Official 2017 Rank Order List

[SmallBird]

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Hello,
to the above poster sorry I cant help with your post but I have a similar question. Im having difficulty deciding between my top two programs. Does anyone have any thoughts on University of Tennessee VS University of Connecticut?

I've been trying the pros and cons of both. U Tenn pays a lot less but also has much lower cost of living. Tenn also has better weather year round and Memphis seemed like a nice city. On the other hand I think that possibly, the UConn program was a little better and it doesn't hurt to be a two hour drive from NYC but the weather...ikkkk. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thank you!

UConn is a larger academic center for psychiatry, but these locations are so dramatically different it's hard to imagine you don't feel a strong pull in one direction - and not just related to weather. Connecticut is a solid blue state, very high taxes, but also comprehensive mental health services. Central Connecticut in particular has some beautiful small towns that you won't find in Tennessee (Farmington, Avon, Glastonbury, Simsbury), with top notch school district. On the other hand the cities of Hartford and New Britain which are up there offer very little. People without families tend to crowd around West Hartford which is nice but overall this is not a particular vibrant part of the state. If you have a family, like skiing, have some savings, and pretty much drink wine (don't mean to offend if you don't!) and like dining out you will be very happy living around UConn🙂

I don't know much about Memphis but I have to assume it's vastly different.

 

[thomasina]

Any thoughts on how to rank mount Sinai Icahn (main mount Sinai) and NYU? I was lukewarm about both program's interview days, did not feel I was treated that well during the interviews. My goals are academics (not sure about specific fellowship, possibly forensics, possibly CL?) and underserved populations.

My thoughts on both:
NYU: very heavy workload across multiple training sites (kind of a negative for me), outstanding clinical training, seemed like an organized program, great location for my life circumstances, interview seemed somewhat robotic and borderline unprofessional in terms of questions asked by my interviewers which made me feel uncomfortable and is making me hesitate on ranking it highly, seems generally like a well-regarded program.

Mount Sinai- just didn't seem organized on my interview day for various reasons (interviewers didn't read my file ahead of time and told me they had meetings to rush to, interviewers didn't seem interested in me, interviewers talked about patients, lunch didn't arrive on time...) It's also in a good location and it seems that many residents factored this heavily into their decision on ranking it highly. I'm not sure about how well the program is regarded; the residents are certainly impressively pedigreed but that might just be what the program selects for. Younger faculty than the other New York programs I looked at, not sure if that's a positive or negative. Lighter workload than NYU and touts its flexibility with different tracks.

 

[MedMusicArt]

Hi guys, I am an IMG and have been following you guys since the beginning of season. I am thankful to have received tonnes of useful information from this forum which otherwise would have been impossible for me to attain. I have been blessed to have received interviews from some good programs despite being an IMG. I am puzzled with my top few choices and would greatly appreciate more insight into these programs. I don't have any geographical preference and am focussing on the quality of training primarily.

1) Cleveland Clinic
2) University of Miami
3)SUNY Downstate

 

[RudinChickpea]

Hi guys, I am an IMG and have been following you guys since the beginning of season. I am thankful to have received tonnes of useful information from this forum which otherwise would have been impossible for me to attain. I have been blessed to have received interviews from some good programs despite being an IMG. I am puzzled with my top few choices and would greatly appreciate more insight into these programs. I don't have any geographical preference and am focussing on the quality of training primarily.

1) Cleveland Clinic
2) University of Miami
3)SUNY Downstate

If I were you I would rank 1) > 3) > 2)

Cleveland Clinic has good reputation. Solid training and the city's very affordable. SUNY is quite nice for IMGs but NYC's crazily expensive. Their salary's not so competitive for living there. They've got a new chair who's a reputable researcher. Seems to be going through positive transitions. Miami I'm not sure how the program is, but Google their chair for news articles from 2011. I don't like what I read. But if you have high tolerance for ethical compromise then it's not a problem


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[postbacpremed87]

Hi guys, I am an IMG and have been following you guys since the beginning of season. I am thankful to have received tonnes of useful information from this forum which otherwise would have been impossible for me to attain. I have been blessed to have received interviews from some good programs despite being an IMG. I am puzzled with my top few choices and would greatly appreciate more insight into these programs. I don't have any geographical preference and am focussing on the quality of training primarily.

