really great to get some input from people who have recently matched - It seems that psychiatry has gotten more competitive with the jump in mean Step 1 score from 214 to 220 and Step 2 from 225 to 233 between 2011 and 2014 based on Charting Outcomes. Thanks!

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[MLT2MT2DO]

Hey all - Long time lurker turned new member. Last WAMC thread is from two years ago so it might be time for a new one. Last thread's format from LimbicResponse (thanks!) seemed to work well for most, so here we go:

Step 1:
Step 2 CK/ CS:
School:
Class Rank:
Grades in Clerkship:
AOA:
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars:
Red Flags: (step failures, etc)
Overview of where you want to end up:

It would be really great to get some input from people who have recently matched - It seems that psychiatry has gotten more competitive with the jump in mean Step 1 score from 214 to 220 and Step 2 from 225 to 233 between 2011 and 2014 based on Charting Outcomes. Thanks!

First kiddos on making a new WAMC, my class, myself included never got around to it.

On the test scores, remember that they have risen overall during that time frame. I can only speak for the west but it felt very competitive this year.

I would also not rule out the Midwest as they are less competitive than either coast but many of the residencies I felt were much stronger.
If I had to do it over again I would have chopped a couple of my west coast "safety" schools and searched a bit deeper in the midwest.

Good Luck!

 

[clausewitz2]

I guess I'll go first:

Step 1: 227
Step 2 CK/ CS: to come in July/August
School: solidly middle of the pack US allopathic state school
Class Rank: probably bottom third
Grades in Clerkship: high 80s OB, medicine, 90s family, psych, neuro, EM, dunno about surgery and peds yet
AOA: nope
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: PhD in a cognitive neuroacience field; couple publications prior to med school in cognitive neuroscience, several posters at neuroscience conferences, platform session at Academy of Aphasia meeting, one neuroradiology pub in med school, hoping to crank out another paper from my dissertation before the match, getting into a naloxone project

Red Flags: whiffed first year biochem by a point, remediated with a shelf exam the following summer

Overview of where you want to end up:
Not a secret that OHSU is my top choice, but otherwise looking at warm cities with over a million people. Only Austin probably acceptable in Texas, though. Ethnically diverse population a huge plus. Spouse also strongly dislikes California.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Ok, so like dude, what’s wrong with California’s Zen inspired, road rage fueled, cleansed, tanned and silicone injected way of life? When you are in “the business”, it only matters how you look. Check your super egos at the door, California is the land of id and proud of it. If it weren’t for yogurt and beer yeast, they wouldn’t have any culture at all.

 

[Dharma]

Hey all - Long time lurker turned new member. Last WAMC thread is from two years ago so it might be time for a new one. Last thread's format from LimbicResponse (thanks!) seemed to work well for most, so here we go:

Step 1:
Step 2 CK/ CS:
School:
Class Rank:
Grades in Clerkship:
AOA:
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars:
Red Flags: (step failures, etc)
Overview of where you want to end up:

It would be really great to get some input from people who have recently matched - It seems that psychiatry has gotten more competitive with the jump in mean Step 1 score from 214 to 220 and Step 2 from 225 to 233 between 2011 and 2014 based on Charting Outcomes. Thanks!

Yo dude, thanks for starting the thread. But hey, you never filled out your info. Wanted to give the heads-up, just in case.

 

[MLT2MT2DO]

I guess I'll go first:

Step 1: 227
Step 2 CK/ CS: to come in July/August
School: solidly middle of the pack US allopathic state school
Class Rank: probably bottom third
Grades in Clerkship: high 80s OB, medicine, 90s family, psych, neuro, EM, dunno about surgery and peds yet
AOA: nope
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: couple publications prior to med school in cognitive neuroscience, several posters at neuroscience conferences, platform session at Academy of Aphasia meeting, one neuroradiology pub in med school, hoping to crank out another paper from my dissertation before the match, getting into a naloxone project

Red Flags: whiffed first year biochem by a point, remediated with a shelf exam the following summer

Overview of where you want to end up:
Not a secret that OHSU is my top choice, but otherwise looking at warm cities with over a million people. Only Austin probably acceptable in Texas, though. Ethnically diverse population a huge plus. Spouse also strongly dislikes California.

As mentioned before I think you and OHSU would be a solid fit. Match your step 1 with a bit higher or similar step2 and you're golden. Do an away if you really want to secure the spot.

I would have most likely ended up here if the COL was a bit more resonible and the weather was a bit better.

