RELIGION - Did it come up in your interview?

[Geronimo]

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If religion came up in your interview, how do you think it affected you?

 

[SlopinMunkyDude]

I had a friend who had it mentioned in her interview at Colorado, where she is presently attending. Apparently her interviewer talked with her about her beliefs for about 5 minutes. She'd been on several mission trips abroad, and her interviewer seemed intrigued and supportive. Her stats were about average there, so I'm sure it didn't hurt her and likely helped her.

 

[delicatefade]

Negatively. I'm from a Christian background and had a Muslim interviewer at one school. He asked me what I thought about current Israel/Palestinian relations, and to be honest, I felt trapped. I'm not a super Israel supporter but I wouldn't say I'm too sympathetic to the Palestinians either. I knew that he was clearly bringing it up having a specific answer in mind.

Next, we moved on the the brutality of the crusades. Which were brutal, without a doubt. I don't think he liked it when I mentioned that although the Christians were brutal and unfounded in their motives, the Muslims also fought their way through much of Europe so I thought that there was probably some blame on both sides.

Next, we discussed whether Islamic culture was "better" than Western culture. He clearly thought that it was, although his parents were immigrants and he had just finished telling me about the large, successful (ie- doctors, lawyers) Muslim population in Detroit. I pointed out that whatever flaws he thought Western culture had, his family surely thrived in a capitalist culture and the large Muslim population certainly seemed to be doing well as transplants. Western culture must not be that bad. I don't think he liked that either.

I'm pretty sure it had something to do with my being wait-listed despite my well above average GPA, MCAT, and EC's for that particular school. Sheesh.

 

[SlopinMunkyDude]

although the Christians were brutal and unfounded in their motives,

Sheesh, he wouldn't have liked to hear my opinions on Fatimid Caliph Al-Hakim. That guy disgraced Islam (brought a pig into a mosque and replaced Allah's name with his own) and Christianity (destroyed some 10,000 Christian churches in less than a decade, including the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem, which incited the Crusades). That's about the best I could have done. I really don't think either sides' motives were unfounded.

That's a tough interview, man.

Did you make your beliefs a fundamental part of your application?

 

[Blake]

Yea, we talked about it like 5 seconds. Just answered the question and we moved on other subjects. Seriously, my 2 med interviews, out of a possible 3, were a breeze. My stress level was 2 out of 10 😀

 

[Loula]

Negatively. I'm from a Christian background and had a Muslim interviewer at one school. He asked me what I thought about current Israel/Palestinian relations, and to be honest, I felt trapped. I'm not a super Israel supporter but I wouldn't say I'm too sympathetic to the Palestinians either. I knew that he was clearly bringing it up having a specific answer in mind.

Next, we moved on the the brutality of the crusades. Which were brutal, without a doubt. I don't think he liked it when I mentioned that although the Christians were brutal and unfounded in their motives, the Muslims also fought their way through much of Europe so I thought that there was probably some blame on both sides.

Next, we discussed whether Islamic culture was "better" than Western culture. He clearly thought that it was, although his parents were immigrants and he had just finished telling me about the large, successful (ie- doctors, lawyers) Muslim population in Detroit. I pointed out that whatever flaws he thought Western culture had, his family surely thrived in a capitalist culture and the large Muslim population certainly seemed to be doing well as transplants. Western culture must not be that bad. I don't think he liked that either.

I'm pretty sure it had something to do with my being wait-listed despite my well above average GPA, MCAT, and EC's for that particular school. Sheesh.

I can't believe such an interview would occur in the U.S.?
Isn't it not politically correct to even talk about religion?
You should complain!!!

 

[freaker]

Isn't it not politically correct to even talk about religion?

Only if you're someone who feels stifled by political correctness. But in all candor, I would think that in a field like medicine where so many are going to be instilled with their medical calling through their religious background, one might expect those beliefs to come up in an interview.

With that said, I have no idea why the Crusades and the "superiority" of one culture to another came up in an interview. Both were inappropriate, divisive topics that had very little to do with the OP's background or interest in medicine (unless the poster was of MEastern descent). The situation in the ME was likely to bring out another politically correct (read: meaningless and insincere) answer, as well, so I'm not sure about the point of that one, either.

