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StartingoverVet said:
She was defending the mason earlier in the game as being unlikely to be a wolf for some reason (which I forgot) even though she was suspcious of her earlier ( i posted about this earlier).

This means that 1) Jilary isn't the Mason IMO since she would never have been suspicious ofher and 2) she isn't likely a wolf, because why would she randomly defend someone at that point. Wouldn't give you much brownie points...

Just seems very villagery to me. No one else has much I can count on as a villager.
Click to expand...

I'm not following the reasoning. Wolves can be suspicious of someone, then flop and defend them. So not sure I agree here.
 
1doggeek said:
I will probably be voting for LoTF unless she comes around and has something substantial to say... I'm feeling most suspicious of her at the moment. I should be able to be around at lynch close, however, so I'll hold off for plurality reasons. In case someone else can't!
Click to expand...
another one of those throwing suspicion on lotf but not in the final vote tally. a bit sketch.
we have seen this a lot in this game though. not sure why.
 
StartingoverVet said:
really in a 7-6 (or whatever the count), that is not a throw away, she is getting lynched anyway vote.

If it was a 2 or 3 vote lead, sure, but when it is only 1 vote away you know your vote is counting. If you are a wolf you would be pretty reluctant to seal the fate of a fellow wolf if you didn't have to at that point. A throw away vote on another person would be wolfy, a reluctance to vote at all would be very wolfy. Putting the nail in the coffin, very un-wolfy... and i said it before. Anyway.. water under the bridge now.

A wolf could very easily hop on the LOTF train because it seemed safe, y'all were jumping on her it seemed.
Click to expand...

It was not much before lynch closed and it was obvious AB was getting lynched anyway at that point. A vote to tie would have been worse. But instead of voting her voiced suspicions she did a throw away vote on the lead. I've caught wolves that way before. It is something I look for.

Kind of similar to Teep's vote on hayley that I mentioned yesterday.

And to say we were jumping on her is a bit absurd, she had 4 votes which wasn't even a majority. And she's been suspicious since day 1, it was hardly a poor vote.
 
DVMDream said:
It isn't odd. It looked like a last minute, "well she's getting lynched anyway so I might as well vote for her too".
Click to expand...
that is how I view your vote yesterday. Not wolfy, not villagery, just voting cause lotf was getting lynched anyway. I draw no conclusion from it.

the third vote though.. that was piling on and probably the nail in the coffin at that point in the game. since it was a villager, it tells me nothing though about the 3rd vote, but if we got a wolf, i would think they were more likely villager at this point in the game.
 
StartingoverVet said:
another one of those throwing suspicion on lotf but not in the final vote tally. a bit sketch.
we have seen this a lot in this game though. not sure why.
Click to expand...

Lynch closed a little early, which is why I don't have a vote on the final tally. I checked in a few minutes before 9 my time and it was closed already - as I said in my post, I could be around close to lynch close, so I wanted to hold off on voting since other people couldn't.
 
If we're going to start digging into all run away votes, we have hayley, AM, LIS and I'm sure others to look at.

This is why I find you suspicious, you play Monday morning quarterback on single events that play to your perceived ideas but ignore your own shortcomings, such as the LIS lynch.
 
StartingoverVet said:
that is how I view your vote yesterday. Not wolfy, not villagery, just voting cause lotf was getting lynched anyway. I draw no conclusion from it.

the third vote though.. that was piling on and probably the nail in the coffin at that point in the game. since it was a villager, it tells me nothing though about the 3rd vote, but if we got a wolf, i would think they were more likely villager at this point in the game.
Click to expand...

I had voiced my suspicion of her very early before she really had any votes. I only held off because of the number of votes that came in, didn't want a plurality and I mentioned that. My vote was going to go that way from the beginning but I held off to allow for more discussion. That isn't the case with LoTF's vote on AB. But perhaps it is more fresh in my mind because I just read through it yesterday.
 
DVMDream said:
If we're going to start digging into all run away votes, we have hayley, AM, LIS and I'm sure others to look at.