USF may also fit your bill. You shouldn't have a problem matching there.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

I guess I'll go first:

Step 1: 227
Step 2 CK/ CS: to come in July/August
School: solidly middle of the pack US allopathic state school
Class Rank: probably bottom third
Grades in Clerkship: high 80s OB, medicine, 90s family, psych, neuro, EM, dunno about surgery and peds yet
AOA: nope
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: couple publications prior to med school in cognitive neuroscience, several posters at neuroscience conferences, platform session at Academy of Aphasia meeting, one neuroradiology pub in med school, hoping to crank out another paper from my dissertation before the match, getting into a naloxone project

Red Flags: whiffed first year biochem by a point, remediated with a shelf exam the following summer

Overview of where you want to end up:
Not a secret that OHSU is my top choice, but otherwise looking at warm cities with over a million people. Only Austin probably acceptable in Texas, though. Ethnically diverse population a huge plus. Spouse also strongly dislikes California.

Hmm, Portland doesn't quite fit that warm city criteria, although it's getting too damn hot these days. I'm suspecting we'll have a brutal summer. Other thought -- Austin isn't that dramatically better than the rest of Texas. The other big cities (Houston and Dallas) are about as liberal and probably have as many cool spots. Houston's probably a lot more diverse than Austin. Large warm cities not in Texas and California really narrows your choices. Let's see -- Arizona, New Mexico (is ABQ warm enough?), New Orleans, Birmingham, Atlanta, Charleston, Raleigh-Durham area. DC? Baltimore? Deep south cities aren't going to be much better than Texas cities.

Anyway, you'll probably match at OHSU, so whatever. If you're not already a student there, do an away and be sure to let them know you really want to be there.

 

[clausewitz2]

Away is probably not going to end up happening, but I am planning a visit and meeting in the department in the next couple months at which I will convey my enthusiasm.

I've only been through Houston kind of briefly - is it really as liberal as, say, Austin? I was definitely struck by the diversity, having really excellent pho and bun chay in a random place in a strip mall on the outskirts.

I guess when I say "warm" I mean "blizzard is not really a word we use around here" rather than "balmy and dry." Unless I am seriously misreading climate data Portland fits the first category, at least.

 

[Monocles]

I'll be 2nd! Any advice/tips would be much appreciated!

Step 1: 221
Step 2 CK/ CS: will take in July/September
School: state school in midwest
Class Rank: middle? (our school doesn't have official ranks, I struggled really hard during basic science years but am killing it on my clerkships, so I'm guessing it balances out?)
Grades in Clerkship: Overall Honors in peds, Pass in everything else (held back by shelf exam in every block, although I have clinical honors in almost every block and glowing reviews)
AOA: No
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: 2 peer-reviewed pubs (but unfortunately from undergrad) in pharmacology, 1 poster at internal med conference, currently doing bipolar research (but will probably not have anything published by ERAS). Founder and president of our school's psych interest group
Red Flags: (step failures, etc) remediated biochem during M1 year (failed test by 1 point) and another course during M2 (failed test by 0.5 point)
Overview of where you want to end up: This is going to sound dumb but any major coastal city with a well-educated and diverse dating pool. Boston, New York, Portland, Seattle? Career-wise I would love to be able to attend a program with strong psychotherapy/CAP training as I'm 90% sure I'm set on a CAP fellowship. My dream program is probably Harvard Longwood but do I have a chance?

Thanks!

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Away is probably not going to end up happening, but I am planning a visit and meeting in the department in the next couple months at which I will convey my enthusiasm.

I've only been through Houston kind of briefly - is it really as liberal as, say, Austin? I was definitely struck by the diversity, having really excellent pho and bun chay in a random place in a strip mall on the outskirts.

I guess when I say "warm" I mean "blizzard is not really a word we use around here" rather than "balmy and dry." Unless I am seriously misreading climate data Portland fits the first category, at least.

I guess an away isn't necessary. From what I've heard, the program is looking more toward interviewing people who convey some interest in the program or the area after getting burned a few years ago interviewing a bunch of highly qualified Californians who really wanted to go to California and were just using OHSU as a backup -- Californians, man. So yeah, find a way to convey interest, and I suspect you'll be good.

Yes, Portland has a moderate climate in that it rarely gets below freezing, and snow storms only occur every few years and are rare enough to shut down the city. It's definitely rainy, though, and our fall/winter/spring can be chilly in that it won't necessarily be sunny, and you might want to wear a jacket or long sleeves for a good chunk of the year. People who describe themselves as liking "warm" weather generally complain a lot about the weather here.

About Houston, my understanding is that the central part of the city is fairly liberal while the suburbs are more conservative. Unless it's changed a lot (possible), Austin won't necessarily feel that liberal to you if you're not from Texas. It's liberal for Texas, not for the rest of the country. Admittedly I've got a bit of an anti-Austin bias -- I spent 3 years there and found it to be pretty overhyped ... well, aside from the food which was awesome.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

after getting burned a few years ago interviewing a bunch of highly qualified Californians who really wanted to go to California and were just using OHSU as a backup -- Californians, man.

