Question Regarding Acceptance

[lucasmd99]

Hi all,

So I graduated high school in 2017 with a good GPA, and enrolled at a community college for the fall of 2017 online. I did not complete my first semester of community college and essentially failed (I should not have done it online; this was my fault as I managed my time poorly). Anyways, I then later applied as an incoming freshman to ASU to start in the fall of 2018, indicating on my application that I had already attended a community college the year prior and did not do well the only semester I was there; I was accepted to ASU nonetheless. My main question here is, when I go to apply for medical school in four years, will my community college hickup have any affect on acceptance? Even if I do well all four of my years at ASU? I kind of want to forget that community college hickup ever happened, even though I did include it on my ASU application because I did not want to get caught for being academically dishonest. But will medical schools see that a semester at the community college, even if I essentially ‘started fresh’ at ASU afterwards? Thank you in advance for any help/advice.

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[Goro]

Hi all,

So I graduated high school in 2017 with a good GPA, and enrolled at a community college for the fall of 2017 online. I did not complete my first semester of community college and essentially failed (I should not have done it online; this was my fault as I managed my time poorly). Anyways, I then later applied as an incoming freshman to ASU to start in the fall of 2018, indicating on my application that I had already attended a community college the year prior and did not do well the only semester I was there; I was accepted to ASU nonetheless. My main question here is, when I go to apply for medical school in four years, will my community college hickup have any affect on acceptance? Even if I do well all four of my years at ASU? I kind of want to forget that community college hickup ever happened, even though I did include it on my ASU application because I did not want to get caught for being academically dishonest. But will medical schools see that a semester at the community college, even if I essentially ‘started fresh’ at ASU afterwards? Thank you in advance for any help/advice.

If you do well from now on, the CC experience will indeed be viewed an a hiccup.

Not everyone is ready to go to college at age 18.

You still have to report your CC courses.

 

[Catalystik]

If you do well from now on, the CC experience will indeed be viewed an a hiccup.

Not everyone is ready to go to college at age 18.

You still have to report your CC courses.

And the CC grades will be included in the calculation of your med school application GPAs. But stats are listed year by year, not term by term. So your first term at the University will moderate the lower CC grades. And your sophomore terms together will show a steep rise in GPA from there. Adcomms love rising GPA trends.

 

[lucasmd99]

And the CC grades will be included in the calculation of your med school application GPAs. But stats are listed year by year, not term by term. So your first term at the University will moderate the lower CC grades. And your sophomore terms together will show a steep rise in GPA from there. Adcomms love rising GPA trends.

Even though the poor CC grades were in 2017 and the University grades are beginning in 2018?

 

[AttemptingScholar]

Even though the poor CC grades were in 2017 and the University grades are beginning in 2018?

Yes, they are listed by school year, not calendar year.

 

[lucasmd99]

Yes, they are listed by school year, not calendar year.

Ok because the CC semester was fall 2017 and I am starting at ASU for fall 2018. I did not enroll or attend any courses in spring 2018.

 

[ciestar]

You report all grades from all undergraduate courses taken. You will submit your transcripts from these institutions to AMCAS.

 

[Catalystik]

Ok because the CC semester was fall 2017 and I am starting at ASU for fall 2018. I did not enroll or attend any courses in spring 2018.

They will all be categorized as Freshman year grades and calculated togther, even though the terms were not contiguous in time.

 

[lucasmd99]

They will all be categorized as Freshman year grades and calculated togther, even though the terms were not contiguous in time.

Ok, so let’s say I get straight A’s my freshman year at ASU, that would average my frshsmean year grades to straight C’s? (the classes taken that semester (fall 2017) at the CC are not all identical to those I am taking my first semester (fall 2018) at ASU). And then if I get excellent grades sophomore, junior, and senior year I should be ok?

 

[Catalystik]

Ok, so let’s say I get straight A’s my freshman year at ASU, that would average my frshsmean year grades to straight C’s? (the classes taken that semester (fall 2017) at the CC are not all identical to those I am taking my first semester (fall 2018) at ASU). And then if I get excellent grades sophomore, junior, and senior year I should be ok?

You haven't taken into account the number of semester hours credit you have been/will be awarded.

This links to a good, downloadable AMCAS GPA calculator: AMCAS GPA Calculator (Revised) so you can do precise calculations of what to expect.

 

[lucasmd99]

Lets say you dont speculate on things you cant change and just worry about what you can change: move on

That is actually very good advice. Very good point.

 

[lucasmd99]

You haven't taken into account the number of semester hours credit you have been/will be awarded.