You would think that any related questions would relate to one's motivations and serve as more of a means of understanding that arising confrontation.

 

[thewzdoc]

Oh man...I hope it doesn't come up in any...I'd have to find a way to side step that hot potato....It?s hard to discuss what your beliefs are without sounding like you are ?against? someones?.

 

[samurai_lincoln]

I can't believe such an interview would occur in the U.S.?
Isn't it not politically correct to even talk about religion?
You should complain!!!

I agree... how can schools get away with this, when private employers can't touch the subject? Especially when schools typically consider themselves bastions of political correctness. Now I feel obliged to look up whether there are any laws pertaining to what subjects, if any, are prohibited in a school interview.

 

[burlypie]

Yes, I can't remember how it came up but my interwiewer and I came to the conclusion that, for the most part, religion and political leanings won't affect most of the medical care a doctor gives a patient. It was a friendly discussion and igot in soon after 🙂

 

[LoneCoyote]

I was surpirsed when it came up in one of my interviews since I have nothing about religion listed on my applications. The interviewer ended up asking me very detailed questions about what religion I considered myself, whtether I believed in God, what that entailed, etc. Overall, it was not the greatest interview because the interviewer asked some other very random, personal questions. I got waitlisted.

 

[curlycity]

I can't believe such an interview would occur in the U.S.?
Isn't it not politically correct to even talk about religion?
You should complain!!!

Medicine has long been tied up with religion; two major schools of medical ethics come from Jewish and Catholic teachings. A lot of hospitals are sponsored/founded by religious groups; the Texas Medical Center even has a building called "center for religion" or something like that. Aside from asking inflammatory or insulting questions, finding out someone's attitude towards religion could be useful to an interviewer, especially if the school has a historical religious affiliation. It's not so much what do you believe, but what are your attitudes toward others' beliefs, that would be an appropriate topic of conversation. And finding out how you handle challenges to your beliefs or adversarial comments is another interview strategy, although I don't agree with gratuitously offending people.

Religion per se didn't come up in my interviews, but I did get asked "Do you think people are basically good?" and other 'deep' philosophical questions.

Also as a doctor you might face religious discrimination - I worked with a wonderful doc whose parents were from India and I had a patient actually ask me her nationality, "just to be sure." As in, be sure she's not Muslim? !!! Offended! So an interviewer might ask you how you would handle that sort of situation.

Religion and politics aren't polite topics of conversation, but a med school interview isn't a cocktail party 🙂 and I got asked a lot of questions that would qualify as politically incorrect. So in your interviews, be sure the tone and content of your replies indicate a calm temper and open mind if at all possible. Good luck!!!

 

[shadowy onion]

I think it is fair game to get a sense of the person sitting in front of you even when not PC.
As a person you my have your personal beliefs and strong feelings towards a specific population (for instance when you are at war with a nation)
However the adcoms want to make sure that any bias stays out of the hospital. Their way of discovering this (or at least trying) is by bringing up subjects like the israeli/palestinian conflict (especially if you are involved) and asking for your thoughts.
I would think that the adcoms would be wrong not to ask about it.

 

[curlycity]

I was surpirsed when it came up in one of my interviews since I have nothing about religion listed on my applications. The interviewer ended up asking me very detailed questions about what religion I considered myself, whtether I believed in God, what that entailed, etc. Overall, it was not the greatest interview because the interviewer asked some other very random, personal questions. I got waitlisted.

Yeah I had some really personal questions too! But I think they were looking for an articulate and confident reply rather than trying to discriminate against me - like when they asked my how my husband felt about the time and financial commitment I was making, and even the magic bullet "what about having children," I made a sensible answer instead of getting offended and refusing to answer.

One other thing - asking detailed questions would tell them if you're someone who has examined and carefully chosen their beliefs, or if you're blindly going along with parents/culture. It might seem oxymoronic that you could be expected to reason on your religion, but I know I respect people a lot more when they can make a good explanation other than "because I was born X and I'm going to die X".

 

[Scubadoc]

when they asked ...the magic bullet "what about having children," I made a sensible answer instead of getting offended and refusing to answer.

what did you say!?

 

[curlycity]

what did you say!?

