Experiences as or with URMs at your school

[gostudy]

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I think Q is correct that a large contributing factor to prejudice is based on the idea that we (the collective "we" of humanity) see people who are not like us as OTHER. In this way, we do not relate to them, and can even dehumanize them. In my own experience as a URM, or half URM, or whatever you want to call me, I've encountered ignorance more than I've encountered hate. Thus, the best solution, as one poster commented on above, is to confront prejudice when we witness it and use it as an opportunity to educate others.

Agreed. I don't encounter racism on a daily basis rather I encounter ignorance. And I counter this ignorance by exposing my personhood. I also like your point about "other." I think different ethnic and racial groups tend to group other ethnic and racial groups into one big huge stereotypical monster instead of realizing that we are all more alike than we are dissimilar. It's just how white people say black people look the same and blacks say whites look alike or people saying Asians all look alike. This all stems from the ignorance of looking at these groups as one stereotypical monster instead of a group comprised of idiosyncratic individuals.

 

[beefballs]

I would hang out with you

 

[DOCTORSAIB]

Agreed. I don't encounter racism on a daily basis rather I encounter ignorance. And I counter this ignorance by exposing my personhood. I also like your point about "other." I think different ethnic and racial groups tend to group other ethnic and racial groups into one big huge stereotypical monster instead of realizing that we are all more alike than we are dissimilar. It's just how white people say black people look the same and blacks say whites look alike or people saying Asians all look alike. This all stems from the ignorance of looking at these groups as one stereotypical monster instead of a group comprised of idiosyncratic individuals.

Yeah, that's a sociological concept called "Outgroup Homogeniety Effect," where everyone outside of your "group" looks/is the same. It's sad to think that way but a lot of people do, unfortunately.

And yes, I was a Psych major in college.

 

[QofQuimica]

Agreed. I don't encounter racism on a daily basis rather I encounter ignorance. And I counter this ignorance by exposing my personhood. I also like your point about "other." I think different ethnic and racial groups tend to group other ethnic and racial groups into one big huge stereotypical monster instead of realizing that we are all more alike than we are dissimilar. It's just how white people say black people look the same and blacks say whites look alike or people saying Asians all look alike. This all stems from the ignorance of looking at these groups as one stereotypical monster instead of a group comprised of idiosyncratic individuals.

That is actually an interesting question to me, and I wonder how much of it is due to us having different INTRAracial physical characteristics that we use to distinguish one another within our racial groups. For example, if I want to describe another white person, I might say, "oh, Jane is the girl with the black, curly hair." And if Jane has those characteristics, that will distinguish her from many other white people. In contrast, I would almost certainly not describe Jane by saying, "oh, she's the pale white girl." Obviously, this would not distinguish her from most other white people; we're almost ALL pale. 😛

In contrast, if Jane were black, I often would be unable to distinguish her by her hair color. Saying, "oh, she's the girl with the curly black hair," will not distinguish her from the majority of other black girls. On the other hand, black people do have a very rich variety of skin tones. So if I described Jane as a pale black girl, this WOULD distinguish her from many other black people who are darker-skinned than she is.

The point of this example is that white people may not be accustomed to looking for, say, skin color differences to distinguish one another, while they ARE accustomed to looking at hair color or straightness. So that might then make it more difficult for them to distinguish among many black people who have more similar-looking hair. They're accustomed to focusing on a different set of physical traits.

Hispanic people are a unique case, in that they have a great deal of variety both in skin color AND in hair color. I would predict that it is easier for both whites and blacks to distinguish Hispanics versus other groups because of this.

 

[KNightInBlue]

It looks like this thread is turning out pretty good. Just one question though...can you all actually say what school you go to instead of saying, "At my school", so we can get an idea of the atmosphere there? Thanks.

You can see where I go to school from my signature. In our admitting class for 2005 (I mention that specifically because we have some repeating students from last year), we have 2 black students, 1 male and 1 female, out of a class of almost 180.

That, to me, was shocking.

 

[skypilot]

You can see where I go to school from my signature. In our admitting class for 2005 (I mention that specifically because we have some repeating students from last year), we have 2 black students, 1 male and 1 female, out of a class of almost 180.

