LUCOM standards

[artist27]

from their website "Behavioral standards which include the prohibition of drug, alcohol and tobacco use, coed residence halls, and sexual promiscuity."

Do they mean you're not allowed to smoke drink etc at all? How would they find out if a student did? Are people not allowed to have sex? Do students get kicked out for this?
Just curious cause I've seen some interesting comments about LUCOM on this site so decided to look up their actual standards. It's interesting.

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[Les12345]

Yup that's Liberty...my friend's boyfriend used to go there and she wasn't allowed to go visit him and stay with him...she'd have to get a hotel every time she visited.

 

[artist27]

Yup that's Liberty...my friend's boyfriend used to go there and she wasn't allowed to go visit him and stay with him...she'd have to get a hotel every time she visited.

Do they monitor where he's staying the night? Couldn't he go spend the night at the hotel too? Lol

 

[Les12345]

Do they monitor where he's staying the night? Couldn't he go spend the night at the hotel too? Lol

Well, yeah. This was for undergrad, so he was staying on campus and students couldn't have members of the opposite sex in their room unless they were married...

 

[On_The_Way_Up]

Yes. I went to a similar school for a year playing football and also visited Liberty because that was also one of the schools I was looking at to play football. These schools are very strict when it comes to this. You have to sign in a guest of the opposite sex and at the university it was strongly encouraged to keep the door to the dorm open. And at about 9:00 everyone of the opposite sex has to leave the building. No sex was allowed in the dorms. Dismissal from the university if you did. Alcohol wasn't allowed in the dorm at all. Of course you can go have sex and drink off campus. Many students did that. But you can't in your place of residence on campus. They actually do "spot checks" where they go door to door to check if you have any alcohol.

 

[freak7]

Well, yeah. This was for undergrad, so he was staying on campus and students couldn't have members of the opposite sex in their room unless they were married...

Yes. I went to a similar school for a year playing football and also visited Liberty because that was also one of the schools I was looking at to play football. These schools are very strict when it comes to this. You have to sign in a guest of the opposite sex and at the university it was strongly encouraged to keep the door to the dorm open. No sex was allowed in the dorms. Dismissal from the university if you did. Alcohol wasn't allowed in the dorm at all. Of course you can go have sex and drink off campus. Many students did that. But you can't in your place of residence on campus. They actually do "spot checks" where they go door to door to check if you have any alcohol.

These are both stories from UG. I believe OP was asking about enforcement for the LUCOM not just Liberty.

 

[On_The_Way_Up]

These are both stories from UG. I believe OP was asking about enforcement for the LUCOM not just Liberty.

I know. Apparently they have the same rules for all students.

 

[787593]

from their website "Behavioral standards which include the prohibition of drug, alcohol and tobacco use, coed residence halls, and sexual promiscuity."

Do they mean you're not allowed to smoke drink etc at all? How would they find out if a student did? Are people not allowed to have sex? Do students get kicked out for this?
Just curious cause I've seen some interesting comments about LUCOM on this site so decided to look up their actual standards. It's interesting.

It's probably just an honor system. I know a gal from their undergrad who breaks all the rules off campus and nobody cares.

 

[freak7]

I know. Apparently they have the same rules for all students.

Same rules, yes. Same enforcement? I'm not so sure.

I believe that's what OP was getting at. Correct me if I'm wrong @artist27

 

[libertyyne]

Same rules, yes. Same enforcement? I'm not so sure.

I believe that's what OP was getting at. Correct me if I'm wrong @artist27

Why would one want to subject them selves to that torture, even if the rules are not enforced today, that doesnt mean they wont be enforced against you later, and you are left to the capriciousness of some administrator

 

[freak7]

Why would one want to subject them selves to that torture, even if the rules are not enforced today, that doesnt mean they wont be enforced against you later, and you are left to the capriciousness of some administrator

I agree with you, but I still don't think that's what this thread was intended to be about.

 

[libertyyne]

I agree with you, but I still don't think that's what this thread was intended to be about.

The rule book says that the LUCOM standards are in addition to the Liberty U standards. Plus those rules are enforced by students tattling on each other.

 

[On_The_Way_Up]

Why would one want to subject them selves to that torture, even if the rules are not enforced today, that doesnt mean they wont be enforced against you later, and you are left to the capriciousness of some administrator

That would suck so bad.

 

[Vitani]

I will always struggle with the concept of trying to prevent consenting adults from having sex. Like, illegal drugs, sure. Even smoking on campus, sure. But sex? I just can't be ok with regulating that.

