AZCOM vs TOURO NY-harlem

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lalalalala987

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I have been accepted to both AZCOM and Touro New York-Harlem.
I am stuck in a dilemma and need your help.

AZCOM
Pros-

-The faculty is helpful, supportive, and quick
- Excellent facilities/beautiful campus
-Excellent match list
-Faculty didn't seem to have a push towards primary care
-Picked and got my first choice 3rd year rotation site (Chicago)
-Access to excellent hospitals in the Phoenix area which serve a large and diverse population
-cheap housing

Cons-

-Its hot as hell 3 months out of the year
-Price 60K this year!
-Big class

Touro New York Harlem
Pros-
- uh..NYC?!?
-cheaper tuition (compared to AZCOM)
-lecture style at TouroCOM: don't have to attend lectures, all lectures are prerecorded by professors and posted online for download.
-grading system at TouroCOM: not graded against each other but against the class before
-mentor/mentee system that pairs first years with second years
-TouroCOM is big on community service within the Harlem Community

Cons
-expensive living
-Not sure if i can defend myself in case something happens while I'm walking home at night...
-no real campus (2 floors?)

any advice would be appreciated. :)

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Dr Tony T. Chopper

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Also take these into consideration:
  • The cost of living in Harlem is 51% higher than the New York average.
  • The cost of living in Harlem is 84% higher than the national average.
  • The cost of housing in Harlem is 189% higher than the national average.
  • New York general sales tax is 21% lower than the national average.
  • New York state income tax is 80% higher than the national average.
I get a room to myself in Arizona, and I am paying $405 a month with utilities and internet included. Compare that to your rates in the Harlem area as well and you may find that the difference in cost is less than you imagine even though we are comparing $60,000 to $48,140.
 
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AM508

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The cost of living in NYC is going to eat up the difference in tuition and then some. Not to mention, at least in my opinion NYC is a real pain in the ass to get around in and becomes a tiresome place to be very quickly. I can't say as I have been impressed with anything that I have heard about Touro-Harlem (granted that is all hersay as I didn't apply there when I applied as it didn't interest me in the least). If I were in your position, I would pick AZCOM over Touro-Harlem in a heartbeat.
 
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NecrotizingFasciitis

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Just out of curiosity, would you mind sharing your stats op? I'm interested in both schools.


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Ioannes Paulus

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I would, personally, go to Touro-Harlem because
(1) NYC, nuff said. It's the greatest city in the world. You don't need a car because everyone takes the subway. Yes, housing is expensive but if you room with multiple people, it works out okay.
(2) smaller class size.
(3) No moving around during years 3-4. Most AZCOM students move to California for clinical rotations. Clinical rotations are a mess.

I would go to Touro for the location alone.
 
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bon22

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You listed a pro for TOURO-NY being the recorded lectures, but I'm pretty sure AZCOM also has that.
 
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cassis_Cake

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Touro Harlem has a fabulous campus ;)
 
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drkube

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I would, personally, go to Touro-Harlem because
(1) NYC, nuff said. It's the greatest city in the world. You don't need a car because everyone takes the subway. Yes, housing is expensive but if you room with multiple people, it works out okay.
(2) smaller class size.
(3) No moving around during years 3-4. Most AZCOM students move to California for clinical rotations. Clinical rotations are a mess.

I would go to Touro for the location alone.

To add on:
1) definitely a huge plus if you're a city person. Tons of good food & always something to do

2) Touro NY has a smaller class size, but if you want a "big campus" I would go to AZCOM. They also have other programs like vet med, ot, etc. so you don't get sick of seeing medical students all the time

3) you still would have to move or at least commute a bit as touros rotations are not in Manhattan.

You don't have to move to CA for rotations. AZCOM lets you choose. For example, my rotations are in the east valley all within driving distance of Phoenix.
 
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KP2AZ

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I would, personally, go to Touro-Harlem because
(1) NYC, nuff said. It's the greatest city in the world. You don't need a car because everyone takes the subway. Yes, housing is expensive but if you room with multiple people, it works out okay.
(2) smaller class size.
(3) No moving around during years 3-4. Most AZCOM students move to California for clinical rotations. Clinical rotations are a mess.