That, to me, was shocking.

If they can't maintain a diverse class in New York City something is really wrong.

 

[LadyJubilee8_18]

I think Q is correct that a large contributing factor to prejudice is based on the idea that we (the collective "we" of humanity) see people who are not like us as OTHER. In this way, we do not relate to them, and can even dehumanize them. In my own experience as a URM, or half URM, or whatever you want to call me, I've encountered ignorance more than I've encountered hate. Thus, the best solution, as one poster commented on above, is to confront prejudice when we witness it and use it as an opportunity to educate others.

Very true. People say outrageous things to me (like the instance I posted before) because they are ignorant and they feel their assertions are acceptable. I must admit that I was very (and still am to a lesser extent) ignorant of other races and cultures before I got to college. At my high school, there was one Asian person--the rest of the population was White, Black, or Mexican. It was like everyone hung out with their respective color-coded group (poor Asian girl) and no one interacted at all. I am very thankful that I attend such a culturally diverse university (U of H) where I've become better acquainted with many different groups of people. I think I've become most educated/more familiar with Asian culture (mostly Southeast Asian culture) and Hispanic culture (since my bf of almost 3 years is Mexican). I find it most interesting how self-identity changes as you learn to define others beyond their superficial racial descriptions. This is a great reason why medical school classes should be diverse. You don't really begin to understand all people until you are able to break this racial barrier.

 

[BlondeCookie]

I go to lunch many days between classes with a group of friends from school. Two of them are always talking about this reverse discrimination thing about how we (non-URMs) have to work harder and score better to get into schools, jobs, etc while the URMs have it so easy. It's really kinda annoying. Lately, I've been a bit put off by it.

There is one guy in our lunch group that keeps referring to a girl in our lab as "that monkey". Things like, "did you see what that 'monkey' did today? Why does that 'monkey' ask such stupid questions in class?" He is always cracking stupid one-liners like that. And the others laugh along. The girl happens to be black. Sorry for the naive question, but what is this derogatory association between monkeys and black people? Should I tell this fool to shut up?

 

[skypilot]

It is a slur, and a pretty disgusting one too.

 

[geekOCD]

Basically, racist scientists from back in the day decided through their "analysis" of cranial angles, shapes, noses, etc. that there was a hierarchal ranking of the races - white at the top, black at the bottom (closest to monkeys or great apes). From there you have a long history of monkey being a slur, continuing well up till today where soccer fans in europe have been blasted for making monkey noises and such to a black player on an opposing team. Try googling "Physiognomy" (the "science" behind the monkey connection) for more info.

 

[Saluki]

Basically, racist scientists from back in the day decided through their "analysis" of cranial angles, shapes, noses, etc. that there was a hierarchal ranking of the races - white at the top, black at the bottom (closest to monkeys or great apes). From there you have a long history of monkey being a slur, continuing well up till today where soccer fans in europe have been blasted for making monkey noises and such to a black player on an opposing team. Try googling "Physiognomy" (the "science" behind the monkey connection) for more info.

I especially liked the experiment where they determined intelligence by measuring how much grain would fit in the skulls of people of different races.... So scientific 🙄

 

[WhatUpDoc!]

Sorry for the naive question, but what is this derogatory association between monkeys and black people? Should I tell this fool to shut up?

YES!!! And then bust his @$$ for being so ignorant 😡

 

[Newton Bohr MD]

I can’t say any of these things really surprise me… When people are not being PC their views tend to be what they have been for the last 400 years…

 

[Hard24Get]

There is one guy in our lunch group that keeps referring to a girl in our lab as "that monkey". Things like, "did you see what that 'monkey' did today? Why does that 'monkey' ask such stupid questions in class?" He is always cracking stupid one-liners like that. And the others laugh along. The girl happens to be black. Sorry for the naive question, but what is this derogatory association between monkeys and black people? Should I tell this fool to shut up?

"Monkey" is also a term that was ued alot in the earlier 1900s, when it was acceptable to be entertained by blacks, but not for them to be equal in any way (like watching the antics of monkeys in a zoo or circus). This view of blacks explains why sports and the rest of the entertainment industry quickly integrated as opposed to more cerebral fields that don't tolerate such disparities well, like medicine. I'm wondering if this guy going to think of colleagues and patients like this for the rest of his life. Will he disregard consults from URM specialists? Will he fight as hard to save the life of a URM patient?

