The ultimate COVID thread

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nimbus said:
One of the Italian physicians and the NEJM editorials said same thing. Despite the urgency and desperation, we still need high quality trials. There are already doctors out there advocating zinc and ashwaganda supplementation without evidence.
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There are vaccine candidates (not for C19) which, if given to humans, would probably kill them, based on the animal models. What makes sense in vitro doesn't always work in vivo.
 
Trump and the government are spending trillions to bail out the economy and the general public and my fiscally conservative heart does not know how to feel about all this. They all were so critical of Obama and here they are pulling an Obama!
 
BLADEMDA said:
I will let you know as the cost to me will be negligible while the benefit could be tremendous.
Research in Australia, South Korea, China and the USA is confirming chloroquine is working against COVID-19. Bayer have increased chloroquine production for the US government.

The one we want is PLAQUENIL. We are on the front lines people. You need this drug on hand.
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I just checked. CVS caremark has it. 10$ mail order for 180 capsule through insurance. I am wondering if I can just self-prescribe without using the insurance.
 
narcotics999 said:
I just checked. CVS caremark has it. 10$ mail order for 180 capsule through insurance. I am wondering if I can just self-prescribe without using the insurance.
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Careful! In many states, self-prescribing is illegal. It can get you in hot water.

This is because the AMA has brainwashed everybody in believing that doctors are too dumb to treat themselves. Not only that, but you don't have a patient-doctor relationship with another doctor unless there is a paper trail for the visit (i.e. you make money for his Big Health employer).

If this turns into a hysteria, don't think they won't go back and check which physicians prescribed it and for what reason. It's just a database search nowadays.
 
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BLADEMDA said:
Wealthy because of innovation: Ipod, Computer, Iphone, dozens of new medications saving countless lives. Every single one of us is better off because of capitalism in our Biotech/Pharm industry. Sure, it needs some regulations but they save lives. We simply fund the innovation (or 90% of it) for the entire world.
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All of these things came because of significant government investment as well. Multiple engineers in my family have sold to large corporations such as apple. Want to know where their research started? Large universities from taxpayer-funded programs. Same with many lifesaving drugs. NIH, or NIH funded programs.
 
vector2 said:
Donald f'ing Trump of all people is about to initiate the most massive government wealth transfer in the history of our country, followed likely by bailouts for industries that bought back hundreds of billions of dollars worth of stock during a massive bull run instead of shoring up their balance sheets.

Maybe now isn't the best time to be espousing the wonders of an economic system that works great except for the fact that it totally collapses every 10 years or so?
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Donald Trump has done some very good things, but regarding fiscal responsibility he gets a zero like basically every other president and politician. It's not Capitalism that collapses every 10 years, it's the eventual collapse of these propped up industries and markets with mountains of debt and inflated money from artificially low interest rates. Then the masses will say, capitalism is the culprit, let's do that great thing called Socialism where government knows how to run industries and innovate better than anyone.
 
FFP said:
I wouldn't advertise having it. because you could have only bought it ilegally. As in you don't have an indication for it.
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If you have a medical license and a credit card, you can buy just about anything. If you have a DEA number, you can buy scheduled drugs. It's certainly not illegal to get them and possess them.

What you do with them is another issue. Self-prescription, and prescription to family members is discouraged by every state medical board and bodies like the AMA. Hospital bylaws typically forbid it (but that really only applies to activities conducted on their premises or on their time). But there are typically exceptions for emergency care or "immediate" need. Documentation is always required.

I'm not saying it's a great idea to buy some hydroxychloroquine, Keletra, colloidal silver, and some pre-chewed Zukawoo Tree root just to have on the shelf next to the expired Tamiflu that's been sitting there since the 2009 swine flu terror.

But it's not illegal for a licensed physician to buy prescription medications, have them, and use them during a system-swamping pandemic where care through normal channels isn't available.
 
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FFP said:
Versus one that functions all the time as if collapsed? 🙂

Btw, this is a black swan, like a major war, not a regular cycle.
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1980, 1987, 1992, 1999, 2008, 2020....at what point do we acknowledge that yes, it does collapse or almost collapse every 10 years or so, and that "black swan" seems like a bit of a misnomer for an event that happens with shocking regularity? Capitalism is great- just make sure the workers and the people are taken care of as well before the inevitable corporate bailouts.
 
