School Clinical Requirement Comparison

[jojotheshow]

Hi all!

I was wondering if students at other dental schools can provide what your clinical requirements are to graduate? I'm just interested to see what other schools are like. Specifically, the number of:

- SRPs
- Crown/bridge units
- CDs
- RPDs
- Miscellaneous prosth
- Operative
- Extractions
- Endo
- Post and core
- Size of your class

Thank you!

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[Bifenthrin]

-SRPs: 12 quads in D3 and 12 quads in D4 minimum
- Crown/bridge units: 7 PFM, 1 porcelain, 1 3 unit or greater bridge, 1 implant crown
- CDs: 3 arches
- RPDs: 3 arches
- Miscellaneous prosth: 1 overdenture, 1 misc procedure like a denture repair (not adjustment but legit repair like reline or fixing a tooth)
- Operative: 10 class 2, 10 class 3 procedures
- Extractions: 40
- Endo: 5
- Post and core: not a requirement
- Size of your class: about 360

 

[jojotheshow]

-SRPs: 12 quads in D3 and 12 quads in D4 minimum
- Crown/bridge units: 7 PFM, 1 porcelain, 1 3 unit or greater bridge, 1 implant crown
- CDs: 3 arches
- RPDs: 3 arches
- Miscellaneous prosth: 1 overdenture, 1 misc procedure like a denture repair (not adjustment but legit repair like reline or fixing a tooth)
- Operative: 10 class 2, 10 class 3 procedures
- Extractions: 40
- Endo: 5
- Post and core: not a requirement
- Size of your class: about 360

Wow that's a lot of stuff. What school is that?

 

[ncide]

Wow that's a lot of stuff. What school is that?

Given the huge class size, NYU.

 

[Bifenthrin]

Yep, NYU.

 

[jojotheshow]

-SRPs: About 12 quads total

- Crown lengthenings: 4

-Crown/Bridge Units: around 10-12 pfm or porcelain, depending on patient's budget. Veneers and whitenings were optional, I personally didn't do those.

-CD's: 4 sets (8 arches) I did an upper denture reline myself and documented each step in the lab as well. Was given opportunity to work on a tooth supported overdenture but ran out of time.

- RPD's: 6 arches

- Operative: 32 amalgams, 50 comp, 8 inlays, 8 onlays.

-Extractions: 80+, additionally, 8 extra surgical procedures, mostly thirds. We had (OS) days in an actual surgical OR. In your last year they would let you do small buccal Incisions/flaps and ostectomies for 2B in vertical/mesial positions (semi impacted third molars), preprosthetic surgery, frenulectomies and other minor dentoalveolar procedures with the help of your OMFS instructor 🙂

- Endo: 10 anteriors, 2-4 premolars.

-Post and core: at least 2 (fiberglass)

-Ortho: 4 space mantainers in 3 different kids but had to do ALL cavities and extractions/pulpotomies BEFORE. This was the most difficult one!!

-Pedo: 50+ operative procedures, 10 extractions, plus 4 pulpotomies + stainless steel crowns.

Mind you, we had 2.5 years of full blown clinics and in the last two semesters we had an "Integrative Clinic" in which we had to do everything a patient had pretty much. So if the Pt. needed something you could not do (i.e implant, molar endo) you referred pt to that Dpt. for that specific procedure and then back to you to continue TX plan.

::Nicaragua::



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Wow that's a lot too! What school is that?

 

[arlmay]

Hi all!

I was wondering if students at other dental schools can provide what your clinical requirements are to graduate? I'm just interested to see what other schools are like. Specifically, the number of:

- SRPs
8 Quadrants

- Crown/bridge units
~25 units of Fixed

- CDs
6-8 arches minimum

- RPDs
2-3

- Miscellaneous prosth
restore 1 implant

- Operative
200 surfaces including competency procedures (back 2 back amalgam/composite, 3S amalgam/composite, Pin build up, etc)

- Extractions
Done on a rotation basis

- Endo
4-8 teeth required (2 ant/premolar, 1 molar minimum)

- Post and core
1
- Size of your class
50

SIU

 

[orthodental]

There are too many requirements at Tufts to list (we have a huge book full of forms), but here's the few main ones that are for our on-site clinic:

10 crowns, 1 cad/cam, 1 implant-retained, 1 post and core minimum
3 Complete Dentures
1 cast metal RPD
16 quads Sc/RP + a dozen other things
5 RCT
40 fillings
10 extractions without assistance + suturing, flap and stuff

most of us do way more than this (except endo and crowns), and we all have to do a 5 week externship in addition to the above, where we do countless more. We also have a ton of pedo requirements, emergency rotations, special care rotations, public school rotations. Tufts and NYU are pretty comparable, we get more clinical experience than any other schools.