This is why I find you suspicious, you play Monday morning quarterback on single events that play to your perceived ideas but ignore your own shortcomings, such as the LIS lynch.
Click to expand...
i am reading the votes of important events. The lynch of a wolf is relevant. The lynch of a villager is common, especially early in a game.

So I was wrong about LIS? So were a lot of people. I give you credit for defending him and that's it.
Everyone has had some wrong suspicions. But it is a bit different accidentally lynching a villager in the middle of the game and the end of game. And there are fewer votes now.

SMH.
 
And LIS was a plain vanilla villager. Why would I, as a wolf, even care if he was lynched or not. I would certainly not go out of my way in any fashion to get a nobody lynched. Your suspicions of me make no sense. Which is of course suspicious to me.
 
StartingoverVet said:
i am reading the votes of important events. The lynch of a wolf is relevant. The lynch of a villager is common, especially early in a game.

So I was wrong about LIS? So were a lot of people. I give you credit for defending him and that's it.
Everyone has had some wrong suspicions. But it is a bit different accidentally lynching a villager in the middle of the game and the end of game. And there are fewer votes now.

SMH.
Click to expand...

The lynch of a villager in this game is going to be common basically most of the way through. I don't consider yesterday's lynch "end game", but that's a difference of opinion. But to come on here and claim that someone getting lynched with 4 votes was a "pile on" when there were 10 players and that lynched person has been suspicious since day 1,is really no different than me saying the LIS lynch was a pile on and we should further investigate that lynch.

And we've only lynched 2 wolves, one of which WTF gave us info on, the other we barely lynched.
 
StartingoverVet said:
And LIS was a plain vanilla villager. Why would I, as a wolf, even care if he was lynched or not. I would certainly not go out of my way in any fashion to get a nobody lynched. Your suspicions of me make no sense. Which is of course suspicious to me.
Click to expand...

Umm, at least 90% of villagers are vanilla, why would that matter? The wolf seer is dead, not like the wolves are going to know who is vanilla vs who isn't.
 
StartingoverVet said:
And LIS was a plain vanilla villager. Why would I, as a wolf, even care if he was lynched or not. I would certainly not go out of my way in any fashion to get a nobody lynched. Your suspicions of me make no sense. Which is of course suspicious to me.
Click to expand...

Your current suspicions make no sense if you really do find the lynch of a wolf relevant. Perhaps you should reread the AB lynch since it is really the only wolf lynch we can get info from.
 
StartingoverVet said:
I wanna recall who lynched LOTF. I still think discounting her vote in the AB wolf lynch is odd.
Click to expand...

My vote in AB lynch was the actual vote that pushed it to AB... Sure, LoTF vote could also be seen as helpful to seal the deal... But I'm confused how you think that made her super villager-Y but not me (since you listed me on your equally-as-wolfy list). Earlier game you said you didn't think either of us was a wolf based on that vote.
 
StartingoverVet said:
And LIS was a plain vanilla villager. Why would I, as a wolf, even care if he was lynched or not. I would certainly not go out of my way in any fashion to get a nobody lynched. Your suspicions of me make no sense. Which is of course suspicious to me.
Click to expand...

I feel like it might be more suspicious if anyone was gung ho about lynching a villager that ended up having a role. Lynching a vanillager isn't nearly as big of an oops and would be more easily forgiven, IMO.
 
1doggeek said:
My vote in AB lynch was the actual vote that pushed it to AB... Sure, LoTF vote could also be seen as helpful to seal the deal... But I'm confused how you think that made her super villager-Y but not me (since you listed me on your equally-as-wolfy list). Earlier game you said you didn't think either of us was a wolf based on that vote.
Click to expand...
That is what I said at first, but then everyone pointed out that you were #2, so you were just voting to preserve your life. No brownie points for saving your butt by voting for the "other guy". Doesn't mean you are a wolf or a villager....

See, DVMD, people pointed out I was wrong, and I conceded the point and moved on. So I do not ignore what is inconvenient. I evaluate as i go.
 