 

[On_The_Way_Up]

The rule book says that the LUCOM standards are in addition to the Liberty U standards. Plus those rules are enforced by students tattling on each other.

The "tattling students" is very true. This is how most discipline is carried out. The RAs do the spot checks and enforce the rules. They are the dedicated devote Christian's. They feel it is their calling to carry out these rules and enforce them. Visitation at Liberty and the school I went to they were very serious about their responsibilities. I spent a weekend at Liberty in the dorms. It was part of the recruitment along with attending one of the games. Also they have discipleship small groups. If you go to school there you better be somewhat religious and accept their rules. Otherwise you will have a hard time. May drive you crazy.

 

[On_The_Way_Up]

It's probably just an honor system. I know a gal from their undergrad who breaks all the rules off campus and nobody cares.

Yeah you can do whatever off campus.

 

[libertyyne]

Yeah you can do whatever off campus.

as long as no one narcs on you.

 

[Mad Jack]

Yeah you can do whatever off campus.

All it takes is one gunner with a cell phone and some pictures to do you in. Don't know if I find that a very comfy proposition, because the rules still apply off campus so long as they have proof of violation.

 

[artist27]

Same rules, yes. Same enforcement? I'm not so sure.

I believe that's what OP was getting at. Correct me if I'm wrong @artist27

Yeah I meant the medical school but any insight is interesting

 

[artist27]

All it takes is one gunner with a cell phone and some pictures to do you in. Don't know if I find that a very comfy proposition, because the rules still apply off campus so long as they have proof of violation.

Yeah this is what I was getting at. I was wondering if the rules are still applicable off campus as well.

 

[libertyyne]

You go to this school you are doing really well, you want to blow some steam off by drinking some booze and having some pre-marital relations with a gender of your choosing. You realize you have to do this off campus, you decide to hold a hotel room party and drink profusely, a gunner you invited that is 2nd in class behind you wants your position, research hookup and generally doesnt like the way you press you khaki's. Said gunner surreptitiously, takes pictures of you imbibing and making out with some cutie. Said gunner, Chad, then uploads pictures to imgur, scrubs meta data , and sends a link from a temporary email account to the University's morality officer. What is going to happen?
A. You are going to have a bad time .
B. You are going to have a bad time.
C. You are going to have a bad time.
D. I deserved it since i was engaging in sinful behavior.

If you answer is anything but D, do not go to LUCOM.

 

[Lawpy]

from their website "Behavioral standards which include the prohibition of drug, alcohol and tobacco use, coed residence halls, and sexual promiscuity."

Do they mean you're not allowed to smoke drink etc at all? How would they find out if a student did? Are people not allowed to have sex? Do students get kicked out for this?
Just curious cause I've seen some interesting comments about LUCOM on this site so decided to look up their actual standards. It's interesting.

https://forums.studentdoctor.net/th...t-medical-school.1209131/page-3#post-18593034

Here are some more gems :

"Students are to be in their residence halls each night by curfew. Everyone is asked to be courteous at all times concerning noise. No one is permitted to do laundry after curfew. Curfew hours are:  Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday - 12:00 AM (midnight)  Wednesday - 10:00 PM  Thursday – 12:00 AM (midnight)  Friday and Saturday - 12:30 AM"
"Liberty University prohibits the possession, use, manufacture, or distribution of alcoholic beverages, tobacco, nicotine and illegal drugs or controlled substances by its students, whether this occurs on or off campus. This includes the use or possession of prescription medications not prescribed to the student and the abuse of prescribed medication. Violations of this prohibition may result in disciplinary action, including administrative withdrawal. In addition, the possession, use, manufacture and/or distribution of illegal substances is a crime and Liberty University will cooperate with law enforcement authorities who are charged with enforcing the law"

"For the protection of its students and community, the university conducts an on-going program of mandatory random drug testing"

"Media or entertainment that is offensive to Liberty's standards and traditions (i.e., lewd lyrics, anti-Christian message, sexual content, nudity, pornography, etc.) is not permitted"

"While industry ratings systems for movies, games, and other media generally are not reliable standards, they can be helpful in identifying content. Movie content rated “X” and “NC-17” and video game content rated “A” are not permitted. • Caution should be used in viewing movie content rated “R” and “PG-13” and video game content rated “M”"

"12 Points (+ $50.00 Fine) • Deception • Minor violation of the Statement on Sexuality & Relationships (e.g. inappropriate personal contact; visiting alone with the opposite sex at an off-campus residence; entering the residence hallway, quad, or on-campus apartment of the opposite sex or allowing the same; visiting any dwelling or residence with a member of the opposite sex in inappropriate circumstances)"
"
"18 Points (+ $250 Fine & 18 Hours Disciplinary Community Service)
Intentional participation in a social gathering where alcohol is served (e.g. party, bar, or nightclub)
• Obscene, profane or abusive language or behavior • Violation of the Entertainment Guidelines (may be considered a 12-18 point violation)
• Sexual misconduct and/or any state of undress with member of opposite sex"

"Liberty"

"Obscene, profane or abusive language or behavior "

Oh ****. I'm ****ed.