Not to hijack the thread, but -

I explained in one sentence how we were financing my med school; I used one more sentence to describe our relationship as "two busy people who like each other the way we are and really enjoy the time we do spend together;" and then I simply stated that, my husband and I have always agreed that we don't plan to have children, and that although we of course might change our minds later, at this point in our education/career we're happy with the choices we've made. [I was 26 and married 7 years when I interviewed - I think a younger woman making this assertion might face a bit more skepticism, but they seemed to accept my answers.]

So that was like a 30-60 second reply to some heavy questions that really could have bogged down the interview! But I was ready for 'em! Mostly because EVERYONE I knew from family to casual acquaintances had asked me that exact list of questions.

 

[delicatefade]

Sheesh, he wouldn't have liked to hear my opinions on Fatimid Caliph Al-Hakim. That guy disgraced Islam (brought a pig into a mosque and replaced Allah's name with his own) and Christianity (destroyed some 10,000 Christian churches in less than a decade, including the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem, which incited the Crusades). That's about the best I could have done. I really don't think either sides' motives were unfounded.

That's a tough interview, man.

Did you make your beliefs a fundamental part of your application?

I didn't mention them at all in my application. The interviewer is of Syrian descent. I'm your typical mid-20's, white male applicant.

 

[leechy]

I was surpirsed when it came up in one of my interviews since I have nothing about religion listed on my applications. The interviewer ended up asking me very detailed questions about what religion I considered myself, whtether I believed in God, what that entailed, etc. Overall, it was not the greatest interview because the interviewer asked some other very random, personal questions. I got waitlisted.

Oh my... They can get away with asking questions about personal religious beliefs? That's awful! I can understand it if the school has a strong religious affiliation (like Loma Linda), or if the applicant had made it a prominent part of their application / essay. But it seems unfair to ask the question outside of these contexts! Inevitably, if your personal views contradict those of the interviewer, it's going to create some subconscious tension, even if you couch your views in tolerant, non-judgmental language. And if you happen to share the interviewer's beliefs, it's going to put you in a better light in the interviewer's mind, even if the interviewer doesn't consciously admit that a similarity of religious beliefs is what makes him like the candidate a bit more. Really, these sorts of questions should not be allowed in med school interviewers. 👎

 

[kingcer0x]

It is possible to say you have faith or dont have faith without delving into the depths of your beliefs. Why get into specifics? Tolerance is a beautiful thing.

If they wish to know more, your interviewer is a putz and didnt like you in the first place.

 

[Newquagmire]

what are you gonna do when a patient comes in and says something completely wacky? are you going to say, "i'm sorry, that's an illegal question, i'm not answering it, and i'm reporting you to the admissions office?"

 

[flighterdoc]

Oh man...I hope it doesn't come up in any...I'd have to find a way to side step that hot potato....It?s hard to discuss what your beliefs are without sounding like you are ?against? someones?.

I can't believe that a school would even ask it. I know that an employer couldn't. It would be interesting to get some lawyers involved for anyone who was rejected after an interview like that.

 

[flighterdoc]

I think it is fair game to get a sense of the person sitting in front of you even when not PC.
As a person you my have your personal beliefs and strong feelings towards a specific population (for instance when you are at war with a nation)
However the adcoms want to make sure that any bias stays out of the hospital. Their way of discovering this (or at least trying) is by bringing up subjects like the israeli/palestinian conflict (especially if you are involved) and asking for your thoughts.
I would think that the adcoms would be wrong not to ask about it.

You're contradicting yourself. You want the adcoms to make certain that you're unbiased, but they start out asking such a politically charged question?

I admire your self-control, though.

 

[thewzdoc]

what are you gonna do when a patient comes in and says something completely wacky? are you going to say, "i'm sorry, that's an illegal question, i'm not answering it, and i'm reporting you to the admissions office?"

That?s easy?you increase their meds. That?s just crazy talk?.

 

[delicatefade]

of course this is all evidence that medical school admissions are totally random and controlled by the whims of The Man. If you pre-meds don't believe that now, you will!!!

 

[thewzdoc]

of course this is all evidence that medical school admissions are totally random and controlled by the whims of The Man. If you pre-meds don't believe that now, you will!!!

Yes but now we have to define who/what "The Man" is......

