Vote for President

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Vote for President

  • Hillary Clinton

    Votes: 150 52.1%

  • Donald Trump

    Votes: 138 47.9%
  • Total voters
    288
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Ignatius J said:
It is. Did you employ this line of reasoning when Hillary doubled down on Trump being the lead recruiter in ISIS, and in fact actually lied about the circumstances?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/22/politics/hillary-clinton-donald-trump-isis-recruiting/

You probably did not. I know you did not, actually.
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Answered already my friend. I said I believed Hillary (like I originally thought Trump did) spoke in hyperbole.

When asked about it, she referenced "quotes from Rita Katz of the SITE Intelligence group, which tracks and analyzes terrorists. 'They [ISIS] love him [Trump] from the sense that he is supporting their rhetoric,' the gorup's executive director, Rita Katz told NBC News earlier this month. 'When he says, 'No Muslims should be allowed in America,' they tell people, 'We told you America hates Muslims and here is proof.'" http://www.cbsnews.com/news/fact-check-hillary-clinton-calls-donald-trump-isis-best-recruiter/

I don't think she meant he opened an ISIS recruiting station and was handing out pamphlets, but at least she attempted to provide a logical argument that has a basis in fact. As further investigated her claims, she was proven wrong (then half-right as other organizations used his quotes).

Did she lie because she spoke in hyperbole? If her words were 100% literal, sure she did, but I don't think anyone reasonably thought she was literal (just like we didn't think Trump spoke literally about founding ISIS, until he told us he did).
Did Trump lie because he spoke in hyperbole? No. But as he dug his heels in and stuck by a literal definition of 'founded', yes, that's edging closer and closer to lying (or being a ***** and stupid/careless with words).

Or you can keep putting words in my mouth cause you know exactly how I think. Except for the you being wrong part, it is easier than typing; thanks.
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I honestly wonder how much Trump wants to win at this point. Forget about the speaking 'troubles' he's had since the RNC; he's setting himself up with an out if he looses in November.
Today he said: "We're going to watch Pennsylvania. Go down to certain areas and watch and study and make sure other people don't come in and vote five times. If you do that, we're not going to lose. The only way we can lose, in my opinion -- I really mean this, Pennsylvania -- is if cheating goes on."
He's making public excuses (it's rigged against him, watch out for cheating, etc.) I bet he's getting his lawsuit to file ready come 12:01 AM on November 9th.
 
Ignatius J said:
Giuliani is a good man who has successfully prosecuted about 90% of his cases and actually upholds the law. He has forgotten more about law in the last 5 minutes than you will know in your lifetime. He is licking his chops to get at Clinton. What prosecutor with half a brain isn't? Maybe the ones who don't want to end up dead, but that's another point.
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I certainly hope he knows more than me about the law. He's a lawyer.

I don't hate Giuliani. He's a politician like the rest with affairs, public money spent privately, cronyism, etc... But he isn't stupid and I don't think he's dangerous. (Not to me, at least).

But the guy running isn't terribly smart, and they keep bailing him out. You get enablers like that, and he ends up getting us ALL in trouble with his stupidity if he were president. He's a f$&@ing grown man. Ever wonder why he's unable to learn?
 
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doctalaughs said:
There are different levels of hyperbole or "sarcasm" as he puts it (even though seems like an incorrect use of the word).

Clinton claiming that Trump is helping ISIS recruit may be slight hyperbole (I'd say 3/10 given they are using him in recruiting videos but he isn't actually trying to help them).

Trump claiming that Obama is the "founder" of ISIS is more like 7/10 since it's clearly ridiculous by anyone's definition of the word.

If a presidential candidate said "if I'm elected I will nuke every city in every country that harbors terrorists"... well I guess they could claim it was hyperbole or sarcasm but even you would admit they should be punished.

See the differences?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
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I think you with then talking heads are mincing his words for political gain. As simple as that. If someone came up to you on the street and said that, you would know exactly what they are trying to say.

In related news, great article on the abomination that is Hillary's economic plan:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...the_hillary_clinton_economic_plan_131503.html
 
Fluffhead87 said:
You are right. It is "cute when someone gets mad on an internet forum" such as typing in all caps. Assuming you are not trolling, I think you are still arguing for the sake of arguing.

Understand that I might be putting words in @deepstate2016 's mouth, I think s/he was referring to Germany 1930s to 1940s. You know, when the government raided homes and rounded up people. The KKK wasn't a government entity. Not sure how you drew that connection.