Few more...

These are a few gems.

"Code of Personal Conduct The College of Osteopathic Medicine Code of Conduct does not replace the University Code of Student Conduct rather supplements it for osteopathic medical students."

"Non-marital sexual relations and the encouragement or advocacy of sexual behaviors which undermine Christian identity or Liberty Universities faith mission are defined by the University as morally inappropriate misconduct and constitute violations of this Personal Code of Conduct."

"E. Pornography Involvement with pornographic, obscene, indecent, or other similarly offensive materials, expressions, or conduct is inconsistent with the Personal Code of Conduct and the Christian World View of the College and University. Use of the University's computing network to obtain or distribute such materials constitutes a violation of the Code."


https://www.liberty.edu/media/1290/pdfs/LUCOM-Code of Conduct-Academic Standards-Computing-Social Media Policies-11212014.pdf

I hope you dont like wearing shorts either.
"Students may not wear the following unless specified in the syllabus of a specific course or as required for laboratory experiences:
• Shorts or cutoffs
• Miniskirts
• Jeans or denim of any type
• See-through clothing or halter tops
• Sandals, flip-flops, crocs, or any open-toed shoe
• T-shirts of any type may not be worn as the outer shirt Jogging, yoga, or other exercise clothing
• Inappropriately matched garments
• Garments with any offensive, suggestive, obscene, or unprofessional statements or gestures
• Hats, caps, or head coverings, other than religious cover, may not be worn in the classroom, laboratories, library or other educational settings.
• Scrubs may not be worn outside of the OMM, Anatomy or Clinical Medicine Laboratory.
• Scrubs may not be worn on clinical rotations except on Surgery, OB, or ER unless directed by faculty or DSME"

I wonder if they are talking about those in the biblical sense. Yeah, they probably are. This sounds a lot like Saudi Arabia in terms of personal liberty.

 

[freak7]

You go to this school you are doing really well, you want to blow some steam off by drinking some booze and having some pre-marital relations with a gender of your choosing. You realize you have to do this off campus, you decide to hold a hotel room party and drink profusely, a gunner you invited that is 2nd in class behind you wants your position, research hookup and generally doesnt like the way you press you khaki's. Said gunner surreptitiously, takes pictures of you imbibing and making out with some cutie. Said gunner, Chad, then uploads pictures to imgur, scrubs meta data , and sends a link from a temporary email account to the University's morality officer. What is going to happen?
A. You are going to have a bad time .
B. You are going to have a bad time.
C. You are going to have a bad time.
D. I deserved it since i was engaging in sinful behavior.

If you answer is anything but D, do not go to LUCOM.

Damn it, freaking Chad.

 

[Goro]

Do NOT underestimate the vindictiveness and zeal of people who are on a Mission from God.

I am NOT talking about the majority of LUCOM students, some of whom I have PMed with and seem like nice people. But there definitely are people at LUCOM (well, like the UG school's founder and his son, Jr) who completely ignore the first five books of the New Testament. Citation: Jerry Jr's enthusiastic embrace of Der Trumppenfuhrer.

I give kudos to the Liberty students who organized protests against the latter.

Yeah this is what I was getting at. I was wondering if the rules are still applicable off campus as well.

 

[Endoxifen]

The concept of a religious medical school is a bit weird to me... IDK, different strokes I guess.

 

[On_The_Way_Up]

All it takes is one gunner with a cell phone and some pictures to do you in. Don't know if I find that a very comfy proposition, because the rules still apply off campus so long as they have proof of violation.

Freaking narcs man.

https://forums.studentdoctor.net/th...t-medical-school.1209131/page-3#post-18593034






Few more...

Lmao totally forgot about the dress code there. Yeah Liberty is one of the most devout religious schools.

 

[On_The_Way_Up]

All it takes is one gunner with a cell phone and some pictures to do you in. Don't know if I find that a very comfy proposition, because the rules still apply off campus so long as they have proof of violation.

Hmmm. I would hope they let you have sex off campus.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Do NOT underestimate the vindictiveness and zeal of people who are on a Mission from God.

