2011-2012 University of Pennsylvania Application Thread

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JWinters said:
Just called--they said all full merit scholarships have gone out, but that there are still a few partial merit scholarships that haven't been announced. It sounded like they would be released around the same time as the need-based packages, possibly next week, but by penn preview at the latest. Hope that helps!
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Well, then for me, it looks like it is over. Oh well. I'll go to a lesser school that has offered me money and crush the boards. Same diff in the end I guess.
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To those who were expecting merit aid, don't give up yet. If you have offers from other schools, send a copy of your award letter from the other medical schools to the admissions office at Penn. They take this into consideration and may be able to come up with extra money...if they really want you of course.

In addition, there will be some students that get awarded scholarships at Penn, but who choose to attend another school ..(why in the world would anyone go elsewhere ??? !!!! :) ) So, it is advisable to wait a little and see what happens... However, I will add that this only works if you got aid from peer schools or other high ranked med schools...
 
Penn demonstrates how much they want us by providing some aid. If they are not that interested in some of us, they won't offer us aid, and we should take that into consideration. I'm not going to start begging. They either have money or they don't. I find the fact that they will "find" money if I beg a bit demeaning.

They choose to give 24 people 100% rides, instead of 48 people 50%. Great, they'll get those 24. Personally I see no reason to pay $280,000 for something they give away to others with marginally better or worse stats.
 
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DoctorDachshund said:
Penn demonstrates how much they want us by providing some aid. If they are not that interested in some of us, they won't offer us aid, and we should take that into consideration. I'm not going to start begging. They either have money or they don't. I find the fact that they will "find" money if I beg a bit demeaning.

They choose to give 24 people 100% rides, instead of 48 people 50%. Great, they'll get those 24. Personally I see no reason to pay $280,000 for something they give away to others with marginally better or worse stats.
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That's just the way the process works at most schools. They have limited scholarships and have to draw the line somewhere. Unfortunately, there are a ton of very talented people out there, so many talented applicants don't get scholarships obviously. I don't see anything demeaning about negotiating for a better offer, as this is common is in most professional and academic settings where money is involved. If you have leverage and can negotiate, go ahead and see how much it can help you.

Also, admissions and fin-aid is just part of the med school equation and you've come a long way in the med school admissions process. Don't let your ego prevent you from trying to maximize your outcome at this stage of the game.
 
DoctorDachshund said:
Penn demonstrates how much they want us by providing some aid. If they are not that interested in some of us, they won't offer us aid, and we should take that into consideration. I'm not going to start begging. They either have money or they don't. I find the fact that they will "find" money if I beg a bit demeaning.

They choose to give 24 people 100% rides, instead of 48 people 50%. Great, they'll get those 24. Personally I see no reason to pay $280,000 for something they give away to others with marginally better or worse stats.
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Really? This is your attitude after getting in, when thousands of others applied this year and didn't? They want you. Just because they want others a bit more does not make your admission less meaningful.

I understand the financial issue is frustrating, but let's maintain a bit of humility here.
 
DoctorDachshund said:
Penn demonstrates how much they want us by providing some aid. If they are not that interested in some of us, they won't offer us aid, and we should take that into consideration. I'm not going to start begging. They either have money or they don't. I find the fact that they will "find" money if I beg a bit demeaning.

They choose to give 24 people 100% rides, instead of 48 people 50%. Great, they'll get those 24. Personally I see no reason to pay $280,000 for something they give away to others with marginally better or worse stats.
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We all got into Penn, that in itself is a great achievement. Let's not lose sight of that :).
 
lo215 said:
I received aid information last Wednesday. I was very happy with the aid package
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When did they receive your documents? Just trying to figure out when I should expect something. Thanks!
 
DoctorDachshund said:
Penn demonstrates how much they want us by providing some aid. If they are not that interested in some of us, they won't offer us aid, and we should take that into consideration. I'm not going to start begging. They either have money or they don't. I find the fact that they will "find" money if I beg a bit demeaning.

They choose to give 24 people 100% rides, instead of 48 people 50%. Great, they'll get those 24. Personally I see no reason to pay $280,000 for something they give away to others with marginally better or worse stats.
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Wow, I can see that you are extremely disappointed but I hope you can eventually get over your bitterness. I will venture to say that your attitude will not go well at Penn. Just think that things happen for a good reason. Make sure that you pay the $280,000 for a school where you would be a better fit.
 