 

[shadowy onion]

You're contradicting yourself. You want the adcoms to make certain that you're unbiased, but they start out asking such a politically charged question?

I admire your self-control, though.

Not at all.
I think people are biased. I also think that adcoms realize this.
However as a doctor you need to focus on the human being with a clear mind.
This my friend is a very hard task.
Imagine doing CPR on a suicide bomber who just killed a dozen innocent people. Not easy (from experience).
Adcoms are not interested in potential doctors who cannot let go of their biased opinons for the preservation of life.
They ask the hard questions not to see if you are biased (they know we are in certain cases), but to see how we can handle the balance between medicine and some real crazy realities.

 

[flighterdoc]

Not at all.
I think people are biased. I also think that adcoms realize this.
However as a doctor you need to focus on the human being with a clear mind.
This my friend is a very hard task.
Imagine doing CPR on a suicide bomber who just killed a dozen innocent people. Not easy (from experience).
Adcoms are not interested in potential doctors who cannot let go of their biased opinons for the preservation of life.
They ask the hard questions not to see if you are biased (they know we are in certain cases), but to see how we can handle the balance between medicine and some real crazy realities.

I'm not questioning your motives. I'd question the interviewers. The interviewer should not have any biases - how do you know, especially when he asks such a loaded question? And, what does that say about HIS ability to let go of his biased opinion when he so clearly demonstrated a potential bias?

By the way, have you heard back?

 

[leechy]

what are you gonna do when a patient comes in and says something completely wacky? are you going to say, "i'm sorry, that's an illegal question, i'm not answering it, and i'm reporting you to the admissions office?"

No, of course not, because your answers to those questions in that setting don't directly impact your future (as long as you're polite and respectful). Having med school interviewers ask questions about religious beliefs is a different animal, because there, your answers CAN make an impact on your future, and it's something that really shouldn't be making a difference in admissions (unless of course you are applying to a school with an explicit religious orientation). Some would say that interviewers would be able to totally divorce your answers to religious questions from their opinion of you, but I'm not sure that's the case. Interviewers are human too, and if your views on religion greatly differ from theirs, it's going to inevitably taint their view of you.

It's true that probing questions about religion and politics can be a way of assessing how you handle awkward situations, and whether you can deal with them when dealing with patients... But the downside is that, rather inevitably, your answers to questions of religious belief are going to affect how your interviewer perceives you - just as everything else you say is affecting how he perceives you.

In any case, I think that at the very least, when questioned about their religious beliefs in a med school interview, it should be perfectly acceptable for a person to answer that they prefer not to answer such questions (just like they can plead the fifth when asked about significant others, sexual orientation, or the other inappropriate questions that interviewers sometimes throw at you). And perhaps it IS perfectly acceptable to answer that way - I don't know, not having been through the interview process yet.

 

[Newquagmire]

It's true that probing questions about religion and politics can be a way of assessing how you handle awkward situations, and whether you can deal with them when dealing with patients... But the downside is that, rather inevitably, your answers to questions of religious belief are going to affect how your interviewer perceives you - just as everything else you say is affecting how he perceives you.

unless your interviewer is, in reality, politically apathetic and just wants to see how you respond.

 

[chopper]

I guess there are two possibilities to this one:

1. The individuals who brought up the 'un-PC' questions do really think that way, and they are trying somehow to influence the makeup of the class coming in. Maybe, but unless he/she is hiding this from the others on the admissions comittee - do you think they would figure out not to put him in interviews (or discount his/her recommendations) pretty quickly?

2. They were just testing you. If they wanted to see how you would react in this kind of situation, wouldn't it make sense to send in the interviewer who 'looks' the part of the radical Muslim. I can see it now: the most secular, 'new world' Iranian/Pakistani/<insert correct moniker here> on the admissions comittee gets called on from time to time to play the 'angry Muslim' to shake up the white bread applicant and see how he reacts. Think of the laughs the comittee would have that night recalling how they made the poor kid squirm.

 

[flighterdoc]

what are you gonna do when a patient comes in and says something completely wacky? are you going to say, "i'm sorry, that's an illegal question, i'm not answering it, and i'm reporting you to the admissions office?"

