Dare you to reply!

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Moonbeams said:
He's just trying to troll someone into saying something, probably anything, about identity politics that he can spin as white supremacist and get the thread shut down. Nope.
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I get it, and I'm not trolling him. The overarching gist of this thread is not that diversity is unimportant, it's, "no ****, diversity is important."
 
Ray D. Ayshun said:
I get it, and I'm not trolling him. The overarching gist of this thread is not that diversity is unimportant, it's, "no ****, diversity is important."
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I'm not entirely sure about that. There are some dubious takes enclosed within. Trolling for more dubious takes is a.... choice, I guess.
 
Mandelin Rain said:
I'm not entirely sure about that. There are some dubious takes enclosed within. Trolling for more dubious takes is a.... choice, I guess.
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Gist, not everything. My take, and my posts however they're interpreted are meant to emphasize how boring the approach to solving this problem is. It's just righteous indignation.
 
Mandelin Rain said:
I'm not entirely sure about that. There are some dubious takes enclosed within. Trolling for more dubious takes is a.... choice, I guess.
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Plenty of dubious takes within.


It’s definitely not SDNs greatest work

Even simul would agree he wouldn’t want person X to read this thread alone and judge SDN by it, I would hope
 
RealSimulD said:
It's the equivalent of posting a racist joke and then calling out people that laugh at it.
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you're an absolute dope lol.

the thread is called DARE YOU TO REPLY and you're accusing ME of posting for being bombastic?

get a freaking grip dude.

Moderator note: Be civil with each other. You are welcome to disagree and discuss, but name calling and personal attacks are not permitted.
 
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jondunn said:
you're an absolute dope lol.

the thread is called DARE YOU TO REPLY and you're accusing ME of posting for being bombastic?

get a freaking grip dude.
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Out of everyone who posts here, you are the only one who posts or has posted Twitter links without further commentary. Doesn't that give you at least a little bit of pause?
 
OTN said:
Out of everyone who posts here, you are the only one who posts or has posted Twitter links without further commentary. Doesn't that give you at least a little bit of pause?
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okay - here is your commentary

'This story is interesting and demonstrates why representation in medicine can be so important to patients, despite many posters in this thread feeling that it should not matter at all. Please read if you have a second, which Im guessing you do as you're bored lurking on SDN'


the calls for 'commentary' are a farce.
 
RealSimulD said:
Interesting to move to a personal insult / attack. I've stayed kind and polite and professional. I wish you were able to do so.
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yep real polite. You have no self awareness.

Posts about the black experience are equated to posting a racist joke. Accused of using minorities as a tool

I urge you to read your posts.
 
First post was a clear story, did you click it?

Second post was a picture, yes.

I wish you wouldn’t play dumb
 
JD:
Grampa Simpson Meme GIF by MOODMAN
 
there's no article.

I'm done, I think you just enjoy arguing. I even gave you post numbers to reference.

enjoy your day.

'why would i click it'

so you don't read or look at it and just argue.


You made your name by arguing, that's your shtick, I get it.
 
Mandelin Rain said:
JD, come on man, you know you were baiting for a reaction. Just own it. Maybe you'll get a bite next time.
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I wanted to post a response to that second pic as I was very upset about the mask mandate these fascist ORs continue to enforce. KHE FOREVER!!!
 
jondunn said:
okay - here is your commentary

'This story is interesting and demonstrates why representation in medicine can be so important to patients, despite many posters in this thread feeling that it should not matter at all. Please read if you have a second, which Im guessing you do as you're bored lurking on SDN'


the calls for 'commentary' are a farce.
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Who said representation doesn't matter? Which "many posters in this thread" feel that it should not matter at all? Critiquing current DEI ideology does not equate to saying representation isn't important. Twitter is the place for positions with complete lack of nuance, not here.

It must be upsetting that no one ever takes your bait. As an angler myself, I would consider switching techniques.
 
RickyScott said:
In practical terms, end result of affirmative action comes down to replacing Asians and Indians with urm. The percentage of caucasians does not really change (university of California experience when ended aa, number of Caucasian students did not increase) In many of these elite institutions/ Asians and Indians are over represented. Basically swapping one darker skin tone for another. For medschool, someone with a Native American grandparent, or a wealthy South American jew gets much greater preference than a Vietnamese boat refuge who had to endure camps and poverty.
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just searched the word representation in this thread and this is one of the first things i saw.


many posts of this ilk in this thread, where there has been debate back and forth on the importance of diversity in medicine.
 
and to play your ridiculous game - if angling for annoying replies was what I was after - clearly I struck gold. this is the most active this thread has been in weeks. 30 posts for two seemingly harmless tweets. clearly something was triggered.
 
jondunn said:
and to play your ridiculous game - if angling for annoying replies was what I was after - clearly I struck gold. this is the most active this thread has been in weeks. 30 posts for two seemingly harmless tweets. clearly something was triggered.
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No, you are just trying to troll people into falling into your trap of making an argument for a race-neutral society, meritocracy, whatever, so you can call them racist for not being "anti-racist", and no one is falling for it.

