SGU MD admission

[islandinthesunnn]

Does anyone have an idea of how the admissions process works at SGU ( pre and post interview). Do they look at your grades before granting the interview? If so then what is the reason for the committee meeting AFTER interview to decide whether you are accepted or not.

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[CharlieBillings]

I didn't even know SGU had interviews

 

[DexterMorganSK]

you should post here instead:

Caribbean

 

[sliceofbread136]

I think the only thing they look at is making sure your check doesn’t bounce

 

[wholeheartedly]

moving to pre-allo as this is a pre med question

 

[Isoval]

Well, first, they send your application over to their financial department.
Your credit scores, along with your MCAT score and GPA, will be weighted and evaluated according to a predetermined set of criteria. I understand that having a strong credit score is paramount to garnering an admission.
Next, your most recent health records are sent to their clinicians for review. Dead or dying applicants can't pay.

Finally, if you've passed both of these screening processes, you may or may not be invited to interview. Interviews are usually just a formality to make sure they haven't missed any red flags: does the applicant look well-dressed enough that he/she can pay us? did the applicant carry a checkbook to the interview?

 

[Turkishking]

I mean, admission is probably fairly lenient, however, you still need to be above a certain threshold for the GPA requirement. What I don't understand with SDN is that, the members act like a 1.9 can get you admission with a pulse and a check. Maybe that's accurate for the schools other than the Top 3. Now, do I recommend you go with this route? No.

And from reading several posts on these forums, yes they have interviews, and it's basic. I recall reading one where the interviewer was late, asked 3-4 questions, and finished it.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I think the only thing they look at is making sure your check doesn’t bounce

There was actually a guy on the old premeds podcast who was rejected from SGU and another Carib school. He ended up doing a postbacc and getting like a 3.9 or something, then applied DO. They messed up his grade replacement and listed his cGPA as 2.9 instead of above 3.0. He applied to an SMP that same cycle and got accepted. He completed the first semester and updated his application and was accepted to two DO schools in the same cycle. Crazy story.

 

[Rhabdoviridae]

Acceptance rate was 38% two years ago according to my classmates. Nowhere near as competitive as getting into a stateside program but hardly open admission by any standard.

 

[laricb]

Well, first, they send your application over to their financial department.
Your credit scores, along with your MCAT score and GPA, will be weighted and evaluated according to a predetermined set of criteria. I understand that having a strong credit score is paramount to garnering an admission.
Next, your most recent health records are sent to their clinicians for review. Dead or dying applicants can't pay.

Finally, if you've passed both of these screening processes, you may or may not be invited to interview. Interviews are usually just a formality to make sure they haven't missed any red flags: does the applicant look well-dressed enough that he/she can pay us? did the applicant carry a checkbook to the interview?

With more than 900 US residencies in 2017, no other medical school in the world provides more new doctors to the US health care system; in fact, they are the number one provider of doctors into first-year US residencies for the last seven years combined

 

[altblue]

With more than 900 US residencies in 2017, no other medical school in the world provides more new doctors to the US health care system; in fact, they are the number one provider of doctors into first-year US residencies for the last seven years combined

Mmm yeah, 10/10 would attend

 

[goatmed]

With more than 900 US residencies in 2017, no other medical school in the world provides more new doctors to the US health care system; in fact, they are the number one provider of doctors into first-year US residencies for the last seven years combined

The lesson to be learned here is that frequency of matched applicants and the probability of being matched are not the same. I advise you look at the latter

 

[TheWolfOfMainStreet]

With more than 900 US residencies in 2017, no other medical school in the world provides more new doctors to the US health care system; in fact, they are the number one provider of doctors into first-year US residencies for the last seven years combined

What is superior: A school that places 200 of its 200 graduates or a school that places 900 of 1500?

Most would say the former.

 

[laricb]

The lesson to be learned here is that frequency of matched applicants and the probability of being matched are not the same. I advise you look at the latter

All I am stating is this school(sgu) is far superior to the other carib schools. There given you a gra

What is superior: A school that places 200 of its 200 graduates or a school that places 900 of 1500?

Most would say the former.

more like 900 of 1200

 

[TheWolfOfMainStreet]

more like 900 of 1200

Fair enough, but would you play Russian roulette with 1/4 odds of financial suicide? I wouldn't.

 

[laricb]

Fair enough, but would you play Russian roulette with 1/4 odds of financial suicide? I wouldn't.