I would go to Touro for the location alone.

Just a quick note on this- most students DONT go to California. If you wanted to, you could try to get a spot In LA/SD. You could also do the same with Chicago. No one is making anyone take those spots- they're usually very sought after.
Also- board study time at AZCOM is 4 weeks (below average). Not the most important thing in the decision, but definitely a factor.


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Dr Tony T. Chopper

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Just a quick note on this- most students DONT go to California. If you wanted to, you could try to get a spot In LA/SD. You could also do the same with Chicago. No one is making anyone take those spots- they're usually very sought after.
Also- board study time at AZCOM is 4 weeks (below average). Not the most important thing in the decision, but definitely a factor.


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Haha I've been hearing the student say that admin reverted the changes to cutting dedicated time. I'll have to see how it's going down at orientation.

Btw I got assigned a spot in San Diego, I mainly picked it based on the published scores and satisfaction ratings from students. Should I keep it instead of swapping for an Az spot?
 
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cassis_Cake

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Lol, I wanted to do my rotation in San Diego but didn't get it :( I got LA region instead.
 
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KP2AZ

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Lol, I wanted to do my rotation in San Diego but didn't get it :( I got LA region instead.

I wouldn't worry about that. Lots of trading goes on during the year for all the rotation spots. The two biggest drawing factors are:
1) people trying to get back to LA
2) People trying to get back to Chicago

If you wanted SD, you could probably make a 2 or 3 way trade.


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KP2AZ

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Haha I've been hearing the student say that admin reverted the changes to cutting dedicated time. I'll have to see how it's going down at orientation.

Btw I got assigned a spot in San Diego, I mainly picked it based on the published scores and satisfaction ratings from students. Should I keep it instead of swapping for an Az spot?

It's really up to you. I would wait and see how much you like AZ/Phoenix. There are definitely great options for rotations in Phoenix. The one that surprises people is Tucson though: satisfaction is really high, Tucson is a fun town (so I'm told), and you won't really be driving all over east or west valley...or LA/SD to get to rotations every day.


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lalalalala987

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Just out of curiosity, would you mind sharing your stats op? I'm interested in both schools.


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Sorry for the late reply.
sGPA: 3.5
cGPA: 3.4

mcat submissions: 26/510
 
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aljcharles

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I have been accepted to both AZCOM and Touro New York-Harlem.
I am stuck in a dilemma and need your help.

AZCOM
Pros-

-The faculty is helpful, supportive, and quick
- Excellent facilities/beautiful campus
-Excellent match list
-Faculty didn't seem to have a push towards primary care
-Picked and got my first choice 3rd year rotation site (Chicago)
-Access to excellent hospitals in the Phoenix area which serve a large and diverse population
-cheap housing

Cons-

-Its hot as hell 3 months out of the year
-Price 60K this year!
-Big class

Touro New York Harlem
Pros-
- uh..NYC?!?
-cheaper tuition (compared to AZCOM)
-lecture style at TouroCOM: don't have to attend lectures, all lectures are prerecorded by professors and posted online for download.
-grading system at TouroCOM: not graded against each other but against the class before
-mentor/mentee system that pairs first years with second years
-TouroCOM is big on community service within the Harlem Community

Cons
-expensive living
-Not sure if i can defend myself in case something happens while I'm walking home at night...
-no real campus (2 floors?)

any advice would be appreciated. :)


Have you spoken to any of the actual student who attend TOUROCOM-Harlem? Grade is based on Z-score (yes that is based on the class prior to your class, now includes Middletown students) which means if the OMS-1 class before you was full of Masters students that were gunners then your mark is substantially higher. It is not pass/fail program and heavily on ranking. Class size is not smaller - last class 180. yes, there aren't in class lecture(also the professor your watching may or may not be in the harlem building)....only in school for labs and clickers. DO/MS students all on one floor - not a lot of in building study space. Some professors are great super helpful others aren't (that is normal everywhere). If you are self learner and don't need structured schedule then TCOM is for you. If you need more structure/schedule/school services (even have that as a option) then not so much. Community service is limited.....they prefer you focus on school work.
 