1doggeek said:
My vote in AB lynch was the actual vote that pushed it to AB... Sure, LoTF vote could also be seen as helpful to seal the deal... But I'm confused how you think that made her super villager-Y but not me (since you listed me on your equally-as-wolfy list). Earlier game you said you didn't think either of us was a wolf based on that vote.
Click to expand...

Well, you were second for that lynch, so your vote to AB was more of a life-saving vote for yourself. So we can't know if we should be giving you kudos for that or not until we know if you are a wolf or a villager. And we can't know if you are a wolf or a villager until you are lynched, you die, or the game ends.

So that is more of the reason why I can't really assign your particular vote as villagery or wolfy

We will have to see if SOV agrees with this assessment or not. However, it appears I needed to look back at the AB lynch as well because I think teep was among those first few votes on AB, so I may need to reconsidering my vote.

For now, Unlynch Teep

I am going to back an read some of kaydubs old posts, maybe I can get some information from them
 
StartingoverVet said:
That is what I said at first, but then everyone pointed out that you were #2, so you were just voting to preserve your life. No brownie points for saving your butt by voting for the "other guy". Doesn't mean you are a wolf or a villager....

See, DVMD, people pointed out I was wrong, and I conceded the point and moved on. So I do not ignore what is inconvenient. I evaluate as i go.
Click to expand...

And he agreed! And ninja'd me...
 
DVMDream said:
Your current suspicions make no sense if you really do find the lynch of a wolf relevant. Perhaps you should reread the AB lynch since it is really the only wolf lynch we can get info from.
Click to expand...
You are completely mis-understanding me, so I am reluctant to continue this.

I am lynching Zen for the reasons I gave yesterday. That he voted to lynch a villager this late in the game is just gravy.

And you are continuing to find anything to be suspicious of me, like yesterday when you said I have been quiet since the LIS lynch when I have probably posted a lot more than you since then(especially yesterday you ignored all my posts, and the previous cycle I broke my butt to post even while having to work to 14 hour days without a break...).
 
DVMDream said:
Well, you were second for that lynch, so your vote to AB was more of a life-saving vote for yourself. So we can't know if we should be giving you kudos for that or not until we know if you are a wolf or a villager. And we can't know if you are a wolf or a villager until you are lynched, you die, or the game ends.

So that is more of the reason why I can't really assign your particular vote as villagery or wolfy

We will have to see if SOV agrees with this assessment or not. However, it appears I needed to look back at the AB lynch as well because I think teep was among those first few votes on AB, so I may need to reconsidering my vote.

For now, Unlynch Teep

I am going to back an read some of kaydubs old posts, maybe I can get some information from them
Click to expand...
yes i agree with that... and I either said I agreed with this early (or something like this makes sense, or whatever), and clearly never defended 1dogg again because of that.
 
DVMDream said:
Umm, at least 90% of villagers are vanilla, why would that matter? The wolf seer is dead, not like the wolves are going to know who is vanilla vs who isn't.
Click to expand...
when does a wolf go out of their way to lynch a random villager? What do they gain by being insistent and wrong? Nothing. Ever. They just look suspicious. And here we are. Wolves plant seeds and step away mostly. Or get pushy when it is particularly important, not against a villager in a game where most everyone is vanilla.

Is that not easy to understand?
 
DVMDream said:
The lynch of a villager in this game is going to be common basically most of the way through. I don't consider yesterday's lynch "end game", but that's a difference of opinion. But to come on here and claim that someone getting lynched with 4 votes was a "pile on" when there were 10 players and that lynched person has been suspicious since day 1,is really no different than me saying the LIS lynch was a pile on and we should further investigate that lynch.
Click to expand...
Again you are misconstruing me. I don't understand your analysis of everything i say.

I was drawing an analogy with yesterday's vote, to show you why I would consider your vote at the end, just a pile on, vs the LOTF vote which was not. And then went on to say that since it was a villager who was lynched it was all meaningless.

