Anesthesiologist dies during Mexico vacation

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Twiggidy said:
I do think you're underestimating the athleticism of our top athletes. i'll agree with you that our training systems aren't good, but i'd argue the talent and athletes in that system aren't that great either.

i think a better comparison would be to show me Spain's little league basketball system vs the US AAU basketball system (Actually, that wouldn't be a good comparison because Spain's best athletes play soccer)
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Why do you think our top athletes are any more athletic than any other countries? What has become clear over the last 10-15 years with sports in the US at the top levels is that training (and scientifically backed training methods) make a huge difference, even with something as simple as straight line speed. Athletes are getting faster, stronger, better endurance, etc...That's all improvements in training (and maybe some doping along the way).

I'm not saying US athletes aren't super athletic...there are plenty that are. But my point is that there are plenty of athletic guys all over the world and they put their talents to whatever their countries do best and the training they get helps them get to the top of whatever is popular where they grow up.

Put a LeBron in spain at age 5 and I'm sure he could become a fantastic soccer player. But I'm equally sure if you took Ronaldo and put him in the US at 5, he could just as well dominate a basketball court.
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facted said:
Why do you think our top athletes are any more athletic than any other countries? What has become clear over the last 10-15 years with sports in the US at the top levels is that training (and scientifically backed training methods) make a huge difference, even with something as simple as straight line speed. Athletes are getting faster, stronger, better endurance, etc...That's all improvements in training (and maybe some doping along the way).

I'm not saying US athletes aren't super athletic...there are plenty that are. But my point is that there are plenty of athletic guys all over the world and they put their talents to whatever their countries do best and the training they get helps them get to the top of whatever is popular where they grow up.

Put a LeBron in spain at age 5 and I'm sure he could become a fantastic soccer player. But I'm equally sure if you took Ronaldo and put him in the US at 5, he could just as well dominate a basketball court.
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So I like this because this is quite literally my argument. Let's take Ronaldo and Messi (who are superior soccer athletes) and have them raised i the US soccer system and play for the USMNT. Is the US winning world cups now? Maybe right. Because the best athletes are playing soccer in this scenario.

The world is better at soccer because their most mediocre players are still the best athletes playing soccer. In the US, our mediocre soccer players probably couldn't play another sport. In the US, our mediocre athletes in the NFL and NBA are infinitely more athletic than our best soccer players, ie, someone like Austin Rivers (decent NBA player) or even a decent MLB shortstop is a better athlete than Clint Dempsey. If our mediocre to best athletes were playing soccer (ie grew up, trained, a dedicated to the game), Clint Dempsey wouldn't have a job and we would compete for World Cups every year. (Example, the USWNT. Because that's the exact scenario. In this country the best female athletes that don't play basketball likely play soccer, for the most part)
 
Twiggidy said:
So I like this because this is quite literally my argument. Let's take Ronaldo and Messi (who are superior soccer athletes) and have them raised i the US soccer system and play for the USMNT. Is the US winning world cups now? Maybe right. Because the best athletes are playing soccer in this scenario.

The world is better at soccer because their most mediocre players are still the best athletes playing soccer. In the US, our mediocre soccer players probably couldn't play another sport. In the US, our mediocre athletes in the NFL and NBA are infinitely more athletic than our best soccer players, ie, someone like Austin Rivers (decent NBA player) or even a decent MLB shortstop is a better athlete than Clint Dempsey. If our mediocre to best athletes were playing soccer (ie grew up, trained, a dedicated to the game), Clint Dempsey wouldn't have a job and we would compete for World Cups every year. (Example, the USWNT. Because that's the exact scenario. In this country the best female athletes that don't play basketball likely play soccer, for the most part)
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Nah. Don't agree. Ronaldo and Messi don't become who they are as soccer players if they grew up in the US. The US isn't winning world cups because the whole training culture for soccer that exists in the US is maybe 1/100th of what Europe and South America are doing. Change that, and I'm sure the US could field a great team.