I am NOT talking about the majority of LUCOM students, some of whom I have PMed with and seem like nice people. But there definitely are people at LUCOM (well, like the UG school's founder and his son, Jr) who completely ignore the first five books of the New Testament. Citation: Jerry Jr's enthusiastic embrace of Der Trumppenfuhrer.

I give kudos to the Liberty students who organized protests against the latter.

I'm totally down with almost everything you say and appreciate your advice and contributions to this forum, but honestly your endless comparison of Trump to Hitler is offensive. As a Jew who has family and friends who were in the concentration camps, that ludicrous and hyperbolic comparison just bothers me to no end.

And I say that not as a #maga Trump fanboy. I actually wanted to vote for Bernie. But Trump is my Commander in Chief, so I do what I do.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

https://forums.studentdoctor.net/th...t-medical-school.1209131/page-3#post-18593034






Few more...

I'm not planning on applying there, but I'd still go in a heartbeat if it was my only acceptance.

 

[Mad Jack]

Freaking narcs man.


Lmao totally forgot about the dress code there. Yeah Liberty is one of the most devout religious schools.

Devout? Hardly. Self-righteous is more like it, as there isn't anything in the bible about watching movies, and Jesus himself turned water into wine, yet they won't allow any alcohol whatsoever. I wonder how much do you think they'd fine Jesus for throwing that party? Don't even get me started on dress codes...

 

[GypsyHummus]

I applied to Liberty last year cuz the whole strictness didn't bother me (tend to not be the party kind of person) and they have strict MCAT cuttoffs; no less than a 500 and no less than a 125 in each section.

I thought they would have trouble attracting people but I guess I was wrong.

 

[787593]

I applied to Liberty last year cuz the whole strictness didn't bother me (tend to not be the party kind of person) and they have strict MCAT cuttoffs; no less than a 500 and no less than a 125 in each section.

I thought they would have trouble attracting people but I guess I was wrong.

Are they really that strict with the MCAT??

 

[NecrotizingFasciitis]

EDIT: LUCOM is not my "cup of tea" by any means; I couldn't do it.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[libertyyne]

Are they really that strict with the MCAT??

I am not sure if a cut off at 500 is being strict.

 

[787593]

I am not sure if a cut off at 500 is being strict.

More so with the 125 per section. Considering that they're new and DO.

 

[SlugMD]

For many reasons, LUCOM gets a lot hate but SDNers tend to forget that it is not the only religious medical school in the USA. IIRC, Loma Linda is just as strict as LUCOM, maybe even more so.

 

[libertyyne]

For many reasons, LUCOM gets a lot hate but SDNers tend to forget that it is not the only religious medical school in the USA. IIRC, Loma Linda is just as strict as LUCOM, maybe even more so.

Loma Linda is not as strict as LUCOM, also there are plenty of catholic institutions that manage to act like normal educational institutions, except when it comes to abortion.

 

[Goro]

I'm not going to hijack the thread with a response, so put me on Ignore if you find these offensive.

I'm totally down with almost everything you say and appreciate your advice and contributions to this forum, but honestly your endless comparison of Trump to Hitler is offensive. As a Jew who has family and friends who were in the concentration camps, that ludicrous and hyperbolic comparison just bothers me to no end.

And I say that not as a #maga Trump fanboy. I actually wanted to vote for Bernie. But Trump is my Commander in Chief, so I do what I do.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I'm not going to hijack the thread with a response, so put me on Ignore if you find these offensive.

I don't just slap people on ignore, especially if they are generally helpful. I just wanted to let you know that I (and I'm sure I'm not the only one) find that offensive. Do with that what you will, but saying put me on ignore if you don't like it is exactly the response I was expecting, unfortunately.

Carry on. Sorry for the temporary hijack, OP.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Loma Linda is not as strict as LUCOM, also there are plenty of catholic institutions that manage to act like normal educational institutions, except when it comes to abortion.

Loma Linda is one of them, and just in general, Loyola is a great institution that does not have the hyper strict over the top rules (at least the Baltimore campus).

 

[Dr. Rafiki]

I wonder how many of you interviewed at LUCOM / visited campus and talked to students to see just how strict they are? Look, they are very openly Christian. They set out their standards and stick to them. Will they kick you out for winding down on some wine in your own house or out with your significant other? No. Do they generally advise against that according to what they believe will be the best way to live out a Christ-like life? Yes. Will you gain an excellent medical education? Ask the first-time COMLEX takers who scored higher than the first-time takers of any of the last 11 new DO schools.

