Unofficial WAMC Thread Psychiatry Residency 2020

[Thelonious Chunk]

Posted on the old thread a while ago and didn't see a new thread, but I am looking for advice on how many programs to apply to, and what type of programs I would be considered at. I am happy to do residency anywhere, but if I could be in Cal, AZ, or Texas that would be best (I know California is v competitive so I'm curious if I would have a realistic shot at any program in the state). I searched around and didn't really find recent answers to these questions.

Step 1: 20*
Step 2 CK: 24*
Comlex 1: 51*
Comlex PE: P
Comlex 2: not back yet
School: 2020 DO not on a coast
Class Rank: bottom quartile
No failures

Clerkship Grades: pass on all, all positive but brief evals from preceptors (we are only P/Honors and honors is given to only a couple students) except for psychiatry which was a lengthier and very positive eval.

Research/ Publications: none

Extracurriculars: mental health related volunteering since the start of med school, student leadership in our psychiatry club, student govt position, psychiatry tutor.

LORs: Two LORs so far, one from a Psych MD and another from FM. Hoping to get another psych LOR

bonus: Doing 1-2 auditions before submitting. psychology undergrad.


TLDR: low step 1, better step 2 as DO w/ demonstrated psych interest. How many programs should I apply to? How high would a reach program be and how low would a safer program be? How can I determine what is a lower-tier v. mid-tier v. high tier so that I don't apply to the wrong programs? Do I have a reasonable shot anywhere in California? People have been telling me to apply to 100+ programs and to avoid focusing on the coasts but 100+ is a lot of $. Thanks for reading and GL to all candidates this cycle!

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[Stagg737]

I'd say apply to at least 50. I had no step and a sub-500 Level 1 and had no problems getting interviews and matching with 75 programs. Make sure your LORs are very strong and that you make sure to apply heavily within your geographic area.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

50 can be plenty, and 100 can be not enough depending on how realistic you are in where you apply. As a bottom quartile DO there are a lot of places that you should not waste your money applying to. You should apply to places that know you and where you did aways for sure, but don't waste your money on places that clearly will not consider you. There are plenty of good places that will consider you, you need to hit most of those.

 

[Oedipa Maas]

Thank you for starting this thread!

I have a strong background in psych but when I entered medical school, I really tried to maintain an open mind and pursued some research in a surgical subspecialty as I love working with my hands. When I entered my clinical years, I realized that this is not what I find gratifying in medicine but I stayed with my project because I believe in it and love my lab. How much should this be addressed in my personal statement?

Step 1: 22x
Step 2 CK: 24x
School: 2020 MD, Southwest
Class Rank: Unsure, got As and Bs in pre-clinical years, clerkship grades below
No failures/red flags

Clerkship Grades:
- Honors - OB/GYN, Surgical Subspecialty Elective, and Psychiatry
- High pass - IM, Peds, and Family
- Pass - Surgery and Neurology (limited by shelf score, not clinical evals)

Research/ Publications: 4 publications prior to medical school in neurodevelopment (bench work), 2 presentations in surgical subspecialty (bench work), 1 case report in internal medicine.

Extracurriculars: Volunteering at a psych free clinic, volunteering/leadership in surgical free clinic, volunteering/leadership in humanities.

LORs: Three - one adult psych, one child psych, one current research PI (PhD).

Bonus: Doing 1 audition before submitting. Psychology undergrad. Crisis hotline worker prior to medical school.

Residency goals: Open to biological model and psychotherapy, hoping to find a program with a bit of both. Interested in CAP and would like a program that offers this fellowship with the hopes of matching there and being in a location for 5 years instead of 3 then moving again. Research is something that I enjoy but I tend to follow my passions for a project rather than have a specific goal/area going in so I don't know if applying to research tracks is worthwhile. I hope to apply to the Southwest as well as both coasts for program reasons + family/friend/partner/support system reasons + a genuine love for both regions. I am looking for guidance with respect to a list//if there is anywhere I should apply to that is not encompassed by west coast + east coast + southwest. My current list feels very top-heavy and I would like to be realistic.

TLDR: How much should I "explain" my interests/volunteering/research outside of Psych in my personal statement? Should I bother applying to research tracks? Is the east coast or west coast too much of a reach? Are there any programs that fit my goals that I'm not thinking of? Is 30 programs a reasonable number?

 

[Thelonious Chunk]

50 can be plenty, and 100 can be not enough depending on how realistic you are in where you apply. As a bottom quartile DO there are a lot of places that you should not waste your money applying to. You should apply to places that know you and where you did aways for sure, but don't waste your money on places that clearly will not consider you. There are plenty of good places that will consider you, you need to hit most of those.