I also don't at all understand why you think that the US has any more gifted athletes than any other country in the world. Why are people more athletic in the US than in Brazil? Again, though, the problem isn't the type of athlete that goes into soccer in the US, it's the training system that supports them (and that applies for any sport, which is why there's tons of basketball talent in Europe, for example, that is so raw and often under-developed until those players come the the US IE: The Greek Freak)
 
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Renaldo couldn’t play a professional sport in the US at a high level other than soccer. Tons and I mean tons of NBA/NFL players could be elite soccer players
 
facted said:
Nah. Don't agree. Ronaldo and Messi don't become who they are as soccer players if they grew up in the US. The US isn't winning world cups because the whole training culture for soccer that exists in the US is maybe 1/100th of what Europe and South America are doing. Change that, and I'm sure the US could field a great team.

I also don't at all understand why you think that the US has any more gifted athletes than any other country in the world. Why are people more athletic in the US than in Brazil? Again, though, the problem isn't the type of athlete that goes into soccer in the US, it's the training system that supports them (and that applies for any sport, which is why there's tons of basketball talent in Europe, for example, that is so raw and often under-developed until those players come the the US IE: The Greek Freak)
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*See any Summer Olympics where the US wasn't involved in a boycott*
 
acidbase1 said:
Renaldo couldn’t play a professional sport in the US at a high level other than soccer. Tons and I mean tons of NBA/NFL players could be elite soccer players
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That's what I'm saying. I personally don't think US training in soccer is as bad as people make it to be, it's just that the talent and athleticism decided to play another sport (mostly for scholarships and money)

I feel like what is trying to be argued and is being danced around is that "Who's more athletic, Ronaldo or Russell Westbrook?" which is hilarious.

Most soccer fans (especially international fans) know that soccer is just about the only thing they can hold in the US's face. But I'm telling everyone if the US started playing soccer players 10-20 million dollars to play the sport and gave huge endorsements with it, you'd see a bunch of little athletic ghetto kids kicking soccer balls around and the USMNT would change dramatically

(yeah, I said little ghetto kids, because let's be honest)
 
SaltyDog said:
London Mayor Sadiq Khan enacts ‘knife control’ policies to crack down on stabbing epidemic
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knife control

chefsknives-rock.gif
 
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facted said:
I also don't at all understand why you think that the US has any more gifted athletes than any other country in the world.
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:) Don't overthink this. There are 330 million people in the USA. Essentially none grow up malnourished or with a parasite burden. If tiny countries like Portugal and third world countries in Africa and South America can produce top futbol talent, it's just silly to think we couldn't.

We just don't, because our best choose other sports.

facted said:
the problem isn't the type of athlete that goes into soccer in the US, it's the training system that supports them (and that applies for any sport, which is why there's tons of basketball talent in Europe, for example, that is so raw and often under-developed until those players come the the US IE: The Greek Freak)
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And we don't have the training system, because our best choose other sports.

Our training system is so bad, in fact, that it is probably worse than having no "training system" at all. Look at who's not playing in the World Cup Finals this time around ... There's a compelling argument to be made that our youth system breeds mediocrity.

MLS was started up over 20 years ago, after we hosted the 1994 World Cup, with the notion that a domestic pro league would breed top flight talent, but it was just built wrong from the ground up, ie no relegation. Even worse was the mindset in the early days - they actually tried to "Americanize" the league by, among other things, having the clock run backward instead of forward. Not having commercial breaks during play was unthinkable.

I remember watching the first MLS game on TV. It was played on a non-soccer field, artifical turf, non regulation dimensions (they couldn't even get running starts at corner kicks because the stands were about three feet from the line), an overinflated overbouncy ball that made the players' touch look like JV high schoolers. Wynalda scored a nice enough goal though.

MLS has gotten better, to be sure, but it's nowhere near the level of the European leagues, and it never will be. Because our best athletes choose other sports.

Maybe in 50 years when the NFL has dried up and blown away, after moms quit letting kids play it for fear of chronic brain injury, and southwestern state demographics shift in a more Spanish-speaking direction.

Til then, I'll just watch and cheer for whichever team happens to be playing against the Italians. Seriously, **** those guys.
 
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pgg said:
:) Don't overthink this. There are 330 million people in the USA. Essentially none grow up malnourished or with a parasite burden. If tiny countries like Portugal and third world countries in Africa and South America can produce top futbol talent, it's just silly to think we couldn't.

We just don't, because our best choose other sports.



And we don't have the training system, because our best choose other sports.