I was not accusing you of anything. I said it was meaningless. Are you just taking offense for the hell of it? or trying to make me seem what I am not?

Really? It appears you have pre-judged me and view everything through some skewed view.

Even MrsSOV doesn't mis-understand me this much.
 
StartingoverVet said:
You are completely mis-understanding me, so I am reluctant to continue this.

I am lynching Zen for the reasons I gave yesterday. That he voted to lynch a villager this late in the game is just gravy.

And you are continuing to find anything to be suspicious of me, like yesterday when you said I have been quiet since the LIS lynch when I have probably posted a lot more than you since then(especially yesterday you ignored all my posts, and the previous cycle I broke my butt to post even while having to work to 14 hour days without a break...).
Click to expand...

I said you have been quieter since the LIS lynch, which is true. I have not been ignoring your posts, there just haven't been as many. Whether it is because you are busy or something else, I can't determine. Heck, I even stated yesterday during my analysis that quieter can just mean became busy with other life stuffs. Heck, I was quieter the last few days because I was basically the solo vet working appointments for a few days in a row. I didn't have time to check in and mentioned it a few times.

But becoming quieter can imply wolfiness too, even in myself. It is when you get back when you have a chance and your post count goes back up that my suspicion drops some.


Now, I am more suspicious because you say you only look at relevant lynches.... which would include the AB lynch, but your suspicion list includes basically every player that voted for AB. Not every person that voted AB can be or is a wolf.
 
DVMDream said:
I said you have been quieter since the LIS lynch, which is true. I have not been ignoring your posts, there just haven't been as many. Whether it is because you are busy or something else, I can't determine. Heck, I even stated yesterday during my analysis that quieter can just mean became busy with other life stuffs. Heck, I was quieter the last few days because I was basically the solo vet working appointments for a few days in a row. I didn't have time to check in and mentioned it a few times.

But becoming quieter can imply wolfiness too, even in myself. It is when you get back when you have a chance and your post count goes back up that my suspicion drops some.


Now, I am more suspicious because you say you only look at relevant lynches.... which would include the AB lynch, but your suspicion list includes basically every player that voted for AB. Not every person that voted AB can be or is a wolf.
Click to expand...
I wasn't quiet yesterday. I was probably the leading poster. Go back and check. And I wasn't posting a lot during the LIS lynch. Go back and check. It was a long freaking cycle, and I probably posted less than yesterday.

as for the specifics of the AB lynch. I have no idea who voted, I looked at it like a week ago. That is where my comments on LOTF came from (and I made them back then).

Our conversation is distracting at this point, and I will try to end it.
 
StartingoverVet said:
when does a wolf go out of their way to lynch a random villager? What do they gain by being insistent and wrong? Nothing. Ever. They just look suspicious. And here we are. Wolves plant seeds and step away mostly. Or get pushy when it is particularly important, not against a villager in a game where most everyone is vanilla.

Is that not easy to understand?
Click to expand...

I get what you are saying. Because I agree, a wolf gains nothing from being insistent and wrong. 100% agree. However...



Are you not putting everyone who voted LoTF on your suspicious list... for basically what you describe above??? I mean, if a wolf gains nothing from being insistent and wrong, then how is the entire group of people who were insistent on LoTF suddenly suspicious?
 
StartingoverVet said:
that is what i said.
Click to expand...

I thought you were saying that it wasn't suspicious to lead the lynch on a vanillager..? Because they're "just" a vanillager and wouldn't be worth leaping after.
I was saying I would be more suspicious of someone who really pushed to lynch someone who ended up being an important villager, not a vanillager.

If that's what you meant, great. Just not how I read it 😉
 
DVMDream said:
I get what you are saying. Because I agree, a wolf gains nothing from being insistent and wrong. 100% agree. However...



Are you not putting everyone who voted LoTF on your suspicious list... for basically what you describe above??? I mean, if a wolf gains nothing from being insistent and wrong, then how is the entire group of people who were insistent on LoTF suddenly suspicious?
Click to expand...
no. i made that comment after my list.