And we all know that there are some people that come off as less than bright. But rather than being judged individually (and generally with bias), each person is a potential penalty against the perceived intelligence of their race. I know a lot of stupid caucasians, but I don't go around attributing that to their race. On the other hand, although I'm often told that I am bright, people will say "oh, but you're not like those others". Meaning they are not allowing me to change their perception of my race! 😡

 

[BlahtoThis]

I think all sides in this deabte have proven they are both right and wrong on many levels by this point. (I've heard plenty of things from URM's at my school suggesting they are more deserving of special consideration than other people, regardless of the background of those other people.)

There's no doubt racism still exists. But there's also no doubt that URM's need to get significantly lower scores to get into medical school (unless you disagree with the AAMC's stats). Needing significantly lower scores means that it's easier to get in, period.

I just wish all this talk and money that's been dedicated to trying to get increased representation of underrepresented minorities in professional fields after high school/college would be dedicated to improving school systems and trying to improve the social structure for individuals coming from disadvantaged backgrounds. Maybe showing people that they have opportunities and are equal to other people from day 1 would contribute a lot more to fairly creating more equality.

 

[Brainsucker]

I think all sides in this deabte have proven they are both right and wrong on many levels by this point. (I've heard plenty of things from URM's at my school suggesting they are more deserving of special consideration than other people, regardless of the background of those other people.)

There's no doubt racism still exists. But there's also no doubt that URM's need to get significantly lower scores to get into medical school (unless you disagree with the AAMC's stats). Needing significantly lower scores means that it's easier to get in, period.

I just wish all this talk and money that's been dedicated to trying to get increased representation of underrepresented minorities in professional fields after high school/college would be dedicated to improving school systems and trying to improve the social structure for individuals coming from disadvantaged backgrounds. Maybe showing people that they have opportunities and are equal to other people from day 1 would contribute a lot more to fairly creating more equality.

1. This was intended not to be an AA thread.

2. "all this talk and money" doesn't amount to very much--not nearly enough to fix public schools.

 

[billclinton]

I think all sides in this deabte have proven they are both right and wrong on many levels by this point. (I've heard plenty of things from URM's at my school suggesting they are more deserving of special consideration than other people, regardless of the background of those other people.)

There's no doubt racism still exists. But there's also no doubt that URM's need to get significantly lower scores to get into medical school (unless you disagree with the AAMC's stats). Needing significantly lower scores means that it's easier to get in, period.

I just wish all this talk and money that's been dedicated to trying to get increased representation of underrepresented minorities in professional fields after high school/college would be dedicated to improving school systems and trying to improve the social structure for individuals coming from disadvantaged backgrounds. Maybe showing people that they have opportunities and are equal to other people from day 1 would contribute a lot more to fairly creating more equality.

I will concede that some URMs have a harder time in the process. However, what I don't understand is why few people talk about the disadvantages of people from poor socioeconomic backgrounds. Why don't people ever talk about this? These people face just as many obstacles, imho.

 

[beefballs]

I will concede that some URMs have a harder time in the process. However, what I don't understand is why few people talk about the disadvantages of people from poor socioeconomic backgrounds. Why don't people ever talk about this? These people face just as many obstacles, imho.

more

 

[geekOCD]

well, there is a box to check for disadvantaged status on the amcas which is seperate from the URM boxes. Why do people always ignore that box? Adcoms do take it into account. (low SES should definitely be talked about. but people act like it's totally ignored, which isn't quite true.)

 

[8744]

.