Our training system is so bad, in fact, that it is probably worse than having no "training system" at all. Look at who's not playing in the World Cup Finals this time around ... There's a compelling argument to be made that our youth system breeds mediocrity.

MLS was started up over 20 years ago, after we hosted the 1994 World Cup, with the notion that a domestic pro league would breed top flight talent, but it was just built wrong from the ground up, ie no relegation. Even worse was the mindset in the early days - they actually tried to "Americanize" the league by, among other things, having the clock run backward instead of forward. Not having commercial breaks during play was unthinkable.

I remember watching the first MLS game on TV. It was played on a non-soccer field, artifical turf, non regulation dimensions (they couldn't even get running starts at corner kicks because the stands were about three feet from the line), an overinflated overbouncy ball that made the players' touch look like JV high schoolers. Wynalda scored a nice enough goal though.

MLS has gotten better, to be sure, but it's nowhere near the level of the European leagues, and it never will be. Because our best athletes choose other sports.

Maybe in 50 years when the NFL has dried up and blown away, after moms quit letting kids play it for fear of chronic brain injury, and southwestern state demographics shift in a more Spanish-speaking direction.

Til then, I'll just watch and cheer for whichever team happens to be playing against the Italians. Seriously, **** those guys.
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this post 1000%

it's because we're a first world country that we should be better at soccer, but as you said so very eloquently......our best choose other sports
 
I just looked up the 1st MLS game on YouTube.



Looks like that game was on real grass after all. I misremembered that ...

Look at the clock, running backwards. Was 0-0 going into the last few minutes. They were going to have a shootout, for the love of god. Look at the far side of the field ... it's more like 1-2 feet of space.

Wynalda's goal was good though. About 1:53 on the YouTube video, around 3 minutes left in the game.

Credit where credit is due, MLS is a lot better these days.
 
pgg said:
I just looked up the 1st MLS game on YouTube.



Looks like that game was on real grass after all. I misremembered that ...

Look at the clock, running backwards. Was 0-0 going into the last few minutes. They were going to have a shootout, for the love of god. Look at the far side of the field ... it's more like 1-2 feet of space.

Wynalda's goal was good though. About 1:53 on the YouTube video, around 3 minutes left in the game.

Credit where credit is due, MLS is a lot better these days.
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It's as if Vince McMahon started a soccer league. It is better today, even if it is the retirement league for the good European players.
 
La Crosse anyone?

What happened to American Tennis?

Speaking of incredible athletes, how come no one mentions tennis players? Who else plays at full speed for 4 hours, jumping, quickly stopping and changing directions, diving, sprinting, lunging, etc.
 
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epidural man said:
La Crosse anyone?

What happened to American Tennis?

Speaking of incredible athletes, how come no one mentions tennis players? Who else plays at full speed for 4 hours, jumping, quickly stopping and changing directions, diving, sprinting, lunging, etc.
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They're on the court for 3h, they probably play 40min.
 
>thread about anesthesiologist dying
>open said thread for the first time but go to the last page
>people discussing athlete performances

the internet is a weird place man
 
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epidural man said:
La Crosse anyone?

What happened to American Tennis?

Speaking of incredible athletes, how come no one mentions tennis players? Who else plays at full speed for 4 hours, jumping, quickly stopping and changing directions, diving, sprinting, lunging, etc.
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I think individual sports are a different monster. on both the men's and women's side there are like 4 or 5 great players and then everyone else. on the women's side, the best happens to be an American. When people say what happened to American tennis they're referring to the men. I personally feel when it comes to individual sports the field is a bit more level because it comes down to how much a person practices. Same with golf. I think all PGA players are about the same level, it just depends on who's having a good day and putting well. Also, Tiger made being an "in shape golfer en vogue". When he started winning all those tournaments while being in stellar shape (and yes, possibly on roids) all the other guys started hitting the gym too.
 
Brorthopedic said:
>thread about anesthesiologist dying
>open said thread for the first time but go to the last page
>people discussing athlete performances

the internet is a weird place man
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if you read this forum enough, especially the anethesiology forum, derailing to sports isn't necessarily a bad thing
 
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MaximusD said:
Keep tilting at windmills, beating the snot out of that horse, etc

That’s not the discussion. Stay on topic.
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And who the hell made you boss man?