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You're confusing me with somebody who cares what you think.


BrainBuff said:
Wow, I can see that you are extremely disappointed but I hope you can eventually get over your bitterness. I will venture to say that your attitude will not go well at Penn. Just think that things happen for a good reason. Make sure that you pay the $280,000 for a school where you would be a better fit.
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I thought they demonstrated how much you are in need of aid, by offering you some aid (need-based). In terms of full merit scholarships, do you consider yourself one of the top 20 people who applied and got accepted? If so, call them and tell them why they should also think so. While having more money to yourself is nice, even a poor soul like myself realizes that I can pay it off as a poor doctor. I think withdrawing now may demonstrate how little you want Penn, at least compared to others that are willing to go $280k in debt for the experience and opportunities Penn has to offer.Anyway, good luck. Even if you go to one of the "lesser" schools, as you call them, you'll still get an MD which is what matters most. Come do a sub-i at Penn for free.



DoctorDachshund said:
Penn demonstrates how much they want us by providing some aid. If they are not that interested in some of us, they won't offer us aid, and we should take that into consideration. I'm not going to start begging. They either have money or they don't. I find the fact that they will "find" money if I beg a bit demeaning.

They choose to give 24 people 100% rides, instead of 48 people 50%. Great, they'll get those 24. Personally I see no reason to pay $280,000 for something they give away to others with marginally better or worse stats.
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Can anybody gauge on how good the need-based aid is? Also, I received a substantial scholarship from my state school (it would cost 60k total for all 4 years), could I use that to negotiate my financial aid with Penn or do they look for only "top tier" offers?
 
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Anyone else choosing between Penn and Hopkins? This is an incredibly difficult decision so please share your views or message me. Thanks!
 
protonate said:
Can anybody gauge on how good the need-based aid is? Also, I received a substantial scholarship from my state school (it would cost 60k total for all 4 years), could I use that to negotiate my financial aid with Penn or do they look for only "top tier" offers?
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From my understanding, each school has their own specific way of calculating need, so I think it may be difficult to negotiate on the basis of need. If you were offered merit money, however, there may be some leeway, but I believe your chances are better if you have an offer from a competing school. That said, it doesn't hurt to ask.
 
protonate said:
Can anybody gauge on how good the need-based aid is? Also, I received a substantial scholarship from my state school (it would cost 60k total for all 4 years), could I use that to negotiate my financial aid with Penn or do they look for only "top tier" offers?
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They only really look for top tier offers. But it is worth a try.
 
masrawy said:
Anyone else choosing between Penn and Hopkins? This is an incredibly difficult decision so please share your views or message me. Thanks!
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Make sure you attend Second Look at Hopkins and Penn Preview at Penn. It will definitely be the deciding factor. The vibes at both schools are completely different. As far as academics...there are no significant differences.

Penn - undergrad and graduate students are all over the place. Most students live in Center City (a 15 min walk from school). Neighborhood is quaint, many small bars, restaurants, cafes. You have the river with a beautiful trail, plenty of joggers, bikes, etc. Students tend to be laid back with many outside interests.

Hopkins - isolated campus, neighborhood is just depressing. You will need to drive to get to a cool place to hang out. First year students live in dorms.

I almost went to Hopkins but I changed my mind after Penn Preview. Hopkins students seemed to be "all about medicine" with not too many outside interests. However, I loved the colleges structure and the whole emphasis they place on tradition. Professors are great and very sociable and accessible.

Overall, I found Penn students more "relaxed" and "easy going". Although the undergrad "ivy bros" can get annoying sometimes...
 
Megatron2016 said:
What would be considered top tier? Top 10-ish?" 5?
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That is the frustrating part because for instance, Harvard and Hopkins do not give merit aid. Penn seems to look closer to awards from schools they consider "peer schools"... regardless of ranking... Wash U (ranked 6th) is not a "peer school"...
 