1) Cleveland Clinic
2) University of Miami
3)SUNY Downstate

I am considering Cleveland Clinic next cycle. Would you mind sharing your stats?

 

[clozareal]

Any thoughts on how to rank mount Sinai Icahn (main mount Sinai) and NYU? I was lukewarm about both program's interview days, did not feel I was treated that well during the interviews. My goals are academics (not sure about specific fellowship, possibly forensics, possibly CL?) and underserved populations.

My thoughts on both:
NYU: very heavy workload across multiple training sites (kind of a negative for me), outstanding clinical training, seemed like an organized program, great location for my life circumstances, interview seemed somewhat robotic and borderline unprofessional in terms of questions asked by my interviewers which made me feel uncomfortable and is making me hesitate on ranking it highly, seems generally like a well-regarded program.

Mount Sinai- just didn't seem organized on my interview day for various reasons (interviewers didn't read my file ahead of time and told me they had meetings to rush to, interviewers didn't seem interested in me, interviewers talked about patients, lunch didn't arrive on time...) It's also in a good location and it seems that many residents factored this heavily into their decision on ranking it highly. I'm not sure about how well the program is regarded; the residents are certainly impressively pedigreed but that might just be what the program selects for. Younger faculty than the other New York programs I looked at, not sure if that's a positive or negative. Lighter workload than NYU and touts its flexibility with different tracks.

NYU has fantastic forensics, with one of the only hospitals with a court system within it's walls. They also have a court-based evaluation clinic, an acute psych unit for pre-trial detainees, a forensic state hospital (Kirby) which is a maximum-security hospital where you can learn how to provide treatment for insanity acquittees, incompetent defendants, and civilly committed patients who cannot be managed in less secure settings. The training between the three different sites (private Tisch, public Bellevue, and VA Manhattan) sounds like it'd offer exceptionally thorough training. Each one of those locations has their own flavor for CL: Tisch has their psycho-oncology and behavioral neurology clinics, Bellevue has their HIV, survivors of torture, and reproductive psychiatry clinics, and the VA has their primary care integration program. I also thought my interview day was somewhat weird with the questions asked and some of the interviewers really overtly challenging me to get a rouse out of me. The residents who were at the dinner also seemed pretty tired and lots of them were speaking to each other rather than the applicants, but that might have just been that night although something makes me think that the residents aren't as cohesive. How could they be though since they live all over the city and are in so many different hospital settings? However, I think that the program itself is strong with an incredible volume of great faculty, a broad range of patient diversity/psychopathology, and seems extremely organized. Even though I do think that they have a very heavy workload with lots of structure guiding their training, the residents come out excellent because of it. That's not to say that Mt. Sinai residents aren't though.

I think Mt. Sinai is definitely a more flexible program that allows you to tailor your training to whatever you're interested in. Their schedule isn't as structured as NYU so there's a chance you might not get excellent training in all areas, but some applicants I've met on the interview trail wanted that. They were interested in something very specific and wanted to focus on mainly that (they have their specific clinical and research tracks), which is what Mt. Sinai offers in terms of academics. They don't have their own forensic fellowship or as many opportunities for that as NYU does, but they do have a robust CL opportunities. Again, I got the sense that the program and department in general was in a bit of turmoil with the changes in faculty and in mission lately, but residents seemed to think that all the changes are for the better.

If it were me, I would rank NYU > Mt. Sinai for it's thorough more intense training, but Mt. Sinai > NYU if you have specific academic interests and want the flexibility to do so.