Thank you for the perspective. Would you recommend looking at program rosters for current DOs as the best way of determining my competitiveness, or is there a more efficient way?

 

[phonyreal98]

Should I bother applying to research tracks?

How much do you want to do research? What I'm getting at is are you willing to tell programs at this point in time that you're ok with giving up other opportunities in order to make time for research during residency? Or would you rather figure things out with research after you get started with residency and have a better idea of what opportunities might be available at your program?

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Thank you for the perspective. Would you recommend looking at program rosters for current DOs as the best way of determining my competitiveness, or is there a more efficient way?

Looking at rosters for current DOs is about the only way to do this. If you write PDs and ask, they will generally say that they consider DOs even if they don't. Many have GME policies that state that they take DOs, but these policies are not enforced with any teeth.

 

[FlowRate]

Thank you for starting this thread!

I have a strong background in psych but when I entered medical school, I really tried to maintain an open mind and pursued some research in a surgical subspecialty as I love working with my hands. When I entered my clinical years, I realized that this is not what I find gratifying in medicine but I stayed with my project because I believe in it and love my lab. How much should this be addressed in my personal statement?

Step 1: 227
Step 2 CK: Will take in August
School: 2020 MD, Southwest
Class Rank: Unsure, got As and Bs in pre-clinical years, clerkship grades below
No failures/red flags

TLDR: How much should I "explain" my interests/volunteering/research outside of Psych in my personal statement? Should I bother applying to research tracks? Is the east coast or west coast too much of a reach? Are there any programs that fit my goals that I'm not thinking of? Is 30 programs a reasonable number?

Get a better score on CK, that'll go a long way toward getting in the door and making you more competitive for coastal academic programs.

I don't know that you need to explain your research outside of psych as much as you need to clarify whether your interest going forward is in doing research. If yes then you can just write about what you enjoyed about the research you did. It would be nice to get input from people who have a better feel for the psych residency landscape though.

 

[EarlyCareerAcademicPsych]

TLDR: How much should I "explain" my interests/volunteering/research outside of Psych in my personal statement? Should I bother applying to research tracks? Is the east coast or west coast too much of a reach? Are there any programs that fit my goals that I'm not thinking of? Is 30 programs a reasonable number?

I have read literally thousands of personal statements.

Here is some process-oriented advice:
1) Don't "explain" anything in your personal statement. Show the reviewers who you are by how your write about what you have done.
Be yourself. This goes a long way. You want a good match as much as you want to train at a good place.
2) Show your personal statement to people who know you well and to people who do not know you well.
Make sure to take the input from both groups seriously.
For the first, does the personal statement capture you and your interest in becoming a psychiatrist?
For the second group, would they hire you? would they like to teach you?

Re: the rest, I don't have a clue.

Good luck!

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

If there is something that needs "explaining" your personal statement is the only place you can do this. Otherwise you need to hope that the Dean's letter or a LOR does this for you and that isn't likely. The only thing worse than having something that needs explaining is having something that needs explaining and not explaining it so it is left to our imagination.
"Oh my, what happened here... Humm, can't tell, Next."
I agree with EarlyCareerAcademicPsych in principle, but beg to differ if there is a clear "Oh my what is that about" in your application. I have literally have read about ten thousand PSs. It is irritating when you go digging for a specific answer and don't find it. If I'm honed in on something and it isn't mentioned that is a big problem.

 

[FlowRate]

If there is something that needs "explaining" your personal statement is the only place you can do this. Otherwise you need to hope that the Dean's letter or a LOR does this for you and that isn't likely. The only thing worse than having something that needs explaining is having something that needs explaining and not explaining it so it is left to our imagination.
"Oh my, what happened here... Humm, can't tell, Next."
I agree with EarlyCareerAcademicPsych in principle, but beg to differ if there is a clear "Oh my what is that about" in your application. I have literally have read about ten thousand PSs. It is irritating when you go digging for a specific answer and don't find it. If I'm honed in on something and it isn't mentioned that is a big problem.

It sounds like indirectly you're saying that person might want to explain why they're still doing surgery research? Or am I reading too much in to your comment?

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

You are over reading this. Doing surgery research is a positive; not as beneficial as psychiatry research, but definitely better than no research. I'm talking about a core rotation failure, or repeating a year or something bad that would make a reader wonder what happened.