BrainBuff said:
That is the frustrating part because for instance, Harvard and Hopkins do not give merit aid. Penn seems to look closer to awards from schools they consider "peer schools"... regardless of ranking... Wash U (ranked 6th) is not a "peer school"...
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chronicidal said:
Please elaborate.
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The only way in which WashU and Penn are not peer schools is an artifact of the admissions process: Penn has a higher yield.

Judging by the yield from other schools, this difference probably stems from location differences. Baltimore, Durham, St. Louis, and Palo Alto are on the low end (<50%), while Boston, San Francisco, and Philadelphia are on the high end (>50%). Though not shown here, Columbia/New York falls in the high category (55.6%) while Yale/New Haven falls in the low category (38.0%).

Other possible explanations for yield differences include admissions+financial aid practices and applicant self-selection.

You can make a reasonable argument that Penn ought not consider financial aid packages from WashU because of the yield difference, but you can't attribute the difference to the quality of the schools.
 
BrainBuff said:
No I am not, which is exactly the reason why I am really pleased to know you won't be coming here.
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Oh, but I will. I'm banking on the fact that most of the students are not wads like yourself. Have a nice life.
 
Other possible explanations for yield differences include admissions+financial aid practices and applicant self-selection.
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Personally, I think you have stated the main explanation. As far as the other issue, Penn seems to consider "peers" the schools with which they have the most cross admits.... and no, I am not going to take the thread there ;)
 
BrainBuff said:
Personally, I think you have stated the main explanation. As far as the other issue, Penn seems to consider "peers" the schools with which they have the most cross admits.... and no, I am not going to take the thread there ;)
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I think you mean schools with which Penn has a low cross-admit yield.

A cross-admit is someone who is admitted to two schools. I would think Penn has the most cross-admits with schools that are upper-tier or similar geographically, and have a relatively high acceptance rate. That could include WashU or even Jefferson.
 
Completely unrelated: I'm not going to be able to make it to preview because I'm going to be on the West Coast (I'm originally from the East Coast) and I'm somewhat concerned about the housing. Most likely, I'll look at housing sometime in May, but I was wondering whether it was easy to obtain housemates if I advertise on FB/SDN because I doubt I'll get to meet many students before orientation and I would really like to live with at least another person from Penn med.
 
ru4real1666 said:
Completely unrelated: I'm not going to be able to make it to preview because I'm going to be on the West Coast (I'm originally from the East Coast) and I'm somewhat concerned about the housing. Most likely, I'll look at housing sometime in May, but I was wondering whether it was easy to obtain housemates if I advertise on FB/SDN because I doubt I'll get to meet many students before orientation and I would really like to live with at least another person from Penn med.
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After you log onto the UPenn admitted student site, open this link: http://www.med.upenn.edu/student/

Click roommate list (this will only work if you are logged into the admit site)

This should be a good place to start.
 
Ah yield, the USN&WR statistic that has decimated the admissions process.

...Now that we've experienced student doctor at it's greatest... more Penn Puns anyone?
 
MembersName said:
Ah yield, the USN&WR statistic that has decimated the admissions process.

...Now that we've experienced student doctor at it's greatest... more Penn Puns anyone?
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nah, it's getting kind of late for that. Regarding previous financial aid comments, I'd think the opporutunity to attend UPenn would more than comPennsate for any lack of funding, at least imo.
 
Hi all, I went through all this financial aid nonsense last year and completely agree with BrainBuff - there are partial scholarships, and there is extra money they have to bargain with. Further, some people who are offered full rides turn them down, and then they offer the scholarship to someone else.

My advice is to be persistent. Make sure they know that Penn is the place you want to be and that finances are the only thing holding you back. Show them all the merit money have have obtained from other institutions. I know some people don't want to beg, but I certainly did. I kept in touch with the financial aid officers through email before preview, and then after preview I probably probably talked to them on the phone 4 times. But it did pay off, they did increase my award. In the end it didn't match the aid I got from other schools, but it was enough so that I didn't feel as bad about the amount of debt I will ultimately be in.

Talking about finances can be super awkward, but you have to do it. It can only ultimately help you in the end!
 
MembersName said:
Ah yield, the USN&WR statistic that has decimated the admissions process.