The number of interviews the average applicant goes to keeps getting higher and higher. I think US grads were now over 12 and IMGs somewhere around 20. The odds of getting any particular person you interview are now in the single digits so now it feels like everyone is using everybody as a backup. It is an enormous waste of time and money really. I think it is all coming from medical school deans who want to be able to say that everyone of their graduates matched. They are scaring their students into spending way too much time and money. They generalize advice like everyone is trying to get into optho or derm and the psych applicants catch this anxiety. We say apply broadly and this is good advice, but if you’re getting good interview invitations, you don’t have to go to every program in the country.

 

[xjoc]

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[clausewitz2]

I think it is all coming from medical school deans who want to be able to say that everyone of their graduates matched. They are scaring their students into spending way too much time and money. They generalize advice like everyone is trying to get into optho or derm and the psych applicants catch this anxiety. We say apply broadly and this is good advice, but if you’re getting good interview invitations, you don’t have to go to every program in the country.

This reflects my experience. Met with my dean recently in a mandatory "make sure your application strategy isn't ludicrous" type meeting, had to basically promise to apply to at least 25 places to satisfy him. Man is a psychiatrist by training, so I have to assume this is a case of his current professional incentives overriding firsthand knowledge of the field.

 

[Monocles]

The number of interviews the average applicant goes to keeps getting higher and higher. I think US grads were now over 12 and IMGs somewhere around 20. The odds of getting any particular person you interview are now in the single digits so now it feels like everyone is using everybody as a backup. It is an enormous waste of time and money really. I think it is all coming from medical school deans who want to be able to say that everyone of their graduates matched. They are scaring their students into spending way too much time and money. They generalize advice like everyone is trying to get into optho or derm and the psych applicants catch this anxiety. We say apply broadly and this is good advice, but if you’re getting good interview invitations, you don’t have to go to every program in the country.

This is definitely the case. I had my "mandatory M4 meeting" with the dean and she (a child psychiatrist herself!) told me to apply for 40 programs(!!!!) across the country. My advisor said "that's ridiculous! Just apply to 12". I can see where the dean's priorities are, considering there was a year where 9 people didn't match at our school and that made the school look really bad.

 

[DrMeowMeow]

.

 

[Freddie Mercury]

This is definitely the case. I had my "mandatory M4 meeting" with the dean and she (a child psychiatrist herself!) told me to apply for 40 programs(!!!!) across the country. My advisor said "that's ridiculous! Just apply to 12". I can see where the dean's priorities are, considering there was a year where 9 people didn't match at our school and that made the school look really bad.

Same as my school. Our dean's office even gave us numbers for # of applied programs for previous matches from our school, USMLE score ranges etc. For psych in the 2015 match, we had a USMLE Step 1 score range of ~195 to ~255, and the range of # of programs applied to was 42-127. So even the person that had a Step 1 score of ~255 applied to AT LEAST 42 programs. Seems pretty ridiculous IMO. This is a US allopathic school, albeit lower tier.

 

[InvegaSustenna]

Step 1: 231
COMLEX 1: 621
Step 2 CK/ CS: taking end of July
School: DO school
Class Rank: upper quartile
Grades in Clerkship: Honors in IM and Peds. The rest are Passes.
AOA: n/a
SSP: yes
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: a good amount of volunteer work, poster presentation.
Red Flags: (step failures, etc): non thus far
Overview of where you want to end up: doesn't matter. Will be applying both AOA and ACGME

 

[scudiera]

Step: 259/262/not taken yet
School: Top 20 allo
Class Rank: top 1/3
Grades in Clerkship: 1 H (IM), rest HP, 1 P
AOA: doubtful
Research/ECs: Extensive leadership, service, ECs. Limited research, a few abstract pubs.
Red Flags: (step failures, etc): Nope
Overview of where you want to end up: Struggling w/ this. Don't want to apply too broadly.

 

[scudiera]

Same as my school. Our dean's office even gave us numbers for # of applied programs for previous matches from our school, USMLE score ranges etc. For psych in the 2015 match, we had a USMLE Step 1 score range of ~195 to ~255, and the range of # of programs applied to was 42-127. So even the person that had a Step 1 score of ~255 applied to AT LEAST 42 programs. Seems pretty ridiculous IMO. This is a US allopathic school, albeit lower tier.

Insane. I am not applying to more than 18-20 tops. The person with a 255 must have been couples matching.

 

[Monocles]

Insane. I am not applying to more than 18-20 tops. The person with a 255 must have been couples matching.

With stats like yours you'll probably kill it everywhere!

 

[Dharma]

Step 1: 231
COMLEX 1: 621
Step 2 CK/ CS: taking end of July
School: DO school
Class Rank: upper quartile
Grades in Clerkship: Honors in IM and Peds. The rest are Passes.
AOA: n/a
SSP: yes
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: a good amount of volunteer work, poster presentation.
Red Flags: (step failures, etc): non thus far
Overview of where you want to end up: doesn't matter. Will be applying both AOA and ACGME

You sure you want to go down the AOA road? Any reason why? Just curious.