jondunn said:
just searched the word representation in this thread and this is one of the first things i saw.


many posts of this ilk in this thread, where there has been debate back and forth on the importance of diversity in medicine.
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First attempt didn't work, so trying again. JD gonna JD.
 
jondunn said:
just searched the word representation in this thread and this is one of the first things i saw.


many posts of this ilk in this thread, where there has been debate back and forth on the importance of diversity in medicine.
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Many Asian- and Indian-Americans have a huge issue with current DEI ideology for the exact reason this poster explained (see the most recent Harvard lawsuit for example). I find nothing offensive about the post. It never says representation isn't important, but rather explains that the practical results of DEI guidelines can impact minority communities in this country.
 
RealSimulD said:
Angling for someone to say something jerky and racist as bait. Multiple posters have said this. No one said angling for annoying responses.
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there is zero reason to angle someone to say something jerky and racially insensitive. this thread is full of those examples already.

we can disagree on this. Clearly most of SDN Rad Onc leans a certain way on this issue.

I would have hoped that some would read the story in the twitter thread I posted and maybe seen another side of the issue. I believe some will.

Many many many people read here and never post, and my DMs are full of people who tell me that is true.
 
Apparently, Asians are not as likable..

"The facts, as presented by the plaintiffs, are crystal clear. Asian Americans admitted to Harvard have higher standardized-test scores than any other group including whites. Harvard itself found in a 2013 internal study that, if it admitted applicants solely on the basis of academic merit, its share of Asian American students would explode from 19 percent to 43 percent. Preferences for legacies and athletes have propped up the white share of students admitted. (One analysis finds the effect of those “pales in comparison” to the diversity benefits stemming from racial preferences.) Asian Americans are punished by both forms of preferences.

Harvard’s method for tamping down its Asian American applicants to an acceptable level has controversially involved using a subjective “personal” score, gauging qualities such as “likability, courage, kindness and being ‘widely respected.’” According to Harvard, Asian Americans systematically score worse by these measures than any other racial group, weighing down their admittance rate despite higher academic scores."

 
Okay good - so now one can see WHY I posted that story?

You may not agree with the importance of black patients having black doctors to look up to or to help take care of them. That's fine. or maybe you sympthatize but also feel bad for the asians who get 'screwed'. I get that too.

But that is why I posted that.
 
jondunn said:
Many many many people read here and never post, and my DMs are full of people who tell me that is true.
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Story checks out. Yes, JD, I'm sure that your DM is full of people who are hesitant to express an opinion about progressive ideas because discussing such things on an anonymous message board, let alone on a place like Twitter under your real name, would be far too risky.
 
RealSimulD said:
this is just too good…

The masses of progressive people yearning to have their voices heard on social media.
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God you’re honestly really not that smart.

Sdn is not social media.
 
Also I love how one person who is definitely in the minority here posts that URM representation is important, about a dozen posters attack, and they all say ‘there’s no issue here why are you posting this’

It’s unbelievable actually

but yes, SDN is the 'only' place for an open discussion! more like an echo chamber.
 
jondunn said:
Okay good - so now one can see WHY I posted that story?

You may not agree with the importance of black patients having black doctors to look up to or to help take care of them. That's fine. or maybe you sympthatize but also feel bad for the asians who get 'screwed'. I get that too.

But that is why I posted that.
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One way to interpret that tweet is that it's important for patients of the same race, who live in a society that has historically, and currently, discriminated against them, to be able to commiserate, or even to be able to see that progress is being made. Another way to interpret that tweet is that the patient now no longer has to worry about a racist piece of **** who only got his career because of his privileged upbringing performing an operation on him that might've actually helped. Tweets like this both illustrate progress and the lack thereof. ANd I think you know it. However, you've convinced yourself there's only one interpretation, and any other one represents some sort of close-minded POV. It's the pot calling the kettle black.
 
Ray D. Ayshun said:
One way to interpret that tweet is that it's important for patients of the same race, who live in a society that has historically, and currently, discriminated against them, to be able to commiserate, or even to be able to see that progress is being made. Another way to interpret that tweet is that the patient now no longer has to worry about a racist piece of **** who only got his career because of his privileged upbringing performing an operation on him that might've actually helped. Tweets like this both illustrate progress and the lack thereof. ANd I think you know it. However, you've convinced yourself there's only one interpretation, and any other one represents some sort of close-minded POV. It's the pot calling the kettle black.
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I mean - is the second interpretation really fair? Is that something that you're concerned about? That there may be some amazing doctor out there that would have saved the patient's life, but because some black doc took his spot, the patient may die or have a worse outcome?