 

[Monocles]

Each year I feel less and less qualified to give advise in this thread. As a new pgy-4 child fellow the stat creep is incredible... when I was a rotating med student the residents I worked with had step scores of 200s... I briefly glanced through some folders of residency applicants (in the same university based system) and barely saw anything under 230

 

[EarlyCareerAcademicPsych]

You are over reading this. Doing surgery research is a positive; not as beneficial as psychiatry research, but definitely better than no research. I'm talking about a core rotation failure, or repeating a year or something bad that would make a reader wonder what happened.

Actually - I agree with MacDonaldTriad here that you have to address parts of your application which may be considered red flags for poor performance.

When you have failed a USMLE Step (and then gone back and passed it) or failed a clerkship or some other place where you fell short, you get a chance to speak that experience in the personal statement. DON'T SHY AWAY FROM DOING THIS - IT IS VITAL. Sorry, I don't mean to get loud but this is really important. You have to face it head on.

But - it is HOW you choose to do this which is important. It shows who you are. HOW you describe what you did to remediate a failed clerkship, for example. What you learned from it (honesty and genuineness are super important here - if you learned nothing then don't try to make something up).

I guess when I give the advice "Don't explain", I am saying something like "Don't explain away" what happened and try to make it like it didn't happen. Take responsibility for it. Learn from it. "Make use of your experience because it is yours" (the Elvin Semrad quote is much better - I will go find it now)

 

[EarlyCareerAcademicPsych]

Check this out (Jerry Gans reflects on his memories of Elvin Semrad, a legendary clinician educator at Mass Mental):

https://www.agpa.org/docs/default-source/practice-resources--group-circle/2013_spring_group_circle.pdf?sfvrsn=0&sfvrsn=0

The last paragraph is what stuck with me as applicable here:

((( And last but not least was to value my own personal experience. When I came to MMHC, I was probably as smart as I would ever be. I had just finished a year of a medicine internship, using my vast knowledge to take care of people, only to walk on to an in-patient psychiatric unit where most of my knowledge would be of little use in helping severely mentally ill patients. It was very upsetting and frightening. It was at that juncture that Semrad said something that I have always treasured: “The one thing that each of you has that no one else has is your own experience as you experienced it. You might not like it, you may feel it stinks, you may not have elected it; but it is yours, so value and use it.” )))

THIS is what the personal statement is for. Make use of your own experience in life to show who you are. That is what the best personal statements do, in my opinion.

 

[ridethecliche]

Research/ Publications: 4 publications prior to medical school in neurodevelopment (bench work), 2 presentations in surgical subspecialty (bench work), 1 case report in internal medicine.

Extracurriculars: Volunteering at a psych free clinic, volunteering/leadership in surgical free clinic, volunteering/leadership in humanities.

LORs: Three - one adult psych, one child psych, one current research PI (PhD).

Bonus: Doing 1 audition before submitting. Psychology undergrad. Crisis hotline worker prior to medical school.

TLDR: How much should I "explain" my interests/volunteering/research outside of Psych in my personal statement? Should I bother applying to research tracks? Is the east coast or west coast too much of a reach? Are there any programs that fit my goals that I'm not thinking of? Is 30 programs a reasonable number?

I think you can mention it in passing. I.e. you have enough psychy stuff in your application that no one is going to be surprised. You should mention that you were interested in something and chose to pursue it and then decided to see it through even though you knew you weren't going to pursue that field in residency.

Each year I feel less and less qualified to give advise in this thread. As a new pgy-4 child fellow the stat creep is incredible... when I was a rotating med student the residents I worked with had step scores of 200s... I briefly glanced through some folders of residency applicants (in the same university based system) and barely saw anything under 230

Don't worry fam. I'm a PGY1 in an east coast program with a step 1 score that was 210-215. Step 2 was much better though at 235-240.

The program was wayyyy down my list though, but shockingly I kinda like it here. (/sarcasm re the shockingly bit. Most programs are pretty solid.)
The match is weird, but yolo and it seems to work out if you're honest with yourself and don't go to interviews/rank places where you know you'd never go.

 

[Oedipa Maas]

@ridethecliche @EarlyCareerAcademicPsych @MacDonaldTriad @FlowRate @phonyreal98

Thank you all so much, your responses were all uniquely helpful and you have given me a lot to think about/act upon!