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We'llBeDoneIn15Minutes said:
Donald Trump has done some very good things, but regarding fiscal responsibility he gets a zero like basically every other president and politician. It's not Capitalism that collapses every 10 years, it's the eventual collapse of these propped up industries and markets with mountains of debt and inflated money from artificially low interest rates. Then the masses will say, capitalism is the culprit, let's do that great thing called Socialism where government knows how to run industries and innovate better than anyone.
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Or, you know, what about a system where capitalism still underpins the whole thing but the government ensures very strong social protections and/or support for citizens? Why does everyone keep pretending that it has to be some binary choice between the Gilded Age and Hugo Chavez..
 
BLADEMDA said:
Azithromycin was added because it is known to be effective against complications from bacterial lung disease but also because it has been shown to be effective in the laboratory against a large number of viruses, the infectious disease specialist explained.
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Viruses, eh?

Wow, is there anything a Z-Pak can't do?
 
I got my Plaquenil this morning. There will be a run on it soon. It’s cheap and effective so I have it available now if/when I get exposed to Covid 19.

But, I know Zinc works on my physiology to shorten the common cold. I’ve been taking zinc for 15 years whenever I get a cold with excellent results.

Hence, I can believe that Plaquenil May shorten the severity of Covid 19 and reduce the viral load. A drug need not cost $10,000 per dose to be effective. I do respect FFP’s opinion that Covid 19 may not be reduced with Plaquenil but on a personal level I find the risk/reward by taking this drug when I become symptomatic to be quite compelling. I plan on taking Plaquenil when I show signs of Covid 19 infection.
 
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BLADEMDA said:
I got my Plaquenil this morning. There will be a run on it soon. It’s cheap and effective so I have it available now if/when I get exposed to Covid 19.
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I'm hearing talk of take it in advance of exposure and that it should hang in your tissues a very long time. Thoughts?
 
vector2 said:
1980, 1987, 1992, 1999, 2008, 2020....at what point do we acknowledge that yes, it does collapse or almost collapse every 10 years or so, and that "black swan" seems like a bit of a misnomer for an event that happens with shocking regularity? Capitalism is great- just make sure the workers and the people are taken care of as well before the inevitable corporate bailouts.
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I do not believe in bailouts. I do believe in the govt taking a stake in companies with strings attached. That means the govt buys stock and imposed restrictions on companies needing assistance. In time the company pays the govt back the money but must also comply with new rules such as no stock buy backs.
 
Main point: Hydroxychloroquine was found to be more potent than chloroquine at inhibiting SARS-CoV-2 in vitro. Hydroxychloroquine sulfate 400 mg given twice daily for 1 day, followed by 200 mg twice daily for 4 more days is recommended to treat SARS-CoV-2 infection.

I have 3 x that amount at home now. I’m all set.
 
anbuitachi said:
alright time for everyone to buy? i have a few thousand dollars i can spare to buy some stocks!
delta anyone?
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If any of these bad case scenarios play out I would say pain has barely begun and bottom is well off.
 
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We'llBeDoneIn15Minutes said:
If any of these bad case scenarios play out I would say pain has barely begun and bottom is well off.
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Nobody can predict the market bottom. Second, the market will bottom before we hear good news about Covid 19. That said, I too believe the economic pain had not yet been fully priced in and believe the S and P 500 has at least another leg down of 10 percent or more before a bottom is reached.
 
BLADEMDA said:
Main point: Hydroxychloroquine was found to be more potent than chloroquine at inhibiting SARS-CoV-2 in vitro. Hydroxychloroquine sulfate 400 mg given twice daily for 1 day, followed by 200 mg twice daily for 4 more days is recommended to treat SARS-CoV-2 infection.

I have 3 x that amount at home now. I’m all set.
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Interesting. I aware that some data exists for ct chest exams on Covid positve, asymptomatic patients, are abnormal. They are exhibiting a ground glass appearance. Maybe a way to evaluate people when bio marker testing is unavailable. Looking for some Placquinal now.
 