OP: don't believe everything you read on SDN. Yes they are Christian, and yes the undergrad is quite strict. No, the med school is not at all like the undergrad.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

This stuff actually wouldn't bother me, my undergrad is just as strict. What bothers me is the creationism being taught openly, I mean I am a religious man and read my scriptures often but taking it all as literal fact is quite the stretch. You can still believe in a creation and a higher power without ignoring science, they are not mutually exclusive as much as some people would like to believe so.

 

[zero0]

The short answer is lol no.

I honestly don't even know what the policies at the undergrad campus are, but from the sound of it the med school is a completely different world. As long as you're not drinking heavily and shouting out profanities at a public bar while wearing a LUCOM t-shirt, no one cares.

 

[787593]

This stuff actually wouldn't bother me, my undergrad is just as strict. What bothers me is the creationism being taught openly, I mean I am a religious man and read my scriptures often but taking it all as literal fact is quite the stretch. You can still believe in a creation and a higher power without ignoring science, they are not mutually exclusive as much as some people would like to believe so.

It depends...

According to Romans 5:12 "Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned."

Creationists who I've spoken with claim that evolution requires millions of years of death before the point when they claim sin entered the world. They conclude that if death, and therefore sin, existed before the garden of eden, then there was no need for Christ to come since death would no longer be a consequence of sin.

Also, how can one simultaneously believe in creation and evolution? They are completely different.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Also, how can one simultaneously believe in creation and evolution? They are completely different.

What? Because I believe in a God who is the ultimate scientist... Someone can most definitely believe in both. They are not mutually exclusive. That is all I will say, as to not turn this into a religion debate.

 

[787593]

What? Because I believe in a God who is the ultimate scientist... Someone can most definitely believe in both. They are not mutually exclusive. That is all I will say, as to not turn this into a religion debate.

Not my intention at all! I apologize if I made it seem that way.
What I should have said is "how can one simultaneously believe in creation and evolution and be consistent?"

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

It depends...

According to Romans 5:12 "Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned."

This doesn't preclude evolution at all. It just says that through sin, we suffered death.

Creationists who I've spoken with claim that evolution requires millions of years of death before the point when they claim sin entered the world. They conclude that if death, and therefore sin, existed before the garden of eden, then there was no need for Christ to come since death would no longer be a consequence of sin.

Aside from the obvious position of not taking Genesis literally (and almost no Orthodox Jew that I've ever studied with does), again, this doesn't preclude evolution. Many Torah scholars wrote about the evolution of man through creation. How life evolved from the sea and eventually into man.

In the 13th century, the Ramban was writing about how the universe started as the size of a mustard seed (a Hebrew idiom for very small) and expanded out of that, and then how life started out as small creatures in the ocean and eventually evolved into everything we see today. He also takes about how there were hominids around at the time of Adam and that Adam was just the first ape to be given that extra piece of God that made him human.

His was not an uncommon reading of creation, and he is still one of the most studied Torah scholars.

Also, how can one simultaneously believe in creation and evolution? They are completely different.

They aren't. Creation is just the belief that God created the universe. Evolution doesn't discuss the origin of life or what sparked life just as Big Bang Theory doesn't discuss what started the universe. Even if they did, they are just scientific explanations for what happened, and nothing precludes me from believing that those theories are simply the scientific explanations for how God created everything.

Young Earth Creationism != creation and I'd wager most Christians are not young earth creationists. I've only met two in my entire life, and one of them also believes that the sun revolves around the Earth.

Edit: this is why schools like Loma Linda and Loyola are more respected. They don't see an issue between creation and science. They are just two sides of the same coin.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Not my intention at all! I apologize if I made it seem that way.
What I should have said is "how can one simultaneously believe in creation and evolution and be consistent?"

Oh no you're fine! I typed that in a hurry and didn't see how it sounded.

For example my personal view of creation rejects the idea of creation out of nothing, actually my whole religion does. I believe the world (and all of matter) has simply been organized and God is a being that uses eternal and scientific principles, and evolution is a part of that. The evolution of organisms has played an integral part in the development of life and our world, and I believe God is behind it. I cannot explain the details because I don't know them, but I do think God intends for us to find out through scientific advancement.

But to simply answer your question, it's easier to reconcile the two if the traditional, literal scriptural view of a creation out of nothing, 7 actual days, 6,000 years blah blah is rejected.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

They aren't. Creation is just the belief that God created the universe. Evolution doesn't discuss the origin of life or what sparked life just as Big Bang Theory doesn't discuss what started the universe. Even if they did, they are just scientific explanations for what happened, and nothing precludes me from believing that those theories are simply the scientific explanations for how God created everything.

Bingo

 

[libertyyne]

This thread took a weird turn.