If it was my only shot I would for 1 semester at sgu and only continue if I pull all A's

 

[gonnif]

All I am stating is this school(sgu) is far superior to the other carib schools. There given you a gra

more like 900 of 1200

This is the actual data from the NRMP per country in 2013 (last year I have readily available)

I am not a big fan of off-shore schools but by no means do I rule them out (see my standard advisement in item #8). However, I want to make sure people go into this with eyes wide open. So know what the hell you are talking about before you post

1) actual rates are way below there reported numbers
(data from www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/NRMP-and-ECFMG-Publish-Charting-Outcomes-in-the-Match-for-International-Medical-Graduates-Revised.PDF-File.pdf#page=28)

2) There was and still is minor SOAP post-match placement for IMG so : chart from 2013 (to match spreadsheet)
(see www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/resultsanddata2013.pdf#page=55)
(for similar 2017 data see http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Main-Match-Results-and-Data-2017.pdf#page=57)

3) 2013 had the "all-in" policy for NRMP so minor amount of pre-match which appears now to account for less than 100 slots

4) we have no individual data on both NRMP withdrawals and no ranks, both of which drop from NRMP data rates. My last calculations of that showed US MD Senior with about 8% overall residency failure (no match, withdraw from match, did not rank in match) while over US-IMG from all school showed about 61% in overall residency failure (for data see http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Main-Match-Results-and-Data-2017.pdf#page=23)

5) Just to be clear, reports from off-shore includes any all post graduate "placements" not match. SGU reports about 29% are non-NRMP placements (they may even count the few SOAPs in this) This would be Match, Post-Match SOAP, formal off-match residency (prematch), substitute/open contracts which can be for other residents who drop position. This also appears to include non-residency post graduate contracts. In other words, they get a job in facility under physician and in some states, a year of this can get your license). I will not get into the nitty gritty of prelim spots for them. So their numbers show graduates who get into ANY kind of post-grad slot, be it residency or not. For comparison, US MD Seniors get into one of the their top three programs about 78%. That is not simply the specialty they want but the actual hospital/school program in the location they chose.

6) SGU reports a total of 5,654 in four year programs, so there should be about 1414 enrollment per year. They also report their 5-7 year program which should include about 56 enrollment per year. So 1470 estimated class size. They state over 900+ placements. Lets say 950 divided by 1470 and that is 61%. Where are the other 40%?
SGU states "93% OBTAINED POSTGRAD POSITION Of our eligible 2016 US graduates who applied for a postgraduate position, 93 percent obtained one within one year." With 950 as estimated number for 93% that would mean about 1020 as eligible US grads, where are the other 450 who started the school? How many either withdrew or didnt rank? Are they just not US Citizens and didnt apply to NRMP? How many never graduated so they dropped out? The spreadsheet above shows a 67% match rate for US citizens. Now which number am I gonna trust?

7) we have no verifiable and therefore reliable data on the schools attrition rates and therefore cannot tell a prospective student their "success" chances. That is starting medical school, earning a degree, and actually getting any residency slot. With US students, we know 97% will ultimately graduate and over 99% will get a residency slot, for both MD and DO. Using SGU as an example, even with something as low as 10% attrition, that means maybe 90% of people graduate and 67% match, that means 60% success rate.

8) I am not a big fan of Off-shore schools but by no means do I rule them out (see my standard advice below):
as I've said often, before considering any offshore school applicant must go through at least two application cycles for both MD and DO with at least a year break in between (ie skip a cycle) for application repair and/or enhancement. the break is necessary to analyze and understand the weaknesses in an application. Repair may be as simple as reorganizing rewriting application or it may require postbacc, SMP, MCAT, or additional extracurricular such as clinical volunteering and other items. I strongly advise that no student should consider off shore schools until the above has been done

 

[Isoval]

All I am stating is this school(sgu) is far superior to the other carib schools. There given you a gra

more like 900 of 1200

Translation: SGU is the shiniest of the s***.

 

[Rhabdoviridae]

Translation: SGU is the shiniest of the s***.

Roughly 1% of ALL practicing physicians in the US are graduates of SGU alone. Perhaps you need to reevaluate things a bit.

 

[gonnif]

Roughly 1% of ALL practicing physicians in the US are graduates of SGU alone. Perhaps you need to reevaluate things a bit.