 

[JoseyCali123]

Step 1: 211
Step 2 CK: 243
Step 2 CS: Not Taken Yet
School: mid-tier MD in Northern California
Class Rank: middle quartile

Clerkship Grades: 3rd Year - Honors in Psychiatry, Honors in Child Psychiatry Elective, High Pass Family. 4th Year - Honors in Pediatrics Sub-I, Honors in Psychiatry Sub-I; All MSPE comments are strong.

Research/ Publications: 1 first-author pub, 10 posters, running own research projects. All are in Psychiatry and geared towards social justice related focus.

Extracurriculars: Act as President of Psychiatry Free Clinic for over three years, Act as President / Co-Founder of LGBT+ Health organization for over three years, Coordinated statewide conference on LGBT+ Health for two years, Created and coordinate class on LGBT+ Health class
*I'm hesitating to describe too much on what I did on these activities because I do not want to identify myself

Awards: Two national scholarships from Psychiatry organizations (APA + AACAP), Gold Humanism Honor Society

LORs: Three LOR - Two nationally renown Psychiatry MD's, One from Pediatrics 4th Year Sub-I. All will be strong and excellent.

Do I have a shot in Psychiatry?

 

[splik]

Step 1: 211
Step 2 CK: 243
Step 2 CS: Not Taken Yet
School: mid-tier MD in Northern California
Class Rank: middle quartile

Clerkship Grades: 3rd Year - Honors in Psychiatry, Honors in Child Psychiatry Elective, High Pass Family. 4th Year - Honors in Pediatrics Sub-I, Honors in Psychiatry Sub-I; All MSPE comments are strong.

Research/ Publications: 1 first-author pub, 10 posters, running own research projects. All are in Psychiatry and geared towards social justice related focus.

Extracurriculars: Act as President of Psychiatry Free Clinic for over three years, Act as President / Co-Founder of LGBT+ Health organization for over three years, Coordinated statewide conference on LGBT+ Health for two years, Created and coordinate class on LGBT+ Health class
*I'm hesitating to describe too much on what I did on these activities because I do not want to identify myself

Awards: Two national scholarships from Psychiatry organizations (APA + AACAP), Gold Humanism Honor Society

LORs: Three LOR - Two nationally renown Psychiatry MD's, One from Pediatrics 4th Year Sub-I. All will be strong and excellent.

Do I have a shot in Psychiatry?

omg yes of course you do, but you seriously need to chill and do something about this unsustainable level of neuroticism because that is the main thing you have going against you. if you come across as not believing in yourself or overly anxious during interviews or away rotations, it will kill any chance you have of matching. Otherwise, you have some really positive things for your application. board scores are not the be all and end all.

 

[clausewitz2]

Each year I feel less and less qualified to give advise in this thread. As a new pgy-4 child fellow the stat creep is incredible... when I was a rotating med student the residents I worked with had step scores of 200s... I briefly glanced through some folders of residency applicants (in the same university based system) and barely saw anything under 230

I really hope for the sake of the meta that Step 1-focused builds get nerfed whenever the next patch is released.

 

[Central_SOULcus]

Check this out (Jerry Gans reflects on his memories of Elvin Semrad, a legendary clinician educator at Mass Mental):

https://www.agpa.org/docs/default-source/practice-resources--group-circle/2013_spring_group_circle.pdf?sfvrsn=0&sfvrsn=0

The last paragraph is what stuck with me as applicable here:

((( And last but not least was to value my own personal experience. When I came to MMHC, I was probably as smart as I would ever be. I had just finished a year of a medicine internship, using my vast knowledge to take care of people, only to walk on to an in-patient psychiatric unit where most of my knowledge would be of little use in helping severely mentally ill patients. It was very upsetting and frightening. It was at that juncture that Semrad said something that I have always treasured: “The one thing that each of you has that no one else has is your own experience as you experienced it. You might not like it, you may feel it stinks, you may not have elected it; but it is yours, so value and use it.” )))

THIS is what the personal statement is for. Make use of your own experience in life to show who you are. That is what the best personal statements do, in my opinion.

^Yes to this. I had something in my app that *some* might consider a red flag, but because it was a part of my own personal experience, I mentioned it in my PS. It ended up being a non-issue as all my interview invites were from academic programs in big cities and I matched at my number 2 spot. Of course, we can't know what my outcome would have been if I hadn't mentioned it, but I definitely had a few interviewers in at least 3 programs say the honesty of my personal statement made them want to meet me.

Edit to add: I didn't get interviews from all the places I applied to, and this may have (likely?) been because of what I wrote, but in the end I got enough and I feel blessed to have ended up at my current program. In the end, regardless of all the factors, I strongly believe we end up where we're supposed to.