 

[blkprl]

My school seems to have a good representation overall. But one thing i noticed that bothers me. There is not one black male in our entire class. And that does not represent the demographics of the area.

that's because most of them are in jail.....
checkout this statistic
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/prisons.htm

 

[beefballs]

and I would be willing to bet that the vast overwhelming majority of those of all races that were incarcarated were poor

 

[blkprl]

I don't think that's what he/she was saying at all... Rather, that because of affirmative action even the people who would have gotten in w/o that boost are often assumed to be less qualified....[/QUOTE]

very well said... Saluki

 

[blkprl]

and I would be willing to bet that the vast overwhelming majority of those of all races that were incarcarated were poor

and high school dropouts

 

[Brainsucker]

that's because most of them are in jail.....
checkout this statistic
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/prisons.htm

Wow, that's a nasty slur. While it's true that blacks are overrepresented in jail, there's 3,218 black males in prison/100,000 black males in the US. I'd hardly call that most. 3.2% isn't nearly enough to change the representation of black males in other fields significantly.

 

[blkprl]

If they can't maintain a diverse class in New York City something is really wrong.

NYMC is not in New York City...

 

[blkprl]

I go to lunch many days between classes with a group of friends from school. Two of them are always talking about this reverse discrimination thing about how we (non-URMs) have to work harder and score better to get into schools, jobs, etc while the URMs have it so easy. It's really kinda annoying. Lately, I've been a bit put off by it.

There is one guy in our lunch group that keeps referring to a girl in our lab as "that monkey". Things like, "did you see what that 'monkey' did today? Why does that 'monkey' ask such stupid questions in class?" He is always cracking stupid one-liners like that. And the others laugh along. The girl happens to be black. Sorry for the naive question, but what is this derogatory association between monkeys and black people? Should I tell this fool to shut up?

Please do or give me his number I will tell him myself.

 

[beefballs]

Wow, that's a nasty slur. While it's true that blacks are overrepresented in jail, there's 3,218 black males in prison/100,000 black males in the US. I'd hardly call that most. 3.2% isn't nearly enough to change the representation of black males in other fields significantly.

SHe wasn't slurring them (black males) she was aluding to the much higher number of blacks in jail versus other races. -

blk prl-I am not arguing with you yes probably poor and insufficiently educated

 

[blkprl]

I think all sides in this deabte have proven they are both right and wrong on many levels by this point. (I've heard plenty of things from URM's at my school suggesting they are more deserving of special consideration than other people, regardless of the background of those other people.)

There's no doubt racism still exists. But there's also no doubt that URM's need to get significantly lower scores to get into medical school (unless you disagree with the AAMC's stats). Needing significantly lower scores means that it's easier to get in, period.

I just wish all this talk and money that's been dedicated to trying to get increased representation of underrepresented minorities in professional fields after high school/college would be dedicated to improving school systems and trying to improve the social structure for individuals coming from disadvantaged backgrounds. Maybe showing people that they have opportunities and are equal to other people from day 1 would contribute a lot more to fairly creating more equality.

VERY WELL SAID....but I must disagree with the statement in bold though...
just because URMs get lower scores does not mean that they always get in especially to the top ten schools. if that's the case there will be significantly more URMs in med schools.
there are not enough URMs in med school because most of them are not competitive enough and adcoms usually have to compete with eachother for the same handful that are qualified (I heard this from an adcom member at a top ten school)

This issue of low test scores goes way beyond MCATs and has its roots in the disparity in educational opportunities for poor people (who are usually underrepresented minorities in medicine)
Please read this weeks time magazine or watch today's Oprah show or visit www.standup.org and you'll see what I mean. By the time, most URMs take the MCAT they are all ready disadvantaged....I actually had this discussion with fellow URMs at a second look visit that I attended. the affluent ones who attended good elementary and middle schools disagreed and the ones that came form lower income families agreed

so it all boils down to money and not intelligence......

 

[blkprl]

Wow, that's a nasty slur. While it's true that blacks are overrepresented in jail, there's 3,218 black males in prison/100,000 black males in the US. I'd hardly call that most. 3.2% isn't nearly enough to change the representation of black males in other fields significantly.

the statistic for white males is 463/100,000 that means there are 7 times more black males than whites in jail.

there are not in law school
http://www.lsac.org/LSAC.asp?url=lsac/minorities-in-legal-education.asp

or in graduate school...believe me I checked

they are not engineers
http://www.nsbe.org/aboutnsbe/mission.php

so obviously they are either dead, on the streets, or in jail.

I know it's sad but that's the truth.....