 

[cooliyak]

There are too many requirements at Tufts to list (we have a huge book full of forms), but here's the few main ones that are for our on-site clinic:

10 crowns, 1 cad/cam, 1 implant-retained, 1 post and core minimum
3 Complete Dentures
1 cast metal RPD
16 quads Sc/RP + a dozen other things
5 RCT
40 fillings
10 extractions without assistance + suturing, flap and stuff

most of us do way more than this (except endo and crowns), and we all have to do a 5 week externship in addition to the above, where we do countless more. We also have a ton of pedo requirements, emergency rotations, special care rotations, public school rotations. Tufts and NYU are pretty comparable, we get more clinical experience than any other schools.

I'm not sure that's true that you get more clinical experience than any other school and I really don't think that anyone can say that for sure. East coast schools maybe, but who's to say? Those requirements are pretty similar to what we do at Colorado (including the additional rotations and whatnot), except we do 3x the externships and I know our stuff pales in comparison to other schools, mostly private, but still. A lot of us do more than the bare minimum as well.

 

[SnozzBerry]

There are too many requirements at Tufts to list (we have a huge book full of forms), but here's the few main ones that are for our on-site clinic:

10 crowns, 1 cad/cam, 1 implant-retained, 1 post and core minimum
3 Complete Dentures
1 cast metal RPD
16 quads Sc/RP + a dozen other things
5 RCT
40 fillings
10 extractions without assistance + suturing, flap and stuff

most of us do way more than this (except endo and crowns), and we all have to do a 5 week externship in addition to the above, where we do countless more. We also have a ton of pedo requirements, emergency rotations, special care rotations, public school rotations. Tufts and NYU are pretty comparable, we get more clinical experience than any other schools.

Just cause you're paying the most doesn't mean you're getting the most clinical experience lololol.

 

[ShortShortsDad]

Yeah, as a recent Tufts grad I can comment accurately. We lived in a bubble in Boston - BU got dumped on and Harvard was notoriously clinically light so we were told that we had a lot of experience. Working in the military with people from all over the country, I can confirm that the "Tufts is very strong clinically" statement is a complete myth, or maybe just outdated. What made it hard for some people to get their requirements done at Tufts were structural issues, long block apt scheduling, lack of chairs/patients, booking too far out, too much lab work, insane QA to send out prosth, old school professors making things take forever, and incompetent administrators.

We were required to do very little actual dentistry - we had to play a stupid game, checking BS checkboxes, without really getting into a groove. I can't emphasize that enough - we were checking boxes and playing the game, and that doesn't really correlate to clinical competence (see how many people fail boards because they still don't know if they removed all the caries). Now, there were the top tier of students that completed their requirements easily and went on to do pursue whatever they wanted or take it easy clinically last semester - I basically spent my entire senior year shadowing the specialty I ended up matching. There were definitely dental schools that were much worse than Tufts (looking at you Lecom) but our clinical experience was on the lighter side and completely paled in comparison to the private practice style schools.

Newer dental schools often follow a private practice model where the school has no speciality programs and the dental students do as much as they want - this is the future and it won't take long until it proves an existential crisis to schools like Tufts. Tons of CAD/CAM, full mouth rehab, getting Invisalign certified, lots of molar endo, retreats, perio surgery, surgical extractions, bone grafting with PRF, placing dozens of implants themselves, start to finish all-on-4, doing over 100 crowns wasn't unheard of.

In the first month of working after graduation you will do more than you did in the 2 years of dental school you spent in clinic combined. You won't have a 3 hour block to do a single MOD - you'll be getting 45 min to do a quad of operative.