Its not the 1% of practicing physicians that I am concerned with. It is the approximate same number of students who started SGU that either never graduated nor ever made it into tesidency

 

[TheWolfOfMainStreet]

Roughly 1% of ALL practicing physicians in the US are graduates of SGU alone. Perhaps you need to reevaluate things a bit.

You willingly transferred from a stateside DO program to a Caribbean MD school. You are in no position to tell other people to re-evaluate things

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Acceptance rate was 38% two years ago according to my classmates. Nowhere near as competitive as getting into a stateside program but hardly open admission by any standard.

Lol

With more than 900 US residencies in 2017, no other medical school in the world provides more new doctors to the US health care system; in fact, they are the number one provider of doctors into first-year US residencies for the last seven years combined

Nice post. No one cares the raw number, they care that the match rate and attrition are crap.

more like 900 of 1200

Yeah, no. They have a class of almost 800 start twice a year, and have about half that end up in a residency.

Roughly 1% of ALL practicing physicians in the US are graduates of SGU alone. Perhaps you need to reevaluate things a bit.

I think you need to re-evalute some things.... I'm amazed you haven't been banned yet for giving horrendous advice to people.

 

[DubbiDoctor]

You willingly transferred from a stateside DO program to a Caribbean MD school. You are in no position to tell other people to re-evaluate things

I have a friend who only applied to MD schools as a traditional applicant, but she included the Caribbean as MD schools. She now attends SGU. I don't understand why she didn't apply DO, or reapply - and I really can't respect her anymore.

 

[Rhabdoviridae]

Lol



Nice post. No one cares the raw number, they care that the match rate and attrition are crap.



Yeah, no. They have a class of almost 800 start twice a year, and have about half that end up in a residency.



I think you need to re-evalute some things.... I'm amazed you haven't been banned yet for giving horrendous advice to people.

Funny I was thinking the same thing recently........I'm surprised you haven't been banned for you sarcastic, vitriolic demeanor.

 

[laricb]

Translation: SGU is the shiniest of the s***.

They continuously pick SGU Students over DO at many programs

 

[altblue]

If it was my only shot I would for 1 semester at sgu and only continue if I pull all A's

the issue there is that if you can get into st. george, which generally won't let in people with absolutely abysmal stats, you can probably fix your application up for DO/low-tier MD. so unless you're a convicted felon, which most SGU students aren't, it wouldn't be your only shot

 

[Isoval]

They continuously pick SGU Students over DO at many programs

This is unbelievably false

 

[DubbiDoctor]

the issue there is that if you can get into st. george, which generally won't let in people with absolutely abysmal stats, you can probably fix your application up for DO/low-tier MD. so unless you're a convicted felon, which most SGU students aren't, it wouldn't be your only shot

They want to take the easy path to an MD, instead of doing the hard work of post-graduate GPA repair, SMPs, research, volunteering, or swallowing their pride and explaining to friends and family what a DO is.

 

[laricb]

They want to take the easy path to an MD, instead of doing the hard work of post-graduate GPA repair, SMPs, research, volunteering, or swallowing their pride and explaining to friends and family what a DO is.

Its actually harder your numbers coming out need to be more competitive to get a residency caused by the bias

 

[Mwooster]

the issue there is that if you can get into st. george, which generally won't let in people with absolutely abysmal stats

I consider applicants with MCAT below 500 and GPA under 3.2 "absolutely abysmal" stats. These are SGU's peeps.

you can probably fix your application up for DO/low-tier MD

Low-tier MD? No way. Maybe the newer DO programs

 

[laricb]

I consider applicants with MCAT below 500 and GPA under 3.2 "absolutely abysmal" stats. These are SGU's peeps.



Low-tier MD? No way. Maybe the newer DO programs

Don't understand how I scored in the mid 20's on my MCAT then proceeded to score in the high 250's on my step 1 and 2

 

[gonnif]

They continuously pick SGU Students over DO at many programs

SGU reports total enrollment over 4 year programs at in excess of 5600 so on average of 1400 per year. With 900+ residency placements, what happened to the other 450? How many didnt apply to residency, how many dropped out? No reliable data is available on these questions
DO grads get residency placement at 99.44% . In the last cycle, from the 5,984 seeking GME, 37 (0.66%) did not get any placement into residency. DO has a 3-4% attrition rate.

 

[Rhabdoviridae]

I consider applicants with MCAT below 500 and GPA under 3.2 "absolutely abysmal" stats. These are SGU's peeps.