...Now that we've experienced student doctor at it's greatest... more Penn Puns anyone?
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Ya, it's the reason Pitt is afraid to offer admission to anybody with an MCAT over 36 unless you send them countless love letters.
 
bluedevils said:
Hi all, I went through all this financial aid nonsense last year and completely agree with BrainBuff - there are partial scholarships, and there is extra money they have to bargain with. Further, some people who are offered full rides turn them down, and then they offer the scholarship to someone else.

My advice is to be persistent. Make sure they know that Penn is the place you want to be and that finances are the only thing holding you back. Show them all the merit money have have obtained from other institutions. I know some people don't want to beg, but I certainly did. I kept in touch with the financial aid officers through email before preview, and then after preview I probably probably talked to them on the phone 4 times. But it did pay off, they did increase my award. In the end it didn't match the aid I got from other schools, but it was enough so that I didn't feel as bad about the amount of debt I will ultimately be in.

Talking about finances can be super awkward, but you have to do it. It can only ultimately help you in the end!
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Do you have any sense for the percentage of people who are getting any merit? Then after that, do you have any sense about other aid... is it only given to people whose parents are making $50,000 or less? How many people are paying the full amount??
 
chronicidal said:
I think you mean schools with which Penn has a low cross-admit yield.

A cross-admit is someone who is admitted to two schools. I would think Penn has the most cross-admits with schools that are upper-tier or similar geographically, and have a relatively high acceptance rate. That could include WashU or even Jefferson.
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No, I meant cross admits. I did not mean "low cross admit yield". Penn has the greatest number of cross admits with Harvard, Hopkins, Yale, Stanford, Columbia and Northwestern. There are not too many cross admits with WashU and definitely almost none with Jefferson.

On the other hand, Hopkins and WashU share a significant number. I think this definitely says something about the Penn admissions process.
 
BrainBuff said:
No, I meant cross admits. I did not mean "low cross admit yield". Penn has the greatest number of cross admits with Harvard, Hopkins, Yale, Stanford, Columbia and Northwestern. There are not too many cross admits with WashU and definitely almost none with Jefferson.

On the other hand, Hopkins and WashU share a significant number. I think this definitely says something about the Penn admissions process.
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That's interesting if true. How do you know this?
 
chronicidal said:
That's interesting. How do you know this?
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I have asked. We have access to the admitted list of students every year, and during Penn Preview it is widely discussed since students are trying to make a decision, comparing schools, etc.

If you go to Second Look at WashU, you will see that not too many students were admitted to Penn, however there will be plenty of Hopkins, U of Chicago and Duke cross admits.
 
BrainBuff said:
I have asked. We have access to the admitted list of students every year, and during Penn Preview it is widely discussed since students are trying to make a decision, comparing schools, etc.

If you go to Second Look at WashU, you will see that not too many students were admitted to Penn, however there will be plenty of Hopkins, U of Chicago and Duke cross admits.
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Your list of admitted students has also a list of schools they're accepted to?

Did you see such a list at WashU?

Of course school decisions are discussed, but it feels so anecdotal. You don't get to ask anywhere near 100 people at revisit about their top considerations. My experience at WashU second look actually contradicts your claim; I recall meeting more Penn admits than Hopkins/Pritzker/Duke admits. Of course I'm not claiming that's reflective of the true cross-admit pattern. I'm just skeptical of your claims.
 
Withdrew my acceptance this morning. Hopefully it opens up a spot for someone on the waitlist!

Good luck to everyone
 
Anyone know if there is always something required on every day during the preclinical curriculum or if it is possible to sometimes take a three day weekend or just not go to school? Thanks!
 
Megatron2016 said:
Anyone know if there is always something required on every day during the preclinical curriculum or if it is possible to sometimes take a three day weekend or just not go to school? Thanks!
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Every month there's 1 or 2 opportunities to just not be on campus (and take a 3-d weekend). Plus you're allowed to take 1 unexcused absence. Many classmates use this opportunity visit significant others.
 
Beren said:
Every month there's 1 or 2 opportunities to just not be on campus (and take a 3-d weekend). Plus you're allowed to take 1 unexcused absence. Many classmates use this opportunity visit significant others.
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Thanks!
 
Withdrew acceptance the other day. Hope this means good news for someone else!
 
Does anyone know if the waitlist will be tiered at any point? And if not does that indicate even slimmer chances than past years of getting of the waitlist?
 
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