 

[Obra4]

the statistic for white males is 463/100,000 that means there are 7 times more black males than whites in jail.

there are not in law school
http://www.lsac.org/LSAC.asp?url=lsac/minorities-in-legal-education.asp

or in graduate school...believe me I checked

they are not engineers
http://www.nsbe.org/aboutnsbe/mission.php

so obviously they are either dead, on the streets, or in jail.

I know it's sad but that's the truth.....

Apparently, I am either dead, on the streets or in jail. Thank you Queen non sequitur! Thanks for the heads up. It's a little chilly and I could really use a blanket statement right now....... Especially one so warm and fuzzy......On the bright side it makes simply being alive a major deviation from the norm for me. Ah, Success, so few taste it's sweet ambrosia!!!

At the same time it makes me sad. Because it means that people like you think I really don't belong .....I knew I should have applied to jail instead of medical school.

You know, for the brotherhood.

Kwasia

Now back to your regularly scheduled programing. 😡

 

[beefballs]

VERY WELL SAID....but I must disagree with the statement in bold though...
just because URMs get lower scores does not mean that they always get in especially to the top ten schools. if that's the case there will be significantly more URMs in med schools.
there are not enough URMs in med school because most of them are not competitive enough and adcoms usually have to compete with eachother for the same handful that are qualified (I heard this from an adcom member at a top ten school)

This issue of low test scores goes way beyond MCATs and has its roots in the disparity in educational opportunities for poor people (who are usually underrepresented minorities in medicine)
Please read this weeks time magazine or watch today's Oprah show or visit www.standup.org and you'll see what I mean. By the time, most URMs take the MCAT they are all ready disadvantaged....I actually had this discussion with fellow URMs at a second look visit that I attended. the affluent ones who attended good elementary and middle schools disagreed and the ones that came form lower income families agreed

so it all boils down to money and not intelligence......

money and not race

 

[BlondeCookie]

I told the guy yesterday that it's not cool to call somebody "monkey". She's black. And I told him if you want to call her anything, call her black or African-American. Or better yet, call her by her name. He didn't take it very well. And started off on his stupid tirades about how he would've got into such and such school if it weren't for those damn "monkeys" and that at the residency level it's more of the same. I told him that if not for slavery and the oppression of blacks generations ago as well as the hardships & disadvantages that other minorities have faced, there would be no need for Affirmative Action because our med school classes would be far more diverse than they are now. I was basically told that I have no clue. 🙁

Anyhow, I really don't like to get into these Affirmative Action discussions. Most of my friends are white and they think like this guy, although none of them go to the extremes of using derogartory slurs and such. His reverse discrimination bent is like his whole identity or something. I don't even like the guy. It's just that my friend is massively attracted to him, so I end up sitting there in our luch group with my friend and this a-hole.

 

[Brainsucker]

the statistic for white males is 463/100,000 that means there are 7 times more black males than whites in jail.

there are not in law school
http://www.lsac.org/LSAC.asp?url=lsac/minorities-in-legal-education.asp

or in graduate school...believe me I checked

they are not engineers
http://www.nsbe.org/aboutnsbe/mission.php

so obviously they are either dead, on the streets, or in jail.

I know it's sad but that's the truth.....

I stand by my criticism. You said that there weren't many black males in med school because most of them were in jail. BTW, your current analysis seems to have left out working. (Wait, why I am humoring him?)

 

[blkprl]

Apparently, I am either dead, on the streets or in jail. Thank you Queen non sequitur! Thanks for the heads up. It's a little chilly and I could really use a blanket statement right now....... Especially one so warm and fuzzy......On the bright side it makes simply being alive a major deviation from the norm for me. Ah, Success, so few taste it's sweet ambrosia!!!

At the same time it makes me sad. Because it means that people like you think I really don't belong .....I knew I should have applied to jail instead of medical school.

You know, for the brotherhood.

Kwasia

Now back to your regularly scheduled programing. 😡

I suppose I should apologize (and explain) to the black males out there who are doing good and getting somewhere. I was trying to make a point about the obvious disparity and stating one of the reasons for this disparity...
http://www.aamc.org/data/facts/2005/2003to2005detmat.html


Obviously, this a very sensitive subject for Obra.