Low-tier MD? No way. Maybe the newer DO programs

SGU reports total enrollment over 4 year programs at in excess of 5600 so on average of 1400 per year. With 900+ residency placements, what happened to the other 450? How many didnt apply to residency, how many dropped out? No reliable data is available on these questions
DO grads get residency placement at 99.44% . In the last cycle, from the 5,984 seeking GME, 37 (0.66%) did not get any placement into residency

View attachment 224344
View attachment 224343

Your proposition is incorrect for two reasons. It assumes that class sizes have been the same each year and your chart reflects the current number of students only. If you recall the file I attached in a similar conversation several days ago, class sizes have dramatically increased over the past couple of years. Hence, comparing match results from the class size 4 years ago to present day cohort size severely underestimates graduate success in the match. I would honestly have expected better from somebody who has put so much time into researching this topic.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Funny I was thinking the same thing recently........I'm surprised you haven't been banned for you sarcastic, vitriolic demeanor.

I, unlike you, give good advice. You made one of the worst decisions in SDN history, goodluck.

Don't understand how I scored in the mid 20's on my MCAT then proceeded to score in the high 250's on my step 1 and 2

People do this at DO schools too.... so I don't see your point.


What always kills me about these Carib trolls is that they so vehemently argue for the Carib when every actual practicing Carib grad I have talked to has said to avoid the islands like the plague. It's a unanimous opinion.

 

[laricb]

SGU reports total enrollment over 4 year programs at in excess of 5600 so on average of 1400 per year. With 900+ residency placements, what happened to the other 450? How many didnt apply to residency, how many dropped out? No reliable data is available on these questions
DO grads get residency placement at 99.44% . In the last cycle, from the 5,984 seeking GME, 37 (0.66%) did not get any placement into residency

View attachment 224344
View attachment 224343

You have to account for there own placement (DO)

 

[gonnif]

You have to account for there own placement (DO)

no you dont, the NRMP is good about these sorts of things.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Your proposition is incorrect for two reasons. It assumes that class sizes have been the same each year and your chart reflects the current number of students only. If you recall the file I attached in a similar conversation several days ago, class sizes have dramatically increased over the past couple of years. Hence, comparing match results from the class size 4 years ago to present day cohort size severely underestimates graduate success in the match. I would honestly have expected better from somebody who has put so much time into researching this topic.

First, SGU has matriculated about 800 students twice a year for a good while. Second, your trying to convince us that a carib school, with the knowledge that growth in US seats and the merger will cause a residency squeeze for their graduates, a school with already abysmal match rates (for those that even get that far), a school that has actually gone out of their way to INCREASE number of seats, is a good place to be? Yeah no one is buying that one.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

You have to account for there own placement (DO)

No you don't, the true DO placement rate is above 99%.

 

[Dr.Jekyll75]

The fact that we argue this IMG idea boggles my mind. Island is last resort after post bacc and no acceptance after 3 cycles. I dont understand why this such a hard concept to grasp for people.

 

[laricb]

I, unlike you, give good advice. You made one of the worst decisions in SDN history, goodluck.



People do this at DO schools too.... so I don't see your point.


What always kills me about these Carib trolls is that they so vehemently argue for the Carib when every actual practicing Carib grad I have talked to has said to avoid the islands like the plague. It's a unanimous opinion.

And what kills me is how DO Students constantly want to play down the Carib students just because we choose not to take the same route. I wanted to be an MD and at the time my numbers weren't good enough for a US MD School.

 

[gonnif]

The fact that we argue this IMG idea boggles my mind. Island is last resort after post bacc and no acceptance after 3 cycles. I dont understand why this such a hard concept to grasp for people.

I would dial that back a little. First MD/DO cycle, then PostBacc/SMP cycle, then Second MD/DO, then I would consider Off-Shore

as I've said often, before considering any offshore school applicant must go through at least two application cycles for both MD and DO with at least a year break in between (ie skip a cycle) for application repair and/or enhancement. the break is necessary to analyze and understand the weaknesses in an application. Repair may be as simple as reorganizing rewriting application or it may require postbacc, SMP, MCAT, or additional extracurricular such as clinical volunteering and other items. I strongly advise that no student should consider off shore schools until the above has been done.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

And what kills me is how DO Students constantly want to play down the Carib students just because we choose not to take the same route. I wanted to be an MD and at the time my numbers weren't good enough for a US MD School.