 

[salemstein]

I really hope for the sake of the meta that Step 1-focused builds get nerfed whenever the next patch is released.

Agreed, Step 1 is too OP right now. My defensive EC based build needs a major buff

 

[EarlyCareerAcademicPsych]

Agreed, Step 1 is too OP right now. My defensive EC based build needs a major buff

Please translate what this means!

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

I agree, lets keep it in English please. My google efforts indicate that OP is Over Powered, but the rest is beyond Google it seems.

 

[Ludwig2000]

My guess: An application “build” based on a high Step 1 is too overpowered; a defensive application based on Extracurriculars (EC) needs a relative power boost

 

[FlowRate]

I really hope for the sake of the meta that Step 1-focused builds get nerfed whenever the next patch is released.

I thought Step 2 was already taking over the meta because it targets psychiatry's clinical focus and weakness to basic science material. I guess it's probably true that it's still better to SAD and pump Step 1 than to MAD 1+2 or SAD 2 (since you can't totally neglect 1).

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Please tell me you guys do realize that you are still not speaking English, right? I'm so lost.

 

[clausewitz2]

I thought Step 2 was already taking over the meta because it targets psychiatry's clinical focus and weakness to basic science material. I guess it's probably true that it's still better to SAD and pump Step 1 than to MAD 1+2 or SAD 2 (since you can't totally neglect 1).

Yeah I mean if you run the San Francisco mod like ophtho and uro you don't even have that choice because the whole match is so short.

 

[daylightfire]

Step 1: 240
Step 2: taking in November
School: top 40 MD in the northeast
Clerkship Grades: HP everything, probably honors in psych (but still pending)
Research/ Publications: research in a surgical subspecialty with a couple posters and 1 paper submitted for publication (2nd author)
Extracurriculars: president of a hobby-related club, free clinic volunteering, nothing too exciting

I'm very interested in LGBT/trans psych. I have a good history of demonstrated interest in the field since before med school (aside from my research in a different field). Really hoping to stay in a major city, especially on the east coast.

I think my chances at matching in psych are pretty good, but I guess I'm trying to figure out how competitive I am. Am I okay to apply to top-tier places, or is that overreaching? Just trying to be realistic!

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Absolutely apply to top tier places, just don't forget to add a few less than top tier you would be willing to go to.

 

[Old&InTheWay]

Step 1: 240
Step 2: taking in November
School: top 40 MD in the northeast
Clerkship Grades: HP everything, probably honors in psych (but still pending)
Research/ Publications: research in a surgical subspecialty with a couple posters and 1 paper submitted for publication (2nd author)
Extracurriculars: president of a hobby-related club, free clinic volunteering, nothing too exciting

I'm very interested in LGBT/trans psych. I have a good history of demonstrated interest in the field since before med school (aside from my research in a different field). Really hoping to stay in a major city, especially on the east coast.

I think my chances at matching in psych are pretty good, but I guess I'm trying to figure out how competitive I am. Am I okay to apply to top-tier places, or is that overreaching? Just trying to be realistic!

I think your stats will probably get you some interviews at some fancy programs. But I wouldn't only apply to "top-tier" places. Try to find a mix of programs that actually appeal to you for one reason or another...don't get hung up on name recognition. You might be surprised by how you feel about programs on your interview days. Just make sure you apply to enough to ensure you have a sufficient number of interviews to have a good chance at matching.

 

[daylightfire]

Absolutely apply to top tier places, just don't forget to add a few less than top tier you would be willing to go to.

I think your stats will probably get you some interviews at some fancy programs. But I wouldn't only apply to "top-tier" places. Try to find a mix of programs that actually appeal to you for one reason or another...don't get hung up on name recognition. You might be surprised by how you feel about programs on your interview days. Just make sure you apply to enough to ensure you have a sufficient number of interviews to have a good chance at matching.

Thanks for your input!! I definitely will apply broadly. I actually don't care about prestige very much, but I know that sometimes a desirable location can be synonymous with prestige.

So far I have a list of about 30 programs that I'm interested in. Do you think that will be enough, or should I set a higher target?

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Broadly doesn't just mean a high number. Without knowing the details about the types of places on your list, this is hard to answer your question. 30 is more than enough typically, but 50 can be not enough and 15 can be more than enough depending on what the places are like.