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Ioannes Paulus

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Lol, I wanted to do my rotation in San Diego but didn't get it :( I got LA region instead.
What are their LA affiliated hospitals? I'm from LA and am curious about which hospitals around here have an AZCOM affiliation.
 
D

deleted731525

Have you spoken to any of the actual student who attend TOUROCOM-Harlem? Grade is based on Z-score (yes that is based on the class prior to your class, now includes Middletown students) which means if the OMS-1 class before you was full of Masters students that were gunners then your mark is substantially higher. It is not pass/fail program and heavily on ranking. Class size is not smaller - last class 180. yes, there aren't in class lecture(also the professor your watching may or may not be in the harlem building)....only in school for labs and clickers. DO/MS students all on one floor - not a lot of in building study space. Some professors are great super helpful others aren't (that is normal everywhere). If you are self learner and don't need structured schedule then TCOM is for you. If you need more structure/schedule/school services (even have that as a option) then not so much. Community service is limited.....they prefer you focus on school work.

I thought Touro Harlem was 135 students per year. Source: https://tourocom.touro.edu/about-us/our-students/demographics/
 

KP2AZ

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What are their LA affiliated hospitals? I'm from LA and am curious about which hospitals around here have an AZCOM affiliation.

Couldn't tell you. I know they let students choose north or south LA this year once you got LA for a rotation to make commuting easier, but I don't know specific hospitals.


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doczebra

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Touro NY has the highest entry stats of all DO schools and they also have the highest Board fail rate (~20%)

You'd be an idiot to pick touro, dont be an idiot, run for your life.

Edit: Also the faculty was panicking this year about the fail rate. I'm pretty sure the school's accreditation will be on the line if COCA decides to take action.
 
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KP2AZ

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Touro NY has the highest entry stats of all DO schools and they also have the highest Board fail rate (~20%)

You'd be an idiot to pick touro, dont be an idiot, run for your life.

Edit: Also the faculty was panicking this year about the fail rate. I'm pretty sure the school's accreditation will be on the line if COCA decides to take action.

If that stat is accurate (holy cow), people might be getting fired. We will see what happens this year with AZCOM's class only getting 3 weeks for board prep.
 

Nesmall2

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Touro NY has the highest entry stats of all DO schools and they also have the highest Board fail rate (~20%)

You'd be an idiot to pick touro, dont be an idiot, run for your life.

Edit: Also the faculty was panicking this year about the fail rate. I'm pretty sure the school's accreditation will be on the line if COCA decides to take action.

Not sure where you got your stats from but definitely wrong. Board pass rate was 98.3% (Step 1). Match rate was 100%. Also your grades are not compared to masters students, only DO students in the z-score system. Our school had plenty of community service opportunities, and many of my classmates had over 100 hours of service while getting good grades. Also the class size is 135. I think this year the oms1 had only 133.
 
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AsianPersuasion

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Not sure where you got your stats from but definitely wrong. Board pass rate was 98.3% (Step 1). Match rate was 100%. Also your grades are not compared to masters students, only DO students in the z-score system. Our school had plenty of community service opportunities, and many of my classmates had over 100 hours of service while getting good grades. Also the class size is 135. I think this year the oms1 had only 133.

Wouldn't Z-score grading breed unnecessary competition between students etc? Is this grading system true to all campuses?
 

Nesmall2

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Wouldn't Z-score grading breed unnecessary competition between students etc? Is this grading system true to all campuses?
The grading system if actually based on the previous 3 years classes and not your classmates. You get the cut off for each class in the beginning of the school year.

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Ceramium

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Touro NY has the highest entry stats of all DO schools and they also have the highest Board fail rate (~20%)

You'd be an idiot to pick touro, dont be an idiot, run for your life.

Edit: Also the faculty was panicking this year about the fail rate. I'm pretty sure the school's accreditation will be on the line if COCA decides to take action.
They do the flipped classroom model for all classes there right? I didn't interview at Touro NY Harlem, but I did at the Middletown campus and that's how the curriculum is taught. They kept on talking about how amazing it was, but if your stats are right about the highest board fail rate, then the flipped classroom model really can't be that great, right?
 

doczebra

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Not sure where you got your stats from but definitely wrong. Board pass rate was 98.3% (Step 1). Match rate was 100%. Also your grades are not compared to masters students, only DO students in the z-score system. Our school had plenty of community service opportunities, and many of my classmates had over 100 hours of service while getting good grades. Also the class size is 135. I think this year the oms1 had only 133.