 

[raccoon914]

Currently in love with 3 programs
Einstein (philly), Rochester (NY) and Hofstra SI

Einstein I really liked the people, I loved the CRC (esp the child CRC since it's the only one, currently, in the city) and I liked that it was really a mix of psychotherapy and psychopharm

Rochester NY held a special place in my heart. I had no idea what to expect but ended up liking the city. I love snow, but I really loved the people and the program director in particular. They had a great list of fellowships and everything in one hospital with Epic as their EMR is cool.

Hofstra is a big hospital system with some big name doctors. I liked the island a lot as a mix of right next to the city but not as busy as manhattan. The residents were all helpful, and a mix of IMG/DO/USMD and the medicine program was huge, so it seems you'd never be overwhelmed or understaffed.

any thoughts?

I also loved Hofstra SI, but was discouraged by their recent PD email regarding ranking decisions. What did you think of this, and them giving us feedback at the end of the interview day?

 

[drsolo]

Is Hofstra SI the Staten Island campus? Is this separate from the Zucker Hillside Hospital program? Do residents from the two programs interact at all?

 

[TheFuture_22]

I was just wanting some thoughts/advice on my rank list. Currently, this is how it stands, however, I change them around almost daily because it's a close call for me.

1. Mayo Clinic
Was extremely impressed with the residents and faculty, but the location isn't ideal (although I feel like I could learn to love it). Plus, it's Mayo and I do have some interest in academics as well as want to dabble in research. However, I'm not 100% I want to do academics and could just as easily see myself working out in the community. They don't seem to publish department specific NIH funding, but I assume research is plentiful there.

2. University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences (UAMS)
Was impressed with the residents, liked the program, it has a good reputation in the south and they seem to treat their residents well. Better location for me personally due to family being close by. Might have trouble getting involved in research since it's not plentiful and academic jobs outside UAMS might be harder to come by if I go that route.

3. Indiana University
This program surprised me with how robust it is. I also liked the diversity of clinical environment experiences you get there. Was impressed with residents and faculty. Also, ranked like 21 in NIH funding so research is available there. Location is decent for me as it was a nice livable city with at least not terrible weather.

4. University of Maryland
Pretty strong program with broad exposure to different work environments. Baltimore was nicer than I thought it would be and seemed livable and close proximity to other nice cities such as DC, philly and NYC. Not an ideal location for me personally though but weather not terrible and on the coast which is nice. Ranked 20th in NIH funding so research is available there as well.

Things that are important to me in no particular order are: access to research/academia, quality of training, work life balance, good work environment, good resident cohesiveness, prefer warmer climates.
Any advice or additional info would be appreciated. Thanks!


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[raccoon914]

Is Hofstra SI the Staten Island campus? Is this separate from the Zucker Hillside Hospital program? Do residents from the two programs interact at all?

Yes, it's the Staten Island campus, separate program from the one at Zucker. It seems the residents from the two programs interact at some of their sites.

 

[StrangerFigs]

I was just wanting some thoughts/advice on my rank list. Currently, this is how it stands, however, I change them around almost daily because it's a close call for me.

1. Mayo Clinic
Was extremely impressed with the residents and faculty, but the location isn't ideal (although I feel like I could learn to love it). Plus, it's Mayo and I do have some interest in academics as well as want to dabble in research. However, I'm not 100% I want to do academics and could just as easily see myself working out in the community. They don't seem to publish department specific NIH funding, but I assume research is plentiful there.

2. University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences (UAMS)
Was impressed with the residents, liked the program, it has a good reputation in the south and they seem to treat their residents well. Better location for me personally due to family being close by. Might have trouble getting involved in research since it's not plentiful and academic jobs outside UAMS might be harder to come by if I go that route.

3. Indiana University
This program surprised me with how robust it is. I also liked the diversity of clinical environment experiences you get there. Was impressed with residents and faculty. Also, ranked like 21 in NIH funding so research is available there. Location is decent for me as it was a nice livable city with at least not terrible weather.

4. University of Maryland
Pretty strong program with broad exposure to different work environments. Baltimore was nicer than I thought it would be and seemed livable and close proximity to other nice cities such as DC, philly and NYC. Not an ideal location for me personally though but weather not terrible and on the coast which is nice. Ranked 20th in NIH funding so research is available there as well.