 

[mm45]

Step 1: 235
Step 2: 245
School: top 50 MD in the South
Clerkship Grades: H Surgery, HP internal medicine and psychiatry
Research/ Publications: two neuroscience poster presentations, one psychiatry presentation
Extracurriculars: PsychSIGN, psych interest group, underserved clinic
Red flags: failed to match prior cycle, did not apply broadly enough and had some poor interviews

Targeting PGY2 positions this cycle but also applying broadly throughout the country. No geographic restrictions. Would like to end up at an academic program.

 

[clausewitz2]

Step 1: 235
Step 2: 245
School: top 50 MD in the South
Clerkship Grades: H Surgery, HP internal medicine and psychiatry
Research/ Publications: two neuroscience poster presentations, one psychiatry presentation
Extracurriculars: PsychSIGN, psych interest group, underserved clinic
Red flags: failed to match prior cycle, did not apply broadly enough and had some poor interviews

Targeting PGY2 positions this cycle but also applying broadly throughout the country. No geographic restrictions. Would like to end up at an academic program.

Do you know why those interviews went badly? Being able to correct this is the most important thing you can do.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

mm45, I assume you are a PGY-I now, so it is early, but get your current PD to summarize your performance even if this is only a couple of months. You can bring a more up to date letter with you on interviews. PGY-II slots will insist on some communication with your PD anyway.

 

[BigJaySon]

.

 

[mm45]

Do you know why those interviews went badly? Being able to correct this is the most important thing you can do.

From the feedback I received, the majority went well however the poor feedback revolved around not sounding excited about the program which is something I have been practicing!

 

[psychappguy1]

US MD mid-tier
Step 1: 244
Step 2: 258
Clerkships: all honors
Research: a few psych projects. a couple papers. one first author.
Letters: 3 pretty good. 1 research.
volunteering: student gov position and some health screening.

Hoping to match at an academic place like yale or ucsf. I am worried that if I apply to only big name places that my app might be too risky.

 

[Señor Científico]

Top 10
step 1: 25x
step 2: 24x, pass first attempt
clerkships: honors - surgery, peds, primary care, neuro
highpass - medicine, obgyn, psych
research: several papers and psoters
letters: research; medicine; PD
ec's: student and resident leadership positions
red flag: changing fields, won't have a psych letter until beginning of november

hoping to go to a strong academic place, not necessarily boston or cali. wondering how big of a deal the hp in psych and delayed letter will be - planning on addressing that issue in my PS. i'll probably have step 3 passed by november.

 

[Horners]

240s and 250s... sheesh what are you guys worried about

 

[WorldChanger36]

Chances?

Currently a TRI ( Traditional rotating intern) preliminary in a small hospital in NY

Step 1: none
Step 2 CK: none
Comlex 1: 595
Comlex PE: Pass on 2nd attempt
Comlex 2: 515
COMLEX 3: Will take End of sept should have score in by nov-ish
School: The only DO school in MS
Class Rank: bottom quartile
No class failures

TRI performance:TRI rotations going very well strong evaluations from psych and medicine. Currently on Emergency psychiatry a rotation they normally don't allow interns to do, it is going very well. The chair of psychiatry ( a practicing psychiatrist) is willing to write me a letter as is my program director for the TRI program.

LORs: The Two from my TRI program noted above and 3 from last cycle 2 are from psychiatrists I rotated with in medical school in my 4th year and one is from a Family doc I rotated with in my 4th year.

Red flags : 1) COMLEX PE failure. I am not sure if passing level 3 instantly makes up for this or not but I hope it isn't a mill stone around my neck this whole cycle.

Yellow Flags: 1) I really don't care for my home hospitals psych program, they prematch only mostly carib grads, education is poor, didactics are not protected, will require I start over, will not allow or recommend any graduates for fellowships and maybe closing in the next 2 to 3 years. While I am willing to start over as an intern if I have to I would prefer it be in a stronger program closer to home if that happens. 2)I am an intern so I can't just take time off to interview this limits the number of interviews, time of the year and distance I can go to interviews.

Goals: My top goal is to land a categorical position in the southern US with 6 months of credit ( 3 medicine, 1 ER and 2 of psych) from my TRI. Baring that I would be happy with a categorical position as an intern in psych on the east coast or southern US.

1) What is the likelihood I would find a program that is available to get some to 6 months of credit for my TRI year at another program?
2) What are my chances of matching if I roll the dice with just the match with my current stats and I apply to 60 ish programs in the south to midwest?
3) Do I take the deal if offered to prematch at my home hospital even with the risk of it closing and poor education or do I roll the dice with the match and hope I get picked up?
4) How do most programs view TRIs reapplying to their programs?
5) Does a level 3 pass and a solid intern year make up for a level 2 PE board failure?