Angus Avagadro said:
Interesting. I aware that some data exists for ct chest exams on Covid positve, asymptomatic patients, are abnormal. They are exhibiting a ground glass appearance. Maybe a way to evaluate people when bio marker testing is unavailable. Looking for some Placquinal now.
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For those on the front line which includes most of us I highly recommend a stash of Plaquenil at home. It is a cheap drug and we know side effects are minimal for a short course. I highly recommend it for early treatment of Covid 19. Do it for yourself or for your family members.
 
BLADEMDA said:
Main point: Hydroxychloroquine was found to be more potent than chloroquine at inhibiting SARS-CoV-2 in vitro. Hydroxychloroquine sulfate 400 mg given twice daily for 1 day, followed by 200 mg twice daily for 4 more days is recommended to treat SARS-CoV-2 infection.

I have 3 x that amount at home now. I’m all set.
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Great, thanks...we'll put Plaquenil on the list with toilet paper of the things hoarders denied everyone else.
 
"There is evidence that chloroquine is effective when they looked at SARS in vitro with primate cells," said Dr. Len Horovitz, a pulmonologist and internist at Lenox Hill Hospital in New York City. "The theory of the experiment with primate cells was that chloroquine could be for preventing viral infection or as a treatment for viral infection after it had occurred. In vitro in these primate cells, there was evidence that viral particles were significantly reduced when chloroquine was used."

Both the virus that causes SARS and the virus responsible for COVID-19 belong to the same overarching family of coronaviruses. Researchers in China discovered that the protein spikes on the surface of the COVID-19 virus are similar to the protein spikes found on the surface of the SARS virus.
 
Researchers are also exploring whether chloroquine could be used prophylactically -- that is, to prevent infection before it occurs. It is particularly key "for healthcare workers that get sick," noted Dr. Eric Cioe-Pena, director of Global Health at Northwell Health in New Hyde Park, New York. "Prophylaxis is a viable treatment option, at least in theory. It needs to be studied. It could be studied while in use. It is something we need to look at, and as terms of a candidate for preventing disease spread and severity."
 
LineAndBerry said:
Agree, not letting any crisis go to waste, this seems beyond the dreams of any far left progressive: In one fell swoop......the biggest bail out in world history, largest seizure of control of public life since WWII, free money for everybody, etc., etc.
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It’s despicable. What should be happening is we double the amount of money for unemployment insurance and make sure we include everyone that needs it
 
BLADEMDA said:
It’s despicable. What should be happening is we double the amount of money for unemployment insurance and make sure we include everyone that needs it
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This whole public health thing, just downright despicable.😕
 
Arch Guillotti said:
This whole public health thing, just downright despicable.😕
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The wasting of tax dollars by sending money to everyone is despicable. I am not referring to buying medical equipment or Covid 19 research/testing. But, public money should be spent wisely and that means targeting the money to those in need like the unemployed or homeless.

Do you honestly think the upper middle class and wealthy need this money? Again, I believe this is a crisis and govt intervention is needed but the taxpayer money should be spent where it is needed.
 
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BLADEMDA said:
The wasting of tax dollars by sending money to everyone is despicable. I am not referring to buying medical equipment or Covid 19 research/testing. But, public money should be spent wisely and that means targeting the money to those in need like the unemployed or homeless.

Do you honestly think the upper middle class and wealthy need this money? Again, I believe this is a crisis and govt intervention is needed but the taxpayer money should be spent where it is needed.
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Dude they aren't going to send money to "everyone".
 
BLADEMDA said:
The wasting of tax dollars by sending money to everyone is despicable. I am not referring to buying medical equipment or Covid 19 research/testing. But, public money should be spent wisely and that means targeting the money to those in need like the unemployed or homeless.

Do you honestly think the upper middle class and wealthy need this money? Again, I believe this is a crisis and govt intervention is needed but the taxpayer money should be spent where it is needed.
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I just heard the Pres say he would be in favor of Govt participating in private company ownership. Good Lord, @Vector could be right!
 
“It's unclear what the income threshold will be for Americans to qualify for the checks. However, according to the Hill, Senate Republicans are reportedly considering making the limit $75,000 for individuals and $150,000 for couples.”