Thats just a silly analogy. The patient doesn't have any position of power over you, the interviewer does by their position - a bad review and you are objectively harmed.

Now, if a patient came in asking questions that weren't relevant to their care, I'd politely tell them to stfu.

 

[flighterdoc]

Good point,
I never thought of it from that direction.
I just assumed it was a question that would pop up with my military background, and when it did I never considered that option.

I passed the interview.

Passed the interview as in you were offered a position at that school? Thats the ONLY criteria that matters, btw. If you weren't accepted and offered a seat, then you may well have been illegally discriminated against.

 

[Newquagmire]

Thats just a silly analogy. The patient doesn't have any position of power over you, the interviewer does by their position - a bad review and you are objectively harmed.

Now, if a patient came in asking questions that weren't relevant to their care, I'd politely tell them to stfu.

life is full of silly analogies, and i'm determined to make them all. don't fear the interviewer, it's just an interview.

 

[flighterdoc]

life is full of silly analogies, and i'm determined to make them all. don't fear the interviewer, it's just an interview.

LOL, one more down. How many to go?

 

[kingcer0x]

Abortion always comes up at interviews, perhaps that could lead to discussions about faith. You have balls if you tell an interviewer you wont perform abortions because of your faith. You are telling him that your beliefs do not allow you to perform a legal recognized medical procedure even in cases where it is necessary. Thats why, you say nothing now, and don't go into ob/gyn... haha.

i was asked if i would perform abortions by the way and I said yes as long as I dont get shot by anti-abortion protestors on the way out. i got into the school.

 

[douche]

Shouldn't these types of questions be strictly prohibited at PUBLIC schools? IMHO, you have a valid complaint here.

 

[kingcer0x]

Shouldn't these types of questions be strictly prohibited at PUBLIC schools? IMHO, you have a valid complaint here.

I second that.

 

[gizmoduck]

You have balls if you tell an interviewer you wont perform abortions because of your faith. You are telling him that your beliefs do not allow you to perform a legal recognized medical procedure even in cases where it is necessary.

I must have a pair the size of Texas then. Personally I think if a school won't let you work according to your convictions then that isn't the school at which to be. As for religion, just go with voodoo witch doctor. That's always a safe call.

 

[Newquagmire]

Shouldn't these types of questions be strictly prohibited at PUBLIC schools?

no. how is a public school any different?

 

[samurai_lincoln]

no. how is a public school any different?

Because discrimination on basis of religion is prohibited for "state actors" (governmental entities, including public schoos), but this is not the case for private organizations. Think of Augusta National or the local Elks lodge, who are free to exclude whomever they want.

However, the sticky point here is that private employers are forbidden from asking interview questions relating to religion (can't even imply it - "can you work weekends?"). Not sure whether this also applies to private schools.

 

[principessa]

Negatively. I'm from a Christian background and had a Muslim interviewer at one school. He asked me what I thought about current Israel/Palestinian relations, and to be honest, I felt trapped. I'm not a super Israel supporter but I wouldn't say I'm too sympathetic to the Palestinians either. I knew that he was clearly bringing it up having a specific answer in mind.

Next, we moved on the the brutality of the crusades. Which were brutal, without a doubt. I don't think he liked it when I mentioned that although the Christians were brutal and unfounded in their motives, the Muslims also fought their way through much of Europe so I thought that there was probably some blame on both sides.

Next, we discussed whether Islamic culture was "better" than Western culture. He clearly thought that it was, although his parents were immigrants and he had just finished telling me about the large, successful (ie- doctors, lawyers) Muslim population in Detroit. I pointed out that whatever flaws he thought Western culture had, his family surely thrived in a capitalist culture and the large Muslim population certainly seemed to be doing well as transplants. Western culture must not be that bad. I don't think he liked that either.

I'm pretty sure it had something to do with my being wait-listed despite my well above average GPA, MCAT, and EC's for that particular school. Sheesh.

Sounds like somebody was a little insecure about his ethnic background. You know it?s a bad interview when the interviewer spends that much time talking about himself.

As for whether they are allowed to ask certain questions, they can ask ANYTHING - religion, political affiliation, sexual orientation, feelings about having kids, whether your boobs are real, etc. It?s sad, and probably illegal, but who?s going to do anything about it? The best thing to do is provide a graceful answer, or politely decline to answer.