 

[psych_psych_psych]

Unranked School (New School)
Step 1: 23x
Step 2: 24x, pass first attempt
Clerkships: Honors: primary care, Psych elective
Pass with Remediation: Pediatrics Inpatient
Pass: everything else
Research: 2 pubs from undergrad, 3-4 pubs from med school related to nervous system/psychiatry
Letters: Medicine, Psych x3 (x2 away), and FM (Not sure which to use/if I need another psych) MSPE is pretty cookie cutter except for psych MPSE section where they state residents loved having me, was always looking for cases, great attitude, etc.
ECs: long-term leadership position at volunteer at student clinic for homeless and psych interest group, started two companies in medical school: one donates profits to student clinic and transgender medicine clinic and the other is a healthcare IT company. Got a masters in healthcare innovation while in medical school.
**RED FLAG**: Pass with Remediation of Pediatrics Inpatient

Hoping to match to an academic medical center....WAMC?

 

[BiscoDisco]

So I realize I’m probably a stronger applicant but wondering how that should influence where I apply

Step 1: 263
Step 2 CK: 269
Step 2 CS: Pass on 1st attempt
School: mid tier MD school in NE US
Class Rank: top 25%
Elected into AOA
Honors in all 3rd year clerkships, honors In medicine subI and I have one other honors from a psych outpatient rotation. No other grades back yet.
Awards: Elected into pathology honors society, academic award for performance in medical genetics

LORs:
-my third year preceptor in psych at a rural community hospital
-my preceptor on my outpatient psych elective as a fourth year who is well known
-well known forensic psychiatrist from my away
-medicine subI attending

Research: one pub from summer between 1st and 2nd yr in liver disease and obesity. one poster from college. 1000 hours of neuroscience research from college (different from the research in Med school), but sadly our paper was just rejected and my PI isn’t submitting another one soon

ECs:
-EM club president (changed my specialty obvs lol)
-coordinated a health outreach clinic in a rough neighborhood
-tutored in anatomy 2nd year
-student interviewer for med school admissions my first year

Goals: want to match at a top program, preferably in the south but also applying Harvard, Penn, etc in the NE.
Questions:
1) for programs requiring three letters, should I send 3 in psych or 2 in psych and 1 in medicine
2) I want to match in the south, but have no connections there other than 1 away in Georgia. Will I get invites without connections?
3) will mid tier programs not interview me because I am a strong applicant? (Have heard of this being an issue)
4) what are my chances at a tippity top program? I do not go to a big name med school
5) how many programs should I apply to?

Guys I am not worried about not matching, so before my anyone dumps on me for seeking advice....
I just want to know what I should expect.

Expect the unexpected.

 

[splik]

So I realize I’m probably a stronger applicant but wondering how that should influence where I apply

Step 1: 263
Step 2 CK: 269
Step 2 CS: Pass on 1st attempt
School: mid tier MD school in NE US
Class Rank: top 25%
Elected into AOA
Honors in all 3rd year clerkships, honors In medicine subI and I have one other honors from a psych outpatient rotation. No other grades back yet.
Awards: Elected into pathology honors society, academic award for performance in medical genetics

LORs:
-my third year preceptor in psych at a rural community hospital
-my preceptor on my outpatient psych elective as a fourth year who is well known
-well known forensic psychiatrist from my away
-medicine subI attending

Research: one pub from summer between 1st and 2nd yr in liver disease and obesity. one poster from college. 1000 hours of neuroscience research from college (different from the research in Med school), but sadly our paper was just rejected and my PI isn’t submitting another one soon

ECs:
-EM club president (changed my specialty obvs lol)
-coordinated a health outreach clinic in a rough neighborhood
-tutored in anatomy 2nd year
-student interviewer for med school admissions my first year

Goals: want to match at a top program, preferably in the south but also applying Harvard, Penn, etc in the NE.
Questions:
1) for programs requiring three letters, should I send 3 in psych or 2 in psych and 1 in medicine
2) I want to match in the south, but have no connections there other than 1 away in Georgia. Will I get invites without connections?
3) will mid tier programs not interview me because I am a strong applicant? (Have heard of this being an issue)
4) what are my chances at a tippity top program? I do not go to a big name med school
5) how many programs should I apply to?

Guys I am not worried about not matching, so before my anyone dumps on me for seeking advice....
I just want to know what I should expect.