Things that are important to me in no particular order are: access to research/academia, quality of training, work life balance, good work environment, good resident cohesiveness, prefer warmer climates.
Any advice or additional info would be appreciated. Thanks!


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If I had read through these without knowing what order you put them in, I would've thought Indiana was #1.

 

[TheFuture_22]

If I had read through these without knowing what order you put them in, I would've thought Indiana was #1.

That's probably because it surprised me the most as I didn't expect to rank it so high in the beginning. However, all of these have been my number one at one time or another so they are very close in my mind and the order may change before last rank day.


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[TheFuture_22]

Also, forgot to mention I'm interested in CL so that is another big reason Mayo is number one on my list right now. I'm also interested to hear how others interested in CL would rank my top 4?


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[FatBoy530]

Mayo vs. MCW vs. Cleveland Clinic....any thoughts?

 

[FatBoy530]

TheFuture_22....

Of the programs you mentioned, I only Interviewed at Mayo. In my humble opinion, if you are interested in research and C/L, you can't go wrong with Mayo.



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[cavsfan2306]

Yes, it's the Staten Island campus, separate program from the one at Zucker. It seems the residents from the two programs interact at some of their sites.

Any word on how the two Hofstras compare to one another?

 

[st2205]

Mayo vs. MCW vs. Cleveland Clinic....any thoughts?

Interviewed at Mayo and MCW. I really liked MCW. Great diversity of training sites, both inpatient and outpatient, a lot of fellowships. Friendly people. At the time (4 years ago) it had a very cush call schedule. There ended up being some debate about that as there was conflicting information. Ended up ranking MCW #2. Mayo was okay. Nothing bad. I ended up ranking it a lot lower not for any reason in particular, there just wasn't as much drawing me to it. Also, I'd be willing to wager the ratio of axis I to axis II among patients feeling they need to be at Mayo is fairly low (that's just a bias confirmed by small anecdata and partially joking).

 

[DrMcCoy]

Anyone have thoughts on U Maryland vs UNC vs Brown? I am having a lot of trouble deciding between these programs. Baltimore is a great location for me but UNC and Brown were wonderful on interview day.

 

[clozareal]

Also, forgot to mention I'm interested in CL so that is another big reason Mayo is number one on my list right now. I'm also interested to hear how others interested in CL would rank my top 4?

Out of the programs you're considering, I would agree that Mayo would be a great place to do CL since it's a quaternary care center with extremely specialized clinical areas, the strength of the CL faculty, and the availability of a psychosomatic fellowship. They have an integrated behavioral health for outpatient CL as well.

If you're interested in academics, they publish a ton in clinical research (and meagerly in basic sciences), and many of their residents have said they published or are working on projects. There's a strong epidemiological database many researchers use there called the Rochester Epidemiology Project and a biobank that links up to the clinical data for each patient. Research funding is mainly done internally and is plentiful, so is funding and time off to go to conferences to present/attend. Their NIH funding isn't as high but the amount of donor funding for research alone can comparably put them in the top 10 for NIH funding.

 

[ForeverAndEver88]

Any thinking in terms of U of Chicago vs. Rush vs. UIC in terms of work/life balance?

 

[TheFuture_22]

Out of the programs you're considering, I would agree that Mayo would be a great place to do CL since it's a quaternary care center with extremely specialized clinical areas, the strength of the CL faculty, and the availability of a psychosomatic fellowship. They have an integrated behavioral health for outpatient CL as well.

If you're interested in academics, they publish a ton in clinical research (and meagerly in basic sciences), and many of their residents have said they published or are working on projects. There's a strong epidemiological database many researchers use there called the Rochester Epidemiology Project and a biobank that links up to the clinical data for each patient. Research funding is mainly done internally and is plentiful, so is funding and time off to go to conferences to present/attend. Their NIH funding isn't as high but the amount of donor funding for research alone can comparably put them in the top 10 for NIH funding.

