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Day 3

When SDN glitches for so long that players forget they're playing....

May this be a lesson to NEVER WAFFLE FEST LIKE MAD 10 MINUTES BEFORE CLOSE AGAIN.

Dead by student assembly is @alissa14 - 2nd year student (vanillager).


It is now Night 3.
Night will close at 10am EDT (9am central/8am mountain/7am fantasy land) or sooner if PMs are sent expressly.


A note on PMs: You may chat with anyone in your group. As requested, include mods if you so choose.

11 players remain

PM Chat Groups:

Year 1:

@killerleaf
@vetmedhead
@Ms Procrastinator

Year 2:
@cubsrule4e
@Animal Midwife

Year 3:
@ddstothecor
@SARdoghandler
@Stagg737

Year 4:
@WildZoo
@Dinashadow
@genny


Expelled or Otherwise Removed
@katashark - 4th Year Student (vanillager)
@Barkley13 - The Student Who Asks Way Too Many Questions During Lecture (neutral)
@Cyndia - 4th Year Student (vanillager)
@FrostySparrow - 3rd Year Student (vanillager)
@Dr. ForgotToFlush - 1st Year Student (vanillager)
@alissa14 - 2nd Year Student (vanillager)


Spec
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~~~~**** Table of Contents ****~~~~​
 
FWIW regarding remaining players, MsP and dds are still useless for wolf hunting at this point. Killer also not bringing much to the table but reads like her typical play from what I remember. Dina, cubs, SAR, Genny in my village pile (roughly in that order). AM most likely village based on play. I already had Stagg lower in my list (along with alissa after the weird posting last night), and his play today has certainly been sketchy enough to earn my vote again tomorrow because beyond the confusing "strategy posts" today and trying to bus the **** out of me five minutes before vote close I really hadn't seen a lot out of him on thread beyond occasional posts about needing to read more to solidify thoughts and then not particularly following through.

I originally had dubz in my village pile, but very recent play has been less contributory than I feel like she typically is and gave me just the slightest amount of pause, so I'll be rethinking her a bit tonight. But "slightest amount of pause" has really moved her more into my "probably village" pile than my "maybe wolf" pile.

I would still be down to vote dds. I am curious why cubs is so gung ho about him though (@cubsrule4e ?)

I think it's clear at this point that just based on math there are at least a few people in my village pile who are wolves. Historically the players I have the hardest time reading are Genny/AM/dubz, but based purely on play they haven't been obviously pushing dumb lynches or avoiding lines of questioning that I would have pursued myself.
 
What's conflicting you?
Stagg has usually been kind of a shoot from the hip player and I can see a last minute reveal of seeing me interact with Dina because he got to the point of a down-to-the-wire role reveal and latched onto speculation that the two interactions with Dina seemed like w + v based on her interpretation of the wording. He mentioned not wanting to accidentally reveal a PR in some other post about Genny but I don't think thought through that in a game with so many vanillagers, anybody with a night action does in fact have potential to be a role of utility to the village.

On the other hand the caginess today, the last minute role revealing despite this being a great way for last minute village misvotes because of a scramble after somebody claims a PR down to the wire, and still not having a good explanation of the persistent reacts to various players beyond "trolling duh" makes me feel more wolfy there. Especially because trolling like that is frequently done to just one player or a few you're good friends with. The additional selection of players ranked mid to high on village piles (dubz, cubs, SAR) to do this to feels like something else is going on to me

I also found it strange because he didn't particularly push Genny or I today despite apparently being suspicious about both of us based on his watching. He mentioned repeatedly that he would have to "look more into us" but largely avoided any actual questioning of us (aside from arguing about grammar lol)
 
Well to keep things exciting we can discuss what happens if MsP flips wolf vs if she flips village (or purple 3p???). Like get a head start on tomorrow's discussions lol
By the way this is the dubz post that made me feel weird. I think it's just because I found it a little weird to not more ask for thoughts on other players we also currently find suspicious outside of MsP/who we would be voting for if she wasn't on the docket.
 
Stagg has usually been kind of a shoot from the hip player and I can see a last minute reveal of seeing me interact with Dina because he got to the point of a down-to-the-wire role reveal and latched onto speculation that the two interactions with Dina seemed like w + v based on her interpretation of the wording. He mentioned not wanting to accidentally reveal a PR in some other post about Genny but I don't think thought through that in a game with so many vanillagers, anybody with a night action does in fact have potential to be a role of utility to the village.