 

[InvegaSustenna]

You sure you want to go down the AOA road? Any reason why? Just curious.

Mostly just to see how things go and where and how many interviews I get.

 

[Dharma]

Mostly just to see how things go and where and how many interviews I get.

Makes sense. I'm thinking you will do pretty well for yourself if you apply to right places. There are a good number of really solid programs that should give you a sniff going by your numbers (btw congrats on those; hope you stomp Step 2!). I doubt you will need to rank any AOA programs.

 

[InvegaSustenna]

Makes sense. I'm thinking you will do pretty well for yourself if you apply to right places. There are a good number of really solid programs that should give you a sniff going by your numbers (btw congrats on those; hope you stomp Step 2!). I doubt you will need to rank any AOA programs.

Thanks, Dharma! Any program suggestions are welcome.

 

[Dharma]

Thanks, Dharma! Any program suggestions are welcome.

I'm at the same stage of the game as you (similar numbers as well). Maybe some of the others with more experience can chime in. Paging @MLT2MT2DO

 

[ChanandlerBong3]

.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Same as my school. Our dean's office even gave us numbers for # of applied programs for previous matches from our school, USMLE score ranges etc. For psych in the 2015 match, we had a USMLE Step 1 score range of ~195 to ~255, and the range of # of programs applied to was 42-127. So even the person that had a Step 1 score of ~255 applied to AT LEAST 42 programs. Seems pretty ridiculous IMO. This is a US allopathic school, albeit lower tier.

That is absolutely insane. I applied to like 20 programs back in 2010, which was way overkill back then. 42 programs without red flags! Poor programs having to sort through all this craziness.

I'm wondering if programs are seeing a greater number of interview offer declines -- it's not that hard to apply to a ton of programs, but interviewing at even 20 places is pretty challenging.

 

[Dharma]

Step 1: 253
Step 2 CK/ CS: 262, Pass
School: DO school, older and established
Class Rank: Top 10%
Grades in Clerkship: All Honors except IM
AOA: N/A
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: 1 first author in neuroendocrine pharmacology in middle of the road journal, undergrad thesis in memory/behavioral field, 6-7 abstracts along the same lines, 3 poster presentations 3rd year
Red Flags: (step failures, etc): none
Overview of where you want to end up: I am not sure, I would suppose the only thing holding me back in the DO thing. Plan to apply broadly.

Already took Step 2? Wow!

 

[Dharma]

Yeah, I had an easy rotation in February (out by noon almost everyday) so I just used the time to study and bang it out. I had only yet to do surgery and psych core rotations and those were my highest sections on the score report.

That's awesome! Killer scores too!!!

 

[Asklepian]

Step 1: 253
Step 2 CK/ CS: 262, Pass
School: DO school, older and established
Class Rank: Top 10%
Grades in Clerkship: All Honors except IM
AOA: N/A
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: 1 first author in neuroendocrine pharmacology in middle of the road journal, undergrad thesis in memory/behavioral field, 6-7 abstracts along the same lines, 3 poster presentations 3rd year
Red Flags: (step failures, etc): none
Overview of where you want to end up: I am not sure, I would suppose the only thing holding me back in the DO thing. Plan to apply broadly.

Honestly, you will probably interview / match nearly anywhere you want. Those are all great stats, congratulations!

 

[promotemma]

I guess an away isn't necessary. From what I've heard, the program is looking more toward interviewing people who convey some interest in the program or the area after getting burned a few years ago interviewing a bunch of highly qualified Californians who really wanted to go to California and were just using OHSU as a backup -- Californians, man. So yeah, find a way to convey interest, and I suspect you'll be good.

Yes, Portland has a moderate climate in that it rarely gets below freezing, and snow storms only occur every few years and are rare enough to shut down the city. It's definitely rainy, though, and our fall/winter/spring can be chilly in that it won't necessarily be sunny, and you might want to wear a jacket or long sleeves for a good chunk of the year. People who describe themselves as liking "warm" weather generally complain a lot about the weather here.

About Houston, my understanding is that the central part of the city is fairly liberal while the suburbs are more conservative. Unless it's changed a lot (possible), Austin won't necessarily feel that liberal to you if you're not from Texas. It's liberal for Texas, not for the rest of the country. Admittedly I've got a bit of an anti-Austin bias -- I spent 3 years there and found it to be pretty overhyped ... well, aside from the food which was awesome.

My understanding is that OHSU isn't accepting visiting students for psychiatry away rotations. If they've changed their position please let me know as it would be high on my list as well!