Very helpful, thanks!


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[SmallBird]

Anyone have thoughts on U Maryland vs UNC vs Brown? I am having a lot of trouble deciding between these programs. Baltimore is a great location for me but UNC and Brown were wonderful on interview day.

They seem quite different - UNC probably has the most research going on. Residents I know at Brown seem very happy and their PD is awesome. They also have a beautiful hospital (as dose U Maryland). Certainly still has academic opportunities. Based on anecdote and prior impressions posted on this forum I've seen Brown and UNC high on lists more often than U Maryland but I guess it depends on how important being in Baltimore is. If you have any interest in child psych Brown would definitely stand out in terms of prestige, clinical programs, engagement in AACAP, etc.

 

[Salpingo]

I've seen many people concerned about it, but haven't seen any promising answer to the question of stability.

Someone at the program might have a better sense, but the rumors I've heard is that the city/state/office of mental health interceded due to the huge vacuum that would have been created in the NYC mental health system. Beth Israel has one of the biggest substance abuse programs and visiting mental health services in the city, and covering a huge encatchment area. It will be interesting to see it become essentially a freestanding psych facility occupying valuable real estate. Hopefully it can emerge as a strong addiction/public health program, similar to NYU but maybe less academic.

But unless someone closer to the program chimes in, my sense is that you're rolling the dice that the government/OMH will continue to advocate for the program against strong financial pressure.

 

[Degas1452]

Question regarding WPIC (UPMC) standing vs Yale, MGH, top NYC schools? Per current residents, therapy training used to be a weak point but I'm unsure if this has been addressed. Thoughts?

 

[Seroquel]

I literally change my rank list everyday .. I don't want to move after residency and it's hard for me to justify the COL and salary in NYC vs Minneapolis/St. Paul. OTOH it might be easier to meet the future Mr. Seroquel in ny. Idk

 

[Merovinge]

Question regarding WPIC (UPMC) standing vs Yale, MGH, top NYC schools? Per current residents, therapy training used to be a weak point but I'm unsure if this has been addressed. Thoughts?

UPMC might as well be Harvard or UCSF when it comes to psychiatry IMO. I have zero ties there, but 100% of the folks I met that trained there were top flight. East Coast psychiatrists still gonna be East Coast psychiatrists and won't be as impressed but everyone else knows how freaking good UPMC is.

 

[Merovinge]

They seem quite different - UNC probably has the most research going on. Residents I know at Brown seem very happy and their PD is awesome. They also have a beautiful hospital (as dose U Maryland). Certainly still has academic opportunities. Based on anecdote and prior impressions posted on this forum I've seen Brown and UNC high on lists more often than U Maryland but I guess it depends on how important being in Baltimore is. If you have any interest in child psych Brown would definitely stand out in terms of prestige, clinical programs, engagement in AACAP, etc.

Brown does a lot of research and their PD is awesome. Weather in NC is great though, and the Raleigh/Durham area is a good fit for the "average" psychiatrist IMO (particularly Durham).

 

[Merovinge]

Very helpful, thanks!

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Keep in mind that Mayo is quite mediocre in psychiatry compared to their more classical areas of strength. Many Midwestern programs are either outright better or have different areas of strengths. You will get exposure to crazy CL things, undeniably. IU and UAMS are really good programs, so if you like those areas more you are not missing out on something amazing if you drop Mayo lower. I consistently find med students who are in awe they got an invite to Mayo in psychiatry not realizing how much less competitive they are in psych.

 

[TheFuture_22]

Keep in mind that Mayo is quite mediocre in psychiatry compared to their more classical areas of strength. Many Midwestern programs are either outright better or have different areas of strengths. You will get exposure to crazy CL things, undeniably. IU and UAMS are really good programs, so if you like those areas more you are not missing out on something amazing if you drop Mayo lower. I consistently find med students who are in awe they got an invite to Mayo in psychiatry not realizing how much less competitive they are in psych.

