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Getting into Med School is Hard? Not with BeMo.
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I made homemade nachos last night, let's just say I didn't need to wait until I had my coffee this morning.
 
@Healer@1994 I saw a random ad on SDN this morning that looked just awful and I mistook it for one of your spicy posts
 
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Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
That was the whole point of the EC--to prevent regional bias like those that form in those areas to dictate the presidency. That's why we need voter education.
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There is already adequate representation through the senate. Education is always simultaneously the answer and not the answer.
 
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libertyyne said:
There is already adequate representation through the senate. Education is always simultaneously the answer and not the answer.
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:confused:

So because there is "adequate representation" in the Senate, having adequate representation in the POTUS election is unimportant?
 
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Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
:confused:

So because there is "adequate representation" in the Senate, having adequate representation in the POTUS election is unimportant?
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yes. There is weighted representation in the house of reps. You are saying the unequal weight of Americans votes based on geography is somehow better .
 
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Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
No, I'm just pointing out your straw man.
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I was preempting the next argument. Which is inevitably tyranny of the majority, yada yada yada. If the purpose of the ec was to prevent a charlatan from taking power.... Well I might have some bad news regarding it's efficacy.
 
libertyyne said:
I was preempting the next argument. Which is inevitably tyranny of the majority, yada yada yada. If the purpose of the ec was to prevent a charlatan from taking power.... Well I might have some bad news regarding it's efficacy.
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Except I didn't bring that up. I also didn't bring up the Senate. You brought it up to shift focus away from the EC, and then claimed that my desire for equal representation across states somehow implied that I prefer that OVER equal representation in the Senate--an argument I never made.
 
Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
Except I didn't bring that up. I also didn't bring up the Senate. You brought it up to shift focus away from the EC, and then claimed that my desire for equal representation across states somehow implied that I prefer that OVER equal representation in the Senate--an argument I never made.
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Ergo the preemption.
 
Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
You can't argue a point I didn't make. That's not how it works.
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I mean you can.

Breaking news: New Fallacy discovered on SDN.
*beepbeebeepeeepeepeeebeep*
A local community has just discovered a new fallacy. Let's go to Tom in Atlanta.

Hi Amanda. They're calling it the "windmill" fallacy. Inspired by Don Quixote's preemptive strike on, not a strawman, but a windmill. We'll have details at 8. Back to you Amanda.

Thanks Tom. Up next after our break can these berries cure cancer? And good news for wine lovers, a new study says you may just want to pop open another bottle to make your spouse more appealing than meets the eye. We'll be back after this.
 
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freak7 said:
I mean you can.

Breaking news: New Fallacy discovered on SDN.
*beepbeebeepeeepeepeeebeep*
A local community has just discovered a new fallacy. Let's go to Tom in Atlanta.

Hi Amanda. They're calling it the "windmill" fallacy. Inspired by Don Quixote's preemptive strike on, not a strawman, but a windmill. We'll have details at 8. Back to you Amanda.

Thanks Tom. Up next after our break can these berries cure cancer? And good news for wine lovers, a new study says you may just want to pop open another bottle to make your spouse more appealing than meets the eye. We'll be back after this.
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Funny. Tilting at windmills is not really a fallacy though. It's just an idiom related to relevance fallacies.
 
Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
Funny. Tilting at windmills is not really a fallacy though. It's just an idiom related to relevance fallacies.
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Damn it, I knew that was taken. I was having a hard time thinking of preemptive strikes that weren't political
 
Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
That was the whole point of the EC--to prevent regional bias like those that form in those areas to dictate the presidency. That's why we need voter education.
Click to expand...

libertyyne said:
There is already adequate representation through the senate. Education is always simultaneously the answer and not the answer.
Click to expand...

Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
:confused:

So because there is "adequate representation" in the Senate, having adequate representation in the POTUS election is unimportant?
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Please inform me on how exactly this is a strawman ? Your contention that the "whole point" was to prevent regional bias in the presidency ( which represents governmental power), and I merely stated that adequate representation in the senate ensures people from less populous states dont get forgotten by those in power?

You can continue to make "strawman strawman " arguments or you could defend why it is necessary to have less populous states have continued oversized influence in the election of the president.
 
libertyyne said:
Please inform me on how exactly this is a strawman ? Your contention that the "whole point" was to prevent regional bias in the presidency ( which represents governmental power), and I merely stated that adequate representation in the senate ensures people from less populous states dont get forgotten by those in power?
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If anything, the regional bias is amplified by the EC. No one cares about states in mountain zone. Everyone cares about swing states like PA and OH where they actually have fewer than expected electoral votes.

