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Discussion in 'ERAS, SOAP, and NRMP Match' started by Frederica, Nov 12, 2014.

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  1. aProgDirector

    aProgDirector Pastafarians Unite! SDN Advisor SDN Moderator 10+ Year Member

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    No. They are in the same positions they otherwise would have been in.
     
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  3. LadyRad

    LadyRad

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    How about green card holders from those countries? Would you change their rank even though they do not need a visa?
     
  4. aProgDirector

    aProgDirector Pastafarians Unite! SDN Advisor SDN Moderator 10+ Year Member

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    Just to be clear, I haven't decided what to do yet. In any case, anyone with a GC is good to work, doesn't need a visa. They changed their policy quickly from implementation to allow those with GC's to enter and leave the country. Anyone with a GC is unlikely to have it removed. So, I don't see this as a risk at all.
     
  5. LadyRad

    LadyRad

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    Makes sense, thank you!
     
  6. Transposony

    Transposony Do or do not, There is no try 5+ Year Member

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    Dagobah
    Received the following email:
     
  7. j4pac

    j4pac PM&R resident 10+ Year Member

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    Do you screen applicants' social media pages as part of the process?
     
  8. docdionne

    docdionne

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    This was partially addressed earlier - the idea of mentors making phone calls on your behalf post-interview, pre-rank list submissions. I understand that it might mean nothing, but is there a chance it might hurt my chances? Will the program director feel like my mentor or I are trying to twist his arm?
    This place is my #1 by far - I love it so much there, but it's probably a reach for me. I don't look great on paper. At the interview, I found out the program director was actually a big fan of this mentor's writing, so I thought maybe he'd fan-girl a bit to get a personal phone call... but then I think I'm a jerk for thinking that. Can this be over already?
     
  9. gutonc

    gutonc No Meat, No Treat SDN Administrator 10+ Year Member

    You don't really have much to lose from this.

    Is it a bit manipulative? Possibly...but whatever.

    Unlikely to harm you.
     
    hallowmann likes this.
  10. cardioqueen

    cardioqueen

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    US IMG, w/ Step 1 208, Passed CS first time, California resident, looking to apply to family med or IM, w/ future goal of primary care.

    I apologize if I repeated any questions, but I looked through forum trying to avoid a repeat question. I am hoping I didn't. Thank you in advance.

    1. Does ERAS show two Step 2CK transcripts (one failed, one passed)?
    2. Is there a filter for those who have failed Step 2ck?
    3. Should I explain a failed Step 2Ck in a personal statement or somewhere in my application?
    4. Is it recommended to take Step 3 before residency since I have one failed attempt for Step 2CK?
    5. I have option of graduating from my school on April 2017 vs November 2017, is it better to apply in ERAS as a medical student vs grad?
    6. Any other recommendations for someone who failed Step 2 ck? I've developed a test phobia for this test and want to do really well before i retake.
     
  11. Bancrofti

    Bancrofti 5+ Year Member

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    Dumb question, but are those papers we're supposed to sign and give back on interview days actually important? I have a couple folders with the paper still inside, because I wasn't thinking about it when I was at the interview. I feel like it's a formality for the programs, but in these next 2 weeks of freaking out on a daily basis and rehashing what I might have screwed up to not make me match, I just want to make sure they aren't something truly important that they won't rank you without.
     
  12. mcl

    mcl 7+ Year Member

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    1. Yes
    2. Programs can design any filter they want
    3. Up to you. An explanation may sway some programs but work against you at others. If you do address it in your personal statement, try to make the explanation not sound like an excuse. If you had a leave of absence related the the CK failure, you could also address it in that section.
    4. From what I understand, you aren't likely to do as well on Step 3 before residency, and the score would matter more if you are trying to offset the CK failure.
    5. It's better to apply as a medical student so defer graduation if you can.
    6. Apply broadly, find a mentor/adviser who can help you craft your application and who would be willing to make some calls on your behalf to secure interview invitations, and stay involved clinically.
     
    cardioqueen likes this.
  13. mcl

    mcl 7+ Year Member

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    They are only important if you match, and then only if you wanted to challenge something in your contract, so don't worry about it affecting your ranking. I doubt my PD even knows that there is a form for the applicants to sign (it's really my department's business manager who cares deeply about those forms). However, if you liked those programs, returning the form would be a way to touch base with them and show interest. You could scan the signed document and attach it to an email.
     