The board pass rate is high on comlex 1 because you're not allowed to take the test unless you score at least near median on COMSAE. We dont know the real rate here.

There is no filter for step 2, ergo of the remaining students who were allowed to take the test and proceed to rotations, 20% failed comlex 2.

And between comsae and the match 10-20 students are kicked out. This is far from 100% placement. It's closer to 80-85%. Also, despite the school taking in transfer students in 3rd year, we still match ~120 student while the class began with 135 students in first year.

There is a lot of shadiness around the school and you'll learn all about it in second and third year.
 

Ioannes Paulus

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The board pass rate is high on comlex 1 because you're not allowed to take the test unless you score at least near median on COMSAE. We dont know the real rate here.

There is no filter for step 2, ergo of the remaining students who were allowed to take the test and proceed to rotations, 20% failed comlex 2.

And between comsae and the match 10-20 students are kicked out. This is far from 100% placement. It's closer to 80-85%. Also, despite the school taking in transfer students in 3rd year, we still match ~120 student while the class began with 135 students in first year.

There is a lot of shadiness around the school and you'll learn all about it in second and third year.

Are you sure you are not confusing this with anther Touro? All my friends are loving their time in Manhattan and enjoying the school. They never mention any shadiness or anything negative about the school.
 

doczebra

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Are you sure you are not confusing this with anther Touro? All my friends are loving their time in Manhattan and enjoying the school. They never mention any shadiness or anything negative about the school.

Not confused whatsoever.

Second years got a scolding since the admissions office was unhappy with us talking to perspective interviewees. It's not just me, nearly every oms2 ambassador was told to stop being so honest.
 

Ioannes Paulus

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Not confused whatsoever.

Second years got a scolding since the admissions office was unhappy with us talking to perspective interviewees. It's not just me, nearly every oms2 ambassador was told to stop being so honest.

Is this the Harlem campus for osteopathic medicine were talking about? My ambassadors were really cool and funny. They didn't mention anything "shady."
Do you think some of the problems are because of just how saturated the medschool market is in NYC or is something more internal, like curriculum or administration?
 
D

deleted731525

I think most med schools play games with their placement
 
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maxinia

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Hey, it's one year later and I'm having the exact same dilemma... If anyone's still here, which did you end up choosing and how has it been thus far?
 
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maxinia

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ME TOO !!
I made a 2017 version about this lol (AZCOM vs Touro-Harlem).

Maxinia, did you make a choice between the two yet?

I went with AZCOM, coz I've been in a snowy place for too damn long. I also preferred the campus feel, always did (turned down UofToronto for McMaster because of that). Prob not very helpful for you, but yea that's what I did.
 

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Not true. TouroCOM-NY matches have been getting better every year.

I only counted 100 advanced matches in 2017. It looks about the same for 2016 list. What happens to the 30 students that are left without a residency or only get an internship? As for the rest of the matches, it's very average.

On the flip side, AZCOM's list is very impressive. It's by far one of the best schools to go to in term of prospective residency opportunities along side CCOM, TCOM, and MSU.
 

Money4MyHoney

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I only counted 100 advanced matches in 2017. It looks about the same for 2016 list. What happens to the 30 students that are left without a residency or only get an internship? As for the rest of the matches, it's very average.

On the flip side, AZCOM's list is very impressive. It's by far one of the best schools to go to in term of prospective residency opportunities along side CCOM, TCOM, and MSU.
I only counted 100 advanced matches in 2017. It looks about the same for 2016 list. What happens to the 30 students that are left without a residency or only get an internship? As for the rest of the matches, it's very average.

On the flip side, AZCOM's list is very impressive. It's by far one of the best schools to go to in term of prospective residency opportunities along side CCOM, TCOM, and MSU.

Right now for those deciding on a school, find one that fits your heart. Worry about the residency issue when you get to that that point. Stop trying to jump from point A straight to point C. Get good board scores and you will get that residency interview no matter where you go.

Also, don't believe everything you read from SDN.
 
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