 

[promotemma]

Step 1: 242
Step 2 CK/ CS: Pending
School: DO school
Class Rank: Not sure, but probably lower half
Grades in Clerkship: Psych: HP, Honors in IM and FM, pass on others. All of my evals say the same thing pretty much, hard worker, eager to learn, very personable.
AOA: NOPE
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: Leadership in a couple school clubs that really didn't do anything. Lots of poverty relief work in undergrad. I'm a NHSC scholar recipient. I have 3 children (my own), who are technically financially disadvantaged that I tutor for free
Red Flags: (step failures, etc) None
Overview of where you want to end up: If I could find somewhere that was rural, liberal and with a moderate climate that would be great. I'm not tied geographically to any particular region. The liberal mecca of california would be great, possibly UC Irvine. OHSU would be great as well. Maybe Cambridge health alliance or Dartmouth in the northeast. Since I'm an NHSC scholar, a program with a strong social/community/public psych focus would be great. The bay area seems cost prohibitive. blah blah blah Oh: we're an interracial family, so anywhere with lots of rebel flags is off the list.

 

[NickNaylor]

I guess I'll go first:

Step 1: 227
Step 2 CK/ CS: to come in July/August
School: solidly middle of the pack US allopathic state school
Class Rank: probably bottom third
Grades in Clerkship: high 80s OB, medicine, 90s family, psych, neuro, EM, dunno about surgery and peds yet
AOA: nope
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: PhD in a cognitive neuroacience field; couple publications prior to med school in cognitive neuroscience, several posters at neuroscience conferences, platform session at Academy of Aphasia meeting, one neuroradiology pub in med school, hoping to crank out another paper from my dissertation before the match, getting into a naloxone project

Red Flags: whiffed first year biochem by a point, remediated with a shelf exam the following summer

Overview of where you want to end up:
Not a secret that OHSU is my top choice, but otherwise looking at warm cities with over a million people. Only Austin probably acceptable in Texas, though. Ethnically diverse population a huge plus. Spouse also strongly dislikes California.

As a native Texan returning to Dallas for residency, I think Austin is hugely overrated. If you're interested in Texas, I agree with @Doctor Bagel with respect to Dallas and Houston. They are both very large cities - Dallas with more "urban sprawl" than Houston - with plenty to do and just as much "ethnic diversity" as Austin. Austin is a cool city to visit for a weekend but traffic is an absolute killer if you've never lived in a city with significant traffic. If you have an interest in Texas, I think you should consider Houston in Dallas in addition to Austin. If you have no interest in Texas and it's "Austin or bust," then save yourself the money I suppose.

 

[psych72]

To a bunch of the DO's who posted. First, your stats look absolutely stellar. Congrats on having the work ethic, brilliance and hard work to achieve them.

I think you guys have a shot at almost any program. I will caution you about California as a whole though, it's still fairly biased. Or at least it was this last cycle, maybe because a record number of Loma Linda graduates decided they wanted to do Psych or just the popularity of the profession in general.

What irks me is that the bias towards DO's is so great that allopathic candidates who don't even have ties to the area, have red flags, etc. still got priority over some of those DO students who had excellent stats and were at the top of their class. I'm not even talking about myself, but I had some friends who were rockstars yet still didn't get invites at some Cali places. I guess it makes sense sorta.

Best of luck to all!

 

[clausewitz2]

As a native Texan returning to Dallas for residency, I think Austin is hugely overrated. If you're interested in Texas, I agree with @Doctor Bagel with respect to Dallas and Houston. They are both very large cities - Dallas with more "urban sprawl" than Houston - with plenty to do and just as much "ethnic diversity" as Austin. Austin is a cool city to visit for a weekend but traffic is an absolute killer if you've never lived in a city with significant traffic. If you have an interest in Texas, I think you should consider Houston in Dallas in addition to Austin. If you have no interest in Texas and it's "Austin or bust," then save yourself the money I suppose.

Yeah, I am getting the sense that my idea of Houston is perhaps malformed, but the sprawl that comes with lack of effective zoning is a bit of a deal-breaker for the spouse. This rather means that Dallas is right out as well. We are both familiar with really nasty traffic (hailing originally from a city that never fails to enter the top 5 whenever people rank such things) so bad jams are not so much the issue, but extreme spread out-ness rather is. Phoenix is another place we're not fond of for basically the same reason; I got the impression while visiting that it seemed to take about 40 minutes to go between any two points in the city, largely independent of distance.

 

[675015]

I will caution you about California as a whole though, it's still fairly biased.

What irks me is that the bias towards DO's is so great that allopathic candidates who don't even have ties to the area, have red flags, etc. still got priority over some of those DO students who had excellent stats and were at the top of their class.

It might be frustrating if you are a DO but it's not just an arbitrary bias. I don't see how differences in "ties to the area" are the same as differences in where you attend medical school in an application.