On the other hand the caginess today, the last minute role revealing despite this being a great way for last minute village misvotes because of a scramble after somebody claims a PR down to the wire, and still not having a good explanation of the persistent reacts to various players beyond "trolling duh" makes me feel more wolfy there. Especially because trolling like that is frequently done to just one player or a few you're good friends with. The additional selection of players ranked mid to high on village piles (dubz, cubs, SAR) to do this to feels like something else is going on to me

I also found it strange because he didn't particularly push Genny or I today despite apparently being suspicious about both of us based on his watching. He mentioned repeatedly that he would have to "look more into us" but largely avoided any actual questioning of us (aside from arguing about grammar lol)
Oh, and the other thing, which is that he tried to fling genny under the bus before he tried to fling me under. Felt more like a scramble to get attention on someone other than himself to give himself an extra day to use some kind of action
 
I’ll give more in depth responses in the am, but I’ll say that the progression of posts by Dina that led up to me saying VMH acted on Dina was shady af, and Unless Genny can give an actual vouch I’m fine with voting Dina tomorrow.

I already gave my actions and results but here they are again:

N1- watched Genny: I tried to watch her, but could not find her (was still mixing up tracker and watcher)
N2- watched Dina: I saw VMH visit her
N3-Stagg probably dies

After N2 I asked if I get results of what happens to them or also what they do and was told only what happens to them. I then asked what the deal with my Genny results were (is that what happens when no one visits or is it something else) and Kaydubs gave me an answer but deleted it before I could read it. She then said to just imagine what the results for each of those sitations would be, so I’m assuming something else happened.


I'm still trying to wrap my head around whether Stagg is a wolf or just made an incredibly poorly calculated decision tbh

SAR is pretty pissed in PMs, so here is my response to her:

“Yea, I realize that she’s (VMH) likely village now. But given info I had at the time and knowing I’m village it was the right move. As soon as I said I was a watcher, which was 20+ minutes before close, she should have known to switch her vote. Especially after I said I watched Dina N2. [to clarify, she should have known I saw her visit Dina]

All I knew was that VMH did something to Dina, not what. With Genny supposedly soft vouching for Dina and Dina saying that her other “watcher”/ whatever Wasn’t village,I can only assume that either Dina AND Genny are in a wolf team or at the very least one of them is non-village. Or far more likely that VMH is non-village. Which makes more sense?

Knowing that information, does it make more sense to let myself, a decent village PR go down, without telling thread that VMH is likely a non-village PR, or put that info out there so that we can now figure out who out of the three people I’ve mentioned are shady as balls?”
 
Oh, and the other thing, which is that he tried to fling genny under the bus before he tried to fling me under. Felt more like a scramble to get attention on someone other than himself to give himself an extra day to use some kind of action

No, it was a scramble to provide as much info as possible to village before I was potentially killed.
 
Stagg has usually been kind of a shoot from the hip player and I can see a last minute reveal of seeing me interact with Dina because he got to the point of a down-to-the-wire role reveal and latched onto speculation that the two interactions with Dina seemed like w + v based on her interpretation of the wording. He mentioned not wanting to accidentally reveal a PR in some other post about Genny but I don't think thought through that in a game with so many vanillagers, anybody with a night action does in fact have potential to be a role of utility to the village.

On the other hand the caginess today, the last minute role revealing despite this being a great way for last minute village misvotes because of a scramble after somebody claims a PR down to the wire, and still not having a good explanation of the persistent reacts to various players beyond "trolling duh" makes me feel more wolfy there. Especially because trolling like that is frequently done to just one player or a few you're good friends with. The additional selection of players ranked mid to high on village piles (dubz, cubs, SAR) to do this to feels like something else is going on to me

I also found it strange because he didn't particularly push Genny or I today despite apparently being suspicious about both of us based on his watching. He mentioned repeatedly that he would have to "look more into us" but largely avoided any actual questioning of us (aside from arguing about grammar lol)

The reacts started out as trolling, but later became a bit more strategic. Was going to watch Cubs on N2, but after the stuff with Dina and Genny late in the day changed my mind. Also was reacting to Genny today to gauge a reaction and was considering watching her tonight.

I didn’t push you or Genny because I wanted more info first. Genny is deputy mayor or whatever and I didn’t know if your actions on Dina were village or not and I didn’t want to out or push a PR vote. Believe it or not I’m not a total idiot even when I’ve barely got time to skim.
 
I’ll give more in depth responses in the am, but I’ll say that the progression of posts by Dina that led up to me saying VMH acted on Dina was shady af, and Unless Genny can give an actual vouch I’m fine with voting Dina tomorrow.

I already gave my actions and results but here they are again:

N1- watched Genny: I tried to watch her, but could not find her (was still mixing up tracker and watcher)
N2- watched Dina: I saw VMH visit her
N3-Stagg probably dies

After N2 I asked if I get results of what happens to them or also what they do and was told only what happens to them. I then asked what the deal with my Genny results were (is that what happens when no one visits or is it something else) and Kaydubs gave me an answer but deleted it before I could read it. She then said to just imagine what the results for each of those sitations would be, so I’m assuming something else happened.