As you can see, this whole thread has devolved into a sports thread and you are picking at me from three /four pages ago?
Are you having a bad day and need to internet punch someone?

Ignore me!! If I bother you.
 
pgg said:
Isn't that what rich white private prep high school kids play between the polo and sailing seasons?
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Ya, right after 7th period skeet shooting and before their 4pm T-time on the back nine.

(I chuckle as a white kid who went to private school).
 
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Ive been to Mexico 20+ times. Matter fact, Im going to tomorrow. Its safe if you stay in certain areas
 
twospadz said:
Ive been to Mexico 20+ times. Matter fact, Im going to tomorrow. Its safe if you stay in certain areas
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This is about the same level of thinking as my patients', when they say (after I tell them about the risks of anesthesia): "I have had 10 surgeries already and never had a problem, so I'll be fine". :bang:

And we wonder why American physicians suck at statistics (and anything that's serious math).
 
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FFP said:
This is about the same level of thinking as my patients', when they say (after I tell them about the risks of anesthesia): "I have had 10 surgeries already and never had a problem, so I'll be fine". :bang:

And we wonder why American physicians suck at statistics (and anything that's serious math).
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which is hilarious because i have the exact opposite happening with my patients. The come in nervous after having had a boatload of general anesthetics but for some reason they fear TODAY is going to be the one that kills them.
 
Twiggidy said:
which is hilarious because i have the exact opposite happening with my patients. The come in nervous after having had a boatload of general anesthetics but for some reason they fear TODAY is going to be the one that kills them.
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Are they white? :D
 
It sucks that these criminals have such capacity for destruction. By all accounts the Mexican drug cartels are fragmenting/splintering and the violence is beyond your imagination. Aside from maybe Cozumel with a direct flight into the island, I'd really be giving these places a serious second thought.

This is not random petty crime that anyplace is going to have in their poorer neighborhoods. This is intentionally violent, drug cartel violence meant to send a message. It's an entirely different beast.

Some of the most horrible videos I've ever seen comes from ISIS/Mexican drug cartels, followed by Brazilian thugs as a close second. But, the Mexican drug cartels are up there with ISIS judging by the scale and degree of terribleness. BTW, I do not recommend watching those videos as I firmly believe they can induce PTSD. The only "benefit" being that you can't fully appreciate the situation unless you perhaps do. Reading about it and watching it are very different.
 
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Just came back from Mexico, safe and sound after partying with friends yesterday. The only problem Ive had in Mexico was with the police. They pull people over randomly at night. They never openly asked for money but took 40 buck out of my car. That was during my second time there. Ive been 20+ so I use different routes and never have been pulled over since. On a side note, Ive never met any gringo who had any run ins with Mexican cartel. Honestly, Im sure the cartel knows if they mess with gringos their money will dry up quick since no one will come anymore. The probably will mess with you if you actually go looking for trouble or out there for the wrong reasons. That's why I don't see a real issue going to Mexico. Honestly, the only pressure the cartel is probably applying is on the clubs and surrounding businesses for protection money but that is a whole different topic. The only thing annoying is a lot of the residents in Mexico see gringos as a meal ticket so a lot of begging and if not careful, over charging.

Lastly, I just wanna say. Yes Mexico can be dangerous but can still also be fun and safe if you practice precaution. Many opinions against Mexico are people who have never been to Mexico. So anybody reading this thread, should take each opinion for what its worth.
 
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Good for you. I could probably visit Iran and make it out alive. Doesn’t mean I’m going to do it.
 
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acidbase1 said:
Good for you. I could probably visit Iran and make it out alive. Doesn’t mean I’m going to do it.
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This is why I say take people's opinions on here for what its worth. Also a reason why I like hanging with people outside of medicine smh. Everyone on here. Please get advice from people who have experience. Doesn't matter the circumstance
 
GA8314 said:
It sucks that these criminals have such capacity for destruction. By all accounts the Mexican drug cartels are fragmenting/splintering and the violence is beyond your imagination. Aside from maybe Cozumel with a direct flight into the island, I'd really be giving these places a serious second thought.

This is not random petty crime that anyplace is going to have in their poorer neighborhoods. This is intentionally violent, drug cartel violence meant to send a message. It's an entirely different beast.