I have nothing against those who graduate and become practicing physicians, they are just like any other doc. The problem with the Carib is the very predatory nature of the schools, the terrible attrition, and absolutely brutal match rates.

The Carib is a last ditch Hail Mary, and should only be suggested to those students who have tried every other option first. It is disingenuous to suggest it to pre-meds who haven't tried the much safer options first.

 

[gonnif]

I have nothing against those who graduate and become practicing physicians, they are just like any other doc. The problem with the Carib is the very predatory nature of the schools, the terrible attrition, and absolutely brutal match rates.

The Carib is a last ditch Hail Mary, and should only be suggested to those students who have tried every other option first. It is disingenuous to suggest it to pre-meds who haven't tried the much safer options first.

^^THIS

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I would dial that back a little. First MD/DO cycle, then PostBacc/SMP cycle, then Second MD/DO, then I would consider Off-Shore

as I've said often, before considering any offshore school applicant must go through at least two application cycles for both MD and DO with at least a year break in between (ie skip a cycle) for application repair and/or enhancement. the break is necessary to analyze and understand the weaknesses in an application. Repair may be as simple as reorganizing rewriting application or it may require postbacc, SMP, MCAT, or additional extracurricular such as clinical volunteering and other items. I strongly advise that no student should consider off shore schools until the above has been done.

This, 100%. There is an episode of the the premed years (originally thought it was old premeds because of his age, but it's not) where a dude with a sub-3.0 GPA applies to SGU after graduating and gets rejected. He then does a post-bacc where he got a 3.8 and applied to DO schools. He had a crazy application cycle with his grade replacement getting messed up, then doing an SMP that cycle, and then getting accepted during that same cycle after updating his app from the fall SMP semester.

But the point is he didn't need to go to the Carib. He put in a lot of work with a post-bacc and an SMP (which may or may not have been necessary if his grade replacement hadn't gotten messed up) and got in. Into a US DO school.

 

[islandinthesunnn]

Can we please get back to the main point of my thread....

 

[Dr.Jekyll75]

Can we please get back to the main point of my thread....

you cant start a Caribbean thread without a major debate, you should know better....
on the real though, i dont think they do a post interview review, they probably just look at yours grades then do a 1 on 1 interview to make sure youre not off your rocker, then youre in but i would strongly recommend you read what people are saying about going

 

[gyngyn]

Can we please get back to the main point of my thread....

If you got an "interview," you are highly likely to be admitted.
I have seen seriously impaired individuals admitted despite what must have been a very weak "interview."

 

[laricb]

I have nothing against those who graduate and become practicing physicians, they are just like any other doc. The problem with the Carib is the very predatory nature of the schools, the terrible attrition, and absolutely brutal match rates.

The Carib is a last ditch Hail Mary, and should only be suggested to those students who have tried every other option first. It is disingenuous to suggest it to pre-meds who haven't tried the much safer options first.

But what you said was

I have nothing against those who graduate and become practicing physicians, they are just like any other doc. The problem with the Carib is the very predatory nature of the schools, the terrible attrition, and absolutely brutal match rates.

The Carib is a last ditch Hail Mary, and should only be suggested to those students who have tried every other option first. It is disingenuous to suggest it to pre-meds who haven't tried the much safer options first.

But how you come across, anyone who scores a 500 on there mcat and has a 3.0 GPA is pathetic and shouldn't be aloud to become a physician and these are the kind of students SGU picks, which is far from the truth. If you want to inform pre-meds then give an honest opinion not your carib bios attitude.

 

[Rhabdoviridae]

Can we please get back to the main point of my thread....

Since I didn't apply to this school until after my 2nd year, things may be a bit different for you. To my understanding, from what I read from the handbook and heard from classmates, you are more likely to be rejected before the interview than after. It is possible to get waitlisted or rejected after the interview, but I think somewhere like 70% who are interviewed are accepted.

 

[gonnif]

Can we please get back to the main point of my thread....

If you got an "interview," you are highly likely to be admitted.
I have seen seriously impaired individuals admitted despite what must have been a very weak "interview."

Since I didn't apply to this school until after my 2nd year, things may be a bit different for you. To my understanding, from what I read from the handbook and heard from classmates, you are more likely to be rejected before the interview than after. It is possible to get waitlisted or rejected after the interview, but I think somewhere like 70% who are interviewed are accepted.

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