 

[NickNaylor]

Yeah, I am getting the sense that my idea of Houston is perhaps malformed, but the sprawl that comes with lack of effective zoning is a bit of a deal-breaker for the spouse. This rather means that Dallas is right out as well. We are both familiar with really nasty traffic (hailing originally from a city that never fails to enter the top 5 whenever people rank such things) so bad jams are not so much the issue, but extreme spread out-ness rather is. Phoenix is another place we're not fond of for basically the same reason; I got the impression while visiting that it seemed to take about 40 minutes to go between any two points in the city, largely independent of distance.

I'd say it depends for Houston. If you're interested in living in a more urban area, the downtown and TMC areas are huge and will give you a similar feel to Austin. Dallas has a downtown area but it's not nearly as robust as Houston or Austin. If you don't like the idea of sprawl then Dallas definitely isn't for you. I grew up in Dallas so I personally prefer it to the claustrophobic feeling I get with cities, but driving is pretty much a must. I'll be living about 20 minutes away in a suburb for residency.

 

[notdeadyet]

Overview of where you want to end up:
Not a secret that OHSU is my top choice, but otherwise looking at warm cities with over a million people. Only Austin probably acceptable in Texas, though. Ethnically diverse population a huge plus. Spouse also strongly dislikes California.

If warm cities of >1 million people and ethnically diverse populations are the top of your list of priorities, you might want to think long and hard about the Portland idea.

Nothing wrong with strongly disliking California. If more transplants felt that way, we'd have a better state out here.

 

[clausewitz2]

Again, warm is dfinitely the wrong word choice, in retrospect, as it s more about avoiding snow. True, whitebread-ness is Portland's major disadvantage for me, but there are several other factors in its favor. Also, the metro is easily over a million, and that is usually what makes it for me - I grew up in a town that on paper in the city had only a few hundred thousand but had about six million in a 30 minute radius.

 

[Phlox]

Step 1: 245
Step 2 CK/ CS: Taking this month
School: State school, allopathic, middle of the road.
Class Rank: Middle of the pack
Grades in Clerkship: A's in IM/Surgery/Peds/Psych/Neuro, B's in FM and OB
AOA: Nope
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: 1 poster presentation
Red Flags: Don't think so
Overview of where you want to end up: I have a rough draft list of Duke, UNC, LSU/Oschner, Tulane, UAMS, MUSC, UTSW, UT-Austin, Vandy, UF, UCSD, UCLA, UCSF, Stanford. Don't have more clarity about specific career aspirations at the moment. I like warm weather.

I applied last year with very similar stats, slightly more research. I applied to and received interviews at Duke, UNC, MUSC, Vanderbilt, and UCSD (off the waitlist). I did not receive interviews at UCLA or UCSF, and did not apply to the others. I think you have a good shot at most of these programs! If you're looking in the southeast, you might also consider Emory. I also really liked UC Davis.

 

[MLT2MT2DO]

Step 1: 231
COMLEX 1: 621
Step 2 CK/ CS: taking end of July
School: DO school
Class Rank: upper quartile
Grades in Clerkship: Honors in IM and Peds. The rest are Passes.
AOA: n/a
SSP: yes
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: a good amount of volunteer work, poster presentation.
Red Flags: (step failures, etc): non thus far
Overview of where you want to end up: doesn't matter. Will be applying both AOA and ACGME

Your resume looks nearly identical to mine...I had better clerkship grades but guessing I also go to a school that is easier to get "As" or "Honors" in 3rd/4th year.

As Dharma said, why AOA? Are there certain programs you're interested in? You really don't need to go that route. I applied to 2 programs, one was a giant safety net if I failed the PE/it was my home program so I only had to take a half day off of rotations, the other was dually accredited and in the geographic region I was interested in.

You have solid stats, and no reason to "apply broadly". There are a ton of solid ACGME residencies that are DO friendly (there's plenty that aren't also), you just need to figure out where you want to be. With that said the Midwest is very DO friendly and surprised me during interview season at the quality of many of the programs. Other than that if you don't have some idea of what you want either interest wise or geographic wise there's not much else I can say.

 

[MLT2MT2DO]

Step 1: 253
Step 2 CK/ CS: 262, Pass
School: DO school, older and established
Class Rank: Top 10%
Grades in Clerkship: All Honors except IM
AOA: N/A
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: 1 first author in neuroendocrine pharmacology in middle of the road journal, undergrad thesis in memory/behavioral field, 6-7 abstracts along the same lines, 3 poster presentations 3rd year
Red Flags: (step failures, etc): none
Overview of where you want to end up: I am not sure, I would suppose the only thing holding me back in the DO thing. Plan to apply broadly.

So you have the scores, the research, and the school you go too isn't named LECOM or Touro (the last really only matters at a select few residencies). You've broken down every barrier a DO has.
There is no reason for you to "apply broadly" you're going to waste a ton of money, wasting a lot of time scheduling/cancelling interviews, or worse going on WAY too many interviews.
Like I mentioned to Invega, you need to figure out where your interests lie, and whether geography is a concern for you. Personally just looking at your resume UCSD (yes neigh impossible for a DO to match, but if anyone can do it you probably can) or UW (again touch for DOs to match but no unheard of plus you have the research) looks like a nice fit for you, but I have no idea if you have any interest in the West.