Based on the information you've given, your application is strong enough to get invites and have a good chance of matching at most, but not all of the top programs (the main thing being there is nothing discernible about your application that helps you stand out, and also that you don't go to a top med school).
You should not have all psych letters. At least one (if not more) LoRs should be from a non-psychiatry. I would include the medicine sub-I attending letter everywhere.
You can consider having a specific personal statement for certain programs, highlighting your interest in matching in the south and your reasons for doing so. If you really want to go all out, you can even have something tailored to individual programs you are most interested in matching at, that you are concerned you may not get an interview at.

 

[FlowRate]

You can consider having a specific personal statement for certain programs, highlighting your interest in matching in the south and your reasons for doing so. If you really want to go all out, you can even have something tailored to individual programs you are most interested in matching at, that you are concerned you may not get an interview at.

Agreed with the reminder that telling programs of your specific interest can be helpful. I sent Emory an email when I hadn't received an interview invite by mid-October and they immediately invited me. Probably helped that my reason was around family ties to the area.

 

[Merely]

Unranked School (New School)
Step 1: 23x
Step 2: 24x, pass first attempt
Clerkships: Honors: primary care, Psych elective Pass with Remediation: Pediatrics Inpatient Pass: everything else
Research: 2 pubs from undergrad, 3-4 pubs from med school related to nervous system/psychiatry
Letters: Medicine, Psych x3 (x2 away), and FM (Not sure which to use/if I need another psych) MSPE is pretty cookie cutter except for psych MPSE section where they state residents loved having me, was always looking for cases, great attitude, etc.
ECs: long-term leadership position at volunteer at student clinic for homeless and psych interest group, started two companies in medical school: one donates profits to student clinic and transgender medicine clinic and the other is a healthcare IT company. Got a masters in healthcare innovation while in medical school.
**RED FLAG**: Pass with Remediation of Pediatrics Inpatient

Hoping to match to an academic medical center....WAMC?

You failed your psych rotation and you want to match psych?

 

[FlowRate]

You failed your psych rotation and you want to match psych?

I think they honored it. The formatting is a little confusing on first glance.

 

[psych_psych_psych]

I think they honored it. The formatting is a little confusing on first glance.

@Merely @FlowRate

No, I passed psych core rotation (neuro/psych combined course) and I honored my psych elective.
I didn't fail any courses. We are given F's on our transcripts for failures, but a "pass with remediation" if the deficiency was something minor that needed to be worked on to satisfy the clerkship directors expectations. Although, I'm unsure of how this will impact my chances of matching.

 

[ThisHumerusIFound]

If anyone would be kind enough to give some guidance, I'd be very grateful. I'm currently planning to apply to about 150 programs, predominently in my home state/state of school, home program, programs where I did research and rotated/will rotate. Not asking for an exhaustive list by any means, but if anyone has suggestions per the questions I list at the end, I'd be extremely appreciative!

Comlex 1: 478
Comlex 2CE: 503
Comlex 2PE: Pass - first attempt
No USMLE
School: DO, 2020
Class Rank: 3rd quartile

Pre-clinical: mostly HP with a few H and a few P. No failures.

Clinical Grades: 2 H, 1 P, all rest are HP. Have multiple, detailed extremely positive evals (namely Psych and IM) with the rest being either above average but short and positive, and a few relatively standard/average.

Electives: 3 H, 1 HP. 2 more to come. 2 are non-psych, all psych elects are H's so far and expect one for this current rotation.

Research/ Publications:
- 2 publications - both 1st author. 1 is in psych.
- 6 presentations (1 oral presentation in psych, 1 poster in psych at APA, rest are a mix) - 1st author on all posters except 1 (in a different field)

Extracurriculars: a lot of volunteering over a 10 year span, likely in the 2000s in terms of total hours, about 300 during medical school, involvement in school's psych club.

Military: former military with honorable discharge

LORs: Have 4 psych LoRs already including department chair who knows me and I rotated with. All letters are from clinical preceptors. Had letters from other fields throughout the year, but my psych ones were strong as per what I was told by the writers, so I decided to use only my psych letters.

Bonus: psychology undergrad degree.

Sub-i's: completing 3 sub-i's in psych, but 2 are after submitting ERAS and before interview season is really underway - will be done with the last at the beginning of November.

TLDR: Veteran, DO student with subpar Level 1 with some improvement for Level 2. Psych interest is demonstrated. I am from the NE and go to school in the NE but also have connections/ties in a few other east coast states including 2 aways in other states.


Edited for having already applied, but what are my chances?

Thank you, and good luck to everyone!