The 2012-2013 Underdog Thread

[BabyDoc86]

Would I be considered an underdog?

AACOMAS GPAs:
sGPA:3.92
cGPA: 3.89

BS Biochem Honors 2009
MA Bioethics & Medical Humanities 2011

I've taken the MCAT, but my score is now "too old." (28R: 8PS, 10 V, 10BS). Retaking in a couple weeks and feeling worried about it since work has been so hectic and putting in 50-60hr weeks.

Lots of shadowing, volunteering, published research, etc.

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[nirvikalpa]

I have two scores under my belt, one from early 2010 (boo) and one from January of this year... same score (<20). Took the June 21st, voided (the PS section killed me, which upset me even more when I saw the VR and BS sections focused on all of my strong points... *sigh*), and now set for August 10th.

I'm getting my AAMC's to average at least 27, if I kill myself in the process.

 

[JaBoomDay]

My practice exams were all over the place! I hit this weird plateau at 25 for like 2 months and I studied like crazy. Two weeks before I took the MCAT I tried a different time-saving strategy and my scores went to 27, 29, 31, and 33.
I have no idea what to believe. I hope that last two weeks is indicative of how I did on the real test. You never know though...

 

[nirvikalpa]

Would I be considered an underdog?

AACOMAS GPAs:
sGPA:3.92
cGPA: 3.89

BS Biochem Honors 2009
MA Bioethics & Medical Humanities 2011

I've taken the MCAT, but my score is now "too old." (28R: 8PS, 10 V, 10BS). Retaking in a couple weeks and feeling worried about it since work has been so hectic and putting in 50-60hr weeks.

Lots of shadowing, volunteering, published research, etc.

How old? Sometimesssss if you call up the certain schools you're interested in, they can make exceptions...

 

[BabyDoc86]

January 2008

 

[touchpause13]

Dear lord what the hell happened in that BS section. I swear there was an experimental passage in there....

 

[nirvikalpa]

Dear lord what the hell happened in that BS section. I swear there was an experimental passage in there....

It wasn't. Want to know how I know? I had that passage... twice. The first time was on a 2010 test... unfortunately.

 

[psychgirrrl]

Hi everyone!

cGPA 3.54

sGPA 3.68

cGPA last 80 hours 3.92

MCAT....7,7,7 = 21 totally freakedout

Retake on July 27th

Strong application. ER tech since 2010, BLS instructor, just got hired atKCUMB's Micro Lab, good LORs, lots of presentations, one publication, pendingone more.



I’m afraid of f-ing up the MCAT again…material is not my problem, timing andreading comprehension. I’m originally from Iraq, so English is my secondlanguage.

Help!!!

Hi, I am sorry about your MCAT score. How did you study? I am second language as well and scored a 10 in VR so I would not write it off as "okay" because you are second language due to the fact that there are applicants like me who are second language and score well in VR.

I used examkrackers books, their audio osmosis, and did a crap ton of practice exams. If you think English is your major problem I would recommend reading as much as you possibly can in all subjects, not just science.

Just giving you a heads up because I know it's hard when English is your second language, but when there are people like me who do just as well and are ESL I don't see how ADCOMs are going to cut you any slack for being foreign.

 

[DrWily]

Would I be considered an underdog?

AACOMAS GPAs:
sGPA:3.92
cGPA: 3.89

BS Biochem Honors 2009
MA Bioethics & Medical Humanities 2011

I've taken the MCAT, but my score is now "too old." (28R: 8PS, 10 V, 10BS). Retaking in a couple weeks and feeling worried about it since work has been so hectic and putting in 50-60hr weeks.

Lots of shadowing, volunteering, published research, etc.

>3.9 gpa
>masters
>published
>wants to know if underdog

MFW -_- SMH

Do decent on the MCAT and you'll be swimming in acceptance letters granted you're not a weirdo.

 

[411309]

Thanks! appreciate the encouragement...how did you study for the second MCAT?

i did a longer version of the SN2 but where I failed on bio was a combination of nerves and not studying orgo hardly at all and getting 3 challenging orgo passages..that was gg for me Lol

 

[PBLI4M]

PBLI4M cGPA: 3.18 sGPA 3.20 MCAT 23 (retake pending ~27-30 on practice)

 

[rzoo14]

PBLI4M cGPA: 3.18 sGPA 3.20 MCAT 23 (retake pending ~27-30 on practice)

Good luck on the retake.

