Postbac allowed to fulfil degree requirements?

[Ketu]

hi all,

I think I have a peculiar question. I am from the Engineering background and my undergrad GPA is not that great although the cumulative comes to around 3.2. been working for about 2.5 years in total between my bachelor's & masters and afterwards added (probably a unique situation, for someone wanting to change career after a masters).

My question: Does anyone have a clue about postbac premed students allowed to fulfil requirements towards a second bachelor's degree while they were on the traditional postbac premed course (3 years including glide year)?

I want to be sure that my application to medical school becomes competitive hence my apprehensiveness, also there are programs like MD-PhD which does help in graduating debt free and I'm most certainly sure that my undergrad major along with all my marks wouldn't be competitive enough for a PhD, let alone the subject requirement. A second bachelor in biochemistry/neuroscience isn't a very bad idea, according to me and that might later help me in applications for MD-PhD (if at all I happen to get into in any of them).

I need opinions please, to make an informed decision.

Thanks

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[Ketu]

I am not sure I understand your question; please clarify

Hey,

Sorry, I shall reframe it.

Hypothetical scenario: let's say you're in a traditional postbac premed program and you decided to apply to med schools through the linkage program. But your undergrad GPA is not enough to make a competitive application. In that case, if you decided to pursue a second bachelors, will your academic advisor or the dean of school allow you to do that?

*Since you're not an Undergraduate student of the university nor applied to any undergraduate program, but a postbaccalaureate premed student who wants to continue taking more courses to increase the GPA and have a second undergraduate degree.

 

[RangerBob]

It all depends on if those courses count towards the degree or not (and if you end up enrolling at another school, if they're transferable). Presumably all the bio and chem pre-reqs are required for a biochem major. I do believe you have to be an actual student (not an "open university" student) however. This is a question you really need to ask the university you're taking the courses at, as they may have their own policy.

At some programs post-bacs are enrolled as grad students (as was my case), or undergrads. Sometimes it's a specific certificate program and you're eligible for aid, other times you're a non-degree student and not eligible for aid. Everything is very specific to the college/university you're taking the courses at.

However, I think you're also focusing a bit on the wrong question. A second bachelor's will not make you a more competitive applicant. It looks like you already understand that it's your GPA that needs help--I'd focus on that. I think you're someone who might benefit from a special master's program (SMP). Many (most?) of these require you to have already finished the prereqs so you'd likely still want/need to do the post-bac work prior to applying. You can find more details in the post-bac and career changer forums, but it's worth looking into.

I cannot stress how important is is to get only A's/A-'s in any coursework here on forward. You need to prove your 3.2 undergrad GPA does not accurately represent you anymore. I'd imagine two years of solid A's, A-'s would show that (obviously more would help even more, but doing 4 more years to get another bachelor's is a waste of time/money in my mind--however, if you've got the time and money go for it, as I'd love to go back to college and get another degree just for fun). Hopefully some medical school admins can weight in as I'd take their word over mine.

 

[Ketu]

It all depends on if those courses count towards the degree or not (and if you end up enrolling at another school, if they're transferable). Presumably all the bio and chem pre-reqs are required for a biochem major. I do believe you have to be an actual student (not an "open university" student) however. This is a question you really need to ask the university you're taking the courses at, as they may have their own policy.

At some programs post-bacs are enrolled as grad students (as was my case), or undergrads. Sometimes it's a specific certificate program and you're eligible for aid, other times you're a non-degree student and not eligible for aid. Everything is very specific to the college/university you're taking the courses at.

However, I think you're also focusing a bit on the wrong question. A second bachelor's will not make you a more competitive applicant. It looks like you already understand that it's your GPA that needs help--I'd focus on that. I think you're someone who might benefit from a special master's program (SMP). Many (most?) of these require you to have already finished the prereqs so you'd likely still want/need to do the post-bac work prior to applying. You can find more details in the post-bac and career changer forums, but it's worth looking into.