If you want to talk about this, let's talk.

to me that seems like a straw man.
 
jondunn said:
I mean - is the second interpretation really fair? Is that something that you're concerned about? That there may be some amazing doctor out there that would have saved the patient's life, but because some black doc took his spot, the patient may die or have a worse outcome?

If you want to talk about this, let's talk.

to me that seems like a straw man.
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If one of your former patients referred to you as "some Asian Guy," would you have a problem with it, or would that be contingent on their skin color?
 
Ray D. Ayshun said:
If one of your former patients referred to you as "some Asian Guy," would you have a problem with it, or would that be contingent on their skin color?
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kind of a non-sequitur reply it seems to me

but to answer - I myself am not someone that is easily offended. If a patient didnt know my name and if I was asian, and referred to me as 'that asian doc' to someone else, and that person told me, I would probably be like 'whatever'


not sure I get the point or relevance to what we were talking about
 
jondunn said:
kind of a non-sequitur reply it seems to me

but to answer - I myself am not someone that is easily offended or would cry foul. If a patient didnt know my name and if I was asian, and referred to me as 'that asian doc' to someone else, and that person told me, I would probably be like 'whatever'
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"whatever" was the collective response to your posting that tweet. then, the thread heated up, and you made reference to that tweet as somehow indicative of the progress that SDN radonc has a problem with. I'm not offended by that tweet. I don't find that tweet anything. It's just there. An example of nothing in particular besides just that there are more black doctors now. Great. However, if forced to interpret it more deeply, which you're angling for, there are a number of things that tweet could indicate, all of which might be correct, and none of which might be. You seem to think it supports only one viewpoint, and in turn will be liked by those that are correct and disliked by those that are not. I think it's a tweet intended for those who can identify with and appreciate the history, but could reasonably be misinterpreted by others. I hate twitter as it removes nuance from meaningful discussions. It's perfect for making topical, frivolous statements that don't deserve deeper consideration. Twitter exists for a society only interested in the superficial, and is driving us in that direction, which consequently makes a post-racial society even less likely. I find racial history interesting, but race quite boring.
 
Ray D. Ayshun said:
If one of your former patients referred to you as "some Asian Guy," would you have a problem with it, or would that be contingent on their skin color?
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My wife's patients refer to her "chinita" (Spanish for little Chinese lady) constantly. It boils her blood. She's not even Chinese, and she speaks near fluent Spanish.
 
As a card carrying dem, progressives catfishing people into "gotcha" moments is not a particularly endearing nor productive element of my ilk.

However, it definitely turns people off enough that they'd rather vote for some paranoid, potentially treasonous lunatic than ever consider voting blue.

So there's that.
 
Mandelin Rain said:
As a card carrying dem, progressives catfishing people into "gotcha" moments is not a particularly endearing nor productive element of my ilk.
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dude this is the 5th post of yours on this page alone talking about me fishing for a reaction!

why the hell are you so into this? maybe you should take a breather

I guess I was 'fishing' in that any post on a message board is to have a conversation. I was actually kind of happy that it seemed like Ray D Ayshun wanted to have a convo but then it derailed into 'well anyone can read into anything on any topic'
 
jondunn said:
dude this is the 5th post of yours on this page alone talking about me fishing for a reaction!

why the hell are you so into this? maybe you should take a breather

I guess I was 'fishing' in that any post on a message board is to have a conversation. I was actually kind of happy that it seemed like Ray D Ayshun wanted to have a convo but then it derailed into 'well anyone can read into anything on any topic'
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I'm up for a conversation. Just not about tweets. Twitter has set us back. We've historically complained about how political soundbites serve to obfuscate in order to make up for a lack of substance. The outlet for this was the national news. Then cable news. Then Twitter came along and basically put substance out of it's misery by allowing everyone to appear substantial, if only in their own mind. I can't have a conversation about a void. There was an snl cartoon I remember where they played audio from "friends" as they talked while the four horsemen of the apocalypse rode in and the apocalypse commenced. That's how I imagine a conversation about tweets.
 
So.... JD's career at SDN has come to a tragic end. Continuing to be a dick to other SDN members will not be tolerated. After enough beatings/warnings the banhammer will come down.

All say your final prayers for JD, one of the most prolific posters in SDN RO history, with 2k posts in less than 12 months. He wasn't always right, but he always had an opinion.
 
evilbooyaa said:
So.... JD's career at SDN has come to a tragic end. Continuing to be a dick to other SDN members will not be tolerated. After enough beatings/warnings the banhammer will come down.

All say your final prayers for JD, one of the most prolific posters in SDN RO history, with 2k posts in less than 12 months. He wasn't always right, but he always had an opinion.
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What! I was waiting for a knock down drag out on “the wunderlich test” in the dare you to reply thread.
 
Ray D. Ayshun said:
I always have mixed emotions. I'd love a documentary about the more prolific posters whp were banned. Where they came from, what became of them.
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I'd pay good money and grab a Foley to watch the KHE/Turaco/JD trilogy
 
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