To those who think they cannot get into a competitive specialty with a DO

[cliquesh]

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How many DO students do you know are interested in rad/onc? No one in my class was pursuing it. How many DOs students do you know that have a 240+ Step 1 score? There were less than 5 in my class. But a handful of DOs match rad/onc each year. I kind think a DO student with a decent usmle score and a rad/onc specific resume, which is admittedly hard from a DO school, might have an easier time matching than we might think based on nrmp numbers alone.

Does it really matter? I don't know. If some DO student finds cancer interesting they can always go the heme/onc or pathology route if the rad/onc route is closed to them. Medicine is a big field and there usually are several ways to end up in the same ball park.

 

[IslandStyle808]

How many DO students do you know are interested in rad/onc? No one in my class was pursuing it. How many DOs students do you know that have a 240+ Step 1 score? There were less than 5 in my class. But a handful of DOs match rad/onc each year. I kind think a DO student with a decent usmle score and a rad/onc specific resume, which is admittedly hard from a DO school, might have an easier time matching than we might think based on nrmp numbers alone.

Does it really matter? I don't know. If some DO student finds cancer interesting they can always go the heme/onc or pathology route if the rad/onc route is closed to them. Medicine is a big field and there usually are several ways to end up in the same ball park.

The part that people don't realize and you nailed it!

 

[deleted731525]

Carribean students always try to m



DO placement rate is around 99.6 percent, could you remind us what the US-IMG rate is?

Lol.

Why would he care? He has already matched to a university program IIRC. I know there is some tension between IMG and DO students for some dumb reason but it is good to listen to people who have already been through the process.

 

[sab3156]

Want to bring up his CV? I'm going to tell you that i'll probably need to undergo mitosis and have a clone doing work for me to have a CV that is close to his likely.

What about the DOs that have recently matched Orthopedic Surgery at Cleveland and Mayo? What about the Anesthesiology residents at Hopkins (granted it's not a competitive specialty, but Hopkins is top tier and selective)? There are other examples. So are you sure that you aren't being inaccurate by putting a blanket "it's basically impossible" statement over the idea of a DO matching into competitive specialties? I'm sure this is more to do with other factors other than what you're suggesting, and the anti-DO bias is clearly not at every school, including top tier programs.

 

[the argus]

What about the DOs that have recently matched Orthopedic Surgery at Cleveland and Mayo? What about the Anesthesiology residents at Hopkins (granted it's not a competitive specialty, but Hopkins is top tier and selective)? There are other examples. So are you sure that you aren't being inaccurate by putting a blanket "it's basically impossible" statement over the idea of a DO matching into competitive specialties? I'm sure this is more to do with other factors other than what you're suggesting, and the anti-DO bias is clearly not at every school, including top tier programs.

Pointing to the handful of DO grads getting top tier residencies is just as worthless as pointing to the handful of Caribbean grads getting top tier residencies. There's always a few ophtho or neurosurg matches from Ross/SGU every year, but no one would argue that it's reasonable to assume you can do that coming from the Caribbean.

Any specialty is possible from any background, this is proven every year. But when talking about realistic expectations for match outcomes, playing the outlier cards isn't very productive.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

What about the DOs that have recently matched Orthopedic Surgery at Cleveland and Mayo? What about the Anesthesiology residents at Hopkins (granted it's not a competitive specialty, but Hopkins is top tier and selective)? There are other examples. So are you sure that you aren't being inaccurate by putting a blanket "it's basically impossible" statement over the idea of a DO matching into competitive specialties? I'm sure this is more to do with other factors other than what you're suggesting, and the anti-DO bias is clearly not at every school, including top tier programs.

While bias is still strong in some fields and programs IMO a far larger issue is that very few DOs have the application required for these competative specialties and programs. The average DO CV is not close to the average MD CV. Very few DOs even have any research experience while almost all MDs have some form of meaningful research, this is just one example. The DO applicants who have a CV to match their specialty aspirations actually tend to match just fine.

 

[sab3156]

Pointing to the handful of DO grads getting top tier residencies is just as worthless as pointing to the handful of Caribbean grads getting top tier residencies. There's always a few ophtho or neurosurg matches from Ross/SGU every year, but no one would argue that it's reasonable to assume you can do that coming from the Caribbean.

Any specialty is possible from any background, this is proven every year. But when talking about realistic expectations for match outcomes, playing the outlier cards isn't very productive.

What I am saying is that there is more to this than what we are arguing about here. There is more complexity to analyzing the DO match into ACGME due to confounding variables like the AOA match, and also school-by-school bias. Can we get any real relevant numbers that take these things into account?

 

[sab3156]

While bias is still strong in some fields and programs IMO a far larger issue is that very few DOs have the application required for these competative specialties and programs. The average DO CV is not close to the average MD CV. Very few DOs even have any research experience while almost all MDs have some form of meaningful research, this is just one example. The DO applicants who have a CV to match their specialty aspirations actually tend to match just fine.

I think you and I are on the same page.

 

[IslandStyle808]

What about the DOs that have recently matched Orthopedic Surgery at Cleveland and Mayo? What about the Anesthesiology residents at Hopkins (granted it's not a competitive specialty, but Hopkins is top tier and selective)? There are other examples. So are you sure that you aren't being inaccurate by putting a blanket "it's basically impossible" statement over the idea of a DO matching into competitive specialties? I'm sure this is more to do with other factors other than what you're suggesting, and the anti-DO bias is clearly not at every school, including top tier programs.

The reason why it seems like there is not much anti-DO bias at top DO schools is that you have top students. The top programs in anesthesia have taken DO student from schools that are only 30-40 years old, schools that would be considered mid quality. So DO schools are not viewed that differently from one another by these ACGME PDs.

Yes, I am in agreement with you in that the anti-DO bias varies in many different ways.