    Bancrofti likes this.
  14. IMPD

    IMPD 2+ Year Member

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    H1B is a fascinating visa for medicine residency. Probably not what it was intended for and is varibaly offered by programs. As a PD who does NOT offer the H1B for Residency, I don't have to worry about this one.

    J1 visas for immigrant physicians constitute ~50% of trainees in the USA. That's 3000 positions annually. I would have said before that it is inconceivable that this program would be affected in a broad manner (aside from the 7 countries). I would not say that anymore, mainly because I don't think that the consequences of any of these policies has been well thought out. I do think that the general "deterrent" effect has been the main goal and that goal has been achieved. Mission accomplished.

    I gave a talk for 3 months about not changing people's ranks based on their visa status. I have a small number of students from the affected countries. I certified my list last week with them on it. It's a stubborn decision and not entirely rational. I have other visa-needing applicants on my list as well. If the whole J1 program gets thrown into doubt, I will be only one of scores of programs across the country in trouble. There is no back-up plan for that situation.
     
  15. aProgDirector

    aProgDirector Pastafarians Unite! SDN Advisor SDN Moderator 10+ Year Member

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    Interestingly, my answers are somewhat different from @mcl.

    1. Sort of. Yes, your official USMLE transcript will show all attempts and all scores, so it's all there for review. But, when I create "filters" for applicants, I can only filter based upon your last score. So if you fail, and then pass, and I run a filter for "fail", your application will not show up. When I pull your app up for review I'll see an indication that there was a USMLE issue, and then I need to look at the report for the details.

    2. See #1. If your most recent score is fail, then yes. If you fail and then pass, then no.

    3. This is controversial, I agree with mcl. You failed because you got too many questions wrong. That's really the only "explanation". So, if you're going to talk about it, the key is to try to explain why it won't happen again. But it's a balancing act between making excuses and convincing me the problem is fixed.

    4. If you did really well on S3, then sure it would be a big boost. But let's be serious here -- you didn't do all that well on S1, and then failed S2. S3 covers material that tends to be learned as an intern. Your chances of doing well on it as a medical student don't seem good. Just barely passing it won't help at all. Failing it will definitely hurt you. It's a huge risk with little chance of upside.

    5. This is also controversial. The NRMP data shows that current students do better than prior grads. But this is highly biased/skewed -- previous grads usually are applying a second (or more) time, hence have something in their app that caused them to not match the first time, so it's not a surprise that they have more trouble matching. If the gap from medical school to residency is too long, then PD's make become concerned that your skills have atrophied. But graduating early can have some (rare) benefits -- if a program has an off cycle spot open (i.e. they need an intern now), they might offer you a spot to start early. So, my overall sense is that this probably doesn't matter, and what matters is why you're applying as a prior grad (i.e. if you're actually graduating later than usual because of your CK failure, that will be a problem).

    6. Agreed with above. And try to figure out how to "study smarter". Taking exams is forever in your future -- you want to find a way so that you pass them without worries and anxiety.
     
    cardioqueen and IMPD like this.
  16. cardioqueen

    cardioqueen

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    Thank you very much, your responses were very helpful. (@mcl as well)

    Is "I rushed to take the exam, even though I did not feel ready, to submit my applications for the 2017 match" a good response to "why did you fail?" It may seem like an excuse, but it's my truth.

    Also, my school provides graduation dates for end of March, April and November. I wanted to take a month off for dedicated step 2 ck studying, since I did not do this last time. I would finish my rotations end of May vs end of April, hence pushing me towards an official graduation of Nov 2017. I would still be ECFMG certified when applying for 2018 match. Does that make any difference?
     
  17. checkmed

    checkmed 7+ Year Member

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    What happens to those in pre match programs as well as applicants who matched with them and already signed to contract, if the signed are from countries with visa issues? Would programs reconsider their offers/ contracts?
     