This links to a good, downloadable AMCAS GPA calculator: AMCAS GPA Calculator (Revised) so you can do precise calculations of what to expect.

I will use this. Thank you.

 

[Catalystik]

From the AMCAS Application Guide, p 26, about assigning the year in school:

Each undergraduate status should consist of approximately 24 to 35 semester hours. If you are enrolled
in an institution as a full-time, continuous undergraduate, you should usually change your
Year in School after every two semesters, three to four quarters, or two to three trimesters.

If you have been enrolled part-time or have had interrupted attendance, you should use the following
ranges to determine your appropriate status for each term:
High School (HS) College-level coursework taken while in high school
Freshman (FR) 0 through 35 semester hours
Sophomore (SO) 36 through 65 semester hours
Junior (JR) 66 through 95 semester hours
Senior (SR) 96+ semester hours

If you have a significant number of AP or college-level coursework credits before entering college, you
may list your entire first college year as FR status. In doing so, you will most likely exceed the 0 through
35 credit hour guideline for freshman year, but your AMCAS GPAs will reflect your “true” first year in
college; in these cases, AMCAS will not change your academic status. However, if you would rather
base your academic statuses on credit hours only, your application will be accepted and verified as such.

 

[lucasmd99]

From the AMCAS Application Guide, p 26, about assigning the year in school:

Each undergraduate status should consist of approximately 24 to 35 semester hours. If you are enrolled
in an institution as a full-time, continuous undergraduate, you should usually change your
Year in School after every two semesters, three to four quarters, or two to three trimesters.

If you have been enrolled part-time or have had interrupted attendance, you should use the following
ranges to determine your appropriate status for each term:
High School (HS) College-level coursework taken while in high school
Freshman (FR) 0 through 35 semester hours
Sophomore (SO) 36 through 65 semester hours
Junior (JR) 66 through 95 semester hours
Senior (SR) 96+ semester hours

If you have a significant number of AP or college-level coursework credits before entering college, you
may list your entire first college year as FR status. In doing so, you will most likely exceed the 0 through
35 credit hour guideline for freshman year, but your AMCAS GPAs will reflect your “true” first year in
college; in these cases, AMCAS will not change your academic status. However, if you would rather
base your academic statuses on credit hours only, your application will be accepted and verified as such.

I did take a good deal of honors (and I believe one AP) classes in high school, just not for duel enrollment.

I am enrolled for I believe 15 credits for my first semester at ASU for fall 2018 (ASU recommendes between 14 and 16 in order to stay on track for graduation). And it was 12 credits for that fall 2017 CC semester that I did poorly on.

 

[lekarsz_90]

Try not to let it hold you back too much. You have so much time just try and get on the right foot and crush it from here on out. There are options to pursue later on the road but you're young yet don't worry. Good luck!

 

[lucasmd99]

You haven't taken into account the number of semester hours credit you have been/will be awarded.

This links to a good, downloadable AMCAS GPA calculator: AMCAS GPA Calculator (Revised) so you can do precise calculations of what to expect.

I entered all the data into the calculator. If I kill it from here on out and do extremely well, I could graduate with a 3.6 GPA.

 

[Catalystik]

I entered all the data into the calculator. If I kill it from here on out and do extremely well, I could graduate with a 3.6 GPA.

You can also add summers and higher course loads, once you have your study strategies solidified, and the GPA resuscitation will go faster.

 

[lucasmd99]

You can also add summers and higher course loads, once you have your study strategies solidified, and the GPA resuscitation will go faster.

I also see that in medical school admission application requirements, they talk about having to have passed with a C in courses and that grades below a C are not acceptable. Is this true even if I am able to resuscitate my GPA and apply with a 3.6 GPA or so, since it would show an upward trend? It shouldn’t matter if you have F’s on your transcript as long as your GPA is good, right?

 

[rdyotz]

Prereq courses need to a C or better which means if you retake an F and get an A you are fine

 

[Catalystik]

I also see that in medical school admission application requirements, they talk about having to have passed with a C in courses and that grades below a C are not acceptable. Is this true even if I am able to resuscitate my GPA and apply with a 3.6 GPA or so, since it would show an upward trend? It shouldn’t matter if you have F’s on your transcript as long as your GPA is good, right?

If you failed any college math, English, or sciences that first term, you'd have to retake it. Otherwise, your statement is correct.

 

[lucasmd99]

If you failed any college math, English, or sciences that first term, you'd have to retake it. Otherwise, your statement is correct.