I have my #1 suspicion: zen.
I have 2 people i have reasons that make me think they are villagers.
And everyone else I said was equally suspicious. I.e. I have no particularly strong reason (imo) to think they are villager or wolf.
 
StartingoverVet said:
I wasn't quiet yesterday. I was probably the leading poster. Go back and check. And I wasn't posting a lot during the LIS lynch. Go back and check. It was a long freaking cycle, and I probably posted less than yesterday.

as for the specifics of the AB lynch. I have no idea who voted, I looked at it like a week ago. That is where my comments on LOTF came from (and I made them back then).

Our conversation is distracting at this point, and I will try to end it.
Click to expand...

I kind of feel like conversation during yesterday's lynch died at the end. I remember you posting at the beginning, but from the time I kind of got on, posted, and then took off to the casino, it just died. I don't recall many posts from you from about the time I started posting to lynch end, but I could be wrong would have to go check..


I will quote the AB lynch vote, because I do think it is relevant.


And I agree this is possibly getting a bit distracting, but sometimes these things to lead us to good conversation points and nail us a wolf. I don't want to continue if you are frustrated with it or others are getting distracted, but know that I am really trying to see your point of view and my questions are meant to be taken in any other way.
 
Might go and read the back and forth between DVMD and SOV later. I'm not seeing the Zen suspicions or the reasoning behind Jilary being a villager (because she defended a villager once? Huh?) but I have been wrong a lot this game (and ive been voting for her for like a week, maybe ots time to give up) so I'm going with my second choice today. If Jilary ends up being a wolf though, I'm going to cry.

Lynch bsc
 
Here is the AB lynch, because I do think it is relevant, it is really the only wolf vote we can obtain information from:

dyachei said:
Official lynch tally:
1dog 4 (BSC, genny, deva, teep)
ab 6 (PBC, dvmd, zen, mq, 1dog, lotf)
LIS 2 (BBC, jilary)
rocky 2 (wz, kdizzle)
BBC 2 (guis, rojo)
guis 2 (LIS, guis)

18/21 votes
6/21 minimums met
Click to expand...
 
DVMDream said:
I kind of feel like conversation during yesterday's lynch died at the end. I remember you posting at the beginning, but from the time I kind of got on, posted, and then took off to the casino, it just died. I don't recall many posts from you from about the time I started posting to lynch end, but I could be wrong would have to go check..


I will quote the AB lynch vote, because I do think it is relevant.


And I agree this is possibly getting a bit distracting, but sometimes these things to lead us to good conversation points and nail us a wolf. I don't want to continue if you are frustrated with it or others are getting distracted, but know that I am really trying to see your point of view and my questions are meant to be taken in any other way.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I don't post much in the evenings.... I spend time with my new kitty, MrsSOV, and the doggies (1 of whom is still recovering). So that is correct. I do almost all my posting during the day.
 
WildZoo said:
Might go and read the back and forth between DVMD and SOV later. I'm not seeing the Zen suspicions or the reasoning behind Jilary being a villager (because she defended a villager once? Huh?) but I have been wrong a lot this game (and ive been voting for her for like a week, maybe ots time to give up) so I'm going with my second choice today. If Jilary ends up being a wolf though, I'm going to cry.

Lynch bsc
Click to expand...
i think this is really wrong. Last person I would lynch.
 
On the point about "overlooking" LoTF's vote during the AB lynch, I'm sure any of us could find a reason for people playing that make them more likely to be a villager. Everyone is going to have their own opinion on if it's actually a village move or if it's a wolf move and rank them differently. I don't think anyone playing has such obvious villager brownie points saved up that it would make them a bad lynch candidate overall.
 
DVMDream said:
And I agree this is possibly getting a bit distracting, but sometimes these things to lead us to good conversation points and nail us a wolf. I don't want to continue if you are frustrated with it or others are getting distracted, but know that I am really trying to see your point of view and my questions are meant to be taken in any other way.
Click to expand...
As long as you feel that way... fine.
I am a bit grumpy today (yeah, surprise, surprise I know)... so could be just me.
 