  18. gutonc

    gutonc No Meat, No Treat SDN Administrator 10+ Year Member

    If you can't get a visa, you have violated your contract and it will be null and void. They may wait for you...but I suspect that any program that pre-matches doesn't give 2 s***s about who shows up as long as they can work.
     
    ThoracicGuy likes this.
  19. aProgDirector

    aProgDirector Pastafarians Unite! SDN Advisor SDN Moderator 10+ Year Member

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    I would have worded it a bit differently, but the gist is the same.

    Your match/contract requires that you be able to begin work by a certain date, usually July 1. If you can't start work on that date, whether under your control or not, then you have not met the requirements of your contract and it is no longer valid, and I can petition the NRMP for a waiver if needed. Reasons for not starting on July 1 might include: inability to get a license, failing a drug test, inability to get a visa, not completing orientation / on boarding materials, etc. I can then decide to delay your start, or hire someone new.
     
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  20. IMPD

    IMPD 2+ Year Member

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    In my time, I've had students with visa problems, students get clinically depressed and be unable to work and students break a leg while skiing. I've delayed the starts successfully, though painfully. One student was delayed, was still not ready and eventually we got a waiver for his Match. We kept in touch in the hope that his disease would improve, but it didn't. Still not doing clinical medicine as far as I know.
     
  21. rottenapple1

    rottenapple1

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    US IMG, 3 attempts on CS, first pass on the others. I am graduating in May and pondering the best way to move forward for the 2018 match. My options for the gap time are:
    1. doing burn research with a surgeon at a hospital affiliated with a residency program- they actually offered me an interview despite my first failed CS attempt but I unfortunately let that slipped
    2. working in a private neurology clinic, seeing patients under supervision and helping with clinical trials - I would love to not have a year away from clinical medicine but the networking from this option maybe limited

    I am planning to apply to FM and IM and would appreciate guidance as to which option would be better for my application. Thank you in advance!
     
  22. byaaaaaaah23

    byaaaaaaah23 SDN Gold Donor Gold Donor 5+ Year Member

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    Does anyone have any idea why ROL deadline (and by extension match day) has to be so late? Would be great if everything were moved up a month or so.. feel like i've just been sitting around since beginning of feb.
     
  23. bintal

    bintal

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    Hi there, thank you for answering all of these questions. I'm hoping you can help me with mine, and I apologize that it's so longwinded! I'm a U.S. IMG, graduating from a UK school, and interviewed at 13 internal medicine programs this season. My Step 1 and 2 scores are 240s and 250s, respectively, and passed CS on first attempt.Thankfully, I've received positive feedback and even some written cards post-interview from programs this season. My question pertains to the ECFMG status report vs. USMLE transcript. My step 1 and step 2ck scores were released prior to ERAS applications, so they were uploaded immediately, but my step 2 cs score was released in late November. Unfortunately, I wasn't aware that I was supposed to manually transmit my step 2 cs score once it was released (kicking myself now for my incompetence), so that it could be seen on my usmle transcript in time for match. However, my updated ECFMG status report was uploaded to ERAS immediately after my step 2 cs score was released in November, and as far as I have read, the ECFMG status report contains the pass dates for every step exam taken, including CS.

    Fast forward to the Friday before ROL deadline, and I received a group email from one program coordinator (bless her heart for alerting me to this) asking all of us to update our step 2 cs scores and ecfmg status. It was at this point that I read and realized that I needed to manually transmit my step 2cs score to ERAS, which I then did. The problem is, it was so close to ROL deadline (the weekend before), and I'm worried that the other programs may not have received my step 2 cs info in time. I never heard from any other program that anything was missing, but of course, this was my responsibility to ensure. I even called and emailed several programs to make sure everything was received in time before ROL deadline, but of the half that replied, all they could tell me was that they had my updated information at that time.

    My questions are--is this mistake of mine enough to keep me off an ROL or bump me to the bottom? Would a program have looked at my ECFMG status report, seen that I'd passed step 2cs prior to the ROL deadline, and been satsifed with that? Or would it have been a dealbreaker since it wasn't on my USMLE transcript? And would a program have reached out to me if something important was missing, or do they simply not have the time for that? I apologize again for the long winded and somewhat neurotic post, I'm just really hoping that all of my hard work has not been jeopardized by a very stupid mistake on my part. Thank you!
     