I think most of my classmates are fine after a hard few months getting used to the real world, not too many people werent able to adapt. We're definitely more clinically competent than Harvard grads but we're basically a 1 or 2yr residency level behind people who graduated from a private practice style school.

 

[orthodental]

Just cause you're paying the most doesn't mean you're getting the most clinical experience lololol.

Don't have to ask me, ask your ADEA rep. Surveys were done about treatment cost and clinical experience. Tufts and NYU have the most patients and procedures per student. Also, BU and USC are more expensive than Tufts, so you have no idea what you are talking about and I suggest you educate yourself before you embarrass yourself.

 

[orthodental]

Yeah, as a recent Tufts grad I can comment accurately. We lived in a bubble in Boston - BU got dumped on and Harvard was notoriously clinically light so we were told that we had a lot of experience. Working in the military with people from all over the country, I can confirm that the "Tufts is very strong clinically" statement is a complete myth, or maybe just outdated. What made it hard for some people to get their requirements done at Tufts were structural issues, long block apt scheduling, lack of chairs/patients, booking too far out, too much lab work, insane QA to send out prosth, old school professors making things take forever, and incompetent administrators.

We were required to do very little actual dentistry - we had to play a stupid game, checking BS checkboxes, without really getting into a groove. I can't emphasize that enough - we were checking boxes and playing the game, and that doesn't really correlate to clinical competence (see how many people fail boards because they still don't know if they removed all the caries). Now, there were the top tier of students that completed their requirements easily and went on to do pursue whatever they wanted or take it easy clinically last semester - I basically spent my entire senior year shadowing the specialty I ended up matching. There were definitely dental schools that were much worse than Tufts (looking at you Lecom) but our clinical experience was on the lighter side and completely paled in comparison to the private practice style schools.

Newer dental schools often follow a private practice model where the school has no speciality programs and the dental students do as much as they want - this is the future and it won't take long until it proves an existential crisis to schools like Tufts. Tons of CAD/CAM, full mouth rehab, getting Invisalign certified, lots of molar endo, retreats, perio surgery, surgical extractions, bone grafting with PRF, placing dozens of implants themselves, start to finish all-on-4, doing over 100 crowns wasn't unheard of.

In the first month of working after graduation you will do more than you did in the 2 years of dental school you spent in clinic combined. You won't have a 3 hour block to do a single MOD - you'll be getting 45 min to do a quad of operative.

I think most of my classmates are fine after a hard few months getting used to the real world, not too many people werent able to adapt. We're definitely more clinically competent than Harvard grads but we're basically a 1 or 2yr residency level behind people who graduated from a private practice style school.

I assume you mean schools that send their kids out for 3 or more months of externships because they can't attract any patients. The only "new" schools I'm familiar with are Nova and UNE. Comprehensive care model is educationally superior to just training students to do dozens of amalgams all day.

Indeed, I would say that about 10% (total estimate) of my class had a poor clinical experience at tufts, having to constantly remediate competencies and struggling to keep up with their patient roster. Theres no hand holding, and theres a lot of administrative work on the shoulders of the students, and some kids definitely were not prepared for that.

 

[SnozzBerry]

Don't have to ask me, ask your ADEA rep. Surveys were done about treatment cost and clinical experience. Tufts and NYU have the most patients and procedures per student. Also, BU and USC are more expensive than Tufts, so you have no idea what you are talking about and I suggest you educate yourself before you embarrass yourself.

Just cause you're almost paying the most doesn't mean you're getting the most clinical experience lololol.

 

[Mr.Scalpel]

:troll:

Just cause you're almost paying the most doesn't mean you're getting the most clinical experience lololol.

 

[ShortShortsDad]

I was talking about schools like Midwestern or UNLV. I've been really impressed by their new grads. Not all of them did all of that but they had the opportunity, and it was at their school not externship.

Tufts model is outdated and failing, especially with all the specialty programs in-house. I'm not saying it wasn't a lot of work, it was just excessive wheel-spinning with minimal actual dentistry.

TL/DR: Other schools with private practice style clinics far better prepared their students for the modern reality of private practice.

 

[orthodental]

Just cause you're almost paying the most doesn't mean you're getting the most clinical experience lololol.

Just cause you're almost paying the most doesn't mean you're getting the most clinical experience lololol.

someone's jealous. Must be a BU student.