It was MAT 142, ENG 101, and two history/gov courses at the community college in fall 2017. I am taking MAT 117, ENG 101, and some science (BIO/CHEM) courses at ASU for fall 2018. For ENG 101 it wouldn’t count as a re-take since it’s at a different school, right? I would still have to go back to the CC and re-take it, right? And does MAT 142 count as college mathematics? It’s looking like those are the two I would have to go re-take at the CC.

 

[Catalystik]

It was MAT 142, ENG 101, and two history/gov courses at the community college in fall 2017. I am taking MAT 117, ENG 101, and some science (BIO/CHEM) courses at ASU for fall 2018. For ENG 101 it wouldn’t count as a re-take since it’s at a different school, right? I would still have to go back to the CC and re-take it, right? And does MAT 142 count as college mathematics? It’s looking like those are the two I would have to go re-take at the CC.

You do not have to retake at the CC. It's fine to substitute with similar courses at the university.

What is the name of MAT 142? What is MAT 117 called?

 

[lucasmd99]

You do not have to retake at the CC. It's fine to substitute with similar courses at the university.

What is the name of MAT 142? What is MAT 117 called?

MAT 142: “College Mathematics”
MAT 117: “College Algebra”

 

[Catalystik]

MAT 142: “College Mathematics”
MAT 117: “College Algebra”

Yes, the MAT 142 "counts" as college math.

MAT 117 and another semester of college math or Statistics will be all you need to do to cover many med school expectations. A few schools like Calculus, but Statistics is much more useful over the time of your entire career. You should check out the specific requirements of your state schools and others you are most likely to target, so you don't get surprised at application time.

 

[lucasmd99]

Yes, the MAT 142 "counts" as college math.

MAT 117 and another semester of college math or Statistics will be all you need to do to cover many med school expectations. A few schools like Calculus, but Statistics is much more useful over the time of your entire career. You should check out the specific requirements of your state schools and others you are most likely to target, so you don't get surprised at application time.

Ok, so I would have to re-take the Math 142? I’m taking the Math 117 and then another math class next semester and I believe another one in a later term too.

 

[Catalystik]

Ok, so I would have to re-take the Math 142? I’m taking the Math 117 and then another math class next semester and I believe another one in a later term too.

No, you don't have to retake MATH 142 specifically as you will fulfill the math requirement by substituting another acceptable class.

 

[lucasmd99]

No, you don't have to retake MATH 142 specifically as you will fulfill the math requirement by substituting another acceptable class.

Ok so basically what they mean by nothing below a C in core requirements is, you have to had over a C in those specific pre-req core required classes even if you have an F on your transcript in general, assuming you were able to bring your GPA back up.

 

[Catalystik]

Ok so basically what they mean by nothing below a C in core requirements is, you have to had over a C in those specific pre-req core required classes even if you have an F on your transcript in general, assuming you were able to bring your GPA back up.

They aren't talking about having a C average across all core requirements. Rather, whatever classes go toward a specific core requirement must have a grade of C or better. Once you take Math 117 and another math class, MATH 142 is longer counted toward the core math requirement. It has been substituted.

I googled "math requirements for all med schools," and found this slightly older list. You might do better if you spend a longer time looking. Of course, by the time you apply, things can change: http://sci.tamucc.edu/~scieng/prepro/documents/Pre-Medical Math Req.pdf (Note: many don't require math at all.)

 

[lucasmd99]

(Catalystik): So basically, all is not lost? I figured with how competitive the field is, it would be an automatic disqualifier. But thank you for your reassurance.

 

[Catalystik]

(Catalystik): So basically, all is not lost? I figured with how competitive the field is, it would be an automatic disqualifier. But thank you for your reassurance.

Correct. All is not lost. Now go earn enough A grades to compensate for your lower grades so your overall application GPAs that include both schools are in the competitive range.

[Sidenote: If you want to "page" someone to respond to your post, type an @ symbol, followed by the person's username. Before you're done typing, name choices will pop up. Click the one you want so it triggers the programming to send an Alert to that member.]

 

[lekarsz_90]

I entered all the data into the calculator. If I kill it from here on out and do extremely well, I could graduate with a 3.6 GPA.

That's great! Sometimes too if you retake a course it gets rid of the previous grade, but that depends on the school. My friend had to retake some courses and her uni replaced her score.

 

[candbgirl]

That's great! Sometimes too if you retake a course it gets rid of the previous grade, but that depends on the school. My friend had to retake some courses and her uni replaced her score.