 

[MedPR]

i did a longer version of the SN2 but where I failed on bio was a combination of nerves and not studying orgo hardly at all and getting 3 challenging orgo passages..that was gg for me Lol

3 orgo passages? I think I had 2 and 2 discretes.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

i did a longer version of the SN2 but where I failed on bio was a combination of nerves and not studying orgo hardly at all and getting 3 challenging orgo passages..that was gg for me Lol

I just had an involuntary bowl movement

 

[MedPR]

Would I be considered an underdog?

AACOMAS GPAs:
sGPA:3.92
cGPA: 3.89

BS Biochem Honors 2009
MA Bioethics & Medical Humanities 2011

I've taken the MCAT, but my score is now "too old." (28R: 8PS, 10 V, 10BS). Retaking in a couple weeks and feeling worried about it since work has been so hectic and putting in 50-60hr weeks.

Lots of shadowing, volunteering, published research, etc.

Troll for sure.

I just had an involuntary bowl movement

 

[BabyDoc86]

No, not a troll. Just asking a genuine question.

 

[MedPR]

No, not a troll. Just asking a genuine question.

Get at least a 26 and you'll have multiple acceptances. You got a 28 once, so I'm sure it's safe to say that you can get at least a 26 the second time around.

Of course, this is assuming you're a normal human and don't talk like JT from Grandma's Boy when you get nervous.

 

[HalfListic]

>3.9 gpa
>masters
>published
>wants to know if underdog

MFW -_- SMH

Do decent on the MCAT and you'll be swimming in acceptance letters granted you're not a weirdo.

I disagree, she could probably be a weirdo and still get in if she gets a 26+.

 

[WhyDoWeFall]

Would I be considered an underdog?

AACOMAS GPAs:
sGPA:3.92
cGPA: 3.89

BS Biochem Honors 2009
MA Bioethics & Medical Humanities 2011

I've taken the MCAT, but my score is now "too old." (28R: 8PS, 10 V, 10BS). Retaking in a couple weeks and feeling worried about it since work has been so hectic and putting in 50-60hr weeks.

Lots of shadowing, volunteering, published research, etc.

Someone explain to me how this person could POSSIBLY think she is an underdog lol.

You'll do fine. There is no way you are an underdog.... unless i'm a leprechaun.... while I do have lucky charms in the cabinet I don't think tha'ts the case.

 

[touchpause13]

Get at least a 26 and you'll have multiple acceptances. You got a 28 once, so I'm sure it's safe to say that you can get at least a 26 the second time around.

Of course, this is assuming you're a normal human and don't talk like JT from Grandma's Boy when you get nervous.

ADIOS TURD NUGGETS

 

[411309]

3 orgo passages? I think I had 2 and 2 discretes.

Oh yeah I just figured orgo would be so light on my exam. Shows what I know. Orgo was a huge part of it. If i coul go back in time is get a 10 on that bs but ph well

 

[angldrps]

Oh yeah I just figured orgo would be so light on my exam. Shows what I know. Orgo was a huge part of it. If i coul go back in time is get a 10 on that bs but ph well

yikes this sounds terrible. I had one super simple orgo passage on mine. This proves that when SDNers claim that MCAT is moving in a certain direction (less orgo, more bio), they are wrong.

 

[nirvikalpa]

The underdog section of the MDapp: DO List is pretty bare, and there's much more to an applicant than cGPA/sGPA/MCAT and underdogs know this best! Get a MDapp profile, edit it with your application story: tell of your LOR's, your EC's, and make a timeline of your progress, and post it to the comprehensive MDapplicants: DO List.

 

[rzoo14]

I have a questions regarding clinical experience. I have about 100 hours hospital volunteering but I want to get some ER experience, would it be a bad idea to volunteer at one of those private 24 hour emergency rooms? I also have some minor hospice experience that I plan on continuing.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I have a questions regarding clinical experience. I have about 100 hours hospital volunteering but I want to get some ER experience, would it be a bad idea to volunteer at one of those private 24 hour emergency rooms? I also have some minor hospice experience that I plan on continuing.

Why would it ever be a bad idea?

 

[rzoo14]

Oh I was asking because someone told me not to do because its a private ER and its more of a business than helping people. Just thought I'd ask. I'll go for it.