And the Great Wall of China was an overwhelming failure at it's purpose. It was a series of interconnected watch towers that took hundreds of years to accomplish (and thousands of deaths that were just built over). The wall did not keep out invaders. It didn't ultimately keep out the Mongols. It couldn't be fulled staffed. The wall was a political message of China's border and power, though the invaders that came through/over at multiple times in history didn't respect that message. Guess what, people build tunnels too. We could come into 21st century and push technology that the border patrol agents want, instead of a FDR New Deal type/shovel ready project like this wall.

There is a difference between being dominant and being antagonistic on the global stage. Building such a wall would have unintended consequences to our diplomatic stance with Mexico and the rest of Latin America. I don't believe that not building a wall fails to exert our dominance/strength.
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nice job jerking off your buddy here, i love getting people mad
 
Not looking good for don john deporto. Romney did very well with white college-educated voters....Trump is losing them fast enough to make his head spin. It should give everyone pause that the least educated among us are the most likely to support Trump.

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Also, congratulations to Trump for being so goddamned unlikable that he became the first candidate to get a negative bounce after a convention

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One thing that has annoyed me about this election cycle is how stopping illegal immigration has become 'racist.' I don't want Texas to turn blue.
 
glitchfire said:
One thing that has annoyed me about this election cycle is how stopping illegal immigration has become 'racist.' I don't want Texas to turn blue.
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It's just a matter of time before Texas turns blue and the entire nation becomes a liberal republic like the European countries. It's a sad ending to the dream of the founders where personal liberty and personal responsibility with LIMITED government were the cornerstones of the USA.
 
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BLADEMDA said:
It's just a matter of time before Texas turns blue and the entire nation becomes a liberal republic like the European countries. It's a sad ending to the dream of the founders where personal liberty and personal responsibility with LIMITED government were the cornerstones of the USA.
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It's news to a LOT of people that conservatives have no interest in limiting their personal liberties.
 
glitchfire said:
One thing that has annoyed me about this election cycle is how stopping illegal immigration has become 'racist.' I don't want Texas to turn blue.
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Are people arguing that we shouldn't stop illegal immigration? I think pretty much everyone but the government would like to stop illegal immigration.

The problem is sometimes with how people generalize the morals/ethics of the people wanting to immigrate.
 
BLADEMDA said:
It's just a matter of time before Texas turns blue and the entire nation becomes a liberal republic like the European countries. It's a sad ending to the dream of the founders where personal liberty and personal responsibility with LIMITED government were the cornerstones of the USA.
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I could be wrong but somehow I am sure that the founding fathers dream did not include multinational corporations that power and influence rival many nation states, or the virtual monopoly over public information enjoyed by 4 to 5 companies.
 
I thought this thread had died along with Trump's campaign.
 
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Trump woke up late August and realized racism cannot win in November. Only one problem... He already made hours worth of racist rants for hillary to run in ads. It will be interesting
 
Machinery said:
Trump woke up late August and realized racism cannot win in November. Only one problem... He already made hours worth of racist rants for hillary to run in ads. It will be interesting
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He's controlled himself for about a week now, which is a record for sure. Don't expect it to last much longer.
 
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Machinery said:
In any other election cycle this would have been big news. Not this one though. You can thank Trump for that. If Hillary wins, it will be courtesy of Trump and not her doing.
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Agreed. Even a halfway responsible semi-intelligent republican would've had this in the bank.
 
Pooh & Annie said:
Can you imagine how crazy it'd be if she owed hundreds of millions to Russia and China?!
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There is a difference in running a big private sector business and using your office and leverage as a State official to ***** out your country. Any honest person knows that it isn't the actual act of conducting State business and meeting with countries, but the whoring out of access that is the issue.
 
Btw Pooh, the release of these hidden 15,000 emails that were supposed to be about yoga and Chelsea's wedding seem to be getting closer to that quid quo pro you were talking about. I'm sure she didn't mean to delete all those emails linking the CF and the State Department. Silly her!
 
Ignatius J said:
There is a difference in running a big private sector business and using your office and leverage as a State official to ***** out your country. Any honest person knows that it isn't the actual act of conducting State business and meeting with countries, but the whoring out of access that is the issue.
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Well, except NATO and Eastern Europe are feeling like the wives getting cheated into non-existence.
 
Ignatius J said:
Btw Pooh, the release of these hidden 15,000 emails that were supposed to be about yoga and Chelsea's wedding seem to be getting closer to that quid quo pro you were talking about. I'm sure she didn't mean to delete all those emails linking the CF and the State Department. Silly her!
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Let's see! They'll find em if they exist!
 
Ignatius J said:
There is a difference in running a big private sector business and using your office and leverage as a State official to ***** out your country. Any honest person knows that it isn't the actual act of conducting State business and meeting with countries, but the whoring out of access that is the issue.
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BTW, in the ENTIRE history of government, do you think there is even ONE state official who NEVER met with a person or group as a favor for something, whether monetary or otherwise?
 