 

[thewzdoc]

I passed the interview.

😕 What's that mean.....did you get offered a place?

 

[flighterdoc]

😕 What's that mean.....did you get offered a place?

The amazing thing is that a muslim would ask the question at all. I certainly have strong views (on almost everything) but I also have the self control to keep my private views private in a professional setting.

I find the idea that anyone would ask the question just absolutely incredible. Coming from a muslim to an Israeli, it's akin to asking a "have you quit beating your wife yet" kind of question - theres no good answer. And, since the question is COMPLETELY irrelevant to the purpose at hand (finding out if the applicant is qualified for a position), it shouldn't have been asked.

If the interviewer wanted to know if Tzalli had prejudices that would prevent him from performing the required duties, there are other, less inflammatory ways of finding out. Like asking a simple question that was pertinent to the issue at hand. Tzalli's explanation of doing CPR on a suicide bomber is a fine answer to that sort of legitimate question.

 

[Newquagmire]

Because discrimination on basis of religion is prohibited for "state actors" (governmental entities, including public schoos), but this is not the case for private organizations. Think of Augusta National or the local Elks lodge, who are free to exclude whomever they want.

However, the sticky point here is that private employers are forbidden from asking interview questions relating to religion (can't even imply it - "can you work weekends?"). Not sure whether this also applies to private schools.

as we learned with the stem cell debate, all schools receive government funding in one form or another. to separate religion and the us government is like trying to separate privately funded stem cell research and the nih funded projects in the same lab...

 

[douche]

as we learned with the stem cell debate, all schools receive government funding in one form or another. to separate religion and the us government is like trying to separate privately funded stem cell research and the nih funded projects in the same lab...

Public colleges/universities, however, are there to provide affordable and accessible education to the public. Taxpayers support them so that they and their children can have access to this education. Research grants/etc. for private universities/research is a different thing.

 

[flighterdoc]

Let me clarify something.
The question "so as an Israeli what do you think about the current Israeli/conflict" was not asked directly.
Actually, the interviewer shared his thoughts on the war in Iraq trying to get at my opinion.
Only then did the discussion jump to the parallel Israeli/palestinian conflict.

I don't think that this changes anything, but the exact story should be told.

You're right, it doesn't change anything. What do your views on the war in Iraq have to do with your suitability as a med student? I would never ask a muslim what they thought about Judea and Samaria, for instance. It has no relevance.

 

[Newquagmire]

Public colleges/universities, however, are there to provide affordable and accessible education to the public. Taxpayers support them so that they and their children can have access to this education. Research grants/etc. for private universities/research is a different thing.

i beg to differ. a great deal of top notch research is carried out at public universities. government funding for research and financial aid are inexorably tied up in these same discussions.

 

[kenshinoro2004]

I was asked several times, since alot of my EC's were Christian related... I figured if I didn't get in because of that, then I didnt' want to be there anyway.. On some interviews it came up, but its all about bein honest and articulating what you believe. I got into every school where it was an issue.

 

[pushkin]

I had a mock interview with my school's pre-med committee. I was a religion major in college, but that was seven years ago. Even then I wasn't personally religious, and nowadays I couldn't care less about anything spiritual. During my interview, there was this moment where a couple members of the committee started ambushing me with personal questions--first about stem cell research, then about abortion... My opinions on those topics are very liberal and right in line with a lot of science-minded people--so when they started pressing me, I thought it was because one of THEM must be a religious conservative, and have some kind of bone to pick with me!

It was only in the car on the way home that it occurred to me that they thought I was religious, just because I'd taken lots of classes on Christianity, and because I'd mentioned something about a particular class on Catholicism that I had really liked. I'm glad it happened in a mock interview first, so I can prepare myself for the real thing!

Sheesh, what should I say when it really comes up? It's hard to talk to bio-type profs about the academic study of religion--so few of them have a clue what it's about.

 

[45408]

I think it's ridiculous for them to ask about your plans to have children (if you're female), and I think many schools ban that question, and I think the one Islamic interviewer cornering the guy on the Crusades is absurd. I would've been stifling the desire to punch him in the face.