  24. mcl

    mcl 7+ Year Member

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    Those questions aren't really possible to answer, but I think the greatest likelihood is that programs looked at your status report or contacted you if CS was critical to their ranking. Put this is in the category of things to let go of since you can't change what happened, and try to enjoy the next few weeks. I hope you get good news on Match Day!
     
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  25. bintal

    bintal

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    Thanks so much for your kind response, mcl, I really appreciate everything you guys do, and I'll try my best to take your advice :). If I may ask one more question, just because we can't see things from your end--is it safe to assume that most programs would have seen my ECFMG status report prior to ranking, with the date that I passed CS? In other words, is it something that is visible and routinely checked before ranking IMGs like myself? Thanks and best wishes!
     
  26. kgup5196

    kgup5196 2+ Year Member

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    Thank you for starting this great thread. I'm a non-US IMG with an average resume, ready to apply for this year. I've been looking around for observerships/volunteering/ any chance to familiarize myself with potential programs, but have gotten no where. There are several medical centres near my place in NY and I've tried getting in touch with the PCs to ask for any oppurtunites, but I understand how busy PCs are and its not possible to reply to non priority mails. The only thing I haven't tried is walking up to a medical centre and meeting the PC/PD without an appointment. Is there anything I can do while just waiting around in the country?
     
  27. PDTY

    PDTY

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    One back door would be to call or email the medical student coordinators for the hospital, not the program. Email is usually the best way to start
     
    purpleortholady likes this.
  28. kgup5196

    kgup5196 2+ Year Member

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    Thank you for that quick reply. That's a good idea. I'm trying not to bother PCs as "tis the season" and they are terribly busy. At the same time, I genuinely want to learn how to be better at my job and make the most of being close to so many centres.
     
  29. aProgDirector

    aProgDirector Pastafarians Unite! SDN Advisor SDN Moderator 10+ Year Member

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    I am getting the sense from your post that you have already graduated from med school. If so, you'll find it very difficult to get clinical experience. If you're not a medical student, the med student coordinator is not going to be able to help you. PD/PC's are also unlikely to be able to help -- you won't be able to be credentialed. Often, the best you can do is find a community doc who is willing to have you shadow. Getting an EMT license is another option (and then working as an EMT).
     
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  30. rokshana

    rokshana Member 10+ Year Member

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    no...that shows poor judgement on your part...would make me ask where else would you show poor judgement? or have you fixed that?

    if you don't have a way to show that the mistake you made that led you to fail a step, has been recitfied and won't happen again, then don't mention it...but you may want to work on a way to spin this if asked about this.
     
  31. Obee187

    Obee187

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    Hi everyone,
    This year USCIS suspended premium fee facility. If we match in a H1b sponsored programme, Would it be wise to opt J1 instead of H1?
     
  32. Random-IMG

    Random-IMG

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    I think I'll take J1 instead yeah :(
     
  33. Obee187

    Obee187

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    Can't programme expedite our petition?
     
  34. Random-IMG

    Random-IMG

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    This I don't know.

    Many hospitals are considered non-profit so I'll ask the coordinator in the program if I match to H1 program to ask their lawyer if it's possible to expedite the process for doctors since we start in July not October like most other H1b workers.

    Otherwise I don't think I'll risk applying to H1b and delaying the start of residency or the program cancelling me for delayed visa.

    J1s are usually issued in a week.

    J1 in a week vs H1b at least 2 months.

    I think the decision is easy for me.

    I can't handle more anxiety post match.

    I need to relax and have some fun before residency.
     
  35. Obee187

    Obee187

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    True that and thank you..
     
  36. Bancrofti

    Bancrofti 5+ Year Member

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    I still had an interview in early February, as did a few of the people I know going in to the same field.
     
  37. byaaaaaaah23

    byaaaaaaah23 SDN Gold Donor Gold Donor 5+ Year Member

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    So did I, just seems like there is no reason for that at all. Would be very easy for the NRMP to make programs move up their timelines.
     