Any defense of the electoral college is unsustainable.
 
Lawper said:
If anything, the regional bias is amplified by the EC. No one cares about states in mountain zone. Everyone cares about swing states like PA and OH where they actually have fewer than expected electoral votes.
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Furthermore, the winner take all of the state's EC rules create perverse effects, these rules were not original to the EC and were introduced later on iirc.
 
libertyyne said:
Please inform me on how exactly this is a strawman ? Your contention that the "whole point" was to prevent regional bias in the presidency ( which represents governmental power), and I merely stated that adequate representation in the senate ensures people from less populous states dont get forgotten by those in power?

You can continue to make "strawman strawman " arguments or you could defend why it is necessary to have less populous states have continued oversized influence in the election of the president.
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I said a popular vote is tainted by regional bias, effectively allowing a small number of locations to elect POTUS. Please tell me how that in any way implies that having equal representation across the population is more important than equal representation in the Senate. Also, please tell me why having equal representation in the Senate eliminates the need for equal representation in the Presidential election (just saying having senators is good enough, ironically, isn't good enough).

Then I'll stop calling it a straw man. I don't have to defend positions I didn't take just because you want to use them to deflect.
 
Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
I said a popular vote is tainted by regional bias, effectively allowing a small number of locations to elect POTUS. Please tell me how that in any way implies that having equal representation across the population is more important than equal representation in the Senate. Also, please tell me why having equal representation in the Senate eliminates the need for equal representation in the Presidential election.

Then I'll stop calling it a straw man. I don't have to defend positions I didn't take just because you want to use them to deflect.
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1. BY attempting to eliminate regional bias it effectively diminishes the value of the voters in more populous regions. so in effect you are saying that regional representation is more important than value of an individual vote.
2. I have asserted that equal representation in the senate is an adequate and valid safeguard against too much "regional bias" in the presidency .
3. Because the senate is a branch of the government with vast powers that can effectively represent their regions more effectively than any president.

But you know strawman, strawman , strawman.
 
libertyyne said:
1. BY attempting to eliminate regional bias it effectively diminishes the value of the voters in more populous regions. so in effect you are saying that regional representation is more important than value of an individual vote.
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No, I'm not saying that. I'm actually saying the opposite of that. The EC was designed to prevent regional bias. I think it was a good idea, but its flaws are exploited during campaigns.

As I said previously, ideally we would have a popular vote where everyone made an informed decision. But since that isn't happening even now, switching to the popular vote directly will not solve anything. You'll just go from having a flawed EC to another flawed system where two states elect the President for the other 48 (excuse my slight hyperbole).

2. I have asserted that equal representation in the senate is an adequate and valid safeguard against too much "regional bias" in the presidency .
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I agree that having adequate representation in Congress is a good safeguard, but I disagree that it makes adequate representation in the POTUS election irrelevant or unimportant.

3. Because the senate is a branch of the government with vast powers that can effectively represent their regions more effectively than any president.

But you know strawman, strawman , strawman.
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Agreed, but we live in a country where the President is seen as having significantly more power than he actually carries. Even on this board, we have supposedly educated people claiming that Trump is destroying this country when he hasn't really done much of anything.

Along with the EC itself, this perception is part of why we have such terrible voter turnout. Couple that with ignorant voters and people who just vote along party lines, the "adequate representation" in the Senate is hurt by having the same people in office for decades because people simply vote for their party (or don't vote at all).

Just to be clear, I don't support the EC in practice. I support controlling for regional bias, but my solution is voter education, not a formal system like the EC.

Edit: also it's possible that I missed an obvious connection. I just got off a 26-hour duty shift where I got ~3 hours of sleep and have been awake since 1:00am.
 
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Cyberdyne 101 said:
I still can't believe it happened...

I would take solace in the fact that unlike Kurt and Layne, he was still alive and making music...

I wish he weren't alone that night...
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A great loss. I saw him live at least 4 times when he was touring with audioslave.
 
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Lawper said:
The US should just adopt a parliamentary system
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Watching C-SPAN you wouldn't know that we don't already have one of those what with all those clowns filibustering every minute of every day.
 
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