Some schools replace grades but AMCAS does not. All grades gave to be reported when applying. No exceptions!

 

[lucasmd99]

Is there anything else I can do to improve my chances, in addition to scoring excellent grades? When I do get my GPA back up to a competitive range, once I graduate, do you think I would have a good chance of acceptance into a medical school?

 

[Catalystik]

1) Is there anything else I can do to improve my chances, in addition to scoring excellent grades?
2) When I do get my GPA back up to a competitive range, once I graduate, do you think I would have a good chance of acceptance into a medical school?

1) Get a strong MCAT score and engage in a broad variety of activities that add appeal to your med school application, like clinical experience where you interact with current patients, physician shadowing, community service to those in need, peer leadership, research, teaching, etc.

2) Besides the above, there are other factors important to an acceptance, like supportive letters of recommendation, the quality of your application essays, timing of your application, interview skills, and lack of significant Institutional Action or legal issues. Before engaging in this process, be aware that of all those applying, only 40% get an acceptance, including some with high stats.

 

[Goro]

Is there anything else I can do to improve my chances, in addition to scoring excellent grades? When I do get my GPA back up to a competitive range, once I graduate, do you think I would have a good chance of acceptance into a medical school?

Engage in service to others less fortunate than yourself.
Ultimately, the advice we give here can help you maximize your chances of getting an interview. Getting accepted is 100% on you.

 

[lucasmd99]

So what are those 40% doing that the 60% are not?

 

[Catalystik]

So what are those 40% doing that the 60% are not?

Living in the right state, taking the MCAT only after a prolonged period of dedicated study with repeated scores in their target zone on practice tests, waiting to apply until they have the best possible application, practicing their interview skills, targeting schools whose mission they fit, . . . .

 

[lucasmd99]

@Catalystik By living in the right state what are you referring to? You mean they are applying to schools in their home state, or applying to ones out of state? What does this have to do with acceptance?

 

[Catalystik]

@Catalystik By living in the right state what are you referring to? You mean they are applying to schools in their home state, or applying to ones out of state? What does this have to do with acceptance?

Examples: Some states don't have their own med school. Some states have much more lenient med schools, stats-wise. Some have an abundance of med schools. Some have such a huge population of applicants that only a small percent of acceptees are accepted in-state, while the rest must travel elsewhere.

 

[AttemptingScholar]

@Catalystik By living in the right state what are you referring to? You mean they are applying to schools in their home state, or applying to ones out of state? What does this have to do with acceptance?

So called "lucky states" have a lot of seats compared to the number of in-state applicants. California is unlucky, Texas is lucky. When looking at instate/out of state acceptances to state schools, remember "WWAMI"--UWashington views applicants from Washington, Wyoming, Alaska, Montana, and Idaho as "in state", so their "out of state" acceptances will be inflated. View this thread for more information.

 

[lucasmd99]

@Catalystik

I found this article on this website and I am wondering about the #3 section. I am just concerned that this will disqualify me based on what it is saying, and since that article is from this website. Please see attached photo.

 

[lucasmd99]

@Catalystik

I found this article on this website and I am wondering about the #3 section. I am just concerned that this will disqualify me based on what it is saying, and since that article is from this website. Please see attached photo.

PS: It is titled “how not to get into medical school”

 

[sinigang14]

@Catalystik

I found this article on this website and I am wondering about the #3 section. I am just concerned that this will disqualify me based on what it is saying, and since that article is from this website. Please see attached photo.

Failing a class won't get you disqualified from applying to medical school. There are a lot of students that don't do it right the first time but redeem themselves later on and get accepted. Focus on what you can change from this point moving forward.

That article is just saying something very obvious which is to not fail a class. Failing a class will obviously lower your GPA, and since medical schools use GPAs as a metric to compare applicants, it is in your best interest to have the highest GPA as possible. With that being said, your GPA is only one component of your application. Adcoms are also human and they understand that not everyone will do it right the first time. Relax and focus on your studies! I wish you the best of luck!

 

[Catalystik]

Failing a class won't get you disqualified from applying to medical school. There are a lot of students that don't do it right the first time but redeem themselves later on and get accepted. Focus on what you can change from this point moving forward.

That article is just saying something very obvious which is to not fail a class. Failing a class will obviously lower your GPA, and since medical schools use GPAs as a metric to compare applicants, it is in your best interest to have the highest GPA as possible. With that being said, your GPA is only one component of your application. Adcoms are also human and they understand that not everyone will do it right the first time. Relax and focus on your studies! I wish you the best of luck!

What he said.