The money should be focused on the unemployed and homeless not couples earning $145,000 per year.
 
Trump announced at a White House press briefing that chloroquine, a drug designed for use in malaria, has been FDA approved and will be made available by prescription "almost immediately." He said it was one of a number of antiviral therapies to limit the symptoms of the virus that the administration is trying to get to Americans as quickly as possible
 
BLADEMDA said:
It’s despicable. What should be happening is we double the amount of money for unemployment insurance and make sure we include everyone that needs it
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Maybe if we didn’t cut spending on socialist programs that focus on public health, we wouldn’t be in this mess. Where were all those benevolent capitalists years ago with their vaccines? We’ve known about coronaviruses and their ability to infect humans for years now.

Capitalism is reactive, no proactive. You need a robust centralized public health system to not only plan for these pandemics, but to react to them swiftly. That is something we do not have and now we and our economy is paying the price. You continue to view capitalism and socialism as some kind of black and white thing, which is horribly incorrect.
 
GravelRider said:
Maybe if we didn’t cut spending on socialist programs that focus on public health, we wouldn’t be in this mess. Where were all those benevolent capitalists years ago with their vaccines? We’ve known about coronaviruses and their ability to infect humans for years now.

Capitalism is reactive, no proactive. You need a robust centralized public health system to not only plan for these pandemics, but to react to them swiftly. That is something we do not have and now we and our economy is paying the price. You continue to view capitalism and socialism as some kind of black and white thing, which is horribly incorrect.
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We have the best biotech companies in the world. I view socialism for what it truly is “a necessary evil” for a civilized society. The less of it the better.

Let’s not debate healthcare crisis like Covid 19 in the same context as a single payer system. The former requires govt intervention while the latter is a disaster. We need a 2 tiered health care system. But, the govt will be The player in the crappy “free” system while the Unions and Well-off keep their private insurance.
 
BLADEMDA said:
Trump announced at a White House press briefing that chloroquine, a drug designed for use in malaria, has been FDA approved and will be made available by prescription "almost immediately." He said it was one of a number of antiviral therapies to limit the symptoms of the virus that the administration is trying to get to Americans as quickly as possible
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How great is that! I guess they will be sold just next to the imaginary testing kits.

Dr. Chauncey Gardiner has just created another national mania. Now we'll really run out of (hydroxy)chloroquine, too, because of all the doctors who don't want to lose their patients and will prescribe it like antibiotics. So, if it really works, the people who need it the most, i.e. the ICU and ER teams, and the ICU patients, won't have it. Par for the course.

Just watch what a crapfest we'll have in NYC in less than 2 weeks. Italy will seem like Heaven.
 
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SaltyDog said:
From where?
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In a well-governed country, Plaquenil and ANY drug that could actually work, would be on lockdown, the moment they are mentioned, for NATIONAL SECURITY reasons. Now THAT would be LEADERSHIP. Same for N95 and all the essential things healthcare workers and real patients will need.

China is running circles around the West, while Russia is doing their best to destabilize it.

The Chinese had HALF the infection rate among healthcare workers Italians have. One doesn't play games with this virus. This, while the Sh-tDC is still recommending just droplet precautions (while the Chinese and the EU say airborne), because they don't have the guts to admit that we don't have enough PPE in the country. Worst case scenario, some healthcare suckers will die there, who cares?
 
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Trump announced at a White House press briefing that chloroquine, a drug designed for use in malaria, has been FDA approved and will be made available by prescription "almost immediately." He said it was one of a number of antiviral therapies to limit the symptoms of the virus that the administration is trying to get to Americans as quickly as possible

He did indeed say that and then the FDA MD came right back and explained it was in trials (fast tracked) but not currently available. He’s a clown.
 
anbuitachi said:
Senate Democrats: Cancel student loan payments and $10,000 in debt amid coronavirus

i dont think this is a good idea
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99% chance that this would exclude anyone earning over poverty wages.

1% chance I'm going on a $10K shopping spree.
 
FFP said:
.