Why do you think they are mediocre? I didn't get that idea from my interview day. I realize they aren't ranked as high as some of the Northeastern programs such as MGH and Yale, but they are still ranked like 20 on Doximity which is not mediocre but actually top 10% of psychiatry programs (although I realize Doximity isn't all that accurate most of their top 20-30 programs kinda make sense where they are ranked). I get what you are saying though that IU and UAMS are great programs as well that is why it's a close call for me. I think the only things that are making me lean Mayo are the CL experience and the fact that I had the best experience overall there on my interview day.


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[OldPsychDoc]

Why do you think they are mediocre? I didn't get that idea from my interview day. I realize they aren't ranked as high as some of the Northeastern programs such as MGH and Yale, but they are still ranked like 20 on Doximity which is not mediocre but actually top 10% of psychiatry programs (although I realize Doximity isn't all that accurate most of their top 20-30 programs kinda make sense where they are ranked). I get what you are saying though that IU and UAMS are great programs as well that is why it's a close call for me. I think the only things that are making me lean Mayo are the CL experience and the fact that I had the best experience overall there on my interview day.


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Doximity's ratings are entirely based on name recognition, so it's not surprising that Mayo ranks high there.
The C/L experience is excellent, the Mayo culture is unique--but there are many other programs that equal or exceed their clinical exposure in psychiatry.

 

[clozareal]

Doximity's ratings are entirely based on name recognition, so it's not surprising that Mayo ranks high there.
The C/L experience is excellent, the Mayo culture is unique--but there are many other programs that equal or exceed their clinical exposure in psychiatry.

The C/L exposure is pretty much the main thing Mayo has going for it along with clinical research. They have weak community/public psychiatry, no country hospital, no VA experience, low volume in their main psych hospital, and very select areas of research. The clinical exposure is definitely not as well-balanced in terms of breath, depth, and volume as some other programs.

 

[clausewitz2]

Question regarding WPIC (UPMC) standing vs Yale, MGH, top NYC schools? Per current residents, therapy training used to be a weak point but I'm unsure if this has been addressed. Thoughts?

I'm not going to pretend WPIC is chiefly focused on psychotherapy or anything, but this is definitely a program where you can pursue your interests in this respect with the full support of the program. Several people ahead of me began picking up therapy patients at the start of second year, although this is not advertised. Also worth noting that at the end of the day, the department has 300 faculty, so if you are interested in a particular technique or approach, odds are good someone in the building has published on it.

Also you work closely with Pitt psychology folks closely on several mandatory rotations and can titrate that up as interested. they are fantastic.

 

[jake01]

Anyone have thoughts on U Maryland vs UNC vs Brown? I am having a lot of trouble deciding between these programs. Baltimore is a great location for me but UNC and Brown were wonderful on interview day.

I'm having some issues ranking a couple of these programs also. Trying to decide between Maryland and UNC for my 5/6 spot right now - liked UNC an awful lot on interview day but I was very impressed by UMD as well. Right now I have UMD over UNC because I'd like VA exposure (all the programs I have above these have VA access) but I still find myself going back and forth.

My other issue is trying to decide between MUSC and Vanderbilt for my 2/3 spots. They seem like such a toss up in terms of location, resources, how I felt, etc. Would love any input anyone has on this as well. FWIW I'm not particularly interested in research and am unsure what I'd like to be doing after residency.

 

[clausewitz2]

I'm having some issues ranking a couple of these programs also. Trying to decide between Maryland and UNC for my 5/6 spot right now - liked UNC an awful lot on interview day but I was very impressed by UMD as well. Right now I have UMD over UNC because I'd like VA exposure (all the programs I have above these have VA access) but I still find myself going back and forth.

My other issue is trying to decide between MUSC and Vanderbilt for my 2/3 spots. They seem like such a toss up in terms of location, resources, how I felt, etc. Would love any input anyone has on this as well. FWIW I'm not particularly interested in research and am unsure what I'd like to be doing after residency.

Do you prefer hipsters and country music or Spanish moss and the beach?