 

[TriagePreMed]

The underdog section of the MDapp: DO List is pretty bare, and there's much more to an applicant than cGPA/sGPA/MCAT and underdogs know this best! Get a MDapp profile, edit it with your application story: tell of your LOR's, your EC's, and make a timeline of your progress, and post it to the comprehensive MDapplicants: DO List.

Added this message to the front page.

 

[OPH4Life]

worried abouy my chances. cgpa 3.66 sgpa 3.66 24O with 6vr. Underdog for sure. Any advice. Pending a retake based on practice. Last week sent in primaries to all low tier schools and manu average schools hoping I have a shot with a higher mcat.

 

[rzoo14]

worried abouy my chances. cgpa 3.66 sgpa 3.66 24O with 6vr. Underdog for sure. Any advice. Pending a retake based on practice. Last week sent in primaries to all low tier schools and manu average schools hoping I have a shot with a higher mcat.

Yeah, your GPA is good. You might get some interviews with that 24 too but I'd go ahead and start on MCAT prep asap. Retake it soon and do well. A balanced score of 27-28 will be amazing for you. I'm assuming you have average ECs.

 

[MedPR]

worried abouy my chances. cgpa 3.66 sgpa 3.66 24O with 6vr. Underdog for sure. Any advice. Pending a retake based on practice. Last week sent in primaries to all low tier schools and manu average schools hoping I have a shot with a higher mcat.

Not an underdog imo.

 

[OPH4Life]

Yeah, your GPA is good. You might get some interviews with that 24 too but I'd go ahead and start on MCAT prep asap. Retake it soon and do well. A balanced score of 27-28 will be amazing for you. I'm assuming you have average ECs.

Thank you. I hope I can nail some interviews. I have great ECs. Just my verbal is bringing me down. I sent in my app without mention of a potential retake because I am unsure of improvement. Any ideas what schools to focus on?

How am I not an underdog? I am under the impression an above average gpa will not make up for a 6 on vr?

 

[MedPR]

Thank you. I hope I can nail some interviews. I have great ECs. Just my verbal is bringing me down. I sent in my app without mention of a potential retake because I am unsure of improvement. Any ideas what schools to focus on?

How am I not an underdog? I am under the impression an above average gpa will not make up for a 6 on vr?

You have a slightly above average GPA and a slightly below average MCAT.

Originally Posted by TwinsFan
Thought with all the debate maybe we should use this formula I came up with a while back. It is fairly reasonable and based on statistical data that is tough to dispute.



cGPA * 10 + sGPA *10 + MCAT = applicant score

3.43 * 10 + 3.33 * 10 + 25.66 = 93.3 average applicant

3.49 * 10 + 3.41 * 10 + 26.48 = 95.5 average matriculant

This is based on the observation that osteopathic schools seem be more holistic when evaluating applicants and a little less concerned with numbers, specifically MCAT scores, than their allopathic counterparts. This is shown by the larger percentile difference in MCAT scores (26.5 vs. 31.1) than GPA (3.49 vs. 3.67) It places equal weighting between science GPA, cumulative GPA and MCAT score.


The following modification will be made to account for students who have a graduate degree in the natural sciences or have done a postbacc with 24 or more credit hours completed (one year full time) to account for the weighting of recent coursework in returning students.

(cGPA + grad cGPA) * 5 + (sGPA + grad sGPA)*5 + MCAT = graduate student applicant score

(cGPA + postbacc cGPA) * 5 + (sGPA + postbacc sGPA)*5 + MCAT = post bacc student applicant score


To determine the criteria for an underdog we can utilize the 10th /90th percentile rule from the MSAR and apply it as +/- 1 std deviation, or the 16th / 84th percentile to keep the calculations simple. So the true underdog would have at least one of the three academic categories below the 16th percentile with the other two average or below as well. By using the cGPAas the statistical outlier, and probably the most common one for successful underdogs, we come up with the following score for an underdog:

(3.49 - .26) * 10 + 3.41 * 10 + 26.48 = 92.9 underdog threshold

Your LizzyM (97.2) is higher than mine (97.0), and I am not an underdog. Even if we may feel like it, statistically we aren't

 

[OPH4Life]

You have a slightly above average GPA and a slightly below average MCAT.



Your LizzyM (97.2) is higher than mine (97.0), and I am not an underdog. Even if we may feel like it, statistically we aren't

Thank you for that. Some what comforting. Hopefully that means I can get into a school this year!

