How important is it to have a P on step 1 if you get a decent STEP 2 score? Isn't the assumption that if your STEP 2 score is decent you would likely pass Step 1?
You know what they say about assumptions. Also imagine they do use STEP 1 as some type of screening just to order how they want to view the applications where they start with everyone that has a P. Someone without a P would just not be included in the first group they review, which would be unfortunate.
Most PD's will only interview applicants that check all the boxes and then some. A lot of med school is about just checking the boxes.
Nobody knows with certainty how PDs will react in the future to all of the various scenarios that we can imagine because there is not yet a precedent for P/F Step 1.
I thought DOs dont take Step 3 even if they took Step 1 and 2
Isn't it up to the individual that takes both USMLE and COMLEX which series they wish to complete to gain state licensure?
I wish but then the AOA would lose on $$ b/c no one would take COMLEX. To get their license and practice DO's needs the COMLEX lv 1, 2, and 3. USMLE is just taken so residency directors can compare STEP scores.
Forgive my ignorance, but if a DO meets a state's requirements for licensure by completion of USMLE Steps 1-3, then who forces them to take COMLEX level 3? Licensure codes in all but 5 states dictate that either series is fine. I get that AOA schools require DO students to take COMLEX 1 & 2 in order to receive their degree, but they can't enforce anything beyond graduation (hence, COMLEX 3), right?
For state License you may need Comlex PE or state OMM practical exam, depending on the state.
Yeah I’m hoping to get a better answer to this too whether we can skip Level 3 completely. Multiple people online have told me that Level 3 is required and not to even bother taking Step 3 as well.
Yes, you can skip COMLEX Level 3 and take Step 3 except for the handful of states that have the OMM requirement for DOs. I'd say just take COMLEX Level 3 and be done with it, there is no reason to limit yourself when it comes to State licensure no matter how deep your hate for the NBOME runs.
Yes, you have to complete one 3 board exam series of either COMLEX or USMLE for state licensure. But what OP was asking was whether it is even worth it for DOs to take Step 1 since it is P/F anyway, and since Step 1 completion is also not required to take Step 2 CK. It is not mix and match just trying to level the playing field for residency application. DOs are required by their schools to take COMLEX Level 1 and 2 anyway.
DO students are not required to release their USMLE scores when applying on ERAS. Which means as a DO you get all the benefits by taking the USMLE exams, but almost none of the repercussions. Only downside is for the rare programs that require you to have passing USMLE exams. I only had a passing Step 1 but no Step 2 on my ERAS application, and had both COMLEX level 1 and 2, no program of my 13 interviews asked for Step 2 except for my number 1. I also know people who failed Step 1 and did not report it on their app and still matched. Although Neurology is not competitive, but I can tell you just having a passing Step 1 in there got me a look at many places that wouldn't have otherwise. I was also part of the bottom 1/4 for my class.
Level 1 and 2 is no longer required to graduate at RVU?
Level 1, Step 1, and Level 2
Oh thats really interesting. I wonder if that gets the folks at AOA’s panties in a twist to make Step 1 a requirement. I love that for RVU though.
apparently 25 years ago that was a 75% percentile score...
I can't see it going pass/fail, what's next, a blind lottery for programs to select applicants. If that would occur, those from lower ranked schools would have an uphill battle to compete against those that go to top tier schools. While school prestige/ranking has always played a part of the selection process, it would be weighed that much more with a P/F Step 1 & 2. With step 2 CS gone, schools going P/F, elimination of AOA and so on, what's left to rank applicants......virtual Interviews, LOR, research?
Not very common but it happens. Point is that people change their minds after experiencing their clerkships and it's better to keep other options available.
This is true, idk if it just uworld or what? But about 60 percent of uworld step 2 is uworld step 1.
For FM and Peds, you don't necessarily need Step 1 and 2, but you never know what might happen. You might change your mind during clinicals. I didn't choose to apply neurology until late 3rd year. I was going to apply IM before I changed my mind after rotating in both specialties.
MD world*
For starters, I think having two different tests is part of what stratifies MD applicants from DO applicants in the mind of program directors. OMM could have easily been a separate exam, but it was not designed this way. When MD program directors are familiar with USMLE step and not familiar with comlex then that sets up the notion that it may be easier (which by the subjective data I've seen seems to be slightly true, but who knows). So I think it all comes down to perceptions. The only way to beat the judgement will be to have applicants go through the same training i.e. both taking the step exam. Otherwise there will always be judgement and bias.
Why do you think that not taking step puts DOs behind Caribbean graduates?
I also appreciate you having an opposing opinion to discuss and doing it civilly.
I agree with you here buddy. It’s hard for them to give up that 900 per person.