 

[thomasina]

If my goal is academics (unsure if I would want to pursue fellowship, not terribly attached to the idea of more training though), would I be putting myself at a significant disadvantage by ranking Montefiore above some of the "big four" NYC programs?

 

[splik]

for fellowship it doesnt matter where you train. they'll take anyone. If your goal is to be underpaid, oppressed, and beholden to the whims of egomaniacs, then of course you should go to a more prestigious program. Columbia is going to prefer to hire one of their own than someone from monte. A few years ago they were paying like 140k for new faculty so you may want to rethink academics if you live in NYC. Also more prestigious institutions won't even give you an assistant professor title if you work there to begin with, whereas if go into private practice and join the clinical (i.e. unpaid) faculty, they will...

 

[MSBI Psych]

Someone at the program might have a better sense, but the rumors I've heard is that the city/state/office of mental health interceded due to the huge vacuum that would have been created in the NYC mental health system. Beth Israel has one of the biggest substance abuse programs and visiting mental health services in the city, and covering a huge encatchment area. It will be interesting to see it become essentially a freestanding psych facility occupying valuable real estate. Hopefully it can emerge as a strong addiction/public health program, similar to NYU but maybe less academic.

But unless someone closer to the program chimes in, my sense is that you're rolling the dice that the government/OMH will continue to advocate for the program against strong financial pressure.

I am a current Psychiatry PGY-1 at Beth Israel, and I just created this account so that I could address some of the concerns you guys were having. You are correct in that Beth Israel is downsizing and some of the residency programs are starting to recruit less applicants. However, the department of psychiatry is actually going to be receiving increased funding for renovations of psychiatric services, namely Bernstein (which will become the premier home for psychiatric services for the Mount Sinai system), and a brand new facility on 14th street which would be the new home for addiction services for the hospital. There is no plan for the hospital to become a freestanding psychiatric facility, but rather the plan is for Mount Sinai Downtown to have a significant percentage of medical and surgical services dedicated to outpatient and ambulatory care.

In case you weren't aware of some current updates, for July 1st we have been approved for an additional resident (13 total residents) for the upcoming PGY-1 class, and will also be receiving an additional resident as a transfer to our upcoming PGY-2 class (13 total residents). Something that will also be taking place in the next few months will be a transition of ECT services from Mount Sinai uptown and St. Luke's to Mount Sinai Beth Israel. The current residents are very excited about these upcoming changes and will be looking forward to increased responsibility as residents in detox/rehab services in the upcoming years.

I do understand the concerns that people have, but most of them should have been addressed during by interviewers, on the tours, and during the happy hours. Please feel free to message me if you have specific questions about the program, and I would gladly answer any additional questions you might have regarding the future of the program.

Good luck with the MATCH!

-Steve

 

[Techmed07]

.

 

[jake01]

Do you prefer hipsters and country music or Spanish moss and the beach?

Lol so I take it you feel like the programs are a toss up?

 

[clozareal]

Any thoughts on:


Stanford vs. Yale vs. Columbia

What are you looking for in a program so that we can help you gauge fit?
Also, what are your pros and cons for each place?

 

[clausewitz2]

Lol so I take it you feel like the programs are a toss up?

I think if you are not super interested in research then the specifics matter a lot less because you are not trying to work with specific lab or faculty person for career advancement. Both are solid second-tier type places. If you are all fired about homeless outreach or rTMS then obviously there is a basis for choosing. Otherwise, location is probably more important.

 

[Techmed07]

What are you looking for in a program so that we can help you gauge fit?
Also, what are your pros and cons for each place?

flexibility
cost of living
I am not looking for workhorse program unfortunately.

 

[EAPsych]

Trying to decide between these programs: Utah, MUSC, UNC, UTSW. Any thoughts?? I really liked all four. Interested in adolescent/college mental health, neuromodulation, global health.

 

[clozareal]

flexibility
cost of living
I am not looking for workhorse program unfortunately.