 

[MyocardialCrepitus]

cGPA 3.26
sGPA 3.19
MCAT 25 Retake Aug 4th

 

[MedPR]

cGPA 3.26
sGPA 3.19
MCAT 25 Retake Aug 4th

Good luck!

 

[niabrams]

What does the Underdog thread think about my possibilities? I specialized (masters) in finance and have since realized that I want to get out of business/finance and go to med school.

My UG cGPA is 3.3 and my sGPA is 3.14. I haven't yet taken all the prerequisites, but once I take orgo and bio (doing grade replacement for a C+), my sGPA should sit at 3.35-3.4.

I volunteered as a freshman at a research institution for autism (no pubs), and after that stopped premed. Since then, no volunteering. I plan to start volunteering at an ED in a week or so, and shadowing- by the time I apply I'll have over a year of volunteering/shadowing.

What I'm wondering is, am I likely to get into a decent school with grades like this, as well as a good MCAT (hopefully)?

 

[411309]

What does the Underdog thread think about my possibilities? I specialized (masters) in finance and have since realized that I want to get out of business/finance and go to med school.

My UG cGPA is 3.3 and my sGPA is 3.14. I haven't yet taken all the prerequisites, but once I take orgo and bio (doing grade replacement for a C+), my sGPA should sit at 3.35-3.4.

I volunteered as a freshman at a research institution for autism (no pubs), and after that stopped premed. Since then, no volunteering. I plan to start volunteering at an ED in a week or so, and shadowing- by the time I apply I'll have over a year of volunteering/shadowing.

What I'm wondering is, am I likely to get into a decent school with grades like this, as well as a good MCAT (hopefully)?

if you can pull off a good mcat and make your ECs stand out youll get in somewhere. Work hard and itll pay off.

 

[Temperature101]

cGPA 3.26
sGPA 3.19
MCAT 25 Retake Aug 4th

Apply with these stats now and let them know that you are retaking. You might even have some luck with your current stats.

 

[niabrams]

What's a "good" MCAT? Of course, I want a 45, but what would be 'acceptable' for DO schools?

I want to be a doctor more than anything, but the prospect of leaving the workforce for a year and a half, taking on a bunch of debt and then not getting in anywhere is pretty terrifying.

 

[HalfListic]

45 is acceptable...but 25+ with decent Gpa is good to go

 

[Temperature101]

What's a "good" MCAT? Of course, I want a 45, but what would be 'acceptable' for DO schools?

I want to be a doctor more than anything, but the prospect of leaving the workforce for a year and a half, taking on a bunch of debt and then not getting in anywhere is pretty terrifying.

If your cGPA and sGPA are OK (3.3+ for DO), a 26+ mcat will get you some interviews and from there it is up to you to 'sell' yourself.

 

[VBGLL]

.

 

[niabrams]

If your cGPA and sGPA are OK (3.3+ for DO), a 26+ mcat will get you some interviews and from there it is up to you to 'sell' yourself.

Well then, here's to going back to school!

 

[TriagePreMed]

92.9 is the threshold for underdog according to that lizzy formula?

that would mean im not an underdog even though I hold a 22N. unless im doing it wrong

3.56 cgpa
3.65 sgpa
22
= 94.1?

A lot of people ran into this problem so they created a modified version where certain MCAT scores knock as much as 5 points off your LizzyM score. Either way, remember LizzyM is just a general guide, so you can't just rely on that. Think of a 3.6/32 w/extensive volunteer work vs a 3.9/32 w/no volunteer work. It becomes obvious why the formula is incomplete.

 

[pthx]

hey guys... joining the underdogs for 2012-2013 cycle!

3.43/3.29
24Q

goodluck guys!

 

[MedPR]

What does the Underdog thread think about my possibilities? I specialized (masters) in finance and have since realized that I want to get out of business/finance and go to med school.

My UG cGPA is 3.3 and my sGPA is 3.14. I haven't yet taken all the prerequisites, but once I take orgo and bio (doing grade replacement for a C+), my sGPA should sit at 3.35-3.4.

I volunteered as a freshman at a research institution for autism (no pubs), and after that stopped premed. Since then, no volunteering. I plan to start volunteering at an ED in a week or so, and shadowing- by the time I apply I'll have over a year of volunteering/shadowing.

What I'm wondering is, am I likely to get into a decent school with grades like this, as well as a good MCAT (hopefully)?

What's a "good" MCAT? Of course, I want a 45, but what would be 'acceptable' for DO schools?