StartingoverVet said:
As long as you feel that way... fine.
I am a bit grumpy today (yeah, surprise, surprise I know)... so could be just me.
Click to expand...

I am still be a bit grumpy after the car accident yesterday too, so probably just I am probably not helping either.

I am going to go watch a movie..... and come back later.
 
DVMDream said:
I am still be a bit grumpy after the car accident yesterday too, so probably just I am probably not helping either.

I am going to go watch a movie..... and come back later.
Click to expand...
Saw that. Happy you are ok. That is a bit crazy.
I had a guy pull out on the runway today when I was landing. barely had time to go around, and then he took off right next to me. I could see the color of his co-pilot's shirt. Wasn't too happy about that. And my students keep trying to kill me. Happily I only work 1/2 day on Sundays.

Enjoy the movie.
 
StartingoverVet said:
Saw that. Happy you are ok. That is a bit crazy.
I had a guy pull out on the runway today when I was landing. barely had time to go around, and then he took off right next to me. I could see the color of his co-pilot's shirt. Wasn't too happy about that. And my students keep trying to kill me. Happily I only work 1/2 day on Sundays.

.
Click to expand...

That's crazy... glad there was no collision. Tell the students to stop trying to kill you.... or they are going to quickly need to learn how to use a parachute.. 😉
 
WildZoo said:
Might go and read the back and forth between DVMD and SOV later. I'm not seeing the Zen suspicions or the reasoning behind Jilary being a villager (because she defended a villager once? Huh?) but I have been wrong a lot this game (and ive been voting for her for like a week, maybe ots time to give up) so I'm going with my second choice today. If Jilary ends up being a wolf though, I'm going to cry.

Lynch bsc
Click to expand...
I know you don't believe me rightg now, but, you won't be crying because of me this game.

dyachei said:
Official lynch tally:
1dog 4 (BSC, genny, deva, teep)
ab 6 (PBC, dvmd, zen, mq, 1dog, lotf)
LIS 2 (BBC, jilary)
rocky 2 (wz, kdizzle)
BBC 2 (guis, rojo)
guis 2 (LIS, guis)

18/21 votes
6/21 minimums met
Click to expand...
There is an error in the lynch vote DVMD quoted. It shows guis voting twice, once for herself! Looking back it looks like the second vote for guis should be SOV.

Corrected AB lynch tally:
1dog 4 (BSC, genny, deva, teep)
ab 6 (PBC, dvmd, zen, mq, 1dog, lotf)
LIS 2 (BBC, jilary)
rocky 2 (wz, kdizzle)
BBC 2 (guis, rojo)
guis 2 (LIS, SOV)
18 votes w/ 21 players
Non-voters: Rocky, AB, FB
 
So I thought I had two reasons for thinking Zen was a villager, so I just re-read all of her posts and I could only find the one point, and that was unlynching AM after the nearing plurality announcement was made. So I looked back at that lynch. I noticed two wolves piled on after the mod announcement (AB & KayDubs). I could definitely see Zen, who has been a wolf many times, seeing that and wanting to jump off that bandwagon so that there weren't so many wolves voting for a villager. She has definitely moved up on my suspicion list.

Rojo - Vigilante
1dog
Lotf
DVMD
guis
PBC - Mason
BBC
**Votes below made after mod announcement**
VMH - tracker
MQ - Mod killed villager
AB
LIS
KayDubs
FB - protector
 
Holy crap I just did a lot of reading. So DVMD and SOV have moved down on my list of feels. WZ is in the middle and Zen, Teep & 1dogg are the highest. This is 1doggs 3rd game and I feel posting has changed a lot from the beginning of the game until now. Maybe this game has just been very informative on how to play (it most certainly has been for me anyway) or maybe she has had some help from wolfy friends. Teep has been abnormally foot in mouth, could be wolfy, could be nothing.
 
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