Yale > Stanford > Columbia

Yale's got all 3, Stanford has flexibility and isn't a workhorse program but has high cost of living, and Columbia has maybe flexibility but is definitely a workhorse program with high cost of living

 

[SmallBird]

Any thoughts on:


Stanford vs. Yale vs. Columbia

I was going to say you can't go wrong with either but then you highlighted your key considerations!

I have friends who are faculty and residents at Stamford and the cost of living is horrendous. It's not great in NYC either but you probably have more options. New Haven is still more expensive than other parts of the country but definitely the best of the three in this regard.

Yale certainly offers a lot in terms of flexibility and although I don't think it was a workhorse program it was definitely a better experience for those who liked to put in more effort and get involved in different things.

 

[Techmed07]

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[takeeacy]

I know that Stanford has one of the highest salaries/pay for residencies once you factor in all their benefits. However, I think the fixed living costs esp housing eat up a lot of it. I believe Yale has the highest PGY1 salary (which I believe is when you need it the most for moving costs, buying new furniture/stuff, paying for licenses/licensing exams). However, I remember certain programs in Texas stated that they had the highest effective income since there is no state income tax.

My co-interns and I have felt that there are some similarities in the atmosphere at Stanford and Yale. Both seemed to prize having an abundance of nonclinical research time, a fostering & nurturing academic environment, and an emphasis on education over service (aka not very patient volume oriented/work horse programs, although I imagine the volume being lower at Stanford?). I don't think either program is particularly "cush" or "easy" but I think they probably sit around the middle in terms of work load IMO from the residency interview trail. I made my choice last year based off of the recent histories of the departments (chair and program director changes); one of my co-interns and I had felt that one program seemed more youthful/informal/in development and the other more developed with more history/structure. It felt as though you could bring something exciting and new changes to one residency program; at the other program, it felt to me that much of the kinks have been ironed out and that you would be participating in the ongoing processes of change/improvement (of which many invited participation). Both I think have their pros and cons.

You can't go really go wrong with the Stanford v Yale v Columbia ranking. I think a lot depends on what you will make of your future career, and there are no right or wrongs - truly, after talking to friends at different programs nearly a year after the match, I think better or worse fit (culture/atmosphere/ institution values, career aspirations, life circumstances) was more important to resident happiness than I realized (at least more so than the nitty gritty details such as call schedule, medicine months, 401k plans so long as the residents aren't screwed over). I'm a big believer in gestalt gut arithmetic over pros & cons list-making.

 

[notamindreader]

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[splik]

They are both chill programs so we can guess what you're going for. You are almost certainly going to need to moonlight if you go to san mateo. however there is plenty of in house moonlighting, and last time i check they pay 175/hr so a few shifts here and then should help out in that regard. You will get significantly better psychotherapy training at San Mateo than you would in Vermont. As you can state Burlington is a small town which means you are not going to be seeing a ton of patients while working which is both good and bad (in terms of having a nicer schedule and less rigorous training) respectively. I really don't think residents work very hard there at all but obviously they have some call unlike san mateo. From what I gather some people do choose to live in the city, and the commute to san mateo is doable; to santa clara it will be a pain (but it wouldn't be that bad). otherwise you could live in redwood city or one of the other towns in san mateo. palo alto is especially expensive. for therapy san mateo is definitely stronger. for community mental health - i think the case could be made for either.

The Howard Center (a community mental health center affiliated with UVM) is doing some really interesting work. The director of the center is really nice and a very interesting woman. They have been using open dialog to treat people having psychotic crises and offered patients the chance to come off their neuroleptics if they want to. After one of the state hospitals was destroyed some years ago, they ended up putting money into community services rather than reopening it (i think) and because its a very progressive they have had a lot of free reign to do innovative things. I have no idea how this affects your training experience, if at all. Vermont also sounds like a particularly supportive environment if you are looking to be coddled. Vermont's previous attempts to enact a single-payer health system floundered, but now with the ACA on its last legs I think we might see this come back up again.

 

[notamindreader]

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