I want to be a doctor more than anything, but the prospect of leaving the workforce for a year and a half, taking on a bunch of debt and then not getting in anywhere is pretty terrifying.

45 is acceptable...but 25+ with decent Gpa is good to go

I'd say a 27 with his GPA.

92.9 is the threshold for underdog according to that lizzy formula?

that would mean im not an underdog even though I hold a 22N. unless im doing it wrong

3.56 cgpa
3.65 sgpa
22
= 94.1?

Your MCAT is pretty far below average. I'd say you're an underdog.

 

[docgirl17]

Their website says pre-reqs (http://www.midwestern.edu/Programs_...hic_Medicine/AdmissionApply.html#requirements), but in her email she made it seem like a C- anywhere on your transcript is unacceptable.

Seems unfair since a lot of schools don't have +/-. Oh well.

I have a D in an undergrad non-prereq and I just got CCOM's secondary yesterday. So "no grade lower than a C-" must only apply to the pre-reqs or I would have been screened out, right?

 

[TwinsFan]

A lot of people ran into this problem so they created a modified version where certain MCAT scores knock as much as 5 points off your LizzyM score. Either way, remember LizzyM is just a general guide, so you can't just rely on that. Think of a 3.6/32 w/extensive volunteer work vs a 3.9/32 w/no volunteer work. It becomes obvious why the formula is incomplete.

Below are the additional factors to add to the formula I originally created (TwinsFan score not Lizzy) to make the scoring as complete as easily possible. I created this after carefully looking through statistics in the osteopathic CIB guide and from the AAMC for comparison and modeling, observing trends with past underdogs and my own experience talking to a couple of adcoms. It is not full proof at all, but it aims to give a more comprehensive predictor of if you are "academically qualified" or an underdog.

VBGLL see below

However, outliers cause issues. A 3.6 cGPA, 3.5 sGPA with an 22 on the MCAT will be a underdog, but according to a simple formula it will compute as a competitive score. To combat this we will add several modifiers to compensate for people with unbalanced stats.

-1 point MCAT overall 24
-2 points MCAT overall 23
-3 points MCAT overall 22
-1.5 points Every section on the MCAT that scores a 7
-3 points Every section on the MCAT that scores a 6
-1 point cGPA 3.00-3.19
-3 points cGPA 2.85 - 2.99
-5 points cGPA 2.75 - 2.84
-1 point sGPA 3.00-3.09
-3 points sGPA 2.85 - 2.99
-5 points sGPA 2.75 - 2.84


Additional factors:
MCAT overall scores < 22 will be screened out by nearly every school and will not be rated
MCAT sectional scores < 6 will be screened out by nearly every school and will not be rated
cGPA or sGPA < 2.75 will be screened out by nearly every school and will not be rated

 

[HalfListic]

Below are the additional factors to add to the formula I originally created (TwinsFan score not Lizzy) to make the scoring as complete as easily possible. I created this after carefully looking through statistics in the osteopathic CIB guide and from the AAMC for comparison and modeling, observing trends with past underdogs and my own experience talking to a couple of adcoms. It is not full proof at all, but it aims to give a more comprehensive predictor of if you are "academically qualified" or an underdog.

VBGLL see below

However, outliers cause issues. A 3.6 cGPA, 3.5 sGPA with an 22 on the MCAT will be a underdog, but according to a simple formula it will compute as a competitive score. To combat this we will add several modifiers to compensate for people with unbalanced stats.

-1 point MCAT overall 24
-2 points MCAT overall 23
-3 points MCAT overall 22
-1.5 points Every section on the MCAT that scores a 7
-3 points Every section on the MCAT that scores a 6
-1 point cGPA 3.00-3.19
-3 points cGPA 2.85 - 2.99
-5 points cGPA 2.75 - 2.84
-1 point sGPA 3.00-3.09
-3 points sGPA 2.85 - 2.99
-5 points sGPA 2.75 - 2.84


Additional factors:
MCAT overall scores < 22 will be screened out by nearly every school and will not be rated
MCAT sectional scores < 6 will be screened out by nearly every school and will not be rated
cGPA or sGPA < 2.75 will be screened out by nearly every school and will not be rated

I like the TF score...I think this gets closer to a realistic look

 

[nirvikalpa]

I wonder if we can *eventually* come up with a standard one that even includes EC's... I wish we could get exact numbers (and hours) that most osteo schools want.