There's no need for name calling (yes, I know what Kwasia means)

 

[Obra4]

I suppose I should apologize (and explain) to the black males out there who are doing good and getting somewhere. I was trying to make a point about the obvious disparity and stating one of the reasons for this disparity...
http://www.aamc.org/data/facts/2005/2003to2005detmat.html


Obviously, this a very sensitive subject for Obra.

There's no need for name calling (yes, I know what Kwasia means)

I will apologize for the name calling ( I knew you would know what that meant)..........but not the sarcasm.....I rather enjoyed that.

BTW....the link above doesn't work.

 

[Newton Bohr MD]

I will apologize for the name calling ( I knew you would know what that meant)..........but not the sarcasm.....I rather enjoyed that.

BTW....the link above doesn't work.

hey I speak some Twi also 🙂

 

[Gbemi24]

hey I speak some Twi also 🙂

Are you Ghanaian?

 

[Newton Bohr MD]

Are you Ghanaian?

Hahaha yes! I am Ghanaian, Black, African-American, and many other things…

 

[Newton Bohr MD]

I told the guy yesterday that it's not cool to call somebody "monkey". She's black. And I told him if you want to call her anything, call her black or African-American. Or better yet, call her by her name. He didn't take it very well. And started off on his stupid tirades about how he would've got into such and such school if it weren't for those damn "monkeys" and that at the residency level it's more of the same. I told him that if not for slavery and the oppression of blacks generations ago as well as the hardships & disadvantages that other minorities have faced, there would be no need for Affirmative Action because our med school classes would be far more diverse than they are now. I was basically told that I have no clue. 🙁

Anyhow, I really don't like to get into these Affirmative Action discussions. Most of my friends are white and they think like this guy, although none of them go to the extremes of using derogartory slurs and such. His reverse discrimination bent is like his whole identity or something. I don't even like the guy. It's just that my friend is massively attracted to him, so I end up sitting there in our luch group with my friend and this a-hole.

Your friend seems obsessed with monkeys!!! Why did he not become a vet??

 

[PurpleHaze]

I told the guy yesterday that it's not cool to call somebody "monkey". She's black. And I told him if you want to call her anything, call her black or African-American. Or better yet, call her by her name. He didn't take it very well. And started off on his stupid tirades about how he would've got into such and such school if it weren't for those damn "monkeys" and that at the residency level it's more of the same. I told him that if not for slavery and the oppression of blacks generations ago as well as the hardships & disadvantages that other minorities have faced, there would be no need for Affirmative Action because our med school classes would be far more diverse than they are now. I was basically told that I have no clue. 🙁

Anyhow, I really don't like to get into these Affirmative Action discussions. Most of my friends are white and they think like this guy, although none of them go to the extremes of using derogartory slurs and such. His reverse discrimination bent is like his whole identity or something. I don't even like the guy. It's just that my friend is massively attracted to him, so I end up sitting there in our luch group with my friend and this a-hole.

The saddest part is that this person is going to become a doctor.

 

[Obra4]

The saddest part is that this person is going to become a doctor.

That is just a travesty!!!

 

[Saluki]

The saddest part is that this person is going to become a doctor.

It is sad, but it's not just a thing against URMs... I think it's sad that so many people with a lack of patience and a lack of concern and sensitivity for others make it into med school. It seems like there are a lot of people in my pre-med classes that if they don't like the way a person participates in class or don't like how helpful they are in lab or they just think a person is not that bright it becomes very personal.

"That b**** doesn't know anything about chemistry"

"That guy is such an idiot; how did he ever get into school here?"

The racial slur toward his classmate is just one more example of contempt for others.... The derogatory comment is just one more way for him to belittle a person that he either doesn't get along with or doesn't think well of...

 

[infiniti]

Are you Ghanaian?

I am guessing you are Yoruba, Gbemi. Your name means lift me.

 

[Hard24Get]

There's no doubt racism still exists. But there's also no doubt that URM's need to get significantly lower scores to get into medical school (unless you disagree with the AAMC's stats). Needing significantly lower scores means that it's easier to get in, period.