 

[MLT2MT2DO]

Step 1: 242
Step 2 CK/ CS: Pending
School: DO school
Class Rank: Not sure, but probably lower half
Grades in Clerkship: Psych: HP, Honors in IM and FM, pass on others. All of my evals say the same thing pretty much, hard worker, eager to learn, very personable.
AOA: NOPE
Research/ Publications/ Extracurriculars: Leadership in a couple school clubs that really didn't do anything. Lots of poverty relief work in undergrad. I'm a NHSC scholar recipient. I have 3 children (my own), who are technically financially disadvantaged that I tutor for free
Red Flags: (step failures, etc) None
Overview of where you want to end up: If I could find somewhere that was rural, liberal and with a moderate climate that would be great. I'm not tied geographically to any particular region. The liberal mecca of california would be great, possibly UC Irvine. OHSU would be great as well. Maybe Cambridge health alliance or Dartmouth in the northeast. Since I'm an NHSC scholar, a program with a strong social/community/public psych focus would be great. The bay area seems cost prohibitive. blah blah blah Oh: we're an interracial family, so anywhere with lots of rebel flags is off the list.

My understanding is that OHSU isn't accepting visiting students for psychiatry away rotations. If they've changed their position please let me know as it would be high on my list as well!

You're a solid applicant. OHSU would probably be a solid fit for you. OHSU was accepting VSAS students last year at least for Community Psych and Intercultural Psych, if I remember correctly I don't think they opened up until June, so maybe that is your issue. I applied to Dartmouth, didn't get an interview but I also didn't have strong ties to the NE, just an interest in rural Pscyh. In hindsight I probably should have written a separate Personal Statement for them. I believe UC Irvine is fairly friendly, I only applied to UCSF,UCSD, UC Davis, Stanford myself and heard nothing back. I'd recommend UCSF-Fresno but I'd hardly put them anywhere near the "liberal mecca of California".
Outside of a select few programs I don't have a ton of knowledge on strong community psych, maybe someone else has a better idea.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

It might be frustrating if you are a DO but it's not just an arbitrary bias. I don't see how differences in "ties to the area" are the same as differences in where you attend medical school in an application.

I’m not an expert on the whole anti-DO bias culture or “DO friendly” culture discussions, but it seems to me this has a fairly good parallel process with psychology. Post-doctoral fellowships in psychology spend a lot of time thinking about which candidates come out of university based PhD programs vs. for profit programs. From what I have learned on this forum is that some of the duck test questions about differences in good and bad training would be something like:

Does your school have PhD candidates in anatomy, anthropology, biochemistry, genetics, … and are the associated faculty scientists participating in your basic science education?

Does your school run a major hospital or health care system in which to provide well monitored clinical experiences with consistent grading standards and school credentialed instructors?

Are the activities of the non-elective core rotations centrally planned and organized by a curriculum committee comprised of your school leadership even when there are multiple sites to choose from?

Does your second year science education include some physician clinical faculty who are both practicing and doing research in a field of medicine, and do you then see these same people during rotations in the third and fourth year?

Do you have rotations that include places with level one trauma centers, a wide range of specialties with 24/7 coverage, or is it a hodge podge of specialty centers for oncology, ophthalmology, free standing psych, rehabilitation, interventional cardiology, etc?

Are your mentors pushing the envelope in terms of the latest advances in care?

I’m sure there are both DO and MD schools that do and do not do most of these things, but this is how I would kick the tires when deciding on where I’m educated.


On an other topic,
Can someone tell me what the emphasis on local ties is all about? I mean really, when it comes to ranking a candidate isn’t their commitment to an area completely up to the candidate? If someone wants to move to our neck of the woods, but have never lived here before, who cares so long as they are good at what we need them to do. If they don’t want to come, they will not rank us high and they will go somewhere else. I just don’t see why that would change my ranking behavior. Shouldn’t this just be a matter of ranking candidates by talent, and then let the candidates sort out how to prioritize life decisions? I have heard a lot of posters suggest that applicants be sure and mention geographic connections, but I don’t hear training directors say that this would ever get you invited over someone with better grades.

 

[promotemma]

You're a solid applicant. OHSU would probably be a solid fit for you. OHSU was accepting VSAS students last year at least for Community Psych and Intercultural Psych, if I remember correctly I don't think they opened up until June, so maybe that is your issue. I applied to Dartmouth, didn't get an interview but I also didn't have strong ties to the NE, just an interest in rural Pscyh. In hindsight I probably should have written a separate Personal Statement for them. I believe UC Irvine is fairly friendly, I only applied to UCSF,UCSD, UC Davis, Stanford myself and heard nothing back. I'd recommend UCSF-Fresno but I'd hardly put them anywhere near the "liberal mecca of California".
Outside of a select few programs I don't have a ton of knowledge on strong community psych, maybe someone else has a better idea.