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  38. studyaholic

    studyaholic 5+ Year Member

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    Dear experienced members,

    Is there any correlation in turning in your ROL on the last day versus turning it in the first day it was available? I'm stressing out since I turned in my ROL on Feb 22.
    Perhaps I'm over analyzing the NRMP match algorithm. My apologies if this was already asked, as I cannot find it any of the forums.

    I wish everyone good luck on the match, and the coordinators/directors good luck for your incoming class :)
     
  39. byaaaaaaah23

    byaaaaaaah23 SDN Gold Donor Gold Donor 5+ Year Member

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    Correlation with what? Not matching? There's no difference, it will go down all the certified rank lists the same way regardless of when they were submitted.
     
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  40. gutonc

    gutonc No Meat, No Treat SDN Administrator 10+ Year Member

    You're not really overanalyzing it as much as completely not understanding the process.

    The algorithm gets run "once" after the ROL deadline. Not before.

    So as long as you got your ROL certified by the deadline, the algorithm considers you.
     
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  41. studyaholic

    studyaholic 5+ Year Member

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    Thank you so much for the clarification. Basically, it's like our applications...they were all time stamped the same time regardless of what span you submitted your application prior to MyERAS Sep application submission start date.

    I think the saying is right...an empty mind is a devil's playground...I'm just making worse case scenarios in my mind. By the way, thank goodness this is anonymous! I sound ridiculous right now.
     
  42. mvenus929

    mvenus929 10+ Year Member

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    MDApps:
    What we're saying is that it doesn't matter... you are either certified or not when the deadline happens. You can't submit after the deadline, so it's pretty different from the applications.
     
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  43. VCorp

    VCorp 2+ Year Member

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    What're the requirements for a J1 Visa? How can you choose to be either J1 or H1B?
     
  44. Martasvilla

    Martasvilla

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    Question regarding my Background check for State Board Licensure.

    I got a ticket 12 years ago. I'm not sure of the specific charge. However, I remember going to court, and getting a "Deferred adjudication." Before Submitting my ERAS application I called the county clerk and asked to see my record. Neither the County clerk, nor the Sherrif's office had any records of my ticket and reassured me that I have "nothing on my record." So, I left it off my ERAS.

    Do I need to include this ticket on my State Medical Board License application?
    @gutonc @aProgDirector @mcl
     
  45. ThoracicGuy

    ThoracicGuy 2+ Year Member

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    No.
     
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  46. killerleaf

    killerleaf beware, beyond there be dragons 10+ Year Member

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    dazed and confused
    Yes. If there is a trace, it will be found. Then you get into trouble for not disclosing.
     
  47. nidusiamnot

    nidusiamnot 2+ Year Member

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    Here are my stats:
    • US-IMG who graduated in 2016
    • Step 1 242 taken 2nd yr
    • Step 2 CK 229 taken 4th yr
    • Step 2 CS pass on 2nd attempt taken after graduation
    • 3 US LORs
    • 3 months USCE
    My attempt on the CS has torpedoed my application. I'm currently studying for the Step 3 and working in IM research. I plan to apply to the upcoming match for the first time with IM as my sole focus. IM has been my passion from the very beginning. Students who have similar stats and years out of school are matching primarily to Family Medicine.

    My questions are:
    1. Am I correct to assume that there is no point in explaining why I failed CS in my PS? It was a fluke from my perspective but the damage is done.
    2. On the basis of my stats, can I expect any interviews from IM if I apply widely?
    3. Is it a bad idea to apply only to IM and not consider FM?
    4. Is there anything I can do between now and September to strengthen my application?
    Thank you for reading.

    @aProgDirector, @gutonc, @rokshana, @ThoracicGuy, @mcl
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  48. TheMikesLife

    TheMikesLife

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    Hi! Thanks for doing this.

    Just out of curiosity, if I am an IMG, I went for a surgery clinical elective rotation in the USA (UC system) and I was struggling at first but worked very hard. I believe I earned the respect of the attending and the program director, I want to apply for residency next year, they know about this and got 4 letters of recommendations including letter from the program director herself.

    However, I want rank their Internal medicine program highly, and not the surgery program. IF the program director from the surgery elective "push" for me internally what are my chances of getting an interview/matched to their internal med program? does it significantly higher my chances? The staff, director gave some clues/hints that made me feel they will push for me internally.
     

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