Pooh & Annie said:
BTW, in the ENTIRE history of government, do you think there is even ONE state official who NEVER met with a person or group as a favor for something, whether monetary or otherwise?
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What a joke. I am not going down that slippery slope, my friend. And this is a despicable way into legitimizing a morally corrupt politician. I expect "well, everyone else is doing it!" From my middle schooler, not a physician.
 
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Pooh & Annie said:
Let's see! They'll find em if they exist!
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Some smart prosecutors out there think it does. Good thing she got a hold of that email server before the government did.

"Let's see....Chelsea's flowers....delete....yoga....delete....Foundation asking about meeting with a foreign national foreign Bahrain.....delete delete delete!!!"

Just personal stuff.
 
This is quite simply lobbying legislators routinely do these things, it is very distasteful but at this time it appears no laws were broken
 
Ignatius J said:
What a joke. I am not going down that slippery slope, my friend. And this is a despicable way into legitimizing a morally corrupt politician. I expect "well, everyone else is doing it!" From my middle schooler, not a physician.
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Unfortunately all politics and money are slippery slopes. I can appreciate your distaste, sausage and laws, two things on on really wants to see how it's made. The argument is not "everyone is doing it", the argument is that this is the way it is done.
 
Ignatius J said:
Some smart prosecutors out there think it does. Good thing she got a hold of that email server before the government did.

"Let's see....Chelsea's flowers....delete....yoga....delete....Foundation asking about meeting with a foreign national foreign Bahrain.....delete delete delete!!!"

Just personal stuff.
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Yet these smart prosecutors have not managed to even file charges......
 
Pay for access is political donation 101. Trump talked about it in one of the debates - about how he paid for access. It is slimy but won't stop until there is election finance reform.

The problem with all these revelations about Clinton are that none of them make Trump any more palatable as a candidate. If the Republican Party had nominated someone reasonable, they would have won in a landslide.
 
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Ignatius J said:
What a joke. I am not going down that slippery slope, my friend. And this is a despicable way into legitimizing a morally corrupt politician. I expect "well, everyone else is doing it!" From my middle schooler, not a physician.
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Where is your "slippery slope"? Do you have evidence that someone didn't go through the proper diplomatic channels to get an interview with the the secretary? Are there outliers on that list that had not/ would not be granted interviews by other Secretaries of State?

That answer is no. Look into it. Please.Your slippery slope thing IS middle schooler stuff, as Breitbart anti-Clinton conspiracies usually are.

Quite a scam, though, if anyone had a drop of evidence. "You contribute to AIDS drugs, hospitals, schools, etc... for the impoverished and I'll grant you an interview". That's a scam that people might actually get behind.
 
deepstate2016 said:
What does this have to do with anything? Do you feel your communication with your daughter/son/spouse should be public knowledge?
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Like, do I have a code word to send her email from on my illegal server? No.
 
Pooh & Annie said:
The fact that this is "news" to someone is very telling in itself, isn't it?
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No, it's not. I understand Hillary could carry around a severed head and you would chalk it up to the cost of doing business, but even the Huffington Post thinks this CF should be shut down. If you see no issue with it, that puts you left of them which is somewhere between Hugo Chavez and Bernie Sanders. Congrats on being out of touch.
 
Ignatius J said:
No, it's not. I understand Hillary could carry around a severed head and you would chalk it up to the cost of doing business, but even the Huffington Post thinks this CF should be shut down. If you see no issue with it, that puts you left of them which is somewhere between Hugo Chavez and Bernie Sanders. Congrats on being out of touch.
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Actually, very few people, if anyone at all, want to shut it down. There are way too many people that are alive because of it. Arguing to "shut it down" is absolutely inhuman, and without question "out of touch". That's placing your political hatred and unquestioning belief in every suggested conspiracy above the lives of needy people.

They want it to be absorbed into the Gates foundation or something. I'd be fine with that.
 
Ignatius J said:
No, it's not. I understand Hillary could carry around a severed head and you would chalk it up to the cost of doing business, but even the Huffington Post thinks this CF should be shut down. If you see no issue with it, that puts you left of them which is somewhere between Hugo Chavez and Bernie Sanders. Congrats on being out of touch.
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Carrying a severed head would be evidence of a crime. That would be a big problem I would think.

No one has evidence of a crime. They just have a distorted view of the world where someone they hate is guilty of every possible unfounded accusation.
 
This is a brilliant and absolutely spot on quote from Jorge Ramos's TIME article:
"It doesn’t matter who you are—a journalist, a politician or a voter—we’ll all be judged by how we responded to Donald Trump".

I can say, without reservation, that everyone who sees this person for who he is knows this as fact.
 
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