I cannot stress how important is is to get only A's/A-'s in any coursework here on forward. You need to prove your 3.2 undergrad GPA does not accurately represent you anymore. I'd imagine two years of solid A's, A-'s would show that (obviously more would help even more, but doing 4 more years to get another bachelor's is a waste of time/money in my mind--however, if you've got the time and money go for it, as I'd love to go back to college and get another degree just for fun). Hopefully some medical school admins can weight in as I'd take their word over mine.

Thank you so much.

I really wanted someone to tell me that a second bachelor's is a waste of time. Although, I knew it but its good to hear others opinions that matches yours. Besides, its going to be cumbersome and I don't think i would be able to pay for it without a loan= more debt!!!

Anyways, Have you any idea about the postbac program at Columbia GS? Could you share anything you know?

I've looked into few schools and Columbia GS seems to have the oldest and the largest Postbac Premed Program with around 15 linkage schools and they say previous placement rate of 90% (Not particularly sure about that) for former students into medical schools. Going by that fact, I think that makes it a great program if somebody can get into it. My only concern is my undergrad GPA. Although, few linkage schools like Cornell, Rutgers Robert Wood Johnson states that for the linkage program you need a combined undergrad & postbac GPA of 3.75 or no subject less than B, Columbia's own medical school- 'The school of physicians and Surgeons' and the Alpert Brown both have strict 3.5 undergraduate GPA requirement.

The only thing I'm not sure is whether that strict requirement applies only for students going through the linkage program or it applies to anyone generally. I'm a bit terrified by this entire undergrad GPA thing. I wish I could change something between the ages of 17-21. Damn!

Besides my GPA bantering, anything on schools that would look more favourably on an applicant's performance at the Postbac Program, MCAT, interviews, research work, shadowing a physician, recommendation letters, etc and not put a strict 3.5 GPA requirement which means youth who made mistakes during their teenage years essentially have no good medical future.

 

[Ketu]

haha... Yeah you're right, I need to stop thinking like an engineer. Yesterday I was busy detailing the various subjects needed to be studied at premed, their credits, what would be my 'probability' of getting an A in them, time required for each (factoring an A, so that the overall looks better), how am i going to navigate through them etc etc...

I think I need to stop contemplating and put my time and energy in writing a good essay with a more holistic approach describing why I want to pursue medicine and how I've come to that decision rather than constant factoring of my GPA.

Postbac Programs you would like to suggest? Not the high calibre ivy leagues but decent programs that would be of help to me?

Btw, Thanks for such a detailed answer and for tagging @Goro

 

[Goro]

They're a dime a dozen. Pick one that had success in getting its grads into med school.

You can do them DIY, too.

haha... Yeah you're right, I need to stop thinking like an engineer. Yesterday I was busy detailing the various subjects needed to be studied at premed, their credits, what would be my 'probability' of getting an A in them, time required for each (factoring an A, so that the overall looks better), how am i going to navigate through them etc etc...

I think I need to stop contemplating and put my time and energy in writing a good essay with a more holistic approach describing why I want to pursue medicine and how I've come to that decision rather than constant factoring of my GPA.

Postbac Programs you would like to suggest? Not the high calibre ivy leagues but decent programs that would be of help to me?

Btw, Thanks for such a detailed answer and for tagging @Goro

 

[Goro]

Let's see,....
ALL DO schools
BU
Tulane
Your own state schools
UCSF
Columbia
Dartmouth
Albany
Drexel
Rosy Franklin
Duke
U Miami
Vandy
Pitt
NYMC

There are may schools that reward reinvention (insert @Goro list here). Indeed, most medical schools will weigh a postbacc performance heavily. It will not wipe out your previous work, but having a good post bacc, MCAT, advanced degrees in engineering, and a strong narrative will put your story into context. .

 

[Ketu]

Let's see,....
ALL DO schools
BU
Tulane
Your own state schools
UCSF
Columbia
Dartmouth
Albany
Drexel
Rosy Franklin
Duke
U Miami
Vandy
Pitt
NYMC

thank you for the list.