SAR is pretty pissed in PMs, so here is my response to her:

“Yea, I realize that she’s (VMH) likely village now. But given info I had at the time and knowing I’m village it was the right move. As soon as I said I was a watcher, which was 20+ minutes before close, she should have known to switch her vote. Especially after I said I watched Dina N2. [to clarify, she should have known I saw her visit Dina]

All I knew was that VMH did something to Dina, not what. With Genny supposedly soft vouching for Dina and Dina saying that her other “watcher”/ whatever Wasn’t village,I can only assume that either Dina AND Genny are in a wolf team or at the very least one of them is non-village. Or far more likely that VMH is non-village. Which makes more sense?

Knowing that information, does it make more sense to let myself, a decent village PR go down, without telling thread that VMH is likely a non-village PR, or put that info out there so that we can now figure out who out of the three people I’ve mentioned are shady as balls?”
Why did you choose to watch Dina N2? That is what made you think she was likely to be interacted with that night?

I didn't remove my vote from you because just being a watcher doesn't tell me an affiliation and just a role reveal isn't going to make me back off you. I've been a wolf watcher twice. I did know you had likely seen me visit Dina. Between my suspicion that I was the one that had been tracked and knowing how easy it is to confuse tracking/watching roles I wanted to see how dina responded. Your decision to then reveal lots of "potentially damning" night results that you had never pursued at all before this point felt super wolfy to me, so yes, I never changed my vote
 
I don't understand how you pulled this out of your butt.

You were actuallyin my wolf leans pretty early on, but the stuff with Dina made me pause and rethink things. I want to do some re-reading and look at things with fresh eyes tomorrow, but I’ll be very surprised if you, VMH, and Dina are all village.
 
The reacts started out as trolling, but later became a bit more strategic. Was going to watch Cubs on N2, but after the stuff with Dina and Genny late in the day changed my mind. Also was reacting to Genny today to gauge a reaction and was considering watching her tonight.

I didn’t push you or Genny because I wanted more info first. Genny is deputy mayor or whatever and I didn’t know if your actions on Dina were village or not and I didn’t want to out or push a PR vote. Believe it or not I’m not a total idiot even when I’ve barely got time to skim.
So again, if you thought dina was suspicious then why watch her since you can only see who interacted with your target? Why were you suspicious she would be acted on?
 
Why did you choose to watch Dina N2? That is what made you think she was likely to be interacted with that night?

I didn't remove my vote from you because just being a watcher doesn't tell me an affiliation and just a role reveal isn't going to make me back off you. I've been a wolf watcher twice. I did know you had likely seen me visit Dina. Between my suspicion that I was the one that had been tracked and knowing how easy it is to confuse tracking/watching roles I wanted to see how dina responded. Your decision to then reveal lots of "potentially damning" night results that you had never pursued at all before this point felt super wolfy to me, so yes, I never changed my vote

I chose Dina because I thought I would see who she acted on. Again, confused the role and did not realize I’d be seeing her being acted on.

And MsP and Alissa have both been top candidates for quite a while and here comes a Stagg wagon at the end of Day 2. Yes, I would expect a role reveal to make you back off for at least one day to talk things through more, especially knowing I’d potentially out a village role. If I were a wolf the pack would already know you had a PR anyway, so why would I hold any results back on thread if I were going to reveal? It wouldn’t make sense.

Also, by staying on me, you were continuing to believe that even with the role reveal I was more Wolfe than MsP and Alissa? Your vote seemed opportunistic after AM switched to me, so I had no problem setting you solidly in non-village category once Dina said she felt like one of us was not village.

This raises another question though. @Animal Midwife , why didn’t you switch back to MsP once I role revealed. You’ve been pushing that vote hard for days now, I find it hard to believe that village AM would sit on me instead of switching to gather more info.
 
So again, if you thought dina was suspicious then why watch her since you can only see who interacted with your target? Why were you suspicious she would be acted on?

:bang: Because before Kaydubz clarified my role AFTER N2 I thought I would see who she acted on, not who acted on her. How many times do I need to say that?
 
I chose Dina because I thought I would see who she acted on. Again, confused the role and did not realize I’d be seeing her being acted on.

And MsP and Alissa have both been top candidates for quite a while and here comes a Stagg wagon at the end of Day 2. Yes, I would expect a role reveal to make you back off for at least one day to talk things through more, especially knowing I’d potentially out a village role. If I were a wolf the pack would already know you had a PR anyway, so why would I hold any results back on thread if I were going to reveal? It wouldn’t make sense.

Also, by staying on me, you were continuing to believe that even with the role reveal I was more Wolfe than MsP and Alissa? Your vote seemed opportunistic after AM switched to me, so I had no problem setting you solidly in non-village category once Dina said she felt like one of us was not village.