MLT2MTDO:
Thank you for your input. I called OHSU and they frustratingly explained to me that they are having a difficulty in accommodating their own students in Psych and at this point don't expect to be able to accommodate visiting students. Were your stats roughly similar to mine? Where did you wind up matching if you don't mind me asking.

 

[675015]

On an other topic,
Can someone tell me what the emphasis on local ties is all about? I mean really, when it comes to ranking a candidate isn’t their commitment to an area completely up to the candidate? If someone wants to move to our neck of the woods, but have never lived here before, who cares so long as they are good at what we need them to do. If they don’t want to come, they will not rank us high and they will go somewhere else. I just don’t see why that would change my ranking behavior. Shouldn’t this just be a matter of ranking candidates by talent, and then let the candidates sort out how to prioritize life decisions? I have heard a lot of posters suggest that applicants be sure and mention geographic connections, but I don’t hear training directors say that this would ever get you invited over someone with better grades.

Good post. I was hoping to convey something similar but don't have the experience or wisdom (in fact, I currently have none) to make it sound as good as you.

As far as your second question, I think its two things:
1. Mostly its a hold-over from applying to medical school (very similar to the current trend in applying to a billion places to "make sure" you get in). Many medical schools are state schools and are instructed by charter to give preference to in-state applicants. Many schools even have quotas for how much must be in-state. When the last time you applied to something, you were instructed "Don't apply to programs X, Y, Z because they don't even look at OOS applicants," it makes sense that some of that sentiment will linger when you apply to residency.

2. I think it makes applicants feel more secure (even if superficially) in their interview. For example, when you get asked "why here" the real answer is usually something like "Well, you teach us psychiatry. According to your website you have good psychotherapy but also good pharm lectures. You also have CL, ER, and good outpatient programs." Whether its meaningful or not, it FEELS better to have a connection to the area. But (and I'm sure you've heard similar) have heard people say things like "My cousins live in the area." Not sure how that helps at all.

3. There is this constant worry about programs not ranking candidates by quality but by what they think they will get (which most have assured me is not true). However, I think this makes applicants feel like if they can't convey to a program they REALLY want to go, they won't be ranked as highly. Even more concerning would be getting an interview (especially if an applicant feels they are "overqualified"). People will think they might get passed over because why would a program waste time interviewing if they don't believe you would ever come.

I know all of these things aren't necessarily true. These are just my thoughts as to WHY applicants feel this way.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Even more concerning would be getting an interview (especially if an applicant feels they are "overqualified"). People will think they might get passed over because why would a program waste time interviewing if they don't believe you would ever come.

I know all of these things aren't necessarily true. These are just my thoughts as to WHY applicants feel this way.

Program director’s ego’s are so well developed, it is unlikely any of them would be capable of considering anyone “overqualified”, but the last part is the least true. Lots of candidates apply to places they don’t intent to go, but once they have flown into town, spent a day and paid for a hotel, they have shown enough interest in my opinion.

 

[vanfanal]

Just got my step 2 result back. It's a 226, same as my step 1. I was hoping for at least a 230. What do you guys think? Remember that I'm an IMG.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

My understanding is that OHSU isn't accepting visiting students for psychiatry away rotations. If they've changed their position please let me know as it would be high on my list as well!

I guess they're not this year for various logistical reasons. They do historically accept aways and I'm assuming will start again next year, although I know that doesn't help you out.

 

[MLT2MT2DO]

MLT2MTDO:
Thank you for your input. I called OHSU and they frustratingly explained to me that they are having a difficulty in accommodating their own students in Psych and at this point don't expect to be able to accommodate visiting students. Were your stats roughly similar to mine? Where did you wind up matching if you don't mind me asking.

My step 1 was about 10 points higher, as mentioned my clinical grades were higher but my school is cake when it comes to 3rd and 4th year grades. That's too bad about OHSU, I'm wondering if some of the preceptors decided to not take students this year. I know my preceptor was hardily available while I was there (guy was there 3 days out of 20 and yet he's the one who graded me), though I did get to work with some great doctors.

I ended up matching at Creighton. I struggled with my rank list between ranking Creighton or OHSU above one another. In the end Creighton felt like they were more interested in teaching and allowing more freedom with one's schedule, not to mention long work hours+never seeing the sun didn't sound like a good way to spend my first couple of years as a resident. Also COL in Portland >>>>Omaha. So in the end I placed Creighton above OHSU, and since I have nothing better to do at the end of 4th year, I compulsively wonder if it was the right decision...I'm fairly sure I would have matched OHSU had I placed them above Creighton.