He's a professional liar and conman. Please don't insult the clowns.
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The FDA and CDC really messed up. Let’s not blame all of this on Trump. Our own medical and science specialists were not able to convince anyone to do anything, were not aggressive, did not allow the WHO tests (were they making money off this decision?), aren’t even making enough tests available right now (unless if u r a celebrity or in NBA). The president can only do so much and needs good advisors. Trump is not a scientist or a doctor, and his advisors failed him and us.
 
MoMoGesiologist said:
The FDA and CDC really messed up. Let’s not blame all of this on Trump. Our own medical and science specialists were not able to convince anyone to do anything, were not aggressive, did not allow the WHO tests (were they making money off this decision?), aren’t even making enough tests available right now (unless if u r a celebrity or in NBA). The president can only do so much and needs good advisors. Trump is not a scientist or a doctor, and his advisors failed him and us.
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Oh, please! All the good people are leaving the government, and the ones who don't are kicked out (e.g. the pandemic team, or, just this week, the chief of the OPM, the HR for the 2 million federal employees, in the middle of a pandemic). And now, in times of crisis, it shows.

He doesn't have good advisors because HE only hires sycophants. Even the good people are afraid to speak up. Just look how he went through chiefs of staff, probably the most important role one can have in the White House. Or what he has done with the national security advisors. This is the direct consequence of a bad leader surrounding himself with bad quality people. Deja vu, in any autocracy and The Mob. He values loyalty waaay above competence.

This reminds me of a line from The West Wing, where the chief of staff and the president are reminiscing, and the president says that something like the best advice he ever got was to make his best friend chief of staff. Which makes me wonder: who's this president's best friend?

Also, don't blame the advisors. He's famous for not listening even to the best advice from the most competent individuals. "Like a toddler", remember? He probably has dementia, what do you expect? He doesn't even remember what he said a week ago. If that's true, I am sorry for him (and for us). Plus he's the poster child for Dunning-Kruger.
 
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SaltyDog said:
From where?
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I've purchased things from these guys before.

Medical Supplies, Equipment, Pharmaceuticals | Henry Schein‌

Shop Henry Schein for medical supplies, medical equipment, pharmaceuticals, healthcare solutions and more from our wide selection of brands.
www.henryschein.com www.henryschein.com

The magic drug referenced in this thread is shown as in stock for $16 for a bottle of a hundred 200 mg tablets. It let me add it to my cart anyway. You need an account to see prices. UPS to your door in a few days. Or tomorrow if you want to make it rain with overnight shipping.
 
pgg said:
I've purchased things from these guys before.

Medical Supplies, Equipment, Pharmaceuticals | Henry Schein‌

Shop Henry Schein for medical supplies, medical equipment, pharmaceuticals, healthcare solutions and more from our wide selection of brands.
www.henryschein.com www.henryschein.com

The magic drug referenced in this thread is shown as in stock for $16 for a bottle of a hundred 200 mg tablets. It let me add it to my cart anyway. You need an account to see prices. UPS to your door in a few days. Or tomorrow if you want to make it rain with overnight shipping.
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It may still be illegal, unless you have a practice where you dispense drugs, and you are registered with your state for that. Most anesthesiologists only prescribe. Just sayin'...
 
MoMoGesiologist said:
The FDA and CDC really messed up. Let’s not blame all of this on Trump. Our own medical and science specialists were not able to convince anyone to do anything, were not aggressive, did not allow the WHO tests (were they making money off this decision?), aren’t even making enough tests available right now (unless if u r a celebrity or in NBA). The president can only do so much and needs good advisors. Trump is not a scientist or a doctor, and his advisors failed him and us.
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Someone messed up. Do you remember Ebola a few years ago? We had no community transmissions of the disease. Yet, I had to take classes on donning and doffing PPE. We went through drills on what we would do if an Ebola patient presented to us. Contigency plans were made and beds were set aside.

Now I get daily emails about how we are dangerously low on masks and recommendations from the CDC to use a bandana. Someone is f@cking up BIGLY. Is it Trump? I don’t know. I do know that leadership is an important quality, though.
 
FFP said:
It may still be illegal, unless you have a practice where you dispense drugs, and you are registered with your state for that. Most anesthesiologists only prescribe. Just sayin'...
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Most states don't require you to register as a dispensary. Worst case you have to meet the pharmacy laws about labels.
 
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