This raises another question though. @Animal Midwife , why didn’t you switch back to MsP once I role revealed. You’ve been pushing that vote hard for days now, I find it hard to believe that village AM would sit on me instead of switching to gather more info.
Because you failed to answer many of my questions. I put my hand out and you kept biting me. I don't info-vote, I info-ask, and you know this. Mechanics are dumb and always will be. I only care about content.
 
I’ll give more in depth responses in the am, but I’ll say that the progression of posts by Dina that led up to me saying VMH acted on Dina was shady af, and Unless Genny can give an actual vouch I’m fine with voting Dina tomorrow.

Yep so shady that I told everyone almost exactly what was in my PM, gave my thoughts on what I thought it meant and my reasoning, AND said that it wasn't clear cut but that's what my perception was. You're the one who outed VMH, not me. I would have loved to clarify more before vote ended but SDN was falling apart
 
You were actuallyin my wolf leans pretty early on, but the stuff with Dina made me pause and rethink things. I want to do some re-reading and look at things with fresh eyes tomorrow, but I’ll be very surprised if you, VMH, and Dina are all village.

This is impossible. I was mocked by Animal Midwife for it. Good luck escaping her wrath.
 
This is impossible. I was mocked by Animal Midwife for it. Good luck escaping her wrath.
That's not what you said at all. You said it's genny/Dina which was a highly unrealistic guess and I stand by that. If you truly believe this, you're either or wolf or would cost the game betting on it. They are plenty more realistic combinations out there.

Instead of complaining, you can push people for yourself instead of trying to block everything I say.
 
That's not what you said at all. You said it's genny/Dina which was a highly unrealistic guess and I stand by that. If you truly believe this, you're either or wolf or would cost the game betting on it. They are plenty more realistic combinations out there.

Instead of complaining, you can push people for yourself instead of trying to block everything I say.

I said genny/dina could be wolves out of the alissa trio and you mocked me with fury. That is me trying to push things for myself with you pushing back trying to silence me 💩
 
I said genny/dina could be wolves out of the alissa trio and you mocked me with fury. That is me trying to push things for myself with you pushing back trying to silence me 💩
If it's worth losing the game over, go for it. But I'm always going to call out pushes that don't help the game. Like there's no reason you should even think Dina is a wolf right now. I'm being blunt with you. Remember, for most of D2 you thought it was Cyndia/alissa/Dina before settling on alissa/Dina. Look at the whole picture.
 
Strange that I havent been offed yet. Youd think Genny would want to get her grubby little hands on my title by now if she were a wolf. And she did make that comment that death was coming for me at some point.
Wishful thinking on my part? How else can I get that promotion if the job is already filled?
 
If it's worth losing the game over, go for it. But I'm always going to call out pushes that don't help the game. Like there's no reason you should even think Dina is a wolf right now. I'm being blunt with you. Remember, for most of D2 you thought it was Cyndia/alissa/Dina before settling on alissa/Dina. Look at the whole picture.

Lol I cant lose the game by myself mislynching one person. Is that how you view all your village losses? It was everyone elses fault? You need to make a milk run, must be getting low. You never did actually address abandoning your days long MsP crusade and then turning around and voting with her and VMH who you also called suspect. Saved by the glitch.
 
Lol I cant lose the game by myself mislynching one person. Is that how you view all your village losses? It was everyone elses fault? You need to make a milk run, must be getting low. You never did actually address abandoning your days long MsP crusade and then turning around and voting with her and VMH who you also called suspect. Saved by the glitch.
You actually can do just that during endgame, which I suspect to be coming. And yes, if I give a correct read, try to encourage others to not vote off said read, and put a vote on the wolf, I'm not the one that made the game-losing move, am I? Sure, I lost but not due to anything I could actively prevent outside of free will/stubbornness.

I'm not going to address the MsP thing until you start reading my posts because it should be evident why I moved.
 
By the way this is the dubz post that made me feel weird. I think it's just because I found it a little weird to not more ask for thoughts on other players we also currently find suspicious outside of MsP/who we would be voting for if she wasn't on the docket.
The vote had been stagnant on MsP. I wasn't expecting much of a change, so that's why I phrased it that way, but it's the same information.
 
I originally had dubz in my village pile, but very recent play has been less contributory than I feel like she typically is
This is a NAI characteristic of busy dubz. Wednesday was my last day off, I have had very long days either in the lab or at work or both since then. I play differently when I don't have hours to sit here hounding people.
 
In any case I believe stagg, what with the #glitch and him not being a real yeet candidate until well into the day this feels more like village scrambling than wolf deception. He mentioned a day ago or whatever that he was waiting on mod clarification on something about Dina and unyeeted her after he got that clarification. So for me it pretty much adds up. And meats you have mentioned yourself multiple times that you have mixed up tracker and watcher before, granted you were a wolf but it happens to villagers too.

I wasn't kidding when I said that trying to figure out the game based on night action notifications would get us in trouble.
 
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