Some of the most horrible videos I've ever seen comes from ISIS/Mexican drug cartels, followed by Brazilian thugs as a close second. But, the Mexican drug cartels are up there with ISIS judging by the scale and degree of terribleness. BTW, I do not recommend watching those videos as I firmly believe they can induce PTSD. The only "benefit" being that you can't fully appreciate the situation unless you perhaps do. Reading about it and watching it are very different.
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Mexican cartel and Isis are way too different to compare. Most of the violence between Mexican cartel is among other gangs or Mexicans/government for turf, money and control. For the most part, they are not targeting foreigners. You don't see them making videos killing gringos randomly, Isis violence and aggression is mainly against foreigners however(and even their own people). Also their pattern of violence is random and not goal directed.
 
Psai said:
It is very weird how you keep saying gringo
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Sorry. Just use to the lingo. Ive traveled a lot in central and south America also. Even gringos refer to each other as gringos there.
 
Again, my family owned a place in Cabo. Been going there my entire life. We have seen the evolution of this countrys demise. But what do I know? Stupid gringo here
 
twospadz said:
Mexican cartel and Isis are way too different to compare. Most of the violence between Mexican cartel is among other gangs or Mexicans/government for turf, money and control. For the most part, they are not targeting foreigners. You don't see them making videos killing gringos randomly, Isis violence and aggression is mainly against foreigners however(and even their own people). Also their pattern of violence is random and not goal directed.
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Most victims of ISIS have been arabs, for sure. I agree that most victims of cartel violence are from rival gangs, and not foreigners. But, the level of violence, the volume, the scale, and the cruelty parallels that of ISIS. Perhaps even more cruel actually. And that's not easy to do. This is all I am saying.

I agree that this hasn't yet spilled over into major tourist areas, but I sense that is changing. I also think that the SCALE of the violence should be heeded, in spite of it being mainly among the cartels, for now. I'm just not sure I would gamble given what I have seen.
 
You can go to Mexico and probably survive, but why? There’s so many better places to go
 
acidbase1 said:
You can go to Mexico and probably survive, but why? There’s so many better places to go
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I’m going because I have airline miles that add up to free airfare, the weather will be warm, the food will be delicious and cheap, it’s relatively closer than many other warm beach climates, just to name a few reasons. And I don’t buy into this notion that there will be some bogeymen coming to slice my noggin off while I’m walking down the street. Oh wait, were you being rhetorical?
 
Food good? Cheap maybe but not good

You must be poor
 
acidbase1 said:
Renaldo couldn’t play a professional sport in the US at a high level other than soccer. Tons and I mean tons of NBA/NFL players could be elite soccer players
Click to expand...
Far from the truth. The skill component of soccer is so vastly underrated by many. The NFL is a sport where If you're a freaks athlete they will find someone for you to do on the field. Soccer? You need skill...if you possess no first touch, passing ability, dribbling? there's basically no way to play at the top level at any position.
 
Okay what sport would be play at a high level in the US? NBA? No. NFL? Nope. MLB? Hmm...
 
sheeed said:
Far from the truth. The skill component of soccer is so vastly underrated by many. The NFL is a sport where If you're a freaks athlete they will find someone for you to do on the field. Soccer? You need skill...if you possess no first touch, passing ability, dribbling? there's basically no way to play at the top level at any position.
Click to expand...

These are all learned skills and as I've been saying, if Russell Westbrook has been running around the neighborhood as a kid with a soccer ball he could've easily learned this.

If Ronaldo has grown up in the US with the athletic ability he has and the weight training/conditioning training we have here, he could have been a slow receiver maybe (he is like 6'2) and the slightly racist side of me says that since he's latino he could've been a really good shortstop with his agility and strength or a centerfielder
 
Twiggidy said:
These are all learned skills and as I've been saying, if Russell Westbrook has been running around the neighborhood as a kid with a soccer ball he could've easily learned this.

If Ronaldo has grown up in the US with the athletic ability he has and the weight training/conditioning training we have here, he could have been a slow receiver maybe (he is like 6'2) and the slightly racist side of me says that since he's latino he could've been a really good shortstop with his agility and strength or a centerfielder
Click to expand...

Are Portuguese considered Latino? If so, then I guess I’m part Latino. Man, I feel sexier already.
 
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