About the AAMC scores. I just wanted to point out that the majority of URMs (esp blacks) end up at historically black medical colleges (created due to segregation, etc). These schools consider other factors as more important than grades/MCAT, so you have to keep in mind that these schools effect the URM averages significantly (caucasians can go there too although few apply). Also, URMs are more likely to be involved in community projects, etc, which bolsters their application. Looking at many individual schools, there is only a slight difference between URM grades and that of the GP. As someone who sat on UPenn's admissions committee, I can say that being a URM is one of many diverse characteristics that make the application more attractive, but you still have to make the cutoff. The only exception to the cutoff, it seems, are relatives of faculty and alumni.....

I just wish all this talk and money that's been dedicated to trying to get increased representation of underrepresented minorities in professional fields after high school/college would be dedicated to improving school systems and trying to improve the social structure for individuals coming from disadvantaged backgrounds. Maybe showing people that they have opportunities and are equal to other people from day 1 would contribute a lot more to fairly creating more equality.

I completely agree with this!!!! 😍

 

[Thundrstorm]

I told the guy yesterday that it's not cool to call somebody "monkey". She's black. And I told him if you want to call her anything, call her black or African-American. Or better yet, call her by her name. He didn't take it very well. And started off on his stupid tirades about how he would've got into such and such school if it weren't for those damn "monkeys" and that at the residency level it's more of the same. I told him that if not for slavery and the oppression of blacks generations ago as well as the hardships & disadvantages that other minorities have faced, there would be no need for Affirmative Action because our med school classes would be far more diverse than they are now. I was basically told that I have no clue. 🙁

Anyhow, I really don't like to get into these Affirmative Action discussions. Most of my friends are white and they think like this guy, although none of them go to the extremes of using derogartory slurs and such. His reverse discrimination bent is like his whole identity or something. I don't even like the guy. It's just that my friend is massively attracted to him, so I end up sitting there in our luch group with my friend and this a-hole.

Thank you for speaking up. Not everyone would have done that. 👍

 

[hobs]

It is sad, but it's not just a thing against URMs... I think it's sad that so many people with a lack of patience and a lack of concern and sensitivity for others make it into med school. It seems like there are a lot of people in my pre-med classes that if they don't like the way a person participates in class or don't like how helpful they are in lab or they just think a person is not that bright it becomes very personal.

"That b**** doesn't know anything about chemistry"

"That guy is such an idiot; how did he ever get into school here?"

The racial slur toward his classmate is just one more example of contempt for others.... The derogatory comment is just one more way for him to belittle a person that he either doesn't get along with or doesn't think well of...

It's interesting that people in med school and doctors have this extremely critical character trait. True, this is a generalization, but really-- What kind of person enjoys telling other people how to eat and what to do all day? What gives someone the right to think they know best for OTHER PEOPLE? There's a certain amount of self importance and hubris going on here.

As far as URMs in my school go, i think relations are pretty good. I don't really go to school all that often (mostly to avoid the attitude mentioned above), but it seems that there's a positive vibe between races. I took an elective on health disparities, and the conversations we had about race, gender, etc. and health/culture were low key. There wasn't a whole lot of contentiousness with respect to race, which is a step in the right direction.

And that "monkey" kid......that nastiness is going to hit him in the ass one day, and perhaps he'll learn. I feel kind of sorry for him, though. It would really suck to be thinking of people in a derogatory way all the time; life must be pretty bleak.

 

[WhatUpDoc!]

I told the guy yesterday that it's not cool to call somebody "monkey". She's black. And I told him if you want to call her anything, call her black or African-American. Or better yet, call her by her name.

That's what I'm talkin about. I'm glad you have more sense than your classmates. I'd still like to tear into that dude myself... but calling him out was more than enough... good job 👍

 

[latinfridley]

This is a great reason why medical school classes should be diverse. You don't really begin to understand all people until you are able to break this racial barrier.

...I'm gonna throw a plug in for BCM. It's one of the most diverse medical schools in the country. ~25% URM I believe.

 

[fun8stuff]

That's what I'm talkin about. I'm glad you have more sense than your classmates. I'd still like to tear into that dude myself... but calling him out was more than enough... good job 👍

there are people around today that call people 'monkey'? wtf?